"OUR" PLACE - SEE NEW THREAD!

[Anonymous]

Good morning Tom and all. I'll just have one lite breakfast today. I see Al gave us another streamliner, and Rob put up another classic post of the WP since I was last here. Good stuff gentelmen! Here's my humble offering for today:

Setting the “Standard” for American Toy Trains Allan W. Miller
Photos by Peter H. Riddle Vintage Rails No. 17 1999

Standard Gauge in all its glory, as seen on Richard and Linda Kughn’s Carail Museum Standard Gauge layout. Richard Hughn is the former owner of Lionel Trains, Inc. – one of several corporate entities to have held custody to the trademark in its near century-old tenure. Kughn also inspired Lionel’s reintroduction of Standard Gauge trains in the late 1980s.


Joshua Lionel Cowen, the ever-inspired, often-inspiring, and rarely modest founder of the Lionel Corporation, never was one to settle for second best when it came to advancing his ideas, inventions, and product line. In 1906, a scant six years after he had first ventured into the manufacture of “miniature electric cars” for use as merchant display window attractions, Cowen’s growing assortment of electric toy trains – by that time being actively marketed to the general public, as well – were proclaimed as “Standard of the World.” And what was the source of this official proclamation? None other than Joshua Lionel Cowen himself! As for the basis for this accolade: Well, Joshua Cowen just said that it was so; therefore it was!

Indeed, when it came to the conduct of his business affairs, Joshua Cowen took a back seat to no one in shamelessly tooting his own horn (or whistle, as the case may be) in promoting his product line. More-over, throughout his long career at the helm of Lionel, Cowen often resorted to similarly ingenious (some would even call them devious or unfair) tactics to thwart his competition, and this example marks just one of any such instances. In any event, the ploy worked well enough, and Lionel’s Standard of the World line of toy trains evolved not so much on the basis of widespread consumer or industry acceptance, but rather from Joshua Lionel Cowen’s self-serving intent to create a “standard” size of electric train or, more precisely, a standardized track system for electric trains, which he hoped would stifle competition from any other toy train makers, both at home and abroad.

Cowen rather quickly settled on a track system that measured a distinctive 2 1/8 inches between the running rails, assuring that similarly sized locomotives and cars offered by competitors would not be compatible unless they were reworked to conform to Lionel’s self-proclaimed standard. The track system itself, and the trains that operated upon this track, were thereafter designated as “Standard Gauge,” a term that has endured to the present day; and from 1907 until shortly before World War II, Lionel’s Standard Gauge trains were the accepted Standard of the World in their class.

The American public bought into Lionel’s “Standard of the World” slogan, and, more importantly, they bought Lionel Standard Gauge trains in ever increasing numbers. Even Lionel’s foremost domestic competitors of the time – most notably American Flyer and Ives – deferred to Lionel’s standard in fact if not in name and began manufacturing what they referred to as “Wide Gauge” trains, designed to operate on Lionel’s unique three-rail Standard Gauge track system. But despite Cowen’s somewhat devious intent, it’s also important to bear in mind that Lionel trains became the de facto standard, not just because Joshua Cowen said that they were, but because his somewhat pompous claims were largely validated by a line of toy trains that were superbly crafted, durable, attractive, and highly regarded by consumers.

Originally produced in a time when many homes were spacious enough to accommodate large model trains operating on the living room floor or elsewhere, Standard Gauge electric trains were truly designed to be admired as well as played with. Although they almost never faithfully duplicated the precise appearance of full detail of actual locomotives and cars seen on the nation’s railways, they more than made up for this in other ways. They were constructed of heavy, tinplated metal, adorned with gleaming enamel paint and outfitted with bright nickel or brass trim. Furthermore, they were powered by rugged and reliable motors that were easy to service and repair. Everything about these toys exemplified quality on a grand scale. In the world of toy electric trains, just about nothing else can compare to viewing an eight-foot-long Standard Gauge train streaking toward its imaginary destination amidst equally massive and colorful tinplate buildings, structures, and signals. It’s an awe-inspiring sigh t to behold, and one that, bridging generation gaps, continues to appeal to youngsters old oldsters alike.

Supported by Lionel’s visually stimulating and always persuasive advertising efforts, Standard Gauge effectively dominated the electric toy train landscape in America through World War I and into the years beyond the Great Depression. However, in the period leading up to U.S. involvement in the Second World War, it increasingly lost ground to smaller and more affordable O gauge electric trains, which Lionel had actually been making as early as 1915. By war’s end, Standard Gauge had virtually disappeared, not only from Lionel’s renowned consumer catalogs, but also from the inventory stocked by most hobby shops and department stores. Standard Gauge was all but gone – destined to be relegated to the ranks of museum artifacts, save for products offered by a few small but persistently to keep the tradition alive.

Gone, perhaps the closing years of the 20th century have witnessed a rekindling of interest in Standard Gauge electric trains. In large part, this relates to sentimental attachments to, and nostalgia for, the treasured artifacts of our nation’s heritage, especially among members of the so-called Baby Boomer generation and their immediate predecessors. And Standard Gauge trains were indeed treasured – lovingly preserved in many instances – and passed along from generation to generation, not unlike Great Grandmother’s fine silver or the family photo album. Whatever the reasons that may have sparked this resurgence of interest, the real flames were ignited in 1988 when Lionel Trains, Inc., then-current owners of the trademark, reintroduced models of several of the most desirable Standard Gauge trains and accessories first released in the 1920s and 1930s. Appropriately labeled as “Lionel Classics,” these striking and somewhat costly reproductions quickly nudged their way into train collectors’ hearts.

Although Lionel set the “standard” in Standard Gauge electric trains, erstwhile competitors such as Ives and American Flyer also produced models very similar to Lionel’s. Ives’ rendition of a St. Paul electric locomotive occupies the turntable in this photograph, while American Flyer’s version of the same locomotive awaits its turn at right


Today, these colorful, rugged, and boisterous toys are no longer being produced by Lionel, but they are still being offered by a firm that, by most accounts, ranks as Lionel’s most formidable competitor in the contemporary toy train marketplace: MTH Electric Trains, of Columbia, Maryland. Mike Wolf, the energetic young founder of MTH, has openly professed a personal fondness for Standard Gauge, even though he was not even born until long after original Standard Gauge items had become highly sought after commodities for museum display cases.

Wolf’s attachment to Standard Gauge is both profound and engaging. In the foreword to a recently published book detailing the development or Standard Gauge model railroading (America’s Standard Gauge Electric Trains, written by Dr. Peter H. Riddle and published under the Antique Trader Books imprint), Wolf noted that “the combination of colors, shapes, and sounds of tinplate toy trains creates something of an artistic impression for their owners. While some may prefer more traditional art forms – paintings that can be hung on walls, or statues that are placed on pedestals, for example – my preferred art form can actually be played with as well as admired. Tinplate toy trains – and especially Standard Gauge toys trains – truly are works of art as well as treasured artifacts.”

The wisdom of Wolf’s words is amply evidenced in the photographs accompanying this article, most of which were selected from the previously described book. If the old adage that “a picture is worth a thousand words” really has merit, perhaps these colorful images may help convey the irresistible, almost magnetic, attraction of these charming classic toys. So sit back, relax, and savor a bit of nostalgia born in a bygone era and perpetuated to the present day by a dedicated group of toy train collectors and operators who devote their leisure hours to bringing history to life.

Contemporary reproductions of Standard Gauge trains, such as those seen here on Kughn’s Carail Museum layout, are often adorned in attractive color schemes not offered on models produced between the World Wars.


[:I]
1. Only in America......can a pizza get to your house faster than an ambulance.
2. Only in America......are there handicap parking places in front of a skating rink.
3. Only in America......do drugstores make the sick walk all the way to the back of the store to get their prescriptions while healthy people can buy cigarettes at the front.
4. Only in America......do people order double cheese burgers, large fries, and a diet Coke.
5. Only in America......do banks leave both doors to the vault open and then chain the pens to the counters.
6. Only in America......do we leave cars worth thousands of dollars in the driveway and put our useless junk in the garage.
7. Only in America......do we use answering machines to screen calls and then have call waiting so we won't miss a call from someone we didn't want to talk to in the first place.
8. Only in America......do we buy hot dogs in packages of ten and buns in packages of eight.
9. Only in America......do we use the word 'politics' to describe the process so well: Poli' in Latin meaning 'many' and 'tics' meaning 'bloodsucking creatures'.
10. Only in America......do they have drive-up ATM machines with Braille lettering.
[:I]

[siberianmo]

from: www.viarail.ca

We open at 6 AM. (All time zones - Don’t ask how we do that!)[swg]


WEDNESDAY’s INFO & SUMMARY of POSTS

Wednesday and mid-week! Join us for breakfast – select a <light> or <traditional> breakfast from the Menu Board. Some pastries from The Mentor Village Bakery, and of course a large mug of steaming hot, freshly ground and brewed coffee![tup]


Daily Wisdom

If you see a coward with a gun, its time to get scared or scarce.


