British Railway Operations

[Anonymous]

if you wanto argue abouth the firwst railway then we could go on about the Merthyr tramway (1798) or even the one on the top of Dartmoor.

As for paying passengers. Richard Trevethick and the "Catch me if you Can". 1801 ish. Cornishman you know......hehehehhehehe.

I thought Birmingham was the UK's second largest city?

Anyway. I was bought up in Chester which is definately north of Watford and as my parents were NOT releated to each other before they got married I am not sure if I count as Cornish either... :-).

Association Football...pah. Rugby Football. Proper mans sport!

200 counties in England? Eh? 20 maybe. Not 200.

[mhurley87f]

The second Public Railway, i.e.authorised by Parliament, the Carmarthenshire Railway (and precursor to the Llanelli & Mynydd Mawr Railway) is reputed to have pipped the Surry Iron Railway at the post and opened first.

Was the Middleton Railway the grandaddy -wasn't an earlier tramway extant (around Prestonpans/Musselborough to the east of Edinburgh) at the time of the 1745 rebellion??

Certainly, by around 1800, there would have been dozens of tramways feeding the sizable number of Blast Furnaces going full blast (it was the time of the Napoleonic Wars, after all), as well as the canals, navigations, and estuarine and coastal shipping points wherever coal could be mined at shallow depths.

Martin

[John Bakeer]

Tulyar,
<Middlet railway .org.uk>
1758 early enough.
Leeds was home to more locomotive builders than anywhere, Hunslet, Hudswell Clarke. Fowler. etc.
John B.

[Tulyar15]

QUOTE: Originally posted by John Bakeer
Cogload,
Who do you think built the A1,2,3,4s and Deltics, and produced the steel. We were building railroads while the southern Brits were still knee deep in the bi-products of bovines.

Really? Then how do you explain the following:-

1st Public Railway - Surrey Iron Railway, 1801
1st Passengenger Railway - Oystermouth Railway, 1807

and the Canterbury and Wiltstable Railway opened May 1830, four months ahead of the Liverpool and Manchester!

As for the Deltics, I thought they were all built at Vulan Foundry which is in Cheshire not Yorkshire.

To be honest, I think the better half of Britain is that which lies north and/or west of a diagnonal line from Bristol to the Humber estuary. Generally I find people are more friendly on that side of the line.

[Murphy Siding]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Tulyar15

(For the benefit of those not familiar with British locos, they are given a coloured symbol to indicate which other locos they can work in multiple with. Most of the classic diesel electrics are coded "Blue Star" whilst the newer heavy freight diesels - classes 56 and 58 are "Red Diamond".

[(-D]This makes me think of something American children's clothing reatilers came up with about 20 years ago. It was called "Garanimals". Each shirt and pants had an animal on the label. Match the labels, and your clothes match. It was a feable ( and I think failed [;)]) attempt to get Americans to dress better.

[Murphy Siding]

OK I'm catching on now. All this fuss is about a soccer (or rugby?) game.[(-D]

I've marveled at how the Brits on this forum seem to be more civil to each other than us Americans. Maybe sports is what gets you riled up, instead of GE vs.EMD.[:)]
Have a good day-and I hope your team wins.

[M636C]

QUOTE: Originally posted by germanium

And, there are as nice people and countryside North of Watford as there are South of Watford. Dunno about Watford itself !!
(We won't mention the Cup Final yesterday !!)

Does anyone do an Engli***o American dictionary ? - I'm sure Murphy could use one.

It would go something like:

English:US

Lift/Elevator
Engine/Motor
Bonnet/Hood
Sleeper/Tie
Point/Switch
Bogie/Truck
Wagon/Car

and so on, forever...

M636C

[germanium]

And, there are as nice people and countryside North of Watford as there are South of Watford. Dunno about Watford itself !!
(We won't mention the Cup Final yesterday !!)

Does anyone do an Engli***o American dictionary ? - I'm sure Murphy could use one.

[John Bakeer]

Oh dear!
I must apologise to all you folks overseas, my outburst was provoked by the wall to wall coverage given to an Irish foot. Still I made a tenner on the Scousers (not that there were many English players in the team).
Cogload,
Who do you think built the A1,2,3,4s and Deltics, and produced the steel. We were building railroads while the southern Brits were still knee deep in the bi-products of bovines.
Of the 200-odd counties; Yorkshire is the UK's largest. May I remind you; that there are over 150 north of Watford including Wales and Scotland. I live in N Cheshire just outside Manchester the UK's second largest city.
If you want to hear North/South nobbling? You should tune into some of the US forums.
They do a fine line in insults without rancour, as anyone who has sat in the vault of a northern pub will attest.
Murphy,
Send your language queries to me and I will try to translate (The UK and USA are divided by a common langauge).
To All,
Please don't suppress humour, laughter makes the world a better place.
John B.

