Quentin
Originally posted by CSXrules4eva [ Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Sunday, April 17, 2005 7:53 AM While this is also OFF TOPIC what is more amazing about the Jets stadium deal is the owner is the heir to the Johnson & Johnson fortune & is a billionaire several times over! [:o)][:)][:p] Originally posted by emmaandy [ Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Sunday, April 17, 2005 7:55 AM Inflation was a great problem when the spike in gasoline came in the 70s [:(][:(] Originally posted by Modelcar Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Sunday, April 17, 2005 9:02 AM ...Yes interest rates skyrocketed to the range of 12 to 15%....CD's were really booming but it was not good for our well being. And the Crude price spike in the mid 70's was part of the problem that ignited inflation..... Quentin Reply DSchmitt Member sinceSeptember 2003 From: California - moved to North Carolina 2018 4,422 posts Posted by DSchmitt on Sunday, April 17, 2005 4:21 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by goat uzurpator- The Europeans use a different scale of octane and the numbers don't mean the same as in USA, it is very confusing realy and I don't much more about it. Last time I was there you could still get "plum" and "sans plum", that is leaded or no leaded. But again apparently it is not real lead, but a lead substitute for older cars. But I don't know much more about it. I found the following: Gasoline - Octane Facts and Myths (Minnesota Dept of Commerce) http://www.state.mn.us/mn/externalDocs/Commerce/Gasoline_Octane_Facts_102902052227_OctaneFacts.pdf I found the following about the octane rating in Europe http://www.ozebook.com/compendium/suzi/octane.pdf Both say that there are two methods of determining the octane rating of gasoline: 1) the "motor method" 2) the "reasearch method" The "research method" results in a higher number than the "motor method". The octane number used in the US is an average of the results of the two methods. In Europe they use the "reasearch method" number. I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it. I don't have a leg to stand on. Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Monday, April 18, 2005 11:37 AM ok so lots of good ideas here but thats all they are ideas. Sorry spbed but I'll have to bash you GASOHOL idea right away. Yes it was made from a mixture of corn ethonal and gasoline. In fact it still is most aff the gas you buy in the US is 10 to 15% ethonal still. Makes gas cheaper but has some drawbacks one gallon os ethonal take about one acre of corn so with the amount of it that we would need would nessecitate making almost all of the US into a giant cornfield (as if Wisconsin doesn't have enough already). Also ethonal burns hotter than gasonline since it is a form of alcohol so the motor oil, valves, pistons, o-rings, and exahust manafolds on your car would have to be replaced. So unless your willing to convince everyone to spend several thousand dollars to have there otherwise perfectly good engine rebuilt or replaced ethonal is not a viable solution to the situation. However if the price of gas got high enough say around $15 a gallon then a synthetic gas produced from highly refined ethonal and several other plant by-products this will require more advanced refining plants however so convince the oil companies of that, and would also use several acres of crops for each gallon. So unless a car that runs on salt water is created or anyother good ideas come up gas is the most economical fuel for now. Plus over the past 50 years the price of gas has only gone up at slightly half the rate of inflation while not a guarantee of the future of gas prices it can be used as a rathe acurate estimate of future prices. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply rvos1979 Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Burlington, WI 1,418 posts Posted by rvos1979 on Monday, April 18, 2005 1:24 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by sd452 ok so lots of good ideas here but thats all they are ideas. Sorry spbed but I'll have to bash you GASOHOL idea right away. Yes it was made from a mixture of corn ethonal and gasoline. In fact it still is most aff the gas you buy in the US is 10 to 15% ethonal still. Makes gas cheaper but has some drawbacks one gallon os ethonal take about one acre of corn so with the amount of it that we would need would nessecitate making almost all of the US into a giant cornfield (as if Wisconsin doesn't have enough already). Also ethonal burns hotter than gasonline since it is a form of alcohol so the motor oil, valves, pistons, o-rings, and exahust manafolds on your car would have to be replaced. So unless your willing to convince everyone to spend several thousand dollars to have there otherwise perfectly good engine rebuilt or replaced ethonal is not a viable solution to the situation. However if the price of gas got high enough say around $15 a gallon then a synthetic gas produced from highly refined ethonal and several other plant by-products this will require more advanced refining plants however so convince the oil companies of that, and would also use several acres of crops for each gallon. So unless a car that runs on salt water is created or anyother good ideas come up gas is the most economical fuel for now. Plus over the past 50 years the price of gas has only gone up at slightly half the rate of inflation while not a guarantee of the future of gas prices it can be used as a rathe acurate estimate of future prices. Quick correction: E-85 (85% ethanol) will operate today's (and most of yesterday's) engines just fine, the fuel system just has to have all rubber parts changed to steel or other materials that will not break down in the