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Railroad History Quiz Game (Come on in and play) Locked

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Posted by henry6 on Thursday, January 8, 2009 10:30 AM

oltmannd

The D&H would have been the final owner, but why the swap with the Erie?  Something to do with waning years of the canal business?

Ok.  Lets give it to oltmannd.  But it was the waning of coal and not the canal that brought about the change.  The Erie built the line in the 1800's knowing the DL&W was going to Binghamton and become a strong, direct competitor out of the Lackawanna Valley. The new line met the Erie mainline at Lanesboro (JA).  The D&H's Albany and Susquehanna then built from Nineveh, NY to Lanesboro (under Starrucca Viaduct)  to Jefferson Jct.(about a mile and a half south of Lanesboro) and gained trackage rights on to Carbondale.  In 1955, with anthracite coal traffic virtually gone, the Erie sold the line to the D&H but retained local switching rights and ran a daily round trip local freight from Scranton (Dunmore?) to Susquehanna (but usually only getting as far north as Jefferson Jct.). This ended, I believe, with the EL merger.

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Posted by oltmannd on Thursday, January 8, 2009 9:55 AM

The D&H would have been the final owner, but why the swap with the Erie?  Something to do with waning years of the canal business?

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Posted by henry6 on Thursday, January 8, 2009 9:01 AM

How long should I let this run before giving answer...although the clue above goes a long way in answereing the questions...in fact, D&H and Erie are the roads involved and is the easy part, evidently.

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Posted by al-in-chgo on Wednesday, January 7, 2009 12:37 PM

I haven't got a clue. 

 

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Posted by henry6 on Monday, January 5, 2009 9:13 PM

oltmannd

The D&H and the Erie?  Anybody else got a clue?

 

Your on the right track (pun intended)!

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Posted by oltmannd on Monday, January 5, 2009 8:31 PM

The D&H and the Erie?  Anybody else got a clue?

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Posted by henry6 on Monday, January 5, 2009 6:15 PM

Ok...here goes...hope you don't mind staying in the east....

Between Carabondale, PA and Jefferson Jct., PA there was a line that had an owner and a tenant.  What were the railroads involved, and what year did the tenancy and owner roles change and how?. 

 

AS a footnote to the above discussion of U boats....report is that NYSW shops in Utica, NY has painted two U23B's of CR 1977 (LV's?) vintage for use on new shortline Lehigh Railroad from Athens to Mahoopany, PA...the former LV mainline!

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Posted by henry6 on Monday, January 5, 2009 10:26 AM

OK...let me think on it and get back later today or tonight.

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Posted by oltmannd on Monday, January 5, 2009 9:14 AM

henry6

My first choice is Seaboard, second Erie Lackawanna/CR commuter

They were U36Bs.  SCL already had some, so they are out.  RDG and LV did purchase some new locos prior to Conrail with USRA money, but they were U23Bs and GP39-2s.  EL did operated U34CHs purchased with NJ DOT money, but EL never owned or operated any 4 axle GEs other than U25Bs.

Auto-Train couldn't afford to take delivery on 4 U36Bs in mid 1976, so Conrail picked them up and had GE "Conrail-ize" them before delivery.

 http://crcyc.railfan.net/locos/ge/u36/u36b.html

When Penn-DOT rebuilt I-376 from the Turnpike to downtown Pittsburgh in the early 1980s, they contracted with CR to provide commuter rail service (from Latrobe, I think).  Conrail used the 4 U36Bs and some ratty old P70 coaches.  They service was a flop and the trains ran only a few months.

 Close enough, Henry, you're up!

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Posted by henry6 on Saturday, January 3, 2009 3:23 PM

My first choice is Seaboard, second Erie Lackawanna/CR commuter

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Posted by oltmannd on Saturday, January 3, 2009 2:01 PM

Too new.  Think of the original Auto Train and when they went backrupt and who was desparate for power at that point...

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Posted by ns3010 on Thursday, January 1, 2009 6:45 PM

Absolutely no clue. But a guess because the fact that they were "four GEs" makes sense.

They were Amtrak P40DCs. They were sold to New Jersey Transit for use on the Raritan Valley Line. They are being moved to the Atlantic City Line for ACES.

They are the only P40s on NJT, so that's my guess.

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Posted by al-in-chgo on Thursday, January 1, 2009 3:34 PM

oltmannd

oltmannd

Before Auto Train went belly up, they had ordered 4 additional locomotives from GE. What became of them?  Extra credit:  At some point, their new owner put them in passenger service.  Where was it?

