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Classic Train Questions Part Deux (50 Years or Older)

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Posted by rcdrye on Tuesday, November 6, 2012 6:31 AM

A fair question.  Lowest altitude crossing of the continental divide.

in 1957, Seattle to New Orleans required two car changes via Oakland and LA, or one via Chicago.  This was an every day coach and sleeper pair. 

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, November 6, 2012 3:32 AM

Not having OG's or similar information, but looking at a USA map, it would appear that a through run from Seattle to New Orleans would could qualify as the longest north-south run, although it is also west-east.   A run from El Paso to either Brownsville or Corpus Christie should qualify as the lowest (most southerly) est west.   Or did you mean the lowest in elevation above sea level?   So, prsumably a coach or sleeper could start out in Seattle and and up in Brownsville or Corpus Christie and be SP all the way, coming off the Sunset Limited at El Paso, and an unnamed branch line train to Brownsville or Corpus Christie.

I think you might wish to define "lowest."

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, November 5, 2012 5:47 PM

By the OG I was looking in, Chicago-Madison-Twin Cities trains were almost as slow as the Soo's entry.

In 1957, this sleeper (and a coach) originated on the longest north-south run in the U.S. and finished on the lowest east-west run.

End points, carriers, and car type. 

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Posted by KCSfan on Monday, November 5, 2012 5:07 PM

Rob, You're so close to being right that I'm going to declare you the winner. The sleeper route I was looking for was Chi - Minneapolis but St Paul will suffice. The CNW/CStPM&O route via Madison was the shortest line and at the time its Victory was the fastest overnight train with a schedule of 9 hrs - 50 mins.

The Soo had the longest line (50+ mi longer than the CNW) and the slowest schedule;15 hrs - 5 mins. Its Chi - Minneapolis sleeper was carried in unamed No's 17 (NB) and 18 (SB) which didn't serve the Twin Cities but were Chi - Duluth trains. The through cars were dropped off No.17/picked up by No 18 at Owen, WI. They ran between Owen and the Twin Cities in un-named No's 5 and 6.

The fastest overnight trains on the other roads that ran sleepers between Chi and the TC were: Empire Builder and North Coast Ltd on the Burlington - both 10 hrs - 5 min; the Milw's Olympian - 10 hrs - 15 mins.; and the CGW's Minnesotan - 12 hrs - 40 mins.

Let's have the next question please.

Mark  

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, November 5, 2012 4:25 PM

So... Looking at the oldest OG I have available I get CMStP&P at a little under 8 hours and Soo(WC) at 13 and a bit.  I have a CGW timetable somewhere but can't locate it.

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Posted by KCSfan on Monday, November 5, 2012 1:26 PM

rcdrye

So CB&Q was faster?  That's about the time that street running in LaCrosse was replaced.

Nope - No cigar for you yet Rob.

Mark

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, November 5, 2012 12:32 PM

So CB&Q was faster?  That's about the time that street running in LaCrosse was replaced.

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Posted by KCSfan on Monday, November 5, 2012 6:47 AM

rcdrye

Without an OG handy I'm going to go with Chicago - St. Paul.  Fastest: CMStP&P, slowest CGW.You could travel in tourist sleepers on the Milwaukee, and maybe the Burlington.  Other roads: Soo (WC), CB&Q and C&NW/CStPM&O.  I think this is after the IC/M&St.L car quit.

Rob, you're close but you don't have it right yet.

Mark

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, November 5, 2012 5:38 AM

Without an OG handy I'm going to go with Chicago - St. Paul.  Fastest: CMStP&P, slowest CGW.You could travel in tourist sleepers on the Milwaukee, and maybe the Burlington.  Other roads: Soo (WC), CB&Q and C&NW/CStPM&O.  I think this is after the IC/M&St.L car quit.

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Posted by KCSfan on Monday, November 5, 2012 5:02 AM

Not NY - Cleveland, Dave. Here's another hint. On some of the trains you had your choice of either a standard or tourist sleeper.

Mark

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, November 5, 2012 4:01 AM

New York - Cleveland, via the NYC Ohio State LImited, and Jersey City (NY via ferry) - Cleveland five hours longer?   Pacific LImited or the Lake Cities?     Other overnight runs might be via DL&W-Nickel Plate

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Posted by KCSfan on Monday, November 5, 2012 3:25 AM

Nope, not Chi - LA. The sleeper routes I'm looking for were much shorter - strictly overnight runs.

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Posted by FlyingCrow on Sunday, November 4, 2012 5:57 PM

Hmmm......Chicago to Los Angeles.      CNW-UP // ATSF // RI-SP       The Santa Fe route was the fastest.

