Trains.com

CANADIAN PASSENGER RAILROADS - Let's talk! BYOB ........

29384 views
375 replies
1 rating 2 rating 3 rating 4 rating 5 rating
  • Member since
    May 2014
  • 3,727 posts
Posted by trolleyboy on Thursday, August 31, 2006 6:15 PM

Good evening folks. Interesting to see this thread back up and running and a going concern again Thumbs Up [tup]

DL-Nice to make your aqauintance.I'm one of Tom's barflies as well,so if the welcome mat ahsn't been thrown down enough yet, allow me to place it at your feet as well.Smile [:)]I think you will enjoy your trip,gotta put a good word in for te how team as they say seeing as how the Great Dominion is my home country and all. I'll echo Tom however, if you can make that side trip out to the Delson Museum it will be very worthwhile.

Marc-There is two TEE's left in North Bay, both in dreadfull shape the city and a small group of musuem members are starting to restore them ( strictly for static display on the waterfront ). The ONR is still an intregal railway in the North of my province, with the Polar Bear express and the Little Bear mixed train still calling on all the isolated ( and roadless in some cases ) small towns up around Jame's Bay.Usual trains now consiost of the ONR's GP38-2's and the old single level Go transit cars that have been refurbished for intercity service.The Polar Bear will tack on a dome car for the summer to fall tourist season, and occationally the rebuilt F7A's will pinch hit as power on the train still. Here's a couple recent photo's I snapped in North Bay this past july.

 

Rob

  • Member since
    January 2006
  • From: northeast U.S.
  • 1,225 posts
Posted by LoveDomes on Thursday, August 31, 2006 3:31 PM

G'day!

Good to see ya again DL and am happy to know that you've peeked in the window over at "Our" Place - next time c'mon in. The bar is open Mon thru Sat - and we use Sundays for photo posting . . . I think you'll find us an intersesting lot. Thumbs Up [tup]

Chicago is indeed a great city to browse and spend some time in - and that's coming from a New Yorker (Yawker!). <grin> Always have enjoyed our stays in the Windy City and find it still has a mid-western "air" about it - in spite of the demographic changes - massive changes indeed. But then again, what large city hasn't experienced that, huh Question [?]

I have no current info regarding Montreal or the remainder of Quebec to share with you, but it appears Captain Tom has come to the fore. Thumbs Up [tup] He's most dependable that way, as you'll soon discover.

Nice shot of the TEE, Captain Tom, and wouldn't it be something to board one of those ONR trains Question [?] Several years back we had looked into taking their Polar Bear Express with a couple of the grandkids - but backed off because of the scheduling and difficulty in getting from here to there without incurring a 2nd mortgage on the house. <grin> Not the most accessible of places - but some interesting railroading to say the least.

 

CP FP9A #1416 (photo: Ted Ellis)

 

TurboTrain VIA Rail/CN (from: www.trainweb.com)

 

Until the next time! Thumbs Up [tup]

 

Lars

  • Member since
    February 2004
  • From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA
  • 7,214 posts
CANADIAN PASSENGER RAILROADS - Let's talk! BYOB ........
Posted by siberianmo on Thursday, August 31, 2006 2:14 PM

Greetings DL!

While in the Montreal area, I highly recommend going to the Canadian Railway Museum at Delson-St. Constant. This URL should be of help to you and includes a map:

http://www.exporail.org/musee/musee_crm.htm

When we stay overnight in Montreal, we stay at the Montreal Marriott Chateau Champlain hotel located within walking distance of the Central Station (Gare Centrale). Anyway, the rear of the hotel overlooks the VIA Rail sheds and makes for some fascinating time watching the make up and break up of trains, etc. Just request a room overlooking the rail yards - say about the 8th floor or higher. That should do just fine.  This URL may be of assistance:

 http://marriott.com/property/propertypage/YULCC

Insofar as public places for viewing, my experiences in walking throughout the city have found that the higher the elevation, the better the view and they aren't all that accessible. Perhaps someone reading this may offer some inside scoop . . .

Can't help you with Quebec City.

We have a "regular" over at the bar who lives in Chicagoland (that's the "locals" reference) - anyway, he commutes using the Metra and has Posted some great Pix on our Thread over the past year or so. Chicago is a wonderful town for taking in the RRs - lots of activity there and in my opinion is one of the USAs finest places to visit, IF one enjoys big city life.

Glad you checked "us" out and hope we'll be seeing you as a 'customer' before too long . . .


Enjoy! Thumbs Up [tup]

Tom (siberianmo) Captain [4:-)]Pirate [oX)]

Happy Railroading! Siberianmo
  • Member since
    August 2006
  • 280 posts
Posted by DL - UK on Thursday, August 31, 2006 11:40 AM

Thanks for that invite Lars, in fact I've just checked out 'Our' place following your and Tom's invitation and it was good to browse, being restrained as we English are I've not posted yet, but will be back.

I've e-mailed VIA to request forward facing seating and proximity to the Dome on The Ocean following your advice Tom, I'll see what they say - I see their e-mail booking confirmation allocated me to a car and a room automatically. Thanks also for your night time Dome visit tips. I won't miss that.

Your mention of Chicago reminds me of the pic in Classic Trains earlier this year from late 1960s of, I think, Hinsdale (or west Hinsdale) with a Burlington commuter service (correct me if I'm wrong) viewed from the air. I've given that edition to my parents as they lived in Chicago from 1964 - 1968 before I was born, and my mother commuted on that route from one of the adjacent stations into the City every day. Links with family friends from that time have taken me back to Chicago on a number of occasions and a few years back enjoyed riding some of the Metra routes around the City.

Last question - it occurs to me to ask if there are any locomotive sheds, car shops, depots etc with visibility from public locations in the Montreal area you chaps would recommend I take in whilst staying in the Montreal / Quebec City area? Any railroad / transportation museums in Quebec area I should take in? It is usually possible to squeeze such locations in to the sightseeing itinery.

