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Leeds Sovereign Street & Clarence Dock - a UK based layout

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Posted by NorthBrit on Friday, May 21, 2021 10:01 AM

Some scenes from the last running session.

Kirkstall & East Seacroft Railway locomotive,  'Zephyrus'  on a goods train to Number 1 Filling Station, Barnbow.   K&ESR locomtives are named after  Greek Gods.   The Greek God for the West Wind is Zephyrus.

The locomotive was formally Percy from the Thomas the Tank range.   It has a tendency to travel fast, hence its new name.  It hasn't any crew yet.  A trip to the model store is required.

 

 

A scene at the locomotive depot.   The scene all around is set for when I run diesels.   The locomotives on shed are -  at the rear  'Vivienne' and 'Katie'.  'Allan Water' is in front of them.  To the left is 'Leefy'  and on the right 'Huxtable'.  All are former Calder Railway locomotives now in Lancashire & Yorkshire Railway livery.

In real life by 1929 all the locomotives were scrapped.  But this is 1914/1919 and are good 'workhorses'.

 

Still in her resplendant pre 1913 K&ESR livery is 'Thor' on a passenger train to Kirkstall.  It is waiting whilst  an L&Y goods train passes,  'Allan Water' in charge.

 

 

David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Saturday, May 22, 2021 5:40 AM

Another view of 'Thor' and 'Allan Water'  as they pass at Leeds Sovereign Street Station.   Some snow is still lingering.  (A lite scattering of talcum powder.)   It was a hard Winter.   

 

 

The guard is seen in the 6 wheeled Brake Van (Caboose).   Note the lamp attached at the back.

 

 

'Allan Water' and the goods train at Canal Corner.  The coal bunker is in front of the locomotive cab.  Coal was fed into the boiler by a series of levers.   In real life it was not a successful idea,  but makes an unusual locomotive to the fleet.   A good, little, running loco at that. Smile

 

 

David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Wednesday, May 26, 2021 9:12 AM

For a few days now I have been thinking of altering the layout.   Drawing plans and wondering where the scenery I wanted was to go.  Everytime it came back to what it is now.  So no alterations; just run trains.  Big Smile

 

Here is a picture of a southbound troop train. On board is part of 19th (1st North Riding of Yorkshire) Regiment of Foot.   The locomotive in charge is Ex-Calder Railway 'Bezel'

 

 

The same train passing Crown Point Junction.  Ash Farm Fields and the lake are beyond.

 

 

The scene at Clarence Dock.  The goods train hasn't arrived yet.  A 'little scallywag' is being 'told off' by the policeman.  Has he been stealing (again)?

 

 

David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Friday, May 28, 2021 8:29 AM

I ordered yesterday two North British Railway six wheeled  carriages.  The reason being, every day one carriage would leave Edinburgh and make the whole journey to Plymouth.  The carriage would either leave Edinburgh in the morning, or arrive in the evening.   The Great Western Railway would send one of their carriages from Plymouth to Edinburgh on the opposite service.

Both services traveled thru Leeds New/Central Station.

As I say one carriage did the whole journey; no harm in having two. Whistling

 

Considering I ordered them late yesterday afternoon  (15.20),  the carriages have just arrived (12.48).     Now to open the boxes and give the carriages their first run.   Photos to follow.

 

David

 

 

Edit  -  The pictures.   

 

 

On their first trial run.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Posted by hon30critter on Friday, May 28, 2021 12:18 PM

Hi David,

Those are nice carriages!

Does the middle axle float to get around tight curves?

Dave

I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!

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Posted by NorthBrit on Friday, May 28, 2021 1:34 PM

hon30critter

Hi David,

Those are nice carriages!

Does the middle axle float to get around tight curves?

Dave

 

 
 
Yes, Dave.   Not that the curves on my layout are tight. Smile
 
I am glad to get a couple of North British Railway carriages that are true to my layout area.
 
 
David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Thursday, June 3, 2021 2:29 PM

I have new rolling stock  for when I run my 1914/1919  steam railway.

A six wheeled Brake/Third (Class)  clerestory coach in Lancashire & Yorkshire Railway livery.

 

 

A L & Y  Baggage Brake Van.  Which travels at the end of a rake of coaches.  I have to apply L & Y lettering.

 

Two London & North Western Railway coaches.  A six wheeled all first class four compartment coach.    A three compartment 1st/3rd (Class)  four wheeled coach.

 

 

Note the different heights of the coaches,  typical of the time.

 

David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Friday, June 4, 2021 7:35 AM

Now (I think)  I have enough carriages to operate real services on the layout.  It is not about running any carriage any way.

