Apparently, I should have said three, not two, but one of the three not unique. 1062 was not the car I had in mind and furthermore is a very typical single-end, center exit PCC, like most of the fleet, in no way unique. Louisville got its complete order of PCC's, a few were tested, and all immediately sold to Cleveland and repainted in Cleverland Transit colors and then ended up in Toronto a year before the final Cleveland streetcars ran. The two cars I am asking about are among a minority that differ from the bulk of the fleet. However, there is a hint about one in your answer.
If anyone is having difficulty in answering the quesiton, please visit the website www.streetcar.org, and inspect color side-views of the entire operating PCC fleet.
I really do not understand why my question has not gotten a correct answer. Are you boycotting the website I am recommending?
OK, more hints, the two properties represented by the two specific PCC minority-configuration cars had different gauges. And at least once a real PCC car did visit the actual tracks of one of the properties but not the other.
IT and PST's double enders looked like PCCs but had different trucks, and PST's were 5' 2 1/2" guage. LA Ry had 3' 6" guage PCCs.
Illinois Terminal's double-enders were PCC's and had a varient of the PCC B-3 iinterurban truck as used with wide gauge on the Pittsburgh Railway's 1700 equipped with overhead additional headlight, "cow catcher" and air horn. Philadelphia Suburban's were not PCC's and so you have half the answer, and their cars were not standard gauge and were double-ended. Look at the website. This car is a late edition to the operating fleet. You might want to look at the end-view also.
You're talking about 737, a Brussels Belgium PCC painted for VBZ (Zurich Switzerland) which looks something like the VBZ's Be4/4 1351-1416 (Mittelschwer) and 1501-1552 (Leichtwagen) series cars that were definitely non-PCC (though the 1500s had pedal controls) and were meter guage. The drive system was developed by MFO (Oerlikon) with some cars equipped with motors and controls built under license by BBC (Brown Boveri). All of the carbodies were built by SWS (Schlieren).
Brussels and some other Belgian cities had PCCs (like 737) with undersized bodies for narrow streets. Some have been rebuilt into articulated units over the years.
You still do not have the right one. As a visit to the website will indicate, the Belgian PCC painted to look like a Zurich Swiss Standard, a single-end standard gauge car painted to look like a non-PCC meter-gauge double-end car, is not part of the regular operating fleet on the F line because its narrow width reduces its capacity. In fact, it cannot be used in regular service because it does not have a chair-lift step arrangement to comply with handicapped access requirements, a feature of the regular operating PCC's.
The car I am looking for is painted to look like a car that never existed. Same gauge and double-ended though, and part of the operating fleet. Painted to look like a car that would have been bought if money had been available for the purpose.
No PCC ever visited Zurich, although a car from Ghent or Antwerp, or the one Charleroi sample car, could have, also meter gauge, but not Brussels or The Hague or Marseilles, all standard gauge.
Brussels articulated PCCs, or at least most of them, were built as such, not rebuilt from 4-axle cars. Except for two museum cars, all regular Brusslls PCC's are retired. Some artics still run.
daveklepperBut two cars are painted in color schemes for two systems that never ran PCC's. (1) Which two PCC cars, (2) who built them and for whom, (3) what is different about them from most of the present MUNI PCC fleet, (4) for which systems are they painted, and (5) why?
Just a summation.
1011 painted for Market St Ry was built by St. Louis Car in 1948. MSRy had plans for PCC-type cars that probably would have been electrically similar to the Balboa High Speeds they did build, but MSRy never got any streamilined cars, and was bought out by Muni in 1944. 1011 is a double ender representing the namesake company of the Market St. Ry Assoc., the group that started the restoration of streetcar service on Market St.
1010 is painted for the Muni's Magic Carpet cars, PCC bodies built without the the Transit Research patented PCC parts. St. Louis car 1948. As a nod to Muni's pre-PCC streamliners.
1062 is painted for Louisville, KY. Built for Philadelphia Transportation Co. as its 2101 in 1948 by St. Louis Car. Louisville bought PCCs but never ran them, almost immediately selling them to Cleveland, which later resold them to Toronto, where they were reguaged to 4' 10 7/8" The car was originally 5' 2 1/2" guage when it was in Philadelphia. Philadelphia still runs some St. Louis-built PCCs on the 15 Girard Ave line.
Narig, but MUNI does and did operate PCC"s, so just because the car is paianted like a Magic Carpet, still does not count. YOu got half the answer with the Philly Suburban-painted double-ender (1007), and the other car is the one painted like a Markeet Street Ry PCC that never existed (1011). These are the two cars that fully meet the requirements of the question. And note that the long-time actual operating tracks of the F line, which were also the main line downtown for the remaining five lines during the period before the Subway, are the former Market Street tracks, the inside tracks, not the former MUNI tracks which were the outside tracks. So with two people each giving half the answer, you decide between yourselves.
Thar is RCdye and narig1
Take it IGN!
