hon30critter We started the current fiscal year (October 2018 to Sept 2019) with a $2500 budget. By early December 2018 we had spent most of that and the rest was used up quickly in the new year.
Sounds like you need to be more forward thinking with your budget.
What we do is decide how much we have available to spend in the coming year.
Then we try to do is determine which things we would like to accomplish, Each of these is a "project". Then an estimate is made of what each project would cost, and what items are proposed to be purchased. The total of the estimates is added up. If that total exceeds the available budget, a pin gets stuck into someone's dream idea.
The reason we discuss the potential purchases is because it mostly restrains folks from buying things on a whim, such as that $4500 folk art loco, because they just had to have it.
Dave, keep doing what you are doing. We are interested.
Despite my reputation for being outspoken, I read lots of stuff on here and don't respond.
And if I'm not interested, I have the self discipline to stop reading and move on.......
Sheldon
Me, I like pictures too but I can get those anywhere. I am here because I like the problems and controversy of running a club and that the thread starter is willing to discuss them with an open mind, very rare.
hon30critter Bigjim7 Why don't you spend some of the money on a camera. I check in now and then here and their is never any pics of the layout. Pretty boring thread just reading your club problems. Really?!? Our club problems are boring? I apologise. I'll try to stir up some real crap so that my posts will be more interesting!
Bigjim7 Why don't you spend some of the money on a camera. I check in now and then here and their is never any pics of the layout. Pretty boring thread just reading your club problems.
Really?!? Our club problems are boring? I apologise. I'll try to stir up some real crap so that my posts will be more interesting!
Now, I realize that words typed out in a forum thread may come across more harshly than the spoken word, but the criticism here seems unwarranted. After all, this thread has over 53,000 views, so I find it hard to believe that so many model railroaders are tuning in on a regular basis just to be bored.
Rich
Alton Junction
Bigjim7Why don't you spend some of the money on a camera. I check in now and then here and their is never any pics of the layout. Pretty boring thread just reading your club problems.
Seriously Bigjim7, no offense intended. You make a very good point. I am perhaps being a bit too open about what goes on in the club, but my hope is that some of you will find our trials and tribulations to be entertaining.
I will endeavour to take more pictures soon. The problem is that not too much has changed in the last few months in terms of the appearance of the layout. It is still a plywood paradise. I was actually concerned about posting pictures of the same old same old because not a lot had changed. One of the problems was that the Atlas #4 turnouts which we were so desperately in need of were on backorder for months. That slowed us down a lot.
Now that we have the turnouts we have recently been able to add more sidings which I will take some pictures of. We have also installed a tiny bit of foam as an initial experiment with scenery methods. However the bulk of the progress over the last few months has been made under the layout. So far we have installed a total of 75 Tortoises with approx. 20 more to go. All 75 are wired and working. That is no small task, but it also isn't particularly photogenic.
We have also had a few running sessions and I could have videoed those, but ultimately that would only have lead to embarrasment since a few of the members still seem to be unable to look ahead of their trains!
I'll take some pics next Tuesday.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Turns out the money thing is a tempest in a tea pot! We got so concerned about the outlay that we pretty much stopped spending all together. The only thing we have purchased recently is a booster and the related power supply. We still have about $450.00 in the budget up until October. We had a discussion on what to spend it on on Monday night and it was determined that nothing immediate was required. We can wait.
I kind of feel like I am on one of the rides at the Canadian National Exhibition which takes place in Toronto in late August every year. You spin round and round and maybe get dizzy, but ultimately when the ride stops you get off at exactly the same place you started!
And yes, I plan on running for a second term as President in October!!
Still an influx of funds could for upgrades (with other items hidden it) would not slow your progress.
rrebellAs far as club money problems,
Hi rrebell,
We don't have money 'problems' in terms of being short of cash. Quite the opposite. It is more an issue of how fast we are spending the money. The layout is eating up funds fast and most people get a bit uncomfortable when that happens. As the Layout Committee we are obliged to demonstrate that we are in control of the spending, and that's where our mistake of underestimating near term expenditures causes problems. We are reluctant to say to the members "hi, we know we only asked for $500 between May and September but we actually need $2500 right now!". I'm sure you get the picture.
It is not a serious issue in that the expenditures can wait until our new fiscal year which starts in October. However, it will delay progress in some areas and I'm not happy with that.
As far as club money problems, you must have a member who sells on e-bay. Sell off those things which the club has desided don't fit and ask for donations from members of items they just want to get rid of. You could also do what a club out our way dose. They have a member out here that agments his income by selling on e-bay, his percentage is 25% but he dose all the work, good for him and good for anyone that wants to get rid of any train related item. He got rid of alot of my unwanted stuff.
