Hello, good Sunday everybody. I've been studying in some other resources, so no questions right now from that angle, but...I'd like to re-post a question from back a bit.
As I'm going back through everything, this is really 'bugging' me, too. Why is it that a diesel will handle differently every time you take her out. Like on an am run, it behaves or responds (or not) one way, but on the pm run, it's quite a lot different. I'm thinking humidity, engine fluids being cold, air temp., veh temp (sitting for 4 hours might not be like sitting overnight or a couple days), poss. even the rails being cold in the am but warming up in the sun? Are these viable ideas? I'm sure there are others.
Thanks, as always, and everyone stay safe.
Nance-CCABW/LEI
“Even if you are on the right track, you’ll get run over if you just sit there.” --Will Rogers
Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, you're right! --unknown
Well, fortunately there is no bad news on the weather front. It kind of surprises me though, considering the wind we finally got here very early this morning. When I got my paper at 6:00 AM it was really howling. It is still blowing from the West at 37 kph.
Bruce
So shovel the coal, let this rattler roll.
"A Train is a Place Going Somewhere" CP Rail Public Timetable
"O. S. Irricana"
. . . __ . ______
I'm definitely not the one to help you with that one, Nance. I suspect that the problem isn't noticed by that many people, since most engineers these days rarely use the same locomotive on consecutive assignments; and it probably has to be a single unit, or the idiosyncrasies would probably be attributed to something else in the consist.
Finally get to spend a few minutes in here today, what with sleeping in, church, shopping, lunch, and opening up a drain for what we hope will be copious amounts of meltwater over the next couple of days. One forecaster even says 50 degrees might be reached on Thursday!
While out on our errands (one of which was fueling our car, for the first time in February), we did catch a couple of trains, including a freight that has given me a couple of good sightings. I have to find out (I think--I might have done this before) where the Warwick Railway got a few big, blue box cars in the 600 series; this is the only really challenging one from this trip.
Also, we saw the ongoing construction in Villa Park of a place named "Trackside". While I don't doubt for a minute that it would have a lounge in it, it's for off-track betting--not the kind of trackside I'd be even remotely interested in. (Oh--it isn't beside any railroad tracks, either.)
I might not be in for the first part of Valentine's Day--my Valentine will get to chauffeur me around from place to place much of the day. Unfortunately, the only place we might be interested in going is from the surgical center back to home, as I recover from being put under for a routine (in my case...I hope!) gastroscopy. Pat says I shouldn't come near the computer until I've had a good, long nap to recover.
Carl
Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)
CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)
I really enjoyed seeing today's, February 14, Photo of the Day. On the TRAINS homepage.
The 2816 is out where it started. Back in 1930, its' first job was taking passenger trains from Winnipeg to Calgary, and back. It worked this run until 1937, when after it's major re shopping it ended up at various locations in central Canada for the rest of its' career.
Take away the diesel and the second tender, and that Express Boxcar would likely have been filled with storage mail right behind the engine. That baggage car you see would have been behind that. Then, you can imagine what "The Dominion" would have looked like.
That plant in the background is at Carseland. The Calgary city limits are about 26 miles back, and he is about 35 rail miles east of the old Calgary station. From around Strangmuir passenger trains would really start to go, I mean go, 700 miles or so to Portage la Prairie, MB. Eighty mile per hour speeds were hardly out of the question for those Hudson's.
Nice to get insight like that from time to time, Bruce. Much appreciated here.
(Back from my checkup. The name was longer this time--esophagogastroduodenoscopy--so consequently my throat is sorer. My esophagogastroduodenointerologist says things look fine--improved, perhaps--though he did remove a polyp in the stomach and scraped a couple of places on my esophagus for biopsy.)
Back down for another nap.
CShaveRR Nice to get insight like that from time to time, Bruce. Much appreciated here. (Back from my checkup. The name was longer this time--esophagogastroduodenoscopy--so consequently my throat is sorer. My esophagogastroduodenointerologist says things look fine--improved, perhaps--though he did remove a polyp in the stomach and scraped a couple of places on my esophagus for biopsy.) Back down for another nap.
