Hi Tom and all.
A pint of Bathams Bitter to start today please LEON.
Lots to read at the bar after Tom and my great trip to Kansas City on Amtrak. I will not say too much about our day, as Tom will have some photos of a lot of what we saw, but I must say the model shop and the KCS cars are well worth seeing. As well as my first sight of one of the UP diesels painted in heritage colors. On the way back we passed the UP heritage train although a pair of newer diesels not a heritage locomotive hauled it.
ROB Great job yesterday at the bar, H&H has got the mushy peas down to an art, only problem is they make a big pot and as I am the only one who will touch them (apart from TEX) I have to eat the lot accompanied with the unfortunate effects later. The only good thing is if the track gang won't leave at closing time we only have to release TEX and the bar is cleared in seconds. At least it is one night of the week.
What a great place that apartment in St Catharines must have been to live in when steam was working the trains. As I write this I am playing a CD of LMS recordings in the days of steam,I brought over from England. The two tracks playing are on the Lickey Incline and the whistles from the train loco and the helpers can be heard. I guess 0-6-0 tank locos were used as all the weight of the locos could be used for adhesion, and the bank was only two miles long.
There is a connection with North America to the Lickey Incline. The early helpers were supplied by the Norris Locomotive Company of the USA. There is a carving on two gravestones in Bromsgrove Churchyard of the locomotives on the graves of two railwaymen who unfortunately were killed when a boiler exploded on the incline, although the loco that exploded was not one of the Norris engines. For a bit more on the story here is a link
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bromsgrove_railway_works
I did not know about Bromsgrove's connection to the ‘Saddle Tank'.
Many thanks for the new Classic Juice and the Classic Steam encores all really great reads and great Canadian National ads.
I have yet to see a CN or CP diesel through here yet although there have been a few hire locomotives and CSX diesels through on the UP line here lately.
DOUG Great to see you in at this busy time for you. I am sure you will find a fine horse and it will be very lucky to have you as the owner.
Thanks for the joke
JAMES Great set of the videos in the links you posted, you can get a sense of what theDD40X sounds like, I think the engineer was enjoying the attention 6936 was getting from the chasers. Loved the videos of 844.
The loco with the bell, Great Western Railway ‘King' class 6000 King George V is at Swindon Museum on part of the now closed works where the loco was built. Quite a famous loco already, 6000, was the locomotive which was used to haul the first special train after the BR steam ban, in 1971, after all steam was banned from the main line after steam finished on BR in 1968.
Many thanks the Duluth Missabe and Iron Range Railroad, a great post on an iron ore line. I wonder if any of the2-8-84 ‘Yellowstones' was saved for a museum. The map helped a lot as well.
Thanks for sharing your GE drawing it looks great to me when enlarged.
CM3 I must have been a great experience to see the DD40Xs in service judging by the video in James's link.
Very much enjoyed the recollections of the RTE 128 station and the baggage handlers at Nashville, many thanks for sharing.
Is the Mentor Septic Beer Co another of Vito the Hit's companies
ERIC Thanks for the photo of 6915, I believe we will see one of the class at the St Louis Museum of Transportation.
Those FL9s sound an interesting loco; I guess the 5-axle design was for weight distribution.
The Lickey still uses helpers today for heavy freight trains, a select few of the GM class 66 locos. In steam and early diesel days the speed restriction at Bromsgrove at the bottom of the bank was 30 MPH, today it is 80MPH so the passenger trains have a far better run at it. There have been a few steam specials up the bank in recent years and I was fortunate enough to travel on one, which was double headed. The two Alans were on one last year which featured the ex LMS Jubilee class loco 5690 Leander which made a fantastic climb of the bank, as this loco was based at Bristol Barrow Road for many years, it would have climbed the Lickey many many times in its BR career, working the South West
ENCORE! Saturday ‘n Photo Posting Day!
at "Our" Place!
We are CLOSED on SUNDAYs!Starting Sunday at the Mentor Village Emporium Theatre!
. . . April 29th thru May 5th: Fear Strikes Out (1957) Starring: Anthony Perkins, Karl Malden, Norma Moore, Adam Williams & Perry Wilson - and - Forest Gump (1994) Starring: Tom Hanks, Robin Wright Penn, Gary Sinise, Mykelti Williamson & Sally Field. SHORT: The Three Stooges - From Nurse To Worse (1940).
Fear Strikes Out (1957)
PLOT SUMMARY:
From its early scenes of a young Jimmy Piersall literally suffering his father's abusive determination that the boy should play baseball, Robert Mulligan's 1957 Fear Strikes Out becomes more about mental health than love of the game. But this is a compelling drama about the real-life Piersall's gradual breakdown one season before a national audience, the legacy of his domineering dad's overbearing ways. (Karl Malden plays Piersall's father.) Mulligan (To Kill a Mockingbird) brings his usual, civilized mix of poignancy and dramatic urgency to the proceedings, keeping any viewer (sports fan or not) involved. Perkins looks out of place on the field and is meant to appear that way; his fragility and intensity underscore the sad tale of Piersall's woes. --Tom Keogh
from: amazon.com
Forest Gump (1994)
The movie begins with a feather falling to the feet of Forrest Gump (Tom Hanks) sitting at a bus stop in Savannah, Georgia. Forrest tells the story of his life to a woman seated next to him (the listeners at the bus stop change regularly throughout his narration).Much of Forrest's philosophy comes from his mother (Sally Field). Forrest often recalls her favorite sayings, "Mama always says, 'Life is like a box of chocolates, You never know what you gonna get.'" and "Stupid is as stupid does." Both sayings became popular catchphrases following the movie's release.A classic film in all respects!
Much of Forrest's philosophy comes from his mother (Sally Field). Forrest often recalls her favorite sayings, "Mama always says, 'Life is like a box of chocolates, You never know what you gonna get.'" and "Stupid is as stupid does." Both sayings became popular catchphrases following the movie's release.
A classic film in all respects!
SHORT: From Nurse To Worse (1940)PLOT SUMMARY: Featuring Moe, Larry & Curly
The Stooges' friend Jerry informs them of a great money-making scan: buy insurance, go to the insurance doctor and claim insanity, and be paid $500 a month for the rest of their lives. Eager for easy money, they take a policy out on Curly, and then proceed to bring him into the insurance doctor, Dr. D. Lerious's office with Curly masquerading as a dog. Curly's performance is so convincing that the alarmed doctor demands that Curly be prepared for "cerebrum decapitation." After giving the doctor and a hospital guard the runaround, the Stooges escape, just barely, and vent their revenge on Jerry.
from: threestooges.net
Enjoy! Tom
ENCORE! Saturday - 'n ' Photo Posting Day!
The Bar is CLOSED on Sundays!
Here are some Pix from a trip to KCity with Pete back in Sep of 2005 . . .
Interior of Great Northern Observation #1292 at KCity's Union Station (Pete) Interior of Great Northern Observation #1292 at KCity's Union Station (Tom) Interior of Milwaukee Road Diner at KCity's Union Station Galley in Milwaukee Road Diner at KCity's Union Station Eastbound Amtrak train #306 at KCity's Union Station Amfleet Café Car #48177 at KCity's Union Station Ooooooops! Goodbye Tom! Pete at Jefferson City, MO
Enjoy (again!)
Tom
Here's something to ponder with regard to our appreciation and fascination with Classic Trains. Check these hotel ads (from The Official Guide of the Railways - 1956) [located on the inside, back cover]
Initially Posted on Page 141 of the original Thread
OKLAHOMA BILTMORE in the heart of Oklahoma City 600 Outside Rooms with Bath 600 Free Radios MARTIN J. REINHART, President H.P "Johnnie" JOHNSON, Mgr. "Where courtesy creates its own welcome" - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Where Downtown SAN ANTONIO meets the River The PLAZA HOTEL . . . . . . . . . . . Air-Conditioned . . . . . . . . . . . . . SAN ANTONIO . . . . . . . . . . . The Venice of Texas . . . . . . . . . 500 Rooms . . . . . . . . . . . TOM L. POWELL, Mgr. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - IN SAN FRANCISCO . . . KARL C. WEBER . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 500 Rooms President and . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . from $5.00 - Single General Manager . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . from $7.00 - Double HOTEL WHITCOMB Market Street at Eighth AT THE CIVIC CENTER - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - HOTEL LAFAYETTE LAFAYETTE SQUARE BUFFALO, N.Y. Buffalo's Most Centrally Located Hotel 400 ROOMS WITH PRIVATE BATH . . . . . . . . . . From $2.75 Single . . . . . . . . . . Delicious Meals at Moderate Cost KENNETH A. KELLY, President and Manager - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - IN ATLANTIC CITY IT'S . . . HOTEL DENNIS Boardwalk at Michigan Avenue AMERICAN and EUROPEAN PLANS Walter J. Buzby, Inc. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - PHILADELPHIA'S VERY BEST! 1200 Rooms - 1200 Baths The finest of food and entertainment The BENJAMIN FRANKLIN A GREAT NAME . . . . . A GREAT HOTEL JOSEPH F. CONLAN, General Manager. . . . . . . . . WAlnut 2-8600 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - THE CONRAD HILTON C H I C A G O World;'s Largest and Friendliest Hotel 3000 ROOMS COMPLETELY REFURBISHED - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - MARK TWAIN HOTEL . . . . . . . . . . ELMIRA, NEW YORK . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Elmira's Finest Hotel . . . . . . . . . . . . 250 OUTSIDE ROOMS WITH BATH Television and Air Conditioning - Four Restaurants W. C. EMERSON, President and Managing Director - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - IN NEW ORLEANS The ST. CHARLES . . . . . . . . A DINKLER HOTEL . . . . . . . . Completely Air-Conditioned J. J. ("Mike") O'Leary, V.P. & Mgr. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - HOTEL ROBERT TREAT . . . . . . . . . . "A KNOTT HOTEL . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . NEWARK 1, N.J. SINGLE - $5.25 Up . . . . . . . . . . DOUBLE - $8.50 Up STANLEY J. AKUS, Mgr. . . . .ALBERT W. STENDER, Pres. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - One of the world's distinguished hotels The WINDSOR . . . . . . . . MONTREAL, CANADA . . . . . . . . MAXIME RAYMOND Q. C. President & Managing Director - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Enjoy! Tom
Hi Tom and everyone, a round for the house
Well I never heard of the Duluth, Kimosabe & Iron Age either, and what the heck is Taconite?
