Convicted One I believe that many of you are overlooking the impact that consolidation has had upon the industry. Back when there were 20+ class one railroads, there was a good chance that if you got fed up with one employer, you could quit, walk across town, and hire on with a different railroad, the same day. Since the employee had options, the employer had to at least be mindful of that. Now, the employer really doesn't have to care if the employee feels job satisfaction, or not. Where else you gonna go? Lower paying short line? commute a couple hundred miles? Rip up all your roots and move to a new city?
I believe that many of you are overlooking the impact that consolidation has had upon the industry.
Back when there were 20+ class one railroads, there was a good chance that if you got fed up with one employer, you could quit, walk across town, and hire on with a different railroad, the same day. Since the employee had options, the employer had to at least be mindful of that.
Now, the employer really doesn't have to care if the employee feels job satisfaction, or not. Where else you gonna go? Lower paying short line? commute a couple hundred miles? Rip up all your roots and move to a new city?
Doktor No As for regular work...thats why I went into Yard Service. Regular hours, days off and I actually forgot what a crew caller even was. Gone 7 years and with an excellent pension and wouldn't have changed a thing. WIfe enjoys her piece of Railroad Retirement too. 8-)
That's the problem. They have been cutting so many regular job that many will spend most of their careers on extra lists/pool service/relief jobs. The incentive of some day holding a regular job is all but gone in most places.
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
zugmann Doktor No As for regular work...thats why I went into Yard Service. Regular hours, days off and I actually forgot what a crew caller even was. Gone 7 years and with an excellent pension and wouldn't have changed a thing. WIfe enjoys her piece of Railroad Retirement too. 8-) That's the problem. They have been cutting so many regular job that many will spend most of their careers on extra lists/pool service/relief jobs. The incentive of some day holding a regular job is all but gone in most places.
As Zugmann shows us, things have changed for the worse in recent years. The title is concerning major railroads currently.
Today's carriers are a far cry from what there were then 'At This Moment' was filmed in the middle 1950's. In the intro of the actual movie - look at all the logos of the Class 1 carriers that existed at that time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pRSDItUGmM
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
I'm just the opposite of others. I love working the road pools. You'll never see me on a regular yard job unless it's all I could hold.
I guess working out, laying over, then working back for so long has me set in my ways. I can't imagine being home every night.
Jeff
jeffhergertI'm just the opposite of others. I love working the road pools. You'll never see me on a regular yard job unless it's all I could hold. I guess working out, laying over, then working back for so long has me set in my ways. I can't imagine being home every night. Jeff
Different strokes for differet folks.
At one point in time I had the Georgia RR as a part of my territory on CSX. Crews were home in Augusta, GA and worked to Atlanta and Plant Harrlee outside Milledgeville, GA. Crews would also protect the New Georgia RR Dinner train that operated from Atlanta to Stone Mountain and return as well as ballast trains that took empties from Atlanta to Lithonia and return to Atlanta with loaded ballast cars. Coal trains operated from Atlanta to Plant Harrlee, most time empties came back to Atlanta, sometimes they went to Augusta.
The agreement in effect when I first worked the territory only required crews to be DH back to Augusta IF they had not been 'home' for 14 DAYS - TWO 7 DAY WEEKS. And it wasn't hard to keep crews out of Augusta for that length of time.
Train Augusta to Atalnta, Get Rest, Dinner Train to Stone Mountain and back, Get Rest, Loaded Coal train to Plant Harrlee, Get Rest, Empties from Plant Harrlee to Atlanta, Get Rest, Lithonia Ballast train turn Get Rest - Each run worked would be 10 to 12 hours - Rest would be 8 hours or more 16, 18 or 20 hours before being called back on duty.
Obviously the Union official that negotiated that contract was of the opinion - 'I am working for money not prestige', and had the support of those working at the time of his election to the post. Later on the agreement was changed to a 4 trip maximum. ie. Augusta to Atlanta, Atlanta to Harrlee, Harrlee to Atlanta, Lithonia turn, DH Home (or work a train to Augusta rather than the Lithonia Turn).