alcohol. If you want to get MAX POWER out of an engine burning E-85, the compression ratio will need to be raised, or the boost can be cranked up for you turbo or blower guys (and gals). Yes, the engine will run slightly hotter, but as long as the cooling system is in good shape, there should be no problems. According to www.badgerstateethanol.com, their plant was designed to take 14.8 million bushels of corn and produce 40 million gallons of ethanol. By my quick figures, that's about 2.7 bushels of corn per gallon of ethanol. Also, based on an average of 200 bu/acre, you're looking at about 74,000 acres of corn for ethanol. That's about 116 square miles. Of course, this will vary with corn yields. Randy Randy Vos "Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings "May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Monday, April 18, 2005 2:45 PM Thank you for the corrections rvos. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply rvos1979 Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Burlington, WI 1,418 posts Posted by rvos1979 on Monday, April 18, 2005 3:56 PM unfortunately, I may have to correct myself. According to www.e85fuel.com, one bushel of corn can produce 2.7 gallons of ethanol. apparently, even the websites have different views. you decide who is right. Randy Randy Vos "Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings "May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Monday, April 18, 2005 8:17 PM Thats the internet though you really have to double check the information. As I should have done as most of my statistics for producing ethanol are from 1981 so a little out of date, sorry. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 12:05 AM Corn is as cheap as it gets. This stuff is so overproduced it is ridiculous. All soft drinks are corn syrup based. Fructose = corn. It is unavoidable in sweetened packaged foods. Dispite this there are very few varieties left being farmed in the US what with mono-crop cultivation and cross pollination of GM corn. Pity the poor farmer who unknowingly has some Round-up ready varity blow in. Monsanto sues at the drop of a hat. Faster than a record exec at a Napster party. Sure drive some of this overproduction to another use. Save some farms, they need the money. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 1:26 AM Some of the folks indicate the high cost of hi test (Premium gas) can only be afforded by the rich. That aint so. I feed my olds with the V6 supercharger 93 octane all the time. I get about 400 miles out of it for about 16 gallons of gas give or take a gallon. That is good for about a week's run covering everything. The best thing I can say about that is on lower octane gas it becomes really reluctant and lethargic on the throttle in cut- throat traffic. Reply Edit edbenton Member sinceSeptember 2002 From: Back home on the Chi to KC racetrack 2,011 posts Posted by edbenton on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 8:39 AM Actually all Ford Tauraus and Rangers from 1995 on and Chrysler minivans from 1994 on all already set up to burn E-85. The manufacturs did that to get a huge tax break and the engine does not even know the difference. If E-85 were made the standard fuel for cars our oil consumption would drop roughly 40% and crop prices would go up 20% meaning more money for farmers. Also ethanol can be made from any grain all ethanol is is grain alcohal. Another way to lower prices on oil is biodiesel burns just like regular diesel and costs right about the same blended 50/50 with regular diesel would cut oil consumption right around 10% again. That means we would be free of OPEC's price fixing to maike them even richer. Always at war with those that think OTR trucking is EASY. Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 9:11 AM Just paid $231.9 for 87 octane. Down $0.02 from last week Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 9:15 AM Well I do not know the spread between 87 & 93. But whatever it is in 10/03 87 was $1.50 a gallon now today $2.31. So using your 16 gallons you can figure how much more you now pay then Oct 03 [:(] Originally posted by HighIron2003ar Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:18 PM The Key to what you said in your post HighIron is that you have a supercharger. Most vehicles with a supercharger or turbocharger run better on higher octane gasoline. But for someone like me with an Olds Alero with a regular 3.4 V6 the difference in gas mileage and preformance between 93 octane and 87 octane is not worth the price difference. Especially since here 87 octane droped 5 cents a gallon this week and 93 octane didn't drop at all. And no I don't belive that you have to be rich to afford hi test gas you just have to have a car that benifits from it. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:21 PM Can you get rid of a "supercharger'? [:o)][:D][:p] Originally posted by sd452 Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:27 PM You can get rid of a supercharger spbed but if I had one on my car I would leave it on. Any car that comes from the factory with a supercharger is designed to have one and run best with one. So some Tinkering with the engine to get it to run at its best after removing the supercharger is nessesary. If it is an aftermarket supercharger though then most likely the headers where also changed and all that would be nessasary is puting factory headers back on and a tune up. But It depends on how you personaly feel about it. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 4:06 PM ....I doubt very much if the Alero 3.4L V6 would run any better on 93 octane as opposed to the reg. 87 octane stuff....This engine is designed and set up to run on 87 oct. and probably does fine on it... Quentin Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 4:42 PM It doesn't run any better thats what i was trying to say. Sorry for any confusion. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply passengerfan Member sinceMarch 2004 From: Central Valley California 2,841 posts Posted by passengerfan on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 6:54 PM JUst finished a trip to Lost Wages (Las Vegas) and paid 2,78 9/10 per gallon of 87 Octane at Mojave. Cost fifty bucks each way just for gas. Drove over on Monday so the hotel rooms are cheaper, Well surprise surprise three conventions in town this week Motel 6 rooms $93.75 per night. and those were the only rooms available in the city. Same old story motels just like the oil companies prices are by supply and demand. Guess at these gasoline prices people won't be travelling to Vegas as often. Reply rvos1979 Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Burlington, WI 1,418 posts Posted by rvos1979 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 7:35 PM Filled up in Mazomanie, WI today, price for #2 diesel was 2.38 a gallon, dropped 60 bucks into my tank. Good thing I have a truck that gets 21.5 miles to the gallon. Randy Randy Vos "Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings "May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Thursday, April 21, 2005 4:19 PM ...In our local...prices today varied from 2.10 to 2.26.... Quentin Reply « First«78910111213 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub
Originally posted by emmaandy [ Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Sunday, April 17, 2005 7:55 AM Inflation was a great problem when the spike in gasoline came in the 70s [:(][:(] Originally posted by Modelcar Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Sunday, April 17, 2005 9:02 AM ...Yes interest rates skyrocketed to the range of 12 to 15%....CD's were really booming but it was not good for our well being. And the Crude price spike in the mid 70's was part of the problem that ignited inflation..... Quentin Reply DSchmitt Member sinceSeptember 2003 From: California - moved to North Carolina 2018 4,422 posts Posted by DSchmitt on Sunday, April 17, 2005 4:21 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by goat uzurpator- The Europeans use a different scale of octane and the numbers don't mean the same as in USA, it is very confusing realy and I don't much more about it. Last time I was there you could still get "plum" and "sans plum", that is leaded or no leaded. But again apparently it is not real lead, but a lead substitute for older cars. But I don't know much more about it. I found the following: Gasoline - Octane Facts and Myths (Minnesota Dept of Commerce) http://www.state.mn.us/mn/externalDocs/Commerce/Gasoline_Octane_Facts_102902052227_OctaneFacts.pdf I found the following about the octane rating in Europe http://www.ozebook.com/compendium/suzi/octane.pdf Both say that there are two methods of determining the octane rating of gasoline: 1) the "motor method" 2) the "reasearch method" The "research method" results in a higher number than the "motor method". The octane number used in the US is an average of the results of the two methods. In Europe they use the "reasearch method" number. I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it. I don't have a leg to stand on. Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Monday, April 18, 2005 11:37 AM ok so lots of good ideas here but thats all they are ideas. Sorry spbed but I'll have to bash you GASOHOL idea right away. Yes it was made from a mixture of corn ethonal and gasoline. In fact it still is most aff the gas you buy in the US is 10 to 15% ethonal still. Makes gas cheaper but has some drawbacks one gallon os ethonal take about one acre of corn so with the amount of it that we would need would nessecitate making almost all of the US into a giant cornfield (as if Wisconsin doesn't have enough already). Also ethonal burns hotter than gasonline since it is a form of alcohol so the motor oil, valves, pistons, o-rings, and exahust manafolds on your car would have to be replaced. So unless your willing to convince everyone to spend several thousand dollars to have there otherwise perfectly good engine rebuilt or replaced ethonal is not a viable solution to the situation. However if the price of gas got high enough say around $15 a gallon then a synthetic gas produced from highly refined ethonal and several other plant by-products this will require more advanced refining plants however so convince the oil companies of that, and would also use several acres of crops for each gallon. So unless a car that runs on salt water is created or anyother good ideas come up gas is the most economical fuel for now. Plus over the past 50 years the price of gas has only gone up at slightly half the rate of inflation while not a guarantee of the future of gas prices it can be used as a rathe acurate estimate of future prices. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply rvos1979 Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Burlington, WI 1,418 posts Posted by rvos1979 on Monday, April 18, 2005 1:24 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by sd452 ok so lots of good ideas here but thats all they are ideas. Sorry spbed but I'll have to bash you GASOHOL idea right away. Yes it was made from a mixture of corn ethonal and gasoline. In fact it still is most aff the gas you buy in the US is 10 to 15% ethonal still. Makes gas cheaper but has some drawbacks one gallon os ethonal take about one acre of corn so with the amount of it that we would need would nessecitate making almost all of the US into a giant cornfield (as if Wisconsin doesn't have enough already). Also ethonal burns hotter than gasonline since it is a form of alcohol so the motor oil, valves, pistons, o-rings, and exahust manafolds on your car would have to be replaced. So unless your willing to convince everyone to spend several thousand dollars to have there otherwise perfectly good engine rebuilt or replaced ethonal is not a viable solution to the situation. However if the price of gas got high enough say around $15 a gallon then a synthetic gas produced from highly refined ethonal and several other plant by-products this will require more advanced refining plants however so convince the oil companies of that, and would also use several acres of crops for each gallon. So unless a car that runs on salt water is created or anyother good ideas come up gas is the most economical fuel for now. Plus over the past 50 years the price of gas has only gone up at slightly half the rate of inflation while not a guarantee of the future of gas prices it can be used as a rathe acurate estimate of future prices. Quick correction: E-85 (85% ethanol) will operate today's (and most of yesterday's) engines just fine, the fuel system just has to have all rubber parts changed to steel or other materials that will not break down in the alcohol. If you want to get MAX POWER out of an engine burning E-85, the compression ratio will need to be raised, or the boost can be cranked up for you turbo or blower guys (and gals). Yes, the engine will run slightly hotter, but as long as the cooling system is in good shape, there should be no problems. According to www.badgerstateethanol.com, their plant was designed to take 14.8 million bushels of corn and produce 40 million gallons of ethanol. By my quick figures, that's about 2.7 bushels of corn per gallon of ethanol. Also, based on an average of 200 bu/acre, you're looking at about 74,000 acres of corn for ethanol. That's about 116 square miles. Of course, this will vary with corn yields. Randy Randy Vos "Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings "May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Monday, April 18, 2005 2:45 PM Thank you for the corrections rvos. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply rvos1979 Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Burlington, WI 1,418 posts Posted by rvos1979 on Monday, April 18, 2005 3:56 PM unfortunately, I may have to correct myself. According to www.e85fuel.com, one bushel of corn can produce 2.7 gallons of ethanol. apparently, even the websites have different views. you decide who is right. Randy Randy Vos "Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings "May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Monday, April 18, 2005 8:17 PM Thats the internet though you really have to double check the information. As I should have done as most of my statistics for producing ethanol are from 1981 so a little out of date, sorry. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 12:05 AM Corn is as cheap as it gets. This stuff is so overproduced it is ridiculous. All soft drinks are corn syrup based. Fructose = corn. It is unavoidable in sweetened packaged foods. Dispite this there are very few varieties left being farmed in the US what with mono-crop cultivation and cross pollination of GM corn. Pity the poor farmer who unknowingly has some Round-up ready varity blow in. Monsanto sues at the drop of a hat. Faster than a record exec at a Napster party. Sure drive some of this overproduction to another use. Save some farms, they need the money. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 1:26 AM Some of the folks indicate the high cost of hi test (Premium gas) can only be afforded by the rich. That aint so. I feed my olds with the V6 supercharger 93 octane all the time. I get about 400 miles out of it for about 16 gallons of gas give or take a gallon. That is good for about a week's run covering everything. The best thing I can say about that is on lower octane gas it becomes really reluctant and lethargic on the throttle in cut- throat traffic. Reply Edit edbenton Member sinceSeptember 2002 From: Back home on the Chi to KC racetrack 2,011 posts Posted by edbenton on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 8:39 AM Actually all Ford Tauraus and Rangers from 1995 on and Chrysler minivans from 1994 on all already set up to burn E-85. The manufacturs did that to get a huge tax break and the engine does not even know the difference. If E-85 were made the standard fuel for cars our oil consumption would drop roughly 40% and crop prices would go up 20% meaning more money for farmers. Also ethanol can be made from any grain all ethanol is is grain alcohal. Another way to lower prices on oil is biodiesel burns just like regular diesel and costs right about the same blended 50/50 with regular diesel would cut oil consumption right around 10% again. That means we would be free of OPEC's price fixing to maike them even richer. Always at war with those that think OTR trucking is EASY. Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 9:11 AM Just paid $231.9 for 87 octane. Down $0.02 from last week Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 9:15 AM Well I do not know the spread between 87 & 93. But whatever it is in 10/03 87 was $1.50 a gallon now today $2.31. So using your 16 gallons you can figure how much more you now pay then Oct 03 [:(] Originally posted by HighIron2003ar Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:18 PM The Key to what you said in your post HighIron is that you have a supercharger. Most vehicles with a supercharger or turbocharger run better on higher octane gasoline. But for someone like me with an Olds Alero with a regular 3.4 V6 the difference in gas mileage and preformance between 93 octane and 87 octane is not worth the price difference. Especially since here 87 octane droped 5 cents a gallon this week and 93 octane didn't drop at all. And no I don't belive that you have to be rich to afford hi test gas you just have to have a car that benifits from it. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:21 PM Can you get rid of a "supercharger'? [:o)][:D][:p] Originally posted by sd452 Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:27 PM You can get rid of a supercharger spbed but if I had one on my car I would leave it on. Any car that comes from the factory with a supercharger is designed to have one and run best with one. So some Tinkering with the engine to get it to run at its best after removing the supercharger is nessesary. If it is an aftermarket supercharger though then most likely the headers where also changed and all that would be nessasary is puting factory headers back on and a tune up. But It depends on how you personaly feel about it. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 4:06 PM ....I doubt very much if the Alero 3.4L V6 would run any better on 93 octane as opposed to the reg. 87 octane stuff....This engine is designed and set up to run on 87 oct. and probably does fine on it... Quentin Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 4:42 PM It doesn't run any better thats what i was trying to say. Sorry for any confusion. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply passengerfan Member sinceMarch 2004 From: Central Valley California 2,841 posts Posted by passengerfan on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 6:54 PM JUst finished a trip to Lost Wages (Las Vegas) and paid 2,78 9/10 per gallon of 87 Octane at Mojave. Cost fifty bucks each way just for gas. Drove over on Monday so the hotel rooms are cheaper, Well surprise surprise three conventions in town this week Motel 6 rooms $93.75 per night. and those were the only rooms available in the city. Same old story motels just like the oil companies prices are by supply and demand. Guess at these gasoline prices people won't be travelling to Vegas as often. Reply rvos1979 Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Burlington, WI 1,418 posts Posted by rvos1979 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 7:35 PM Filled up in Mazomanie, WI today, price for #2 diesel was 2.38 a gallon, dropped 60 bucks into my tank. Good thing I have a truck that gets 21.5 miles to the gallon. Randy Randy Vos "Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings "May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Thursday, April 21, 2005 4:19 PM ...In our local...prices today varied from 2.10 to 2.26.... Quentin Reply « First«78910111213 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
Originally posted by Modelcar Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Sunday, April 17, 2005 9:02 AM ...Yes interest rates skyrocketed to the range of 12 to 15%....CD's were really booming but it was not good for our well being. And the Crude price spike in the mid 70's was part of the problem that ignited inflation..... Quentin Reply DSchmitt Member sinceSeptember 2003 From: California - moved to North Carolina 2018 4,422 posts Posted by DSchmitt on Sunday, April 17, 2005 4:21 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by goat uzurpator- The Europeans use a different scale of octane and the numbers don't mean the same as in USA, it is very confusing realy and I don't much more about it. Last time I was there you could still get "plum" and "sans plum", that is leaded or no leaded. But again apparently it is not real lead, but a lead substitute for older cars. But I don't know much more about it. I found the following: Gasoline - Octane Facts and Myths (Minnesota Dept of Commerce) http://www.state.mn.us/mn/externalDocs/Commerce/Gasoline_Octane_Facts_102902052227_OctaneFacts.pdf I found the following about the octane rating in Europe http://www.ozebook.com/compendium/suzi/octane.pdf Both say that there are two methods of determining the octane rating of gasoline: 1) the "motor method" 2) the "reasearch method" The "research method" results in a higher number than the "motor method". The octane number used in the US is an average of the results of the two methods. In Europe they use the "reasearch method" number. I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it. I don't have a leg to stand on. Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Monday, April 18, 2005 11:37 AM ok so lots of good ideas here but thats all they are ideas. Sorry spbed but I'll have to bash you GASOHOL idea right away. Yes it was made from a mixture of corn ethonal and gasoline. In fact it still is most aff the gas you buy in the US is 10 to 15% ethonal still. Makes gas cheaper but has some drawbacks one gallon os ethonal take about one acre of corn so with the amount of it that we would need would nessecitate making almost all of the US into a giant cornfield (as if Wisconsin doesn't have enough already). Also ethonal burns hotter than gasonline since it is a form of alcohol so the motor oil, valves, pistons, o-rings, and exahust manafolds on your car would have to be replaced. So unless your willing to convince everyone to spend several thousand dollars to have there otherwise perfectly good engine rebuilt or replaced ethonal is not a viable solution to the situation. However if the price of gas got high enough say around $15 a gallon then a synthetic gas produced from highly refined ethonal and several other plant by-products this will require more advanced refining plants however so convince the oil companies of that, and would also use several acres of crops for each gallon. So unless a car that runs on salt water is created or anyother good ideas come up gas is the most economical fuel for now. Plus over the past 50 years the price of gas has only gone up at slightly half the rate of inflation while not a guarantee of the future of gas prices it can be used as a rathe acurate estimate of future prices. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply rvos1979 Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Burlington, WI 1,418 posts Posted by rvos1979 on Monday, April 18, 2005 1:24 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by sd452 ok so lots of good ideas here but thats all they are ideas. Sorry spbed but I'll have to bash you GASOHOL idea right away. Yes it was made from a mixture of corn ethonal and gasoline. In fact it still is most aff the gas you buy in the US is 10 to 15% ethonal still. Makes gas cheaper but has some drawbacks one gallon os ethonal take about one acre of corn so with the amount of it that we would need would nessecitate making almost all of the US into a giant cornfield (as if Wisconsin doesn't have enough already). Also ethonal burns hotter than gasonline since it is a form of alcohol so the motor oil, valves, pistons, o-rings, and exahust manafolds on your car would have to be replaced. So unless your willing to convince everyone to spend several thousand dollars to have there otherwise perfectly good engine rebuilt or replaced ethonal is not a viable solution to the situation. However if the price of gas got high enough say around $15 a gallon then a synthetic gas produced from highly refined ethonal and several other plant by-products this will require more advanced refining plants however so convince the oil companies of that, and would also use several acres of crops for each gallon. So unless a car that runs on salt water is created or anyother good ideas come up gas is the most economical fuel for now. Plus over the past 50 years the price of gas has only gone up at slightly half the rate of inflation while not a guarantee of the future of gas prices it can be used as a rathe acurate estimate of future prices. Quick correction: E-85 (85% ethanol) will operate today's (and most of yesterday's) engines just fine, the fuel system just has to have all rubber parts changed to steel or other materials that will not break down in the alcohol. If you want to get MAX POWER out of an engine burning E-85, the compression ratio will need to be raised, or the boost can be cranked up for you turbo or blower guys (and gals). Yes, the engine will run slightly hotter, but as long as the cooling system is in good shape, there should be no problems. According to www.badgerstateethanol.com, their plant was designed to take 14.8 million bushels of corn and produce 40 million gallons of ethanol. By my quick figures, that's about 2.7 bushels of corn per gallon of ethanol. Also, based on an average of 200 bu/acre, you're looking at about 74,000 acres of corn for ethanol. That's about 116 square miles. Of course, this will vary with corn yields. Randy Randy Vos "Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings "May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Monday, April 18, 2005 2:45 PM Thank you for the corrections rvos. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply rvos1979 Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Burlington, WI 1,418 posts Posted by rvos1979 on Monday, April 18, 2005 3:56 PM unfortunately, I may have to correct myself. According to www.e85fuel.com, one bushel of corn can produce 2.7 gallons of ethanol. apparently, even the websites have different views. you decide who is right. Randy Randy Vos "Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings "May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Monday, April 18, 2005 8:17 PM Thats the internet though you really have to double check the information. As I should have done as most of my statistics for producing ethanol are from 1981 so a little out of date, sorry. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 12:05 AM Corn is as cheap as it gets. This stuff is so overproduced it is ridiculous. All soft drinks are corn syrup based. Fructose = corn. It is unavoidable in sweetened packaged foods. Dispite this there are very few varieties left being farmed in the US what with mono-crop cultivation and cross pollination of GM corn. Pity the poor farmer who unknowingly has some Round-up ready varity blow in. Monsanto sues at the drop of a hat. Faster than a record exec at a Napster party. Sure drive some of this overproduction to another use. Save some farms, they need the money. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 1:26 AM Some of the folks indicate the high cost of hi test (Premium gas) can only be afforded by the rich. That aint so. I feed my olds with the V6 supercharger 93 octane all the time. I get about 400 miles out of it for about 16 gallons of gas give or take a gallon. That is good for about a week's run covering everything. The best thing I can say about that is on lower octane gas it becomes really reluctant and lethargic on the throttle in cut- throat traffic. Reply Edit edbenton Member sinceSeptember 2002 From: Back home on the Chi to KC racetrack 2,011 posts Posted by edbenton on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 8:39 AM Actually all Ford Tauraus and Rangers from 1995 on and Chrysler minivans from 1994 on all already set up to burn E-85. The manufacturs did that to get a huge tax break and the engine does not even know the difference. If E-85 were made the standard fuel for cars our oil consumption would drop roughly 40% and crop prices would go up 20% meaning more money for farmers. Also ethanol can be made from any grain all ethanol is is grain alcohal. Another way to lower prices on oil is biodiesel burns just like regular diesel and costs right about the same blended 50/50 with regular diesel would cut oil consumption right around 10% again. That means we would be free of OPEC's price fixing to maike them even richer. Always at war with those that think OTR trucking is EASY. Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 9:11 AM Just paid $231.9 for 87 octane. Down $0.02 from last week Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Tuesday, April 19, 2005 9:15 AM Well I do not know the spread between 87 & 93. But whatever it is in 10/03 87 was $1.50 a gallon now today $2.31. So using your 16 gallons you can figure how much more you now pay then Oct 03 [:(] Originally posted by HighIron2003ar Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:18 PM The Key to what you said in your post HighIron is that you have a supercharger. Most vehicles with a supercharger or turbocharger run better on higher octane gasoline. But for someone like me with an Olds Alero with a regular 3.4 V6 the difference in gas mileage and preformance between 93 octane and 87 octane is not worth the price difference. Especially since here 87 octane droped 5 cents a gallon this week and 93 octane didn't drop at all. And no I don't belive that you have to be rich to afford hi test gas you just have to have a car that benifits from it. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:21 PM Can you get rid of a "supercharger'? [:o)][:D][:p] Originally posted by sd452 Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:27 PM You can get rid of a supercharger spbed but if I had one on my car I would leave it on. Any car that comes from the factory with a supercharger is designed to have one and run best with one. So some Tinkering with the engine to get it to run at its best after removing the supercharger is nessesary. If it is an aftermarket supercharger though then most likely the headers where also changed and all that would be nessasary is puting factory headers back on and a tune up. But It depends on how you personaly feel about it. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 4:06 PM ....I doubt very much if the Alero 3.4L V6 would run any better on 93 octane as opposed to the reg. 87 octane stuff....This engine is designed and set up to run on 87 oct. and probably does fine on it... Quentin Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 4:42 PM It doesn't run any better thats what i was trying to say. Sorry for any confusion. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply passengerfan Member sinceMarch 2004 From: Central Valley California 2,841 posts Posted by passengerfan on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 6:54 PM JUst finished a trip to Lost Wages (Las Vegas) and paid 2,78 9/10 per gallon of 87 Octane at Mojave. Cost fifty bucks each way just for gas. Drove over on Monday so the hotel rooms are cheaper, Well surprise surprise three conventions in town this week Motel 6 rooms $93.75 per night. and those were the only rooms available in the city. Same old story motels just like the oil companies prices are by supply and demand. Guess at these gasoline prices people won't be travelling to Vegas as often. Reply rvos1979 Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Burlington, WI 1,418 posts Posted by rvos1979 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 7:35 PM Filled up in Mazomanie, WI today, price for #2 diesel was 2.38 a gallon, dropped 60 bucks into my tank. Good thing I have a truck that gets 21.5 miles to the gallon. Randy Randy Vos "Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings "May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Thursday, April 21, 2005 4:19 PM ...In our local...prices today varied from 2.10 to 2.26.... Quentin Reply « First«78910111213 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
QUOTE: Originally posted by goat uzurpator- The Europeans use a different scale of octane and the numbers don't mean the same as in USA, it is very confusing realy and I don't much more about it. Last time I was there you could still get "plum" and "sans plum", that is leaded or no leaded. But again apparently it is not real lead, but a lead substitute for older cars. But I don't know much more about it.
I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.
I don't have a leg to stand on.
QUOTE: Originally posted by sd452 ok so lots of good ideas here but thats all they are ideas. Sorry spbed but I'll have to bash you GASOHOL idea right away. Yes it was made from a mixture of corn ethonal and gasoline. In fact it still is most aff the gas you buy in the US is 10 to 15% ethonal still. Makes gas cheaper but has some drawbacks one gallon os ethonal take about one acre of corn so with the amount of it that we would need would nessecitate making almost all of the US into a giant cornfield (as if Wisconsin doesn't have enough already). Also ethonal burns hotter than gasonline since it is a form of alcohol so the motor oil, valves, pistons, o-rings, and exahust manafolds on your car would have to be replaced. So unless your willing to convince everyone to spend several thousand dollars to have there otherwise perfectly good engine rebuilt or replaced ethonal is not a viable solution to the situation. However if the price of gas got high enough say around $15 a gallon then a synthetic gas produced from highly refined ethonal and several other plant by-products this will require more advanced refining plants however so convince the oil companies of that, and would also use several acres of crops for each gallon. So unless a car that runs on salt water is created or anyother good ideas come up gas is the most economical fuel for now. Plus over the past 50 years the price of gas has only gone up at slightly half the rate of inflation while not a guarantee of the future of gas prices it can be used as a rathe acurate estimate of future prices.
