"OUR" PLACE - SEE NEW THREAD!

[West Coast S]

Morning Tom and the gang...

What a weekend! What a week, Cuppa joe if you please.

Exceptional posting CM3, It's a shame that the great coal hauling roads are now just a memory. The era of the super mergers may be great for the stockholders, but not the railfan or historically inclined ,somehow the railroading world seems a bit empty with their absence.

Russell, Ted, good info on KC, I was relieved to see that E unit dressed in the proper colors, I understand KCS is seriously considering bringing those colors back, can you imagine modern power done up that way, would be one sharp looking fleet indeed!

Tom, love the fallen flag theme and anadotes , Pictures, you want pictures? Got lots of pictures, now to get off my duff and scan my select 35mm collection to disc, takes time to review over 4000 negatives you know!

A round of thanks to all who make "Our Place" what it is and a big kudo to Tom for providing the oppertunity to sit a spell and partake in our mutual love of classic railroading..

I'll return a bit later, gotta go put some fires out around the office, duty calls.

Dave [tup]

[siberianmo]

Mornin' Guys!

Another Monday and looks like we're off to a fine start with two of our more dependable regulars having jumped into the conversation; good seeing you coalminer3 CM3 and Ted ....... [tup]

Looks as if the Track Gang Pool Tournament has hit a snag and has been postponed until further notice. Actually, postponed until bail is made sums it up a bit better! The Can-Am Flyers, The CP Railers and the CN Noodles were doing fine in the round robin affair - up until someone decided that it was time to see who could down the most beer between turns at the table. Leon the Night Man set up a couple of kegs in the pool room and they were drained before he got back to the bar - or so it seemed. Pool turned to boys being boys, and the next thing you know, the Mentor Village Constabularly and Volunteer Fire Department descended upon "Our" Place to break up the friendly scuffle. Fortunately, the boys took most of it out back, but the pool cues and a few pitchers bit the dust. And I'm not too sure just how that keg wound up wedged between the urinals in the men's room - but some things are better off not being explained. Boris was overheard saying, "Me having great fun - me like bashing heads, me ........." Fortunately, Leon got him away from the main brawl and somehow managed to shackle him inside his shed. What a weekend!

CM3 I see that Fayette County is in southeastern WVA ... didn't know that. Pretty rugged country - but then again, so is the entire state. Should have been named something other than West Virginia - pehaps something more relevant to the mountainous terrain. Those Appalachians are great in that part of the country .... [tup]

Enjoyed the accounting of the C&O and it brought back some memories of viewing those long coal trains that I used to see while passing through the state to & from Ohio. Those were up north, to the east of Wheeling if I recall. That was back in the early 60's - have no clue what things are like up that way today.

Thanx for the round and the funds to replenish our pool equipment! [swg]

Ted Didn't catch the show you mentioned, and probably wouldn't have know it was even on. I'm terrible when it comes to browsing through the TV section to find out what's on. Saturday evening we were at the theatre and last night we watched a DVD concert - The Eagles "Hell Freezes Over" tour. Really great stuff, love their music! Also have their "Farewell 1 Tour" DVD - which is next on the viewing list for a night when we get tired of watching same-o, same-o on FOX News or CNN!

Know exactly what you mean when it comes to the pricing for those "millionaire" trains. We priced the Rocky Mountaineer a few years back for one of their 8 days/nights tours, beginning and ending in Vancouver, BC. Came to somewhere around $15k for the two of us. Can you bellieve it? That's way out of our league; 8 days at that! <yikes>

Glad you noticed and appreciate the heralds posted on Sunday. My hope is that the guys will catch on to this and save up their relevant Classic Trains photos - real or model - for Posting then. As you said,. Sunday is rather perfect for that kinda thing.

Catch ya later! [tup]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[Anonymous]

Good Mornin' to all you early risers. Tom, can't wait to get my chops around a Black Rasberry Danish and a cuppa Joe. Russell, thanks for the mail, have replied to same post haste. I had an uneventful weekend but then, most of my weekends are pretty much like any other day. The "live steam" crowd will be starting their activities over in Largo (FL) soon. Its a real "kick" to see the little kids wide eyed and excited with steam, smoke and cinders filling the air. Fairland Park (KCMO) had a 4-6-2, Pacific in 15" guage that I rode as a Tot. Before my time (and most of yours), there was a Trolley Park across the river in North KCMO which, until destroyed by fire, was "the place to be" on a lazy summer weekend. I have some old pix of the place and WOW, does it beckon me back to that era when this was a totally different Country.[^]

I hope some found the time to watch the Travel Channel special on: "Riding Millionaires Rails." The Blue Train (S. Africa), Orient Express (refurbished Eorope) and Northern Belle (U.K.) were documented in good detail.[tup] Of course, it wasn't long before realizing these trains truly are targeted for the affluent.[:O] Beginning at around $4500, they are way out of my league.[V] The best I can do is a trolley ride to the Columbian Restaurant in Ybor City (Tampa). But, you know what? That ain't bad either.[:D] BTW, soon the Tourist season begins hereabouts (Nov. thru April), If any of "Our" Place folks have plans to perambulate around the Tampa Bay are, drop an e-mail in advance and we'll "do Tampa/St Pete."[8D]

Gunns, the "scull and disc" drivers had me going until I saw the "expanded view." The first frame looked like something out of a Rod Serling episode of "The Twilight Zone."[alien] Yes Tom, another winner from the "head shed." Sunday is perfect for sitting around the den, viewing slides and sharing memorabilia with the gang. The logos are surely appreciated and look great.[tup]

Gots'ta make this a wrap for now. Okay Boris, Herr Fleishmeister is interested in the Skunk hides for his Curio Shop. 'Says they will make great Daniel Boone caps for the kids. Looks like you and Leon may have the start of a small enterprise on your hands.[tup] But, how about something less odoriferous next Safari?[alien] Happy rails all.