[Anonymous]

they play rugby here with everybody not born West of the Tamar.

Drop the caricatures chaps.

n.b. I don't think they have discovered "fire" yet in some parts of Yorkshire....;-)

[Tulyar15]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Murphy Siding

QUOTE: Originally posted by John Bakeer

GRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!
They play footy here with foriegn poofters.
John B.

??? But do they provide translation services for thoses of us west of the Atlantic who aren't even sure what you mean?[:0]

Well you can buy dialect books in Illkley, the Yorkshire Town famous for its moor and the song "On Ilkley Moor 'baht hat" (which translated into ROW English means "On Ilkley Moor without a hat".

[Murphy Siding]

QUOTE: Originally posted by John Bakeer

GRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!
They play footy here with foriegn poofters.
John B.

??? But do they provide translation services for thoses of us west of the Atlantic who aren't even sure what you mean?[:0]

[John Bakeer]

GRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!
They play footy here with foriegn poofters.
John B.

[germanium]

Yes I've been north of Watford - some nice caves up there, but the dinosaurs are a bit scary !

[Anonymous]

yes. born in Oxford.

[John Bakeer]

Have non of you guys been north of Watford?
John B.

[Tulyar15]

Yes, Cornwall is one of the nicest parts of Britain.

[Murphy Siding]

QUOTE: Originally posted by cogload

Slightly off topic here but hey. Yesterday morning the Up "Hind" (0507 Penzance - London Paddington) encountered a shopping trolley/ goggle box set which had been placed on the line at Dolcoath and promptly knocked the air cocks out. That train stood for two hours. Crawled into Cogloads station at around 07:45 (booked to depart at 05:42!). Train terminated. Queue of trains behind to Penzance. Sent train back to Pigsarse (Long Rock). Then the points failed in reverse at the west end. The 06:01 arrival crawled in at around 08:40. The first train East was eventually sent on its way at 09:10.

As you may imagine, there was a hefty queue especially on an AB railway with rather long signal sections. Managed to eventually sit down at 11:30 ish and rant at the world.

Today, sun shining, workwent smoothly and have just been for a 4 mile walk along Penhale beach with the sun setting and a smooth late evening tide with enough to tempt the late evening surfers. Turn 180 and the moon was low in the early evening sky, bright as a button. All what was missing was female company. Moral of the story - your work does not have to follow you home and I am very lucky to live where I do.

Just thought I would share that.

cogload: I do enjoy your commentary, although I'd have to admit that it sometimes requires multiple readings for me to fully understand. You're description of the ocean sure does sound like paradise to those of us that live 1500 miles from an ocean. Thanks

[Hugh Jampton]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Isambard

Cogload:
I speak some English and understand some Britspeak (my middle son and his new wife live in Southampton), however wrt "shopping trolley/ goggle box set ", what does "goggle box set" refer to??
[:)]

A TV

[Isambard]

Cogload:
I speak some English and understand some Britspeak (my middle son and his new wife live in Southampton), however wrt "shopping trolley/ goggle box set ", what does "goggle box set" refer to??
[:)]

[Murphy Siding]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Simon Reed

Dave - all IR and NIR locomotives are GM - there's been no British built locos in action since the Metropolitan-Vickers "A" class were withdrawn in 1997.

Murphy - travel on the Motorway (Interstate equivalent) in the UK. 90 is illegal but tame. My car is very comfortable at about 85 and that's probably about an average speed for cars.

Ah yes, but you've never ridden with my wife.[:0]

[Anonymous]

Slightly off topic here but hey. Yesterday morning the Up "Hind" (0507 Penzance - London Paddington) encountered a shopping trolley/ goggle box set which had been placed on the line at Dolcoath and promptly knocked the air cocks out. That train stood for two hours. Crawled into Cogloads station at around 07:45 (booked to depart at 05:42!). Train terminated. Queue of trains behind to Penzance. Sent train back to Pigsarse (Long Rock). Then the points failed in reverse at the west end. The 06:01 arrival crawled in at around 08:40. The first train East was eventually sent on its way at 09:10.

As you may imagine, there was a hefty queue especially on an AB railway with rather long signal sections. Managed to eventually sit down at 11:30 ish and rant at the world.

