Railroaders ideas to improve crossing safety

[Anonymous]

Oh man Ed, that story is rich! Thanks for the laugh.

[edblysard]

Try union switch and signal, they make the wayside signals and the crossing gates used here at the port. And you just made me think of a magazine I read once, its a trade magazine called railway age, it was full of railroad electronics and such...
Ed

[edblysard]

If you ever meet a small town Texas cop, the story becomes more belivable...
Ed

[edblysard]

Do you think highway K rails would stand up? I watched a highway crew replace one, it took a good sized crane to move the thing. And it looks to be about the right size, with the number of the things used now days, their cost ought to be relatively cheap? And I have seen kids stopped at the crossing throwing rocks at the are lights to break them, out of boredom, I guess. Nothing better to do saterday night except tear things up...
Ed

[Anonymous]

I was a volunteer fireman in NC for about 10 yrs and one accident that stands out the most was a train vs truck. To make a long and rathering sickening story short, I was looking for the body of a female when I caught a sparkle from my flashlight. I approached it and radioed that I thought I had found the girl, when in fact all I had found was her left hand and a poriton of her arm. Later it was determined that her B.A.C. was .18, more than double the then legal amount. I hope her kid ended up with a good family.

In this area, if you get hit by a train, your just a frigging idiot.
Bud

[Anonymous]

Sounds like the Schertz TX police are about as competent as the Cookville TN cops.

[Anonymous]

Oh I don't doubt it! We've got some Oregon cops that might pull something along those lines too, tho your story by far ranks as one of the more unusual examples.

[Anonymous]

This seems to be a reverberating statement; Size does matter!! We can stop our cars-you can not stop a train....Isn't that a comercial ad (Nothing stops a trane) yet people keep ignoring the facts!!
Icemanmike-Milwaukee

[wabash1]

yes there is batteries to operate the signals after a power outage it is all run on dc current . they use bulbs at a voltage of 15-18 volts dc( at least here on the ns.) and depending on how long the outage is ive seen these systems last 1 week of normal traffic on batteries.

[Anonymous]

The ongoing theme here is that no matter how much we try to inform, warn, and educate the public, every time someone tries to beat a train, it's the railroad's fault when a collision occurs. A crying shame that personal responsibility has left our society. If someone dies at a grade crossing, perhaps we should console the train crew and not "victimize" the idiot who tried to beat the train to start with. A few minutes of your time is certainly not worth losing your life.

[edblysard]

Hi emory,
What it boils down to is that we seem to have come down to 2 concepts here, 1: educate the public, kids especialy, on the danger of trying to beat a train or driving around down gates, or 2: physicaly preventing someone from entering a crossing when a train is anywhere near. It seems as if we have to protect people from their own foolishness. What we need are your ideas on both concepts. Any ideas?
Ed

[Anonymous]

Hey people! If we are trying to inform the public then why don't we? All these sue happy people have a crapload of stuff that they try to push off on us...So why dont we do the same?
Im working on my first webpage. For links so far I have my favorite music channel, beretta.net (My CAR that carefully crosses the tracks :) ), and trains.com. I plan on trying to get OLS as a link on my page..as Im still learning how to put one together its just a matter of time! I figure with the cross traffic of planes, trains, automobiles and music. Its just a mater of when some one will be curious enough just to look. REMBER if they just glance..even for a second or two, you planted a seed. This seed will make people think (some times in the back of the mind) about the crossings. Hey it's the least that we can do for all sides of the track!!
I hope some of you have/are planning, or at least considered on doing the same!
Icemanmike-Milwaukee

[edblysard]

Well Duh!
All us bright guys, and the thought never occured to us....
So now I have to get my wife to show me how to do a web page, she says I am computer illiterate, and shes right. Has anybody found a lost of state reps e-mail addresses? Add that to your page so others can write them. Make public pest out of ourselves, they may just listen..good idea Iceman..
Stay Frosty
Ed
by the way, you pronounce my last name Blizzard, like the snowstorm...kinda funny, huh.

