Train Horns and Whistles - Too Quiet?

[Nora]

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2003-12-17-train-noise_x.htm

That's a link to the article I think you're talking about. Here's a link to a PDF of the actual rule that's being proposed:

http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/p77/262041.pdf

It is extremely long (103 pages) but here is one of the relevant parts:

QUOTE: • Locomotive horns must be sounded while approaching and entering upon each public highway-rail grade crossing. The horn sound level must be a minimum of 96 dB(A) and no louder than 110 dB(A) measured 100 feet in front of the locomotive and 15 feet above the rail. All locomotives must sound the horn in the standard sequence of two longs, one short, and one long starting at least 15 seconds, but no more than 20 seconds before reaching the grade crossing, however, in no case may the horn be sounded more than 1#8260;4 mile before the crossing.

I wonder what the current volume level usually is "100 feet in front of the locomotive and 15 feet above the rail"? I'm not in favor of restricting where train horns can be used, or reducing the volume of them. But I would like to know how much difference there actually is between what they are proposing and what the current practice is.

Finally, here is a link where you can view all the current comments on the legislation (and presumably submit your own):

http://dms.dot.gov/search/searchResultsSimple.cfm?numberValue=6439&searchType=docket

[Anonymous]

110 decibels...20 seconds...? with all these people not paying attention (Stay off the tracks topic) at crossings, It should be the other way around.

[Train Guy 3]

Why not lower the train horn volume? Motorists already don't listen to them. They don't stop at the lowered gates. The don't listen for a clanging bell. And they definatly don't look at the flashind red lights.

So of course the volume should not be lowered, it may be the only thing to save some of these risk takers.

[Nora]

Hey, I found a comment from an old "friend" of ours:

http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/pdf74/144229_web.pdf

Don't worry, I didn't waste my time reading all of it. [:D]

There are some pretty funny comments to be found, athough they all refer to earlier versions of the legislation where it seems the noise level limit wasn't included. Some of these people must live near wabash1 because they say the horns are louder now and that "the engineers are laying on the horns longer than usual and at such times as 2:00 a.m., 3:00 a.m. and 4:53, yes 4:53 a.m."

Would 4:54, yes 4:54 AM have been better? [:p]

--Nora

[Modelcar]

....The above Horn and loudness data is in our Muncie paper today too....

[dharmon]

Forget the horns, whistles, bells, lights whatever...just get rid of all of them. Period. Instead have a large capacitor installed. As you go down the rails, build up an steady charge, then if someone gets in the way. Hit the button and discharge it into the tracks and ZAP.

[edblysard]

Why do I get the feeling the same guys who proposed this, are the same folks who want mufflers installed on Dan's jets?
Ed

[RudyRockvilleMD]

I am not in favor of limiting the volume of of horns at grade crossings. The sound pressure level requirement is 110 dBA at 100 feet from the horn and 15 feet above the rail. Neglecting the height above the rails, at 60 mph (88 ft/sec) a train would be 1/4 mile from the grade crossing when the horn is sounded 15 seconds before reaching the grade crossing; the sound pressure level at the grade crossing would be 88 dBA at that time. In general the sound pressure level decreases by 6 db with a doubling of distance thus at 200 feet the sound pressure level would be
104 dBA, 98 dBA at 400 feet, etc.

At 79 mph a train would be 1740 feet from the grade crossing if the horn is sounded 15 seconds before reaching the grade crossing; this would reduce the sound pressre level at the grade crossing at the moment the horn is sounded to 85 dBA

It seems it would be better to set the rule for sounding an air horn at a specified distance before reaching a grade crossing rather than at a certain time before reaching a grade crossing especially if train speeds vary. While a 3 dB difference in the sound pressure level doesn't seem like a lot it represents a 40% difference in the sound pressure.