CM3 thanks for excellent commentary. Ford Falcon, it was in 1960 that the Big 3 signed the Compact of Downsizement. GM's back-motored Corvair was the nadir of mobile safety, and then there was Chrysler's valiant attempt to ramble, nashurally. (See your DeSoto-Plymouth dealer and tell them Groucho sent ya)
St. Clair Tunnel or Sania Tunnel
http://memory.loc.gov/pnp/habshaer/mi/mi0300/mi0363/data/005.gif
http://memory.loc.gov/pnp/habshaer/mi/mi0300/mi0363/photos/339795pv.jpg
http://memory.loc.gov/pnp/habshaer/mi/mi0300/mi0363/photos/339794pv.jpg
http://memory.loc.gov/pnp/habshaer/mi/mi0300/mi0363/photos/339781pv.jpg
http://memory.loc.gov/pnp/habshaer/mi/mi0300/mi0363/photos/339786pv.jpg
http://www.imagescn.technomuses.ca/_images/common/photos/original/CN000166.jpg
http://67.15.20.45/images/c/CN9303_oct_1991_sarnia_on.jpg.82009.jpg
http://www.trainweb.org/westminsterstn/pics/sartun4f.jpg
CN Turbo
http://216.94.16.48/_images/common/photos/original/CN000556.jpg
http://216.94.16.48/_images/common/photos/original/CN000564.jpg
Taconite
http://www.mnhs.org/library/tips/history_topics/24taconite.html
http://collections.mnhs.org/visualresources/VRDbimages/pf008/pf008833.jpg
http://67.15.20.45/images/6/650-2.jpg.74722.jpg
New Haven FL9s
http://67.15.20.45/images/images2/n/NH_2026_r.jpg.30055.jpg
http://67.15.20.45/images/images2/n/NH_2042.jpg.70124.jpg
New Haven H16-44
http://67.15.20.45/images/images2/n/NH_0594_Southhampton.jpg.59511.jpg
Union Pacific 4-8-4, and James that was a neat video, cool soundtrack too
http://67.15.20.45/images/6/6-28-97_Salt_Lake_City.jpg.19282.jpg
Ulysses S. Grant
http://aok.lib.umbc.edu/speccoll/imcatimages/78-121-204.jpg
Robert E. Lee
http://iarchives.nysed.gov/images/extscaled/generalrobertleefull.jpg
Supercontinental
Photo courtesy Canada Science & Technology Museum
Mike
Courtesy: http://www.viarail.ca/
ENCORE! Saturday -‘n - Photo Posting Day!
The bar is CLOSED on Sundays!
G'day Gents!
Back from one of our finest rail journeys thus far, with anticipation building for the next two up in "Oh Canada!" Pete ‘n I had a fine day and there'll be bits ‘n pieces along with some Pix in the next few days. Amtrak is Amtrak, or "it is what it is," and there just isn't much we can do to paint the picture otherwise. However, the idea was to have fun, relax and pass the time, which we did. Pete found an old friend in the café car on our return trip - someone named Samuel Adams. <grin>
Given the work going on between St. Louis ‘n Kansas City by Union Pacific, Amtrak was able to keep us rather close, schedule wise. My notes indicate we arrived in KCity a mere 12 minutes later than scheduled, even though we were 33 minutes late getting to Pete in Jefferson City. On the return, we arrived in JCity 27 minutes behind time and at Kirkwood (my station) 32 minutes late overall. Really not bad, not bad at all.
The train (same for both directions) had a single GE P42 locomotive and Horizon equipment - very, very dirty on the outside with windows that hadn't seen a washing ‘n scrubbing since Moby Dick was a Minnow (go ahead and steal THAT ONE, Rob! <grin>). There were 3 coaches and one café car (where Business Class is - including us.) The order: Cafe car - three coaches; simple enough.
My biggest complaint was about the condition of the windows, absolutely no excuse for that. We had a rather nice day, weather wise, and the scenery along the route is pleasant to view, but NOT through filthy windows. <grimace>
I noted that there is quite a bit of material since my last Post and yesterday was chock full o' interesting stuff. Noted too a drought of nearly 12 hours. See, it DOES make a difference when just ONE of our "foundation blocks" is missing - but when two are gone, Lars ‘n Pete, well . . . ‘nuf said.
Many thanx to those of you who kept the place operating, I'm sure Ruth ‘n Leon enjoyed the company! I haven't detected any signs of destruction in the pool room, so my guess is the monthly Friday Nite Pool Challenge amongst the Track Gangs went off well. <phew>
Truly haven't the time to do full justice to all the guys who provided such fine material - suffice it to say, THANX again!
Customer ACKNOWLEDGMENTS (since my last narrative):
Rob at 8:22 PM ‘n 9:07 PM Thursday: A bit of chat, an Encore! Post and a brew or two, makes for a nice evening, fer sure, fer sure! Thanx!
Eric at 1:13 AM yesterday: Well, you MAY have missed something way, way back on the original Thread. Count Robulla comes from our 1st Halloween, if I recollect and also in connection with the trolleyMANs late, late night visits back then. So, the name was given and "anointed," so to speak. <grin>
Nice looking UP loco, however these days (daze) I'm not thinking very positively about that RR. <groan> They do what they do, but the ramifications at times make life difficult if areas they aren't concerned about - passenger rail travel for example! <exasperated>
Appreciate the visit and yes, the countdown continues . . .
James at 7:40 AM yesterday: You said you'd be here to help out and you did! I'm sure the guys appreciate being able to check in to see that the place is runnin' just fine.
I never heard of the DM&IR, but now I have! Regional roads really are great to read about, especially those with such an integral tie to the economic health of a given area. Thanx!
Rob at 8:48 AM ‘n 8:53 yesterday: Figured our Chief Chef would come through in the clutch and thankfully your job schedule permitted not one, but TWO submissions on Friday morning!
Informative Post, great looking GT ‘n CN ads - what more could we ask for, eh A RIDE ABOARD THOSE TRAINS, that's what!! <grin>
Many thanx for taking the time before work to help out ‘round here!
CM3 Shane at 9:14 AM yesterday: Stories, chit-chat and inclusiveness all mark another fine visit from our WVA Connection! Recalled the L&N "laffer' from the past . . .
The "128" mentioned brings back memories of long ago . . .
Your mention of horses, the bar, and beer wagons brings to mind that during our Rendezvous, we will pay a visit to the home of the Clydesdales at a place called Grant's Farm (yes, "that" Grant - U.S. Grant, 18th President of the U.S. (2 terms) and General of the U.S. Army during the civil war. Anyway, in these parts, beer wagons, Clydesdales and the "Budweiser song" make for feeling gooooooood. Doug will undoubtedly love those horses . . .
Thanx for the visit, quarters ‘n round!
Rob at 8:34 PM ‘n 8:42 PM ‘n 9:26 PM ‘n 9:51 PM ‘n 10:35 PM yesterday: And here comes trolleyMAN, the Chief Chief to save the day after nearly a 12 hour drought! A 5-Post Nite for our Ontario Connection earns a 5-
Good morning Captain Tom and Gentlemen!!
Leon, time for my favorite, Rumpsteak Café de Paris! Fries!
I can see Rob has been here almost all day today! A lot of good reading! Friday in Phoenix was on the warm side, 97° F. The summer is coming soon! The test runs on our new (under construction) light rail system begun this week! That is a good sign.