[wabash1]

I got ya beat ed. i haft to show my wife how to do all the computor stuff... right after i go to a friends house and have him show me how its done.

[edblysard]

Yeah, I guess I shoud have taken typing/computer repair in H/S instead of wood shop and metal shop. Nobody wants wood cabinets hand made any more, and you need two college degrees just to figure out how to tune up your car nowadays. My wife has a associate in computer languages, another one in business science,(what the heck is that, anyway?), and she just gave up on me, told me when I break it, just leave her a note telling her what the last thing I did was. So much depends on this silly machine now, I couldnt get rid of her now if I wanted to, who would fix this darn thing for me? But it does sit on a really gorgeous golden oak early American colonial desk, finished with four coats of PPG's DCA 468 lacquer. And she still cant cook as good as I do...
Stay Frosty
Ed

[Anonymous]

Hi Ed,
Recently, a major effort has been announced here by the local police agencies to crackdown on red light runners and speeders--I guess I should call their pulic affairs depts. to see if they can add grade crossings to the list. The police effort has gotten a lot of publicity and if they mention grade crossings it might get people to think. Also, stiffening the penalties for going around gates might help to deter some--especially after they get fined. Thanks, and keep up the good work Ed. emory

[edblysard]

Sounds great, here the fines are steep, you may check with your local PD, throw a couple of local tv new cameras in, and you can bet their pr dept you would jump on it...
Stay frosty
Ed

[Anonymous]

As a point of interest, Operation Lifesaver has changed a few of the cliches normally associated with grade crossings. One is from "Trains can't stop, you can", to "Trains can't stop quickly". A number of news reports and news documentaries gave the impression that trains don't stop at all. Of course, there's nothing more absurd. Another is from "Stop, Look and Listen" to "Look, Listen and Live". According to OL literature, someone who had just been to an OL presentation came upon a siding that crossed a main street. The driver did just what they had just heard and was rear-ended by the following vehicle. The incident resulted in civil litigation which prompted OL to change the wording. Just when you thought you've heard everything.....
Regards and have a safe day. gdc

[edblysard]

Makes you wonder how "common" common sense is. Who would have though that a person would sue, and win, a company for selling coffee that was "too" hot..
Oh well,
Ed

[Anonymous]

For some odd reason Im not too suprised to hear that someone got rearended!
Icemanmike-Milwaukee

[Anonymous]

Hey Ed, hope all is going well down in TX. Did you know the company knew that the coffee was dangerously hot, yet in an effort to maximize 'profit' it was kept that hot. Did you know that as a result of this spilled coffee the person suffered thousands of dollars in medical bills. Did you know that they had hundreds of smaller incidents with people getting burnt and continued to keep it at that excessive temp. I didn't either. Its a perfect case of being single sided until you know the complete story. Please read this letter that follows. It is from someone who is also concerned about rail safety and wrote to the Senator for Texas.

The following is a letter sent to Senator Kay Bailey Hutchison

Greetings,

Still having deep roots in Texas , I write again. I continue to learn in my quest to become an effective rail safety advocate.

I know you have strong ties to the rail indsutry, and Operation Lifesaver. I wonder if you are aware of how slanted the message they present , really is? I hope not, and that you are willing to learn.

Operation Lifesaver gets their info from the railroads and FRA. FRA takes what the industry hands them. It is not a clear and full picture. I know that a grade rail crossings accident history , has to do with it's working it's way up a priority list for 'active protective devices'. When an accident does not show up on a crossing's accident history it's rather like a batter getting a free strike.

The crossing where my daughter was hit and killed, for even up to 4 years later; it's history showed NO accidents. There have been numerous accidents there. I had seen the debris from ours and one other 2 years before. Locals have told me of others. Only after contacting Tom Woll at FRA and bringing this to his attention , were even those 2 added to the history.