Hint.  They were the only four of this model on the roster.

Happy New Year! 

I'll guess CP.  -  a.s.

 

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Posted by oltmannd on Wednesday, December 31, 2008 11:54 PM

oltmannd

Before Auto Train went belly up, they had ordered 4 additional locomotives from GE. What became of them?  Extra credit:  At some point, their new owner put them in passenger service.  Where was it?

Hint.  They were the only four of this model on the roster.

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Posted by oltmannd on Tuesday, December 30, 2008 8:31 PM

Before Auto Train went belly up, they had ordered 4 additional locomotives from GE. What became of them?  Extra credit:  At some point, their new owner put them in passenger service.  Where was it?

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Posted by Deggesty on Tuesday, December 30, 2008 12:53 PM

henry6

Since I tripped up, I'm out right?  At lesat for now?

From the basic question, "What three railroads used the L&HR as a bridge for passenger service?" (Henry6 @7:29 am MT on 12-19-08) it seems to me that Oltmannd (@ 4:13 pm MT on the same day) came close to answering the question, and he has the privilege of asking the next one. As I commented in one of my responses, back then the representations, in the Guide, of many railroads do not show whether there is through service or if there are only connections. Some of the connections shown for this possibly through service are at inconvenient times in the night, and may have actually been the times for through service, at which the next railroad took charge of the cars and moved them over its part of the route.

Some roads do not even show through service that other roads show existing in connection with them. Here is one example of this situation: the N&W shows a through sleeper between Norfolk and Louisville via the Cumberland Gap Line, connecting with the L&N at Norton, Va.; the L&N shows only an overnight sleeper between Louisville and Norton. The N&W representation does not show the L&N’s times at Norton, but does show them at Big Stone Gap; the N&W train is shown arriving in Norton at 5:45 pm ET; the L&N train is shown leaving Norton at 4:35 pm CT; both roads show the same time at Big Stone Gap. Eastbound the L&N arrived in Norton at 12:40 noon CT, and the N&W left at 2:00 pm ET.

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Posted by henry6 on Tuesday, December 30, 2008 11:15 AM

Since I tripped up, I'm out right?  At lesat for now?

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Posted by Deggesty on Tuesday, December 30, 2008 11:07 AM

passengerfan

Whose turn next?

Al in stockton

Yes, who has the privilege of asking the next question?

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Posted by passengerfan on Saturday, December 27, 2008 4:26 PM

Whose turn next?

Al in stockton

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Posted by henry6 on Tuesday, December 23, 2008 4:09 PM

OK. So that this does not dangle like an empty Chirstmas stocking by the fireplace...I was looking for the Federal which the PRR operated.  All the cars were floated from Exchange Place, Jersey City to the NH in the Bronx.

With the opening of Penn and Hell Gate the run through of cars and whole trains became common and trivial.

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Posted by henry6 on Monday, December 22, 2008 3:24 PM

Actually, I believe the opening of Penn Sta.and Hell Gate Bridge put an end to the train I mention and opened up a whole bunch more opportunities.

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Posted by Deggesty on Monday, December 22, 2008 12:36 PM

henry6

OK. Then my question is wrong because I was looking at the PRR Federal from Washington to Boston via the  Bel-Del and L&HR and NYNH&H.  DL&W added a car from Hoboken at Andover Jct.  I don't know if it was a PRR car from Jersey City or a DL&W car.  I stand corrected in that I was looking for that answer.  The information you have porvided, Johnny, indicates that there was a through routing earlier than the Federal under the Philadelphia and Reading umbrella which would have been B&O to Philadelphia, RDG to Allentown, CNJ to Easton, L&HR to Maybrook, Central New England to Hartford at least, and NYNH&H to Boston I believe..

So question; can I recoup the question spot with this:  The Federal eventualy was handled through Penn Station, NY and over Hell Gate Bridge to the NH.  But the Federal always had through cars from Washington to Boston via the two roads,  How?

 

A little correction on the route shown in 1893--the Central Massachusetts Division of the B&M handled the route into Boston, going into North Station.

It is interesting to me that I cannot find in the June 1916 Guide any mention of a through train between Washington and Boston. The L&HR, and the NYNH&H, which would have carried it, do not show any. There could not have been service via the Hell Gate Bridge at that time, since the bridge was not completed until 30 September 1916.