All good wishes

DL

 

 

  • Member since
    February 2004
  • From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA
  • 7,214 posts
CANADIAN PASSENGER RAILROADS - Let's talk! BYOB ........
Posted by siberianmo on Thursday, August 31, 2006 8:19 AM
G'day Marc (in Newfoundland and Labrador)!

In a word, yes - the Ontario Northland is alive 'n well. They still operate passenger service and there's some good scoop at: http://www.northlander.ca/

Would be grand to see the TEEs restored - heard a similar endeavor is taking place with ONR - but I believe moreso with volunteers and a skimpy budget. Perhaps someone "out there" can enlighten us . . .

Regarding this Thread - there's all kinds of info jammed into the pages - it started off with a lot of enthusiasm - lost direction - went into hibernation - and seems to be resurfacing. Appreciate your interest! Thumbs Up [tup]

ONR Northlander TEE train (foto credit: Bob Boudreau)



Tom (siberianmo) Captain [4:-)]Pirate [oX)]
Happy Railroading! Siberianmo
  • Member since
    November 2002
  • From: NL
  • 614 posts
Posted by MStLfan on Thursday, August 31, 2006 6:13 AM

It is my first time on this post. Scanned the first 10 pages very quickly but did not see anything on the Ontario Northland. Are they still in business?

5 cars of the former Dutch / Swiss TEE service (running as Northlander in Canada) are now in the Netherlands to be restored.

greetings,

Marc Immeker

For whom the Bell Tolls John Donne From Devotions upon Emergent Occasions (1623), XVII: Nunc Lento Sonitu Dicunt, Morieris - PERCHANCE he for whom this bell tolls may be so ill, as that he knows not it tolls for him; and perchance I may think myself so much better than I am, as that they who are about me, and see my state, may have caused it to toll for me, and I know not that.
  • Member since
    February 2004
  • From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA
  • 7,214 posts
CANADIAN PASSENGER RAILROADS - Let's talk! BYOB ........
Posted by siberianmo on Wednesday, August 30, 2006 3:54 PM

Hello DL,

Glad you found my Post and that the info will be of use. Thumbs Up [tup]

I see my friend, Lars, has been here today and seized the moment to invite you over to "Our" Place. Smile,Wink, & Grin [swg] Won't add anything to that which he provided other than to say, you're most welcome to stop by.

The reference to the Isle of Skye brings to mind some very fond memories. No, I haven't ever been there - but for a time in my family, one would have thought we had. The family pet was a Skye Terrior - a great loving dog who was indeed a rare find. That began a bit of research to find out just where he originated - which of course led to all kinds of interesting facets and facts about Scotland and the Isle.

Have always had a fascination with and for the trains of Great Britain and one day hope to take advantage of a trip or three! Smile,Wink, & Grin [swg] And yes, I understand the looming threat of discontinuance with the overnight travel . . . we here in the states live with that all of the time. Even in Canada there has been more than cursory talk of eliminating the long distance trains and going more to a point-to-point system with overnights in hotels. The spiraling costs of staffing those trains, maintaining them and providing the amenities expected by those who can afford to ride them would gag a healthy maggot.<grin>

I shall run that itinerary by my friend, Pete from Rugby, and should you visit us at "Our" Place - perhaps you two will have a chance to "meet." Thanx! Thumbs Up [tup]

The California Zephyr of old was "THE" train to take, amongst several others when crossing the continent. I'm very partial to "The Canadian" when operated by the Canadian Pacific but alas, never had the pleasure. My wife and I have crossed Canada on 4 trips aboard VIA Rail's version - "Canadian" (dropped the "the" - for whatever the rationale!). Anyway, it's a wonderful experience as will be your trip to Nova Scotia. Dome travel is most enjoyable and one thing that always comes to mind is sitting up there at night. Watching the headlight "playing games" as it widens and narrows when approaching highway overpasses, or narrow passages, and tunnels is great fun. Yes, I think you will have a marvelous time of it. Thumbs Up [tup]

Appreciate the response!

Tom (siberianmo)Captain [4:-)]Pirate [oX)]

Happy Railroading! Siberianmo
  • Member since
    January 2006
  • From: northeast U.S.
  • 1,225 posts
CANADIAN PASSENGER RAILROADS - Let's talk! BYOB ........
Posted by LoveDomes on Wednesday, August 30, 2006 1:53 PM

G'day DL!

My name is Lars (LoveDomes) and I just read your posting . . . I think you may find some interesting conversation along with similarities of experiences over at Tom's bar 'n grill on the Classic Trains forums - General Discussion. It's called "Our" Place and is a cyber bar 'n grill - lots of great interaction - adult conversation and humor - wonderful material and photos. Hope you get the chance to stop by - we're hospitable, but rather structured. Check us out, you may like what you see!

You struck a positive note with the mention of the "California Zephyr" at one time America's premier dome train. To this day, even under Amtrak's operation, we try to make one annual round trip to the left coast. Lately we fly from New York City (where I reside) to Chicago, then embark upon our journey to the Pacific. Wonderful scenery - but alas, things have changed as Amtrak's budget and maintenance seems to dwindle into the abyss.

Had one marvelous rail experience in the UK some years back. I used to sail the 7 seas as a "merchie" and had some time while in Portsmouth/Southampton. Took a rail sojourn northward - got totally snokered (as opposed to snookered) when I hooked up with a couple of Brit sailors who were bound 'n determined to "show me" the sights. Must've been a wonderful time. Smile,Wink, & Grin [swg]

Must agree with Tom though, the best of North American passenger rail travel is in Canada aboard Via Rail! They still do it right and their long distance trains are simply grand experiences. Best to you on your voyage to Nova Scotia! Thumbs Up [tup]

Nice to have "met" you and hope to see ya over at the bar!