Johnny
Johnny, basically they took a look with a fiber-optic camera down my throat and into my stomach. Other tools had the capability of cutting and retrieving skin samples. The procedure was fast, but I'm still sore (as I said, this is unusual--hope I can sleep it off tonight). It will take a week to ten days for the reports on the tissue samples to come in, but the doctor (he's really a gastrointerologist) says that things look good, for my past history.
I just recently got involved in a project to determine the proper prototype for a series of secondhand (actually thirdhand or more) box cars. It's an eye-opener for me, because the 40 cars in the series are of at least four different sizes and three manufacturers. Seven of them are gone now, which doesn't help.
Oh, and from yesterday, the answer to my mysterious blue box cars from the Warwick Railway...they were previously operated by the Lancaster & Chester. No, I'm not making these railroad names up!
Are you sure??!! Next, you're gonna be telling us their law firm was Dewey, Cheatum & Howe!!
Carl & Jim (or anyone else who's interested),
Yesterday I think I caught movement of new (empty) DMIR ore jennies northward. Unfortunately I didn't realize (or think about it) until this morning when I realized none of the numbers I saw came up on other lists. Here's some photographic goodies for ya:
Golden Jennies
DMIR 70992
Inside a Hopper
End Markings
Those cars were part of a semi-eventful 90 minutes (most of which was spent driving...ugh). First thing I saw just outside of work:M346
After hearing the East RTC tell L528 to "...duck into WINNEBAGO to meet one Northbound" I headed north. Just in time to catch the local.L528
I decided to head further north to see about getting an overhead shot of whatever was coming I had no idea what it would be. Soon, IC 1004 leading "Grain Train" (only identifier other than the loco I heard) into Dixie Siding came along.IC 1004 Leading
That was the train that had the Ore Jennies. Today may yield a present from the WSOR...but that depends on timing...stay tuned!
Dan
Like I said, Dan...don't make me come up there!
The numbers of the ore cars now go up as high as 71203. I forgot what I said the end point was earlier, but there have obviously been at least 500 added. I don't see the National Steel Car decals on these, so it's possible that someone else built them. Nice down-on view, by the way.
___________________
Nance, it's funny that you mentioned Dewey, Cheatem & Howe, especially in connection with the Lancaster & Chester Railroad. If any railroad could ever be accused of not taking itself too seriously, it was the Lancaster & Chester! Their listings in the Official Guide were required reading at one time. I have only one of these listings from back in the day (1948, in my case). It was rather tame compared to the others. This 29-mile shortline had about 25 vice presidents, most of which were in New York City, but there was one each in Nyack, New York, Xenia, Ohio, Daytona Beach, Florida, as well as many of the larger American Cities. W. F. Halsey was the Vice President in charge of White Horse supply, based in Charlottesville, Virginia. (A chapter describing the L&C noted that Gypsy Rose Lee was once their Vice President in charge of Unveiling.) The line had two attorneys, but three surgeons. This Official Guide listing shows that their Advertising Agent was Lowell Thomas, in New York City, and R. J. Reynolds was their Marine Superintendent (on a land-locked railroad!).
According to the chapter on the L&C in A Treasury of Railroad Folklore by B. A. Botkin and Alvin F. Harlow, they had other brochures and dining-car menus (on a freight-only line!) that were even more outrageous. One of the passenger trains, the White Horse, was scheduled to travel the 29 miles in 30 minutes, but was "to be run only by a Vice President". A note at one station meant "bad connection", and at the next station, "not the slightest connection". It would be nice if someone could provide a link to some of these items.
The sore throat lingers, but I'm otherwise feeling much more normal today. We're going out to BNSF country in a little while, east of our usual haunts (Pat needs to go to a specific location for some supplies; it's up to me to make the most of the journeys to and from).
So, I guess I was right on the money! (That's a first!! ) But...I Googled it and was surprised to see them operating today!! Well, OK, it is now Lancaster & Chester RailWAY, which I've learned from all my studies, is often the case for reincarnation!! It's all paying off!!
I'm glad you are better; gee, maybe another trip to DQ would help you feel even better? Take care.
WMNB4THRTL Are you sure??!! Next, you're gonna be telling us their law firm was Dewey, Cheatum & Howe!!
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
From the sounds of it, it was both!!
