"Looks like it's about that time again..."
[Locked]
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
I try to avoid these "end of the hobby as we know it" and the "all the hobby shops are closing" threads since they tend to be extremely repetitive, pointless and usually degenerate into name calling.
However, I would like to mention two things: My wife's hobby is salt water reef aquariums. We now have to drive 200 miles to buy fish and coral as ALL of the area aquarium stores have closed. She buys almost all of her tanks and filters from online sources. My other big interest is golf. All of the golf forums that I go to are also infected with doom and gloom about the future of golf in the US. Golf stores are closing left and right. Large amounts of golf equipment is bought online. Numerous golf courses including one in my back yard have closed and are growing back to nature.
My points are this: (1) The internet has changed the way we spend money on our leisure activities. Sellers will need to adapt to this fact or perish. (2) The economy has decreased our spending on leisure activities across all hobbies and leisure activities. Why should model trains be any different. I do not believe that this hobby is dying any more than I believe that salt water aquariums are dying or that golf is dying. - Nevin
BRAKIE No,John the hobby is not dying as you repeatedly imply but,never give any hard facts or figures..
No,John the hobby is not dying as you repeatedly imply but,never give any hard facts or figures..
Larry, you know very well that I presented plenty of cited documentation repeatedly in multi-page threads here in the past, only to be assailed by hobby dabblers who demonstrated a total lack of any knowledge of the hobby's past, or current, status. Nevertheless and lacking anything to substantiate their opinions, they insisted that none of the figures I located could be true. So now I simply advise those honestly interested to search out the earlier threads on the subject.
I think that you are likewise aware that absolutely no one, including yourself, has ever provided a shred of documented countering information, only an endless stream of largely baseless personal opinions, presented as fact, that the situation is other than what I indicate. Quite honestly, it is the often juvenile approach to the hobby exhibited by many here that has caused most of the serious hobbyists that once frequented this site to have abandoned it. What can I say?
CNJ831
0-6-0 Hello they best way to make the hobby grow is to tell people about it. I have read more then once were somebody said they don't talk about there hobby for one reason or another. If you want more people to get involved you have to show or tell them about it. All my friends know I am in to trains and most have seen my layout. I even got one of them into a small garden layout. I don't understand how any of the numbers could be right if some of us wont tell anyone we have trains? Have a nice day Frank
Hello they best way to make the hobby grow is to tell people about it. I have read more then once were somebody said they don't talk about there hobby for one reason or another. If you want more people to get involved you have to show or tell them about it. All my friends know I am in to trains and most have seen my layout. I even got one of them into a small garden layout.
I don't understand how any of the numbers could be right if some of us wont tell anyone we have trains? Have a nice day Frank
Thanks, Frank! THAT"S a positive contribution. Anybody else have something positive to say?
I love the cartoon of Chicken Little staring into the sky. As the story goes...Chicken little ran up to the farmer who was playing with his train set and yelled..."The sky is falling! The sky is falling!" Now what do you think the farmer thought?
"Holy @#^&, a talking chicken!!"
HZ
Walleye The postings on this topic are fascinating! The original posting is a pessimistic prediction that our hobby is in decline, that it may soon fade away. Most of the other posters seem to agree. A few take issue with the premise. But, 55 long, detailed posts later, no one has tried to suggest a solution! 55 active model railroaders found the time to write about how the End is near, but nobody could offer one idea for what they, I, or anyone else could do about it. I had a boss once who had a term for this kind of thinking. He called it “admiring the problem.” Personally, I’m not in the doom-sayers’ camp. But it really doesn’t matter who is right on this. The future will tell us that soon enough. Meanwhile, if you think the hobby is in decline, for Heaven’s sake, tell us what you think can be done to revitalize it. Because we already have 55 obituaries. One more won't help at all.
I'm always amazed how these discussions get off topic. As the co-promotor of a fairly large mid-Atlantic train show (www.gsmts.com) , I have learned to welcome and be thankful to anyone who comes through the gate....not giving a hoot if he plays "Lionel style" on the floor with his butt facing the heavens or is giving the late John Allen a run for his money. Many have entered into our hobby with a loop of brass snap track and a Tyco train set. Many do upgrade and eventually become serious model rails, but in proportion to their abilities and talent. That is fine as we all can not be great artists or modelers. The point is to have fun. A talk-down approach to entry level (RTR) folks is not going to grow model railroading.