James – Thanks for the interesting story about the Duluth, Missabe and iron Range Railway!! 50 years since the passenger service ceased 46 years ago but still running (at least parts of it) today! I guess the solid lines on the map indicate railroads still in service.Nice picture(s) of the GE-locomotive. I have one question though, why is the horn facing backwards? Rob – Thanks for the info on remaining tracks of the commuter lines! When we were in Toronto with the X2000 in 1993 we did two demo runs to Guelch Junction and back. Could that be on those tracks?Nice ads! The top one is obviously from 1941 and it seems like the other one is from the same period of time, the 40’s. Correct?The Super Continental, April 24th 1955! No steam power, all diesel. I guess that shortened the traveling time so they could call it Super. I like your short stories about Classic Steam, like these on The Lake Simcoe Jct Railway and The Bay of Quinte Railway! I am saving many of them. I still remember the last one of today’s stories about the Canadian Northern! CM3 – Route 128? I’ve been there a number of times by train. If I recall right it's located on a pretty long straight stretch of the railroad and there is an overpass (Route 128) on the Boston side of the station. Poor baggage man, didn’t like the company, I guess.FL9 is kind of a different engine with its 5 axles and diesel-electric or electric operation! As far as I know some of them have been rebuilt and are still in service.
1993.
Eric
G-day Tom and all present!
Leon- Just a coffee for me, thanks
Alright, I will need to save my acknowledgements for tomorrow but I will be here. And things are looking good around here. I am impressed with the number of posts on a friday, especially from Rob. Just wanted to drop off my GE picture. It' didn't turn out as well as I thought it would but it gives you an idea. It definitely looks better on paper. It's not yet finished but getting really close.
Well, here is the front half od the GE evolution series locomotive.
And the back half.
Enjoy!
Happy railroading
James
Okay Leon , one last Keith's for me then I'm shutting off the lights.Here is one more encore to wind out today's efforts. thsi will be a teaser for tuesday's Railroads of Canada theme day. This was first posted on page 16 of this new bar.Catch everyone tomorrow.
Rob
CLASSIC STEAM #39 ONTARIO'S THIRD MAINLINE THE CANADIAN NORTHERN
Well we will tell the tale ( an abriviated version ) of the "third" national dream in Canada.The Stroy of Mackenzie and Mann and the rail empire that never quite made it.
In 1895, another chapter in Canadian railway history began. In that year the famous Canadain partners,William MacKenzie and Donald Mann bought the failing Manitoba railway , The Lake Manitoba Railway & Canal Company.And with this purchase they began assembling a network of unused charters and undervalued lines that would eventually stretch from coast to coast.The key link in this chain of railways would be the connecting link running between Ottawa and Toronto.They didn't seem bothered by the fact that two other mainlines were already destined to run east from Toronto,the 50 year old Grand Trunk and the line proposed by the CPR.
By the time the line was under construction, most of the towns along the line were well established. The GT had taken up the best station grounds close to the downtowns, and left the fledgling Canadian Northern ( CnoR ) the inferior alignments on the outskirts of the towns.The route ventured northeast from Toronto far to the north of Oshawa and Bowmanville and was unable to get a desirable run close to Lake Ontario until it reached Port Hope.from there the next amjor town was Desoronto, where the line followed closly that of the GT at times running parallell.
Between Napanee and Sydenham ( north of Kingston ) the CnoR incorporated the existing Bay of Quinte RR ( BQ ) but from there they laid their own trackage into Ottawa.From Ottawa the route continued along the south shore of the Ottawa river to Hawksbury, where it crossed into Quebec sending spearate branches to Montreal and Quebec City.
The Blind ambition of building this and the third trancontinental mainline the Grand Trunk Pacific, however lead to the CnoR's downfall.The completion of three national mainlines, and three east of Toronto wiht all the extra branches to feed them essentially duplicated each others services.With the world on the verge of a world war, this had the makings of a financial disaster. By wars end two of these lines were bankrupt. The GT Pacific and the CnoR.With the government owned Intercolonial in the maritimes not being much more healthy.
In an effort to save the bleeding red of these essential services ( for movuing goods and people and to avaoid a national financial crash ) Tjhe federal government decided to rationalize the redundant netwok of trakage that spiderwebbed it's way accross Ontario and much of the country.In this way the Federal government assumed control of the GTP, the CnoR & the Intercolinial forming the Canadian National Railways ( much to the dismay of the CPR )
Under the new CNR banner, the lines that at one point were heated rivals were now suddenly redundant.This was espeacially eveident in the extra trackage east of Toronto.The CNR did not need two mainlines running side by side serving the same communities etc. So the more profitable line was retained.So in 1936 the least profitable line was abandonned, MacKenzie & Mann's CnoR. The line only ran for two decades, yet track remained in place until the 1940's when the metal was torn up for the war effort. Some trackage of this eastern portion of the CnoR still remains in use today in Oshawa and Coburg, but only as stub ended industrial spurs feeding the old GT mainline.
Leon your not sleeping on my time are you Well I can't blame you it's been a tad slow but we all figured that much today.Well here is another encore this time reproduced from the old thread.
CLASSIC STEAM #29 THE BAY OF QUINTE RY
This was first posted on page # 364 of the old thread.Please enjoy again !
The Bay of Quinte RY of (BQ),despite it's history and many bits and pieces left behind is little more than a small footnote in Ontario's railway history.
It all began with Edward Rathburn.One of the ambitious entrepreneurs that was spawned by the 19th centuries industrial revolution.Rathburn founded what would become one of the largest and most diversified empires in 19th centruy Canada.From it's large mills in Desoronto Ontario ( the northeastren shore of Lake Ontario ) the Rathburn company expanded in all directions.It's fleets carried lumber and other cargo southward to Oswago NY, while it's trains moved cargo east and west along the Grand Trunk.To the north lay Rathburn's vast timber reserves and his Bay Of Quinte RY.
Like much of Rathburn's empire the railway began as a mishmash of existing lines and unused charters.After building his own link from Deseronto a short distance from Grand Trunks main line west of Napanee Ontario,Rathburn purchased the Napanee Tamworth and Quebec Line, a railway that led north from Napanee.He extended this line northwest to Tweed and later Banockburn,as well as northeast to Syndenham.This gave the company the all-important access to it's timber limits.By 1903 the network of tracks had become known as The Bay of Quinte RR or BQ.
The railway gained it's revenue from more than just Rathburn's timber ventures.a marble qaurry at Actinolite,a cement plant at Marlebank, and a pyrite mine at Queensborough all added their piece to the railways profits.In 1910 the expanding Canadian Northern added the BQ to it's national inventory of undervalued lines.The CnoR, was less interested in the timber, mines and quarries than it was in it's completeing of it's mainline from Toronto to Ottawa.The BQ was a valuble link in that route.
Neglected by it's new owners, the cement plant , mines and mills closed one by one,by 1930 only one train operated north of Tweed each week.To no ones supprise the section between Tweed and Banockburn was abandonned in 1935, and from Tweed to Yarker in 1941.The CNR continued service from Napanee to Yarker and beyond to interchange with CPR at Smithville until 1986. Run brieflty as a shortline the Smithville branch was lifted in 1991.The BQ left a colourfull history and many old stone mills and plants along it's ROW many are still to be seen today.
Okay folks here's a little encore of a piece I first posted back on january 15th. A bit more light bedtime reading for those who were away playing on trains todayWe have to keep up our reputation of filling thesepages with at least a bit of train info and fun afterall.
Enjoy Rob
CLASSIC STEAM #38 THE LAKE SIMCOE JCT RAILWAY
One of the main goals of the early railway builders in Ontario,was to tap the resorces of the Provinces hinterlands.Here was where the timber,minerals and the farmland resided. All vital to the new countries fledgling economy.The first lines were usually anchored to a lake port, and from there they wound their way inland to wherever their charter and their funding would take them.Often with many of the first lines this wasn't very far ,and many of the lines were simply built as portages.
While the Toronto & Nippissing Railway ( never even got close to lake nippissing ) was being built and wound it's way from Toronto to coboconk,it lacked a neccessary portage conection.Accordingly a feeder line was proposed from a point on the TN to Lake Simcoe,which was at that time a key transportation route for Ontario's early settlers, and lumber companies.
The Lake Simcoe Junction Railway,began ant Stouffville a booming town set amidst some of Ontario's finest farmland,and terminated at Sutton,with a spur extending to the warf at Jackson's point on Lake Simcoe.Watre tanks and a small coal facility were placed at Mount Albert,while two engine sheds were built in both Sutton and Stouffville.Eight stations and sidings were located along the line, with the buildings at Mount Albert and Sutton being built to the specs of the two stroy wood frame sattion at Stouffville. The rest were simple single stroyt buildings built in the style of the TN parent road.The station at Kirkfield still stands as does the TN station at Markham Ontario ( suburb of toronto ).
train service on the LSJ was not frequent. Two daily train mixed trains called at each station for the first three yeasr of operation,by the fourth year this was reduced to one,however by 1910 a full passeneger train was operating in each direction on the line.By 1917 this was reduced once again to just the one mixed train as the interurban rr The Toronto and York radial (TTC forerunner ) was offering daily excursions to Lake Simcoe on the faster, quieter and cleaner electric interurban cars.With this heavily patronised competition the LSJ cut train service back from Jakson's Point to Sutton ( thus not evening reaching ake Simcoe ).firhter competion arrived in 1919 in the form of the Canadian Northern's new transcontinnetal line which ran from Toronto northeast of Lake simcoe along the eastern shore of the lake. this line actually ran parallell to the LSJ,with the lines almost adjacent to each other at Mount Albert !