Lars

  • Member since
    August 2006
  • 280 posts
Posted by DL - UK on Wednesday, August 30, 2006 11:54 AM

Thanks Tom

 

Public holiday w/e means I’ve been away from the computer so just read your post.

 

Thanks for those tips, they will all be handy. I’ll e-mail VIA re compartment location and see what they say.

 

We should not have too much problem with the ticket collection as we fly into Montreal about 2 weeks before our journey – It was my intention to go and check out the station geography then, and ask about getting our tickets. I’m relaxed about the language, as we get taught French in school and although I make no claim to speak it properly I can manage enough lines to get by! Other people I know who have visited the French part of Canada tell me we should manage OK!

 

The seating layout is typical of UK First Class – 2 on one side – 1 on the other. Shame the diner is not proper chef food – it should be really, and like you I prefer the old ways. If you want airline food – travel by plane!

 

Thanks also for the tips on the scenery. In fact the thing is, being in a foreign country almost anything you see is interesting. I found this out 5 years back first time I took a north American train journey since I was in Toronto with family and wanted to see friends in Chicago. Took me a while to persuade others that flying between the two was not required, we took The International train (no longer in the schedule I believe) and although it is not the most scenic of rides, it was still fascinating to observe the communities and country side en-route. A couple of years later my brother was working for a short period in Boulder – so on a visit I took the opportunity to go Denver – Emeryville and back on the California Zephyr. A great journey of course. This trip on The Ocean will be my first long distance Canadian journey. And first ever 'real' dome!

 

We will manage OK with the small room size, as UK sleeping cars are small inside and we tend to travel light anyway.

 

In fact I did not realise that the whole Renaissance vehicles needed re-build work on insulation – I know they were sold at a knock down price by UK govt. but after all that work one wonders if VIA did indeed get a bargain.

 

On a related matter you should start planning a UK visit – you are right – sleeper LondonScotland is a good journey – but with small distances here (and faster line speeds) you tend to leave London after dark and arrive at Scottish destination early morning. The Highland Sleeper runs north through Rugby (non stop at about 10pm) and then splits into three portions in Edinburgh in the early hours – 1 for Aberdeen, 1 for Fort William in the West Highlands, and 1 for Inverness. The latter 2 are the most scenic and the Fort William one arrives mid morning so in summer plenty of daylight to view this highly scenic Highland journey.

 

A classic summer trip would be: north from London to Fort William on over night sleeper which connects into Fort William to Mallaig scheduled summer only daily steam hauled service. From Mallaig take ship to Isle of Skye and bus to place to stay on the island for a few days. Then bus off Isle of Skye to Kyle of Lochalsh where take train on highly scenic route to Inverness. Stay in Inverness (or at least take evening meal in Inverness) – then take overnight sleeper back to London. Do this mid June to get benefit of longest daylight hours. Run this itinerary past your Missouri based Rugby born friend and see what he thinks!

 

The reason you need to plan your journey before too long is these overnight services are under continual low level threat of withdrawal (something you north Americans must live with all the time of course). The stock was built by British Rail in the early 1980s and is still in good condition. Many routes were scrapped in the run up to privatisation in the 1990s and many sleeping cars withdrawn at that time. Current operators run minimal services with no spare stock (so on busy holiday weekends they can not extend the trains, so they do not promote the service as they can’t cope with demand). The original chunnel night train plan was scrapped before it was ever tested out, and this meant there is no chance of new generation sleeping cars for UK services. When the powers that be decide the 1980s sleeper cars are ‘life expired’ no new ones will be built – it will be used as an excuse to withdraw the service. That will not happen yet, but it is hard to see the service still in existence in 10 years time. As a result I try to take a couple of UK sleeper journeys each year whilst I can.

 

I’m digressing from the forum topic, but I hope I’ll be excused.

 

DL

 

  • Member since
    February 2004
  • From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA
  • 7,214 posts
CANADIAN PASSENGER RAILROADS - Let's talk! BYOB ........
Posted by siberianmo on Tuesday, August 29, 2006 1:27 PM

G'day!

A few Pix from a recent trip to Toronto and some riding of the rails . . . Metro might enjoy these, as they feature GO Tranist . . .

 

GO Transit ticket counter at Toronto's Union Station

 

GO Transit car at Union Station

 

GO Transit train (east bound) at Pickering Station

 

Enjoy! Thumbs Up [tup]

 

Tom (siberianmo) Captain [4:-)]Pirate [oX)]

Happy Railroading! Siberianmo
  • Member since
    January 2006
  • From: northeast U.S.
  • 1,225 posts
CANADIAN PASSENGER RAILROADS - Let's talk! BYOB ........
Posted by LoveDomes on Tuesday, August 29, 2006 1:06 PM

G'day Captain Tom!

Didn't realize that you were resurrecting your old thread so far away from the Classic Trains forums! Smile,Wink, & Grin [swg] Good to see ya "oooot 'n aboooot" and getting back into the swing of things once again. Thumbs Up [tup]

That last post from Metro reminds me a bit of my first trip by rail into Canada. Was way back "when" as my dad took us on a round trip to Montreal. It was back in the late 40s and my memories are somewhat vivid and hazy at the same time.