[coalminer3]

Good Morning - Coffee, please. A round for the house and here's some money to replace broken cue sticks, etc. from the weekend!

I rec'd my October issue of RMC the other day and inside is a feast of delights for those of us interested in mining railroads, especially in the UP of Michigan. The title of the article is "From Out of the Past: The Isle Royale Copper Comapny Railroad." I am still studying the picture of IR Copper Co's No. 4, a 2-8-2T with a monstrous snowplow. Also some lovely pictures of Copper Range hopper cars.

"High and the Mighty" ran on AMC (I think) awhile back. The moral of the story is never fly with a pilot who whistles. Not a bad picture.

Today's installment, from the stack of notebooks is abt the C&O's operations in deepest Fayette County, WV. This dates back to when C&O was still C&O as you can tell from the references to trains and places; much of what's talked about in here is either gone or changed beyond recognition.

Quinnimont

The call sign was a simple QN, but Quinnimont was (and still is) a busy place on the C&O. The name Quinnimont means five mountains, and if you stand in the right place, you can see all five. Quinnimont was settled about a quarter century before West Virginia became a state, and was a quiet place until iron and coal were discovered and the railroad came.

The main line of the Chesapeake and Ohio sits on the north bank of the New River. The tracks exit the east portal of Stretcher’s Neck tunnel about one and one half miles west of QN, pass through Prince and sweep around a horseshoe bend in the River. There used to be a tower (cabin in C&O language) at Prince, call sign NI that controlled traffic to and from the Piney Creek line. NI cabin was torn down in one of the railroad’s periodic drives to reduce tax liabilities and other potential lawsuits by demolishing unneeded structures.

There are two yards at Quinnimont; one at the west end of the curve and one to the east the railroad hugs the base of Backus Mountain as it heads east toward Hinton. The west yard lead begins at Prince almost at the same spot where the Piney Creek branch enters the main line. The yard lead allows work to be done without having to tie up the branch. Also, Piney Men could leave QN and head up the branch without having to go out on the main line. A set of crossovers near NI allowed access to the main which made for additional operational flexibility.

Heading toward QN, the mainline is on the left (north) side and several yard tracks are to the right of the main. These tracks are used to hold loaded coal cars from mines near Beckley. These cars are picked up by eastbound coal trains as trailing point switches allow for a simple backup move. A short piece of mainline track separates the two yards. This is called the "neck" because the tracks pinch down. The tracks cross Laurel Creek on a wooden bridge that is in the middle of the neck. Sets of crossovers in the neck allow trains to cross from one main track to the other and to pick up and set out cars without having to run through too many switches. The east yard is on a curve and it can be entered from two directions. Typically westbound loads are set out in this yard and empty coal cars, which generally return from Tidewater, are set out for movement up the Piney Branch.

Immediately west of the neck is a wye. The middle of the wye used to have an engine house and other servicing facilities for the steam switcher that was based at QN. When I first started spending time at Quinnimont the old sandhouse was still there along with a wooden water tower and a water column located adjacent to the westbound main line.

The tail of the wye ran into a small yard and then to the Laurel Creek Branch which operated on almost vertical terrain from Quinnimont to Hemlock Hollow. Here was some tough railroading over terrain that looked more like that found in Colorado than in West Virginia. A resident told me about how as a boy he along with some of his friends would hitch a section car to a train headed up the branch and then ride the car from the top of the branch down into the yard at Quinnimont. This was pretty dangerous at any time, but was made even more so because the section cars had no brakes!

The shifters that ran on the line followed standard C&O practices except that the caboose was chained to the rear of the train as well as coupled, in case of a broken knuckle on the way up the branch. Coming down, retainers were turned up on all cars, train length was limited and engine crews were instructed to bail out if the speed got over about 10 miles per hour. It was not for the weak kneed or faint hearted. I rode the shifter a few times and was always very pleased to reach the end of the return side of the trip.

Have a good day.

work safe

[siberianmo]

MONDAY’s NEWS & SUMMARY of RECENT POSTS

Good Morning! A new day, a new week and another opportunity to spend a bit of time with us at ”Our” Place! Coffee’s fresh – The Mentor Village Bakery pastry case is full – and our light breakfasts are ready to serve ……. Whatillyahave [?] [tup]

News of the Day:

(1) Something new! Sunday Photo Day got off to a good start ….. check it out! You are invited to post your Classic Trains pix (real & model) on Sunday’s.

(2) Check out the Fallen Flags Posts on pages 106, 108, 109 and 110. The roads covered are: SP – MoPac – WP - Frisco and MKT. Heralds of the Fallen Flags are on page 112.

SUMMARY

Name - Date/Time - (Page#) – Remarks

(1) siberianmo Tom Posted: 18 Sep 2005, 01:11:12 (112) Sunday’s News & Summary

(2) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 18 Sep 2005, 07:25:27 (112)

(3) siberianmo Tom Posted: 18 Sep 2005, 12:01:38 (112) Picture Posting Day!