Former Calder Railway and Leeds, Scarcroft & Wetherby (now Lancashire & Yorkshire Railway) carriages operate most services.  The London & North Western Railway and North British Railway carriages operate on the thru services.

The Baggage Brake Vans  (I will have two)  will be on the rear of the little four wheeled coaches.  True to prototype.

 

David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Sunday, June 6, 2021 6:29 AM

For a long time I have been searching models of Challenger Tanks that were built at The Royal Ordnance Factory (ROF)  Barnbow.  My local model store owner told me he had something similar.  Two 'Battlezone' Tanks on Lomacs.  'Battlezone' is a kids train set.    A  purchase was made as they looked like  (near enough)  Challenger Tanks.

As received.

 

 

Now to find out what the real ones looked like on leaving the ROF.   What color?  Were they covered over etc.?

 

David

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Posted by Pruitt on Sunday, June 6, 2021 9:59 AM

I'm looking forward to seeing what you do with the tank.

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Posted by NorthBrit on Sunday, June 6, 2021 10:56 AM

Pruitt

I'm looking forward to seeing what you do with the tank.

 

 
 
So am I,  Mark.  Laugh    The real Challenger tanks had armour plating 'skirts' on the side,  so I am attaching some  (thin card).   A repaint to knock the plastic look off.  Then find out how they left ROF Barnbow.
 
I knew that tanks were being built there  since 1936.  When I lived near the factory I never saw a tank leave,  so did not know how they did.
 
David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Sunday, June 6, 2021 2:36 PM

Just been looking at some old film of tanks leaving ROF Barnbow.  They left on tank transporters and went by road to their destination.

Therefore it is a case of modellers license for tanks to travel by rail.

A bit more research to see if there is any more information I may need.

 

David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Monday, June 7, 2021 10:41 AM

First coat of paint on the 'Challenger' tanks.  Compare to the above.

Matt Summers watches as they pass.

 

 

David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Wednesday, June 9, 2021 4:39 AM

The rail track has had a good clean.   

The Kirkstall & East Seacroft Railway Company has spent a few pounds on buying a second hand coach.   A five compartment All 3rd.  (They do not buy new.)   Here it is at Roseville Station.   The coach is from the European company Piko  and has been Anglicised.

 

 

A train of the four new six-wheeled carriages on their way to Leeds Central.

 

 

Some scenery to 'spring clean'  and redo to brighten things up again.

 

David

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Posted by Lastspikemike on Wednesday, June 9, 2021 9:05 AM

NorthBrit

Just been looking at some old film of tanks leaving ROF Barnbow.  They left on tank transporters and went by road to their destination.

Therefore it is a case of modellers license for tanks to travel by rail.

A bit more research to see if there is any more information I may need.

 

David

 

And modellers license to move 1980's tanks out of Barnbow?

The Chieftain goes back to the mid '60's and looks fairly similar to a Challenger, to your average  1/87 back garden observer.

Bonus, ROF Leeds certainly built Chieftains but by the time the Challenger came out that facility had been privatized to Vickers Alvis so who knows whether it also built the newer tank, all according to Wikipedia of course. And the link I posted below to that Leeds site confirms that the Challenger 2 was the last tank type to come out of Barnbow.

The big change between the immediate post WWII battle tanks and the later designs from the 60's on is the turret shape, flatter and wider with sloped flat armour rather than curves. Your tanks are post 50's turret designs but on tanks built after time the turrets all look fairly similar. I'd be calling those models of Chieftains myself...at 1/87 nobody will be the wiser.

PS I had two Matchbox Chieftains each on its own drop deck trailer, acquired in a stunning new-for-old trade I engineered with a slow witted friend. Two fairly new Matchbox saloons for a dozen British Army vehicles including the aforesaid tank sets. And I said no to his suggestion that my bright green Ferrari Berlinetta and my blue Jaguar S type would be a fair trade. He got my least favourite models. Back then a new Matchbox was two bob, a months pocket money but my Mum was so pleased I bought these instead of weekly sweets that she slipped me a bob extra if I bought the toy instead.... a bob extra was a 400% pay rise.

Ah, what we remember...those British Army models didn't make the cut on our emigration from the UK so I only enjoyed them for a year. The 1/76 Airfix infantry did make it over...a bit Dunkirky...I was into painting those tiny figures back then along with Airfix 1/72 model  aircraft. Handy skills I still seem to have.

Alyth Yard

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Posted by Lastspikemike on Wednesday, June 9, 2021 9:32 AM

What the hey, I googled 1/76 Airfix and all that stuff is still available. Momentarily I forgot that OO is 1/76. If you're so inclined you can buy and assemble a variety of military vehicles that may have been built at  Barnbow during any era you choose. Just btw. 