We departed from the "Grand Lady" herself, Grand Central Terminal in New York City and had sleeping car accommodations. It was a long, long trip and it was a rather cold time of year, for I recall staring out of the windows at the snowy landscape zipping by the windows, along with the telephone poles! My brothers and I gave mom 'n dad a merry chase through the cars as we drove them, and probably everyone else, totally nuts! <grin>

Later on in life, during the emergence of Amtrak, I took the train to both Toronto and Montreal. No comparison, although I did enjoy the club cars! <grin> <double grin>

Isn't it a sad reality to realize that what once was, just isn't anymore Question [?] As you know, but others may not - I'm a retired sailor - spent many years at sea as a "merchie." Those days and companies and ships are long, long gone along with all the attendant support industries as well. Thumbs Down [tdn]

Wish you well with your efforts over here and see ya back at the bar! Thumbs Up [tup]

 

Until the next time! Thumbs Up [tup]

 

Lars

  • Member since
    October 2003
  • From: Milwaukee & Toronto
  • 929 posts
Posted by METRO on Tuesday, August 29, 2006 12:26 PM
My first train memory is of GO Transit in Toronto. The gleaming green and white F7ACPUs and the old silver single-level self powered coaches. I remember taking the train down to Toronto Union Station then connecting to the VIA train to Niagra Falls, which was the first time I'd seen them.

I must have been about 5 at the time and took the trip with my dad, and met my grandfather (who was living in Buffalo) at the falls. My most vivid memory is of the white line on the GO platform, and how my dad told me that if I crossed that line and a train came it would go so fast that it would suck me up into the air and I'd blow away.

That day I also got to see the Northlander and several CN business cars too.

Cheers!
~METRO
  • Member since
    February 2004
  • From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA
  • 7,214 posts
CANADIAN PASSENGER RAILROADS - Let's talk! BYOB ........
Posted by siberianmo on Tuesday, August 29, 2006 11:50 AM

G'day!

A Pix or two may rekindle the interest . . . .

 

courtesy: www.viarail.ca

 

courtesy: www.viarail.ca

 

Enjoy! Thumbs Up [tup]

 

Tom (siberianmo) Captain [4:-)]Pirate [oX)]

Happy Railroading! Siberianmo
  • Member since
    February 2004
  • From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA
  • 7,214 posts
CANADIAN PASSENGER RAILROADS - Let's talk! BYOB ........
Posted by siberianmo on Monday, August 28, 2006 4:24 PM

G'day!

Party time in the Park car's Mural Lounge or the Bullet Lounge or up in the Dome is "where it's at!" Thumbs Up [tup] Now, signing off on one of the murals, well that's 'nother story. <grin>

For anyone who doesn't know and may have an interest, those artists (the "Group of Seven") that Tatans referred to are (were):  Franklin Carmichael, Lawren Harris, A. Y. Jackson, Frank Johnston, Arthur Lismer, J. E. H. MacDonald, and Frederick Varley. These men were included within a larger group of artists who were commissioned to paint the distinctive murals in the Park cars.

Long live the Park cars! Thumbs Up [tup]

Tom (siberianmo)Captain [4:-)]Pirate [oX)]

Happy Railroading! Siberianmo
  • Member since
    May 2004
  • 4,115 posts
Posted by tatans on Monday, August 28, 2006 1:16 PM
I believe some of the murals were saved (I hope) as some of the artists were from the original group of seven (now we all know them fromCanadian history,don't we??? ) I hate to admit this, but in 1964 I travelled across Canada and had a few parties in these cars and I think I signed my name on the bottom of one of the murals ( I said I think I did) naughty, naughty.
  • Member since
    February 2004
  • From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA
  • 7,214 posts
CANADIAN PASSENGER RAILROADS - Let's talk! BYOB ........
Posted by siberianmo on Friday, August 25, 2006 11:54 AM
G'day DL!

Would love to experience a rail trip in the UK and have always thought of an overnight to Scotland from London. I have a close friend (mate) who now resides here in Missouri, USA, originally born and raised in Rugby. He and I have shared many a rail trip story while traveling day trips aboard Amtrak - his stories are so much more interesting than mine! <grin> Anyway, on to your Post . . .

Hopefully these comments will address your questions . . .

The use of the "Renaissance" equipment on the "Ocean" will continue throughout the calendar year. The only thing different in November is the Budd Park Car gets taken off the line. The idea was (and is) to use that car as a promotional gimmick for the tourist season (May-Nov). This plan has been in the mill for several years but has been somewhat sidetracked due to a host of issues with the former Chunnel cars.

A glaring problem was the insufficient insulation to hold up to Canadian winters. As I understand it, the cars then had to go into the shop in New Brunswick for reitting. There were several other adaptations that had to be made as well, which delayed the full implementation of the cars on the route of the "Ocean." A sad, sad day for those of us who appreciated "what was" and are still resisting "what is" by simply avoiding passage aboard those cars. 'Nuf said on that.

Insofar as the sleeping preferences you desire: most certainly communicate directly with VIA by the most expeditious means available to you. I'm a bit surprised the were tardy in an e-mail response, for most of my experiences have had replies within 48 hours of the initial request. At any rate, with sufficient lead time, there should not be any problem with having a forward facing room in the central portion of the car. I'd also recommend having a car assignment closest to the Park Car - with only one dome in the consist, you may wish to have proximity in your favor.

The only difference in bedrooms units between "Easterly" and "Easterly Deluxe" is having a shower within the toilet compartment in your room. I found those bedrooms rather small in comparison with the Budd sleepers, however, the toilet facilities are well done and enclosed within your room. Additionally, storage of carry on baggage is a problem. Whereas one could easily stow two good sized cases in the Budd double bedrooms - not so with the "Renaissance." In fact, I used the toilet facilitiy for storage for one of mine. Made it a bit of a challenge for the "nighttime visit" - but what the heck! Smile,Wink, & Grin [swg]

Additionally, if you are traveling alone, recommend using the lower bunk AND have the mattress pulled away from the wall. That way you'll have sufficient room to turn over! Yes - they are a bit narrow.

Picking up tickets at Montreal's Central Station shouldn't be an issue for they use "live" agents as well as ticket kiosks. Certainly recommend that you get there a couple of hours before boarding time. That may sound like an overkill, but there have been times when the "live" check in as been rather slow. As an Easterly Class traveler, you will also have use of the "VIA 1" lounge too. Boarding for Eastlery Class begins about one half hour before departure.