Re: Boxcars owned by railroads with odd names - Back in the early 1970's days of the financial unraveling of Penn Central, there was the strange case of the LaSalle & Bureau County Railroad in north central Illinois as I recall, which was found to own something like 270-some boxcars. Now this was before the "incentive per diem" short-line boxcar fleet craze of the later 1970's, so it was somewhat unusual. Allegations were made that the railroad's officials had been - as the old Western saying goes - "somewhat careless in the manner of their acquisition of riding horses" - or here, "rolling stock"; in other words, they were stolen from PC. However, "the rest of the story" seems that there was a mix-up and bad record-keeping by the tottering rail giant - see, for example: http://www.trainweb.org/lsbc/theft.html
And at about 3/4 of the way down this webpage: http://www.kinglyheirs.com/NewYorkStateRailroads/PennCentral1.html#BoxCars
From http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?11,2119011 -
LaSalle & Bureau County = "LSBC" = "Let's Steal Box Cars"
You Upper MidWest folks might enjoy the comments in that thread, too !
- Paul North.
CShaveRR Like I said, Dan...don't make me come up there! The numbers of the ore cars now go up as high as 71203. I forgot what I said the end point was earlier, but there have obviously been at least 500 added. I don't see the National Steel Car decals on these, so it's possible that someone else built them. Nice down-on view, by the way.
You and Pat are quite welcome to come up this way! I think I could even locate a quilting/fabric store to keep her busy...and some company with which to work her trade whist we entertained ourselves otherwise. Things are picking up and I've been getting a better feel for when things "should" be moving around here. Let me know if you do decide to pop up...we'll make something happen.
Thanks for the compliments!
Paul_D_North_Jr Back in the early 1970's days of the financial unraveling of Penn Central, there was the strange case of the LaSalle & Bureau County Railroad in north central Illinois as I recall, which was found to own something like 270-some boxcars. Now this was before the "incentive per diem" short-line boxcar fleet craze of the later 1970's, so it was somewhat unusual. Allegations were made that the railroad's officials had been - as the old Western saying goes - "somewhat careless in the manner of their acquisition of riding horses" - or here, "rolling stock"; in other words, they were stolen from PC.
Back in the early 1970's days of the financial unraveling of Penn Central, there was the strange case of the LaSalle & Bureau County Railroad in north central Illinois as I recall, which was found to own something like 270-some boxcars. Now this was before the "incentive per diem" short-line boxcar fleet craze of the later 1970's, so it was somewhat unusual. Allegations were made that the railroad's officials had been - as the old Western saying goes - "somewhat careless in the manner of their acquisition of riding horses" - or here, "rolling stock"; in other words, they were stolen from PC.
Thank you, Paul. I have been waiting for years to see this item either in the magazine or posted here. I can remember vividly reading about this while I still lived at home. There was a picture of one decrepit looking boxcar. I never remembered the RR name, but I do remember it was in the upper Midwest somewhere. I can't remember if the story was in TIME Magazine or in the CPR staff magazine. The whole thing struck me as so crazy.
Once I started to read TRAINS magazine again and join the forum I began to understand about reporting marks, and began a patient wait for this story to eventually come out. Thanks again.
The LSBC cars I saw (this was about the time I hired out for the C&NW, in 1971) were mostly old New York Central 40-foot box cars. I think the route to LSBC was via some leasing company in Florida. I'm not sure that it was so much out-and-out theft as a misunderstanding...but I'm sure that the company that suffered because of the misunderstanding (PC) didn't see it that way! The cars I saw probably never were returned to PC--the same old cars would up with CLK reporting marks soon thereafter (and the operator of the Cadillac & Lake City was not unfamiliar with criminal proceedings, as we later found out). Some of those CLK cars eventually wound up on the Maryland & Pennsylvania--by which time I presume the misunderstandings had all been ironed out.
Cripes...that's complicated Carl!
It was another good 3 hours...hehe. Look away now, Carl...all are clickable FMI should anyone so desire.
Started my afternoon off by catching M341 waiting to head north once A416 was clear:
Along the way back to the other end of the yard, a local seemed to "get caught", lucky Devil!
Talk about timing? How's two FREDs in one shot?