[JoeKoh]

They could crank the horn up real loud and people still wouldnt here it because of radios cell phones or just not paying attention!!!.
stop look listen and live!
Matt know when we approach a rr crossing he says train train? If a two year old can fiqure it out whats wrong with these other people!
stay safe
Joe

[Mookie]

ahem.....gentlemen - it is called being accountable for your own actions. Since this too died, what is left? How much longer will we have to run after adults like they are small children and hover over them because they don't want to play by the rules.

Mookie

[CSSHEGEWISCH]

The actual volume of horns and whistles has actually become irrelevant in many areas due to municipal quiet zones. The BNSF Chicago-Aurora main line is covered by these for most of its length. In all fairness, the grade crossings on this line are well protected (gates, flashing lights, etc) and accidents involving pedestrians or autos are surprisingly uncommon when you consider how built up the area near the tracks is. Also, quiet zone ordinances will allow the horn to be sounded when necessary to prevent an accident. This occurs regularly when a suburban rush hour express on the center track overtakes a local near a station or grade crossing.
The loudness of the horn is also irrelevant if nobody pays attention.

[jchnhtfd]

As usual... Mookie is SO right! Tragic...

The specified maximum horn volume isn't actually much lower than today's. Aside from the minor detail that most drivers pay zilch attention to any warning device, stop sign, or anything else that gets in their way (a corrollary to Mookie's comment), another problem which is quite relevant is that many cars and SUVs today are so well soundproofed that the locomotive horn is quite literally inaudible over the sound system inside the car. And since people run red lights, never mind grade crossing lights, and slalom around two bar gates... I don't know what can be done. It's discouraging.

[tree68]

I recall speaking with someone on the phone some years ago when a train passed the business, horn blaring. She told me that due to an accident they had made the railroad put l o u d e r horns on the locos... How long will it be before some suit-happy lawyer sues a railroad because the horn wasn't loud enough or sounded long enough to provide sufficient warning to his client...

[mudchicken]

Tree: You haven't figured out that this is the first thing they (ambulance chasers) do now?

Mudchicken proposes:

They can have the no-whistle zones IF:
(1) Everybody within 1320 ft of the crossing signs a legal binding document that they will assume the liability for the actions of any motorist using the crossing.
(2) The local government agency will post a surety bond that ALL of the drivers license applicants are guaranteed not to be stooopid louts and understand that railroad crossing rules will be followed to the letter of the law.
(3) Any person found ignoring crossing signals and/or signs IMMEDIATETLY loses ALL driving and license priviledges (It is a priviledge, not a right!!!), and
(4) Any time there is a grade crossing accident, the crossing is closed and barricaded for 30 days (at driver or local government expense) and the name of the offender, his address and telephone number , are posted prominently for all to see as the cause of the closed crossing. (Just like highway construction companies in construction zones)

IF these 4 conditions are not met, live with it.[;)]

Mudchicken[}:)]

(Lived within 100 ft. of a crossing protected only by a wig-wag for 8 years, 20-25 trains per day .....and have done countless accident surveys and wonder daily how some of these morons were given the priviledge to get behind the wheel, kill themselves and others plus traumatiize plenty of others)[V]

PS- Bergie, you need an icon with fangs![:D]

[rrnut282]

This sounds like NIMYB's (not in my backyard) running amuck again. You know, the ones who told the realestate agent that the proximity of the RR tracks wasn't a factor in choosing to buy a house then, but now it's a problem...make the government help!

One possible solution to this problem is remote way-side warning devices. These are horns mounted at the crossing and activated by an approaching train, so the decibel level is constant at crossing. This technology is available only in select areas (that use positive train separation.)

On a sad note, Darwin was right. If these horn bans go into effect as the NIBY's want, there WILL be more grade-crossing incidents, and a resulting drop in population of non-railfans. Because only railfans stop and look both ways before crossing the tracks, even when the lights aren't flashing....

[ironhorseman]

interesting

[AntonioFP45]

The proposal to quiet horns had to be made by some bleeding hearts that lack basic common sense. As a railfan, I love the sound of a train horns and yet even at 3am I'm sometimes awakened by a horn that an engineer is "laying" on. I assume that someone's trying to beat the train to the crossing. (mainline is just 1 mile from my house). Lowering the levels would be statistically disastrous.

