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Classic Railroad Quiz (at least 50 years old).

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Posted by Overmod on Saturday, February 17, 2024 10:06 AM

Still trying to come up with a good one.

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Posted by rcdrye on Sunday, February 4, 2024 2:06 PM

Well done!  The first five, lettered for Virginian as 900-904, never ran there, becoming N&W 2000-2004 instead.   The USA class and postwar USB class (many rebuilt to USC and USD) eventually numbered 40 engines. The ex-N&W USEs came from the AT&SF in 1947, which bought them for helper service from the N&W in 1943. Though not the original 5, they were the same N&W Y-3 class as the first USRA engines.

Virginian also had 7 pre-USRA 2-8-8-2s (class AD and AE, Alco-Richmond 1910)

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Posted by Overmod on Sunday, February 4, 2024 12:52 PM

That's going to be the USRA 2-8-8-2 (notably enough, substantially developed out of the Y2 class of the 'most famous of the three railroads' -- a set of blueprints being helpfully made available to the USRA design committee early.)

Those first five were lettered for the Virginian.  The latter 20 acquired by that road were their (appropriately chosen!) USA class; I can't find any mention of the 'second' road they might have been offered to while VGN was reluctant to take them immediately postwar.

There were 15 more (USB) in 1923, but I can find no indication of these being built for someone else.

The Virginian USE was (coming more than full circle) ex-N&W Y-3s.

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Posted by rcdrye on Friday, February 2, 2024 7:31 AM

Penn Station Third rail had about the same clearance diagram as Grand Central.  The old "Official Register of Passengr Train Equipment" had restriction lists for various classes of equipment. Without going too far into the weeds, there were several variations of the GSC truck with outside swing hangers.  My bet is that Pullman (and Pullman-Bradley) made sure the ones intended for use in the New York area were carefully chosen.  Oof course all of the Budd-built 10-6s from AT&SF, UP ans SP that made up the backbone of Amtrak's sleeper fleet were OSH-equipped.

One of the USRA types created during WWI was designed for a specific service.  The first 5, built by Alco-Schenectady, were lettered and numbered for one railroad, but ended up being delivered to a second, where they formed the basis of a large and famous class, most of which were not built by Alco.  The first railroad did eventually get similar engines built by Alco-Richmond, along with some post-USRA examples from the second railroad via a third railroad.  Name all three railroads.

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, February 2, 2024 2:40 AM

1.  The AT&SF baggage cars sold to the NYNH&H were pre-WWII.

2.  But both underrunning NYCentral and standard H&M, BMT-IND, LIRR third rail had no problem with regular swing-hanger trucks,  Recall that post-WWII AT&SF sleepers ran into both Penn and GCT in transcontinental sleeper service.

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Posted by Overmod on Thursday, February 1, 2024 7:33 PM

rcdrye
...a lot of later AT&SF equipment had outside swing hanger trucks, which weren't allowed in third rail territory.

According to John White, some of the most extreme-width OSH trucks were provided on late orders of New Haven equipment -- he even has a cross-section of one in The American Passenger Car.  Were cars with those bolster arrangements only allowed to operate into Penn Station, and not to GCT by way of New Rochelle?

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Posted by rcdrye on Thursday, February 1, 2024 8:00 AM

The AT&SF baggage cars must have been pre-war, as a lot of later AT&SF equipment had outside swing hanger trucks, which weren't allowed in third rail territory.

The milk cars off the D&H and Rutland must have been handled on the West Side line.

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, February 1, 2024 7:21 AM

By aaven's  wood baggll means ask the next question.  You got the right railroad  for the MUs, but not the New  Haven's Wood short baggage-only cars, which continued to enter and leave GCT until the Central insisted they be replaced, which they were with a few AT&SF lightweights.

The original NYNH&H AC-DC MUs, which were open-platform, but longer than the Central's DC MUs, ran into GCT until around 1948. But continued in use on the Norwalk - Danbury shuttle and the New Cannan  Stamford shuttle, the latter until the 4400s, the :"Wasboards" arrived.

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Posted by rcdrye on Wednesday, January 31, 2024 1:40 PM

New Haven still had some open-platform MU cars into the 1940s.  The wooden cars would be express refrigerator cars.  Express and milk reefers continued in use on the west side line until the milk trains stopped in the late 1950s.

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, January 31, 2024 7:39 AM

The DeLaware & Hudson also had all-steel open-platform coaches in Sranton - Carbondale service, which I rode in the summer, 1950.

But these into GCT were even more unique and lasted also lasted until until well after WWII, although in the  end their last assignment did not include running into GCT, just every connection possible with trains  that did.

And some wood non-perople cars  did continue to serve the railroad for a  few years, but not into GCT.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Monday, January 29, 2024 10:09 AM

I can reluctantly understand why South Shore gets overlooked since it started losing its interurban character when the Insull steel cars were delivered in 1927.  I would opine that South Shore lost its last interurban characteristics when the steeplecabs were retired since mainline street running also existed on several steam railroads.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, January 29, 2024 3:07 AM

Hints:

The wood steel-underframe vcars did not carry passengers

The open-platform cars were steel, built in the 20th Century, and operated into GCT on its opening day.