 Also, the station complex itself is well worth the visit - definitely a unique set up and something I always look forward to. Also, while Montreal is definitely a French speaking city, my experiences have been more positive than not when it comes to being responded to in English - especially in the station complex and local hotels. Thumbs Up [tup]

Back to the bedrooms - during the time when the beds are not set down, the seating within the compartment allows for unobstructed views through a spacious enough window. I have also used the coach seating, with permission from an attendant, when I got tired of sitting in the room and the train was without a dome car. The coaches are well done - single seating on one side, double on the other. Cart service for snacks & drinks. Very comfortable seats and large windows. Nicely done.

The diner is also something that took a bit of getting used to. They don't carry a Chef and the food is prepared by some sort of a mix between Convection and Microwave technology. For the moment the name escapes me. But I wasn't thrilled with the bill o' fare. Then again, I am most definitely biased in favor of the "way it was" and know that I resist change - kicking and screaming all the way! <grin> Having said that - the food preparation really left a lot to be desired, in my opinion. The diner itself is well appointed - double seating on one side - quad seating on the other. Very nice.

You will have about 20 minutes in Moncton, New Brunswick to get off the train - take some photos and stretch your legs. I've always found it to be a nice break. From that point on, get to the dome car! For the best photo ops will be during the leg between Moncton and Truro, Nova Scotia. Not that anything earlier isn't good - it is - but the more scenic lies within those parameters.

So, that should give you head's up on your journey. Thumbs Up [tup]


Tom (siberianmo)

Happy Railroading! Siberianmo
  • Member since
    August 2006
  • 280 posts
Posted by DL - UK on Friday, August 25, 2006 10:30 AM

Thanks Tom (and thanks again Pathfinder)

Yep, I reactivated the post as I thought here is where I'll find people with good knowledge - indeed I have! I'm a subscriber to Classic Trains so it was my first port of call.

I checked out journey via www.seat61.com (if you have never seen this site you are in for a treat if you like steel wheel and steel rail travel). Done by a UK guy but has worldwide scope.

I wanted to travel Budd cars of course (who would not) but I confess being interested to go on an ex UK renaissance (last time I saw them was in sidings outside the now defunct Merto Cammell build plant here in UK before the whole channel night train project was aborted and they went into store) - I guess I'll be used to the small loading gauge as I'm a regular traveller on UK sleepers to Scotland and Cornwall.

In fact I did e-mail VIA customer services to find out if Stainless cars ran every day but they did reply quick to tell me it is Ren stock every day until Nov (what happens then - back to Stainless for the winter?). This is what led me to book Easterly to get access to The Park car - and then the delux upgrade was such little extra that I booked that too. It's not so expensive (probably only time I'll do the trip of course so can afford to splash out a bit and make the most of it) - just seems bad when you see a bargain price then when you book it is no longer there - if I'd never seen that price I'd never have thought more about it - just taken the hit and thought "well that is what I've got to pay".

Thanks for your tip about forward facing - I'm not too bothered as waking hours will probably be spent in the Park Car, but booking on web did mean I did not think I got the choice - what is your tip? Should I e-mail VIA with my booking code and ask for allocation forward facing (there are 2 of us by the way). I confess I was surprised during booking you got no choice option for such things (indeed I was surprised no query on diet since my partner is vegetarian and sometimes they need to know these things). Booking from overseas I have to pick up tickets at station, by which time I expect to find myself allocated whatever seats the computer decides. I also prefer a room in the centre of the car and not over the wheels (call me traditional...). Maybe as I'm paying top rate I should e-mail VIA and ask for what I want?

In UK I never book on line (unless a big saving) prefering to book at the station with staff who will override the reservation system to get the best seats (I don't want to end up with a seat with a window pillar and no view thanks very much) I have a list of best seats on the main types of UK rolling stock to make this task simple. I realise I'm sounding fussy, but you pay for the journey and I don't bury my head in a book (until darkenss falls) when there is scenery and trackside interest to watch out for!

Thanks for your input - as you can imagine - this is one journey I'm really looking forward to!

 

DL - UK

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: BC, CANADA
  • 1,279 posts
Posted by Pathfinder on Friday, August 25, 2006 9:25 AM
 DL - UK wrote:

Thanks Pathfinder - I'm pretty sure I researched it correctly first time round - as being the first time I've booked VIA on line I was very careful to check and double check - of course an error on my part is not impossible - I did not print out the screen prices when I first looked, just scribbled them down on a bit of paper so I have no proof apart from faith in myself, then went to book my flights from UK as did not want to book The Ocean before I had secured a flight (which was a good thing since I had to change my plans due to the annoying habits of the airline industry!) - then went back to VIA and found the price change.

I'm sure we will enjoy it - thanks for your good wishes. In these situations there is a good motto: "The quality is remembered long after the price is forgotten" or some such - was it a Rolls Royce slogan perhaps? Although I've never even sat in a Rolls Royce I tend to find this slogan applies all over the place! 

DL - UK



No problem.  I am in the process of booking a flight from the BC (on the west coast of Canada) to ST. John's Newfoundland (for work) for the end of September and in a 24 hour period, the cost went up by about 30%.  Can't confirm the booking until my client OK's the costs and the longer they wait, the more it will cost.  Not sure but maybe VIA has the same sort of fare policy on certain types of classes?  I only checked the regular fare costs, not the upper end like sleeper.

That is a trip I got to do some day as well.  Post some pictures when you are done if you can.

P.