One of my favorite activities is scratch-building structures of my own designs. When companies like Walther's and others started offering ready to plant buildings, I was aghast at first, but it did not take me long to realize that these RTR buidings were a plus. It allowed many folks to enhance their layouts without tackling something that for now could have been intimidating. A good chance exists that entry level model rails will expand their horizons and eventually build stuff, but again what is important is these folks have joined our hobby and are patronizing shops, shows, and on line businesses.
Like it or not, those who gleefully support this recent RTR trend are increasingly pushing the hobby back to becoming simply an HO version of playing with Lionels...a juvenile, not an adult, pursuit. The RTR trend really indicates a lack of talent, skills and ability, or any real interest beyond simply playing with trains, among its newer practitioners (and even some of its older ones, too!). The hobby of "adult scale model railroading", as MR referred to it, is a very different hobby from that. You need to face the fact that the very nature of what we term model railroading is its involvement with craftsmanship...far more than just running miniature trains in little circles
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John,Now you're sounding like the scratch builders when plastic kits and brass steam locomotives became the norm.Sheesh!
I think today's models and layouts is superior to anything done in the past by the so called "craftsmen" and if a craftsmen is a modeler that builds the high dollar "craftsmen kits" that looks like something from the "Popeye" movie then I will gladly stick with my plastic buildings,RTR cars and locomotives.
However,true craftsmen been gone for years-they died with my dad's generation of modelers..Anybody that can take tin or brass stock, some Kemtron parts and make a locomotive is a true craftsmen other then that he's a glorified "craftsmen" kit builder.
As I mention its no longer the hobby I grew up with.The hobby has changed with each new generation of hobbyist.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
Lake Thanks, Brakie and Andre for some common sense based on reality. In my opinion, I don't know how CNJ831 gets his way of thinking but its 2010 not 1953. If there are so few persons buying as he implies how is it that Walthers, Atlas, Kato, Blair Line, and others keep spending money putting out new products. It's because there are far more people buying model train stuff then CNJ831 thinks. A retailer or manufacture does not care if the buyers is a craftsman modeler that is 70 or a 10 year old that may buy less then $100.00 then nothing ever again, all they see are sales.Many do come back to the hobby though as I'm sure many who read the forums have stated. It gets me when I see post about so many manufactures making the same engine, cars, etc. and the poster saying who needs all of them. Well some one must be buying this stuff or it would not be made. I have come to the conclusion that the amount of all people of all ages, and skill levels is far higher then many believe. Probability over a million or even closer to 2 million. Again the people selling the stuff do not care about the reason some one buys the stuff as long as they buy it. Of course many people that start will not stay with it. The same as most other hobbies. Andre, I think your reply to CNJ831 was great. It has every thing to do with the posts he has made. CNJ831 your living in the MRR past really hit a nerve.
Thanks, Brakie and Andre for some common sense based on reality.
In my opinion, I don't know how CNJ831 gets his way of thinking but its 2010 not 1953. If there are so few persons buying as he implies how is it that Walthers, Atlas, Kato, Blair Line, and others keep spending money putting out new products. It's because there are far more people buying model train stuff then CNJ831 thinks. A retailer or manufacture does not care if the buyers is a craftsman modeler that is 70 or a 10 year old that may buy less then $100.00 then nothing ever again, all they see are sales.Many do come back to the hobby though as I'm sure many who read the forums have stated.
It gets me when I see post about so many manufactures making the same engine, cars, etc. and the poster saying who needs all of them. Well some one must be buying this stuff or it would not be made. I have come to the conclusion that the amount of all people of all ages, and skill levels is far higher then many believe. Probability over a million or even closer to 2 million. Again the people selling the stuff do not care about the reason some one buys the stuff as long as they buy it. Of course many people that start will not stay with it. The same as most other hobbies.
Andre, I think your reply to CNJ831 was great. It has every thing to do with the posts he has made. CNJ831 your living in the MRR past really hit a nerve.
Ken, the problem with discussions of this nature revolves around people like yourself and Andre actually not even knowing fact one about the hobby's basis and its history, leaving you without a clue as to the actual situation. It also leads to a host of nonsensical statements like your estimate that there are probably 1 or 2 million model railroaders, when all available evidence points to figures of only 1/10 that number.
