mudchicken wrote: Did C&EI sneak-in on TRRA, A&S, IT or Manufacturer's?Did Frisco sneak across the river to hook-up via A&S?
Did C&EI sneak-in on TRRA, A&S, IT or Manufacturer's?
Did Frisco sneak across the river to hook-up via A&S?
MC,
I purposedly limited my question to passenger trains because I wasn't really sure of the situation at St.L and NO. I think the freight trains of the roads that served both cities stopped at one side or the other of the Miss and cross river movements were by trains of the TRRA and NOPB. There may have been exceptions but I really don't know.
Mark
route_rock wrote: Did someone mention M&StL in the Miss River Crossings? Or am I just getting blind in my old age?
Did someone mention M&StL in the Miss River Crossings? Or am I just getting blind in my old age?
Good call Route Rock. The M&StL did indeed have passenger service between Okaloosa and Peoria that crossed the Mississippi though I think that by 1950 it was down to just a mixed train.
The Desert Storm unit was long since restored to original paint (and may no longer be around). UP also repainted a couple of units for the 1996 Olympics, but they too were restored to their original paint. SD40-2 3300 has been floating around in a special blue paint scheme for United Way.
I'm not sure what's meant by "Heritage" units, because there were only the six of those in the special paint schemes. However, the questioner may have a 2008 UP calendar in front of him...
Carl
Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)
CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)
KCSfan wrote: I can't give you individual locomotive numbers but think there's one each painted in the colors of the MoPac, MKT, CNW, SP and D&RGW making a total of five units. There may be a sixth painted in the livery of the WP but I'm not sure of that.Mark
I can't give you individual locomotive numbers but think there's one each painted in the colors of the MoPac, MKT, CNW, SP and D&RGW making a total of five units. There may be a sixth painted in the livery of the WP but I'm not sure of that.
Yes, there's a WP and a Bush 41, but that's not technically a "heritage". They also did a pair of non-heritage units for the Salt Lake City winter Olympics. There was an SD40-2 for Desert Storm - don' know if it's still roaming around in cammo, tho'.
Hmmm.. Can't think of any more.
-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/)
passengerfan wrote: I came up with 24 and they are the following1 IC 2 CB&Q 3 GN 4 NP 5 C&NW 6 CGW 7 CRI&P 8 CMSTP&P 9 NYC 10 PRR 11 B&O 12 SOU13 L&N 14 WAB 15 StLSW 16 SP (T&NO) 17 GM&O 18 MP (T&P) 19 Cotton Belt 20 AT&SF 21 SOO 22 IT 23 KCS 24 NKP 25 N&WAl - in - Stockton
I came up with 24 and they are the following
1 IC 2 CB&Q 3 GN 4 NP 5 C&NW 6 CGW 7 CRI&P 8 CMSTP&P 9 NYC 10 PRR 11 B&O 12 SOU
13 L&N 14 WAB 15 StLSW 16 SP (T&NO) 17 GM&O 18 MP (T&P) 19 Cotton Belt 20 AT&SF
21 SOO 22 IT 23 KCS 24 NKP 25 N&W
Al - in - Stockton
In the 1950's the N&W didn't go west of Cincinnati....what train of their went across the Miss?. Wouldn't a lot of those that crossed at St.L. be tenant's ala the UP on Milw and C&NW?
Yes we are on time but this is yesterdays train
Does this mean it's time for a new and possibly easier question? - a.s.
I thought it was time for an easier question but didn't think this one would be all that easy for you guys. Michael, by NW I assumed you meant the CNW and not the Norfolk and Western. You were the first to name the majority of the roads so for that reason and also since I don't think you've had a chance to ask a history question before I'll declare you the winner.
Al, you completed the list but a couple of minor corrections are in order. The N&W shouldn't be included since it didn't gain a Miss River crossing until the 1960's when it absorbed the Wabash and NKP. Also the MoPac and the T&P were separate operating entities during the 1950's and both had their own trains that crossed the Miss so they should be listed separately. Michael, the same holds true for the SSW and the SP.
I purposely excluded the Southern because I thought its passenger service into St. Louis may have been discontinued prior to 1950. I know for a fact that by mid-1954 it didn't run west of Louisville. I also thought of the C&EI but think it discontinued service between Chicago and St. Louis prior to 1950.
The time frame for this question is the early 1950's. Off the top of my head I can think of at least 23 RR's whose passenger trains crossed over the Mississippi River. Exclude the UP whose trains I'd consider as belonging to another road when they crossed the river on the last leg of their route to Chicago. Name as many of these 23 roads as you can.
Carl,
Having grown up in far south Chicagoland and later living in Naperville I was never very familiar with the details of the rail routes runinng north and northwest of the city. I believe there was, and maybe still is, a major junction in or at Mayfair which I am pretty sure is within the Chicago city limits and is northeast of Franklin Park. So I'll make Mayfair my final answer.
CShaveRR wrote:No, Al, Deval isn't in Chicago.
Quite right. Sorry!
CShaveRR wrote: KCSfan wrote: CShaveRR wrote: Right railroad (B&OCT), one right end-point (Franklin Park), but you're going in the wrong direction. Forest Preserve Drive goes northeast from the Franklin Park area. Zeph has also given you a fantastic hint. I'm torn between Morton Grove, Park Ridge, Skokie, Evanston and maybe even DesPlaines. Since I have to pick one, I'll say Evanston.MarkNo to all of those, Mark. In the original question, it was pointed out that this end-point was still a well-known junction. It's in the city of Chicago. Since I can't remember the precise details myself (that electrification study is kept in the rare-book room at the Chicago Public Library, and you have to go through security of sorts to look at it), I'll settle for either of two junctions that are pretty close to each other.Another hint--there may be a tie-in to another thread recently showing up on the Forum.
KCSfan wrote: CShaveRR wrote: Right railroad (B&OCT), one right end-point (Franklin Park), but you're going in the wrong direction. Forest Preserve Drive goes northeast from the Franklin Park area. Zeph has also given you a fantastic hint. I'm torn between Morton Grove, Park Ridge, Skokie, Evanston and maybe even DesPlaines. Since I have to pick one, I'll say Evanston.Mark
CShaveRR wrote: Right railroad (B&OCT), one right end-point (Franklin Park), but you're going in the wrong direction. Forest Preserve Drive goes northeast from the Franklin Park area. Zeph has also given you a fantastic hint.
I'm torn between Morton Grove, Park Ridge, Skokie, Evanston and maybe even DesPlaines. Since I have to pick one, I'll say Evanston.
No to all of those, Mark. In the original question, it was pointed out that this end-point was still a well-known junction. It's in the city of Chicago. Since I can't remember the precise details myself (that electrification study is kept in the rare-book room at the Chicago Public Library, and you have to go through security of sorts to look at it), I'll settle for either of two junctions that are pretty close to each other.
Another hint--there may be a tie-in to another thread recently showing up on the Forum.
Nobody's guessed Deval yet, and that's all there is. But the Canadian line runs generally south and north more than southwest - northwest, so I'm not at all sure. - a. s.
KCSfan wrote: Murphy Siding wrote: KCSfan wrote: Sorry about the Milwaukee Road guys but the Pacific in its name, Chicago Milwaukee St. Paul & Pacific, rules it out.Mark Wasn't the *& Pacific* added around 1906? Before that, wouldn't it have been the Chicago, Milwaukee & St. Paul Rairoad?You're right Murphy it was formerly the Chicago MIlwaukee & St. Paul. Like you I thought the Pacific was added when the Pacific Coast Extension was completed in 1906-7. I searched Google trying to confirm this. The only reference I could find stated that it was "reorganized in 1927 into the Chicago Milwaukee St. Paul & Pacific Railroad Company" but that source didn't say if it CM&StP up to that time. Mark
Murphy Siding wrote: KCSfan wrote: Sorry about the Milwaukee Road guys but the Pacific in its name, Chicago Milwaukee St. Paul & Pacific, rules it out.Mark Wasn't the *& Pacific* added around 1906? Before that, wouldn't it have been the Chicago, Milwaukee & St. Paul Rairoad?
KCSfan wrote: Sorry about the Milwaukee Road guys but the Pacific in its name, Chicago Milwaukee St. Paul & Pacific, rules it out.Mark
Sorry about the Milwaukee Road guys but the Pacific in its name, Chicago Milwaukee St. Paul & Pacific, rules it out.
You're right Murphy it was formerly the Chicago MIlwaukee & St. Paul. Like you I thought the Pacific was added when the Pacific Coast Extension was completed in 1906-7. I searched Google trying to confirm this. The only reference I could find stated that it was "reorganized in 1927 into the Chicago Milwaukee St. Paul & Pacific Railroad Company" but that source didn't say if it CM&StP up to that time.
The "Pacific" was added after the 1927 reorganization. Before that, CM&StP was the name, the nickname was "The St. Paul Road." The western portions I believe were constructed by the Chicago, Milwaukee & Puget Sound. IIRC, one (or more) of the tunnel portals out west had CM&PS initials.
Jeff
Right railroad (B&OCT), one right end-point (Franklin Park), but you're going in the wrong direction. Forest Preserve Drive goes northeast from the Franklin Park area. Zeph has also given you a fantastic hint.
KCSfan wrote: CShaveRR wrote: al-in-chgo wrote:WAG time! It was a branch of the Chicago Great Western that ran from Rondout to Aurora. Wrong on all counts?? - a.s. Nice try, Al! Think local affiliate of a major eastern railroad.With this hint two possibilites come to mind. Either an extension of the IHB from Manheim to Bensenville or the B&OCTRR from Franklin Park to Bensenville.Mark
CShaveRR wrote: al-in-chgo wrote:WAG time! It was a branch of the Chicago Great Western that ran from Rondout to Aurora. Wrong on all counts?? - a.s. Nice try, Al! Think local affiliate of a major eastern railroad.
al-in-chgo wrote:WAG time! It was a branch of the Chicago Great Western that ran from Rondout to Aurora. Wrong on all counts?? - a.s.
Nice try, Al! Think local affiliate of a major eastern railroad.
With this hint two possibilites come to mind. Either an extension of the IHB from Manheim to Bensenville or the B&OCTRR from Franklin Park to Bensenville.
CShaveRR wrote: al-in-chgo wrote:WAG time! It was a branch of the Chicago Great Western that ran from Rondout to Aurora. Wrong on all counts?? - a.s.Nice try, Al! Think local affiliate of a major eastern railroad.
CShaveRR wrote: Nice try, Al! Think local affiliate of a major eastern railroad.
Lake Shore and Michigan Southern Railway
Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.