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An Over-reaction? Locked

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 6:49 PM

NKP guy

 

 
Flintlock76
On a more positive note, I just looked at a chart put out by the CDC that indicates smokers are less susceptible to COVID-19 than non-smokers.

 

   Can you please provide a link to that chart?  This is counter-intuitive.

 

 

 

I know!  It surprised the hell out of me too!

Anyway, here's the link, scroll down through it for the US stats.

https://twitter.com/kerpen/status/1249715841618362369  

Through the courtesy of Miningman, I don't do the Twitter.  

Anyway, you know what we smokers say:

"I'm gonna die someday, I might as well have a say in it!"   

And:

"Smoking takes ten years off your life?  So what?  They're the worst ten years of your life anyway!"   Wink

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Posted by NKP guy on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 6:29 PM

Flintlock76
On a more positive note, I just looked at a chart put out by the CDC that indicates smokers are less susceptible to COVID-19 than non-smokers.

   Can you please provide a link to that chart?  This is counter-intuitive.

 

 

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Posted by Euclid on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 5:45 PM

Convicted One
 
Flintlock76
It's been said the bodys immune system is like a muscle that needs to be excercised on a regular basis, no exercise, it atrophys, just as a muscle will.

 

Hypothetically, if it was discovered that some societal taboo actually killed the virus and restored the person to functional health in just a few days... do you think the authorities  would alter policy to relax the  prohibition of the taboo?

 

I doubt it. 

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Posted by Paul of Covington on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 4:57 PM

Flintlock76
It has been postulated that, while growing up in a filthy environment isn't something to be desired, growing up in an environment that's too clean isn't necessarily all that good either.

   Those of you about my age will probably remember images back in the fifties of rows of kids with polio lying in iron lungs.  There was a program, I think on PBS, that said polio had been around for a long time, but with horses, chickens and other livestock around most households, the virus was more prevalent, and children were exposed to it at an early age.  The immune system could cope with it in infants and the very young, but this capability was lost later in life.  With the automobile and other changes in lifestyle, exposure to the virus was less likely, and when it did occur later in life, the results were devastating.  I thought it ironic that sanitation was a major contributor to the problem.

_____________ 

  "A stranger's just a friend you ain't met yet." --- Dave Gardner

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Posted by Convicted One on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 4:30 PM

Flintlock76
It's been said the bodys immune system is like a muscle that needs to be excercised on a regular basis, no exercise, it atrophys, just as a muscle will.

Hypothetically, if it was discovered that some societal taboo actually killed the virus and restored the person to functional health in just a few days... do you think the authorities  would alter policy to relax the  prohibition of the taboo? I don't want to venture into the realm that might make  the forum police believe I was trying to promote illicit activity, so just use your imagination.

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 4:09 PM

charlie hebdo

Elderly casualty: Casualty

 

Probably a couple of punks with too much time on their hands.   Angry

God help 'em if any classic aircraft fans get their hands on 'em!

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 4:08 PM

Convicted One

 

 
Miningman
https://twitter.com/kerpen/status/1249715841618362369

 

Thanks, a bit of a shocker.

I believe there could be some validity as to the toxic environment we maintain in our bodies  likewise being toxic to the bugs that torment us.

I have in years past assembled considerable anecdotal experience that suggests exactly that. Two day cures for even the nastiest flu that I ever had, as well as lesser bugs.

 

It has been postulated that, while growing up in a filthy environment isn't something to be desired, growing up in an environment that's too clean  isn't necessarily all that good either.  It's been said the bodys immune system is like a muscle that needs to be excercised on a regular basis, no exercise, it atrophys, just as a muscle will.

Or so they say.  I don't know. 

I suppose there's historic evidence for this if not scientific evidence.  It was noted by US Army doctors, up to and including the First World War, that young men who came from the cities were as a rule much heathier and less prone to disease than young men from rural communities.  It was an easy one to figure out, men from the cities having come from areas of heavy population density had already caught and survived any communicable disease that was out there, the country boys not so much, since they came from areas without that same population density.  

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Posted by Overmod on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 3:46 PM

charlie hebdo
Is this TOS the same as the updated forum rules?

No; that's Brian channelling Jeffrey Wimberley.  People keep adding and deleting special 'rules' like the ban on discussing graffiti, hoboes, and moderation actions... usually for some ad hoc reason or personal preference.