(4) siberianmo Tom Posted: 18 Sep 2005, 12:04:10 (112) Nostalgia RR heralds

(5) Trainnut484 Russell Posted: 18 Sep 2005, 13:12:50 (112)

(6) siberianmo Tom Posted: 18 Sep 2005, 15:24:27 (112) reply to Trainnut484

(7) siberianmo Tom Posted: 18 Sep 2005, 15:24:27 (112) reply to: Theodorebear & Trainnut484

(8) Gunns Kevin Posted: 18 Sep 2005, 15:41:59 (112)

=======================================
That’s it! [tup][;)]
Tom (Siberianmo) [4:-)] [oX)]
Proprietor of “Our” Place, an adult eating & drinking establishment!

[Gunns]

Rolled up and poped through the slot,


and an expanded view,


Gunns

[siberianmo]

G'day Gents!

Just returned with the Boyz from Can-Am Gorge ... <whew> what an afternoon! Those two really give me a workout ... Boris 'n Leon what a combo ....... just like a loco 'n tender! [swg]

Ted Didn't mean to ignore your Post .... Most times when we visit KCity on our semi-annual jaunts to western MO - we stay at Union Hill, either the Residence Inn or Fairfield Inn (relatively new). So, we're in close proximity to the WWI Memorial ... great tribute indeed to those who fought "The war to end all wars." Wouldn't it have been nice if only could've been true [?]

Russell I've seen some interesting consists at KC's Union Station. The KCS passenger train, on two occasions, over the years tops the list. At least 10 cars, if I remember, maybe a few more. Really somethng to see in that great looking livery. I've got some pix 'round here somewhere - but they're 35 mm and a bit labor intensive insofar as Posting 'em is concerned.

We're tryying to get something going for a trip to the Midland ..... Right now we're communicating by Email to coordinate it for Oct 1st. Looks like it might be Pete - me and Dan, along with our wives. So if you're interested drop me a note .....

Okay - here's a URL of pix to continue with our Sunday Photo Day::

http://photobucket.com/albums/b222/siberianmo/Can-Am%20RR%20display%20cases/

Enjoy! [tup]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[Trainnut484]

Good Afternoon Tom et all. I know we're closed today, so I'm slipping this GENTLY through the mail slot.

Thanks Tom for posting the Katy information earlier, and also posting logo pixes of great Fallen Flags. It's good to know my influence on something is positive for a change [;)] I was in a hurry last night to post mine.

Al, thanks for providing the 411 on the cars. As I was leaving, they were putting up the bright orange fencing that's in the second pix in the back of the cart. That won't make picture taking fun for classic train buffs next weekend.

Ted, I'll go back and see if those trucks in the second pix are old REA trucks. I'm glad the photos gave you a warm-hearted back home feeling. You have mail that has another heart-warming photo [;)]

Here's my pix for Sunday Photo Day:

UP E9 951 Topeka, KS RR Days 1993


Russell

[siberianmo]

Nostalgia time at "Our" Place ....... Here are some of MY favorite railroad heralds to kick off Picture Posting Day ...


Enjoy! [tup]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[siberianmo]

G'day Guys!

Just getting ready to leave for Can-Am Gorge for our weekly jaunt through the forests ... had the Boyz out early this AM, over by Mentor Gorge - Awk got out - was a veritible calamity for awhile - finally got him back! Phew .......

Okay - the purpose of this Post is to announce something NEW for "Our" Place".

Given that we are CLOSED on SUNDAY's we'll make this our PICTURE POSTING DAY!. So, save up your pix for Sunday's and as long as they connect with our theme 'round here, Classic Trains - real or model - Post 'em! [tup][tup][tup]

Trainnut484 Russell's Post of last night was the inspiration for it ......

Enjoy the next Post!!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[Anonymous]

Well, well, the week begins with a fresh new page and let us hope a fresh start from the previous seven days of rancor and malice from "nay sayers" and spineless toadies on Capitol Hill and beyond. This being Sunday, we can forego the usual greetings and salutations in favor of, hopefully, some quiet, meditative thoughts. The fine pics Trainnut 484 posted from around Union Station and the W.W. I Soldiers War Memorial really "hit home" in a most pleasant way. Those were my "old stomping grounds" as a youth and I can remember riding my bike to the Memorial for the vistas overlooking Union Station and the downtown area of K.C., MO. That was when America's "downtowns" were vibrant busy hubs of commerce, banking and transportation for miles in all directions. Union Station was the fourth largest terminal building when it was completed in 1914. It hosted over 200 trains a day at one time and never failed as an effecient, clean and impressive "people mover."

The air terminal, by contrast, was located in the bottoms near the Mo. river and appeared as a hickeldy-pickeldy montage of out buildings laced together with corrugated iron covered walkways. DC 4's and Lockheed Constellations would strain mightily to clear the high bluff marking the north edge of downtown. More than a few came to rest in the waters of the Misourri due to fog, sleet, mechanical or pilot error. While Union Station was a show place for travelers, the K.C. airport was an embarassment. As a kid, I loved the "war birds" but thought passenger planes were an abomination with their noisy and dangerous practice of falling from the skies.[(-D]

That was then, this is now. Russell, do my eyes decieve me or in the background of the second shot, are there a couple of vintage Railway Express Agency trucks? If so, passengerfan Al would be interested in the "original" colors of those vehicles. The dark green and (later) white or silver roof over the "box" certainly "rings a bell."