That seems to be fairly common in a club environment - different people are there for different things. So far, nothing that's been done is in the interest of those people who volunteered for the operations committee. They joined for operations. Now that it's getting to that point - there is something they wanted to do. So those who weren't interested in design or construction volunteer for the Ops Committee because that's why they were there the whole time.
The real trick will be keeping those who just want to run trains happy and avoiding conflict with those that want prototypical operation. And you see why I have no desire to be the leader of anything
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
We had our monthly business meeting on Tuesday night and we made some real gains IMHO.
The primary accomplishment was that we got several members who are not currently part of any of the existing committees to volunteer to form a committee that will deal with operations. That is a refreshing change. Up until now the four members of the Executive Committee have also formed the majority of the other committees like the Layout Committee and the Annual Show Committee.
The Operating Committee's first goal will be to identify the various types of rolling stock that will be needed to service each of the industrial areas. That includes the main loads in and out as well as the occasional shipments of equipment, etc.
The second goal will be to inventory all of the rolling stock that the club owns.
The third goal is kind of obvious - figure out which items that we own actually fit into the operating scheme(s).
Once we have sorted the inventory into which cars are appropriate for our initial operations, the committee will arrange for each of the appropriate pieces of rolling stock to be brought up to NMRA Recommended Practises in terms of coupler height, weight etc., and they will arrange for the replacement of couplers and wheel sets as needed as well as whatever other repairs are necessary.
All of the above will just be the preliminary work for the committee. The next step will be to start developing operating sessions using the tuned up cars as well as members' own rolling stock. Operating sessions can get quite complex, so part of the goal is to start simple and increase the complexity as the comfort level and capabilities of the club members increase (i.e. no more cornfield meets!!).
We recognize that this won't happen overnight, and there will be a bit of a learning curve involved for many of the club members who have never operated before, but I think we are off to a good start.
As always, your input would be appreciated. As I'm sure you have already figured out, we are learning as we go.
Cheers!!
The club is a bit bogged down right now due to budgeting issues for the new layout. We started the current fiscal year (October 2018 to Sept 2019) with a $2500 budget. By early December 2018 we had spent most of that and the rest was used up quickly in the new year. We decided to ask the club for permission to spend more money and they readily agreed, but we only asked for another $500. As it turns out, that estimate was rather low.
We had expected that we would only be spending money on scenery supplies, mostly foam. However, a rather successful running session two weeks ago demonstrated that we will very soon need both a booster and several more UP5 connection panels. I suggested that we spend the money on them now. That raised the issue of going back to the club members for a third time this year to ask for more money. Unfortunately for me the other three members of the Executive Committee were reluctant to do that because they thought it would make the committee appear to be pretty inept at calculating budgets (which would be true).
So far, so good, except I decided to raise the issue one more time after the Executive Committee had made its decision. I felt that the $500 limit had been poorly calculated and by sticking to it we were just furthering the mistake. Now I know what it is like to get blown out of the water!! Bad move on my part! To put it politely, I got shot down!
So, the decision is that we will wait until the fall to aquire some obviously essential equipment instead of continuing the rapid rate of progress that has been made in the last couple of months! That is both called "management by committee", and "politics"!
Oh well! We will get there eventually!
Good news membership wise!
We have two new members! Actually, they are old members, but not age wise. Both belonged to the club years ago so we have welcomed them back with open arms. They are both nice guys!
Happy, happy!!
hon30critterrrebell These were made by painting the inside of the molds with hydracal and then laying in plaster cloth cut to size, lapping as neccisary and painting on the back of the plaster cloth with the plaster.
hon30critterThat is a great suggestion for making light weight rock castings!
So this process makes "hollow" rock out-croppings? Correct? Great Idea.
Now I'll see if I quoted all of this right.
Mike.
My You Tube
railandsailI found that same thing,...even while being chastised for moving along too slowly
Yes, I noticed that you received some flack for the amount of work you put into developing your layout. Pay them no heed. You are having fun and that's all that matters.
I spent years working on my own layout plan. If I had charged ahead with my first design when I was still physically able to do the work it would have been an operating disaster. Over a few years I learned what I had done wrong, and that knowledge allowed me to design a very workable layout for the club. The club layout's mainline is now operable, and so far nobody has found fault with the plan.
Alas, my back problems preclude me from doing much in the way of construction so my personal layout will never be.
hon30critter We were putting off building the staging area. It now seems that our procrastination was a good thing. Sober second thought! Dave
We were putting off building the staging area. It now seems that our procrastination was a good thing. Sober second thought!
I found that same thing,...even while being chastised for moving along too slowly
Brian
My Layout Plan
Interesting new Plan Consideration
We had another look at the staging area. Originally we planned on being able to access it from both directions on the mainline loop that goes around the service area, but one of our members realized that that wasn't necessary. We have a reversing loop close to the staging yard that will accomplish the same thing as the wye that would have been formed with the first plan.