By 1928, the newly formed Canadian National had assumed control of both lines,and undertook a major line relocation project.They eliminated a section of the LSJ between stouffville and Zepher and moved the junction closer to Sutton to apoint along the higher quality Canadian Northern Line built between Zepher and Sutton.In 1928 thee CNR eliminated all tthe passenger runs on the remaining chunks of the LSJ, regulating it to a part time frieght only traffic.During the 30's - 50s' it was a major farm produce,livestock line feeding traffic to the CNR's eastern lines.Through the late 50's and into the 60's trains became less and less frequent with most of the produce going to trucks.1979 saw CN abandoned the line , along with alot of it's other mid Ontario small yeild lines.
Howdy again Leon another Keith's here's another ad poster to continue on with the evening.
Good evening Leon. Just a samll strip loin for me tonight we're going with a lighter menu with the lower crowds of this evening. I made it back in , a tad later than I wanted but I is here.
CM3-I haven't been able to confirm or deny who had that "problem" witht the coal tower,for some reason CP's Orangeville sub sticks in my mind but I haven't found the proof.If I do I'll let you know.Glad you liked the commuter, piece and Jame's synopsis of the DMIR was bang on.It's a railroad I like always have. I have a soft spot for SD7's and 9's I just like them. Which is odd as they were not built for the Canadian market. They just screme "locomotive".Loved the stories of the old reliable and the New Haven thanks for sharing. The L&N was one of those roads that in my mind did it right. Nice big engines pulling the daylights out of coal drags, classic stuff.I imagine that those UP Centenials would have had a sound of their own, likely shook your fillings loose as they went by as well.
I just hope that Doug has horses that Boris won't easily spook, once he gets in his get up and rides the beer wagon it's a sight to behold.It takes the townsfolk all their resolve and apitence not to break out the linching ropes and torches.
Good Morning Barkeep and All Present; coffee, please; round for the house and $ for the jukebox. We missed a lot of violent weather last night, and gas went back up to $3/gal.
Rob sent lots of material. I enjoyed the piece about passing signals b4 radio. It was fun to watch, especially at night. The Toronto commuter material has been copied. I think maybe we could twitch the menu a little and you could concoct something like "Calamari and Octopus a la Olympia" (the old school hockey folks in the audience will understand this one). I have some good calamari stories, but they would shut the forum down and Boris might even get a little green around the gills. Your TTC and CN posts showed up while I was preparing mine. Always nice to see a timetable I have in my collection.
As I sort of said (huh?) I thought the coal dock that fell over onto the main line might have been CN, but when I rely on my memory...
Barndad and the horses; a couple of more and we can hitch them to the Mentor Septic (No, Boris, that Antiseptic) Brewing Company's beer wagon. AB eat your heart out - it's not every day we see a crew dressed like Raider's fans riding on a beer wagon.Also, why does their label feature a skull and crossbones logo?
There seemed to be a few things today re UP6900s. In answer to James's note. Yes, they were something to watch in operation. I had the privilege of being in Wyoming while they were in regular service. Looked like a building with a lot of wheel underneath. And the sound...
Eric. Thanks for the kind words again.
James, indeed, gave us a good summary of the DMIR. King's DMIR book has been recently reprinted (within the past 5 yrs or so, IIRC). It's a good one if you can find a copy. For those who really want to learn about taconite and taconite processing, here's a citation.
Davis, E.W. Pioneering With Taconite. St. Paul: Minnesota Historical Society, 1964.
Davis was there and it's not badly written. The photos show all kinds of machines, plants, and such as appeal to our "Captains of Industry." Your local library may be able to interlibrary loan it for you. Jeez, where else on the forums can you read about all of this?
Pete stopped by.
OSP sent some SOO material. I'm ready to go on that one myself.
A couple of stories.
I recall riding (a long time ago) a New Haven RR train from New York to Boston. For those who remember, the New Haven ran some long trains even when they were on their last legs.
We detrained (always like to use that word) at Rte. 128 a little before midnight rather than going all the way to So. Station. I hung back a little to watch the train leave. It had an all New Haven stainless and orange consist with a pair of FL9s on the head end. I could see the engineer leaning out and looking for the conductor's signal. The last passengers got off the train and the conductor got back onto the step of the parlor car (they knew how to be comfortable), and using a flashlight, swung up a classic proceed signal. Two toots on the FL9s Hancock whistle and off they went heading down the track toward Readville. So much better than the !@#$ beeps on the Amtubes.
Now, one last departure story which came to mind after looking at all of the L&N-related material. I know this happened because I was there. Those of you who ever spent any time around the old L&N recall that they did things with a sense of style.
A casket had to be loaded into the baggage car of the southbound Pan American. This was not an easy task, even though it was on baggage wagon. The station baggage man did his best, and the remains were properly and respectfully loaded for "the last trip home."
In the meantime, the conductor was anxious to get rolling. Nashville was a passenger engine change, so there was an E7/E8 combination (back to back, of course) powering the train. The conductor highballed the Pan, and the engineer (whose nickname was "Scalded Dog" because he was such a fast runner) hauled back on the throttle and those E's started snarling. They had been idling for awhile, so there was enough smoke to make you think were on a destroyer screening larger vessels.
All of a sudden out of the smoke (in a thick Middle Tennessee accent) came a hair-raising scream, "Stop the train, stop the !@#$ train, I ain't goin' to Bummingham with no stiff!" They got the train stopped a little past the end of the platform and the terrorized baggage man bailed out and ran back rapidly toward the station. Two things stuck in my mind - I didn't know the baggage man knew any of those words, and I had never seen him move so fast.
Barkeep, two fingers of the good stuff for all baggage men.
I'll be running late on Monday and Tuesday (know that already), but will do my best to post.
Work safe
Okay folks make sure you tip Ruth nicely for the rest of her shift, hopefully it won't be too boring for her. I'll grab another coffee to go there Ruth and I'll drop of this little encore for the assembled. Then it's off to work I go.
To classic Ad's to enjoy
Good morning Ruth. I'd love a coffee oh and since Doug's not in yet I'll ave his usual two #3's to get it kicked into gear.What's that No I don't wsh one of the new and improved prune danishes,tell you what I'll buy one for Boris,oh and with Lars out for a few days can you set up the usual treats for the rest of the critters,thank's so much.Nice to see a few faces in so far this am.
Eric-Good luck on your research of that small switcher,could be a whitcomb built unit as well but alot of times they were a tad bigger and diesel powered.I know that the transit companies like diong maintenance and tests of new equipmnet at night, makes sence I suppose less traffic and pring eyes if something should go wrong. The TTC usually does all their testing well after midnight as well,also if the maintenance equipment comes out it's always after the witching hour.
To answer your question a great dael of that trackage is still existant in one form or another.Parts of the Toronto Suburban are still in use ,the TTC purchased from CNR the city portions of the line about ten miles of which still make up the harbourfront loop of the TTC. The belt line is still around with both CN and CP using it to keep freight traffic out of downtown.Parts of the Mimico-Port Credit interurban trackage make up CN's Lakeshore line which carries the bulk of Go Transits commuter trains from Burlington straight through Union Station to Pickering and Ajax.Of the other interurbans mentioned probably 50% of the grand River railway and Lake Erie and Northern trackage still exist carrying CP trains to and from the Toyota Plants babbcocx and Wilcox etc in and around Cambridge and Kitchener. CN still switches several industries here in Brantford on what was LE&N trackage.Of coarse the obly portion of the Toronto Suburbans interurban trackage left is the 40 acre parsell our museum sits on though it is a land locked ROW with no connections to the outside rail world.
Well nice to see young James pop in with some good info on the Misabe. Always and interesting railroad with some equally interesting history ! They were always known for their big brutal locomotives big chunky 0-80 steamers and the big articulated ore haulers as well.A classic example of an industry dependant and based railroad. coarse once they hit the diesel age they still went with the nice heavy duty loco's SD9's and 18's and big oversized SD38's and some rebuilt SD40-3's made from SD45's by Boise locomotive works. Once in a while I see the odd SD38 in full Missabe paint run through on a CN frieght train though they tend to keep the Iron Ranges power on it's home rails.Good show and good choice to keep things perking along today
Well Ruth another coffee and here's a bit of cash to keep the day flowing for the afternooners.
Ruth- Oh, that smell of fresh brewed coffee lead me here. So I'm going to need a cup of that nice coffee and a pastry please. Thanks!