Info for the Day:


Railroads from Yesteryear –
Chicago, Burlington & Quincy (CBQ) arrives next Tuesday!


* Weekly Calendar:


TODAY: Pike Perspective’s Day!
Thursday: Fish ‘n Chips Nite!
Friday: Pizza Nite! & Steak Nite!
Saturday: Steak ‘n Trimmin’s Nite! – and –
ENCORE! Saturday


[tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup]



Comedy Corner

Nearly Always True

"Five second fuses only last three seconds."
- Inf! antry Journal

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bravery is being the only one who knows you're afraid."
- David Hackworth

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"If your attack is going too well, your walking into an ambush."
- Infantry Journal

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"No combat-ready unit has ever passed inspection."
- Joe Gay

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Any ship can be a minesweeper...
once."
- Anonymous

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Never tell the Platoon Sergeant you have nothing to do."
- Unknown Marine Recruit

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Don't draw fire; it irritates the people around you."

- Your Buddies

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"If you see a bomb technician running, follow him."
- USAF Ammo Troop

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Though I Fly Through the Valley of Death ... I Shall Fear No Evil.
For I am at 80,000 Feet and Climbing."

At the entrance to the old SR-71 operating base
Kadena,Okanawa

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"You've never been lost
until you've been lost at Mach 3."
- Paul F. Crickmore (test pilot)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------


[tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup]



The Mentor Village Emporium Theatre

NOW SHOWING:

Double Features and Three Stooges Short Subject!

. . . Sunday, April 23rd thru Apr 29th: Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid (1969) starring: Paul Newman, Robert Redford & Kathy Ross –and- The Sting (1973) starring: Paul Newman, Robert Redford & Robert Shaw. SHORT: Men In Black (1934).



SUMMARY

Name …..…………… Date/Time …..…..………. (Page#) .. Remarks

(1) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 05:21:07 (313) Tuesday’s Info & Summary

(2) barndad Doug Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 06:02:04 (313) ”Quickie!”

(3) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 07:58:53 (313) RRs from Yesteryear #16 – Western Pacific

(4) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 08:02:33 (314) Theme for the Day – Fallen Flag: WP

(5) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 08:02:55 (314) Bear Talk!

(6) LoveDomes Lars Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 09:00:30 (314) Lars Report & Pix

(7) coalminer3 CM3 Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 09:06:00 (314) Theme stuff, etc.

(8) BudKarr BK Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 11:12:27 (314) BK Report!

(9) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 13:38:56 (314) Theme: Nostalgia #62 – California Zephyr

(10) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 15:31:00 (314) Acknowledgments, etc.

(11) West Coast S Dave Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 15:31:16 (314) Dave’s Plethora of WP info![tup]

(12) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 15:36:11 (314) reply to Dave

(13) West Coast S Dave Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 16:10:55 (314) etc.

(14) pwolfe Pete Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 18:09:06 (314) Inclusive Post, etc.

(15) wanswheel Mike Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 19:09:51 (314) Outstanding “theme” URLs

(16) barndad Doug Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 19:25:52 (314) Inclusive Post, Barn yard style & joke

(17) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 19:59:38 (314) Nick at Nite at his best![tup]

(18) passengerfan Al Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 20:04:50 (314) Theme WP: Streamlined obs domes

(19) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 20:16:33 (314) Acknowledgments, etc.

(20) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 20:16:33 (314) Classic Juice #27 – WP Electric Lines

(21) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 20:23:25 (314) reply to Rob

(22) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 20:33:42 (314) Inclusive Post from da Bear!

(23) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 20:35:46 (315) Inclusive, one more time!

(24) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 25 Apr 2006, 20:46:50 {315) etc.




That’s it! [tup][;)]


Tom [4:-)] [oX)]
Proprietor of “Our” Place, an adult eating & drinking establishment!

[trolleyboy]

Well look at that two more post snuck in while I was still sitting here [tup]

Tom I think I can safly say that this has been bar none the most successfull of the theme days, the info flying hot and heavy out there today. Good job everyone. Reminds me of the heady days ( daze) of last june and july ! Boris ring the ding for a round for the boyz on me if you please. Leon doesn't look overworked enough yet [swg]

Ted Good to see you still up and at it this evening, climatizing yourself for Toronto[?] remeber wear the sandwich board with your name on it so I can find you termninal [swg]. I agree wholeheartedly with you on the quality of today's prose though.[tup] for eberyone today again.

Rob

[trolleyboy]

What Ho folks, still looks to be a busy evening I see that da Boss Tom and Al are still in the house Leon some Choc shakes for the three of us sir [:D][swg]

Tom I only want to install a hot line phone if it's red,lights up and has just one button on it like Adam West's Batphone. LOL Gotta have the cave well equiped dontchaknow. [swg]I will definatly help out Lars or not Lars tomorrow, two times tomorrow one daylight and one moonlight for me.

Al Nice to see you drop by with the Zepher post, nice way to keep the ole exchange of WP info flowing. Have any info on the SN or TS [?]

Doug Nice to see you pop through. You arecalways welcome at our museum,espeacially if you bring at track crew up with you. [swg] Glad to hear that the selling and moving stuff is moving on at a decent pace for you. Hopefully the JO's in your basement are not home for the open house.

Nick Come sit and have a round.I know what you mean about the frustration's of train s and cameras and the not having them at the right time. last week when I was finalizing the rendezvous VIA tickest a CN frieght went by with a Sante Fe Blue and Yellow Warbonnet in all it's glory [:(!] Good to hear that the local constabulary won't need to investigate the strange goings on imn your neighbours backyard.

Rob

[Anonymous]

"Nobody doesn't like W.P." Tom I'll take Dave up on his offer of a Labatss Pilsner please, thanks. Just incredible input for the "Darling" of western roads and its' signature varni***he "California Zephyr." Many thanks to Cm3, Dave, Tom, Lars, Mike for bringing that marvelous era of "extra fares" Limiteds back to our own little virtual reality at "Our" Place. There just aren't words that adequately capture the wonderful oppulence of "first class" travel by rail. It was as much an aura as any combinations of the luxurious amenities offered. I believe today's posts on the California Zephyr came as close to capturing that "aura" as anything posted to date.[^] How soon it was all lost to history and not in deserving regal manner but a pitiable crush of reckless abandonment. Sometimes I ponder the notion that many of us might still be in a state of denial and an objective observer would probably agree. Well, I can only hope that the dispassionate "observer" will fogive our wallowing in former reveries when they come to realize "they no not of what we speak." Again, thanks to all who have posted these descriptive narratives and relevant data yesterday and today especially.

I've run out of time and had no material to begin with, so I must bid all of you a good night. Tom, Rob, Lars, and BK you have mail in reply to your own thoughtful messages. Happy rails to all.

[siberianmo]

Hey Rob!

Following my own advice - I stuck around after my Post and there you were! [swg]

Appreciate the "theme" support! Good choice - something a little different (like Monty Python, eh[?][swg]) Anway, looks like this is one of our more successful "theme" days and everyone is pitching in quite well.

Ring the bell Boris - I know Dave's buying - but this one is on me! Ding-a-ling one and all! [swg]

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[trolleyboy]

CLASSIC JUICE # 27 WP's ELECTRIC LINES

Well good day again gents another round of Blue I think Tom please. I haven't much info on the WP, however after such info packed pieces as dave and yourself put forth I'll just add this little bit on WP's electric lines. I know that these are in no way complete. Perhaps our local West Coast connections can fill in the more interesting meat that i leave out as I know there will be much.

in the days of steam most Railroads viewed the electric interurbans as interlopers that competed for customner traffic and were to be beaten down at all costs. the WP thought differently and purchased two local lines and continued to operate them as electric lines years after many such railways had faded into history. Indeed the Sacarmento Northern and the Tidewater Southern fed needed traffic to their WP parent, and were a help as opposed to a hinderence.

When the Wp's last steam power was being phased out the SN steeple cabs still fed freight to it's parent from the electric lines industrial spurs.

Built primarily as a passenger line the SN ran interurban cars for three decades between the communities of its region. Indeed in 1941 when the SN ran it's last interurban passenger cars it bosted then the longest interurban run in the country an approx 200 mile round trip. Boarding one of the SN's cars at the Trans Bay Terminal in San Francisco, a passenger would cross the Bay Bridge into Oakland and then out into the dry Oakland Hills Region and down into the San Ramon valley. At Pittsburg Ca,the car ferry Ramon carried the cars across the Sacramento River. Beyond there the interurban cars sped across the delta lands on trestles and levees toward it's namesake city of Sacramento then continued north through the Sacremento valley to it's termi nus in Chico. The SN began scrapping it's steeple cabs in the mid 50's and aquired it's own roster of diesel locomotive replacements, painted in WP company colours but still lettered for the SN. Gradulaly several segments of trackage were retired and the SN became a collection of spurs reached via trackage rights over other railways. The section between Marysville and Yuba City remained electrified until 1965.