Neither do folks like you apparently grasp that limited runs are a direct response to a shrinking market. Were there a million hobbyists it would be counterproductive to do single limited runs of an item. When the market was far larger than today we saw all the manufacturers keep their line of locos and cars in production sometimes over whole decades, because demand was there. That's how you approach a broad market, not with limited runs of a couple of thousand units run once and unlikely to ever be run again. Very limited, one time, runs is about surviving in a shrinking market, not a thriving one.
You complain that I'm living in the past with the idea that the hobby should still be craftsman oriented and that it should change with the times. Again, ignorance of the subject matter clouds your thinking. The hobby of simply playing with miniature trains existed long before "scale model railroading" ever came into existence - it was done with RTR Lionel and their ilk. Scale model railroading intentionally set itself distinctly apart from that juvenile pursuit by its participants creating much of their equipment and far more realistic layouts. This remained the unchanging situation from the 30's up until just about 15 years ago, when we saw the rise of an increasing range of RTR items.
Like it or not, those who gleefully support this recent RTR trend are increasingly pushing the hobby back to becoming simply an HO version of playing with Lionels...a juvenile, not an adult, pursuit. The RTR trend really indicates a lack of talent, skills and ability, or any real interest beyond simply playing with trains, among its newer practitioners (and even some of its older ones, too!). The hobby of "adult scale model railroading", as MR referred to it, is a very different hobby from that. You need to face the fact that the very nature of what we term model railroading is its involvement with craftsmanship...far more than just running miniature trains in little circles.
I suppose, this being largely an entry-level crowd, that I expect far too much of participants at being capable of objectively addressing such subjects as this. But perhaps just for a moment consider that if what I say wasn't the truth, don't you think our hosts, who have maintained very detailed surveys of the hobby over the years, would step in and present such countering information at least once in all these associated threads? Wake up, Ken and you other folks!
Of the three hobbie shops that were in my area, all are over 30 miles from my home. my vehicle gets 20 MPG so a round trip costs about $9. Then there is a 7 3/4% sales tax to deal with, $7.75 per $100 spent. The hobby shop of this topic had prices right out of the walthers catalog. When you can get something for 25% to 30% or more off on line, no sales tax, no fuel consumed + 2 1/2 hrs of my time not wasted traveling, for a small shipping charge, why do it.. I'll still travel to the two remaining stores if I need something.
There were two shops that dealt with trains here within 10 miles of me. they also had R/C planes, rockets, R/C cars and boats and other hobbies. They have both closed within the last 1- 1 1/2 years.
The postings on this topic are fascinating! The original posting is a pessimistic prediction that our hobby is in decline, that it may soon fade away. Most of the other posters seem to agree. A few take issue with the premise. But, 55 long, detailed posts later, no one has tried to suggest a solution! 55 active model railroaders found the time to write about how the End is near, but nobody could offer one idea for what they, I, or anyone else could do about it.
I had a boss once who had a term for this kind of thinking. He called it “admiring the problem.”
Personally, I’m not in the doom-sayers’ camp. But it really doesn’t matter who is right on this. The future will tell us that soon enough. Meanwhile, if you think the hobby is in decline, for Heaven’s sake, tell us what you think can be done to revitalize it. Because we already have 55 obituaries. One more won't help at all.
I'm live in the twin city area of Minnesota and have a few hobby shops i visit from time to time. I use to go to one on a regular bases just hear all the guys talk about railroading or model railroading, i thought it was a lot fun.The fun for some reason started to go down hill through the years, i suppose because many maybe were dying off or moved away and i also think the younger generation are to into cell phones and electronic toys and the darn television type games.
I don't go down to the one i always like going to because theirs nobody to talk to even the people that work there seem like they do want to be bothered. Ask a question and they don't know and now that i'm older i can't handle all them steps that leads to the shop and the parking is really bad. So i'm on the internet or on the phone talking to people i have never met in my life. The new world, (sucks)
MerrilyWeRollAlongPerhaps this isn't a trend that's only confined to model railroading. Does anyone have any insight as to how the model airplane and slot/remote controlled cars are doing? Are stores that speciallize in those hobbies closing as well? I would think that the internet and other leisure activities are affecting those hobbies.
Perhaps this isn't a trend that's only confined to model railroading. Does anyone have any insight as to how the model airplane and slot/remote controlled cars are doing? Are stores that speciallize in those hobbies closing as well? I would think that the internet and other leisure activities are affecting those hobbies.
Hobby stores of all kinds seem to be declining, at least in northern Virginia. I haven't been keeping close track, but over the last ten years a number have closed that were more than just trains. I can't think of one that opened.