Alright, I'm going to drop off an interesting little article on the DM&IR a railroad that no longer lives up to its name since the Canadian National has taken over. But a very interesting railroad at that!
The Duluth Missabe and Iron Range Railway
The Duluth, Missabe and Iron Range Railway (DM&IR) (AAR reporting marks DMIR) was a railroad operating in northern Minnesota and Wisconsin to haul iron ore and later taconite to the Great Lakes port of Duluth, Minnesota and Two Harbors, Minnesota. The railway was acquired on May 10, 2004, by Canadian National Railway (CN) when it purchased the assets of Great Lakes Transportation.
The DM&IR was formed by the 1938 merger of the Duluth and Iron Range Railway (D&IR) and Duluth, Missabe and Northern Railway (DM&N).
History
The D&IR was formed in 1881 by Charlemagne Tower to haul iron ore from the Minnesota Iron Co. in Tower, Minnesota to the new Lake Superior port of Two Harbors, Minnesota. The first ore shipment from the Soudan Mine over the D&IR was on July 31, 1884. The D&IR was acquired by Illinois Steel in 1887. In 1901, Illinois Steel became part of the newly formed United States Steel Corporation (USS) and the railway became part of its holdings.
The DM&N was incorporated in 1891 and the first load of iron ore was shipped to Superior, Wisconsin in October, 1892. (The formation of the railway was necessary after the discovery of high-grade Mesabi iron ore near Mountain Iron, Minnesota by the Merritt brothers. The D&IR was approached to construct a new branch line, but was not receptive.) The Merritt's expanded DM&N by laying track to Duluth, Minnesota in 1893 and built an ore dock there. The Merritt's shaky financial position, brought in part to building the Duluth expansion, allowed for John D. Rockefeller to gain control of the railway in 1894. In 1901, Rockefeller sold the DM&N to USS.
From 1901 to 1938 the two railways were owned and operated by USS and were operated independently.
Merger
By July of 1938 the two railways merged to form the DM&IR. The railway had two operating divisions, the Missabe and the Iron Range based upon their predecessor's roads. As the
No thanks, Leon, I'll pass! No fish fo... did you? Very nice indeed! Yeah, I'll take it. Don't forget the mushrooms!
A lot of interesting reading tonight, including pictures! I guess Manager Lars is down in the Keys tonight. I'll hope they will find what they are looking for!
Mike – Thanks for the round! Interesting URLs as usual!! You must spend a lot of time finding all those sites! Two pictures from Duluth, where they moved the station building to a new place sometime in the past. Maybe James has some info on that?Tom – Have I missed something? Count Robulla? Is that the strange creature in the dark corner? Hard to hear what he is mumbling about? Class X40 does not only look terrible, they are terrible and the railroad has a lot of problems with those trains, and when I say a lot I mean a lot! They are built by the French company Alstom. Thanks for the Burlington ad! Good idea! Take the train to Colorado Springs! Or ride SOO Line’s Mountaineer through the Canadian Rockies! The idiot of the week must have been a blonde, or...?Three weeks!CM3 – Wow, your info about Mike’s pictures is perfect! I had to open a second window so i could read your text and look at the pictures at the same time! As I said before, you have the wrong kind of job! Thanks for the round!James – Yes, the Norttheast Corridor is a very busy line. You are absolutely correct about about X40! There is one cab at each end and the top speed is 125 mph. Those trains are built by the French company Alstom. The railroad has had and still has a lot of problems with them since day one. They are roughly two years old. Thanks for those videos!! Most interesting and impressive! I saw #844 on display at the World’s Fair in New Orleans 1984. She was then numbered 8444. DD40X #6915 is in the picture below. I know, I have shown it before but...
Pete – Yes, there were some places where helpers, or banking locomotives, were used and there are actually at least one place where they still use them in the fall when the leafs are coming off the trees making the rails extremely slippery. I will try to find my notes about the gas locomotive this weekend. I think Rob is correct about Plymouth. Rob – The only problem getting pictures of the new light rail cars is that most test runs are run during night time, after midnight. Tonight they are running some high speed tests. I think you may be right about the gas locomotive! Plymouth sounds kind of right. I’ll try to find out this weekend. Interesting reading about Toronto’s commuter lines! What is left today? Doug – That was a good joke, I am glad I’m not a thirsty, talking dog. What time do you get out of bed? 4:30 in the morning at your stable? I can say right away, a horse is not for me. I am allergic to early mornings! But I hope you will find a good horse!
Leon my good man I think another helping of Fish and another bottomless Keith's is in order.I'll drop off a new feature for all to enjoy and part from here for now.
CLASSIC JUICE #39 TORONTO'S FIRST COMMUTER LINES
By 1890 Toronto was booming the old Union station was bursting at capacity and the heavily industrialized shoreline was covered with railyards and the pall of coal smoke from plants and locomotives and the steamships and ferries that called on the portlands.
Meanwhile in the purer air of the suburbs, the landboom was well underway.In this period a group of businessmen decided to build a new railway line,radical in it's design and approach.It would encircle the booming city and would link up with the various radial ( interurban ) lines then being built to and from the city.
This would be the Belt Line Railway. It would consist of two belts,starting from a station in the Don Valley, the Rosedale Station. From here one loop would creep up the valley from the Don River towards the Mount Pleasant Cemetary.Then it would angle northwest to Bathurst street and then bend west to the Grand Trunk line and follow it south into the city.From the Davenport Station,located just south of St Clair the second belt llop would venture westerly to lambton and follow a route southerly along the east bank of the Humber River to Swamsea station on the western branch of the Grand Trunk line.
The plan called for ten stations,two of which it would share with the Grand Trunk ( stations at Davenport and Parkdale )While most of the other stations were set up as flagstops.The pne built at Moore Park was the pride of the line.Of all the new subdivisions the line would serve Moore Park was the wealthiest.To fit in with the giant mansions and wide streets, local archetect John Moore designed this grand station with four turrets and placed it in the middle of a large park.
Unfortunatly the park with it's public gardens was never completed as two yeasr after te lines completion, the boom collapsed and the Belt line was absorbed by the Grand Trunk and used as an industrial spur ( much of it still today infact )
The radial lines however were another story and were much more successfull.The first one the Metroploitan RR began as a horse car line running along Yonge street between Summerhill & Eglington St's. In 1890 the horses were replaced by speedier electric streetcars.Following the demise of the Belt Line,and the suburban growth recovered and this line now called the North Yonge railways continued north to Glen Echo by 1892 and Newmarket by 1899.To attract more customers the radial line started up recreation parks in Bond Head on the shores of Bond Lake a 200 acre park all together.And a second park on the large Glacial pond in the town of Oak Ridges.
Radial fever was now in full swing and radial lines were built westward to Port Credit in 1905,eastward to West Hill in 1906. Like the North Yonge line this line the toronto and Scarborough RR built parks to gain more business.Victoria Park at Blayntyre Street and the Toronto Hunt Club on Kingston road at Warden, and Scarborough Heights Park on St Clair.
Upto this point all these lines followed existing roads.In 1904 Mackenzie and Mann of the Canadian Northern fame satrted building their coast to coast railway empire and bought up these radial lines and began extending them acccross the countryside.The Toronto & Yrok was extended into Sutton on Lake Simcoe in 1909 with another Branch built to Schomberg known as the Schomberg and Auruora.In 1911 the Toronto Suburban then just a small streetcar line was added to the empire, and by 1917 was built into a radial reaching Guelph ontario, with twenty station stops between Weston & Guelph ( our musuem property is part of this old line ).
In 1912 when sir Adam Beck's Ontario Hydro entered the radial fray electric lines were everywhere in Ontario.Kitchener through Galt ( Grand River Railway ) Brantford to Port Dover ( Lake Erie and Northern )Hamilton to Brantford ( Hamilton & Brantford ) Hamilton to Beamsville and prot Dalhousie to Port Colbourne ( Niagara St Catharines and Toronto RR ) along with the proto type The London and Port Stanley which ran from London thorugh St Thomas to Port Stanley.
In 1922 when Mackenzie & Mann's Canadian Northern Empire failed Toronto's newly formed Toronto Transportation Commision (TTC) took over all the radials in the city while the Ontario Hydro Corp took over the North Yonge & the Scarborough radials.CNR assumed control of the NS&T and the Toronto Suburban as well as the Oshawa radial Railway and the Montreal and Southern Counties forming the CN electric lines.They even continued the construction on the eastern leg of the belt line which had worked stopped on it in 1913 eventually extending it to Coburg Ontario.
By 1927 buses and casr were sounding the death nell for the smaller radials.The Schomberg branch was the first to go followed in 1931 by the Toronto Suburban to Guelph.By 1936 most of the lines were gone with the Toronto york radil comming under the control of the TTC until it was replaced in 1954 by the Yonge Subway Line.The Ontario Hyudro lines faired better with the L&PS,GRR and LE&N all surviving till the late 1950's. Sinilarly the CN owned lines the NS&T and MS&C all made it to 1960 however losinbg bits and pieces along the way to abandonement since shortly after the war.A brief synposis.