The actual TOS -- and it varies by site -- is the one that used to be linked from the right-hand top menu, and is now almost impossible to actually navigate to (despite being invoked in the boilerplate in all the general Trains Magazine categories!)  Much of this has gone unrevised while rules and wretched overmoderation have been changed over the years; it certainly isn't viewed as important, and we've seen action taken against people for 'violations' either not in the TOS or arbitrarily interpreted.  At some point some CYA language regarding 'banned' users' rights to material they posted was introduced, which essentially reinforces that moderators can leave or remove any material they see fit to leave or remove, but can't edit (or selectively remove) any part of a particular post.

 

I don't think we'll necessarily see any improvement in the situation when the 'new' forum experience is finally rolled out, either, although I seriously think it should be (if the advertisers are to get their best value out of a well-regulated community of marks).

  If so,  there is nothing about the OP having any special privileges.  But there are several rules about things like political topics and use of copyright material that much of Klepper's postings (and that of others) violates repeatedly.  [/quote]

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Posted by charlie hebdo on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 2:42 PM

Deggesty

 

 
charlie hebdo

Elderly casualty: Casualty

 

 

 

This sounds like malicious mischief.

 

 

The motive was unknown for damaging the two DC-3s on Cape Cod. 

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Posted by Miningman on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 2:40 PM

2024!!!!!

Abstract

It is urgent to understand the future of severe acute respiratory syndrome–coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) transmission. We used estimates of seasonality, immunity, and cross-immunity for betacoronaviruses OC43 and HKU1 from time series data from the USA to inform a model of SARS-CoV-2 transmission. We projected that recurrent wintertime outbreaks of SARS-CoV-2 will probably occur after the initial, most severe pandemic wave. Absent other interventions, a key metric for the success of social distancing is whether critical care capacities are exceeded. To avoid this, prolonged or intermittent social distancing may be necessary into 2022. Additional interventions, including expanded critical care capacity and an effective therapeutic, would improve the success of intermittent distancing and hasten the acquisition of herd immunity. Longitudinal serological studies are urgently needed to determine the extent and duration of immunity to SARS-CoV-2. Even in the event of apparent elimination, SARS-CoV-2 surveillance should be maintained since a resurgence in contagion could be possible as late as 2024.

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Posted by Deggesty on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 2:27 PM

charlie hebdo

Elderly casualty: Casualty

 

This sounds like malicious mischief.

Johnny

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Posted by charlie hebdo on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 2:00 PM

Elderly casualty: Casualty

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Posted by Convicted One on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 1:59 PM

Miningman
https://twitter.com/kerpen/status/1249715841618362369

Thanks, a bit of a shocker.

I believe there could be some validity as to the toxic environment we maintain in our bodies  likewise being toxic to the bugs that torment us.

I have in years past assembled considerable anecdotal experience that suggests exactly that. Two day cures for even the nastiest flu that I ever had, as well as lesser bugs.

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Posted by charlie hebdo on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 1:56 PM

I came across a recent study of many Covid-19 patients and looking at the correlation with blood type and vulnerability, as seen with other infections.  Preliminary results suggest Type O has the least chance of infection or death. 

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Posted by Convicted One on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 1:52 PM

Flintlock76
I spoke to David by private message.

Thanks Flintock, hopefully the message you sent was consistent with the guidance you gave me publicly in the "Need a Break?" thread.

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Posted by Miningman on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 1:29 PM

Convicted One---  link re smoking

https://twitter.com/kerpen/status/1249715841618362369

 

 

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Posted by 54light15 on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 1:21 PM

I'm still laughing about the one you sent me. Devil

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Posted by charlie hebdo on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 1:17 PM

Flintlock76

 

 
charlie hebdo

 

 
Flintlock76

 

 
243129

David Klepper, are you an Israeli citizen? If not, why not become one and contribute to the cause you admire and espouse so fervently?

 

 

 

 

Let's not have any of that.  I'm the one who started this thread, if it gets nasty I'll have it shut down.  Play nice people.

On a more positive note, I just looked at a chart put out by the CDC that indicates smokers are less susceptible to COVID-19 than non-smokers.

Light 'em up boys!  Wink

 

 

 

You'll have it shut down?  Isn't that just a we bit presumptuous, if not flat out delusions if grandeur?  Merely starting a thread does not confer ownership or control of it or any other special privileges.  Those all reside with the Kalmbach moderators. There are many reasons why the complaints of many about Klepper's post are valid,  among them the fair use doctrine on copyright infringement. 

That said,  the comment about Klepper's citizenship was out of bounds. Dual citizenship with Israel is legal,  last I noticed. 