Paul
Yes, the local small hobby shops are closing and I really do believe that most being a single owner business will close once the owner retires or dies the same as most small specialty shops do. That's they way it has been and the way it will be.Those that don't realize the way selling and buying are moving will never get it. I just don't see the point of wanting every model railroader to do it the way those that started 40 or more years ago did it and still want to do it. I'm over 60 and never want to build rolling stock, engines or even buildings from scratch. From what I see being made sold, the manufactures have come to the conclusion that persons getting into the hobby now days do not want to do it either. Of course to some it means the death of the hobby.
Ken G Price My N-Scale Layout
Digitrax Super Empire Builder Radio System. South Valley Texas Railroad. SVTRR
N-Scale out west. 1996-1998 or so! UP, SP, Missouri Pacific, C&NW.
Like everyone else I don't like to see another LHS closing. However, and don't hate me for this, I am a strong proponent of e-commerce on the Internet due to my location. Living deep in farm land it is a minimum 3 hour round trip to a decent hobby shop in the city. If there was a LHS in my little farm town I certainly would support them. But with the cost of gas and time I simply don't have the luxury of popping into a hobby shop on a moments notice. For me the Internet is vastly more practical. Add to this all my experiences with online vendors to date have been as good or better than the LHS that is a road trip away. Shucks, my Internet purchases probably are supporting a brick-n-mortar store in someone's neighborhood. It's just not mine!
Alan
Freelancing the LK&O Railroad
CNJ831sandusky This last guy takes the cake and I have vowed NEVER to support his store in any way; but most of them seemed more annoyed with having to field my questions than anything, except of course for the guys who's formerly ran Hobbies for Men up north, shut down or left town (from the model press, MR, I believe, in the late 60's),and reopened in Atlanta (National Hobby Supply), who were there one day and gone the next. They at least were engaging and not hostile. Mike, you've got the the story of Hobbies for Men all mixed up. First of all, the huge store in New York was in business through the late 70's and run very successfully by the father of an eventual father and son team. At the end, the father handed over the business to the kid because of illness, as I recall, who essentially ruined it within just months and had to leave town. The son later reappeared in GA and also elsewhere thereafter, more or less running a mail-order hobby business scam and ending up in court several times (I was involved in one of the court actions). CNJ831
sandusky This last guy takes the cake and I have vowed NEVER to support his store in any way; but most of them seemed more annoyed with having to field my questions than anything, except of course for the guys who's formerly ran Hobbies for Men up north, shut down or left town (from the model press, MR, I believe, in the late 60's),and reopened in Atlanta (National Hobby Supply), who were there one day and gone the next. They at least were engaging and not hostile.
This last guy takes the cake and I have vowed NEVER to support his store in any way; but most of them seemed more annoyed with having to field my questions than anything, except of course for the guys who's formerly ran Hobbies for Men up north, shut down or left town (from the model press, MR, I believe, in the late 60's),and reopened in Atlanta (National Hobby Supply), who were there one day and gone the next. They at least were engaging and not hostile.
Mike, you've got the the story of Hobbies for Men all mixed up. First of all, the huge store in New York was in business through the late 70's and run very successfully by the father of an eventual father and son team. At the end, the father handed over the business to the kid because of illness, as I recall, who essentially ruined it within just months and had to leave town. The son later reappeared in GA and also elsewhere thereafter, more or less running a mail-order hobby business scam and ending up in court several times (I was involved in one of the court actions).
You are just spouting nonsense, Andre. Most of what you posted has not actually the slightest to do with the subject at hand. Can you not ever contribute something...anything...in the way of relevant facts, figures, or in some way pertinent to the subject at hand? Posts like your latest diatribe certainly add nothing to the current discussion. Why not spend some of your on-line time in a far more productive fashion by actually looking into the matter for possible information that contests what I've found?
Now model railroading has, from its very inception in the late 1920's, been considered a craftsman's construction hobby. Simply reading about it, or just collecting/owning trains, honestly relegates one to being an armchair person, or at best a model train enthusiast, as such participation begins and ends with that highly limited, non-modeling, approach to the hobby.
It's absolutely mind boggling that there is a mindset that insists that because things started out a certain way that they must, of necessity, stay that way or the whole endeavour becomes shoddy, if not downright worthless.
