Hey K4, where is the next question?
I still find it a bit hard to believe that they scrapped all the RF-1s. I suppose there was some attempt at preservation but the distance and location were too far, with no 'local' interest in having one for display.
The AuRoRa train was built out of WWII hospital cars. 18 of ARR's ex Army RSD1s were shrouded (and re-trucked to B-B) by various contract shops and ARR's own between 1947 and 1950, with a carbody that looked like a long-nosed F-unit with various porthole arrangements on the side. Some of the units were set up as B units. FP7s came in 1952, but the shrouded RS1s lasted into the 1960s.
http://alaskarails.org/pix/former-loco/UK-1070.html
Alaska Railroad had a fleet of converted war era hospital cars, as to the locomotive originally used, not sure but I think they were ALCo RS1's.
ACL had five twin-unit diners acquired from the giant C&O order in 1950. Two of the kitchen cars were built as kitchen-dormitories, the other three were rebuilt to kitchen-dormitories from kitchen-lunch counters. From 1962 on, three of the dining room cars were assigned to the Florida Special during the winter season without their kitchen cars, as recreation cars.
The Monon was well known for its low-budget streamliners, rebuilt from WWII Army hospital cars. Name the other railroad that built its streamliner using hospital cars, and describe the diesels that powered it before more conventional FP7s arrived in the early 1950s.
Yes. Twin-unit diners. I remember the entertainment car on the Floreida Special as bveing a regular loiunge car, not part of a two-car set.
so ask the next question.
The Florida Special was a winter-time-only all-Pullman operation of the ACL, using borrowed equipment. If a twin-unit diner was relettered for SCL, then they probably purchased it second-hand from Penn-Central. I was about to add that there were reports in the PRR days of the ACL borrowing the twin-sets from the General with winter traffic light on the PRR and heavy on the ACL. The times I rode the Florida Special were all in the ACL days, but after the FEC strike. At that time the entertainment car was separate and there were two regular diners on a very long train of sleepers, with UP yellow amd NP green represented heavily, along with a few stainless steel and tuscan red cars. On one occasion one of the diners was a rebgult pur;ple heavyweight.
By all means ask the next question.
And if someone does consult an accurate ACLK roster and finds ownership of such cars, I'll be glad to be corrected.
rcdryeDave, are you talking about twin-unit diners?
Certainly fits; we had a detailed conversation about them in late 2014:
http://cs.trains.com/ctr/f/3/t/218886.aspx
Incidentally, Ozark Mountain Railcar will sell you one of the NYC fluted-side examples for $63,000.
Dave, are you talking about twin-unit diners?
SCL did have entertainment cars on the Florida Special, and Amtrak might have used them the one winter the Special ran as an Amtrak train.
Just for fun, and not knowing anything with actual substance: cars equipped for showing 'in-flight' movies or providing other entertainment?
(I am still chuckling a bit about a design I did for Amtrak in the '70s that would convert a diner into a disco after hours... thank heaven the '70s are over!)
with one of these on the train, instead of the more usual, i would tend to have less reason to be impatient
Possdibly a few were leased to Amtrak, but none were bought or are operated today.
These cars were used exclusively for long-distance service on the NYCentral and almost exclusiveliy for long-distance service on the PRR, although on some specialo occasions they were used on the NEC. On the Ce3ntral a fewe were two-tone-grey with white stripe and a few were fliued, built by Budd. After the PC merger, the PRR's looked more like the stainless Centrals, because the Tuscan Red was sandblasted off to reveal stainless steel, and the cars were used intgerchangeably on PC long distance. The onliy PC long distance trains out of GCT were the "Steel Fleet" as nicknamed and the two remaining Montral trains, one combined with Empire corridor service GCT - Albany-Rens. The remqining units were typicalliy used on the steel fleet out of GCT and the Broadway (ex-General) out of Penn. By that time they were the only cars of this type in operation in North America. A Western railroad had already quit using the few there.
rcdryeBoth railroads also had scenery cars with end doors to transport stage sets.
Let's not forget the somewhat-similar horse cars.
The only things I can think of were conference cars (PRR) and stand-up bars (both, plus maybe New Haven). Both railroads also had scenery cars with end doors to transport stage sets.
SP had stand-up bars on some of its trains. The Del Monte carried one until the day of its last run, when it carried three.