The K5LA five chime horn is reputed to be the loudest horn on locomotives today (please correct me if I'm wrong) yet, riding in my wife's car with the windows rolled up, running the a/c and playing music at moderate levels I barely hear the train when it's just a mile away. CSX freights in my area do about 55-60mph, Amtrak's Palmetto does 70, and yet not all the grade crossings in my area are protected by gates!

I hope and pray that common sense prevails.

[Anonymous]

That's probably one of the most idiotic ideas I've heard in a long time! I wonder what the folks at Operation Lifesaver have to say about this. As a railfan, I too love hearing the engineer lay on the horn. Let's just hope that someone with at least half a brain will realise how stupid this is!

[Anonymous]

Whatever keeps the idiots off tracks and from driving aroud lowered gates- i say do it!

[JoeKoh]

QUOTE: Originally posted by AntonioFP45

The proposal to quiet horns had to be made by some bleeding hearts that lack basic common sense. As a railfan, I love the sound of a train horns and yet even at 3am I'm sometimes awakened by a horn that an engineer is "laying" on. I assume that someone's trying to beat the train to the crossing. (mainline is just 1 mile from my house). Lowering the levels would be statistically disastrous.

The K5LA five chime horn is reputed to be the loudest horn on locomotives today (please correct me if I'm wrong) yet, riding in my wife's car with the windows rolled up, running the a/c and playing music at moderate levels I barely hear the train when it's just a mile away. CSX freights in my area do about 55-60mph, Amtrak's Palmetto does 70, and yet not all the grade crossings in my area are protected by gates!

I hope and pray that common sense prevails.

I live five miles away from the tracks and if the wind is right I can here the trains entering and leaving town.and common sense?most people dont know what that is anymore[:(]
stay safe
joe

[Anonymous]

Don't have to worry about horns around here- our city has banned them from city limits to city limits. The last WC timetable I have has the instructions, "No whistle will be sounded except when necessary to prevent damage to property or injury to persons from milepost...to milepost..."

About the only time I hear a horn is when motive power is being moved around the servicing area.

[Anonymous]

This wont help around here. People around Brunswick seem to think that crossing gates are just a road obsitcal sometimes, and some of these people have the bass on their car radios ar so loud, no-one can hear the train horn! Cities will start complaining about this before they need to hire more emergency crews.

---

[RudyRockvilleMD]

As i understand it the FRA proposes to preempt local ordinances against sounding airhorns at grade crossings unless the locality takes steps to reduce the risk of accidents at grade crossings. Aside from eliminating the grade crossing altogether Jersey Barriers could be placed in the middle of the road on each side of the track, and extending back perhaps 100 yards. Other possibilities include crossing gates on both sides of the road and crossing gates with long arms to cover both sides of the road.

I agree with those who have said we should be accountable for our own actions, but unfortunately too many people just don't stop and think when it comes to crossing railroad tracks. Another type of grade crossing accident occurs when two trains run in each direction pass the grade crossing at nearly the same time, some motorists may cross the tracks after the first train passes and get hit by the second train. It seems this type of grade crossing is more prevalent when the grade crossings are not protected by gates.

[wabash1]

And to add to the mix, I use the whistle for whistle signals also. sometimes i just dont want to talk on the radio. there is times the conductor might be walking up from the rear and he is not on the right channel with his radio and communication is must. so i use a whistle signal for this. a car horn is not going to cut it. a mile away get real. I say if they want to get rid of my horn then so be it. but we should be given the names of the people who are pushing for this. then when we hit and kill someone we can throw the body on their door step let them be responsible for the arrangements. Sometimes i think we should bring back public exicution. I think that crime and stupidity would drop. but this statment would be for another forum topic.