Airplanes were initially built with wood and fabric and were powered by rather anemic reciprocating engines. I suppose planes built with carbon fiber composites and powered by turbofan jet engines is a sure sign of the decadence of airplane manufacturing in this country and speaks volumes about the modern insistence on instant gratification. After all, if a 110 mph top speed was good enough for a Sopwith Camel, it ought to be good enough for an F-22 Raptor.
Yep, things have really gone downhill since Dec. 17, 1903. Back then, Wilbur and Orville didn't need to take flying lessons. They just strapped themselves in and took off. The wusses of modern aviation require hours of flight instruction and even more hours of ground school. What's even worse, unlike Wilbur and Orville, they demand RTF (ready-to-fly) airplanes. Wilbur and Orville built their own. From scratch, no less.
Model railroading was a craftsman hobby in the late 20's because it had to be a craftsman hobby where you pretty much did everything yourself. Just 35 years ago, if you wanted a home computer, you had to build it yourself from components. I don't suppose that you built the computer you're using, did you? For my part, I'll admit that I'm using an HP laptop. The desktop my wife and I use was custom built for by my stepson, who loves building the things. It's sorta the computer equivalent of having a custom locomotive builder knock out a locomotive for you.
You're a great lover of spouting off numbers (especially MR page counts) as if raw numbers are the holy grail Here's a graph of historical trends in railroad employment. Using your logic, it looks to me that the numbers indicate that railroading is on its last legs and should probably disappear altogether within my lifetime. http://www.railserve.com/employment.html Railroad mileage peaked at 254,000 in 1916. By 2000, mileage was down to about 145,000 (roughly equivalent to US mileage in 1880). Things are going down hill fast.
And don't get me started on photograpy. That started off as a "craftsman" hobby, too. You had to build your own camera and use glass plates to capture the images. Then film was invented, then George Eastman invented the Brownie. I can't even say the name of Edwin Land without running the risk of a stroke. For cryin' out loud, he made it so the film developed itself. And digital cameras? You want to talk about people demanding instant gratification? They're all a bunch of photographer wannabes who must be shunned at all costs to preserve the purity of real photography from the rabble whose only contribution is filthy money.
I don't suppose mentioning the fact that RTR trains have been available since at least the late 1930's will improve your disposition, will it? I wonder how many O scalers of the 30's bought a Lionel Scale Hudson rather than build a kit. Certainly Frank Ellison did.. Mantua was offering RTR HO in late 1937 with a 2-8-0, 2 gondolas and a caboose along with 21 feet of track (in a kit). I suppose the track kit saved the purchaser from the onus of being considered a poseur, a wannabe, a dilettante. OTOH, at $59.50, I the purchaser was probably the moral equivalent of today's brass collector since it was the equivalent of 900 of today's dollars. http://www.railstop.com/History/Mantua/MantuaHistory.asp
I suppose living in the mental equivalent of a gated community where the riff-raff are kept at bay offers its compensations and you can rest easy in the knowledge that the rest of us great unwashed (those of us that the late Lucius Beebe would refer to as "low and easy folk") have no desire to join your country club. The truth is, in the end, it's not at all about craftsmanship, it's about feeling superior.
OK, mods, you can go ahead and pull this post.
Andre
Sad to hear of another Hobby shop closing up. After reading all the reply & comments posted I just had to chime in with my three cents worth. I believe that there will always be hobby shops around as long as there are those who like to build things on their own. But I also think that there will fewer as time goes on.
As has been mentioned at, the internet has taken away a lot from the LHS. True hobby shops are getting harder to find and a good one is very hard to find. I know, I dont have a LHS so I have to rely on the internet for a lot of my modeling supplies and things. The nearest LHS to me is a five hour drive in any direction.
There is a Hobby Lobby in the next city from me, we all know what kind of supplies they have for model railroading, although this one does have Woodland scenics stuff and they do carry Design Preservation Models building kits along with a good selection of paints and airbrushes (under lock and key). I am from the bay area in Ca originaly, if anyone lives close to concord Ca, there is a good LHS called Just Trains. If you happen to be traveling thru that area it is worth a stop they have a large inventory and the owner is almost always there. Neil
I read time and time again that we should support our LHS. Isn't that backwards - shouldn't they support us? If a store is my best choice for buying what I need/want they get my business - all an LHS has to do is be the best choice (there are lots of ways to do that). My opinion is that the LHSs that shut down for lack of customers have somehow lost sight of what their customers want/need, when any business "disconnects" from its customers the business's days are numbered.