The other WP electric line was the Tidewater Southern. it evolved into the diesel world more completly than it's sister the SN and remained intact.WP bought the 46 mile line in 1917 gaining it's conection at Stockton via Modesto and Turlock. This small lines days of electrification fell victim to the depression in 1932 when the passenger service and electric service ended. The WP kept the line open for it's wine and fruit trade however, revenue the line still subsides on today.

Enjoy Rob

[siberianmo]

Good Evening Gents!


This really seems like “old times” with the flow of customers throughout the day. Nice going, guys! [tup]


We may not have a “Guest Barkeep” in the AM – Lars is “touch ‘n go” and we’ll kinda know by the morning whether he can make it or not. At any rate, he’s definitely going to have to be away for the afternoon. Appreciate Rob stepping up for part of the PM “shift.” I’ll put the time to good use, Gents! [swg]


Many thanx to all who have acknowledged my “special Email of this morning and of course, following through …. That response of yours, Mike brought misty eyes in my house. Perhaps a story worth sharing here at a time and occasion of your choosing. Well done, guys! [tup][tup][tup]


Dave “repeat” on the way . . . . . so, you ‘delete’ without looking at the subject line[?] Hmmmmm <grin> Anyway, the important thing is you have read my request – could this be a return to “normalcy” for our left coast guy man of mystery![?]


Appreciate the well done Posts from Pete – Doug ‘n Rob! Always inclusive and always “right on!”[tup] Particularly impressed with Doug taking the time to ensure that all of us get mentioned – and at a time in his life when there are certainly more irons in the fire than the fire can handle! [tup][tup][tup]

Rob I think we need to install one of those “hot line” phones between your house and mine! [swg] Things have been hot ‘n heavy lately, eh[?]

Pete We need to “work” toward getting Ted] to this part of the state either B4 or after KCity – that way he can visit two points of interest: The Can-Am Trainroom – and – the St. Louis Museum of Transportation![swg]


Thanx to the URLMeister for the “theme” support. They surely topped off an all around good day with the Western Pacific! Nice going, Mike. [tup][tup][tup]


Good to see Nick with his “nite cap” of great “stuff” as only he can provide! Well done, Sir and thanx for explaining that C.G.I – makes much more sense now! [swg]

I took a gamble with those CP Pix as “they” never responded to my requests – sent weeks in advance of the date. Hope the bath tub still has sufficient funds to pay the Barristers! <grin>

Never thought of it the way you put it – but we did span quite a bit of passenger railroading in just two short days. The responses were terrific as well and as mentioned a bit earlier – seems like “old times” ‘round the bar!

Glad to learn that your cement work has nothing to do with earning your keep. For that’s hardly a labo(u)r of love, eh[?]


Just caught your Post Al and surprised – but very pleased to see you made it in. Milk we have – Boris just rounded up a couple of stray cows (at least I think they were strays) and has his 3-legged stool all set to go! [swg]

Nice supplemental info for our “theme” – thought you’d like it! [tup] Hope you take the time to check out the pages since your last visit – you’ll get a kick out of much of them! [tup]


For all who provided rounds, our accountants thank you! <grin>

REMINDER: Leon the Night Man takes the bar at 9 PM (Central)


Tom [4:-)] [oX)]


Stick around a few minutes AFTER POSTING -
The information you MISS may be for YOU!

[passengerfan]

Good Evening Tom and the rest of the gang sorry for my absence but will be back in a few days mean as ever. Guess I better have a milk and buy a round for the house. Yes I said milk am on a non drinking binge for the next month. Yeck!

Can't resist WP today.

WESTERN
PACIFIC
Streamlined Dome Observations
by Al

Western Pacific owned two lightweight streamlined Vista-Dome Sleeper Lounge Observations. Both of these Budd built cars were constructed for CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR service between December 1948 and January 1949. The CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR was a joint operation of the CB&Q - D&RGW and WP. The order for CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR observations was for six of the Vista Dome Sleeper Lounge Observations with three CB&Q owned two WP owned and a single car D&RGW owned. Later the CB&Q would order another example that was delivered by Budd in December 1952.
The two WP owned cars were 881 SILVER CRESCENT and 882 SILVER PLANET. The two WP cars had showers fitted in the Drawing Room Annex in 1950. The WP was the first of the three operating partners of the CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR to discontinue service. The two WP owned Vista Dome Sleeper Lounge Observations are in the hands of private owners today.

24 SEAT VISTA DOME 3 DOUBLE BEDROOM 1 DRAWING ROOM 12 SEAT LOUNGE BUFFET 14 SEAT LOUNGE OBSERVATIONS Budd Company December 1948 - January 1949 Plan: 9511 Lot: 9660 (Built for and assigned to CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR)

WP

881 SILVER CRESCENT

882 SILVER PLANET

CB&Q

375 SILVER HORIZON

375 SILVER PENTHOUSE

376 SILVER SOLARIUM

D&RGW

1145 SILVER SKY

TTFN Al

[nickinwestwales]

Well DAVE -I can`t turn down an offer like that-[4:-)][oX)]TOM-stand by to repel freeloaders-I was here first ..!
Good evening gentlemen all,an interesting days exchanges-where to start:-

[4:-)][oX)]TOM naturally,-Enjoyed the olive-drab komedy korner today-works equally well with a Sandhurst Upper -class twit accent-a universal message perhaps...[^]
Whilst on that theme,wouldn`t dream of standing on the rusting bear-trap of knocking any marine rescue service ( the 4th emergency service in these parts)-the C.G.I reference was Computer Generated Imaging-In reference to that set of `Canadian` pix -fair play,they look detail perfect-someone has made a real labour of love of those[tup].
Nice contrast with todays featured road-opposite ends of the continent to yesterday but both still ringing with echoes of past glories--Yet again the trains look wonderful with `F` units on the point..but then again the road switchers look good too..One of those paint schemes that just naturally `works` in all its variants I guess.
You can reassure Vito that he has no immediate need to take a vacation-A neighbour of ours has had a long-running house-extension project going on.
As he has buildings on both sides and a road (literally) right outside his front door his only option has been backwards-straight into the side of the valley-so far we have dug out and wheel-barrowed out ( the only access is a metre wide path) approx 290 cubic metres of bedrock and replaced it with 200% increase in house size plus various patios,decks, conservatory etc.
Happily,the end is in sight-down to paving slabs and mosaic pathways now.

MIKE-Thanks for VoR pix-[tup]-The best detail I can give you on them is :-
the Sepia one-The white patch in the background is`The Rheidol Stag`-a local landmark ,a clearing in the woods that,from a distance ( I.E. the train on the other side of the valley ) looks like a running stag-in fact the spoil heaps from one of the lead mines that provided the traffic.
This one dates from post 1923 ( cream upper panels on coaches ) and whilst it could be as late as 1938 (original coaches scrapped) the look of the foliage and the short train without `tourist` cars suggests an `off season` working which would fix it as pre-1926,when the G.W.R cut out everything except the tourist trains.
The colour one looks to be taken from the platform of one of the radio masts on the north side of the valley-you can just see a flash of white from the`Stag` on the right,below is the new reservoir-the valley has filled up since this pic-the line of the railway can be easily followed through the trees opposite--nice pix[tup]-share em with the boys

PETE-What Ho-glad you enjoyed the V.o.R `taster`-the master of ceremonies may grant us a glimpse of an engine next week..[swg]...Sorry to say I can`t advise R.E. MoW stock-it just doesn`t appear here anymore..[%-)]
Managed to miss a visit from a `King` this weekend-"Edward 1" (I think) running to Fishguard and back-not a thing anywhere in the local media-talk about a wasted oppurtunity...spitting mad-finally got a decent camera "£$%^&*(-----WAAAH .!
enough-

ROB-A fellow `blue`-[tup][^][tup]-For my money it works especially well on the engines-the black upper panel makes them look like they`re wearing shades.
trust cement-based worries assuaged-looking forward to pix of FA2`s-even in plywood country............

DAVE-A splendid extra piece on the road of the day-[tup]-

TED,BK,LARS,CM3,AL-Your health gentlemen-Tis time I was gone again,sleep well one and all,speak soon,nick [C=:-)]

[trolleyboy]

Good early evening folks. Tom I think I could use a pitcher of blue [swg] gotta get in practice eh ? [swg]

What can I say a fab job as usual on the theme of the day. I don't think we need any of Chris's stuff everything seems quite well covered. [tup]I have recieved you emails and all proper responses have been sent on their way as well.