AB Dean Jacksonville,FL
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Posted by KCSfan on Sunday, November 4, 2012 10:29 AM

Sorry Dave but none of those are the route I'm looking for. Here's a hint. Focus on the 59 mile difference between the longest and shortest routes between the cities.

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, November 4, 2012 9:43 AM

New York and Louisville, KY, with the PRR-L&N Cincinnati Lmtd and possibly the Hummingbird (but I am not sure) Cincninnati - Louisville on the L&N, as the fastest, and PRR to Wash, DC and C&O to Louis on the Sportsman or possibly the George Washington, sleepers in the NEC possibly in a combined sleeper trains for the Crescent and the C&O or on the Embassy or one of the other regular NY-Washington trains.  The B&O may have had a sleeper to Louisville out of Jersey City or out of Penn Staition during WWI and just after.

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Posted by KCSfan on Sunday, November 4, 2012 4:50 AM

Buck, the trains I'm looking for ran between another pair of cities not NY and Chicago.

Mark

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Posted by FlyingCrow on Saturday, November 3, 2012 7:09 PM

Mark

You didn't specifically ask to name the two cities, but my guess is NY and Chicago.  The fastest I believe would be the 20th Century Limited.       The slowest.....ummm.......   wow....Lehigh Valley & Nickel Plate ??

Buck

Oh.... Erie, PRR, GTW with a connection, Michigan Central with a connection....


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Posted by KCSfan on Saturday, November 3, 2012 12:14 PM

rcdrye

They were Hudsons.  On the other hand I didn't ask for the wheel arrangement.  All yours.

That's what I get for going strictly from memory - photos of these engines clearly show they were 4-6-4's.

Travelling between these two cities in the late 1930's you had your choice of sleeping car routes on several different railroads. Though there was a difference of only 59 miles between the longest and shortest route there was a time difference of about five hours between the schedules of the fastest trains that carried sleepers on each of the two lines. What railroads had the fastest and slowest sleeping car service between these cities and what trains carried the sleepers? 

For extra credit what other railroad(s) ran sleepers between these cities?

Mark

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Posted by rcdrye on Saturday, November 3, 2012 9:34 AM

They were Hudsons.  On the other hand I didn't ask for the wheel arrangement.  All yours.

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Posted by KCSfan on Saturday, November 3, 2012 8:50 AM

The Burlingtons's two streamlined Pacifics No's. 4000 and 4001 both named the Aeolus.

Mark

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Posted by rcdrye on Saturday, November 3, 2012 6:35 AM

How about another streamlined steam question to make up for it?

This railroad, which named many of its early diesels, gave both of its streamlined steam locomotives the same name.  Looking for railroad, name and road numbers.

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Posted by KCSfan on Friday, November 2, 2012 5:50 PM

The South Wind is correct but we have both made an error. Shortly after posting this question I realized I had overlooked the fact that the train originally ran behind a streamlined PRR K-4 between Chicago and Louisville. The road and engine I was looking for was the L&N and its streamlined 4-6-2 No.295 which handled the SW between Louisville and Montgomery. The 295 was equipped with an oversized 6-wheel truck tender which enabled it to make the 490 mile run with a single stop for coal and water.

Mark

 

 

 

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Posted by rcdrye on Friday, November 2, 2012 1:32 PM

That would be the South Wind which ran behind E6s (and maybe E3s) on the L&N, ACL and FEC, but was handled by PRR K4s 4-6-2  #2665 from Chicago to Louisville via Logansport.

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Posted by KCSfan on Friday, November 2, 2012 12:20 PM

This streamliner ran over several different railroads and when first placed in service was diesel powered over all of its route except for the segment over one road where it was handled by a streamlined steam locomotive. What was the train, the railroad and route over which it ran behind steam, and the type and number of the steam locomotive?

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, November 2, 2012 4:17 AM

100% correct, partly or totally owned by New York Central

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Posted by KCSfan on Thursday, November 1, 2012 5:18 AM

Merchants Despatch (MDT) reefers.

Mark

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, November 1, 2012 4:18 AM

Similar, but not any of the three posted so far.   As far as I know the reporting marks are NOT used today.   A large eastern Class I that did (successor still does) that did have an operation in Canada and does major interchange with CN was part or total owner of the car line.  And only one type of car was involved.   I think at one time steel-framed wood cars as well as all-steel were handled.

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Posted by KCSfan on Tuesday, October 30, 2012 9:04 AM

GATX or UTLX ?

Mark

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Posted by rcdrye on Tuesday, October 30, 2012 6:48 AM

TTX  ? 

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, October 30, 2012 4:49 AM

Hint:   The owner of the car fleet is usually thought of as primarily a USA operation, not Canadian.

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