[Puckdropper]

Reduce the level of train horns? That's a bunch of *insert your favorite bad noun here.*

I slow down and roll down the window at least 2 cm to listen for a train. I can't always hear with as quiet as these cars are. They need to install steel walls that raise when the gate is completely down. That's the only way to protect train crews. (They need to raise about 8-10' in the air to really protect the crews)

[tree68]

QUOTE: Originally posted by mudchicken

Tree: You haven't figured out that this is the first thing they (ambulance chasers) do now?

Most assuredly - my point was that the railroads would be placed in the position of being sued for complying with the law by reducing horn volume and length of horn sounding for crossings. Some bozo runs the gates and complains that the warning from the train (while in perfect compliance with the law) was insufficient. Who gets sued? The railroad.

I'm the same way with sirens as most everyone here in the forum is with train horns and whistles - I hear them when others haven't, because I'm attuned to them and want to know what's going on (maybe a good fire to chase!) Others hear them only as more noise, as has been suggested numerous times in this thread already.

[Anonymous]

I took a local, random poll of all the people I talked to here in Brunswick. We have about 30-50 trains a day come through, and many People i talked to said they should be made LOUDER!!! where are these complaints coming from.

P.S. - a Magority of Brunswickians have a strong Dislike for trains, but still say horns should be louder, Figure that out?

[locomutt]

Why do we have horns & whistles[?]

I agree with Joe: if a 2 yr. old knows, THEN THE OLDER ONES SHOULD[:(!][:O]

I wish a bunch of people would talk to some of the idiots here in Jeff. Co.(KY) and let
them know how important it is to hear the trains.

Several of the smaller cities in the county have or are trying to pass ordinances forbidding train crews to sound horns at crossings because they have to have their
beauty sleep. GO FIGURE[:O][8]

locomutt [8D]

[jchnhtfd]

locomutt -- some of those folks are going to have a mighty long beauty sleep, the day they don't notice the train because it's being quiet.

Idiots.

[Willy2]

The train horns are just fine in my opinion. Just the idea of making it so that the trains cannot blow their horns if they are more than 20 seconds from the crossings if enough to make me puke!!! 20 seconds is not enough time. It seems that people will just never be happy with the way things are. Constantly determined to change things to their own liking. In this case, changing things to their own likings may threaten the lives of those at railroad crossings.

[Anonymous]

Grade crossing accidents will only drop significantly when local police departments give a high priority to enforcement of existing laws regarding crossings. Some motorists are more afraid of a getting a ticket than getting hit by a train.

[dharmon]

This is just one more example of rampant NIMBYism and lack of responsibility that has taken over the country.....

We want absolute security from terrorists, but cannot live with the hassles it creates to our routine

We want inexpensive products but demand higher wages and benefits, but complain when the jobs go overseas, to maintain the profit margin that funds our mutual funds and IRAs

We want airports to be located conveniently, yet not close to where we live.

We want the goverment to provide more services but want lower taxes.

We want the income that a military base brings to the community, we just don't want the soldieres and sailors to be on it.

We want trains to operate safely but not to make any noise in doing so, but are quick to sue when we get hit, because we went around the crossing arms and didn't see or hear the train.....

When alot of us were kids, if you played with fire, you got burned...but you probably didn't do it again. Now, we eliminate the fire, so kids can't get hurt, so they have no concept of why it is dangerous. It's like guns, take you kid to the range and show them how to properly use a firearm and they get an appreciation of it. Or let them see one for the first time with their friends and then it becomes a toy and someone gets hurt.

I just see this as one more example of how our country is headed....

[WDGF]

dharmon;

You're right on target. Over in Dallas, they've had folks moving into the flight-path of Love Field, and complaining to the city to do something about the noise. Similar case with a shooting range up in McKinney. I just can't comprehend how self-centered these people have to be to come up with this rubbish.

[dekemd]

QUOTE: Originally posted by BlackhawkNRHS

Grade crossing accidents will only drop significantly when local police departments give a high priority to enforcement of existing laws regarding crossings. Some motorists are more afraid of a getting a ticket than getting hit by a train.