Randy Vos
"Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings
"May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV
Originally posted by HighIron2003ar Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:18 PM The Key to what you said in your post HighIron is that you have a supercharger. Most vehicles with a supercharger or turbocharger run better on higher octane gasoline. But for someone like me with an Olds Alero with a regular 3.4 V6 the difference in gas mileage and preformance between 93 octane and 87 octane is not worth the price difference. Especially since here 87 octane droped 5 cents a gallon this week and 93 octane didn't drop at all. And no I don't belive that you have to be rich to afford hi test gas you just have to have a car that benifits from it. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:21 PM Can you get rid of a "supercharger'? [:o)][:D][:p] Originally posted by sd452 Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:27 PM You can get rid of a supercharger spbed but if I had one on my car I would leave it on. Any car that comes from the factory with a supercharger is designed to have one and run best with one. So some Tinkering with the engine to get it to run at its best after removing the supercharger is nessesary. If it is an aftermarket supercharger though then most likely the headers where also changed and all that would be nessasary is puting factory headers back on and a tune up. But It depends on how you personaly feel about it. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 4:06 PM ....I doubt very much if the Alero 3.4L V6 would run any better on 93 octane as opposed to the reg. 87 octane stuff....This engine is designed and set up to run on 87 oct. and probably does fine on it... Quentin Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 4:42 PM It doesn't run any better thats what i was trying to say. Sorry for any confusion. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply passengerfan Member sinceMarch 2004 From: Central Valley California 2,841 posts Posted by passengerfan on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 6:54 PM JUst finished a trip to Lost Wages (Las Vegas) and paid 2,78 9/10 per gallon of 87 Octane at Mojave. Cost fifty bucks each way just for gas. Drove over on Monday so the hotel rooms are cheaper, Well surprise surprise three conventions in town this week Motel 6 rooms $93.75 per night. and those were the only rooms available in the city. Same old story motels just like the oil companies prices are by supply and demand. Guess at these gasoline prices people won't be travelling to Vegas as often. Reply rvos1979 Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Burlington, WI 1,418 posts Posted by rvos1979 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 7:35 PM Filled up in Mazomanie, WI today, price for #2 diesel was 2.38 a gallon, dropped 60 bucks into my tank. Good thing I have a truck that gets 21.5 miles to the gallon. Randy Randy Vos "Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings "May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Thursday, April 21, 2005 4:19 PM ...In our local...prices today varied from 2.10 to 2.26.... Quentin Reply « First«78910111213 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
Originally posted by sd452 Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:27 PM You can get rid of a supercharger spbed but if I had one on my car I would leave it on. Any car that comes from the factory with a supercharger is designed to have one and run best with one. So some Tinkering with the engine to get it to run at its best after removing the supercharger is nessesary. If it is an aftermarket supercharger though then most likely the headers where also changed and all that would be nessasary is puting factory headers back on and a tune up. But It depends on how you personaly feel about it. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 4:06 PM ....I doubt very much if the Alero 3.4L V6 would run any better on 93 octane as opposed to the reg. 87 octane stuff....This engine is designed and set up to run on 87 oct. and probably does fine on it... Quentin Reply sd452 Member sinceMarch 2002 From: Wisconsin 43 posts Posted by sd452 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 4:42 PM It doesn't run any better thats what i was trying to say. Sorry for any confusion. Wisconsin Central Forever Reply passengerfan Member sinceMarch 2004 From: Central Valley California 2,841 posts Posted by passengerfan on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 6:54 PM JUst finished a trip to Lost Wages (Las Vegas) and paid 2,78 9/10 per gallon of 87 Octane at Mojave. Cost fifty bucks each way just for gas. Drove over on Monday so the hotel rooms are cheaper, Well surprise surprise three conventions in town this week Motel 6 rooms $93.75 per night. and those were the only rooms available in the city. Same old story motels just like the oil companies prices are by supply and demand. Guess at these gasoline prices people won't be travelling to Vegas as often. Reply rvos1979 Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Burlington, WI 1,418 posts Posted by rvos1979 on Wednesday, April 20, 2005 7:35 PM Filled up in Mazomanie, WI today, price for #2 diesel was 2.38 a gallon, dropped 60 bucks into my tank. Good thing I have a truck that gets 21.5 miles to the gallon. Randy Randy Vos "Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings "May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV Reply Modelcar Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Muncie, Indiana...Orig. from Pennsylvania 13,456 posts Posted by Modelcar on Thursday, April 21, 2005 4:19 PM ...In our local...prices today varied from 2.10 to 2.26.... Quentin Reply « First«78910111213 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.