Good evening again Leon. seems the place is a jumpin this PM good for the ka-chinging of the registers I'll just have another "wobbly pop " and relax upon my stool.
Doug-Good grief another horse! no wonder you have been so busy. The joke well it's gone and busted up the mk3 groanameter we will need to rebuild it bigger and better again. Oh look here comes Boris with his tool belt. every tool one needs so long as it's a hammer !
Tom-Okay as the senior attendee of your trip ,you get to misbehave I'm glad that the menu did it for you. As Pete and Nick will and would have attested to ,Mushy peas are a staple of the fish and chip shops, an aquired taste to be sure, one that I have never aquired.
I would say that eys the train equipment on both sides of the 49th were well worn out by wars end. One of the biggest killers of the street railways on both sides of the boarder as well. That and the raising of metal restrictions and the whloehearted road and car building booms of the late 40's and 50's, the true killers of rail travel along with their ally the airline industry.
Aren't those prices something else on those old calssic model trains.Mind you the cost of today's brand new stuff can give one pause as well. Have a great trip, we'll keeo er going best we can tomorrow You are right. We are small in number, but the info around this place is without equal on the forums.
IDIOT of thte Week #13
I work with an individual who plugged her power strip back into itself and for the sake of her own life, couldn't understand why her system would not turn on.
A deputy with our County Sheriff's office, no less!
STAY ALERT! - They walk among us . . . and they REPRODUCE!!
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Good Evening Gents!
Thought I'd provide my catch-up before Friday morning gets here . . .
CM3 at 8:55 AM today: A super-fine effort with the descriptions of those URL/Pix - simply a superb effort! 5- Salute for Shane!
Anyone who has experienced the train stations of the halcyon days of passenger railroading, regardless of where, will thoroughly enjoy those URLs from Mike. If you haven't "clicked," do so . . .
A shame we haven't more day trip options out of St. Louis via Amtrak. We do have 5 trains daily running both ways between downtown & Chicago, however, only 2 can be safely used for a same-day return. The KCity trip, in spite of the drastic schedule changes, provides for one turn-around in the same day. That's it. The positive "spin" is that those 3 are better ‘n nothing, eh We'll be safe - thanx!
Appreciate the visit, round ‘n quarters ‘n of course the Post!
James at 5:27 PM ‘n 7:;09 PM today: Really another fine inclusive ‘n informative Post from Duluth. Spending more time with us than in recent times, but most welcome, fer sure, fer sure! [
Looking forward to viewing your creativeness with that GE loco . . .
Glad to note that you are picking up on the "benefits' of this bar in that the exchange of information on Classic Trains is absolutely beyond rival. I'll match the "stuff" from our crew with any other Forum ‘n Thread IN TERMS OF CONSISTENCY, ACCURACY and all with GOOD INTENTIONS! Don't see the "crap" here because those frequenting this establishment have "signed on" to civility with a lot of fun thrown in.
Regarding the Northeast Corridor: There's a long history with that area in terms of passenger railroading. Just think about the population centers between Boston and Washington, DC and then the figure out the numbers. It's staggering, fer sure, fer sure. Makes much more sense to take the trains between many of those cities rather than put up with short-haul airline flights and jammed packed highways. So that corridor must be for passenger trains ONLY. It's perhaps one of the better dedicated passenger rights-of-way in North America. Now having said that, just think of what the Europeans have going for them, then it's worth a trip to the Rat's Patoot Room. <groan>
Great URLs, by the by!
Again, appreciate the work you put into your Posts, but more importantly your willingness to interact with the guys . . .
Pete at 7:13 PM today: Was beginning to wonder about our Bar Chandler, but right before I Posted this - there you were (Rob too!!). Soooooo . . . .
Some fine info on the URLs and in the body of your Post. Always look forward to what you have to say and I must admit, I "understand" your writing much more so than . . . .
Oh yes, we WILL visit the hobby store BEFORE heading off to the TrainWreck - for several reasons! <grin> But we can't get too comfortable, as we then must head downtown to pick up Doug at the Amtrak "shack" in mid-day . . .
See ya aboard the train in the AM!! Should be in Jeff City about 2 hours after I board at Kirkwood.
Rob at 7:15 PM today: Hot on the heels of the Wolfman, eh Anyway, great to have you aboard and appreciate the MENU!! Now THAT should make even Eric develop a taste for fish! <grin> Nicely done, Chief Chef!
I don't have that book, but will jot down the title for future use . . . Thanx!
Eight hours in a dome sounds good to me, any time!
I've thrown a lot of money into model railroading, but I surely draw the line at buying "vintage" stuff at the prices being commanded these days (daze) - no thanx!
Not to detract from your point regarding the vintage passenger cars, but consider this: U.S. equipment was totally worn out during the WWII years because of the massive troop movements from coast to coast, coupled with the "normal" travel demands by a traveling population considerably larger than north of the 49th. So the railroads had to go with the new. As I see it, the cars were flat out worn out . . .
Behave Well, perhaps one of us should - but which one is the question!!?? <grin>
Again, really a fine job with the MENU (except the "mushy peas") - haven't had anything like that since the days (daze) of our wandering Minstrel, Nick!
Evening Tom and friends. A bottomless draught for me if you please and a round for the house. Still having a heck of a time doing anything train related this week, as Tom well knows. I'm at our stable 3 times a day. First at 4:30am each morning, then a drop-in around 5:30, and a final lock-down after 9pm. I've also been in the process of acquiring another horse since last Saturday, and have been pulling out of work on and off to do a lot of running around. The only decision left to make is which one to get, and I'm spending all kinds of time with several horses in different locations every day. It's looking like I'll have my new horse in hand about this same time next week, but until then, I'm working on the process of selecting the right horse, for me. I hope that satisfactorily explains why I have been so scarce recently. I certainly am no less interested in train-related topics or hanging at the bar and socializing with ya'll.
The thread still looks awfully good guys, as always. Can you name another thread that has as much to offer?
James likes my jokes??? Are you feeling OK?
Here's another one to test your gag reflex until my next return:
A dog walks into a bar. He hops up on a bar stool and puts his front paws on the bar. He looks the bartender right in the eye and says, "Hey, guess what? I'm a talking dog. Have you ever seen a talking dog before? How about a drink for the talking dog?" The bartender thinks for a moment and says, "Alright. The toilets right around the corner."
Hi Leon , another Keith's and I'll grab the Halibut n chips no hold the mushy peas for me we made them speacial for Pete. speaking of which
Pete-You snuck in while I was typing , I'm glad that you are having a go at the Fish and chips H&H will be pleased, they love it when thier favourite "Englander" enjoys the food they create. Neat links to that musuem I too found the load a bit sklow but worth it. hopefully your pics of those UP passenger cars turn out,I had the supprise to see a UP SD70M (4606 ) leading a CN manifest freight through Brantford not two hours ago, followed by two CN SD75I's and an old SD40-2 witht eh wide CN cab on it. A shock to see a big yellow engine leading through these parts. I'm supprised that 0-6-0's would have been used as helpers. The difference between the railroading in both countries I would suspect.A good friend of mines dad owns a small aluminum die casting factory in St Catharines, it's located along the Welland canal. When he first opened up the plant in 1953 he and his family stayed in an apartment built on top of the factory. CN's canal subdivision ran up alongside the plant and CN used two Mikado's ( the heavy belpair fire boxed 3700's ) as pushers for the canal sub grade, which was close to 3% over ten miles from Merriten to the top of the hill at lock seven.Suffice to say the noise of a mountain pulling the train with two mikes pushing cut in just in front of the caboose kept the family amused and awake on more than one occation. No radio's in the locomotives at that point so they "talked" to each other via whistle and bell signals, that and the thrashing of valve gear and the spinning of wheels must have been a sight to behold.On many occations espeacially in the spring and fall when the rail was wet, the trains would have to be doubled to make it up the hill.Even the RDC's that provided the local passenger service tended to just make the hill.The streetcars of the NS&T which ran up the opposite bank of the canal didn't have near as tough a time,those heavy duty westinghouse traction motors were a thing of beauty
Good evening Leon,figured I would pop by and make sure that H&H were not sluffing off thier duties on this fish fry night.I'll gab a frosty Keith's while I make sure that the menu is off sufficiant grandeur
So here goes on tap for this evening.
All the usual sides will; be available as well.
So now to the acknowlogments for the day.
Tom-Yup looks like eric and I are continuing to be the late night bookends ariound this here joint.loved the redo's of the "Q" and The Mountaneer passenger trains. If you have greg McDonel's Signatures in Steel there are some good shots of the Mountaineer in the fifties You are sooo right about the cost of those Ives trains nowaday's, they make vintage Lionel pricesseem cheap by comparasin. The big Hobby Shop in my hometown of st Catharines gets old sets in of all manufacturers, usually as a result of a death or some other reason for estate collections to materialize. Last summer a ten car two locomotive set including track and transformer from Ives showed up, and sold for a price that was in the high 4 didget range
It is too bad that all that postwar money ended up being wasted on passenger equipment,at least up here VIA ran and still runs some of the classic equipment alot longer than Amtrak did. Different strokes for differnt folks though I suppose. To me air travel will never have the same mystery or appeal as travelling by train.