Dave Wow all one ever wanted to know about the WP and was afraid to ask. That's the way [tup] good to have the left coast back in the saddle as it were. I'm certainly not a affriciando of any of the western roads but man I have to say I've learned something today.

Pete Go ahead and expand away upon the HEP talk the more info the merrier.

Lars An early vote of luck for you tomorrow. I'm on afternoons ( go into work at two ) so i will pop by early on to give you a hand. All should go well however. Glad you enjoyed the HEP info, I tried not to make it so technical that it would put a sloth to sleep. You are right though I was a luckey SOB over that almost lightening strike,not a feeling I would want to experiance full force I have to say. [:O]

BK Welcome back sir. thanks for the email response, I haven't re-responded yet, most likely I will later tonight or tomorrow.Don't listen to "Herr Kapitain" marriage is acompromise, what she wants you compromise too [swg][:D]

Ted I have to say that it's good to have you back most mornings, the bar was missing that certain something, and I know that Boris has been better behaved again ( and it's spring to boot ! )I have to say that my layout is at the Pompeii after the eruption state a flat clean top surface [:O]It will get there just not sure when [sigh]

Mike Some nice photo's there sir ! Sounds like your trip was a keeper as they say, great stuff.

Rob

[Anonymous]

Good evening Tom and gents!. I’ll have my usual bottomless draught, and buy two rounds for not making it in yesterday. Between getting this place ready to sell (cleaning and boxing, getting ready for the realtor open-house today and picture taking for the virtual tour), doing my usual thing as a board member for the association (we had our monthly meeting last night), working on the farmhouse property (moving stuff from here, and prepping walls for painting) and attending today’s 1at article meeting (making of construction selections) for the home we’re building, I’ve been busy. Oh yeah, I went to work too!

Now, to catch-up on the doings here ….. Tom’s Encores included the Lehigh Valley, British Railway, UP and SR ads. By the way, I really like the different pictures you use on your info and summary of posts! Then there were the pix of the movie posters for the shows at the Emporium, and Nick’s pix, then a nice assortment of CPR pix. Loved the Canadian article! It really looked great! Today’s Western Pacific posting was another winner, sir, with a terrific post on the California Zephyr as well. You have been a busy, busy man indeed.

Dave wrote a nice article on the Baldwin 4501 and today’s information on the WP.

Peter had some nice station pix, and a nifty ship at the Mystic Nautical Museum, then some snazzy steam pix of the West Somerset Railway

Purty dome car pix from Lars, and the Silver Crescent picture today. Mike provided train pix and nifty URLs for today

Nick, I can’t take any credit for my Sunday pix being black-and-white. That’s how I got them from the Winter IRM newsletter (I just got it a few days ago!) Thanks for the explanations on the pix submitted to Tom.

Cm3PO …limbs instead of legs for chairs? OK…. Guess I learned something today. Enjoyed your supplementary information on the Canadian and the WP today.

Rob, fine pix again. I really need to get to your museum and see some of these cars! Thanks for another diesel locomotive conversion article too. Good stuff!

Thanks to all you guys for all the work you do to share your information. As for me, well …I do have a Pike submission prepared for tomorrow, but nothing today ..except for:

[:I] A priest, a Pentecostal preacher and a Rabbi all served as chaplains to the students of the University of Minnesota, Duluth. They would get together two or three times a week for coffee and talk shop.
One day, someone made the comment that preaching to people isn't really all that hard. A real challenge would be to preach to a bear. One thing led to another and they decided to do an experiment They would all go out into the woods, find a bear, preach to it, and attempt to convert it.
Seven days later, they're all together to discuss the experience. Father Flannery, who has his arm in a sling, is on crutches, and has various bandages, goes first. "Well," he says, "I went into the woods to find me a bear. And when I found him I began to read to him from the Catechism. Well, that bear wanted nothing to do with me and began to slap me around. So I quickly grabbed my holy water, sprinkled him and, Holy Mary Mother of God, he became as gentle a lamb. The bishop is coming out next week to give him First Communion and Confirmation."
Reverend Billy Bob spoke next. He was in a wheelchair, with an arm and both leg in casts, and an IV drip. In his best fire and brimstone oratory he claimed, " WELL brothers, you KNOW that we don't sprinkle! I went out and I FOUND me a bear. And then I began to read to my bear from God's HOLY WORD! But that bear wanted nothing to do with me. So I took HOLD of him and we began to wrestle. We wrestled down one hill, UP another and DOWN another until we came to a creek. So I quick DUNKED him and BAPTIZED his hairy soul. And just like you said, he became as gentle as a lamb. We spent the rest of the time praising Jesus."
They both looked down at the rabbi, who was lying in a hospital bed. He was in a body cast and traction with IV's and monitors running in and out of him. He was in bad shape. The rabbi looks up and says, "Looking back on it, circumcision may not have been the best way to start things out with my bear" [:I]

[wanswheel]

Hi Tom and everyone, a round for the house.

Good old Dad took me to Los Angeles in 1960, on the Erie-Lackawanna and the UP.
Return trip was up the coast to San Francisco and on to the California Zephyr as far as Omaha.
A fine Western Pacific train with lots of chrome and lots of dome.
And the scenery wasn't bad at all.

Freight Train
http://www.cvrma.org/pictures/MISC/dfrr5_191_wp_western_pacific_the_feather_river_route.jpg

Feather River Express
http://www.cvrma.org/pictures/MISC/dfrr5_195_wp_feather_river_express_sacramento_1940.jpg

Exposition Flyer
http://www.cvrma.org/pictures/MISC/dfrr5_196_wp_exposition_flyer_winnemucca_nv_1940s.jpg

Zephyrette
http://www.cvrma.org/pictures/MISC/dfrr5_197_wp_budd_co_zephyrettes_merlin_ca.jpg

Diesel at Salt Lake City
http://www.cvrma.org/pictures/MISC/dfrr5_198_wp_california_zephyr_salt_lake_city_ut_1969.jpg

California Zephyr climbing 4000 feet in 50 miles to cross the Continental Divide
http://calzephyr.railfan.net/pcplainview1.jpg

CZ entering 6.2-mile-long Moffat Tunnel, four thousand feet under James Peak (13,260 feet).
http://calzephyr.railfan.net/pcmoffat.jpg

Amtrak sees daylight again
http://www.trainnet.org/Libraries/Lib003/CZ818.GIF

A page from the Burlington Route's California Zephyr brochure
http://www.qstation.org/CZ_Brochure/jpeg/California_Zephyr_04.jpg
http://www.qstation.org/CZ_Brochure/ (Entire brochure if you ever need to read it)

The Longest Interurban
http://www.cvrma.org/pictures/MISC/dfrr5_200_wp_interurban_subsidiaries.jpg

On a different subject, I love the chaos in this old picture of downtown Chicago
http://www.lib.uchicago.edu/photofiles/images/apf2/apf2-01602r.jpg

[pwolfe]

Hi Tom and all.

E- Mail recieved and replied to Tom.

Another great Theme Day
TOM,The The Western Pacific had a big following I was surprised when I read the Fallen Flag that the Line had only 1,137 route miles and owned 174 locos in 1950.
I can see how the California Zepher gave the line so much popularity, thanks for the trains details CM3 and the great photo of the Silver Cresent car LARS.
It must have been a mavellous sight when hauled by those FP 7s in the red and silver livery. Loved the line in the ad " Feminine as a boudoir in the women's lounge". A classic Train for sure.
DAVE I 'll gladly have a drink with you for WP day. That post as certainly brought the
Railroad to life for me I can almost see the main Express of the day stopping in the canyon to pick up or set down fishermen and others and apart from the one bad accident the WP had a good safety record. Thanks for the info on the preserved steam locos as well.

It was mentioned about the Union Pacific have painted some new locos in Heritage Liveries. I was wondering in what areas the work as I have not seen any through here.

TED I hope we can meet up in the KC area sometime this year.

MIKE Thanks for the link to the Southern # 4501 and the old photos. I think that the Southern paint scheme for steam locos is one of the best.

BK Good to see you in, there has been some great posts lately.

ROB Thanks for Part 2 of the HEP conversions. I would like to add on the subject a bit later if I may.

I'll try and call in a bit later to have another of Dave's drinks. PETE.

[West Coast S]

Tom, i'm afraid that I have, moments ago emptied my box and all contained therein, could you resubmit? I kinda go numb searching all one hundred and forty messages.

Well, can't linger too long , something about a honey do list, but I wanted to stop by to partake in the interaction you, me and others strive to maintain in a constructive, educational, humerous and yes, even thought provoking manner.

Ok set em' up barkeep, the S man has the tab until closing tonight....to all who frequent today, your'e monies no good here on WP Tuesday.. Enjoy..

