Two of my favorite "Silver" names were from the California Zephyr pool: "Silver Penthouse", which was one of the dome-sleeper-obs; and "Silver Rapids", a 10-6 that was PRR's contribution to the CZ pool during the period of transcontinental sleeping car routes.
daveklepper In an attempt to be have some fun, some names NOT used for sleeping cars: Silver Pajamas, Silver Pillow, Silver Bathrobe, Silver Kamona, Silver blanket, Siklver Sheets, Silver Bedspread, Silver Bedposts
In an attempt to be have some fun, some names NOT used for sleeping cars: Silver Pajamas, Silver Pillow, Silver Bathrobe, Silver Kamona, Silver blanket, Siklver Sheets, Silver Bedspread, Silver Bedposts
I'll post a question later today but Dave's comment reminded me of AT&SF's "Blue" series cars that were used on the Chief and other just-below-the-Super Chief trains. They had 10 roomettes, 3 Double Bedrooms and 2 Compartments. One of the cars was "Blue Moon". I had a roomette on it on Amtrak's Southwest Limited in the mid 1970s.
Correct, and probably it is time for you to ask the next question, although you and anyone else can add additional silver names as they come into your minds.
DC transit's partly silver painted PCC was called the "Silver Sightseer" for which DCT charged a single fare ($.25 !)for a loop tour (featured in "Mr. Smith Goes to Washington" with an older car). It was a postwar PCC fitted with air conditioning. The front of the car was in DC Transit's aqua and cream with salmon stripes with a silver roof. A lower body stripe had "AIR CONDITIONED" in silver letters. Here's a link to a card site that has a good photo:
http://www.cardcow.com/150437/silver-sightseer-transportation-trains-railroad-trolleys/
Yes, do remember its function and name?
Are you referring to DC Transit's silver-painted PCC?
NP Eddie, mail to me is expensive, and you can email what you wish as JPG attachmentts to me at
daveklepper@yahoo.com
Lookiing over the list, I find that some names got used twice, like Silver Sky, but this one was first used by CB&Q for an obs on an articulated train, and then for the D&RGW's obs contribution to the CZ.
Railroads have specific words that are used frequently in passenger service: Railroad, Railway, Express, Limited, Special, Pacific, Alantic, Reserved, Air-conditioned, etc. Does it not seem as if Silver has made that grade?
In on the word silver as applied to a PCC streetcar. It was air-conditioned many years before any other PCC was air condidtioned, and its operation was ended, along with its streetcar system by politics, not by the owner's expressed wishes to continue streetcar operation.
Rob and Dave:
Wayner's "Car Names, Numbers, and Consists" has a list of all of the "Silver" names applied to the various stainless steel passenger train cars that were used on CBQ passenger trains. That listing also includes CZ cars owned by the DRGW, WP, and PRR.
The CBQ owned cars for the NCL and EB were painted for the parent road, with the exception on the CBQ slumbercoaches that were used in NCL service.
I can take photocopies of the CBQ pages and mail them to each of you.
Please call me at 763-234-9306 with your addresses
I'll start with the Burlington's equiment. It may take more than one installment. All info from Wayner's "Car Names, Numbers and Consists" plus some notes from other sources.