Example for WWII era:

https://uk.airfix.com/products/cromwell-mkiv-cruiser-tank-a02338

For Barnbow specifically:

https://uk.airfix.com/products/churchill-mkvii-a01304v

 

And I stumbled over this in my googling adventure on this topic:

 http://www.leedsengine.info/leeds/histtank.asp

In that article is also a link to Fowler of Leeds, locomotive designers and builders. Newly built Fowlers would certainly have been delivered by rail...an excuse to buy more steam locomotives.....lol  

 

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Posted by NorthBrit on Wednesday, June 9, 2021 10:16 AM

Lastspikemike

 

 
 

 

 

And modellers license to move 1980's tanks out of Barnbow?

The Chieftain goes back to the mid '60's and looks fairly similar to a Challenger, to your average  1/87 back garden observer.

 

That's what I get for liking the Challenger tank.  15 years too late.   Embarrassed  

 

Therefore they will have to be Chieftain Tanks. Thumbs Up   No harm done.   At least it is the right era.  Smile

 

David

 

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Posted by Lastspikemike on Wednesday, June 9, 2021 6:10 PM

Or, you could just buy just one more modern locomotive to match the era of the Challenger tanks..... 

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Posted by NorthBrit on Thursday, June 10, 2021 11:48 AM

Lastspikemike

Or, you could just buy just one more modern locomotive to match the era of the Challenger tanks..... 

 

 
 
With over 50  locomotives it takes a lot  to run them already without adding any more.  No  Laugh
 
David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Saturday, June 12, 2021 5:33 AM

A family member is having a 'clear out'  and came across his old model railway packed in a large box.  He is no longer interested in MR so asked me if I wanted the items.

The box duly arrived and I have been looking thru what there is.  A lot is not wrth saving  -  old rusty track and the like.  In fact most of the carriages and trucks were pretty 'beat up';   candidates for the scrap yard.

A small number of incidental items I know I can 'do up'  and put on the layout.

Then at the bottom, like  finding needles in a haystack, wrapped in paper,  three beautiful carriages in 'blood and custard' color.  They were not in boxes, but they look brand new.    A picture will follow later.

Yes, most of the items went in the trash, but well worth the search thru.

 

David

 

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Posted by Lastspikemike on Saturday, June 12, 2021 9:57 AM

Serendipity. Lovely discovery.

One of my favourite aspects to this hobby is finding "old stuff" that was taken care of so looks more or less new. Sure current moulding and design techniques allow more detail and encourage more accurate scale (though OO is its own special thing scalewise anyway) but this hobby is about imagination, not reality.

Old stuff can be very appealing.

Alyth Yard

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Posted by NorthBrit on Sunday, June 13, 2021 4:57 AM

Lastspikemike

Serendipity. Lovely discovery.

Old stuff can be very appealing.

 

 
Thanks Lsm.   I am really pleased with the 'find'. 
 
 
The 'blood and custard'  carriages  found in the box.   In immaculate condition.
 
 
 
 
 
In the box there was, also,  a 'Searchlight Wagon'    (from a Hornby BattleZone set.)  I already had a Searchlight Wagon and Rocket Launcher from a previous purchase.   The grandsons' love running them  with  Marvel Adventure Figures on them.
The searchlights do not work, but hey it does not stop the enjoyment.
 
Here are the wagons on the layout.   Although they are 'huge' they travel the layout without any problem.
 
 
 
 
David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Saturday, June 19, 2021 5:33 AM

In the box from a family member was a beat-up crane.

 With some repairs and alterations I made it into a representation of a steam crane of 1896.   Just what I wanted for Clarence Dock  part of the layout.

 

 

 

David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Saturday, June 19, 2021 5:40 AM

The oldest grandson is here.   'Things take a turn to another planet'.   Laugh

Turn away from any timetable or whatever.  Let the Superheroes rule!!!

 

 

David

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Posted by Lastspikemike on Saturday, June 19, 2021 8:03 AM

Those coaches take me back. For some reason the colours always made me think of Cadbury's white chocolate bars.

Grandchildren remind us of such important things in life.

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Posted by NorthBrit on Sunday, June 20, 2021 6:57 AM

Lastspikemike

Those coaches take me back. For some reason the colours always made me think of Cadbury's white chocolate bars.

Grandchildren remind us of such important things in life.

 

 
 
Cadbury's white chocolate bars?  Laugh    I thought 'blood and custard'  an awful name.   Apt perhaps, but awful.
 