I'll be back tomorrow in the afternoon

Dave

[siberianmo]

G'day Dave!

Now THAT's a Post worth raving about! Where in the world have YOU been[?][?] The return of the "West Coast S Man" we used to enjoy so very much . . . great job and THANX for supporting our "theme for the day!" [tup][tup][tup]

I'm going to enjoy reading that Epistle of yours![swg]

Check your Email you have one 'special' awaiting you . . .

Catch ya later!

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[West Coast S]

[:D][:D] WP Tuesday !!...What's for lunch sir Tom? A plethora of WP trivia awaits all who frequent

In 1915 the idea was put forth by Rio Grande interest for a joint passenger operation, RG blocked west of Salt Lake by UP/CP interest forbiding additional construction or operations chose a second Gould interest , the recently constructed Western Pacific as the means to extend its reach to the Pacific Coast.

That year the Scenic Limited was ingurated with great fanfare, operated on the WP from Oakland to Salt Lake then conveyed to the RG for points east to a CB&Q connection to Chicago.
Concieved as a first class train, emphisis was placed on the scenery, and the respective railroads worked overtime promoting the new train, as they could not compete time wise with the rival carriers. Chronically desitute WP relied on RG and Pullman equiptment for several years until WP was in a finicial position to purchase cars of its own.

Due to the superior engineering of the WP, power no larger then a 2-8-0 or 4-6-0 was required to traverse the Feather River with the typical eight to ten car train and maintain the schedule.
In 1922 the Scenic was requipped with new Alco built passenger 2-8-0's and new Pullman sleepers and rebuilt former UP day coaches, In the summer tourist season the consists would be augmented by the addition of Rio Grande equiptment.

Though the flagship of both roads, it was not uncommon to detrain fisherman and similar outdoor types at selected locations throughout the canyon, WP maintained a hunting lodge outside Keddie until the depression ended such niceties. In a similar manner stops to pick up errant travelers were often common in the remote canyon regions.

Due to the dpression and sinking revenues the Scenic was discontinued in 1936, its duties being assumed by the Royal Gorge. With the outbreak of war in Europe in 1939, WP took notice of a request by the government that all railroads prepare for increased freight and passenger business in the foreseeable future. WP dug deep, and with federal loans envisioned a new train to be known as the Expedition Flyer. In 1938 the flyer made it's first run using the former Scenic Limiteds equiptment and augmented by long term Pullman leases and recieved an infusion of sixteen ex - Florida East Coast mountains, purchased with FRC loans for twelve thousand five hundred dollars per copy. These mountains were able to maintain the schedule of the longer consist now needed to generate revenue and were confined to passenger duty until the Zepher replacement, though rejected by the Florida East Coast for their light weight and modest tractive effort, to WP these mountains were a godsend, allowing passenger 2-8-0's to moved to assist with the ever increasing freight demands as the country awoke from the grip of the great depression.

In a darker note the Exposition Flyer factors into the only accident that occured with a passenger train. In September 1941, locomotive 83 a 1922 Alco 2-8-0 overran a stop signal west of Sunnol on the Altamont , returning light from a helper move, it collided head on with the Flyer, powered by 4-8-2 # 179 running at the posted 50mph speed limit with devastating consquences. Though no passengers were killed, three crew members lost their lives and both locomotives and head end cars were reduced to so much scrap metal by the force of the impact.

Shorty after the investigation was concluded, the Altamont became the first to have CTC installed, by this time the US was active in the war, and with operations on a ten minute headway WP had no desire to take chances. The Flyer continued well past it's target replacement date to assist with the crush of troops returning home, shortages and material restrictions at EMD and the car builders delayed the long awaited Zepher, a dream fostered by the WP ever since before the war. When the first Streamlined Zepher set entered service the era of the heavyweight, first class accomidations on the WP faded into history.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

War babies on the war path

In 1944, facing ever increasing demands and aging power not adquate for the task, WP resorted to leasing power from roads such as the SP, SF and UP whenever those roads could spare a few, still it was not enough..

WP sought relief from the War Production Board, which diverted six Lima GS-6's then under construction for the SP. Virtual copies of the earstwhile cousins, they arrived on the property in late 1944 as the 480 class. From the beginning it was obvious the WP was not impressed with the idea of maintaing and operating such a small diverse lot and they would prove expensive to operate as well.

Throught the remainder of the conflict they served as needed, one positive note was they were able to handle more tonnage then any other class, articulateds excepted and elimintated the practice of helpers wherever they ran. Soon after the first operations WP experienced complaints from engine crews of smoke engulfing the cab and restricting forward vision, odd ,the SP has no record of similar complaints with this similar locomotive. WP forces installed smoke wings to the front running boards to alleviate the problem and in the process made for a odd appearence .

By 1952 the WP was effectivitlely dieselized and the 480 class was among the first to meet the torch, being too foreign was the cause of their premature death sentence, except one that was sold to the SP as a parts engine and later scrapped by that road. By 1953 only one 480 class remained on the property in standby service, no calls for steam power were forthcoming as WP fully dieselized all road operations that year and by 1955 the boiler permits on the few remaining stored steam power were allowed to expire at which point they were cleared out as WP transioned into the diesel era and sought to remove steam service facalities as fast as possible.

Aquired out of desperation and unloved, unwanted , but able just the same, they provide a glimpse to WP in desperate times.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

WP excursion steam

With a management change in late 1955, the decision was made to preserve several historic steam locomotives, operation ws not in the plan. Only four perserved engines remain today,
4-6-0 #94 which pulled the first train into Oakland in 1910, 2-8-2 #338, 2-8-0 #28, 0-6-0 #12.

WP #94 & 338 factored into several excursions by sheer chance, after 1955, extensions were obtained on the permit time to conicide with several civic events being sponsored, both locomotives were the last shopped and in October 1956 #338 powered a NRHS and Pacific Coast Chapter sponsored excursion from Oakland to Oreville, on the return trip #338 suffered firing difficulties due to poor fuel and was removed at Stockton . The next days excusions were powered by the #94 with diesel assistance. The #338 never again operated and was retired for preservation in Rio Vista Ca.

Number 94 also served to represent the railroad prior to final retirement in 1961 she powered a heavyweight consist to Hearst, turned of the wye located there, dropped the cars and awaited the arrival of the California Zepher . She was placed ahead of the A-B-B-A power and lead the Zepher on the last leg to Oakland on the same day she ingurated service so many years before, #94 resides in Rio Vista and was operable and used for excursions on musem grounds into the late seventies, today she is on static display along with the #338 as a visible reminder of the glory years of WP steam.


Dave

[siberianmo]

G’day Gents!


Time again for some ‘small talk’ in the form of acknowledgments to those who visited thus far . . . .

By now I expect everyone has received my Email . . . . thanx to those who acknowledged receiving it and of course for following through . . . . [tup]


trolleyboy Rob
Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 21:55:04 & 22:35:56

Oh, you’ll “do” a hi-wire act, fer sure, fer sure! Never say never![swg] I’ll tell you all about my experience riding the “mechanical bull” down in Dallas way back when I was about 25 years younger. [swg] It’ll cost ya a Blue to hear it in full . . . .

As always, another ‘educational’ piece for us and I too appreciate the effort! [tup][tup][tup]


Theodorebear Ted
Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 08:02:55

Haven’t we traveled this road B4 with the “threat” of a visit to MO[?] Well, let ‘er rip – would love to have ya! As your plans get closer to reality, let’s hear about what you are proposing and I’m sure can all hook up.

There’s one thing about traveling by rail that we can always say we’ve done – and that is crossing Canada – both ways twice – in the drawing room suite (triple bedroom) of the Park observation dome car. Not quite coast to coast – but 3 days and 3 nights worth each way. A great experience and irregardless of the era, when aboard those Budd stainless steel beauties, it cudda been 1955 for all we cared! [tup][tup][tup]


LoveDomes Lars
Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 09:00:30

Got your Email and want you to know, don’t be overly concerned about the change of plans – things happen. We’ll continue along without our “Relief Bartender” until there’s a better time! [tup][tup] Just hope all works out well with this latest situation . . .

Appreciate the morning visit, added nicely to the “theme” and made the morning look “busy!” [swg]

The round is always appreciated as is your company. I have an Email en route . . .


coalminer3 CM3
Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 09:06:00

Appreciate the supplemental WP info and don’t recall viewing it . . . many pages ago, my guess. Anyway, fits right in.

This road was a favorite of our former customer, CFournier Chris and my guess is that he’s got some Posts on previous pages regarding the WP – just haven’t had the time (or inclination) to dig ‘em up . . .