I can tell you now that's not going to happen. Most departments are short on manpower. Budget crunches hit city and county police just like other businesses. No one will get laid off, but positions will go unfilled. When you're up to your eyeballs in B&Es, domestic disturbances, drunk drivers and other idiots, rail crossing violations get pushed aside. Occasionally a department will have a week long "awareness campaign" on railroad violations. They'll have officers ride with train crews and look for violations. I would love to see more enforcement, but the manpower is just not there. Personally, when emergency calls slack off if I hear a train on the scanner, I'll go setup at a crossing and try to catch violaters. Got one Saturday night. wasn't happy when I told him I don't give warnings on crossing violations. [:D]

Derrick

[tree68]

QUOTE: Originally posted by WDGF

dharmon;

You're right on target. Over in Dallas, they've had folks moving into the flight-path of Love Field, and complaining to the city to do something about the noise. Similar case with a shooting range up in McKinney. I just can't comprehend how self-centered these people have to be to come up with this rubbish.

Heard the same song and dance from the public in OKC in the 70's when a fighter crashed near a school built under the flight path. "Move the runways!" They cried.

[tree68]

QUOTE: Personally, when emergency calls slack off if I hear a train on the scanner, I'll go setup at a crossing and try to catch violaters. Got one Saturday night. wasn't happy when I told him I don't give warnings on crossing violations. [:D]

Derrick

You're a good man. Sometimes I wish I could use my red lights for traffic stops. They frown on fire chiefs doing that, though...[:D]

CSX recently had a problem with a southbound locally - totally blocked one crossing, but for some reason the gates stayed down on another, even though marker was well beyond it (ie, several hundred yards). At least the city cops were there to wave folks through the gates. If they hadn't been, I'm sure most folks would have eventually gone around anyhow.

[dekemd]

QUOTE: Originally posted by tree68

QUOTE: Personally, when emergency calls slack off if I hear a train on the scanner, I'll go setup at a crossing and try to catch violaters. Got one Saturday night. wasn't happy when I told him I don't give warnings on crossing violations. [:D]

Derrick

You're a good man. Sometimes I wish I could use my red lights for traffic stops. They frown on fire chiefs doing that, though...[:D]

That's probably a good way to become an EX-fire chief.[:D]

[Big_Boy_4005]

So, if this passes whats next. Restriction of engine noise, then wheel noise.... If people don't like railroad noise, they should move. The railroads were there first !

[phbrown]

What's the history behind measuring the sound 15 ft. above the rail? Who's listening up there? Birds?
Hmm, maybe the sinister hand behind this is the Audubon Society [:)].

AntonioFP45 suggests an interesting point: what they should *really* be measuring is the sound level inside a car.

Not, sadly, that people will listen anyway.

I've always wondered what the problems are with 4-quadrant gates and medians. Is it just cost?

Peace,
--Peter

[Anonymous]

I used to work on the RR then I drove school bus If they will not stop for the stop arm and flashing red lights for a school bus then why blow a horn
if they git hit the law says it's there falt the RR owns the land the crossing
is there for you to cross maybe we need to have no crossings
then the RR will make us pay more in taxes so there will be no crossings we
will have to have a bridge or tunel over/under the crossing
remember they own the land and don't have to have highway rail crossings
they do it in Japan for the high speed trains back in the old days there were laws that said if you were going to hit something open it up as fast as you can
and hit it hard to kill it this was the law for express trains way back when
People need to slow down and smell the coffee the train will win they will win in court so read your darn drivers ed book it is in black and white train crossings look and listen and stop if you have to as for the train will not
but hay again the don't stop for school bus with stop arms can't pull over for fire
or ambulance why think they will stop for a train !?! [:)]

Added 08/30/04
Blow it LONG and Hard wish we could go back to the Steam whistle they sound so much nicer and can be heared for a LONG way !!!!
If you Don't like the horn why do you live near the tracks? Again I say let them be blown
Long and Hard so I don't have to try and save a life of some one who was hit by a train
becouse some *&^^ can't deal with takeing responsibility for them self so they got hit by a train BTW I have been in 3 RR crossing crashes 2 when I worked for the RR Museum
and 1 as a passenger on Amtrak and yes the horn was blowing People just need to get a clue!!!
[^]

[mudchicken]

rebelfdl: NEWS FLASH- City Ordinance is worthless! Superceded by federal rule...