Nick, maybe a little chicken soup will help? Strange custom that; buying cigars and tippling 'til oblivious after a child birth.[:O] Doesn't it seem the mother, not the father, should be engaged in this self indulgence? I'm no one to talk! Unbirthdays qualify for a friendly "toot" amongst old friends on my social register.[:D]

Owright, owright, Boris and Leon are back from the "Gorge" and they let Awk outside in their haste.[:(!] Hmmm! Wonder what these Skunk hides will bring down at old man Fleishmeister's curio shop?[tup] Oh, Tom, that was my Grandfather who did the "Bunny Hop." He played with the Galveston, TX team but took a bad injury at a exposition game in San Francisco aftter the earthquake. It was a short but very good career. He later did well with some patents in the plumbing business. Happy rails.

[siberianmo]

SUNDAY’s NEWS & SUMMARY of RECENT POSTS

”Our” Place is CLOSED on SUNDAYS!

You may drop your messages off by putting them through the slots in either set of front doors. See ya tomorrow! [tup]

News of the Day:

(1) The St. Louis Cardinals are Champs of the National Leagues' Central Division! [yeah][wow]

(2) [bday] U.S.AIR FORCE - 58 years old today!

(3) Check out the Fallen Flags Posts on pages 106, 108, 109 and 110. The roads covered are: SP – MoPac – WP - Frisco and MKT.

SUMMARY

Name - Date/Time - (Page#) – Remarks

(1) siberianmo Tom Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 09:02:42 (111) Saturday’s News & Summary

(2) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 09:56:29 (111)

(3) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 10:08:33 (111)

(4) siberianmo Tom Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 10:30:50 (111) reply to Theodorebear

(5) West Coast S Dave Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 11:51:26 (111)

(6) siberianmo Tom Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 12:43:04 reply to West Coast S

(7) West Coast S Dave Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 13:40:52 (111)

(8) pwolfe Pete Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 14:05:42 (111)

(9) siberianmo Tom Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 14:26:31 (111) reply to West Coast S & pwolfe

(10) West Coast S Dave Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 16:11:02 (111)

(11) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 17:58:26 (111)

(12) siberianmo Tom Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 18:50:04 (111) reply to West Coast S & Theodorebear

(13) Trainnut484 Russell 17 Sep 2005, 19:46:08 (111) Photo display

(14) passengerfan Al Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 22:05:34 (111)

(15) nickinwestwales Nicks Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 23:32:40 (112)

(16) siberianmo Tom Posted: 18 Sep 2005, 00:56:47 (112) reply to Trainnut484 – passengerfan – nickinwestwales

=======================================
That’s it! [tup][;)]
Tom (Siberianmo) [4:-)] [oX)]
Proprietor of “Our” Place, an adult eating & drinking establishment!

[siberianmo]

Well, I'll be ........ Posts from Trainnut484 Russell -and- passengerfan Al! Thanx for the pix, Russell. And of course, thanx to you Al for the round and insight provided on those cars. [tup][tup]

Hey Nick I see you've begun a new page! That should be worth a round on me. Mightly late night for you - early in the mornng - or better yet - an all nighter. Man oh man, don't know where you get the endurance! [swg] Last time I watched the sun rise from one of those toots ........ oh well, it WAS the last time! [;)]

Well, it's closing time - Boris RIng the bell! One round and that's it, Gents!

See ya on Monday.

Nite ...... [zzz]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[nickinwestwales]

Hi guys ,just checking in really-it`s 05.20 am and I`ve just got back from a jolly boys outing to wet the baby`s head,any sensible group of people would have gone to the local pub and had a few beers-not this bunch of water rats,by boat(s)we proceeded downriver about 3 miles(just as the sun was going down-a magical experience)-to a pub on the other side of the river known for it`s generous interpretation of licensing laws and have returned only recently after a return journey made entertaining mostly by the effects of several hours of continuous drinking,will attempt a more coherent posting tomorrow,be well & happy,nick[C=:-)]

[passengerfan]

Good evening Tom How about a CR and a round for the house.

Trainnut 484 thanks for the passenger car pics.
The METIS was originally built in 1937 by Candadian Car & foundry as a 7-Compartment Library buffet Observation Car and has undergone extensive remodeling since. The car is Amtrak compatible and is said to be in excellent shape.

SKYKOMISH RIVER was a 4-Section 1-Compartment 7 Duplex Roomette 3-Double Bedroom Car built for the GN Mid Century Empire Builder in November 1950 by Pullmen Standard. In 1963 car 1260 SNOHOMISH RIVER was remodeled to a 1 Compartment 7-Duplex Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Car and remained in Empire Builder service. The ribbed siding was added to the car by BNSF for Business fleet use.

Milwaukee Road 170 was outshopped by Milwaukee Road shops in Milwaukee Wisconsin in June 1948 as a 48-seat Dining Lounge cars for assignment to the MIDWEST HIAWATHA along with a twin number 171. They operated for years in this service between Chicago and Omaha. The 171 was scrapped while the 170 remains and is an excellent example of the type cars produced by the old Milwaukee Road.