The thing that kept me thinking that LOOK , LISTEN and LIVE was enough to keep us safe, was we did also employ the STOP that OLI used to preach. This is a rural crossing, the county road T's into Hwy 287. At the time of the first wreck I saw the remains of , visability at the crossing was actually severly restricted, but as the BN never did any thing to change the apperance of the crossing, we all thought, 'the man hit just tried to beat the train'. After Jen was hit, I knew better, because of my history with friends being killed at grade rail crossings we were far more cautious than the average . It finally became apparent , we could not see far enough ( inadequate sight triangle ) to allow for the speed the trains going through the crossing. Only after we filed a wrongful death suit, did the BNSF come out and clean out the right of way , to allow a better opportunity to see the train coming. Texas laws speak of keeping right of ways cleared, mentioning of vegetation up to trees of 6 inches in diamater. They felled trees of more than a foot in diameter. Along with those wild plum trees that had grown up into the ballast.

Senator Hutchison, I know this is rather long, but I hope that something in here I relay to you gets your attention. The rail industry has pulled the wool over your eyes. The carnage continues because they are ,and have for decades behaved in a truely unresponsible manner. The numbers for grade rail crossing deaths are rising again, and that is with at least BNSF aggressively closing crossings. Train traffic is up and they refuse to maintain the clear line of sight necessary for safe passage over the danger area. The devices they use to activate flashing light, bells and gates fail. CFR's demand that FAILSAFE devices be used,and it is not being done.

It is just most of America does not understand the workings of the devices,and accept the term the rail industry has coined, mal-functioning.

I just went to the site of a crossing accident, resulting in the death of a vibrant young mother. Restricted visability, the tracks curve not far from the crossing, and beyond the curve , tracks nor train is visable. Track speed is 70 mph. Senator Hutchison, the school bus uses that crossing. And the local coverage of the accident lays all the blame for the accident at the drivers feet. Leaving all the local folks using that crossing believing that long as they drive in a prudent manner and look and listen, they will be safe. Actually they are playing Russian Roulette. Abet , unawares.

It has taken me years to acquire the ability to communicate with others on this subject , without rancor, and hopefully bring understanding of the underlying problem. Legislation must bring the rail industry to responsible corporate behavior. I pray you will be a leader in this quest.

[Anonymous]

Thanks Ed
I'll take a look there

[Anonymous]

So the general concensus is that everyone is trying to beat a train. Pretty bold statement. Your right in part about personal responsibility, the railroad corporation being looked upon in the judicial system as a person takes absolutely no responsibility for any accident and the feds support this. Snow should fit in well at the Treasury:
CSX Executive’s Involvement in Questionable Corporate Practices Raises Serious Doubts About His Suitability for Cabinet Post

WASHINGTON, D.C. – Concerned about the prospect of a corporate executive involved in questionable business practices joining the Bush Cabinet, Public Citizen today filed records requests to obtain information about loans, stock sales, safety compliance and other matters involving John W. Snow, the Treasury Secretary nominee who for years headed CSX Corp.

The requests, filed with the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) and the Federal Railroad Administration (FRA), are an attempt to learn more about Snow’s policies as chairman and chief executive officer of CSX.

"As head of CSX, Mr. Snow apparently was involved in some of the same questionable practices that have come under scrutiny recently and even been outlawed by Congress," said Joan Claybrook, Public Citizen president. "We question whether a top corporate executive who abused his position by benefiting from insider deals will be a good public servant. We are filing this request so that before Congress votes on Mr. Snow, the public record can be clear and complete as to his ethical and safety performance as CEO of a major transportation company."

In the request to the SEC, filed under the Freedom of Information Act, Public Citizen seeks all records concerning loans from CSX to Snow and the forgiveness of those loans, sales of CSX stock by Snow, any SEC investigation into CSX matters, and all transactions between CSX and members of the company’s compensation committee. From the FRA, Public Citizen seeks all records concerning Snow’s role as a CSX executive, Snow’s involvement with the company’s lack of compliance with federal track safety standards, any enforcement actions against CSX since 1991, and Snow’s role in the negotiation and implementation of an April 2000 Safety Compliance Agreement between the company and the FRA, which came about after an FRA review of CSX tracks uncovered a number of safety problems.