As always, that ACR trip is an open invite for the two of you,8 hours in a dome car what could be better. I know 3 days in the dome at the end of the Canadian
Hope you and Pete behave yourselves tomorrow
Eric-I await the shots of those new Phoenix cars with bated breath.Interesting shot of that X train as well. I aggree with Tom a little utilitarian looking but I'm sure that it gets the job done. Those C&O staem turbines were big brutes. I had thought I had seen a few shots of them in with some of wikipedias info on the C&O.If that little industrial switcher you snapped the picture of in Iowa was gas powered , then I would tend to think that it was a Plymouth.
Mike-urls galore thank-you. I'll have to go peruse them a bit more carefully some of them were a tad slow loading and I didn't have the patience, but I'll get back to them
James-Yup you most likely did ride an NP car one of them was a Western Pacific car as well. Thgey have been re-moddeled many times over the years though so the interiors may not quite match up to as built specs.Too bad about the operater on that engine, perhaps it was just a "bad day " Oh on other happy steam notes the BC govt owned Royal Hudson 2860 made three or four full power test runs last week and is an inspection away from resuming excursion service for the first time in almost a decade
CM3-So you think your old falcon was in one of Mike pics eh that would be quite the "small world " occurance I remember reading about that ill fated coaling dock. I had thought it was a CPR one out west though. I'll have to go do some research. I know that the CPR also had difficulties removing one of the TH&B's coal docks wehn then tore out the old steam servicing facilities in Hamilton's Aberdeen yards a couple yeasr back. The water tower and roundhouse also caused them some fits. all torn out to build a big steel transloading facility for the two big steel plants in Hamilton.
A pint of Batham's bitter and the Fish ‘N' Chips later please RUTH.
JAMES Glad you enjoyed the link to the Woodhead site. The large loco in the link was a Beyer-Garratt articulated loco; it was the largest locomotive to work on British Railways with a Tractive Effort of 72,949lb. It was built to bank trains up the Wordsborough incline on the Woodhead route; after the line was electrified it was tried on the Lickey Incline but was not too successful there. The Lickey Incline was a two mile bank at a 2.65% grade. I have a link to the Incline.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lickey_Incline.
I was lucky enough to have been to the incline in steam days. The locos on the banking (I believe they are called Helpers over here) were Ex Great Western 0-6-0 Pannier tank locos and the loco, which took over from a locomotive that had been built by the Midland Railway in their Derby Works in 1919 for the Lickey Incline. It lasted until the mid 1950s its whole career spent banking trains up the incline apart from when the loco went back to Derby Works for overhaul. The loco that took over was a BR Standard 9F 2-10-0 No 92079. I have found a link to some great photos of steam and diesels on the Incline over the years.
http://lickeyarchive.photobook.org.uk/c731782.html
From some of the photos you can get a sense of a steam loco and the bankers working hard to get the train up the grade. It really was a fantastic experience to see.
ROB I am afraid basement, where I am hoping to put the model layout, is a bad word here at the moment.
With The streetcars, a lot of the European cities had the sense to keep their systems and avoided the great expense England has had to pay to put in the light rail systems.
Enjoyed the Postwar Passenger on the C&O it was interesting to read of the C&O Steam-Turbine-Electric which was to haul the Chessie. I wonder if the turbine had been a success, if the design could have challenge the diesels. I guess the turbine must have been a very costly experiment.
ERIC Glad you liked the link to the Woodhead site, there is some good photos in the link to the Lickey. Were there any inclines in Sweden that required the services of banking locomotives.
I see Rob has put forward a couple of suggestions on that small gas engine but it would be great if you can find some more info on it.
Thanks for the link to the Northeast Corridor
MIKE I hope Amtrak gets us into Kansas City on time as we can hopefully go the WW1 Museum.
Many thanks for the great photos in your links; the old engines in the 1864 Nashville photos are great. Enjoyed the pics of the Union Station in KC and many thanks CM3for adding the details to Mike's two posts. I do enjoy reading your details then going back to the photo to have a look again. As the lines in that triple junction are still in use I suppose that it would be possible to get another photo of three trains at once.
TOM. Great to talk to you again yesterday.
Really glad you missed the storms, luckily we did not get it as bad as it was predicted it could be earlier in the day.
My model isHO/OO gauge, it says the track is Bachmann E-Z Tracksystem.
I tried the link to the Woodhead site later and mine was very slow although it seemed quicker earlier today.
It will be good to go to the model shop in Kirkwood. It will be 3 years last October since I was last there; it is amazing how the time flies by. I think it would be a good idea to go there before the TrainWreck as it strange how beer can seem to loosen the wallet.
Many thanks for the Burlington and the Soo line Train Nostalgia encores. I see in the Burlington Route they are advertising the Chicago Railroad Fair of that year, 1949 I wonder if DOUG as any info on what the exhibits were.
The Union Pacific stock I saw last night was
COLUMBINE AND CITY OF PORTLAND Dome Cars
PORTLAND ROSE, KATY FLYER and the car with the small balcony FEATHER
RIVER
What appeared to be a generator car was #220
They looked good, hopefully I had some pics of them but they are in the 35mm camera.
Sorry this post is late but the electrician came to see what work we needed doing, so I got tied up. I see JAMES as called in and I will read the post now.
Looking forward to tomorrow, lets hope Amtrak behaves itself.
Well Leon a round and then
Thanks Leon for the refill. I am good for now on food, but thanks for offering!
I have a few classic videos to drop off.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoGBL0XFjQ8
This is the UP DD40X #6936
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XCY63OQqP4&mode=related&search=
Now this thing is absolutely impressive!!! UP steamer #844 is racing along with it's huge passenger train. I would love to see this thing!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWU7ER2y2wI&mode=related&search=
Here UP #844 is flying along at probably 60 MPH!! What a cool steamer! This is the best video of that steamer.
Leon- Could I get a coffee along with a turkey sandwich, Thanks. And also get the guys a round on me. Thanks again!
Well, today I'm on page 48. Not as many acknowledgements but leaves room for some other neat'o stuff!
CM3- Neat little advertisements on the slumber coaches and on the B&O coal lines. I was really surprised at how many different companies contributed to the coaling lines. Thanks for sharing. Well, I am really surprised to hear that the coaling docks still stand after all this time. I thought for sure that all would be gone, but when you said the CN pulled one down across it's two mainline tracks...... That had to stick!! Of course 12 foot thick walls are nothing to laugh at either.
Rob- Thanks for clearing things up on the Booze line. What an interesting line indeed. Thanks.
It has been a busy three days alright but, it has been one interesting ride all the way there. Some pretty cool stuff has been posted that deserves some attention. Yup, I love those GEs. In fact I was practicing my drawing this last week and I decided that I would try to draw a newer GE locomotive. The GE website came out with the evolution series locomotive and they had a couple of computer drawings of it. So.. I started drawing it. And now I'm almost done. So I should probably scan it on to my computer and show you guys. I know, it's a newer locomotive but It's a cool drawing. I will see if I can find anymore 3D computer drawings of locomotives.
Ya, I didn't think those Algoma Central cars were original, but I didn't know they were NP. So I might have ridden in an NP car!! But I'm not to sure. Like I said, I'm going to look at the video and see if I can find the car on the internet. It would be pretty cool to find that car. I would like to ride another and just see if it had the same type of design as the car I rode in. I do remember what it looked like inside. Maybe that could help determine what car it is. I can certainly draw it and scan it.
Thanks for the article on the postwar C&O. Now I know how the passenger trains got the name, "The Chessie" I thought they got the name for the kitty but I guess the public got to that name before the railroad. Pretty cool stuff. Thanks for sharing.
Pete- The 261 is an absolutely beautiful train but..... Unfortunately the man who runs her is not the nicest man. He thinks he's bigger and better than anybody and he acts like it to. He's not a pleasant man. I think it's very unfortunate.
The B&O #50 passenger loco is located at the St. Louis museum of transportation. You can view it here. http://www.museumoftransport.org/collection.htm Before 1995 the loco was looking pretty ruff and then in 1996 it got a make over and now it looks really nice again. She still survives which is a good thing. Plus you can look at all the other locomotives they have on display. Pretty cool looking place.
I also saw the Bell on the King George. That is a really shiny bell. Where is it located
Ah yes, The search lights on the B&O dome car. It's pretty cool and it must have been a thrill to ride that thing at night. What a car!