The GN 1292 GOING TO THE SUN MOUNTAIN was one of six Mid Century Observation cars built by AC&F for the GN and delivered between October 1950 and March 1951. These cars were among the finest Lounge Observations ever built and seating was for 39 only in the cars. The cars spent most of their GN careers on the rear of the Westyren Star or sandwiched midtrain in the combined Western Star/Fast Mail. Fortunately the car was saved and is an excellent example of a Mid Century EMPIRE BUILDER car.
The car also operated on the Internationals between Seattle and Vancouver for its final years of operation after the PORT OF SEATTLE and PORT OF VANCOUVER were withdrawn and stored. In INTERNATIONAL service they served as Parlor cars.

[Trainnut484]

Good evening Tom and everyone [:)] Cindy, I'll have one of the finest brews from the tap, Thanks.

For those of you who are coming to the KC Rails Expo next weekend Sept 23-25 here at Union Station, here's a taste of what you'll see:

Canadian National "Metis"


Pullman "Skykomis River"


KCS F9 (Don't know why it's between the cars. They may switch it around later)


Milwaukee Road nbr 170


...and GN "Empire Builder 1292"


Milwaukee Road 4-8-4 261 will also be on display

Now, in honor of those who have served, and are serving, our country:
WW1 Memorial (across from Union Station)


Walk of Honor to the memorial


Honorable statement at base of tower


Below the Honorable statement on tower


Another cold one please, thanks again.

Russell

[siberianmo]

G'day (again) Guys!

Just a quick note before we depart for the theatre - last of the summer series at a great venue in Kirkwood, MO called Stages. All musicals - been going for 14 years. Anyway ...

Dave You picked up quite nicely on that Chicago & Alton reference by Pete! [tup] Saturday's are not the best for in depth Postings, so I've withheld my Fallen Flag 'til either tomorrow afternoon or Monday AM. Want it to have a fighting chance of being read. [yeah] Some guys just pick up on the page they are on and don't take the time to scroll back .....

Ted I think I've made this recommendation to Nick - but perhaps it will also help you: prepare your Posts on a word processor program. When done, copy it to the thread. Should anything get "lost" on the thread - you'll still have it on the WP program. Work's for me ......

Sad ending for "Snooks" - at the age you were at, I'm sure that was traumatic indeed. Went through "funerals" for turtles and the like with my 3 kids along with the sadness of having to have our pet dog's put to sleep. Difficult at best, but all part of life's experiences, eh [?]

So, you remember Throckmorton P. Gildersleeve, eh [?] Well, you are just a tad younger than I - but that puts us in the right era for evening radio programs in the parlo(u)r! [swg] By the by, who did your Dad play baseball with [?] My deceased father-in-laws was with the Reds back in the 30's.

Gotta run - time to take in "Hello Dolly!" Seen iterations of it a few times - but always enjoy the music and subtle changes in the way the play progresses ....

Remember, be kind to Cindy and she'll reward you! [}:)][:-,] If not, Leon the Night Man will clean your clocks! [swg]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[Anonymous]

Damm and blast, I just "blew it" on one of my better Posts. Tom, I was going to have an Iron City but now, please make it a double Crown and a splash of Angostura bitters. Glad to see WestCoast S "Back in the Saddle Again" (Gene Autry's Theme). Good information on the Espee again Dave. Hope your leave was refreshing, possily some pix? Okay Tom, the Bunny's name was "Baby Snooks" after a popular comedic radio show which I think was titled "The Great Gildersleeve" but am not too sure. The fate of "Snooks" was unfortuante. My Mother's Father visited us in K.C. and poor "Snooks" zigged when he (gender?) should've zagged. Poppa was a retired professional baseball player and his foot wear was about the size of snow shoes. He weighed in around 200 + lbs.; need I say more? At age 6 or 7, I couldn't be quieted until assurances came that "Snooks" went to Bunny Heaven. All was forgiven and the funerary grave site (back yard) was attended with solemn prayers from my Sister and me.

I had written some on the "Millionaires' Rails" documantary aired by The Travel Channel yesterday but since I was so unceremoniously booted-off, I'll delay this for another post later...still P.O.ed! Okay, allow me to make an unusually hasty retreat via the "Rat's Patoot Room" until we meet again, sayanora for now.

[West Coast S]

Afternoon all... Tom and Pwolf. Round of the best draught available

Trivia regarding the Chicago & Alton.

It was the first US railroad to fully dieselize, in 1947 and was also the first to abandon the traditional Pullman Green for it's passenger fleet, introducing a striking multi-hued maroon scheme as standard around 1927, noteable steam passenger power also wore the maroon colors, predating the later concept of matched power and consits by a number of years. It also suffered the fate of being one of the first roads merged out of exsitence in the post WWII period, merged into the GM&O around 1949. GM&O later adopted the Maroon concept when it went shopping for diesels, thus a fragment of the C&A tradition continued on.

Regarding oddball SP power, The U25B stunned the railway community when introduced in 1959. Most stunned of all was EMD. EMD lost the horsepower race and thus a oppertunity for a substantial order in a attempt to satisfy a SP edict that all future purchases most posses a minium 2500HP per a single unit. EMD in it's haste to say competitive pushed the tried and true 567 to the limit and many roads suffered crankshaft failure with the turbocharged SD24. SP considered and rejected the SD24 as a contender for future purchases.

The undisputed masters of heavy service were the products of the Baldwin Locomotive Works. AS616s in various configurations were the staple of the lumber feeders in Oregon and Northern California and doubled as road helpers and local power when needed.

Hump yards around the system were also home with VO1000, S12s sharing in the duties. AS616s dieselized the Pacific Electric freight operations. Tragedy also took a toll, SP lost a cow-calf set when they failed to heed a open drawbridge, a second set was lost due to a hump yard mishap, additional orders were submitted to Baldwin to replace the lost units displaying SPs firm commitment to Baldwin.