I do not remember what year it was, but my mother, who went to school in Northfield, Mass., spoke of going back to Virginia by boat instead of by rail one year because of a polio epidemic in New York.

I trust someone with better memory of the service you mention lets us all know soon.

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Posted by henry6 on Sunday, December 21, 2008 10:23 PM

OK. Then my question is wrong because I was looking at the PRR Federal from Washington to Boston via the  Bel-Del and L&HR and NYNH&H.  DL&W added a car from Hoboken at Andover Jct.  I don't know if it was a PRR car from Jersey City or a DL&W car.  I stand corrected in that I was looking for that answer.  The information you have porvided, Johnny, indicates that there was a through routing earlier than the Federal under the Philadelphia and Reading umbrella which would have been B&O to Philadelphia, RDG to Allentown, CNJ to Easton, L&HR to Maybrook, Central New England to Hartford at least, and NYNH&H to Boston I believe..

So question; can I recoup the question spot with this:  The Federal eventualy was handled through Penn Station, NY and over Hell Gate Bridge to the NH.  But the Federal always had through cars from Washington to Boston via the two roads,  How?

 

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Posted by Deggesty on Sunday, December 21, 2008 8:04 PM

henry6

Now I am beginning to doubt myself.  The Philadelphia and Reading Routing described above is a very viable answer if there is one, continuous train over four railroads from beginning to end. As I indicated above, these railroads were assembled under the P&R name but I didn't think they ran a continuous train, passenger had to change trains at various points to continue the journey.  My answer is different, however, and I will withold it for the time being.  Question: is there a single train in the timetable that answers my question?  If so, I will gladly capitulate and reveal my answer, although wrong.

I hope I am not muddying the waters with this information. I checked in the June 1893 issue of the Guide, and found that the Lehigh & Hudson River Railway shows a schedule that leaves Washington at 2:40 pm and arrives in Boston at 8:20 am; the reverse schedule leaves Boston at 5:50 pm and arrives in Washington at 11:20 am. The Philadelphia, Reading and New England, which carried the train between Maybrook and Simsbury, representation shows the overall schedule as well; no other road involved shows an overall schedule, and no road at all shows any through equipment. 115 years ago, many roads showed little in the way of through equipment, so we cannot really tell, even if the schedules indicate that connections, at least existed. The NYNH&H schedule shows a train in each direction that went only between Simsbury and Northanmpton. Oltmannd indeed may have something.

Inciudentally, when you mentioned the L&HR, I thought of the Alphabet Route, which was a through freight route between Chicago and Boston through Maybrook. It used the B&O from Chicago to an interchange with the Central of Maryland, which took it on up to (I think) the Reading, and then the CNJ and the L&HR. Crews ran through interchange  points so that they were able to work full days.

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Posted by henry6 on Sunday, December 21, 2008 9:07 AM

Now I am beginning to doubt myself.  The Philadelphia and Reading Routing described above is a very viable answer if there is one, continuous train over four railroads from beginning to end. As I indicated above, these railroads were assembled under the P&R name but I didn't think they ran a continuous train, passenger had to change trains at various points to continue the journey.  My answer is different, however, and I will withold it for the time being.  Question: is there a single train in the timetable that answers my question?  If so, I will gladly capitulate and reveal my answer, although wrong.

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Posted by oltmannd on Saturday, December 20, 2008 9:43 PM

This was the train I was thinking of: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poughkeepsie_Bridge_Route

It actually used 7 railroads.  B&O, RDG, CNJ, L&HR, Central of New England, New Haven and B&M.

It ran from the time shortly after the Poughkeepsie Br was built until the depresion of 1893.

Spoiler alert! 

I think the link has the train Henry's thinking about that used the northern portion of the route for several years.

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Posted by henry6 on Saturday, December 20, 2008 11:06 AM

john_edwards

 New Haven, PRR, L&HR, LV

Not quite.  Knowing the train migh help.

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Posted by john_edwards on Saturday, December 20, 2008 10:57 AM

 New Haven, PRR, L&HR, LV

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Posted by henry6 on Friday, December 19, 2008 6:18 PM

Close but no cigar.  :You are talking about the days of the Philadelphia and Reading Railroad which encompassed these lines but I don't believe ran one train the entire distance between end points.

 

Added clue: participants have been named in the posts but not in the correct context.

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Posted by oltmannd on Friday, December 19, 2008 5:53 PM

How about Phila to Boston via RDG, LV, L&HR, New Haven (via Maybrook over Poughkeepsie Bridge)?

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