Anyone catch actor James Gregory, "Inspector Luger" from the "Barney Miller" TV sitcom, in "At This Moment?"
I've seen "At This Moment" several times and always find it an enjoyable time capsule. The YouTuber's intro to the film is very good putting it in context, but comes across (to me at least) a just a tiny bit smug and condescending. Still, he appreciates the film for what it is, so that's something.
It's the snake that eats itself.
They can't get people so they overuse and abuse the people they have, then wonder why more people quit? The cycle is just getting worse. Engineer's list spends half its time conducting. Or my favorite - they start holding people out for certain jobs. "No, you can't have that decent daylight job today - we need to save you for the midnight job - don't worry, we'll have someone half your seniority step up to run the other job". Yeah, it's a claim if they pay it without a fight, but sometimes you would like to work a daylight gig for a day. I don't know if it's infuriating, depressing, pathetic, or just plain funny (in a sadistic way) anymore.
It's not the same place it was a few years ago.
zugmann I don't know if it's infuriating, depressing, pathetic, or just plain funny (in a sadistic way) anymore.
Sometimes it's very telling the way the term "we" is used in memorandums and other internal correspondence. IS that a "we" that includes me? Or was it expressly intended to draw a line?
One of the few advantages of smaller businesses.. no us verses them.. no management hierachy.. no memos even.. My wife once said to me "It's almost as if you work for the drivers instead of them working for you!" My response was "what do you mean ALMOST?".
zugmann... It's not the same place it was a few years ago.
From everything I have been hearing - I got out when the getting was good. 3 months before EHH tore CSX apart.
Hopefully the top brass are paying attention..
zugmannIt's not the same place it was a few years ago.
That's pretty much the litany for a lot of veteran employees everywhere counting the days until they put in their papers and retire. It was true in my case anyway.
UlrichHopefully the top brass are paying attention..
They are too focused on 'shareholder value' to understand 1st level employee job satisfaction, fact of the matter is they don't care about anyones job statisfaction until they arrive at the 'top brass' level.
BaltACD Ulrich Hopefully the top brass are paying attention.. They are too focused on 'shareholder value' to understand 1st level employee job satisfaction, fact of the matter is they don't care about anyones job statisfaction until they arrive at the 'top brass' level.
Ulrich Hopefully the top brass are paying attention..
Maybe a bit of a silver lining then for those employees who own shares..
UlrichMaybe a bit of a silver lining then for those employees who own shares..
Like what you get when you put a spoon in a pencil sharpener.
Ulrich BaltACD Ulrich Hopefully the top brass are paying attention.. They are too focused on 'shareholder value' to understand 1st level employee job satisfaction, fact of the matter is they don't care about anyones job statisfaction until they arrive at the 'top brass' level. Maybe a bit of a silver lining then for those employees who own shares..
A silver lining thousands if not millions of times thinner than the amount of silver used in film emulsions.
Working is a everyday, day in day out issue. Employee owned stock value/dividends is nominally a once a quarter reality - yes, employees look at their companies stock prices but knowing that nothing you do in the routine performance of your work day duties will have absolutely no effect on either the price of the stock or the size of the divedend. For most employees stock holdings in their companies - if the quarterly dividend for their holdings supply enough 'money' for a night with the family out on the town - they have 'done good'.
BaltACD Ulrich BaltACD Ulrich Hopefully the top brass are paying attention.. They are too focused on 'shareholder value' to understand 1st level employee job satisfaction, fact of the matter is they don't care about anyones job statisfaction until they arrive at the 'top brass' level. Maybe a bit of a silver lining then for those employees who own shares.. A silver lining thousands if not millions of times thinner than the amount of silver used in film emulsions. Working is a everyday, day in day out issue. Employee owned stock value/dividends is nominally a once a quarter reality - yes, employees look at their companies stock prices but knowing that nothing you do in the routine performance of your work day duties will have absolutely no effect on either the price of the stock or the size of the divedend. For most employees stock holdings in their companies - if the quarterly dividend for their holdings supply enough 'money' for a night with the family out on the town - they have 'done good'.
Maybe they can invest more on their own..over years it adds up fast..
Ulrich Maybe they can invest more on their own..over years it adds up fast..
While I do take full advantage of CN's employee share program and have also bought additional shares on my own, that's a naive attitude that fails to account for the reality of life, the universe and everything. Not everyone decides to throw as much as possible into the stock market, even on a historically reliable investment like a Class I railroad, everyone's investment strategy is different and life has a way of throwing other expenses at you.
It's nice to see the stock price go up, but that doesn't really affect me on a daily basis, just like how the things I do really have no effect on the stock price.
As an employee, I would prefer to see upper management take a couple hours to think about improving employee relations and making changes that cut back on the bullying and harassment tactics at work. It is possible, when Mike Cory became CN's COO most of the crap disappeared for a while. But he didn't last, and since he left (replaced by ex-BNSFer Rob Reilly) it has slowly been getting worse again.
But I don't think it will happen again. All they care about are the numbers, and employee (dis)satisfaction cannot be measured in dollars.
Well, unless your business grinds to a halt because no one wants to work for you..........
Greetings from Alberta
-an Articulate Malcontent
Ulrich BaltACD Ulrich BaltACD Ulrich Hopefully the top brass are paying attention.. They are too focused on 'shareholder value' to understand 1st level employee job satisfaction, fact of the matter is they don't care about anyones job statisfaction until they arrive at the 'top brass' level. Maybe a bit of a silver lining then for those employees who own shares.. A silver lining thousands if not millions of times thinner than the amount of silver used in film emulsions. Working is a everyday, day in day out issue. Employee owned stock value/dividends is nominally a once a quarter reality - yes, employees look at their companies stock prices but knowing that nothing you do in the routine performance of your work day duties will have absolutely no effect on either the price of the stock or the size of the divedend. For most employees stock holdings in their companies - if the quarterly dividend for their holdings supply enough 'money' for a night with the family out on the town - they have 'done good'. Maybe they can invest more on their own..over years it adds up fast..
It doesn't add up THAT FAST.
UlrichMaybe they can invest more on their own..over years it adds up fast..
The ol' bootstrap excuse is old and tired.
Transportation is a tough row to hoe in the best of times, and when you add in out of touch or hostile management then things tend to become downright intolerable. I've experienced the same over the years (perhaps not to the same extent as you have).. but enough certainly to get the general feel of it. Hopefully they address those concerns as they appear to be the general consensus across the board.
zugmann Ulrich Maybe they can invest more on their own..over years it adds up fast.. The ol' bootstrap excuse is old and tired.
Urine is about the only thing that trickles down.
Bootstrap is all most of us can do.. its either the stock market or real estate.. or working until you're health gives out.
Socking away 10% of your annual pay into stocks for 30 years is a lot easier to do for a guy making $100K/year, than for a guy making $40K....cause, you know, life happens.
Convicted One Socking away 10% of your annual pay into stocks for 30 years is a lot easier to do for a guy making $100K/year, than for a guy making $40K....cause, you know, life happens.
Life happens for everyone.. even for the 100K+ person.. don't sock away 10% per year.. put away less.. compounding still works..
Ulrichcompounding still works..
So does inflation.
Convicted One Ulrich compounding still works.. So does inflation.
Ulrich compounding still works..
All the more reason to make sure your investments compound.. still beats stuffing the matress with dollar bills.
BackshopYou just live under your means.
Yeah, foregoing "excess" for a lifetime can have benefits, provided one is cozy with the sense of sacrifice.
My point was that after one's basic necessities are taken care of, your 100K guy has more discretionary income to decide what he wants to do with it...live large or invest.
The scale of that determination is decidedly more limited in scope for the 40K guy.
I find now that I am in my 60's, my physical limitations will not allow me to do many things I previously enjoyed. So, in that context, I am glad that I often splurged back when I was still young enough to enjoy it.
A lifetime of sacrifice eating beans and weenies kinda sux too if you don't live long enough for the pay off.
Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.