Snow has been a beneficiary of many of the questionable corporate practices that came to light after the Enron scandal, according to news reports. CSX loaned Snow $24.5 million to purchase company stock valued at $32.3 million, but after the stock price dropped, the company forgave the loan. During his tenure, Snow received more than $50 million in compensation over 12 years even though profits fell and the stock didn’t do as well as the average U.S. company. Last year, he made $10.1 million in cash and stock grants and received stock options valued at $8 million. According to a Corporate Library survey, Snow is the third highest–paid chief executive among 37 transportation company CEOs.

Further, according to media reports, Snow sold 120,000 shares of CSX stock this year, less than a month before the company announced that its third-quarter outlook was not as rosy as it had first predicted. The stock price dropped, but Snow dumped the stock just in time to avoid losing approximately $750,000.

Additionally, Snow served on five other corporate boards, including NationsBank, where he helped set compensation for one of CSX’s outside directors.

"It would appear that Mr. Snow misused his position as CEO to gain benefits available to few others," Claybrook said. "How many CSX workers were able to obtain multimillion-dollar loans for stock purchases and have the loans forgiven?"

[Anonymous]

McFacts abut the McDonalds Coffee Lawsuit

Everyone knows what you're talking about when you mention "the McDonald's lawsuit." Even though this case was decided in August of 1994, for many Americans it continues to represent the "problem" with our civil justice system.

The business community and insurance industry have done much to perpetuate this case. They don't want us to forget it. They know it helps them convince politicians that "tort reform" and other restrictions on juries is needed. And worse, they know it poisons the minds of citizens who sit on juries.

Unfortunately, not all the facts have been communicated - facts that put the case and the monetary award to the 81-year old plaintiff in a significantly different light.

According to the Wall Street journal, McDonald's callousness was the issue and even jurors who thought the case was just a tempest in a coffee pot were overwhelmed by the evidence against the Corporation.

The facts of the case, which caused a jury of six men and six women to find McDonald's coffee was unreasonably dangerous and had caused enough human misery and suffering that no one should be made to suffer exposure to such excessively hot coffee again, will shock and amaze you:

McFact No. 1: For years, McDonald's had known they had a problem with the way they make their coffee - that their coffee was served much hotter (at least 20 degrees more so) than at other restaurants.

McFact No. 2: McDonald's knew its coffee sometimes caused serious injuries - more than 700 incidents of scalding coffee burns in the past decade have been settled by the Corporation - and yet they never so much as consulted a burn expert regarding the issue.

McFact No. 3: The woman involved in this infamous case suffered very serious injuries - third degree burns on her groin, thighs and buttocks that required skin grafts and a seven-day hospital stay.

McFact No. 4: The woman, an 81-year old former department store clerk who had never before filed suit against anyone, said she wouldn't have brought the lawsuit against McDonald's had the Corporation not dismissed her request for compensation for medical bills.

McFact No. 5: A McDonald's quality assurance manager testified in the case that the Corporation was aware of the risk of serving dangerously hot coffee and had no plans to either turn down the heat or to post warning about the possibility of severe burns, even though most customers wouldn't think it was possible.

McFact No. 6: After careful deliberation, the jury found McDonald's was liable because the facts were overwhelmingly against the company. When it came to the punitive damages, the jury found that McDonald's had engaged in willful, reckless, malicious, or wanton conduct, and rendered a punitive damage award of 2.7 million dollars. (The equivalent of just two days of coffee sales, McDonalds Corporation generates revenues in excess of 1.3 million dollars daily from the sale of its coffee, selling 1 billion cups each year.)

McFact No. 7: On appeal, a judge lowered the award to $480,000, a fact not widely publicized in the media.

McFact No. 8: A report in Liability Week, September 29, 1997, indicated that Kathleen Gilliam, 73, suffered first degree burns when a cup of coffee spilled onto her lap. Reports also indicate that McDonald's consistently keeps its coffee at 185 degrees, still approximately 20 degrees hotter than at other restaurants. Third degree burns occur at this temperature in just two to seven seconds, requiring skin grafting, debridement and whirlpool treatments that cost tens of thousands of dollars and result in permanent disfigurement, extreme pain and disability to the victims for many months, and in some cases, years.