First "Silver" cars - 1936 Denver Zephyr (Chicago-Denver)
power unit 1800HP Silver King Silver Knight
power unit 1200HP Silver Queen Silver Princess
power RPO baggage Silver Courier Silver Herald
bagg dorm lge Silver Lining Silver Bar
64 st coach 16 st dinette Silver Beam Silver Bell
The next group were articulated in three car sets
64 st chair car Silver City Silver Spruce
38 seat chair car Silver City Silver Plume
40 seat dining car Silver Grill Silver Service
two unit articulated
12 sect Silver State Silver Skates
12 sect Silver Tip Silver Screen
12 sect Silver Arrow Silver Tone
3 CPt 1 DR 6 DBR Silver Sides Silver Threads
4 rmt, 4 chbrt, 1 DR, 1 Cpt, 4 DBR Silver Slipper Silver Moon
10 parlor seat buffet-obs Silver Flash Silver Streak
All of the cars above to C&S for Texas Zephyr service in 1956
General Pershing Zephyr 9908 St Louis Kansas City
power car/baggage Silver Charger
70 seat chair Silver Leaf
52 seat chair Silver Eagle
Dining Parlor Obs Silver Star
Silver Streak Zephyr 9909 Kansas City- Lincoln - Omaha
E5a locomotive Silver Bullet
Baggage Silver Light
Bagg/RPO Silver Sheen
52 st chair (2) Silver Gleam Silver Glow
Dining/Plr/Obs Silver Spirit
Prewar pool cars
Baggage Silver Chest Silver Express
Bagg-Mail Silver Mail
48 st diner Silver Pheasant Silver Inn Silver Spoon
Dining parlor obs Silver Hours Silver Fountain
52 seat chair Silver Chariot Silver Trail Silver Spring Silver Birch Silver Brook Silver Castle
Silver Cloud Silver Crest Silver Crown Silver Forest Silver Alchemy Silver Cascade
Silver Alchemy and Silver Castle received flat-pane domes in 1945 and 1949, Silver Alchemy
getting the name Silver Dome at that time.
Still to come: Texas Zephyr prewar cars, the CZ, the American Royal, Ak-Sar-Ben, postwar Twin Zephys, Kansas City Zephyr and the 1956 Denver Zephyr.
rcdye: Of course you answered the question and made the entry level. But I think the readers and certainl I would greatly appreciate a long answer with a paragraph for each type of CB&Q, DRG&W, and WP car and the actual names (which is really what I was loooking for). I remember that two of the CZ obs were Silver Planetareum (CB&Q) and Silver Sky (D&RGW). Silver Colt, Mustang. Pony, and Bronco were the four D&RGW domed coaches, diners Silver Service (CB&Q) and Silver Banquet (D&RGW), coaches converted from section sleepers, D&RGW Silver Aspen and Silver Pine. RC, tell us the actual names you know and those you can access without a research project.
Yes the three-body (not five, those were the Multis used on Canarsie-14th, four truck "Little Zepheer" for the BMT was often called the Silver Streak. Probably forgotton by everyone, the aluminum MTA-Boston Pullman Red-Line cars bought for the Quincy service were nicknamed Silver Birds. A hint about the streetcar, it was an air-conditioned PCC.
Great answers guys. Since Dave didn't limit this question to the US I'll add four more.
Silver Jubilee - Great Britain's L&NER - London-Newcastle
Silver City Comet - Australia's New South Ry - Orange -Broken Hill
Silver Fern and Silver Star - New Zealand Rys - Wellington-Auckland
Mark
One addition: SEPTA's suburban MU cars, both on PRR and RDG, were referred to as Silverliners.
For the CB&Q 177 cars (Budd), 21 locomotives plus 18 WP cars, 9 D&RGW cars and 1 PRR car assigned to the California Zephyr (Chicago-Oakland) all had "Silver" names. The Denver Zephyr's (Chicago-Denver) power cars were the first ones with "Silver" in the name (Silver King/Queen, Silver Prince/Princess) but all of the E5s were also named including the still runnable Silver Pilot. The General Pershing Zephyr got "Silver Charger" in the form of a shovel nose "AA" power car for its St. Louis/Kansas City service. Some of the CB&Q locomotive and cars were owned by C&S and FW&D for Texas Zephyr (Dallas-Denver) service. Some Silver cars also served on the Burlington-Rock Island "Sam Houston Zephyr" and the joint Burlington/Rock Island "Zephyr Rocket" (St. Louis/Twin Cities).