By the mid 60s the era of the Baldwin roadswitcher was over, they languished in storage for many years thereafter awaiting buyers or the scrappers torch. The VO1000s were the next to go, happily, the S12s had a few good years left with
retirements begining in the early 70s. A large percentage of retired Baldwins were sold for continued use with other operators, a few continue in service yet today.

Dave [tup]

[siberianmo]

G'day Guys!

Just a couple of responses before I check out for the day - Cindy will work the rest of the day 'n evening ........ I may or may not be back for closing. Saturday night and things to do! [swg]

West Coast S Dave That reference you made regarding the SP Alco's may be attributed to coalminer3 CM3 on page 106. As always, you surely come up with some detailed scoop! [tup]

I see you're paying the price for being away! [swg] Catching up is lotsafun, eh [?] I hope the SUMMARIES are of some help ........

pwolfe Pete Although I don't have any, the railroad maps of the U.S., back in the halcyon days, had tracks just about everywhere one looked. Given that we didn't have the highway system we all take for granted today, rail was King, no doubt about it. There will never be a return to the extent we once witnessed. Oh, we'll see some degree of increased freight shipments (given that the mega-carriers can find the capacity), but I'll put my money on alternative fuel sources for vechicular power. Rail rights-of-way have pretty much dwindled down to a precious few and they are indeed saturated. Reality hits home again! [tdn]

Perhaps Nick will address your question ....... [tup]

Catch ya later - and oh yes, check your Email

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[pwolfe]

Hi Tom and all

I was just about to call in the bar when the wife caught and made me do a chore.
Anyway I think I have earned a pint of Bathams now.

The Fallen Flags have really set off some great personal memories of travel in the days of the Classic Trains. A round for all please[tup].

I see on the atlas that there was a Chicago & Alton (laterGulf Mobile & Ohio) Railroad which ran through Futon M.O. and connected to the KATY at North Jefferson across the river from Jefferson City. I guess this line closed some time ago[?]. Looking at the lie of the land it must have been quite a hilly route.

In a recent Railway Mag.from Britain there is an article on Britain only SHAY engine it worked at an ironworks in BILSTON in the West Midlands some time between 1900 and 1912. They say it was a Class B type with three cylinders and two trucks.Only one known photo exists and the mag. was asking if anyone knew of any information on this particular loco.Any ideas[?].

I hope Nick survives the camping trip PETE.

[West Coast S]

Hello, once again Tom and the gang. I negelected to acknowledge the patron who forwarded the subject of SP Alco freight power. Round for the house if you please.

The SP had a love, hate relationship with the American Locomotive Works. The Alco PA was chosen over comparable EMD offerings due to the GE supplied traction motors, dynamic brakes and the power plant being turbocharged, this combination was able to handle the tough Donner Pass and Shasta routes. Eventually 76 would be purchased, SP thought well enough of them to rebuild and upgrade the entire fleet in the early to mid 60s, unlike some roads they were never downgraded to freight service, all would be gone by 1967.

Alco days were not done yet, SP that year aquired examples of the C-628 and later the C-630. By this date, the SD45 was the engine that GE and Alco had to chase, massive SD45 purchases quickly made these the dominate power on the system. The SD45 had one major fault, a need for lots of fuel. SP turned to Alco in a attempt to match the reliability of the SD45 but with increased fuel savings.

The C- 628/630 delivered the promised fuel economy, but could not deliver on the reliability. It was discovered too late that they did not perform well in heavy, high speed service, changes made to the 251 engine and aluminum wiring resulted in blown cylinders, turbochargers and fires.

Still, SP persisted in finding suitable employment and in those great GE traction motors laid the answer, they could substain extended low speed operation and it was noted that several had been assigned to helper and other secondary service duty throughout the system with no failures recorded. The decision was made to rebuild them for humpyard and transfer service between West Colton and Taylor. They performed admiribly along side newer power until the early 80s when all Alco power was set aside.

Eugene OR, was the second bastion of Alco power on the SP in the 70s, The only RSD15s (3 total) purchased by the SP were assigned to the hump and four axle examples such as the RS11 and switchers retreated north as emissions became an issue in California and Texas.

SP was rebuilding Alco power as late as 1979 when several RS11s were upgraded after being vacated and reassigned from the Cotton Belt. Upon rebuilding they were scattered from Eugene to LA until the requirement to confine them the to select maintaince shops virtually demoted them to captive serivice, thus negating any potential which resulted in periods on the deadline until disposed of.

Dave[tup]

[siberianmo]

[#welcome] Back, West Coast S Dave! [yeah]

Glad you're back with us ....... Help yourself to the breakfast stuff, right over there, next to the coffee urns.

I trust you are well rested and ready to tackle the rigors of the workplace and life in the big city once again. Once that first day back at the grind gets into full swing, it was always as if I had never left ....... [tdn]

Glad you appreciate those Fallen Flags - that's the idea!

We've had a bit of a change 'round here with a couple of guys no longer seen as regulars along with a dip in Postings. Along came coalminer3 CM3 with some pretty insightful stuff and the Fallen Flags idea followed. I want to temper the frequency of those submissions, just to ensure that we don't suffer a burn out effect.