Today, sun shining, workwent smoothly and have just been for a 4 mile walk along Penhale beach with the sun setting and a smooth late evening tide with enough to tempt the late evening surfers. Turn 180 and the moon was low in the early evening sky, bright as a button. All what was missing was female company. Moral of the story - your work does not have to follow you home and I am very lucky to live where I do.

Just thought I would share that.

[Simon Reed]

Dave - all IR and NIR locomotives are GM - there's been no British built locos in action since the Metropolitan-Vickers "A" class were withdrawn in 1997.

Murphy - travel on the Motorway (Interstate equivalent) in the UK. 90 is illegal but tame. My car is very comfortable at about 85 and that's probably about an average speed for cars.

[Murphy Siding]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Simon Reed
To go back to a question raised by Murphy - what can you see at 90? Think about being a passenger on the highway.

The only time I was a passenger in a car going 90, was with my wife driving.[:0]. I only recall my life flashing before me-no scenery.[;)]

[John Bakeer]

With SMTS t's possible to run any thing from a Shinkansen to a SD70 MAC on the Cambrian or S&C, but it'll run Wrong line. Though when I do, ERNI gets rhe hiccoughs and goes into a sulk.
John B.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Tulyar15



Really? I'm surprised at that as much of the Cambrian between Shrewsbury & Machynlleth was upgraded for 90 mph running when the class 158 DMU's were introduced on the line in the 1990's. I gather some bits of the coast have (or will) upgraded to this maxima as 158's are now the standard rolling stock used on all scheduled passenger trains on the Cambrian. Their introduction enabled the journey time to be cut by 20 minutes between Shrewsbury & Machynlleth and the same level of service to be operated with one less unit as compared with the 70mph class 153 and 156's that were previously used. I dont know what speed t he 33's got up to. Officially I think they're now limited to 75mph (their max speed in BR days was only ever 85mph) but it certainly felt like we were achieving those sorts of speeds.

Ah - I stand corrected! Guess the MSTS pack must be set during the '70s (it has the old Class 101 DMUs, which were my principle reason for buying it). I can say that you don't want to ride in a 153 at 70 for any length of time - had a run back from Shrewsbury on one that was running late, driver didn't lift off the power once until we got to the junction at Craven Arms. Very loud, very rough!

[John Bakeer]

The EMD deisels have 'Big Mac &/or KFC' compatibility symbols?!
John B.

[daveklepper]

Friend returned to the USA and reported that Ireland and Northern Ireland have both reversed rail curtailments and are now making improvements and even opening up closed lines. He was of course impressed with Dublin's two light rail lines and with the north-south suburban electrication. He noted that most locomotives in Ireland are double-cab EMD's, and the rest British Brush, reengined with EMD diesels. He was impressed with "Enterprise" Doublin-Balfast service and the eight-trains a day each way schedule. Commuter rail is strong in both cities and Belfast is also planning some ligh rail.

[Tulyar15]

QUOTE: Originally posted by John Bakeer

Tulyar,
It appears that your Barmouth special did have two crews?
Unless there is some wonderous gadget that works via satellite and cardboard wireless?
John B.

I suspect you're right but can't say for sure. Just an aside, I think some of the Mk2 coaches used by Arriva and Wessex trains have been thru wired so that if you couple a "blue star" diesel loco at either end (eg Classes 31, 33 or 37) you can run the locos in multiple. The top and tail 31's used on the Bristol - Weymouth route last year were operated in this fashion I believe. (For the benefit of those not familiar with British locos, they are given a coloured symbol to indicate which other locos they can work in multiple with. Most of the classic diesel electrics are coded "Blue Star" whilst the newer heavy freight diesels - classes 56 and 58 are "Red Diamond". Not sure what code the EMD classes 66 and 67 are but they can multiple with each other).

As to the question of what you can see at 90mph, one of things we enjoyed seeing was our train overtaking cars on the adjacent road. Between Wolverhampton and Shrewsbury we overtook traffic on the M54 motorway and between Welshpool and Caersws (pronounc "Care -sous") we overtook cars on the parallel A road!

[Simon Reed]

Not on the route you took but I seem to remember that the Dovey Junction-Aberystwyth section is pretty fast running and has been so for a while.

To go back to a question raised by Murphy - what can you see at 90? Think about being a passenger on the highway. The foreground detail is a little blurred but that's about the only distortion.

What do you want to see? Anything further than about 20 feet from the train is perfectly clear, it just goes past a bit faster.

One of the disadvantages of the new build high speed rail lines in Europe is that they're often in cuttings or tunnels, or have "sound walls" built around them which does restrict your vision but out of those areas it's perfectly possible to enjoy the scenery even at 186mph.