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, January 28, 2024 5:41 AM

During WWII, open-platform passenger-carrying equipment regularly operated into Grand Central Terminal during rush hours.

And wooden cars of one specific type even after WWII untill replaced by second-hand lightweight replaqcements.

All details for both situations, please.

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Posted by rcdrye on Thursday, January 25, 2024 6:44 PM

Except that the system was not publicly owned until 1985, that's pretty much accurate.  PRR handled the ownership via PRR/PRSL's West Jersey and Seashore, whose initials were painted on all Atlantic City equipment, including the Brillliners.  Operation was handled by the Atlantic City & Shore, which was a management firm. After the sale the Atlantic City Transporation Company owned the property.  The Shore Fast Line used PRR(WJ&S) tracks between Atlantic City and Ocean City by trackage rights, so ACTC never owned the line to Ocean City.  

The P-RSL didn't change much, except that the Reading got consulted.

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, January 25, 2024 6:57 AM

The Atlantic City System, with the interurban running over first PRR-owned and then Pennsylvania-Reading Seashore Line's track.  Municipal ownership led to ending freight service and then first replacement of the interurban to Ocean City and then replacement of the modern "Miss America" Brilliner fleet with buses.

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Posted by rcdrye on Wednesday, January 24, 2024 3:23 PM

Rail operation of both the streetcar line and the interurban continued for a few years after the sale by the class I.  All operations eventually were replaced by buses.  All track was standard gauge.

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, January 24, 2024 12:40 PM

Several lines meet that  description.  Did asseeger service continue on rails?  Does pasenger service on rails exist today?  were not some rail service converted to bus while others continued.  And did not and today' railoperations involve two gauges?

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Posted by rcdrye on Wednesday, January 24, 2024 7:15 AM

This streetcar line and associated interurban, which lasted until after World War II, operated almost entirely on track owned by a class I railroad, which provided steam powered freight service over some of the lines involved.  Sale of the line to new owners ended freight service.

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, January 23, 2024 11:40 AM

RC, would you like to ask the next quwestion here?

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Tuesday, January 23, 2024 10:21 AM

I just finished on the other thread.  Somebody else can come up with a new question.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by rcdrye on Tuesday, January 23, 2024 6:44 AM

CSSHegewisch is up.  Due to the pause someone else can step up.

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, January 23, 2024 12:57 AM

RC or I?

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Posted by Overmod on Monday, January 22, 2024 5:44 PM

Time for another question...

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Posted by rcdrye on Saturday, December 23, 2023 11:11 AM

CSSHEGEWISCH

That suggests that the northbound runs ran around the Loop L in order to stop opposite La Salle Street Station before making a right turn at Lake & Wells to head toward Milwaukee.

 

The left turn at Lake and Wells was there for South Side trains (which used the outer loop).  From 1913 to 1969 the loop was operated in a counter-clockwise direction on both tracks.  The outer loop track had a direct entrance from LaSalle Street Station. For NYC patrons to connect with North Shore trains at the Adams and Wabash station would have been, at best, messy.  With the around-the-loop arrangement passengers could have a leisurely meal at LaSalle Street while their baggage was transferred to the Congress Street stub.  The Limiteds would pick up the combine at Roosevelt Road before looping to pick up passengers.  At Lake and Wells, the Limiteds would resume their trips north.  This practice may only have lasted a short time.  Observations were removed from trains in 1930 or so.

North Shore honored interline tickets and baggage checks, not a common practice on interurbans.

This practice is hinted at, but not directly documented, in several North Shore books and articles.

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Posted by daveklepper on Saturday, December 23, 2023 10:34 AM

Up to the end of service, at least some southbound morning rush-hour trains circled the Loop, running on the Wells Street portion twice, before running to Roosevelt Road.  I assume they did not stop at the Wells Street Stations a second time.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Saturday, December 23, 2023 10:04 AM

That suggests that the northbound runs ran around the Loop L in order to stop opposite La Salle Street Station before making a right turn at Lake & Wells to head toward Milwaukee.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by rcdrye on Thursday, December 21, 2023 10:25 AM

Both north and southbound trips terminated at 63rd and Dorchester (how the trains with observation cars got turned there is another story).  Ordinary north and southbound trains had runs of the same length.  Only the ones that advertised direct connections to NYC trains had the extra northbound distance.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Thursday, December 21, 2023 10:04 AM

Northbound trips started at 63rd & Dorchester while southbound trains terminated at Roosevelt Rd.

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Posted by rcdrye on Thursday, December 21, 2023 6:11 AM

Despite operating on a track layout poorly suited for single-ended cars, the North Shore Line had several brass-railed parlor-observations.  They were assigned to trains like the Badger Limited and Eastern Limited, advertising direct connections with New York Central trains, including the 20th Century Limited.  Northbound trips for trains making these connections were two miles longer than southbound trips.  Explain the reason.

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