CB&Q's "Silver" cars had the following configurations, as well as variations. Some of the cars were articulated - notably the cars from the first DZ
Baggage
Baggage-Mail
50 seat coach
Diner
full parlor
diner/parlor/observation (both round and flat-end configurations)
46-seat dome coach
Pendulum Coach (Silver Pendulum form Pacific Railway Equipment in 1941)
Dome cafe lounge
Lunch counter diner
dome parlor observation
16 section sleeper (Chicago Oakland CZ summer only, 2 WP 1 D&RGW, rebuilt to coaches)
6 section 6 Rmt 4 DBR sleeper (Chicago KC/St Joseph and Chicago St P/Minn)
10 Rmt 6 DBR sleeper (PRR's "Silver Rapids" was this type)
6 DBR 5 CPT sleeper
4-4-1-4 sleeper (one was Silver Slipper, the catalyst for the Pullman breakup)
3 DBR 1 DR dome lounge observation
24 sgl 8 dbl Slumbercoach
The name "Silver Dome" was given to the former coach "Silver Alchemy" when its dome was installed.
Silver Streak Zephyr (9909) Kansas City-Omaha-Lincoln
Power-baggage, coach, dinette, coach, parlor obs
Other "Silver" trains
SAL Silver Meteor(New York/Miami)
SAL Silver Star (New York Miami/St. Petersburg)
SAL Siver Comet (New York, Norfolk to Atlanta and Birmingham
Other "Silver" cars operated by Pullman (1950)
(pool) Silver Star Plan 2410H 12-1
NYC Silver Lake plan 4124 6DBR/Lounge
UP Silver Dollar plan 4053 3DBr/1DR/LoungeObs
(pool) Silver Brook plan 3950F 3DBr/2Cpt Lounge Obs
Silver Palace cars before 1900
CNS&M silverliners (18 cars) including one diner-lounge and one combine Chicago-Waukegan-Milwaukee
That gets me above 25. I can't come up with the RT or Streetcar ones but I'm inclined to think the 5-unit BMT articulated we covered on the forum a while ago might be the RT unit you're thinking of.
Re: IC/CSS&SB 900s - they were retired after the 700s (ex-NYC R2s) arrived.
And two of my answers were definitely correct, the street trackage and carrying adapter couplers. Were any of the IC-CSS&SB locos saved? Didn't one go to Iowa Terminal or to a musuem operation?
My question: Give all examples of the word "Silver" used in public accomodation scheduled passenger service, including train names, car names, even meals. But be specific. Train names must be associated with the railroads involved and end-points. Cars: interior configuration, railroads, assigned trains with end points, builders, etc. The one with the most correct answers wins. Minimum entry 25. I don't have all the answers myself, but there must be over 100. One rapid transit example gets an extra point and counts as two. Ditto one streetcar.
The commonality of Mike and Ike and South Shore 900-903 can be found in Iron and Steel Products, a scrap dealer located in Hegewisch until it folded in the early 1960's. Mike and Ike were scrapped there and South Shore 900-903 were sold by IC to that dealer, who then resold them to South Shore.
I'll give the next question to daveklepper, who put a lot of effort into this question.
And all these locomotives carried on board adapter couplers to mate their standard MCB Janny railroad couplers to the non-standard couplers used on the commuter lines mu' cars. (This was not needed for the MP54's, for the Juniatta double-deckers, or the immediate postwar Pullman-Standard cars. The need started with the M1's. But the IC mu's had Tomlinson couplers from the start. Possibly the adapters were not needed on the South Shore.)
And at one time or another, did all these locos have an orange paint job?
One thing is for sure, they all handled freight cars over street trackage. The CSS&SB still has such in Michigan City, and had a lot more when those electric "motors" ran. Ike and Mike undoubtadly were used on the Bushwick branch of the LIRR, which served several industries near the Bklyn-Queens boarder, but in Brooklyn, that were reached by street trackage.
Were Mike and Ike tested on the South Shore?
Since the IC-CSS&SB units were electric and the two LIRR units diesel, we cannot find much commonality in design, unless all had Westinghouse electric motors, perhaps of a specific HP, and all were of a common weight for approximately the same TE. Regarding location, LIRR regular local service route to Babylon is considered by some a "South Shore" line, so "South Shore" may be common, or is there a Hobart Yard or a Fresh Pond Yard or Jc. along the IC or the CSS&SB? Or where they all the first of series production of locomotives that were then sold to other railroads as well? Were they capable of battery operation, off-wire for the electrics and diesel shut down for the LIRR units?