Keep on Trucking, By Train! Where I Live: BC Hobbies: Model Railroading (HO): CP in the 70's in BC and logging in BC
  • Member since
    February 2004
  • From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA
  • 7,214 posts
CANADIAN PASSENGER RAILROADS - Let's talk! BYOB ........
Posted by siberianmo on Friday, August 25, 2006 9:16 AM
G'day DL in the UK!

Was a bit suprised to see my old Thread reappear on the Forums - but then again, the topic should be of interest - after all, Canadian passenger railroading is by far the best in North America - in my not-so-humble opinion! Smile,Wink, & Grin [swg] Thumbs Up [tup]

DL - I've been traveling between Montreal and Halifax with aboard VIA Rail on an annual basis since 1990 to visit with family and friends. During all of those trips, I've not witnessed any price fluctuations whether booking online or through VIAs reservation centre in Moncton by phone. However - there is something that may be playing into what you've described and perhaps it has to do with the "new" price structure that VIA has created.

Since the inception of the "Renaissance" cars (Chunnel Chuggers), VIA drastically changed the pricing for bedroom accommodations aboard the "Ocean." Without belaboring the issue, the former UK cars  now in regular use on the route to Halifax, replaced the older streamlined Budd cars. The only vestage of the past on the consist is the Budd Park Car (observation dome) for exclusive use of those paying the higher price for Easterly Class bedrooms. VIA offers three different choices for bedrooms - Comfort - Easterly and Easterly Deluxe all at differing price levels. The latter two get you into the Park Car along with other amenities.

Depending on your preferences - traveling alone will cost you a "premium" to sleep in a double bedroom. The "Renaissance" sleepers do not have singles as the older Budd cars did. Also, if you select the "Deluxe" double - it adds to the cost.

If you are still curious regarding the price differential that you found, I recommend you give VIA Rail a call at their toll free number. 
1 888 842-7245 is the number advertised for the US & Canada - perhaps it will "work" for you -worth a try. If not, simply send them an e-mail. I've always found their people to be very helpful and perhaps this may at least clear up any questions you may have.

By the by - you may wish to request a bedroom with seating facing in the direction of travel. Those "Renaissance" bedrooms have every other one with backwards seating. Just a thought . . .

Enjoy your trip - it is a marvelous experience, especially sitting in the Park car's dome. Thumbs Up [tup]


Tom (siberianmo)

Happy Railroading! Siberianmo
  • Member since
    August 2006
  • 280 posts
Posted by DL - UK on Friday, August 25, 2006 3:57 AM

Thanks Pathfinder - I'm pretty sure I researched it correctly first time round - as being the first time I've booked VIA on line I was very careful to check and double check - of course an error on my part is not impossible - I did not print out the screen prices when I first looked, just scribbled them down on a bit of paper so I have no proof apart from faith in myself, then went to book my flights from UK as did not want to book The Ocean before I had secured a flight (which was a good thing since I had to change my plans due to the annoying habits of the airline industry!) - then went back to VIA and found the price change.

I'm sure we will enjoy it - thanks for your good wishes. In these situations there is a good motto: "The quality is remembered long after the price is forgotten" or some such - was it a Rolls Royce slogan perhaps? Although I've never even sat in a Rolls Royce I tend to find this slogan applies all over the place! 

DL - UK

 

 

  • Member since
    February 2004
  • From: Mile 7.5 Laggan Sub., Great White North
  • 4,201 posts
Posted by trainboyH16-44 on Friday, August 25, 2006 3:19 AM
It's official, there's nothing like travelling across the Kicking Horse by train. If I may delve dangerously away from Canadian passenger railroads to Canadian passenger Trains, allow me to regale you with a short tale. I was lucky to be able to do it behind 2816 from Golden to Calgary a month ago. Incredible! And there was a suprise or two on the trip...going through the Spiral Tunnels, the vestibule filled with.....GP38-2 smoke! XD



We ended up topping off at something like 70 or 80MPH at Morley.....gotta love those slightly downhill straight bits. There are more pictures on pag 124 of the TEEN RAILFAN PLACE (Trains.com General Discussion)

Go here for my rail shots! http://www.railpictures.net/showphotos.php?userid=9296

Building the CPR Kootenay division in N scale, blog here: http://kootenaymodelrailway.wordpress.com/

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: BC, CANADA
  • 1,279 posts
Posted by Pathfinder on Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:52 PM
 DL - UK wrote:

OK - I've had a browse but did not find anything on fares so here goes

Does anyone know why Via website fares quotes for Montreal - Halifax (Easterly Class in this instance on The Ocean) pretty much doubled for a booking in late sept between tues 22nd aug 2006 when I looked and it was approx 250 Can $ per person (similar to price Mark quotes on the site) and then when I went to book on weds 23rd it was approx 475 can $  ?

 

Is Via ticketing 'demand responsive' with prices fluctuating constantly according to demand (it does not seem so) or could there have been a special offer that just terminated midnight 22nd? I'm an expert on UK train fare ticketing, but VIA is new to me.

 

I'm booking from the UK so this is the first time I've booked on line with VIA - last time I was in Canada the web was not so common. 

 

I booked anyway as I feared it might go up more - but it has blown a bigger hole in my finances than I'd planned for!

 

DL - UK

PS - any tips for things I should look out for en route from any of you familiar with the route?

 



I did a little comparison on the VIA web site, for Montreal-Halifax, regular fare.  Cost is $233.60 CDN for trips leaving Aug 30, Sept 8 and Sept 22.  So no change due to being closer to the departure date as the airlines do.

Have you tried the Fare Comparison tool on the VIA booking web site to see what different classes cost?  Maybe you did not select the same one?

Please enjoy your trip.