Yes, when the grandchildren come I just let them run things their way.   I only showed a small number of Superheroes my grandson has.  What with 'Transformers' as well there was over 60 models all over the place.
 
I let the grandchildren run trains their way.   Keeping it fun.  It is the younger granddaughter who is the most serious,  albeit running the Class 55s  'flat out'.
 
David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Monday, June 21, 2021 8:43 AM

I did a locomotive exchange with a colleague on a UK Forum.  He sent me some clockwork locomotives.   My intention is to have a small garden layout.

It is raining, so I have had a daft half hour of nonsense in the train room running the clockwork locomotives.  Just having fun.

 

 

David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Thursday, June 24, 2021 12:03 PM

When i first started posting pictures of Leeds Sovereign Street & Clarence Dock  it was just going to be a few pictures  that I thought might give ideas for any readers.  

Now to my surprise I find the layout has had neary 18,000 views  and I thank you.

Perhaps I should now give the reasons on how the rail lines evolved.

The Lancashire & Yorkshire Railway  (L&Y) and Great Northern Railway (GNR)  wanted their own line to York  so they did not have to pay the MR & NER  to run trains on their metals.  The Midland Railway (MR)  and North Eastern Railway  (NER)  blocked any proposals (in Parliament)  for  any lines the  L&Y & GNR  put forward.

The Light Railways Act of 1896 - The 1896 Act defined a class of railways which did not require specific legislation to construct – companies could simply plan a line under the auspices of the new Act, and, having obtained a light railway order, build and operate it. By reducing the legal costs and allowing new railways to be built quickly the government hoped to encourage companies to build the new 'light railways' in areas of low population and industry that were previously of little interest to them.

The L&Y took advantage of this Act  by setting up The Calder Railway Company  (CR)  and with the help of the Great Northern Railway (GNR) a line was built.

First  two curves were introduced on  the Headfield  Branch  allowing CR  trains  to travel from Dewsbury Market Place to the Dewsbury Loop Line.

 

 

The CR purchased  the small railways  East & West Yorkshire Joint Railway  (E&WYJR)  and  South Leeds Junction Railway (SLJR)

 

A light Railway was built from Earlsheaton  (23 on map)  to Lofthouse & Outwood Station,  giving access to collieries in the area.

 

Under the banner of the Calder Railway the L&Y and GNR had a line to Stourton.  A line was then built from Stourton to Leeds Sovereign Street with a small  goods yard at Crown Point.  The local Politicians were becoming aware of 'too many' stations in Leeds so 'ordered' the CR to extend their line to Leeds New  (later Leeds Central).

 

A further instalment later on how the L& Y arrived at Wetherby on their way to York.

 

David

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Posted by NorthBrit on Friday, June 25, 2021 3:38 AM

Although the line built from Dewsbury was mainly single track with passing places, the main things that helped towards keeping the line opened was the following.  ---

Access to collieries near the  line.

A secondary route south to London; joining the main line at Lofthouse & Outwood Station.  Trains could be diverted if any engineering work took place on the Main Line between Leeds Central and Lofthouse.

Later in the diesel era Stourton became a large container dispatch center.

Also Balm Road Quarry Sidings (near Stourton)  was built.

Locomotives at both sites would refuel at Crown Point Yard.

Crown Point Yard was also the refueling point for locomotves arriving at Leeds Central.   There was a steady stream of locomotives to and from the Yard thruout the day.   (Great variety  on the layout.)

Clarence Dock,  Leeds.   The Calder Railway built a short line to the dock,  thereby giving access to the  Leeds & Liverpool Canal, warehouses and businesses in the area.  A small goods yard was also built.

 

David

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Posted by Lastspikemike on Friday, June 25, 2021 8:28 AM

Your thread is inspirational as well as inherently interesting. What I get from your views on the hobby is the idea of maintaining flexibility in the imaginary World we are all striving to create. There's no reason to confine your imagination to one particular set of ideas just because you have only one layout. You demonstrate how one set of ideas can be experienced on the layout for a specific time and specific experience, be it historically real or childlike fantasy.

Mind you, the UK environment you model helps in part because a lot of old stuff in the UK is still current and in use.

I'd be interested to know what was required to qualify as a "light railway" under the legal exceptions you describe.  I know some Heritage railways in the UK were originally constructed as light railways, often narrow gauge. Were there standard gauge light railways and if so what qualified these as "light".

Over here "Light Rail" refers to a type of heavy tram, several cars long but running on light rail some of which is embedded in a roadway, although the roadway parts are  not open to public vehicle access. 

Alyth Yard

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