Do I need to ask another question? Thought this would be easy!
I think NP defaulted on its bonds due to general traffic downturns and overbuilding. The Chicago ventures sure didn't help.
Rob:
I did not know that Jay Cooke was involved in Chicago area railroads or purchasing property. Was that part of the reason he lost control of the NP in 1893 or so?
Ed Burns
The former C&SW track is still in use along 16th St west to about 54th. The connectiing line on Harlem was abandoned in the 1920s when Chicago and West Towns (successor to the Suburban) stopped using it to get to their barn at 22nd (Cermak) and Harlem.
So the tracks still exist, at least most of the tracks.
In the lighweight era, there was on passenger amenity that both the New York ?Central and the Pennsylvania both had, an not other eastern railroad. And it lastred into the Amtrak era in use both on ex-NYC and ex-PRR lines. Ir is a type of railway car, unique in the East to those two railroads. And even before Amtrak, the PRR cars redceived a change making them less distinguishable from aboiut the Half the NYC cars. There were not very many of these, on either railroad, just a few. I think one or two may have been saved.
Grant's plant was to have been one of the largest industrial plants ever built. The Chicago and Southwestern Railway was built by the Chicago and Northern Pacific running from what's now the B&OCT line to Forest Park south along Kenton Avenue (Belt Railway) to 16th St., where it turned west through Cicero to Harlem, where it turned north again to connect to the (now) B&OCT again. NP invested heavily in the scheme, buying large tracts of Cicero for expected housing and industrial development, something that came much later in Cicero. The scheme failed as Grant was hit by a strike and the panic of 1893.
The C&SW remained as a pokey industrial lead, losing its frequent and empty commuter trains. The line in Harlem Avenue was used for a time by Suburban Railroad streetcars between Harrison and 16th. With the rest of the Chicago & Northern Pacific, it passed to the Chicago Terminal & Transfer and to B&OCT in 1910.
Easier than I thought it would be!
Grant Locomotive Works, Chicago.
They did build about 24 locomotives in Chicago in the new plant before closing.
Ypu aare cprrect abpit the non-mu LIRR combines; they had both cleristory and arch-roof PB54s. All P54s, again all or nearly all arch-roof on the LIRR (only) and PB54s were built with the conduit and attachment fittings so that they could be converted to mu cars. In fact, some PRR P54s (cleristory roof, of course) were converted to MP54s post-WWII. The were distringuished by aluminum window frames.
I understand this was also true of Erie Stillwell suburban cars. The provision of conduit and fittings, not the conversion itself, of course.
A tough question you have posed!
LIRR did have some arch roof combines (PB57) but not MU ones.
This medium-size steam locomotive builder proposed in 1890 what would have been the largest steam locomotive plant in the US. A major western railroad purchased large tracts of land near the proposed plant, and even built a branch line to its site to haul materials and workers for the plant which closed shortly after it was completed. A strike and the panic of 1893 bankrupted both the locomotive builder and the major western railroad. Name the company and the city where the plant was to be built.
Right, there were no MPB-54s with arch roofs. All MP4Bs had cleristories. Next question?
Except for the 30 you pointed out, all MP-54s had arch roofs on the LIRR. Hundreds
There were 47 MPB-54 MU baggage-coach combines with clerestories. There were about 30 MU MP-54 coaches that had clerestories as well, and another 29 MU MP-54C cars with arch roofs. P-54 trailers also had arch roofs.
Most LIRR mu equipoment differed from PRR mus not only in having propulsion eeeequipment and third rail pickup bu talso in having arch roofs instead of cleristory roofs. But there were nus of a particular configuration that never had arch roofs, on cleristory roofs. Which mus were these? (Other than the first Gibbs MP-43 cars near duplicages of the first IRT steels).
Correct. NYC used Budds for a few months on the Albany shuttles before they were discontinued. All of them (NYC, B&M, D&H) used RS2s or RS3s (The Rutland/B&M trains pooled them), though the NYC liked GP7s as well. Troy was closed in 1957 as a passenger station with all train exchanges moved to Albany, though a track remained there until sometime in the Penn Central era.
Troy, with the NYC and B&M, both using Budds, the B&M Budds visiting regularly, and the D&H and Rutland third and fourth railroads, except that the Rutland arrived on B&M trackage rights.
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