Keep on Trucking, By Train! Where I Live: BC Hobbies: Model Railroading (HO): CP in the 70's in BC and logging in BC
  • Member since
    August 2006
  • 280 posts
Posted by DL - UK on Thursday, August 24, 2006 11:09 AM

OK - I've had a browse but did not find anything on fares so here goes

Does anyone know why Via website fares quotes for Montreal - Halifax (Easterly Class in this instance on The Ocean) pretty much doubled for a booking in late sept between tues 22nd aug 2006 when I looked and it was approx 250 Can $ per person (similar to price Mark quotes on the site) and then when I went to book on weds 23rd it was approx 475 can $  ?

 

Is Via ticketing 'demand responsive' with prices fluctuating constantly according to demand (it does not seem so) or could there have been a special offer that just terminated midnight 22nd? I'm an expert on UK train fare ticketing, but VIA is new to me.

 

I'm booking from the UK so this is the first time I've booked on line with VIA - last time I was in Canada the web was not so common. 

 

I booked anyway as I feared it might go up more - but it has blown a bigger hole in my finances than I'd planned for!

 

DL - UK

PS - any tips for things I should look out for en route from any of you familiar with the route?

 

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Ontario - Canada
  • 463 posts
Posted by morseman on Monday, November 7, 2005 7:58 PM
TO: SMALLING 60626

your posting brought back fond memories of my family trips
from montrea; to Vancouver on CP route. My wife and I with
our two children decided to go to the Calgary Stampede.
We had reserved a room at the Palliser Hotel where you
stayed & they were over booked & we had to stay in the
salesmen's room for three nights. This room was like
a room in a hostel with only the three beds for us,
but it was so spacious and bare, it could have held
15 beds.
  • Member since
    June 2002
  • 20,096 posts
Posted by daveklepper on Monday, November 7, 2005 2:18 PM
A wonderful memory. Thanks for the sharing of it.
  • Member since
    April 2003
  • 305,205 posts
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 7, 2005 12:53 PM

In the early summer of 1981 I took what’s probably my favorite solo trip, to the West Coast and back via VIA. I had just finished graduate school and desperately needed to loaf a little and get the cobwebs out of my head. The dollar was strong, VIA was subsidized, and I had a small cashed-out pension to spend, all of which added up to a good deal. I was able to travel first-class for the first time since I was a child in a sleeper.

Since there was no direct rail service from Chicago to Winnipeg, I decided to get on the westbound Super Continental at Toronto. I started out with a commuter-train ride on the C&NW to Northwestern Station, transferred to Amtrak at Union Station, and headed for Detroit.

There’s something you should know about me: I’m a jinx. Every time I’m in Canada some key component of the economy is on strike. This time it was the tunnel bus to Windsor, so I taxied across the Ambassador Bridge and holed up a couple of hours in a bar prior to catching the train for Toronto. My first-class seat on the Windsor-Toronto train was certainly comfortable, and the waitstaff brought us sandwiches, but unfortunately some engineer must have skidded a wheel because it was a rapid bump-bump-bump all the way. Gave me a headache and a half!

In Toronto, I had about 45 minutes until the Super Continental left, but after just a few minutes’ wait they let us on the train. The man in line behind me learned I was an American when we chatted. I couldn’t understand the woman in front of me, who was talking to friends. The guy behind whispered that she was a “Newfie” which accounted for the brogue. Although VIA had taken over the long-distance CN and CP trains almost three years earlier, the train was still very much the Super Continental, with its diagonally striped engines and heavy steel cars with black-and-white trim. I had a snug roomette and got my headache under control.

Many Canadians say the shield is boring but I was fascinated. I woke up at dawn and confronted the “blasted” landscape of Sudbury; then we spent the better part of that day arching around the shield with its piney forests and little tiny villages where the train sometimes stopped.

Both my transcontinental trains had “real” tablecloth diners. The food was not exotic and began to repeat itself before Vancouver but it was good: hamburgers with buns grilled in butter, spaghetti, that kind of thing. The prices were reasonable. The seating was not first-come-first served but consisted of three “seatings” for dinner, like on a cruise ship. I chose the third because we could hang around afterwards and smoke.

I was really impressed by the professionalism and considerateness of the train staff. My first sleeping-car attendant was a college-age man who made sure I had all the creature comforts. He was also modest to a fault; didn’t hit me up for a tip when he left the train in Winnipeg, but I had heard ahead of time that tipping before he left was the right thing, so I did. I was also impressed with the loving care that had been given to my sleeping-car’s refurbishment. It was clean as a whistle and was a full-step more elaborate and impressive than Amtrak’s remodeling of the Heritage fleet. I saw carpet-and-quarter-round used next to the floor instead of peel-and-stick fake wood trim, for example.

As a first-class passenger I had certain privileges, like access to the bar car. But a class structure was evident. Besides us in first class, there were essentially two classes of coach, if you will: people riding in daynighter-type cars who had paid a premium over coach were treated with courtesy and respect, but the conductor had no patience at all with some of the people from plain-old-coach. Turns out some of the younger guys were pass riders, a group the trainmen hated, and they practically “frog marched” them to and fro the diner—their only chance at penetrating the first-class fortress.

The Canadian Rockies my northern-route CN line train crossed lacks the manicured park setting of the southern, or CP route. Sometimes the mountains were beautiful; at other times they resembled God’s biggest quarry—more striking than attractive. The biggest travel disappointment I found was the dome car: it was simply impossible to see out of it! Not from dirt, but apparently it had either been refurbished with Plexiglas that then got rough treatment and scarred; either that or something was very hinky about the glass.

As I’m sure many of you know, a long train trip is conducive to making new acquaintances, especially with a lounge car to chat in. There were other Americans on the train, mostly the early-retired or the occasional cat like me who loved trains and was lured north by the bargain fares. One young lady from Australia who was on the train helped me find cheap lodging in Vancouver.