For freight only service instead of for the ruling passenger services on the two lines.
RIDEWITHMEHENRY is the name for our almost monthly day of riding trains and transit in either the NYCity or Philadelphia areas including all commuter lines, Amtrak, subways, light rail and trolleys, bus and ferries when warranted. No fees, just let us know you want to join the ride and pay your fares. Ask to be on our email list or find us on FB as RIDEWITHMEHENRY (all caps) to get descriptions of each outing.
Mike and Ike were diesel-electrics built specifically for LIRR. They were not built for smoke abatement since they did not operate in Manhattan. The common thread for all of these locomotives runs through my original neighborhood (consider my nom de plume and avatar).
Explanaition, the IC had them built for smoke-abaitment purposes . They went to the CSS&SB when diesel switchers came to the IC. All these run on DC power, but the LIRR is 600V and the IC (& CSS&SB) 1500V. Also, were not the LIRR units originally New York Central T-1's (Harmon - GCT) relocated to the LIRR for East River and Hudson River tunnel wire maintenance? Replacing 1910 DD1'? So all these units were relocated from their original assignments. I wonder if any were saved.
CSSHEGEWISCH What do LIRR 403A/403B (Mike & Ike) and CSS&SB (ex-IC) 900-903 have in common?
What do LIRR 403A/403B (Mike & Ike) and CSS&SB (ex-IC) 900-903 have in common?
They're all Baldwin-Westinghouse, built to comply with smoke abatement ordinances. 900-903 were the first B-W class E electrics.
Box cab diesels on electric railroad.
Since I'm up for the next question, we'll go with this teaser:
Rob:
Regarding the X-CGW baggage cars, they may have been renumbered to a MofW series (with or without painting) and used as tool cars.
About 10 years ago, I saw four or five BN ownership company service cars in my hometown of Anoka, MN. They were being as tool cars for a track gang. One of those was an X-GN 2600 series express box car.
If those former baggage cars were used in company service, the steam lines may or may not have been removed, but the air brake system would have been converted to freight settings.
Ed Burns
As far as I know the CGW ex-MILW coaches were scrapped after the end of passenger service. The GN ex-CGW cars were not listed by the time of the BN merger so I'm pretty sure they were retired after the mail contracts ended in 1967. The pictures I've found had "storage mail" painted between the doors.
There's an HO brass version of GN 277-279 listed for the "Empire Builder", but I'd guess the most exalted train they were actually used on was the "Western Star". Between 1964 and the end of most mail service the Milwaukee carried GN storage mail to and from Chicago so these cars may have operated on the Milwaukee as well.
Wayner's "Car Names, Numbers, and Consists (page 133) lists CGW coaches 200 and 201 that were purchased for the Minneapolis/Omaha passenger train. The Milwaukee numbers were 4410 and 4416 respectively. I suspect that the CGW combines were in bad shape and were condemned. The CGW purchased three light baggage cars in 1946 from Pullman, numbers 80, 81, and 82. Page 234 of the above book lists them as purchased by the GN in 1965 and renumbered to 277-279.
Dublin's "More Classic Trains", page 355, shows pictures of one of the baggage cars and coach 200.
Does anyone know the disposition of the CGW coaches or the GN baggage cars?
763-234-9306
CSSHEGEWISCH I will say that two coaches were sold to CGW for service on its Minneapolis-Omaha local.
I will say that two coaches were sold to CGW for service on its Minneapolis-Omaha local.
And you would be right. Built for the 1935 version of the Hiawatha, they were the only lightweight passenger carrying cars the CGW owned, unless you count the George M. Pullman, the experimental aluminum 3-1-1 observation car buit by Pullman in 1933, which ended up in CGW ownership after 1952, but may not have been used by CGW in revenue service. CGW did own a pair of lightweight baggage/express cars later sold to Great Northern.
Your question.
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