Thanx for the quarters and round . . . we’ll find use for both! [swg][tup]


BudKarr BK
Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 11:12:27

My guess is that you’re having a bit of trouble figuring out whether you are coming or going, eh[?] [swg] Well, standby Mate – it only gets “better” once you’re married! [swg]<har, har, har, hee, hee, ho, ho>

Thanx for the round and enjoy your game of ‘catch up.’


Tom [4:-)] [oX)]


Stick around a few minutes AFTER POSTING - The information you MISS may be for YOU!

[siberianmo]

THEME for the DAY! - THEME for the DAY!

PASSENGER TRAIN NOSTALGIA #62
first Posted on page 228

Here’s something to enjoy regarding the California Zephyr from a 1949 advertisement in my personal collection.


Luxurious comfort at economy saving fares in new VISTA-DOME chair coaches.

Feminine as a boudoir in the women’s lounge. Men’s lounges equally complete.

Enjoy delicious meals and personalized service in the California Zephyr’s beautiful dining car.

”SCENIC-WAY” TO CALIFORNIA

TAKE THE VISTA-DOME

CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR

Extra Pleasure * Extra Comfort * No Extra Fare

“Scenic way” is right!” Only the amazing new California Zephyr gives you the double thrill of riding the most wonderful train in the world right through America’s most wonderful scenery./ And what a way to see it! The new VISTA-DOME way! Now you can look ahead . . . look up . . . look down . .l . look everywhere . . . while you glide in luxurious comfort through the magnificent Colorado Rockies and Feather River Canyon in daylight hours . . . Utah and Nevada by starlight or moonlight. Your choice of low cost VISTA-DOME reclining chair coaches or new type Pullman accommodations, drawing rooms, bedrooms, roomettes and sections. Through sleeper daily between New York and San Francisco.

NEW, FASTER DAILY SCHEDULES

WESTBOUND (Read Down) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . EASTBOUND (Read Up)
. 3:30 PM Lv – Chicago . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Ar 1:30 PM
11:59 PM Lv – Omaha . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Ar 4:55 AM
. 1:19 AM Lv – Lincoln . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Ar 3:40 AM
. 8:40 AM Lv – Denver . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Ar 7:00 PM

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Colorado Rockies . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
. 1:53 PM Lv – Glenwood Springs . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Lv 1:35 PM
10:25 PM Lv – Salt Lake City . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Lv 5:40 AM

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Feather River . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
. 7:00-11:00 AM . . . . . . . . . . .Canyon . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2:00-6:00 PM
12:28 PM Lv – Sacramento . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Lv 12:50 PM
. 1:34 PM Ar – Stockton . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Lv 11:53 AM
. 4:00 PM Ar – Oakland . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Lv 9:44 AM
. 4:50 PM Ar – San Francisco . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Lv 9:00 AM

BURLINGTON * RIO GRANDE * WESTERN PACIFIC




Enjoy!

Tom [4:-)][oX)]


THEME for the DAY! - THEME for the DAY!

[BudKarr]

Good Morning Captain Tom and all assembled!

Another return trip for me and quite a bit of catching up to do as well.

Your e-mail has been received - and an appropriate message whisked off as requested. Thank you for including me.

For Rob & Lars your e-maills have also been received and answered. Thank you.

I did notice the previous page full of Canadian Pacific and will be starting my review of material from this page - back. It works better for me that way. A new definition to the term assbackwards! [swg]

Not much to report regarding our most recent getaway, other than to say it was enjoyable, as always. Such a beautiful place to live and so many great sights to take in. I know the world does not stand still for any man, but for me - in this place and time - it seems so. [tup]

A round on me if you please Sir Barkeep! And I will have a Southern Comfort on the rocks then take my leave for a short whille.

Yes - "bookend" you beat me in today (finally!{ [swg]

BK

[coalminer3]

Good Morning Barkeep and All Present; thermos refill please, round for the house and $ for the jukebox.

It has been decreed that we shall do "lots of stuff outside" today - work stuff that is; so this will be quick one. I will acknowledge posts later.

My memories of the WP are pretty much of green and orange diesels in Nevada. At that time the WP was on its last legs before the resurrection by UP. A good source of information on the late days of the WP is Richard Saunders's book, Main Lines: Rebirth of the North American Railroads, 1970-2002. It has some editorial shortcomings, especially on some of the maps and his use of terms, but the story is well-told.

Here is a lkisting of Zepohyr equipment from the Dec. '69 ORG entry for WP.

Vista dome club observation sleeper
Sleepeing Cars
6 double bedrooms, 5 compartments
10 rtte/6 db
Vista-Dome Chair Cars
Vista Dome Buffet-Club Car (that's the one for me)
Dining Car (Dinner reservations)

Trains 17 and 18 will handle checked baggage (no dogs or pets) at San Francisco, Oakland, Fremont, Stockton, Sacramento, Marysville, Oroville, and Salt Lake City only on Western Pacific Railroad.

Following lines were still in service in addtion to the main line and the Inside Gateway

Portola-Reno Jct. - Reno
Fremont (Niles) Milpitas - San Jose (IIRC, this was abt. the last satnd of F units on the WP)
Loyalton Branch - Hawley-Loyalton
Tracy Branbch - Tracy to End of Branch
Tooele Branch - Burmeister to Warner
Ellerback Branch - Ellerbeck to Dolomite

Well, I gotta get out of here - truck's loading.

BTW, Tom, I got your e-mail and have replied to you.

work safe

[LoveDomes]

Good Morning!

Yes, an early morning visit from "The Lars Man!" Just a "test run" for tomorrow. [swg]

Checked out those late night posts from the "Count" and glad he's back on line. I agree, the place isn't quite the same without our "Bat Man!" [swg] I don't need to tell you just how FORTUNATE you are to be around to tell that story regarding the lightning strike. Nothing to fool with and surely something to be thankful for.

Enjoyed your piece on the HEP . . . educational and never hurts to reinforce the background info for us all. Thanx! [tup][tup][tup]

As always Tom, nice work with the "RR from Yesteryear" accompanied by your encore of the Fallen Flag for the Western Pacific! [tup][tup][tup]

My guess is that WP was best known for the California Zephyr which just happens to be my favorite of all U.S. streamliners. Operated by more than one road, this great train surely has a niche in North American passenger railroading lore.

A pix therefore is in order:

WP #881 Silver Crescent (from: www.trainweb.org)


Now, isn't that nice![?] [yeah][wow] Makes one just want to climb aboard and get 'er underway! [tup][tup][tup]

A bit early for my imbibing, so I'll stick with #3 from the breakfast menu, a tall OJ and some of those bisquits from the Mentor Bakery. Man, this coffee has a great taste! There are times when I wonder whether Boris has been washing his socks in the urn! [swg] Only kidding - we all know he doesn't wear any! [swg]

I see Doug 'n Ted made it in this morning - sorry I missed 'em and more sorry they missed your fine posts! They'll be back though and the nice thing about this way of communicating is that the material remains ready for viewing! Long live Kalmbach's Forums! [tup][tup][tup]

Dont' know how many of you follow baseball, much less my Mets, but they have been getting their "lumps" out on the left coast. Not only that, but one of our announcers, former big leaguer Keith Hernandez (you guys had him in St. Louis one time, huh[?]) opened his mouth and inserted foot regarding a comment about a woman in the dugoout. It's been all over the news and sports pages. You'd think there's nothing else going on . . . some people don't need a reason to over react. By the way, where and when did this politically correct crap begin[?] No - no - please don't tell me for I don't want to turn our "Classic Trains" thread into something it wasn't intended to be. We're supposed to "check baggage at the door" if I remember "Nick's House Rules" correctly! [tup]

On a more serious note, I received your morning e-mail and presume the rest of the guys have as well.

I will check back a bit later, if for no other reason than to see if my "bookend" has returned. Lookeee, lookeee, I beat him in! [yeah]


Until the next time!

Lars

[Anonymous]

And a happy Tuesday a.m. to all. Tom, I think a tall Grapefruit juice, Prune Danish and a cuppa Folger's, thanks. Terriffic stuff on the "TheCanadian," "Canadian," Maroon and Gray, Blue and Orange, Red and White, all Budd consists, and "all points stainless." Wouldn't it have been great to have the "where-with-all" to book a bedroom coast to coast on the dome/obsevation car? I understand it is still available if you want to "slap a second mortgage" on the ranch.[:O] The C.P./C.N map seemed to omit the Banff leg? Doug, best wishes on your move. Having survived nine (count 'em) bag, baggage, mattress on the car roof and baby grand piano moves, you have my sympathies. NO MORE!!! If obnoxious new neighbors become intolererable, I'll simply "blow 'em away." I prefer a 8 ft. by 10 ft. cell with 3 "squares" to another move. I guess our friends doing the "real deal" are gearing up for outdoor excursion events for the summer.[tup] I'm toying with the thought of dropping in on some that action near the Kcity, MO area this season. Tom and Pete, I hope this serves as "fair warning," even though El Capitan's traveling shoes may be well worn after his June excursion.[swg] Rob, let there be no "sack cloth and ashes" for procrastinating in the "attic." My efforts in the garage (HO) have come to a screeching halt. As of now, the Pike looks like Hiroshima August 7, 1945. Well, I'm late as it is, so must haul my carcass to the Library and thence to the "think tank."[V] Good luck Lars on the relief shift tomorrow. Of course Boris will be an invaluable assistant for...er...uh...Hmmm? "Bell bashing?" Happy rails to all and especially those I neglected to mention...my apologies.