 

 

 

"I meant what I said, and I said what I meant, 

The Flintlock is truthful, 100 percent!"

The machinery's in place and just needs me to push the button.  Be advised. 

 

Yeah, go running to the lieutenant and have him or her shut it down. . 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 1:02 PM

I spoke to David by private message.  What I said is private, as it would be should I PM any of you.  

I've had PM messages with other posters on other threads, they know I can keep a confidence.

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Posted by Convicted One on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 12:58 PM

Flintlock76
On a more positive note, I just looked at a chart put out by the CDC that indicates smokers are less susceptible to COVID-19 than non-smokers.

Now there is an area where a link would be a great improvement.

BTW earlier in this thread David posted that he believed you as the thread starter should have the ultimate say in whether he should post here  lengthy, drawn out copies of articles published elsewhere on the web.

Would you do me a favor and share with him the guidance you gave me concerning the reposting of longwinded materials published elsewhere? It might help resolve a lot of this "cabin fever" type  debate we have been getting here.

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 12:53 PM

charlie hebdo

 

 
Flintlock76

 

 
243129

David Klepper, are you an Israeli citizen? If not, why not become one and contribute to the cause you admire and espouse so fervently?

 

 

 

 

Let's not have any of that.  I'm the one who started this thread, if it gets nasty I'll have it shut down.  Play nice people.

On a more positive note, I just looked at a chart put out by the CDC that indicates smokers are less susceptible to COVID-19 than non-smokers.

Light 'em up boys!  Wink

 

 

 

You'll have it shut down?  Isn't that just a we bit presumptuous, if not flat out delusions if grandeur?  Merely starting a thread does not confer ownership or control of it or any other special privileges.  Those all reside with the Kalmbach moderators. There are many reasons why the complaints of many about Klepper's post are valid,  among them the fair use doctrine on copyright infringement. 

That said,  the comment about Klepper's citizenship was out of bounds. Dual citizenship with Israel is legal,  last I noticed. 

 

"I meant what I said, and I said what I meant, 

The Flintlock is truthful, 100 percent!"

The machinery's in place and just needs me to push the button.  Be advised. 

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Posted by Convicted One on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 12:16 PM

Euclid
I am not sure I understand your reference to the point of the 1%.  I see that Miningman referred to “the .1%.”  In any case, maybe those are the people manufacturing in China, and not the market for Chinese products. Those business owners certainly would benefit from “Made in China.” 

Don't sell yourself short. It appears to me that you havefigured out the part that  matters. Yes

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Posted by charlie hebdo on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 11:41 AM

Euclid

 

 
Overmod
 
Euclid
Please show me where that is in the TOS.

 

Part of it is implicit in the process for withdrawing as a user and having all one's posts deleted.  More of it comes from specific messages from moderators that invoke the intent, including some concerning the specific ways that 'keeping on topic' (which is a hard provision in every version of the TOS since I originally joined decades ago) that moderators would respect.

It's been made a Chinese puzzle to actually invoke this, though: presumably non-subscribers still need to dial the 'customer service number' as there's still no easy way to send an e-mail directly through any of the contact pages.  My recommendation is to PM a couple of known moderators who will actually respond to 'modac'-related requests (like Ang or Dave Lassen) and have them detail what 'is' and 'isn't' the agreed interpretation in this post-coup time.

 

 

 

Well sure, an OP can complain to a moderator that rules are being violated, and moderator has the authorty to act.  But the OP has no such authority or ability to shut down a thread or delete posts as though he/she owns the thread.

And the moderator has no obligation to act on a complaint from the OP as though the OP has some special authority because they started the thread.   

 

Exactly!! 

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Posted by Euclid on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 11:36 AM

Overmod
 
Euclid
Please show me where that is in the TOS.

 

Part of it is implicit in the process for withdrawing as a user and having all one's posts deleted.  More of it comes from specific messages from moderators that invoke the intent, including some concerning the specific ways that 'keeping on topic' (which is a hard provision in every version of the TOS since I originally joined decades ago) that moderators would respect.

It's been made a Chinese puzzle to actually invoke this, though: presumably non-subscribers still need to dial the 'customer service number' as there's still no easy way to send an e-mail directly through any of the contact pages.  My recommendation is to PM a couple of known moderators who will actually respond to 'modac'-related requests (like Ang or Dave Lassen) and have them detail what 'is' and 'isn't' the agreed interpretation in this post-coup time.