We seem to be back up to speed now, as a few guys have answered the bell and picked up the slack in your absence and those of passengerfan Al and wrwatkins ***. The latter two will return ..... but until then, I've requested that our more dependable guys try to pick a time slot to make at least one Post, just to keep us up 'n runnin' on the Forum. 6 AM to Noon - Noon to 6 PM and 6 PM to midnight. I'm also trying to be a bit more aware of my response times - kinda saving 'em up just to keep us at the top of the page, so to speak. Of course there are exceptions ... but if you detect some changes, that's the story.

Maybe we should consider a weekend blast at your place in Nevada - guys only, of course. I can just imagine the train talk - card games - a bit of imbibing and whatever follows ...... [swg]

Catch ya later! [tup]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

P.S. I saw you lurking in the shadows, pwolfe Pete Bashful [?] You have Email

[West Coast S]

Morning Tom and the gang...WOW, 111 pages and counting! Our Place has come of age indeed! Coffee and fresh blueberry muffins if you could be so kind.

Just catching up on the events going on, as for myself I have some property in NE Nevada that i've been attending two for the past couple of weeks, far away from the hustle and bustle of LA.

The Union Pacifc is about the only activity in town these days a far cry from my first visit in 1981 when Montello had a intact water tank and and SP standard station. UP replaced the depot with a doublewide and the city removed the tank when they contracted for county water. As in SP days, M of W and relief personal are maintained to monitor the causeway across the the Great Salt Lake and to staff helpers headed west over the Pequops. In a historical note, the orginal 1869 CP alignment to Promotory Point, abandoned in 1942 deverged at Lucin, 3 miles from my property.

Tom... Great job on the fallen flags. To all, keep the good stuff coming....

Well, let me do some more catching up, Boris, knock it off, this is a civilized establishment! No slobbering on the patrons, no matter how happy you are!

Until later

Dave [tup]

[siberianmo]

Top o' the mornin' to ya, Ted me boy! [swg]

Just time enough for a couple of words before the Saturday chores get attended to .....

Nice accounting of that trip from your childhood! I too crawled all over old farm equipment (tractors, etc.) during summers at my God-parents relatives farm in a place called Mount Holly, New Jersey. Back in those days, that was strictly rural and farm country - dirt roads, et al. It was a fun place for a kid and it would seem that each summer I'd be there, the County Fair would going on in town. The three of us kids (me and the two who lived there) piled into the back of the pickup - loaded with hay - and off we'd go. Always had a great time. The train used to run right through the center of town and if we'd time it right, there would be a Puffing Billy making it's way to the Depot. Loved it! Simply loved it!
There are times when I just wi***hat time could be made to stand still .... but then again, the 40's weren't really all that great - just snippets here and there! Reality strikes again! [swg]

By the by, what was the name of your Bunny and what of its fate [?]

So, it appears that the Fallen Flags series is making a dent ... good deal! That's the idea, after all. [tup][tup][tup] If I do say so myself ........ Classic Trains Rule! [yeah]

By the by, Boris 'n Leon will in fact be runnin' amok up at Can-Am Gorge tomorrow. Campers and wildlife beware! Actually, that area is far too rugged for campers - believe me - lots of places for the denizons of the forests and caves to lurk in the shadows. Or should I say, hide from the Boyz [?] [swg]

Okay, okay - my turn to run things around here. Which shall it be - vacuum cleaner or ....... [?] Oh the bliss of retired life! [swg]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[Anonymous]

CORRECTION Sorry, I referred to CM 3 and should have typed Earlydiesels Dan. Theodorebear.

[Anonymous]

Tom, maybe just a draught of Iron City and something for yourself. I'm enjoying the latest pix on offer.[^] I can only add a tiny vingette to the ongoing Katy dialogue. I rode a Local (milk train) on that Line from Tulsa to Pawnee, OK. I must've been about 6 (maybe 7) years old, thus the memory is vague at best. I do recall it was steam powered and a pretty rough ride. When we arrived at Pawnee Station, there was a horrific stench of fresh silage wafting through the air.[V] Soon thereafter, I developed styes on both eyes and could scarcely see at all (allergies). My Grandfather owned a prosperous farm near Maramac, OK and there was a derilict old steam tractor in the coach shed. As a Lad, I really enjoyed climbing over the beast, turning the valves and stoaker but didn't have the strength to move the huge all steel spoked wheels. On the return leg, I had as company, a baby Bunny in a wooden cheese box (ventilated) with ample lettuce for the 4 hour return trek. Knowing that pets were not allowed, I did my best to secret the box from view of the Conductor as he made his obligatory rounds through the aisles of the coaches.[8D] I thought I was a pretty cool operator, as if some arch villain in a *** Tracy comic strip. As we detrained in Tulsa, the elderly Conductor casually said (with a knowing grin), "What's the Bunny's name?"[swg] From that encounter on, train Conductors were my heroes.[tup]