[siberianmo]

THEME for the DAY! - THEME for the DAY!

Here’s another Fallen Flag from Classic American Railroads:
first Posted on page 108

Western Pacific (WP)

Headquarters: San Francisco, CA

Route mileage in 1950: 1,137

Locomotives in 1963: Diesel - 174

Rolling stock in 1950: Freight cars – 5,532; Passenger cars – 29

Principal routes in 1950 (not including subsidies):

Oakland-Stockton-Sacramento, CA-Salt Lake City, UT
Keddie-Bieber, CA
Reno Junction-Reno, NV
Niles-San Jose, CA

Passenger trains of note:

California Zephyr (Chicago-Oakland)
Exposition Flyer (Chicago – Oakland)
Feather River Express (Oakland-Portola, CA)
Royal Gorge (Oakland-St. Louis, MO)
Scenic Limited (Oakland-St. Louis)
Zephyrette (Oakland-Salt Lake City) [RDC’s!]

Enjoy! [tup]

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]


THEME for the DAY! - THEME for the DAY!

[siberianmo]

Now arriving on track #1 …..
Railroads from Yesteryear! Number Sixteen


Used with permission from: Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Formatting differences made necessary due to Forums requirements. Some heralds from other sources.


Western Pacific Railroad (WP)




Reporting marks: WP

Locale: California, Nevada, and Utah

Dates of operation: 1903 – 1983

Track gauge: 4 ft 8½ in (1435 mm) (standard gauge)

Headquarters: San Francisco, California



"Drumhead" logos such as these often adorned the ends of observation cars on the Western Pacific Railroad.

The Western Pacific Railroad (AAR reporting mark WP) was a Class I railroad in the United States. It is now part of Union Pacific Railroad (UP).


History

Founded in 1903, the Western Pacific Railroad was built as a portion of the Gould family's efforts to create a transcontinental railroad in the late 19th and early 20th century.

One of the American West’s most popular railroads, the WP attracted rail enthusiasts from around the world. From 1910 to 1982, its diverse route provided scenic views of the San Francisco Bay Area, the mountain communities of the famous Feather River Route, and the deserts of Nevada and Utah. The Western Pacific originated in 1900 as the Alameda and San Joaquin Railroad. The railroad which would become the Western Pacific was financed and built by the Denver and Rio Grande Western Railroad, under the direction of George Jay Gould I, to provide a standard gauge track connection to the Pacific Coast. In 1909, it became the last railroad completed into California.

In 1931, WP opened a second mainline north out of the Feather River Canyon to reach the Great Northern Railway in northern California. This route, called the "Highline", joined the Oakland to Salt Lake City mainline at a junction known as the Keddie Wye. Considered the heart of the railroad, this unique structure featured two steel trestles and a tunnel, all forming a triangle of intersecting track.


A 1930 map of the Western Pacific and Denver and Rio Grande Western Railroad systems.

One of the more well-known aspects of the Western Pacific was its operation of the California Zephyr passenger train, in conjunction with the Denver and Rio Grande Western Railroad and the Chicago, Burlington and Quincy Railroad. The WP handled the "Silver Lady" from Oakland, California, to Salt Lake City, Utah.

Since it competed directly with the long-entrenched and much larger Southern Pacific Railroad, the WP became a company known both for its innovation and for wringing every dollar out of an investment. It was the first large railroad in the West to eliminate steam locomotives in favor of diesels, then kept some of these early diesels running in regular service long after they had been retired elsewhere. It embraced computerized dispatching, concrete crossties and innovative equipment to protect customer shipments, at the same time fielding antique wooden cabooses and rebuilding outmoded freight cars.


Western Pacific #581, a Baldwin Locomotive Works VO-1000, is seen in a September, 1945 builder's photo. (courtesy: www.trainweb.com)

The Western Pacific owned several connecting short-line railroads. The largest and most well-known was the Sacramento Northern Railway, which at one time reached from San Francisco to Chico, California. Others included the Tidewater Southern Railway and the Deep Creek Railroad.

The Western Pacific was acquired in 1983 by Union Pacific Corporation, the owner of its long-time rival, the Union Pacific Railroad. In July 2005, Union Pacific unveiled a brand new EMD SD70ACe locomotive, Union Pacific 1983, in full Western Pacific colors as part of a new heritage program.

References

• Western Pacific Railroad Historical Society
• WP Lives website; Western Pacific History
• National Railroad Museum, Green Bay, Wisconsin
• Encyclopedia of Western Railroad History
• Union Pacific Railroad
• Union Pacific Historical Society



Western Pacific #3009, an EMD GP35, stops for servicing in Stockton, California in 1974. (courtesy: www.trainweb.com)



Western Pacific #805A, an EMD FP7 locomotive on display in June, 1999 at the Portola Railroad Museum in Portola, California. (courtesy: www.trainweb.com)


Used with permission from: Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Formatting differences made necessary due to Forums requirements. Some heralds from other sources.

***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** *****

Enjoy!

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]



Did you miss any of the previous fifteen[?] Click the URL:

#1: Baltimore & Ohio (B&O
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=233&TOPIC_ID=35270
#2: Chesapeake & Ohio (C&O)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=234&TOPIC_ID=35270
#3: Pennsylvania (PRR)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=237&TOPIC_ID=35270
#4: New York Central (NYC)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=240&TOPIC_ID=35270
#5: New Haven (NYNH&H)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=242&TOPIC_ID=35270
#6: Santa Fe (ATSF) (Two Parts)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=246&TOPIC_ID=35270
#7: Southern Pacific (SP)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=253&TOPIC_ID=35270
#8: Northern Pacific (NP)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=259&TOPIC_ID=35270
#9: Coastline/Seaboard (ACL – SCL – SAL) (Two Parts)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=267&TOPIC_ID=35270
#10: Southern Railway (SOU)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=276&TOPIC_ID=35270
#11: Denver and Rio Grande Western (D&RG)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=282&TOPIC_ID=35270
#12: Great Northern Railway (GN)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=287&TOPIC_ID=35270
#13: Missouri Pacific (MP)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=293&TOPIC_ID=35270
#14: Illinois Central (IC)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=299&TOPIC_ID=35270
#15: Boston & Maine (B&M)
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=307&TOPIC_ID=35270

[Anonymous]

Good morning guys. Sorry to do a "post and run", but I didn't want anyone to think I've forgotten. You. Busy day yesterday and today until late. I'll try to get caught-up later this evening. Again .. sorry for having to be so brief!

[siberianmo]

from: www.viarail.ca

We open at 6 AM. (All time zones - Don’t ask how we do that!)[swg]


TUESDAY’s INFO & SUMMARY of POSTS

Tuesday is here! Join us for breakfast – select a <light> or <traditional> breakfast from the Menu Board. Some pastries from The Mentor Village Bakery, and of course a large mug of steaming hot, freshly ground and brewed coffee![tup]


Daily Wisdom

A faint heart never filled a flush.



Info for the Day:


Railroads from Yesteryear – Western Pacific (WP) arrives TODAY!


* Weekly Calendar:


Wednesday: Pike Perspective’s Day!
Thursday: Fish ‘n Chips Nite!
Friday: Pizza Nite! & Steak Nite!
Saturday: Steak ‘n Trimmin’s Nite! – and –
ENCORE! Saturday


[tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup]



Comedy Corner

Nearly Always True

"A slipping gear could let your M203 grenade launcher fire when you
least expect it. That would make you quite unpopular in what's left of your unit."
- Army's magazine of preventive maintenance.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Aim towards the Enemy."
- Instruction printed on US Rocket Launcher

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend."
- U.S. Marine Corps

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Cluster bombing from B-52s are very, very accurate. The bombs are
guaranteed to always hit the ground."
- USAF Ammo
Troop

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"If the enemy is in range, so are you."
- Infantry Journal

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It is generally inadvisable to eject directly over the area you just bombed."
- U.S. Air Force Manual

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never
encountered automatic weapons."
- General Macarthur

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Try to look unimportant; they may be low on ammo."
- Infantry Journal

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"You, you, and you ... Panic. The rest of you, come with me."
- U.S. Marine Corp Gunnery
Sgt.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Tracers work both ways."
- U.S. Army Ordnance

-----------------------------------------------------------------------


[tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup][tup]



The Mentor Village Emporium Theatre

NOW SHOWING:

Double Features and Three Stooges Short Subject!