That has allowed us to vastly simplify and reduce the size of the bridge leading into the staging. The bridge is neccessary to allow access to the electrical panel. We can now use a relatively small liftout section instead of the rather large hinged bridge that was needed to accommodate the wye. That will improve access to the panel even more.
We have also added a fifth yard track to the staging as well as a caboose track, and we have added cross overs on the far end of all of the yard tracks so that we can get a locomotive from any of the five tracks to any other track. That means that we won't always have to back the trains into the yard.
Bragdon, if they are still around, and another company make lightweight foam casting systems to make VERY lightweight AND durable scenery. For moveable hatches - probably a better way than covering it with plaster-based scenery.
I would like a reference to that site as well. (I tried the PM but it didn't work)
rrebellpm me if you want the site for my work
I sent you a PM.
pm me if you want the site for my work
rrebellThese were made by painting the inside of the molds with hydracal and then laying in plaster cloth cut to size, lapping as neccisary and painting on the back of the plaster cloth with the plaster.
That is a great suggestion for making light weight rock castings!
Thanks,
hon30critter We had a Layout Committee meeting on Monday night and we managed to make some decisions about the large area in the center of the peninsula. The spurs that will lead to a quarry and a pulp logging operation will have to be very close to the mainline so that we can reach them, but that is not a problem. We decided that we will build an access hatch into the center of the peninsula. We will still make the mountains removable, and that has been made easier because now we will have three clearly defined smaller mountain sections which can be removed independently of each other in order to allow work to be done on them off of the layout. The center section will be mounted on the hatch so we will have to do something to make the sides of the scenery on the hatch more durable. We are thinking about using 3/16" ply to cover the sides of the seams on the mountains on the hatch as well as the adjoining hills so that the foam doesn't get torn up over time. Any comments would be most appreciated as always. Thanks, Dave
We had a Layout Committee meeting on Monday night and we managed to make some decisions about the large area in the center of the peninsula. The spurs that will lead to a quarry and a pulp logging operation will have to be very close to the mainline so that we can reach them, but that is not a problem.
We decided that we will build an access hatch into the center of the peninsula. We will still make the mountains removable, and that has been made easier because now we will have three clearly defined smaller mountain sections which can be removed independently of each other in order to allow work to be done on them off of the layout.
The center section will be mounted on the hatch so we will have to do something to make the sides of the scenery on the hatch more durable. We are thinking about using 3/16" ply to cover the sides of the seams on the mountains on the hatch as well as the adjoining hills so that the foam doesn't get torn up over time.
Any comments would be most appreciated as always.
Hi Dave,
Sorry I didn't have more time to talk to you at Lindsay. My back was so bad that weekend that the only thing I managed to do was get the layout trailer to the show and pick it up again on Sunday.
We had a discussion with the members last Tuesday about the projected dues increases and everybody was fine with them. They understood the need to keep the club solvent, and in fact they agreed to increase the dues for 2019/2020 even though we could have managed without an increase for next year.
The Treasurer, Dave Wetherald, and I had a meeting with our insurance broker this morning basically to negotiate for additional coverage now that more has been invested in the layout. I do not like this broker! He doesn't finish his sentences, he guesses at what might be covered and what might not be covered, and he uses examples over and over again that are completely irrelevent to our situation. I'm going to suggest that we shop around.
We are taking the portable layout to the Midland show for the weekend. It is supposed to be raining on Saturday morning so I decided to hitch up the trailer tonight. Good thing! No trailer lights! It took me two hours to fix. The single male pin on the four pin connecter had broken off. All is well. The lights are nice and bright now.
Dave:
Here at the Pine Ridge Railroad club our dues are about the same as yours, and projected to go up the way yours are.
We have a lease on a floor in a wing in a church, one of our members is chairman of the board of said church. We have developed a habit to always run clockwise, as we need another passing track to be able to run both ways without really long waits.
Other than really short trains limits (seven cars) we have very little movement controls, and no dispatcher/controller. It seems to work.
Mondays are free run nights, bring in stuff from home, run the length train you want, take in off and home when you are done. I ran 37 ore cars one time.
We are in a large complex. I'm not sure how many units there are but it could 100+.
I think the good thing about the MIT (NNN) fee that we pay is that it is fixed over the five year life of the lease. It works out to about $900.00 per year. Considering the fact that our rent is affordable, and much cheaper than anything else available, we are better off to pay it instead of arguing with it. If it was included in the lease price it would be going up by 4% per year to about $200 more per year by 2024.
In California there is a problem with NNN which I am sure is addressed in alot of leases. This is in the property tax part in that if someone sells, the tax instantly goes up or down to reflect 1% of the sales price and you get a 1% increase of tax every year.