Shortly thereafter the southbound started to pull:
These guys had lots to wait for:
Whaddya know...a northbound (#1):
Followed by an intermodal (NB #2):
Time to jet to Oshkosh to catch a maiden voyage:
Yay for the scanner...one more train for the day!
WHEW!
CShaveRR Nance, it's funny that you mentioned Dewey, Cheatem & Howe, especially in connection with the Lancaster & Chester Railroad. If any railroad could ever be accused of not taking itself too seriously, it was the Lancaster & Chester! Their listings in the Official Guide were required reading at one time. I have only one of these listings from back in the day (1948, in my case). It was rather tame compared to the others. This 29-mile shortline had about 25 vice presidents, most of which were in New York City, but there was one each in Nyack, New York, Xenia, Ohio, Daytona Beach, Florida, as well as many of the larger American Cities. W. F. Halsey was the Vice President in charge of White Horse supply, based in Charlottesville, Virginia. (A chapter describing the L&C noted that Gypsy Rose Lee was once their Vice President in charge of Unveiling.) The line had two attorneys, but three surgeons. This Official Guide listing shows that their Advertising Agent was Lowell Thomas, in New York City, and R. J. Reynolds was their Marine Superintendent (on a land-locked railroad!). According to the chapter on the L&C in A Treasury of Railroad Folklore by B. A. Botkin and Alvin F. Harlow, they had other brochures and dining-car menus (on a freight-only line!) that were even more outrageous. One of the passenger trains, the White Horse, was scheduled to travel the 29 miles in 30 minutes, but was "to be run only by a Vice President". A note at one station meant "bad connection", and at the next station, "not the slightest connection". It would be nice if someone could provide a link to some of these items. ___________________ The sore throat lingers, but I'm otherwise feeling much more normal today. We're going out to BNSF country in a little while, east of our usual haunts (Pat needs to go to a specific location for some supplies; it's up to me to make the most of the journeys to and from).
Carl, you did beat me to expounding on the Lancaster and Chester Railway Co. First, let me say that I do not know how many times I crossed the L&C tracks across Main Street in Lancaster (I grew up ten miles from Lancaster), and I passed the beautiful headquarters building (unveiled by Vice-President Gypsy Rose Lee after the construction was finished), which was right on Main Street.
As to Vice-President in Charge of White Horse Supply, Admiral Halsey was not charged with obtaining White Horse whisky, but with obtaining Emperor Hirohito’s white horse to present to General Jonathan Wainwright (who was captured by the Japanese in the Phillippines) after he wished for the horse (this is best understood by people who were around 60-70 years ago).
Most of the Vice-Presidents lived far away, as Carl noted, but one was in Kershaw (off-line and 17 miles from Lancaster), the location of one of the Springs cotton mills. Most of the mills were on-line, but there was also one in Fort Mill, which, like Kershaw, was on the Southern (Southern served both Lancaster and Chester, on two separate lines). A few years ago, the L&C bought what was left of the Southern line from Lancaster to a little south of Kershaw.
In 1950, there were four surgeons and one consulting physician–none of whom lived online (one was in Denver, Col. (not N. C.) and another one was in Rochester, Minn.
As to the dining car menu, I regret that I never stopped in at the office and asked for one. As to the menu itself, here are a few choice items, as listed in A Treasury of Railroad Folklore. Remember, these prices are from the fifties. Diamond Back Terrapin with drawn butter-$.75; Bareback Taxpayer with drawn blood–$.50; Fillet of Flounder–$1.00; Floundering Filly, New York–$20.00; Floundering Filly, Hampton–$40.00; Pork Chops stuffed with Frozen Spinach–$2.50; Pork Barrel stuffed with Republican–$3.50; Drawn and Quartered Democrat Roasted in own Jacket–$2.00; *** of Peasant stuffed with Russian Propaganda–10 Rubles.
Colonel Elliot Springs (President of the Road) indeed had a great sense of humor–which could be seen in the advertisements for Springmaid products as well as in the L&C listing in the Guide.. But he also ran a good railroad and his cotton mills produced good product–and you can still buy sheets with the Springmaid emblem.
It's good to hear that you recovering from your Greek (I believe that the name is all Greek) exam yesterday .
The book also said that all trains on the L&C were run with "Combination caboose-lounge-observation cars".
I'd just like to see a reproduction on the Internet somewhere of this menu or the other publicity. Amazing that you could just go into the office and ask for something like this!
__________________
Yesterday's trip into the open world was productive enough--we found an interesting restaurant in the suburb of Riverside, Illinois, run by a former co-worker of mine. The best assessment of the food at Grumpy's Cafe is that Pat was referring to "next time" we visit! Since Riverside is a small community with curving streets and literally scores of architectural gems (not to mention the BNSF "Racetrack"!), I suspect that we'll attempt to cruise the city via bicycle sometime this spring or summer.
Trains were not seen while in Riverside (we'll have to coerce "Grumpy" into making a backyard patio at his establishment, if there's room!), but we caught a couple of good ones on the IHB in LaGrange, and plenty of intermodal and dinky activity on the BNSF between LaGrange and Downers Grove.
Hi, I just found this website that I think may have some 'older' info relating to what you are talking about.
http://www.fortunecity.com/westwood/vivienne/438/lcindex.html
(HEY, I FINALLY DID IT-- THANKS, SAM!!! CARL, I KNOW YOU HELPED, TOO)
I don't have a chance to read through it right now as I found out late last night that we lost my best friend Judy's brother, Bob. I'll have to do some figuring on a few different angles on that one.
I'll also continue my RR studying , as circumstances allow, as well as work on my assignments for my Creative Writing class; need to have all that done by Thurs night. Well, just the latter part, of course. Stay safe everyone.
CShaveRR The book also said that all trains on the L&C were run with "Combination caboose-lounge-observation cars".
Nance, thanks for that link provides information concerning the L&C. The SB line of the Southern ran from Kingville (a little below Columbia on the Columbia-Charleston line) to Marion, N. C., (on the Salisbury-Morristown, Tenn. line). It is now broken in many places.
WMNB4THRTL [from a couple weeks ago - snipped] I'm going back over some aspects about air brakes. I've seen where a rule says, "Bottling or canning of air is prohibited." Just what is that and why is it prohibited?
"Why-you-don't-want-to-do-that-Dept.": See this NTSB Railroad Brief Accident Report - a mere 2 pages, approx. 13 KB in size - so it'll be a fast download and "quick read":
at - http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/1998/RAB9801.pdf
What really surprised me was this, from the 3rd paragraph inthe middle of page 2, above "PROBABLE CAUSE": [emphasis added - PDN]: "When the conductor closed the angle$1****$2on the remainder of the train, the brake pipe initiated an increase in pressure that propagated back toward the rear of the train and released the brakes. Because the train was standing on an ascending grade, once the brakes were released, the 73 cars rolled away freely."
Does that seem right ? I can't see merely closing the valve in a brake line that is at a static or equilibrium 'application' pressure causing the brake pipe to spontaneously increase pressure and release the brakes - unless the 'Quick Release' feature of the brake system was somehow triggered thereby ?
Paul_D_North_JrDoes that seem right ? I can't see merely closing the valve in a brake line that is at a static or equilibrium 'application' pressure causing the brake pipe to spontaneously increase pressure and release the brakes - unless the 'Quick Release' feature of the brake system was somehow triggered thereby ?
tree68 Paul_D_North_Jr: Does that seem right ? I can't see merely closing the valve in a brake line that is at a static or equilibrium 'application' pressure causing the brake pipe to spontaneously increase pressure and release the brakes - unless the 'Quick Release' feature of the brake system was somehow triggered thereby ? As I recall from my brakes classes that's exactly the problem...
Paul_D_North_Jr: Does that seem right ? I can't see merely closing the valve in a brake line that is at a static or equilibrium 'application' pressure causing the brake pipe to spontaneously increase pressure and release the brakes - unless the 'Quick Release' feature of the brake system was somehow triggered thereby ?
A couple of things can happen when the air is bottled.
The anglecock may have been closed too soon, before the air has stopped moving. Take a half-full bottle of any liquid and hold it on it's side. Rock it a bit and you can watch the wave go back and forth. Air works the same way. If the anglecock was closed before the air stopped moving, the air will bounce back. This can momentarily increase the pressure at that point. If it's enough (1 1/2 to 2 psi), the control (triple) valve will sense this momentary rise in pressure and can be fooled into initiating a release.
The second thing on a brake pipe where the air pressure has stablized, stopped moving. If the auxilary reservoir has a leak, eventually the control valve will see there is more air pressure on the brake pipe side than the auxilary reservoir side. Again, sensing the higher pressure in the brake pipe, it's fooled into initiating a release.
In either scenario, when the control valve on equipment currently in service goes to release it does more than just release that car's brake cylinder pressure. To get the "quick release" that Paul mentioned, the system taps into the emergency reservoir and puts some of that air into the brake pipe. The brake pipe isn't only the "power" to operate the brakes, but is also the signal. Increasing the pressure at each car as it releases, speeds up that signal. If the air is "bottled," the brake pipe pressure will rise throughout the cut of cars. Each car as it senses the rise, will do the same thing. Release it's brakes and help charge the brake pipe, helping to send the signal down the line.
If the anglecock is open, the bottle uncorked, the air from one car's emergency reservoir will just vent to atmoshpere if it should release. The brake pipe pressure can't rise, triggering the neighboring cars to also release.
Jeff
Thanks for that, Jeff. Any chance you, or anyone else, can please address this question? I'd appreciate it. I've experienced this but I don't know why this occurs.
Well, it now appears that Tru-Green isn't going to have to delay its spring fertilizer applications, after all. We now have quite a bit of bare lawn where those two feet of snow landed two weeks ago, with temperatures in the 50s (record high for today was 60, but I don't think we'll see that, in spite of earlier forecasts).
Pat and I took advantage of the mild temperatures and reappearing sidewalks to walk downtown to the library, and to get lunch and pick up our weekly paper. Most of the places we went were close to the UP main line, so we spent roughly an hour and a quarter within sight of the trains. Here's what we caught, in order:
Eastbound scoot
Westbound scoot
Eastbound stack train (had to wait for the preceding scoot to clear the platform)
Eastbound manifest (MCBPR? Very long, with a DP unit about 3/4 of the way back.)
Westbound manifest (MPRCB or MPRDM, most likely)
Eastbound WEPX coal train (3 units on the point, one DPU)
Westbound ZSKDL--should have counted the reefers on this one; he was long!
Eastbound manifest from North Platte
There was construction going on both at the station platform (in anticipation of the pedestrian tunnel to be built there in a year or so, no doubt) and down where the crossovers are going. But all three tracks were in service (ample evidence of that!), so no switches were being installed.
TJeff - Those are good explanations - thank you ! Hasn't UP tapped you as a trainer of some kind yet ?
For the 'dynamic' one, I would not have thought that the air pressure 'waves' would last that long or be that significant, nor that only 1 or 2 lbs. of pressure would fool the triple valve into a false release - but there you go. It's just like an air line version of 'water hammer' when you turn a faucet or valve closed too quickly in a house without an air cushion in the water lines, and all that column or 'slug' of moving water comes to a sudden stop, and so causes the pipes to move and bang against each other and the walls, etc. from that sudden rise in pressure.
The leak in the 'static' or 'equilibrium' scenario makes sense, too. Then once the Quick Release starts to occur - it's just like a row of dominoes falling over.
For either scenario, see also Al Krug's explanation of "Freight Train Air Brakes of North America" at - http://www.alkrug.vcn.com/rrfacts/brakes.htm - in particular, Quiz #2 about 1/2 of the way down that page.
Nance (and anyone else who's interested) - There's also a pretty good explanation there about 2/3 of the way down that same page of the need for and operation of the "Load/ Empty Sensors" to modulate the brake cylinder pressures - apparently, somewhat higher for loads, and somewhat lower for empties, as more fully explained there.
So I had this car today, loaded with a particular type of soybean meal (I will refrain from saying the specific name as that would give away who it belongs to). But let me tell you - this car smelled like butt. I have never had a grain car stink that bad. Even empty, it was pretty bad.
That is probably the biggest surprise I had out here. Just how much rail cars smell. Actually, the biggest surprise is how nobody communicates with anyone else, but that's another story for another day...
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
"The biggest problems are institutional, not technical." - John G. Kneiling (and some others) about railroads (also applicable to many other organizations, too - governments, some military and intelligence operations, GM, banks, etc., etc.).
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