. . . Sunday, April 23rd thru Apr 29th: Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid (1969) starring: Paul Newman, Robert Redford & Kathy Ross –and- The Sting (1973) starring: Paul Newman, Robert Redford & Robert Shaw. SHORT: Men In Black (1934).



SUMMARY

Name …..…………… Date/Time …..…..………. (Page#) .. Remarks

(1) siberianmo Tom Posted: 24 Apr 200, 05:27:49 (312) Monday’s Info & Summary

(2) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 06:44:11 (313) Bear It all!

(3) siberianmo Tom Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 07:20:36 (313) Something Special – Ad

(4) siberianmo Tom Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 07:47:24 (313) Commentary, etc.

(5) coalminer3 CM3 Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 08:51:13 (313) Inclusive Post, Shane-style!

(6) siberianmo Tom Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 10:22:25 (313) Canadian Rwys of the Past – CP’s “The Canadian”

(7) coalminer3 CM3 Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 12:18:14 (313) Part deux! CP, etc.

(8) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 13:11:24 (313) Inclusive Post, etc.

(9) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 13:21:49 (313) 5 “Sunday” Pix!

(10) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 13:29:10 (313) CN/GT Ad

(11) LoveDomes Lars Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 14:31:16 (313) Lars Report!

(12) siberianmo Tom Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 17:06:45 (313) Acknowledgments, etc.

(13) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 17:35:27 (313) Nick Speaks! On point!

(14) wanswheel Mike Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 18:06:15 (313) URLs & Pix, etc.

(15) pwolfe Pete Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 19:05:13 (313) Wolfman Howls! Good stuff!

(16) siberianmo Tom Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 20:25:11 (313) Acknowledgments, etc.

(17) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 21:55:04 (313) Inclusive Post, etc.!

(18) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 22:35:56 (313) Classic Diesels #19 – Loco Conversions, Pt II




That’s it! [tup][;)]


Tom [4:-)] [oX)]
Proprietor of “Our” Place, an adult eating & drinking establishment!

[trolleyboy]

Okay gents one more post before the count heads back to the crypt. A continuation of friday's non powered locomotive conversions.

CLASSIC DIESELS # 19 LOCOMOTIVE CONVERSIONS PT 2

This piece will cover two other types of old locomotives conversions, completed to help keep passenger trains going.

Head-End Power Cars

head end electric power to provide heat and ligth to passenger cars was not a new idea, the Milwaukee road did build and convert cars to provide light and heat as mentione din the first part of this classic.However the standard method to provide ligthing for passenger cars had come to consist of a truck mounted generator and storage batteries under each car.On long distance higher speed mainline passenger trains this was fine,however on stop and start suburban commuter trains which tended to run shorter slower runs, some form of head end power car was still needed as the short runs and slower speeds prevented proper battery charging.The first systems were fed directly from t a large turbo generator mounted on the boiler of the locomotive or on the tenders in the days of steam,then later as diesels came envogue from the diesel driven generator in the locomotive or mounted in a speacially converted coach or combine car.

Some railroads decided that it was cheaper to house this "head end power" in a locomotive carbody,and could then also serve as the control cab for the non-locomotive end of a push / pull configured train. Good examples of this would be Go transit using converted F7's and the Long Island railroad's FA2's. The Prime movers were removed and small catapiller diesels were placed in their place to provide the hotel power for the coaches. the control satnds were left in along with the mu controls so that the "dummy" could control the trains travel in the one direction of every trip. This avoided the need to turn and remarshall the passenger trains which saves time which is of coarse of prime importance in a commuter type situation.

As with any conversion process a transition period is required.For example as Amtrak began replacing the older axel generator equiped cars with newer head end power cars and replacing the older locomotives such as the SDP40F's which provided steam heating with F40's. They would provide some interm cars and locomotive conversions to compensate for a mixture of the new and old equipment. Some coaches had interm HEP units installed to provide light for new Amfleet equipment while several old surplus E units were converted to steam heat cars for use with the older steam heated coaches still in service.

E8A's 495-499 had their steam generators replaced by HEP units at ICG's Paducah shops in 1975, the sdame year E9B's 1916-1921 were converted to steam heater cars in 1977 at Amtraks own Hialieah shops in Miami. Amtrak maintained these cars and used them right up till the end of the steam heated car era ( early 80's )

Fuel Tender's

The Northern Pacific was the first railway to employ a purpoe built fuel tender, their "water baggage cars ". In these cars extra capacity fuel tanks and water tanks for steam heat boilers were carried and piped to the adjacent locomotives.This was done as the F units that pulled the long distance passenger trains for the NP only had limited space for water and fuel on board. This allowed for less refueling stops and better run times for the main name trains of the line.

Similar problems were found with the new F40PH's on Amtrak. The F40's small fuel tanks lead to excess fuel stops on the transcontinental runs.This is off coarse undesirable when one is schedualling this type of train service,also by lessening the number of fuel stops Amtrak could save on the paymnenbts they made to the host railroads who's fuel and fuel facilities they were using.In 1978 E8A 400 was experamentally converted into a fuel tender. The prime miver was removed and in its place six 1350 gallon fuel tanks ( were old water tanks removed from the SDP40's ) that plus the units actual fuel tank gave it a carry capacity of 9300 gallons !This was enough fuel for the entire Chicago-Seattle trip without having to stop for refueling. This tender was not duplicated and the experament only lasted for a couple of years

Rob

[trolleyboy]

Good evening Leon,an early start for you today as well,impressive.I think I'll just do a tall draft of Keith's this evening sir, thank -you.

Tom Yes I have to say , quite a good day all in all at the ole bar. A relitivly urgent email is on it's way to you as well[:(] I do keep a vat of spf100 handy for my daylight forays into the mentor villiage[;)][:p]. At least the inmates residents don't run in fear when they see me approach anymore[:D].I look forward to the next, batch of Canam train shots [tup][yeah] Sorr I don't do highwire acts anymore,not after what happened to the Flying Walendas[:0][B)][xx(]

lars Jumping in with both feet on wednesday eh[?] Good show, I'll try to be as around as I can for you that day,I'm sure it will work out well [tup] I didn't want my computer to blow up so if in doubt i always leave it off. I was semi zapped once and have vowed never to go there again[:0] I know you need to hear the story so leon another draft please. It was a similar storm of 10 yeasr ago now , i was sitting on my futon( iron bedframe ) watching the tube. I had a the basement apt at the time, ligthning hit a water main 4 blocks away and the after effects travelled through the old iron pipes which ran under the subfloor of my bedroom to the ensuite. I felt a good tingle fo about 20 seconds,not enough to do any damage but enough to scare the who ha out of me. [B)][:0]

Nick I too am very interested in your new found love of the cement mixer[;)][:0][B)][xx(] Nothing horrible I trust[?]Also I'm also one of the few that actually liked the "blue line " paint job on VIA rail. I have a set of FA2's and six old riverossi cars painted that way for running whenever I manage to get the ole rail line moving again in the attic. Yes Tom procrastinatuion still has me in it's grip[:I][V]

pete Do try to get your friend in here, he does have a wonderfull eye for the photographs.

Mike excellent urls from our local research dept as well good stuff [tup]


Rob

[siberianmo]

Good Evenin’ Gents!

Just a few words before signing off – a good day at the bar, especially for a Monday! One just never, ever knows about this place! [swg]

nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 17:35:27

Are you working for “Vito the Hit!”[?] Several have wondered aloud what this cement mixing is all about . . . So what have I missed – C.G.I [?][?] Used to mean “Coast Guard Intelligence”<grin> ‘splain, please!

Yes, the Canadian Pacific undoubtedly was a “world standard,” no matter what my favorite road (PRR) claimed. The Budd cars “made” that train and irrespective of today’s routing, the cars remain as a testament to those wonderful days where traveling by rail was indeed a treat for those who could afford the amenities!


wanswheel Mike Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 18:06:15

The “URLMeister” returns! Loved that Southern loco! [tup]


pwolfe Pete Posted: 24 Apr 2006, 19:05:13

Lotsa info in your Post and another fine example of what our effort to be “inclusive” is all about! [tup][tup][tup]

That VIA Rail Pix with the Elk is my favorite as well – good taste! [swg]

There was a huge investment in passenger trains in the U.S. and Canada almost immediately after WWII ended. It was the RRs “last gasp” at trying to stem the tide that surely was about to change the face of personal travel in North America. It’s a story that has been told very well and perhaps one day, one of us will summarize it for presentation here.


Okay boyz – that’s it for me. Ring the bell, Boris and the drinks are on me! [tup]


Leon the Night Man has the bar – came in early!


Tom [4:-)] [oX)]