Mr. Brown: 4 quadrant gates are going to cost somebody another $150-200,000.00
If not placed correctly, they will still allow motorists to bypass. IF a gate arm is much more than 24 feet long, they tend to break in wind or inclement weather requiring islands and additional gates to be built. With each state getting $1 Million a year in Federal Section 400 monies, not many gates get built. Medians create safety problems for signal maintainers safety. (especially from drunk drivers)...most states have a paperwork (application/decision) process that further bogs the process down during the acceptance/implementation process.

[Anonymous]

In Australia most of the level crossings have been removed from Sydney and surrounding suburbs due to accidents. The most notable level crossing is on Parramatta Road where suburban electric trains and goods trains cross each half hour to hour. Gates, lights and a light tap of the horn is all that protects thousands of motorists travelling one of the main routes between Sydney and Parramatta.

I believe what I am saying is horns, lights and gates only have effect on those who obey thier meaning. Maybe on black spots put a barrier in place that can not be gotten around by motorists and pedestrians alike. Also I like the idea of horns on the crossing as out here we have bells and sirens.

One day I want to travel to the States to enjoy some of your hospitality and travel on some of the best trains in the world, and possibly then I might more qualified to weigh in on this argument. But I see the same thing happening here in Australian society we are going the way of the lawyer and becoming a litiguous society.

Cheers and have a wonderful Christmas and happy new year from your friend in the land of OZ, David.

[kenfath]

In the late 1960's I worked at the ATSF Chicago Coach Yards. Whenever the passenger power, mostly F-units, was moved in the service/roundhouse area the horns would be sounded as a warning. On occasion an off note muted sound would be heard. The explanation was that a large bird had met its demise at the trumpet end of the horn. The carcass would seal off the horn. It was always a debate as to who would remove the remains. Apparently the work rules didn't specify if a pipefitter, machinist or laborer had the task.

Just wondering, will a locomotive with a horn that experiences this kind of malfunction need to be set out or swapped with another unit? This is another example of a problem solved and many more created.

[Anonymous]

another nimby attack!! ok, if they don't want the horns. don't cry on tv when someone you know or love tries to be a tough guy and go under the gates (if any), and that's it. safety and common sense go together. it's the people who sit in front of the tv all day, and don't want to hear the horn, while watching mindless reality shows, and can't hear the tv? maybe, maybe not. still, this is a reality show that no one takes seriously anymore. gates are not enough. i say this, if the horns go away, you are on your own with your fate. we need the horns, they are loud, but that is the whole idea. if it bothers you whiny people out there, then move!! most cases, the railroad was there before you. these are the people who like lawsuits as a sport. "the engineer didn't blow the horn"!! when you think about it, he or she should not have to, but people are so oblivious with their loud stereos, cell phones, etc., that staying alert is too much of a challenge!!! can't walk and chew gum at the same time? ... get out of your car, and take your test over! keep the horns, it's more music than most of this crap blasting out of these goofy kids cars anyway. support O.L !!!!

[JoeUmp]

QUOTE: Originally posted by davidpj1

One day I want to travel to the States to enjoy some of your hospitality and travel on some of the best trains in the world, and possibly then I might more qualified to weigh in on this argument. But I see the same thing happening here in Australian society we are going the way of the lawyer and becoming a litiguous society.

David,

Welcome from the U.S. IMHO if you are experiecing the same problem down under, then you are more than qualified to comment here.