Phil, I'm not a rocket scientist; they are my students.
R. T. POTEETReally???? Boy,you sure fooled the aitch out of me!
Hey there Wild Man What's an aitch? Is that like a scratch you can't get at?
Hello well I just checked the resources tab and clicked on find a hobby shop and went to advanced search put in my zip code and came up with 35 shops with in 50 mile from me. Wow I never thought there were that many around. Now if they are any good I do not know? My have to check some of these out. So now Im wondering if the big group of modelers is now here? Could the interest be moving and the shops follow? Have a nice day Frank
Applying the above reasonable criteria, together with any and all available published hobby statistics, one soon discovers that no matter what figures are employed for supposed hobbyist numbers, one is pretty much forced toward the conclusion that there is unlikely to be much more than just 100,000 practicing model railroaders currently within the United States. Of that total, perhaps 10,000-20,000 might be classified as "serious", or "advanced" hobbyists, implying that their modeling efforts equal, or don't fall all that far short of, the sorts of skill on sees on the pikes appearing in the magazines. Overall, our numbers are really quite small and shrinking. Incidentally, if one attempts to relate these figures to the population by percentage, today it is less that 50% of what it was several decades ago. And the average hobbyist is also just about twice as old today!
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How about the casuals? You can't rule them out..I don't see the hobby shrinking as much as I do splitting into smaller specialized groups we know RR-L is a craftsmen forum by the membership..We see the Atlas forum caters to "serious" modelers..Add the hundreds of SIG found on the Internet.
I haven't seen any hard evidence that suggest the hobby is dying or growing and I have notice a lot of folk in their 30s/40s at the larger train shows..
John,At one time I thought like you and the hobby was shrinking because of reading about LHS closing which no one has even bother to say why other then the hobby is doom due to the on line shops.
As you have asked in times pass where is your hard figures and from what source? Surely not the decline of MR's readership..I think the hobby in general has outgrown the basics MR puts forth and the repeat of articles and articles that is more of a infomercial then solid modeling has driven off readers as well as scale specific magazines along with the instant modeling information found on the 'net.
We live in a completely new era of the hobby that is so different then before...The hobby could see growth and many may not see it because of the lone wolf modelers and clubs that are hard to get information on because they never have a public show or visitor's night..
My brother in law is alone wolf..He doesn't buy MR or any magazines other then Classic Trains and Railfan.He has shopped at the hobby shops in Columbus but,98% of his purchases is done on line.He learn to ballast track watching a on line video.He already knew how to use ground form from his days of building WWII dioramas...I would say he's a advance modeler from his modeling and close attention to details.
The question is how many unknown thousands are there that goes it alone getting the needed modeling information on line like my brother in law?
Driline ATLANTIC CENTRAL Toy stores and department stores have always sold crapy HO and N scale sets as far back as the 50's - that has nothing to do with what is happening now. Tyco, LifeLike, Bachmann, 1958, 1978 or 2010 that has always been. Sheldon It was just a thought
ATLANTIC CENTRAL Toy stores and department stores have always sold crapy HO and N scale sets as far back as the 50's - that has nothing to do with what is happening now. Tyco, LifeLike, Bachmann, 1958, 1978 or 2010 that has always been. Sheldon
Toy stores and department stores have always sold crapy HO and N scale sets as far back as the 50's - that has nothing to do with what is happening now.
Tyco, LifeLike, Bachmann, 1958, 1978 or 2010 that has always been.
Sheldon
It was just a thought
From the far, far reaches of the wild, wild west I am: rtpoteet
ruderunner Hey 0-6-0, where exactly is Al's? And where is hobby lobby opening? Those are both much closer then either place I call a "local" hobby shop. I know where Macedonis and Bedfor are, just never knew about these places.
Hey 0-6-0, where exactly is Al's? And where is hobby lobby opening? Those are both much closer then either place I call a "local" hobby shop. I know where Macedonis and Bedfor are, just never knew about these places.
Hello Al's is located at 708 Broadway ave Bedford ph# 440-232-0591 the hobby lobby is in the shopping center by wal-mart it is in the old giant eagle It's not open yet looks like a couple weeks yet. Not sure where you live but here are more.
Falls hobby 1928 Portage trail Cuyahoga falls 44223 ph# 330-929-1112
There are a few more shops in brook park one is at ridge and snow not to sure? cant remember the name and 1 in Lorain called Wings. Hope this helps Frank