Nick, the pix are great and the streamline diesel frames tell a "theater (theatre) of the mind" story. "Two Foot Guage?" That would be hardly more than a Garden Rwy, right?[#oops] Rob, have a safe camping adventure. I understand Boris and Leon are in the woods this weekend. They are being chaperoned but still "at large" so to speak.[:O] Welcome again Budkarr, its always a pleasure to greet new arrivals who enjoy a little whimsy along with the "nuts and bolts" of Classic Trains at "Our" Place.[tup] I think the site will "fit like an old shoe" in no time at all.[:D] CM 3, like you, there will always be a "soft spot" for the MKT and Frisco among my recollections. I rode the St. L. & S.F. from Tulsa to St. Louis and thence the Pennsy to Penn Station in 1956. I thought the train would never clear the wye backing in at St. Louis. It was such a serpentine movement, I darned near "lost my cookies" to motion sickness. Oh, as I recall, the train was headed by 3 EMD E-7 units (A-B-A). The coaches were a mix of smooth and fluted sides with a couple of "ghost striped" standards for R.P.O. and baggage. There was a long wait in Springfield, MO but not enough time for seeing many sights. In fact, I think I was having lunch in the Dinning Car at that stop.[dinner] I do remember the food was excellent: open face hot turkey sandwich w/trimmings.[^] What a change in "attitude" of the Crew from Frisco to Pennsy.[V]

Okay, I must trim the "Flame-in-the-Woods" shrubs, hedge and Azaleas before the City Fathers serve notice for breaking the "neighborhood covens."[:(!] Maybe a quick pass with the palm sander and Scotch Brite over the G scale R-O-W as well. That's right, its brass rail and the FL. climate (wet) plays havoc on brass. Boris, yank the clapper on old "99,s" bell, if you will. BOINK! What is it this time Boris?, your dirigible dolly deflated again?[xx(] Happy rails all.

[siberianmo]

SATURDAY’s NEWS & SUMMARY of RECENT POSTS

Morning All! A fine weekend day ‘round these parts – comfortable temps and dry conditions after our two days of Monsoon-like rains. Ahhhhhh – the end of the grass growing season approaches! [yeah][wow][tup]

A comment: My thanx to those of you who answered the call for HELP to ensure that we maintain a degree of frequency with the Postings. While it may be premature, it does appear as if those of you who said you would – are! THANX! [tup][tup][tup]

News of the Day:

(1) Check out the Fallen Flags Posts on pages 106, 108, 109 and 110. The roads covered are: SP – MoPac – WP - Frisco and MKT.

(2) Reminder: We’re CLOSED on SUNDAY’s.

SUMMARY

Name - Date/Time - (Page#) – Remarks

(1) siberianmo (Tom Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 00:53:28 (110) Friday’s News & Summary

(2) BudKarr Bud Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 01:50:16 (110 First post & visit

(3) siberianmo Tom Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 07:26:56 (110) reply to BudKarr

(4) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 07:45:09 (110)

(5) coalminer3 CM3 Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 08:13:02 (110) FRISCO info

(6) siberianmo Tom Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 09:13:49 (110) reply to Theodorebear & coalminer3

(7) BudKarr Bud Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 11:56:19 (110)

(8) siberianmo Tom Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 12:00:44 (110) Fallen Flag – MKT

(9) pwolfe Pete Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 13:22:32 (110)

(10) siberianmo Tom Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 13:59:31 (110) reply to BudKarr & pwolfe

(11) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 15:27:47 (110)

(12) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 16:07:37 (110)

(13) siberianmo Tom Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 17:00:41 (110) reply to trolleyboy & nickinwestwales

(14) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 17:46: (110)

(15) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 18:15:29 {110)

(16)) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 18:46:56 (111)

(17) siberianmo Tom Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 19:52:53 (111) reply to nickinwestwales

(18) earlydiesels Dan Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 20:06:45 (111)

(19) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 20:10:02 (111)

(20) Gunns Kevin Posted: 16 Sep 2005, 23:28:43 (111)

(21) siberianmo Tom Posted: 17 Sep 2005, 09:00:30 (111) reply to earlydiesels – nickinwestwales – Gunns

=======================================
That’s it! [tup][;)]
Tom (Siberianmo) [4:-)] [oX)]
Proprietor of “Our” Place, an adult eating & drinking establishment!

[siberianmo]

Mornin' Guys,

Looks like I've got a few responses to make ... checked out a bit early last night. Watched a classic movie on DVD - "The High and the Mighty" with John Wayne. Nice musical score - hoaky acting - but when put in perspective a good "oldie."

earlydiesels Dan Regarding the Oct 1st weekend - it's a "maybe" at this point. What other weekends are you working in Oct [?] If you don't have the schedule right now, don't worry about it.

Glad you are enjoying my Fallen Flags - that's what they were intended to do - project one's mind to the days and times of those great Classic Trains! [yeah][wow][tup]

Nick Are you SURE that you're the ONLY one reading these threads at your house [?] [swg]

Gunns Kevin My guess is that if you are to meet up with the gang from this bar, it will have to be somewhere between where you are and where I am - that would put us in the Kansas City area ...... We've got (or had) a failry good representation from Missouri/Kansas so maybe the Midland would be a smart location for a mini-Rendezvous for "Our" Place. With Pete - Dan and me, this could work out. Add in you and maybe barndad Doug and Trainnut484 Russell[?][?][?], and we'd have a good representation ....... just a thought.

Okay - I've gotta get the SUMMARY out .... before we drop completely outta sight! [swg]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[Gunns]

Evening Ya'll,
coffee and a sammich.

As for the midwesrern tour, I am crewing for the Germans at the AIBF http://www.balloonfiesta.com/ but woul really like to get together later. Also we are having an open house for two days in Oct.


Open House
October 15 and 16 at the site from 10-4 each day
free hot dogs and drinks, live entertainment, education committee functions for the kids...blow the whistle, ring the bell and sit in the engineer's seat...and buy one of our fabulous new T-shirts !
Bring your camera

directions on the club site

later
Gunns