oltmannd The D&H would have been the final owner, but why the swap with the Erie? Something to do with waning years of the canal business?
The D&H would have been the final owner, but why the swap with the Erie? Something to do with waning years of the canal business?
Ok. Lets give it to oltmannd. But it was the waning of coal and not the canal that brought about the change. The Erie built the line in the 1800's knowing the DL&W was going to Binghamton and become a strong, direct competitor out of the Lackawanna Valley. The new line met the Erie mainline at Lanesboro (JA). The D&H's Albany and Susquehanna then built from Nineveh, NY to Lanesboro (under Starrucca Viaduct) to Jefferson Jct.(about a mile and a half south of Lanesboro) and gained trackage rights on to Carbondale. In 1955, with anthracite coal traffic virtually gone, the Erie sold the line to the D&H but retained local switching rights and ran a daily round trip local freight from Scranton (Dunmore?) to Susquehanna (but usually only getting as far north as Jefferson Jct.). This ended, I believe, with the EL merger.
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How long should I let this run before giving answer...although the clue above goes a long way in answereing the questions...in fact, D&H and Erie are the roads involved and is the easy part, evidently.
I haven't got a clue.
oltmannd The D&H and the Erie? Anybody else got a clue?
The D&H and the Erie? Anybody else got a clue?
Your on the right track (pun intended)!
Ok...here goes...hope you don't mind staying in the east....
Between Carabondale, PA and Jefferson Jct., PA there was a line that had an owner and a tenant. What were the railroads involved, and what year did the tenancy and owner roles change and how?.
AS a footnote to the above discussion of U boats....report is that NYSW shops in Utica, NY has painted two U23B's of CR 1977 (LV's?) vintage for use on new shortline Lehigh Railroad from Athens to Mahoopany, PA...the former LV mainline!
OK...let me think on it and get back later today or tonight.
henry6 My first choice is Seaboard, second Erie Lackawanna/CR commuter
My first choice is Seaboard, second Erie Lackawanna/CR commuter
They were U36Bs. SCL already had some, so they are out. RDG and LV did purchase some new locos prior to Conrail with USRA money, but they were U23Bs and GP39-2s. EL did operated U34CHs purchased with NJ DOT money, but EL never owned or operated any 4 axle GEs other than U25Bs.
Auto-Train couldn't afford to take delivery on 4 U36Bs in mid 1976, so Conrail picked them up and had GE "Conrail-ize" them before delivery.
http://crcyc.railfan.net/locos/ge/u36/u36b.html
When Penn-DOT rebuilt I-376 from the Turnpike to downtown Pittsburgh in the early 1980s, they contracted with CR to provide commuter rail service (from Latrobe, I think). Conrail used the 4 U36Bs and some ratty old P70 coaches. They service was a flop and the trains ran only a few months.
Close enough, Henry, you're up!
Too new. Think of the original Auto Train and when they went backrupt and who was desparate for power at that point...
Absolutely no clue. But a guess because the fact that they were "four GEs" makes sense.
They were Amtrak P40DCs. They were sold to New Jersey Transit for use on the Raritan Valley Line. They are being moved to the Atlantic City Line for ACES.
They are the only P40s on NJT, so that's my guess.
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oltmannd oltmannd Before Auto Train went belly up, they had ordered 4 additional locomotives from GE. What became of them? Extra credit: At some point, their new owner put them in passenger service. Where was it? Hint. They were the only four of this model on the roster.
oltmannd Before Auto Train went belly up, they had ordered 4 additional locomotives from GE. What became of them? Extra credit: At some point, their new owner put them in passenger service. Where was it?
Before Auto Train went belly up, they had ordered 4 additional locomotives from GE. What became of them? Extra credit: At some point, their new owner put them in passenger service. Where was it?
Hint. They were the only four of this model on the roster.
Happy New Year!
I'll guess CP. - a.s.
henry6 Since I tripped up, I'm out right? At lesat for now?
Since I tripped up, I'm out right? At lesat for now?
From the basic question, "What three railroads used the L&HR as a bridge for passenger service?" (Henry6 @7:29 am MT on 12-19-08) it seems to me that Oltmannd (@ 4:13 pm MT on the same day) came close to answering the question, and he has the privilege of asking the next one. As I commented in one of my responses, back then the representations, in the Guide, of many railroads do not show whether there is through service or if there are only connections. Some of the connections shown for this possibly through service are at inconvenient times in the night, and may have actually been the times for through service, at which the next railroad took charge of the cars and moved them over its part of the route.
Some roads do not even show through service that other roads show existing in connection with them. Here is one example of this situation: the N&W shows a through sleeper between Norfolk and Louisville via the Cumberland Gap Line, connecting with the L&N at Norton, Va.; the L&N shows only an overnight sleeper between Louisville and Norton. The N&W representation does not show the L&N’s times at Norton, but does show them at Big Stone Gap; the N&W train is shown arriving in Norton at 5:45 pm ET; the L&N train is shown leaving Norton at 4:35 pm CT; both roads show the same time at Big Stone Gap. Eastbound the L&N arrived in Norton at 12:40 noon CT, and the N&W left at 2:00 pm ET.