Coming back from Vancouver, I was on what was obviously the old Canadian with its lightweight equipment. I booked a lower berth because I had never traveled in a “section” before. Just as comfortable as a roomette, I thought, but unfortunately the forward bulkhead creaked like crazy! I was used to it by the second night, though. I believe the rear-end observation-car-with-dome is what is called the Park series, but I’m not sure. If anything the car was more social than the one on the CN route. Service was just fine, and remnants of an earlier life of passenger railroading were apparent in the observation area, which had not yet been refurbished but was clean. I remember in particular the blonde desk-and-chair suite against the fore wall, with its ink well and cubicles suitable to hold stationery, post cards or telegrams. I imagined what it must have been like 25 years earlier, with Marilyn Monroe or maybe Prime Minister (“Deef the Chief”) Diefenbaker riding in style. Truly a nearly vanished way of life, and it went away so quickly.

Disregarding the socializing, the magnificent scenery was worth the trip all by itself. This time the dome on the observation car was in great shape, and one had to wait one’s turn to get into it for a while. The crew was tolerant of the after-dark crowd but had to throw us out of the dome at midnight: none of us had realized that there were people occupying rooms directly below us. Nonetheless, the amenities were outstanding: I played bingo after dinner in the diner and the following day had the best omelet of my life while passing Lake Shuswop(sp??). Would it surprise you to hear that the chef was French Canadian?

I learned a lot on the trip about the country and its resources. The number of freight trains going to and fro, humping raw materials and auto racks, was astonishing to me.. The COFC revolution was not yet obvious, but the CP’s role in connecting the Orient and eastern North America was. Never a dull moment: shortly after crossing the Continental Divide the train passed a full work crew who had obviously just gotten off the track to let us by. The sight of 20 sweaty topless Canadian men waving at the train had quite an effect on the female contingent, I don’t mind telling you! Banff was just as pretty as the postcards and we had a longish stop there. Now, figure this: the post office was on strike but nonetheless one lady was holding down the fort, selling stamps, and warning us that there was no telling how long it would be before our mail could leave the country. (My friends got their postcards about three weeks later.) I’m such a jinx you’d better check with me before your Canadian trip to make sure I’m not up there disrupting the economy.

A late-night Calgary arrival found me needing a room for the night so I could sightsee the next day. Information sent me to the nearest hotel, which was a grand old railroad hotel basically clipped to the train station. As with all the other service staff I encountered on the trip, the room reservations clerk was extremely solicitous at my comfort. He asked if I wouldn’t mind taking the last room, the salesmen’s room, which has full of display material of the kind a salesmen needed to show his wares. I happily took the room and the pipe-rack clothes carts didn’t bother me a bit. The room was HUGE, not only large but high-ceilinged. Slightly eccentric, perhaps, but nonetheless a bit of luxury stumbled onto by mistake.

It was east out of Regina, a division stop, that I reached the height of my trip: a cab ride. All I had had to do was ask one of the trainmen; who got in touch with the engineer and fireman for their okay. In what I was beginning to recognize was classic Canadian modesty, the engineer talked down the prairie view and the old equipment. Just the week before he had had the run over the mountains; squeezed in with the operators was an entire American flight crew including pilot! The engineer also apologized for the “poky” (his word) equipment, since the elderly EMD loco’s (F7’s??) were limited to winter speeds lest the steam line break. I got to toot the horn and see what must have been thousands of prairie dogs go scuttling away. Apologize?? I was in hog heaven.

I flew home from Winnipeg with a million memories and a fistful of Canadian dollars; now made obsolete because of the Loon coin. Sadly, as we know the Canadian transcontinental trains don’t run every day; I understand the CP route isn’t operated at all in the winter. How sad to think that the fantastic traveling experience I had is now limited to people willing to pay US$5,000-plus for the Royal Canadian. As a result of the trip I became a converted Canadaphile and have visited the country several times since, but none so memorably as my transcontinental trip.



  • Member since
    February 2004
  • From: Mile 7.5 Laggan Sub., Great White North
  • 4,201 posts
Posted by trainboyH16-44 on Sunday, November 6, 2005 3:48 PM
Idunno, he sems to know too much for that. How do you do that? I wish I knew as much as you, you seem to know more than the Hitch-Hicker's Guide to the Galaxy and the Encyclopedia Galactica combined. No, I'm not a nerd, but you are!
I suppose that people don't really have anything to say here anymore?
Matthew

Go here for my rail shots! http://www.railpictures.net/showphotos.php?userid=9296

Building the CPR Kootenay division in N scale, blog here: http://kootenaymodelrailway.wordpress.com/

  • Member since
    April 2003
  • 305,205 posts
Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, November 5, 2005 2:03 AM
Time to 'fess up, Dale. You aren't one person; you're the entire research staff of the GLOBE AND MAIL, right?
  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Nanaimo BC Canada
  • 4,117 posts
Posted by nanaimo73 on Saturday, November 5, 2005 1:28 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by smalling_60626

Can someone give me a start date when VIA began to operate passenger trains?
al

How about a bunch of dates, Allen ?
On July 1st, 1976 the Canadian government assumed 80% of passenger operating losses at CN and CP.
On January 12, 1977 VIA Rail Canada was created as a subsidiary of CN.
On June 1, 1977 it assumed responsability for marketing rail passenger service in Canada.
On March 31, 1978 VIA acquired CN's passenger equipment and took over management of CN rail passenger service.
On April 1, 1978 VIA Rail Canada became a separate Crown Corporation.
On September 29, 1978 VIA took over CP's passenger service, acquired CP's equipment and assumed the employment of CN and CP passenger employees.

VIA's route changes are listed in the May 2003 Trains. (They missed a route change at Red Pass, BC.)
Dale
  • Member since
    April 2003
  • 305,205 posts
Posted by Anonymous on Friday, November 4, 2005 10:49 PM
Can someone give me a start date when VIA began to operate passenger trains?
al

Join our Community!

Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.

Search the Community

Newsletter Sign-Up

By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy