One "inconvenient truth" is that I was pretty much forced into brass by what I perceived as the quality failings of some HO plastic. Without going down the road of singling out and trashing various manufacturers, I was simply not happy with what is readily available in rtr plastic form. Tried lots and lots of it and was unhappy. The reason I have traded so much is not that I like the hunt, as some assume, but that I was unhappy with the quality of plastic. I especially don't care for wavy fall off the body handrails. (Yes I fixed some by custom bending piano wire to replace them, but shouldn't have to do that all the time).
So quality has a price, and it may not be cheap, but I can actually be happy with the brass.
I never said brass was for everyone.
This thread was for thoughts about brass locomotives, right? So anyone who does not care or is otherwise not interested in brass...well nobody is holding a weapon to force them to read or contribute here.
I do wish there was a place for brass fans to hangout, and I would love to see more scratchbuilt or homebuilt brass models, from those who care to share them.
The NdeM handbuilt 4-8-4 over on brasstrains website is a beautiful model and worthy of appreciation.
John
Howard Zane Brass models are available not only in model raliroading, but also in ships, planes, automotive, heavy equipment...and have I missed any? Brass trains have never been marketed as mainstream except during the 60's and well into the mid 80's when PFM always had a full page ad on the rear cover of MR along with other importers in other magazines.......but always as an upgrade for afficiandos who appreciated them and who could afford brass. There is really no need to disuss the pros and cons of brass trains. Admittedly they are not for everyone and they were never meant to be.....sort of like anything of extrodinary quality be it housing, yachts, cars, jewelry, etc. HZ
Brass models are available not only in model raliroading, but also in ships, planes, automotive, heavy equipment...and have I missed any? Brass trains have never been marketed as mainstream except during the 60's and well into the mid 80's when PFM always had a full page ad on the rear cover of MR along with other importers in other magazines.......but always as an upgrade for afficiandos who appreciated them and who could afford brass. There is really no need to disuss the pros and cons of brass trains. Admittedly they are not for everyone and they were never meant to be.....sort of like anything of extrodinary quality be it housing, yachts, cars, jewelry, etc.
HZ
Howard, I agree completely. There is however what people can afford, should afford, and what they choose to afford. Clearly, if you saw any of the deleted posts, you know our host does not want us to go down that road.
John spends a lot of time on here "selling" the virtues of brass. I just play devils advocate, because as you say, it's not for everyone.
Being concerned with the future resale value of a model train would spoil that purchase and the hobby for me. The few brass locos I own have been modified, kit bashed, and freelance painted beyond any recognition of their original forms. Most of them now have Bachmann tenders..........
They would be of no value to me otherwise.
Yet in every conversation about some plastic/die cast loco, John reminds us how "cheap" they are and how brass would be a better "investment". At the risk of being censored again, my "investment" money is in real estate......
I live in a quality house built over 100 years ago, I drive nice cars, I own a superior quality garden tractor that still works perfectly after 20 years of service. I don't need any lectures on quality.
But I also understand the theory of deminishing returns as it applies to a lot of products in our culture........
Sometimes, the enemy of good is "better"........
Sheldon
Certainly I would have more respect for the vette restored by owners own hand.
I also appreciate fine models regardless of whose hands built them, even if built by little green aliens, and quite honestly the only scratchbuilt steam power I have ever seen in my entire life...well I can't name very many at all. John Glaab showed some early Japanese brass handbuilts, and they were neat, but usually not engines I had a particular interest in at the time.
Brasstrains has a neat NdeM engine, one of a kind, and the price on it is currently $1795. I think it is the late 4-8-4. It is very well done indeed.
Handbuilt pilot models? I have handled a few.
But truly scratchbuilt steam, has been rare. Kinda hard to appreciate what I can't see. Maybe some folks will post some photos?
PRR8259 Oh by all means if you think you can build it then go ahead and post periodic updates so that others can see and be inspired and maybe try themselves. There is room for all of us. Perhaps my many posts here are somewhat of a reaction to the perception that brass collectors are somehow not "real" model railroaders, not in your posts, but in others. There are folks like Howard Zane who just love brass and do "collect" it, yet at the same time he has an amazing layout where a hundred or more engines are required just to operate it. Howard's attitude is that everything is for sale if somebody only wants to pony up and pay the right price. So it is not a crime, and I am not a model railroading heretic for desiring to buy the occasional model with the idea from the beginning being that I will hold it a couple years, play with it a little bit, and make a profit.That just makes me different from some.
Oh by all means if you think you can build it then go ahead and post periodic updates so that others can see and be inspired and maybe try themselves. There is room for all of us.
Perhaps my many posts here are somewhat of a reaction to the perception that brass collectors are somehow not "real" model railroaders, not in your posts, but in others. There are folks like Howard Zane who just love brass and do "collect" it, yet at the same time he has an amazing layout where a hundred or more engines are required just to operate it. Howard's attitude is that everything is for sale if somebody only wants to pony up and pay the right price.
So it is not a crime, and I am not a model railroading heretic for desiring to buy the occasional model with the idea from the beginning being that I will hold it a couple years, play with it a little bit, and make a profit.That just makes me different from some.
John, you don't have to keep defending your version of this hobby.
But, you are also not likely to sell many people on it either...........
There are great craftsman in this hobby who are also brass collectors.......and then there are those who are only brass collectors........and there are those who are at every possible place in between those two positions.
Personally, I'm not into serial ownership. To take it out of this hobby for a minute, serial ownership is the guy who buys a boat, uses it 3 seasons, looks at it in the yard for two more, sells it and buys a motorcycle, rides it for two seasons, puts it on the front yard and sells it. Uses the cash as a down payment on an RV, buys a 30-6, takes the RV on hunting trips.......for three seasons, sells the RV, lets the 30-6 get rusty in the back of the closet.......and so on.
Admittedly it is a life style choice I simply don't understand, but in the big picture, I don't care what others do with their money, but don't look for my praise or approval for each new purchase and adventure.......
That loco that you will sell off, I will keep and leave to my son, along with model railroad items his grandfather left me. My son was close to his grandfather before he passed away, I think my son will appreciate those things. He is not really a model railroader now, but he does have an interest in trains, hopefully he will be happy to have mine and my fathers stuff and pass it on to his son. If not, that's OK, it's only "stuff" and I have had lots of fun with it.
You have told us you are not really a model builder, that's fine. Others are, and that is their main focus in the hobby, not just what they can buy......
Another example - cars, I like cars, especially old ones, and fast ones. I have restored and built a few in my time. Built a '63 Nova convertible that would go 135 mph and do 14 sec in the 1/4 mile......when I was only 20. I have the skills to rebuild engines, do body work, etc. I will admit it is a hobby I have largely moved on from actual participation.
But, you introduce me to two guys, one has bought himself a brand new Corvette, the other has restored a 1958 Corvette with mostly his own hands......I will have more in common with the guy who restored the '58........even though I drive a new car that is pretty fast.
My fast new car, a 2015 FORD FLEX LIMITED with Eccoboost, 360 HP, twin turbos, 14 sec 1/4 mile, etc - but so what? Anybody with $50,000 can have one. I drive it because its design and comfort fits our personal needs, and because it is fast and fun and I have the money. I understand that most other people don't really care about my expensive high performance station wagon. I don't need or expect them to care.....if they do ask, I will explain my choice and why I like it so much......I don't need them to like it.
And when it comes to this hobby and other people, I am much more interested in the model building others are doing than in what they are buying........
Unfortunetly, they are not making many Boston and Maine or Maine Central prototypes in todays brass. And if they did, the price point would be extremely high (likely to relatively low volume seller anyway, so limited run with high price). No I am not trying to turn this into "this hobby is so expensive".
Ive decided to build what I cant buy. I think I can reverse engineer the plans in the MR articles (OCT 1997-May 1998), to create something close enough.
BMMECNYC--
With a little help from my dad, I built a Bowser ex-PRR L-1s 2-8-2 which Bowser's in-house painter then painted and lettered Santa Fe for me (ATSF bought 3 during WWII). I am nowhere near the capabilities of the Boo Rim craftsman and would never be happy with something I built that could never approach the quality of what is being built today. You can pick up these exceptionally well detailed models and stuff does not fall off like it did 30 years ago with Korean brass then.
Some of today's brass is being designed specifically so that operation on 24" radii is acceptable. They are smaller more compact engines like the Rock Island 2-8-2. So far it is the only recent run that the instructions say is good for 24", but I am sure the plethora of SP smaller steam will also do 24", which is below my radii.
I am with Sheldon except I got rid of a lot of stuff because the new stuff was better than the old and got rid of anything that did not run well out of the box (except for a few brass). Since I ussually bought at a good price, I at least broke even on most stuff (except for some brass that I sold).
PRR8259 riogrande5761-- I was not trying to say that you don't use goal setting, smart shopping, etc., so I hope you didn't take it that way. As applied to brass models, I've seen on other forums/topics people discussing buying an entire fleet of say as many as 50 of those new Scale Trains tank cars...then I can't help but wonder if some of them might be among those who say "I can't afford brass"...when in reality they are just buying what they like, period. To me, anybody that can afford 50 or so of a new state-of-the-art freight car really wouldn't have any issue affording the occasional brass model. It's a question of priorities: Do you need a massive fleet of this, that and the other thing? Or would a few lesser items, but of high value or quality, achieve the same level of enjoyment/bang-for-the-buck? I think we all answer that question in different ways. The only thing I'm not happy about with the new brass hybrid is it has a bit of a noisy drivetrain... John
riogrande5761--
I was not trying to say that you don't use goal setting, smart shopping, etc., so I hope you didn't take it that way.
As applied to brass models, I've seen on other forums/topics people discussing buying an entire fleet of say as many as 50 of those new Scale Trains tank cars...then I can't help but wonder if some of them might be among those who say "I can't afford brass"...when in reality they are just buying what they like, period. To me, anybody that can afford 50 or so of a new state-of-the-art freight car really wouldn't have any issue affording the occasional brass model.
It's a question of priorities: Do you need a massive fleet of this, that and the other thing? Or would a few lesser items, but of high value or quality, achieve the same level of enjoyment/bang-for-the-buck?
I think we all answer that question in different ways.
The only thing I'm not happy about with the new brass hybrid is it has a bit of a noisy drivetrain...
So 10 months ago you posed a question. Well in my case running my 40 car trains is what makes me happy. So one loco and 10 freight cars, no matter how nice, is simply not going to do it for me.
Those 40 car freight trains need power, lots of it. Most steam trains on my layout are pulled by double headers, most diesel trains by 3-4 unit lashups.
With staging for 30 trains, average of three locos per train, 130 powered units is not really all that many locos. And 30 trains times 40 cars........well actually some are passenger trains, so about 800 freight cars and almost 200 passenger cars........
Piggyback flat cars alone, I have enough for an east bound train, a west bound train, and a train worth in the yard......
Truthfully, I'm pretty much done buying locos and rolling stock, there are only a few items left on my rolling stock/loco wish list.
John, buying and selling "used", or previously owned NIB stuff is a hobby all of its own that does not interest me. I know what I like and want, so I don't have anything I "don't need anymore" or are "bored with".
Maybe you did OK, good for you, but simply keeping your money in your pocket for what you "really" want seems so much easier to me.
I don't own any Rapido passenger cars, likely never will, not on my want list. I don't need to own a few to know that, rare or not.....
Don't need any Boo Rim steamers either.......
But, I don't "collect" model trains, I'm building a model railroad..........
And, respectfully, I likely have a different view of children and model trains than you do. My 5 year old grandson has his own seperate Bachmann Thomas and Chuggington, my son, now 32, had his own LIONEL layout in his room starting at age 5, seperate from my trains. He had bunk beds, slept on the top, trains on the bottom.
Never worried about the value of a train after I bought it, never lost money on any, because I never really sold off any........never changed scale, era, roadname, so nothing has ever become "obsolete". One goal, one focus.......
I still have structures and rolling stock on my layout that my father bought when I was a child.....and that I bought as a teen......and I will leave it all to my son.......
PRR8259Open to learning more,
If you cant find it, have you considered building it yourself? I've found that the particular things I am looking for are probably not going to ever be made in plastic or brass, so I will have to make them myself.
March, 2017 Update:
After much running, and a second application by myself of lubricant to the gearbox, the BLI GN S-2 4-8-4 hybrid runs much better than I previously reported. It is still not quiet, at least not compared to the recent (full brass) models from Boo Rim, and the gear noise can still drown out the sound, but it is much improved from what it was. There was no evidence of any unusual gear wear patterns. Also, my son wanted it and asked me to keep it and sell plastic steamers instead, so how could I not let him have it? I just learned today that the prototype was capable of above 100 mph running, and the BLI model certainly does not disappoint in the speed end--especially compared to the other brass models out there, which generally, for new stuff, are geared to run s-l-o-w-ly. For those who want to run alot, the BLI engines can be a good value for the money.
I have spent the last year diligently researching what is out there on the market in ho brass or hybrid steam, frequently checking brasstrains website, and the evil auction sites. I have a pretty good idea, now, of exactly what I want to buy and what they are allegedly worth, but there are surprises like the Boo Rim steamer just listed on Ebay for $650 less than what both myself and another buyer just paid to buy the same engine from brasstrains...can't let that one get away.
So I guess I have to be more selective in buying, and troll Ebay more as there can be good value on there.
In the last year I have thinned my HO plastic down to just 10 freight cars and a Proto ATSF GP-7 "beater engine". Sheldon can laugh all he wants, but selling little used plastic Rapido (rare) passenger cars (no longer needed by my son) and all kinds of other stuff netted me over $1600 and paid for a really nice Boo Rim steamer. I'd sell the stuff again, too. I'm just happier running my admittedly small but growing roster of (hybrid and brass) steam. I have a mint, little used pro trumpet that will also convert nicely to brass steam, as I no longer play...
Now, are there any online forums or websites just for HO brass train aficionados? I found one but it appears to be very little patronized, if at all. Are there any others? Where online do the real collectors hang out? Or do they just not bother online, and prefer to remain anonymous?
Open to learning more,
jecorbett dknelson tstage Dave & jecorbett, I've used both the X-acto aluminum miter box with their precision razor saw blade and the NWSL Chopper II to make precision cuts: Tom Tom and jec: the Miter Box from Micro Mark I was talking about is their new one, hardly thicker than my little finger:. They called it the world's smallest miter box and just introduced it. Here is their description: Our Micro Miter Box is sized exclusively for model builders working with micro-size materials. Make the finest 30, 45 and 90 degree miter cuts you've ever seen in wood, metal and plastic strips, rods and tubes up to .235 inch wide x any length! Excellent for cutting brass tubing . . . especially very short pieces used for mast bands and other items. Includes adjustable stop for making duplicate cuts quickly and easily. Works best with our Ultra Fine Saw Blades (#85853, sold separately). Approx. 3-9/16 inches long x 5/8 inches wide x 3/16 inch high. But now I see from their website it is sold out and discontinued! Sorry for the dead end recommendation. Dave Nelson Dave, I was going to ask if you had actually used it but that seems pointless now. As I was reading the description I thought I was going to have to choose between that set up and their power mini-chopsaw. I guess the decision has been made for me. Although $73 is a lot to pay for something I don't think I will use that much, I think it will be quite a time saver in addition to giving me precision square cuts so that might make it worthwhile. The project I have in mind is a large 12" x 13" hotel with lots of timber framing. It's been quite a while since I've had to cut a lot of 1/8" lumber but my recollection is it takes quite a few passes with the razor saw to cut clean through it. I can see a power saw saving me many hours as well as giving me much cleaner cuts.
dknelson tstage Dave & jecorbett, I've used both the X-acto aluminum miter box with their precision razor saw blade and the NWSL Chopper II to make precision cuts: Tom Tom and jec: the Miter Box from Micro Mark I was talking about is their new one, hardly thicker than my little finger:. They called it the world's smallest miter box and just introduced it. Here is their description: Our Micro Miter Box is sized exclusively for model builders working with micro-size materials. Make the finest 30, 45 and 90 degree miter cuts you've ever seen in wood, metal and plastic strips, rods and tubes up to .235 inch wide x any length! Excellent for cutting brass tubing . . . especially very short pieces used for mast bands and other items. Includes adjustable stop for making duplicate cuts quickly and easily. Works best with our Ultra Fine Saw Blades (#85853, sold separately). Approx. 3-9/16 inches long x 5/8 inches wide x 3/16 inch high. But now I see from their website it is sold out and discontinued! Sorry for the dead end recommendation. Dave Nelson
tstage Dave & jecorbett, I've used both the X-acto aluminum miter box with their precision razor saw blade and the NWSL Chopper II to make precision cuts: Tom
Dave & jecorbett,
I've used both the X-acto aluminum miter box with their precision razor saw blade and the NWSL Chopper II to make precision cuts:
Tom
Dave,
I was going to ask if you had actually used it but that seems pointless now. As I was reading the description I thought I was going to have to choose between that set up and their power mini-chopsaw. I guess the decision has been made for me. Although $73 is a lot to pay for something I don't think I will use that much, I think it will be quite a time saver in addition to giving me precision square cuts so that might make it worthwhile. The project I have in mind is a large 12" x 13" hotel with lots of timber framing. It's been quite a while since I've had to cut a lot of 1/8" lumber but my recollection is it takes quite a few passes with the razor saw to cut clean through it. I can see a power saw saving me many hours as well as giving me much cleaner cuts.
Hello tstage--
Yes, thank you, I have sent engines back to BLI before...removed bottom cover plate (only 5 screws). Lubrication appears to be adequate though only some kind of clear (colorless) oil. Metal gears look to be ok. Added Labelle 106 grease with teflon. I think these just are very noisy gears - metal on metal. They are relatively quiet at low speed (for instance at the speeds used in Youtube video reviews) but at higher speeds there appears to be considerable noise.
Absolutely gorgeous model in appearance. I think I'd still buy it and just live with the noise. Wish they didn't bother with the sound though. My Kato track tends to amplify any drivetrain noises, but...
If I had the cash I'd probably buy another one anyway.
John,
I forgot to mention that all of the repairs were FREE of charge.
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
On the bright side, the difference between even the brass hybrids and the regular diecast/plastic models is truly huge...night and day.
My 9 year old son just loves the brass hybrid with its outstanding glacier green paint scheme. The soldering, while a couple out of the way imperfections are there, is much cleaner than even what Ajin Precision was doing on steam power for Overland Models and others a decade or so ago, and this is delivered at a great price.
So having one brass hybrid on hand, from a detail perspective, does actually make me desire to have all my steam power looking that good.
Best Regards--
PRR8259 Hello don7 and others-- Thanks for the suggestion. I'll only send something back if there's real problems, as this looks like an easily damaged model, cosmetically speaking. Sometimes it's better to try to run them in. We'll see what happens after more running time...it's still a noisy drivetrain for me, but is running more smoothly than it was before. John
Hello don7 and others--
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll only send something back if there's real problems, as this looks like an easily damaged model, cosmetically speaking. Sometimes it's better to try to run them in.
We'll see what happens after more running time...it's still a noisy drivetrain for me, but is running more smoothly than it was before.
FWIW, I would contact BLI via e-mail and describe to them your problem(s) and what you've tried so far. They may have some additional suggestions for you to try, or may tell you to box it up and send it into them for repair. I prefer the e-mail approach because it then documents the issues for them in writting (paper trail) vs. describing it over the phone, which can easily be forgotten.
I've sent 2 or 3 BLI steamers back to BLI for repair (because they arrived with either a decoder or machanical problem) and they have repaired each of them to my satisfaction. You may have to wait a few weeks before it returns but it's worth a better operating steamer. Sending it back also helps BLI know what QA issues need to be tightened up for future runs.
Well, I told myself that I could never afford brass and I didn't want to deal with getting them to run properly. Then up comes an eBay listing for a beautifully painted Dominion Atlantic 4-6-0, and it is named 'Dave'. According to the seller it runs very well.
I put in a bid in the vain hope that it might go cheap, but alas the highest bid is now twice what I offered.
Oh well, that's life. I'm disappointed but not heartbroken.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Hopefully, BLI will send one of the new GN S-2 hybrides to Model Railroader for their review and we can tell if if excess noise is typical or limited to a few of these models.
You comments that while hauling a few cars the noise drowns out the sound sure is not representitive of my locomotives, good sound, minimum electric motor noise.
Have you checked your gears, I remember a few years ago Bachmann was having problems, they used way too much gear lube on a few of their engines, this resulted in excess noise as well.
As far as the sound quality, my sound is every bit as good as the promo video from BLI on the S2 engine.
https://www.facebook.com/BroadwayLimited/videos
FYI, I was very recently in contact with BLI and after talking to the rep, your sound problem is not typical of that model. Give BLI a call or fill out one of their service requests. They will help you sort out the sound problem you are experiencing.
I cleaned the tender wheels to remove any grime whatsoever and ran the GN S-2 4-8-4 some more last night. The motor and drivetrain are indeed "noisy". As speed is increased, the noise becomes more noticeable. The engine may be "running in". However, at passenger train speeds of say 70 or 80 smph, whether in DC or DCC, the gear noise is sufficient to drown out the sound.
I do not have a decibel meter, but this S-2's drivetrain seems to be very nearly twice as loud with extraneous noise as the two new BLI H10s 2-8-0's on hand, which are indeed quiet.
My son wants it to stay, so we'll see if it runs better after it gets more time on it.
PRR8259 riogrande5761-- I was not trying to say that you don't use goal setting, smart shopping, etc., so I hope you didn't take it that way. As applied to brass models, I've seen on other forums/topics people discussing buying an entire fleet of say as many as 50 of those new Scale Trains tank cars...then I can't help but wonder if some of them might be among those who say "I can't afford brass"...when in reality they are just buying what they like, period. To me, anybody that can afford 50 or so of a new state-of-the-art freight car really wouldn't have any issue affording the occasional brass model. It's a question of priorities: Do you need a massive fleet of this, that and the other thing? Or would a few lesser items, but of high value or quality, achieve the same level of enjoyment/bang-for-the-buck? I think we all answer that question in different ways. Personally, I'm now very disappointed in a brand new BLI Brass Hybrid GN 4-8-4. It looks amazing but runs poorly in comparison to my other BLI engines that cost half as much. The motor noise is so loud in both DCC and DC that it drowns out the sound system. The model surges as the throttle is advanced in either DC or DCC mode--the speed curve is not what I would call "smooth". There seem to be issues with either the chuff sensor or the calibration of it, as the sound appears to be erratic. The BLI brass hybrid simply does not run as well as their heavier diecast offerings like the 2-8-0. Clean track, clean wheels and copious amounts of electrically conductive lubricant on the track, combined with checking the plug, did not result in an improvement of the performance of the brass hybrid. As I sit here tonight, I may never try another "brass hybrid" after being so disgusted with this one. It's making the full out all-brass models appear to be a generally better value! John
Personally, I'm now very disappointed in a brand new BLI Brass Hybrid GN 4-8-4. It looks amazing but runs poorly in comparison to my other BLI engines that cost half as much. The motor noise is so loud in both DCC and DC that it drowns out the sound system. The model surges as the throttle is advanced in either DC or DCC mode--the speed curve is not what I would call "smooth". There seem to be issues with either the chuff sensor or the calibration of it, as the sound appears to be erratic. The BLI brass hybrid simply does not run as well as their heavier diecast offerings like the 2-8-0. Clean track, clean wheels and copious amounts of electrically conductive lubricant on the track, combined with checking the plug, did not result in an improvement of the performance of the brass hybrid.
As I sit here tonight, I may never try another "brass hybrid" after being so disgusted with this one. It's making the full out all-brass models appear to be a generally better value!
I bought a couple of the new Hybride S2 BLI Great Northern engines and have had no problems with mine.
After a initial breakin period I cleaned all of the lubricants from the drivers and then applied a small amount of Nano Oil to the axles and also to the rod assemblies.
As far as the motor itself, it is almost silent with the sound turned off, I can barely hear the motor. Perhaps this is your problem. In regard to the sound I have no complaints at all, in fact I am very impressed with the quality of the sound in my two engines. I really think that you should be getting in touch with BLI.
These locomotives in my opinion have as good running characteristics as my other steam BLI locomotives.
Perhaps there is something wrong with your locomotive. Check with BLI. I have no complaints at all with my S2 hybrids. If BLI produces any more that would suite my layout roster I would buy them immediately.
I can echo the sentiments about being focused in one's model railroading goals. Though I've had many dreams of basement empires, I elected to stick to a narrow and tight focus concerning prototypes. I love Pennsy steam in the early '50s and passenger train operations so I'm sticking with that and not much else. I've found it helpful in many ways to be so tightly focused and create a quality collection vs. A large one without much focus. That's just what works for me personally. Aside the trains I love collecting miniature autos, and Preiser figure sets. Though both would fit in with the train models of course.
Alvie
doctorwayne Since most brass locomotives arrived here already built, it's unlikely that you'll find any drawings or service instructions. Each model would have been handcrafted. Basic disassembly of most of them is pretty simple. usually two machine screws at the rear plate beneath the cab, and one up through the frame and cylinders and into the smokebox. If there's a lead truck, it will probably need to be removed to gain access to the latter screw. Make sketches as you take it apart and keep track of where each screw is supposed to go - this will aid in re-assembly. Wayne
Since most brass locomotives arrived here already built, it's unlikely that you'll find any drawings or service instructions. Each model would have been handcrafted.
Basic disassembly of most of them is pretty simple. usually two machine screws at the rear plate beneath the cab, and one up through the frame and cylinders and into the smokebox. If there's a lead truck, it will probably need to be removed to gain access to the latter screw. Make sketches as you take it apart and keep track of where each screw is supposed to go - this will aid in re-assembly.
Wayne
Thanks for the timely response Wayne, ...and the good advice.
Ed
I have two brass steam locos that require disassembly, testing and repair. A Key ACL P5 Pacific and an Overland SR 2-8-0. They have not been run or disassembled since my acquisition years ago. Where can I view/acquire an exploded schematic of these models before I tackle this task. There's no hobby shop nearby. Thanks for any help.
Well, born during 1968, I have always been primarily a "diesel guy", but have at times dabbled in steam. To make the story short: there were recent Athearn Genesis and also rtr diesels that I really really wanted to buy, but their absolutely deplorable QA/QC resulted in my saying "you know, I might as well just do steam and buy what I like/can actually get in brass". I know there's engines I can't get or the layout won't accommodate, but, why not?
Funny thing is, the Athearn Genesis steam is actually better on the QA/QC end than the diesels--generally much much better. Perhaps it's the complex paint jobs and masking on the diesels that get them, I don't fully understand (that and the sloppy glue issues).
In any case, I'm 47 and trying to make the switch to a mostly brass steam-oriented railroad. I've been on the diesel "wagon" for about 8 months now, and even my son is down to just one ACL purple/silver E8A. It's the last diesel we have, and will stay to pull an ACL consist...
Paul--thank you, your comments about the fine New Haven hybrids are duly noted.
Yes John... I do get it. Really it depends - even goal setting and prioritizing would not have allowed me to model steam era D&RGW in past years; I wouldn't have been able to afford it - trust me - it would have taken several years of saving all of my modeling budget just to get one older issue brass steam engine and then it ain't no good it there is no rolling stock or track or anything else. Any way you roll it, brass does require some scratch. My budget is a little better in the past ten years so probably, if I sold most of my fleet and got educated and a new set of skills, I might be able to manage something now, but I don't have an interest in modeling steam era so it's moot.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
John,And yet the BLI I-5 and I-4 brass hybrids are gems right out of the box. They are superb models in both looks and operation.
Don't be so quick to dismiss brass hybrids based on one example. All manufacturers make lemons from time to time. I've had an Atlas H16-44 that buzzed very loudly at low speeds, but every other Atlas I've owned has been a great runner. If I had bought that H16-44 that buzzed first and then sworn off Atlas because of it, I'd of missed out on the couple dozen Atlas engines that I really enjoy.
Paul A. Cutler III