Johnny
passengerfan Whose turn next? Al in stockton
Whose turn next?
Al in stockton
OK. So that this does not dangle like an empty Chirstmas stocking by the fireplace...I was looking for the Federal which the PRR operated. All the cars were floated from Exchange Place, Jersey City to the NH in the Bronx.
With the opening of Penn and Hell Gate the run through of cars and whole trains became common and trivial.
Actually, I believe the opening of Penn Sta.and Hell Gate Bridge put an end to the train I mention and opened up a whole bunch more opportunities.
henry6 OK. Then my question is wrong because I was looking at the PRR Federal from Washington to Boston via the Bel-Del and L&HR and NYNH&H. DL&W added a car from Hoboken at Andover Jct. I don't know if it was a PRR car from Jersey City or a DL&W car. I stand corrected in that I was looking for that answer. The information you have porvided, Johnny, indicates that there was a through routing earlier than the Federal under the Philadelphia and Reading umbrella which would have been B&O to Philadelphia, RDG to Allentown, CNJ to Easton, L&HR to Maybrook, Central New England to Hartford at least, and NYNH&H to Boston I believe.. So question; can I recoup the question spot with this: The Federal eventualy was handled through Penn Station, NY and over Hell Gate Bridge to the NH. But the Federal always had through cars from Washington to Boston via the two roads, How?
OK. Then my question is wrong because I was looking at the PRR Federal from Washington to Boston via the Bel-Del and L&HR and NYNH&H. DL&W added a car from Hoboken at Andover Jct. I don't know if it was a PRR car from Jersey City or a DL&W car. I stand corrected in that I was looking for that answer. The information you have porvided, Johnny, indicates that there was a through routing earlier than the Federal under the Philadelphia and Reading umbrella which would have been B&O to Philadelphia, RDG to Allentown, CNJ to Easton, L&HR to Maybrook, Central New England to Hartford at least, and NYNH&H to Boston I believe..
So question; can I recoup the question spot with this: The Federal eventualy was handled through Penn Station, NY and over Hell Gate Bridge to the NH. But the Federal always had through cars from Washington to Boston via the two roads, How?
It is interesting to me that I cannot find in the June 1916 Guide any mention of a through train between Washington and Boston. The L&HR, and the NYNH&H, which would have carried it, do not show any. There could not have been service via the Hell Gate Bridge at that time, since the bridge was not completed until 30 September 1916.
I do not remember what year it was, but my mother, who went to school in Northfield, Mass., spoke of going back to Virginia by boat instead of by rail one year because of a polio epidemic in New York.
I trust someone with better memory of the service you mention lets us all know soon.
henry6 Now I am beginning to doubt myself. The Philadelphia and Reading Routing described above is a very viable answer if there is one, continuous train over four railroads from beginning to end. As I indicated above, these railroads were assembled under the P&R name but I didn't think they ran a continuous train, passenger had to change trains at various points to continue the journey. My answer is different, however, and I will withold it for the time being. Question: is there a single train in the timetable that answers my question? If so, I will gladly capitulate and reveal my answer, although wrong.
Now I am beginning to doubt myself. The Philadelphia and Reading Routing described above is a very viable answer if there is one, continuous train over four railroads from beginning to end. As I indicated above, these railroads were assembled under the P&R name but I didn't think they ran a continuous train, passenger had to change trains at various points to continue the journey. My answer is different, however, and I will withold it for the time being. Question: is there a single train in the timetable that answers my question? If so, I will gladly capitulate and reveal my answer, although wrong.
Inciudentally, when you mentioned the L&HR, I thought of the Alphabet Route, which was a through freight route between Chicago and Boston through Maybrook. It used the B&O from Chicago to an interchange with the Central of Maryland, which took it on up to (I think) the Reading, and then the CNJ and the L&HR. Crews ran through interchange points so that they were able to work full days.
This was the train I was thinking of: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poughkeepsie_Bridge_Route
It actually used 7 railroads. B&O, RDG, CNJ, L&HR, Central of New England, New Haven and B&M.
It ran from the time shortly after the Poughkeepsie Br was built until the depresion of 1893.
Spoiler alert!
I think the link has the train Henry's thinking about that used the northern portion of the route for several years.
john_edwards New Haven, PRR, L&HR, LV
New Haven, PRR, L&HR, LV
Not quite. Knowing the train migh help.
Close but no cigar. :You are talking about the days of the Philadelphia and Reading Railroad which encompassed these lines but I don't believe ran one train the entire distance between end points.
Added clue: participants have been named in the posts but not in the correct context.
How about Phila to Boston via RDG, LV, L&HR, New Haven (via Maybrook over Poughkeepsie Bridge)?
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