The most important message this case has for you, the consumer, is to be aware of the potential danger posed by your early morning pick-me-up. Take extra care to make sure children do not come into contact with scalding liquid, and always look to the facts before rendering your decision about any publicized case.

[wabash1]

Mike here is something you are not aware of and most if not all engineers operate this way. there is no way i will put my train in emergency til i hit you. i make no throttle aadjustments to change anything i keep running like you wasnt there. why you might ask? simple with all the close calls we have we be in emergency all the time so we keep on moving . like nothing was there. it was hard at first but now it is second nature.

[Anonymous]

Ladies and Gentlmen, I am a bit confused, I thought the topic we were discussing was how to improve the safty of railway crossing's. Please I do not wi***o anger anyone, I would like very much to get back on that suject. Is there a Goverment department in charge of railroad safty? What, if any roll, does the Surface Transportation Board play in crossing safty?
TIM A

[edblysard]

Nor, really Tim, the surf board regulates the industry in that it rules on mergers, both in rail and air, sorta like the old ICC. It also rules on fair trade, ect. The FRA is mandated to deal with all issues of safty on railroads. It draws up rules and recommendations, and can issue citations and levee fines against both railroads as a company, the officers of railroads, and the operational employees, guys like me. The FRA requires things like a random, but mandatory drug testing program. Here at the Port, they require each of our officers to perform 100 safety test per month, in three catagories. Administration, raido rules, and operations. That means at least 3 times a month. I get tested on if I have my paperwork complete and correct, I use my radio correctly, with all the proper over and outs, job ID and such, and if I follow all the safety rules involved in operations. The FRA helps set guidlines for crossing devices also.
Thanks Tim, hope everyone remember what this post is about too!
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[Anonymous]

Had to throw in the McDonald tidbit because of the comments about the lawsuit. I thought the same until the complete story was told. Which is what corporate America does not want. Here is a portion of an email that I recieved:

Did I ever tell you what the first CSXT claims man said to me when I rang him... he told me; Mrs. O... we can kill as many as we want to.. that was a private crossing.

This I'm sure is not every railroaders attitude but seems to be a majority.
Mike

[Anonymous]

Maybe some drunk driver will take the same attitude with you or your family sometime when your out on the road and waiver for a millisecond or walking down the sidewalk and stumble.
My grandfather was a train engineer back when men were really men, and he would have killed himself to avoid killing anyone else, in his train, in is car, on his tractor or at any other time. Even during WW2 he was a corpsman, preserving the most valuable asset we can ever possess.....life.
I have been to train wrecks where body parts were strewn to the extent that they weren't even all recoverable. I would hate to think that some of them could have been prevented by whatever means and weren't. It would take a real low life sob to have that attitude, regardless of which end it was on.

[Anonymous]

On EVERY account I ever had with local rr it was just the opposite! The employees did not want to see myself or anyone else hurt...God forbid killed. Have you ever heard of the saying 'NOT ON MY SHIFT'? This is something I've heard in saftey rings and police deparments MANY times...Why because who wants to be the one who has to knock on your door and give your family the bad news, well..no one here thats for shure!
Lets not forget that most of us are railfans or work the rails. We all had our fair share of near misses and some (as sad as it is)even stared death straight in its face. No one my friend would do this type of thing intentionaly. If there is a dangerous X-ing in your area then contact your local government. If I had to deal with one I know I would, but there is none (localy) that has ever made me nervious enough to do so. It's up to the locals to make it the governments problem, because on man/woman cannot do so by themself! Again Im NOT pointing fingers but saftey is on all sides of the track. This is why OLS was made. Also I noticed that on www.oli.org that they have a list of officials to contact. That shows that there is a government attachment to this delemia. Did any one else put ols on there web pages? I did, will anyone click on the link...I dont know but aleast they have the option! Keep your bodys warm and your heads cool!!
Icemanmike-Milwaukee
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