Stockton and Darlington
That would be the Middleton Railway from Middleton to Leeds. Worked by horses from 1758 to 1812, steam 1812 to 1834, horses from 1834 to 1866. Some of the line is still in operation as a museum railway. The rack operation, later discontinued, was around 1812 using a locomotive named Salamanca.
This railroad operated its own boats on Long Island Sound, connecting with a mail and express train listed as a "mixed" that was often heavy enough to draw a 2-8-0 with a tender booster, the heaviest power on the divison where the boats docked.
Central Vermont
daveklepper Central Vermont
CV had its own piers in New York, and the packet boats Vermont and New Hampshire
rcdrye CV had its own piers in New York, and the packet boats Vermont and New Hampshire
Is CV the correct answer?
Mark
CV is the correct answer. It ran a "mixed" train on its Southern Division (part of today's New England Central's Palmer sub) to meet its boats in New London. CV transportation had its own piers in New York City. The whole operation lasted until the late 1930s. Normal power for the train was a CV 4-6-0, but on heavier days or in the winter the train drew the heaviest power on the Southern Division, 2-8-0's with tender boosters. The rest of the CV had heavy enough track structure to handle small 4-8-4s and 2-10-4s. The other passenger carrying schedule on the Southern Division was covered by a gas-electric.
I had always thought the lines east of White River Jct. were all B&M and didn't realize the CV reached the seaport of New London. Did the CV run through freights to New London via trackage rights over the B&M between WRJ and Brattleboro or was the Southern Div a completely isolated entity. The March 1946 OG doesn't show any through passenger service just all stop Motor trains No's 1 & 2 running between Brattleboro and New London.
Between White River Jct and East Northfield MA (just over the state line from Vermont), the CV owned White River Jct - Windsor VT (original Vermont Central), B&M owned Windsor to Brattleboro (built as Sullivan RR and Vermont Valley). At Brattleboro the CV owned the line that stayed in Vermont towards East Northfield, part of todays NECR Palmer Sub (which also includes the ex-B&M from Windsor). The B&M owned a line that crossed into New Hampshire and ran south to East Northfield. The line was operated jointly under B&M rules and dispatching, with most southbound trains of both roads using the CV, northbouds the B&M. The B&M's bridge at East Northfield collapsed in 1970 and was removed, so all trains ended up on the CV. CV acquired the ex-B&M portion in 1987, and sold the whole system to NECR in 1995. CV used its own and leased CN power on through freights. CV's Texas types could operate as far south as Brattleboro.
An odd feature of the joint operation in steam days is that one pair of B&M passenger trains drew CV power and crews south of Brattleboro even though it ran over the B&M to Springfield Union Station. It was the only train that regularly ran north on the CV-owned line.
The freight trains did continue to run to New London after WWII began in 1939, but the boats were discontiniiued, for fear of U-boat attacks, after the Cunard Line Athena was sunk, 9 September. This ship was carrying mostly British children bound for a safe Canada and did carry any armaments. My cousin Bell Klepper Wilkes and her son, my second cousin of my age and virtual twin in appearance and best friend, Jonti, went down with the ship. Bell's husband, Pediatrician Dr. Edward Wilkes and Janti's older brother, Danial Wilkes survived. The family had been enjoying their yearly Scottish vacation. The freights then interchanged with the Netw Haven via a connecting track that remains in service today. Some freight had been interchanged wih the NH earlier of course. The connecting track has been used for passenger specials (rode several, including steam, CV had trackage rights into the New London Station) and for an occasional Montrealier rerout.
Name the succesful frieght short line: (1) Name contains the complete name of an interurban. (2) All its route and all its trackage except for new sidings and a Y-connection were operated by that interurban. (3) Its iinitial CEO had been the CEO of the interurban. (4) Its initial motive power had been freight power of that interurban.
daveklepper Name the succesful frieght short line: (1) Name contains the complete name of an interurban. (2) All its route and all its trackage except for new sidings and a Y-connection were operated by that interurban. (3) Its iinitial CEO had been the CEO of the interurban. (4) Its initial motive power had been freight power of that interurban.
It's no longer in service but the Aurora Elgin and Fox River Electric met your specs until the early 1980s, when the Fox River Trolley Museum took over the trackage. Later power wa a 45-ton diesel.
The CV-NH (now CV-Amtrak) connecting track in New London was the regular route of the Montrealer after the 1987 ownership shift to the CV until the Montrealer was discontinued in 1995. The Vermonter continues to run on the Palmer sub from East Northfield to Palmer at least until next spring.
What I am referring to is definitely in service. Also note what I wrote about the initial boss of the freight operation, and the initial motive power.
Hints: The first motive power of the independent freight railroad was electric, freight power inhereted from the interurban. But much of the interurbam kept running for a year or so AFTER the frieght railroad became independent, and isolated from the interurban. The full name of the existing diesel freight railroad consists of the name of the interurban and the name of a fallen flag class I steam railroad. Two words (names) plus railroad.
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