Eric- Glad you liked the models. I plan on building a passenger train so we'll see how that turns out. But I'm also going to have to show you guys the revised yard I built last weekend. So probably this Wednesday's optional toy and model train showing i will post the pictures! Thanks for the link to the North East Corridor. So it's all passenger trains. Wow! There are a lot of commuter rails that utilize that track. Especially when the whole line is electrified. I know of one train which traverses this line, and that would be Acela. Of course, now I know a lot of passenger trains that run a long this line.
Ok, your picture of the X40 wasn't too bad. I have seen a lot worse. I just have one more question. I'm guessing that this passenger train is able to run in both directions with the to cab units at each end, right Then I guess I'm looking at one of those ends, correct
Tom- Thanks for the passenger nostalgia on the Burlington route. I have a friend who is big into the Burlington route. In fact he is a locomotive engineer on the Canadian National. But he loves the Burlington route and his collection is really nice. Thanks for the info.
Ah yes, more info on the Soo line and this time on the Mountaineer. Pretty cool stuff there too. Also a nice looking little schedule there too. Thanks for sharing.
Mike- Dropped off some more "clicks and pics" And some of those pics are really nice too. I was really impressed with the Nashville Union Station. That is quite a fancy looking station and that clock tower really gives it it's character. Thanks for sharing.
And why not another ad from yesteryear Something to fill in the "slot" for Manager Lars while he's down south . . . .
PASSENGER TRAIN NOSTALGIA #35
Initially Posted on Page 180 of the original Thread
Here's something to ponder with regard to our appreciation and fascination with Classic Trains. Check this out (from The Official Guide of the Railways - 1956)
The MountaineerFamous Train through the CANADIAN ROCKIES THIS YEAR will operate Daily June 29 thru August 28 between ST. PAUL - MINNEAPOLIS AND THENORTH PACIFIC COAST Via Soo Line St. Paul-Portal . . . . . . . . . . . Can. Pac. Ry. Portal-Vancouver.
Through Standard Sleeping Cars offering Drawing-room, Compartment, Bedrooms, Roomette and Open Section accommodations, also excellent Dining Car Service. Note - The Mountaineer is Diesel Electric Powered between ST. PAUL, MINN., and Portal, N.D. and in the Mountains. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . From ST. PAUL June 29 thru Auust 28. Exmpl . down . . . From VANCOUVER July 2 thru August 31 . . up . . . Exmpl Sat . . . 9 40 PM .lv St. Paul (C.T.) . . . . . . (Soo Line) . . . . . . . .ar 7:15 AM Sat " . . . . 1025 PM lv Minneapolis . . . . . . . . . (Soo Line) . . . . . . . .ar 6 30 AM " Mon . . 7 15 AM ar Calgary (M.T.) . . . . . . . (Can. Pac.). . . . . . . lv 7 20 PM Thu " . . . . 10 30 AM ar Banff . . . . . . . . . . . . . (Can. Pac.) . . . . . . . lv 4 35 PM " " . . . . 11 45 AM ar Lake Louise . . . . . . . . .(Can. Pac.) . . . . . . lv 2 40 PM " " . . . . 12 55 PM ar Field (M.T.) . . . . . . . . . (Can. Pac.) . . . . . . lv 1 30 PM " Tue . . . 7 50 AM ar Vancouver (P.T.) . . . . . (Can. Pac.) . . . . . . lv 6 30 PM Wed " . . . . 10 00 AM lv Vancouver . . . . . . . . . . (C.P.S.S.) . . . . . . . ar 5 25 PM " " . . . . 2 15 PM ar Victoria . . . . . . . . . . . . .(C.P.S.S.) . . . . . . . lv 1 10 PM " " . . . . 9 00 PM ar Seattle (P.T.) . . . . . . . . .(C.P.S.S.) . . . . . . . lv 8 00 AM " C.T. - Central time; M.T. - Mountain Time; P.T. - Pacific Time
Good Morning Barkeep and all Present; coffee, please; round for the house and $ for the jukebox. Sorry I missed yesterday, but was out all day (work, work, work).
Lots of pictures to talk about so we'll begin there.
I enjoyed the card of the "new" coal pier at Newport News. Spent a lot of time there over the years - it is interesting to watch rotary car dumpers at work.
The pictures of the "George Washington" at Alexandria and Richmond show C&O steam in all its glory; polished cylinder heads, George Washington cameo on the smokebox, etc. Too bad we could not enlarge the cars. They would have been dark (almost olive) green with the train name in gold - lovely! Look sharp and you will see different types of locomotives as well.
The triple crossing is still with us.
The shots at Central Station in Louisville show how close it was to the river - flooding posed a lot operational problems. C&O later moved to Louisville Union Station which was closer to the center of town, on a little higher ground; more about that later.
Clifton Forge, Virginia, has always been a busy spot on the C&O. It was a division point marking the boundary between the C&Os Mountain Subdivision and the Alleghany Subdivision (Yes, Tex, that's the correct spelling in this part of the country). Also the James River line splits from the Mountain sub just east of Clifton Forge.
Clifton Forge had a locomotive facility, shop, classification yard and everything that went along with it. The 1958 picture shows the station which does not look all that different today. The big wooden structure behind the station is the Railroad YMCA; it's gone now. The PRR Pullman is set out for servicing. It handled passengers from New York to the Homestead resort. B4 I forget Amtrak 50/51 stop at Clifton Forge.
The shot at Staunton is a little misleading as it does not show the track layout which is a tight curve on a wicked westbound grade - a challenge for train handling. The Staunton station is nicely preserved and an Amtrak stop for 50/51.
Handley, WV is on the Fayette/Kanawha County line. There's not much there now, but when I first moved here, it was a busy place with an engine facility, turntable, yard, etc. It is the home of WV Institute of Technology and also a station stop for Amtrak. The picture was made just west of Handley looking up the Kanawha River toward Charleston which is approximately 24 miles west of where the photographer was standing.
Oh Lord, what to say about the second set of pictures.
The Pan and the George - add that to the piece I sent. I looked to see if I was in some of those pictures, but I wasn't. Anyway, check out the shot of the Pan in the train shed at Louisville. The windows at the end of the shed were all different colors. Look carefully at the consist - you'll see a counter lounge car is the second ca rin the picture - it is the one which has the side that looks as if it's all blanked out.
Nashville 1970 - I was there; think I spotted my old Falcon in the parking lot in one of the shots. Inside the shed you'll see mail handling equipment. The Nashville depot was right next to the main Post Office, and back in the day when mail traveled by train, they did a ferocious business in mail. The photographer is looking south. The Pan used to run on the tracks to the right of the picture and the Georgian to the left. Kayne Avenue Yard was immediately to the right. The picture of the CSX train shows the Nashville Station as it looks today. The shed is gone because it was disintegrating. Kayne Avenue is in the foreground of the picture. The photographer is looking east.
The shots inside the waiting room are as I remember it. This is still with us as the station has been converted into a hotel. Thanks, Mike for sending them along.
Rob sent lots of post merger/postwar C&O material. The picture of the C&O train at Cincinnati that Mike sent gives you a flavor of what it was like-C&O and B&O cars mixed together. C&O ordered a ton of passenger cars after the war, most of which never got to them as the bottom fell out of passenger business. The C&O sold them to a bunch of different railroads.
James sent some interesting pictures. The shot of the CS train with the mixed consist is an interesting one. There was just a handful of WM painted engines left by the time that picture was made. One of them was a chopped GP9 (that's the one in the picture). The coal docks still stand - awful hard to knock something down that has 12-foot thick walls filled with rebar. Maybe Rob can help me with this one, but I recall that CN tried doing that one time and pulled the whole structure down across two mainline tracks - it was a !@#$ of a mess. Also thanks for the MILW model shots.
Eric - Thanks for the kind words.
OSP (as always) keeps us going. Historical material and Ives stuff (love it!) And then Burlington today.
Note to travelers- Have a safe trip and enjoy yourselves.
Thought something from the original Thread might liven up the joint, so how about his one
PASSENGER TRAIN NOSTALGIA #34
Initially Posted on Page 178 of the original Thread
Here's something to enjoy regarding the BURLINGTON ROUTE in a 1949 advertisement from my private collection:
VISIT Colorful Colorado!Land of a Million Thrills!
* No vacation empire in all the world offers you more variety - more sheer enjoyment! Mile-high Denver and its mountain parks . . . picturesque Colorado Springs and pikes Peak region . . . the grandeur of Rock Mountain National-Estes Park . . . the friendly Dude Ranches. Ride or hike! Fish or golf! Go sightseeing or just be lazy! Whatever you choose, Colorado gives you extra pleasure!
For Speed, Comfort, Pleasure . . . Go Burlington!
* Choose between two famous diesel-powered streamlined trains -0 the DENVER ZEPHYR, overnight every night from Chicago to Colorado . . . or the CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR, with its entrancing Vista-Domes. Extra speed, extra luxury . . . but no extra fare!
BURLINGTON'S 100th ANNNIVERSARY * 1849-1949 Way of the Zephyrs
VISIT THE CHICAGO RAILROAD FAIR JUNE 25 - OCT 2
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