 

Well sure, an OP can complain to a moderator that rules are being violated, and moderator has the authorty to act.  But the OP has no such authority or ability to shut down a thread or delete posts as though he/she owns the thread.

And the moderator has no obligation to act on a complaint from the OP as though the OP has some special authority because they started the thread.   

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Posted by charlie hebdo on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 10:58 AM

Implicit?  Only known by you? So there really are no "Terms of Service" as a binding agreement.

The rules, however, are written and thus binding. The one below is especially pertinent and repeatedly violated now by Klepper. I think this was why Wanswheel was suspended (he ultimately left in a huff on his own). Klepper was earlier warned about religious posts. Now he gets into Israeli domestic and geopolitics, much of it controversial, even if he thinks not.  Juniatha left the forum because one poster was incredibly rude to her repeatedly, as she told me in several PMs. Volker Landwehr also became disgusted with the way the forum operates with obvious favoritism. I'm sure the same is true of the many other people who have left or were banished for dubious reasons.

"Please respect copyright material. If you want to share copyright material with our users, please link to it. Don’t take a story from another Web site and post it in our forum."

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Posted by Overmod on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 10:38 AM

Euclid
Please show me where that is in the TOS.

Part of it is implicit in the process for withdrawing as a user and having all one's posts deleted.  More of it comes from specific messages from moderators that invoke the intent, including some concerning the specific ways that 'keeping on topic' (which is a hard provision in every version of the TOS since I originally joined decades ago) that moderators would respect.

It's been made a Chinese puzzle to actually invoke this, though: presumably non-subscribers still need to dial the 'customer service number' as there's still no easy way to send an e-mail directly through any of the contact pages.  My recommendation is to PM a couple of known moderators who will actually respond to 'modac'-related requests (like Ang or Dave Lassen) and have them detail what 'is' and 'isn't' the agreed interpretation in this post-coup time.

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Posted by charlie hebdo on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 10:34 AM

Euclid

 

 
Overmod
 
charlie hebdo
Merely starting a thread does not confer ownership or control of it or any other special privileges.

 

Actually, under the TOS, it does.  The originator of a thread technically retains the ability to determine if it is 'allowed' to drift off topic, and to request that it be summarily terminated "for any reason".  

 

 

 

Please show me where that is in the TOS.

 

 

Is this TOS the same as the updated forum rules?  If so,  there is nothing about the OP having any special privileges.  But there are several rules about things like political topics and use of copyright material that much of Klepper's postings (and that of others) violates repeatedly.  

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Posted by Euclid on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 10:27 AM

Overmod
 
charlie hebdo
Merely starting a thread does not confer ownership or control of it or any other special privileges.

 

Actually, under the TOS, it does.  The originator of a thread technically retains the ability to determine if it is 'allowed' to drift off topic, and to request that it be summarily terminated "for any reason".  

 

Please show me where that is in the TOS.

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Posted by charlie hebdo on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 10:26 AM

It's not even clear where the current TOS is.  Do you know?  Can you link? 

Reporting abuse is not something I choose to do.  I believe it is incumbent on US as members to respect the rules and at least seriously give consideration to the public complaints of others about our postings. That is the adult way of handling this, not running to mama.  Sure,  one can ignore Klepper's long,  long,  unedited (unread by him?) posts. But that means scrolling through pages of material everyday in a thread that is of more general jnterest. .  I suggested he put it in his Israel thread,  but he ignored that request.  I'm beginning to wonder if one of his friends in Israel is doing the posting? 

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Posted by Euclid on Tuesday, April 14, 2020 10:22 AM

Overmod
 

Always fun to have an external enemy you can demonize, especially with carefully-engineered straw-man-style arguments.  This has been happening with the Chinese...

I'm certainly no admirer of the Communist system in China and the various schemes it has developed.  The problem is in assuming that everything that is of Chinese descent, or that comes from China, is part of that "them".  

 

 

Just to be clear, I am not demonizing China as an external enemy.  I just don't like poor quality products.

The actual demonizing of China is being well handled Peter Navarro, the Administration, and others who have been particularly engerized by the perceived wrong that China has inflicted on us with the virus.  From that camp, I am hearing, "We have nothing against the Chinese people, but the Chinese Communist Party MUST GO!"

We seem to be assuming ownership of China that is biting off a lot more than we can chew.  I would prefer that we just get out of trade with China period rather than go to war with them.  I think that is far more realistic than this eternal P-contest over fair trade.  

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