Ilve about a mile from the nearest grade crossing and love to hear the horn when ever the local short line comes through. Even at 3:00 in the morning.[:)]

Joe

[Anonymous]

From: (Dave)[e-mail]
You've got to be kidding about reducing the sounding range of loco horns, that's just
asking for mass fatalities. I live about one third of a mile from the main NS double track
mainline in my town, and between a half dozen crossings, and sure, it gets loud sometimes, but mainly in Winter when the foliage has dropped and the wind is blowing from the East. It's never awakened me! I also happen to be a FRA licensed Engineer for
the Spencer Shortline, part of the North Carolina Transportation Museum's Tourist ride. I
should say the entire complex of tracks at our facility are the Spencer Shortline. We connect with NS on both ends so we abide by all Federal Rules and Licensure. We also
have several Public crossings on the property and in the past 5 years I've been challenged
by at least 5 Schoolbuses that failed to stop as required by law; one semi gasoline tanker;
two fuel trucks, and numerous private vehicles, and I'm just one of 18 or so Engineers who probably have their own horror stories. Thank God we've never had an incident, but
it isn't because the public hasn't tried. We use our Bells, Horns, whistles, and we do lay on them, not for play, but for safety, and we do have some classic Nathans and Leslies
that can wake the dead, and we make good use of them. I have many NS friends who tell
me that all Engineers will have an accident, not if, but when! You can always tell the ones
who have from those waiting to have by the way they use their horns! As I've told my wife
and neighbors, the louder they are, the more serious the accident they were involved in.
So Poppycock to these NIMBYS, maybe a horn will save their SUV driving, cell phone talking, make-up applying butts someday!!!!

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by RTB01

I just read in USA Today (12/18/2003 page 16A) a regulation proposal that would set the maximum volume of train horns and whistles at 110 decibels (as loud as a car horn) and prohibit sounding the horn or whistle more than 20 seconds from a crossing. It seems people have been complaining and the government is listening. This proposal doesn't seem like a good idea to me . In fact I think it sounds unsafe for motorists and pedestrians. The Federal Railroad Administration will take comments from the public for 60 days.

[Anonymous]

I think your government authorities are a bunch of "plonkers".
HELLO! , is the locomotive's whistle not a warning device!
What happens to all the dead people then at the crossings who didn't get enough warning.
If you live beside the railroad track, then you except all the sounds. It's a bit like those people that build beside an airport then complain about the aircraft noise????
Come on get real !!!

[Anonymous]

well, you see, here in the good ol' US of A, some people can live near the tracks all their lives, and then write letters to the government saying that rail lines should be removed and replaced with tractor-trailer and bus only highways, "Because trucks are better and trains are useless". I Know, Ive met some of them in my homr town (Which pretty much was founded by the railroad)

[cypriano]

For years---even going back to C&NW days---Chicago's Metra North Service going thru Wilmette, Winnetka, Highland Park & Lake Forest NEVER (well, seldom) blows the horn. Yet on the nearby North Central service going thru
Mundelein, Gray's Lake, Lake Villa and Antioch, I would hear engineers leaning on the horn---many times even as the entered the crossing so I could get the full Doppler Effect. Now they're experimenting with fixed horns at the crossing aimed at toward the roadway. Just seems like another way for railway equipment people to sell hardware.

[tnchpsk8]

I feel just the opposite. Here in central Tennessee we had two fatalities at the same crossing this year. It's quite possible that the victims could have been using their cell phones or were otherwise distracted. Train horns should be so loud and alarming that you can't help but notice them and react accordingly.

[vsmith]

Funny, I thought horns and gates were there to WARN us, guess they are really just their to annoy the nieghbors...How about this:

Install those rotating warning lights like on top of police cars and fire trucks on to the grade crossing warning lights, at least that would give drivers a clear-bright-visual -hey-look-at-this warning if they cant hear the new low volumn horns or bells (or see the lowered gates) inside their Luxury SUV's, If they are still stupid or impatient enough to ignore the signals then we also install large snowplow like devices to the noses of locos so that they can brush aside these morons without damaging or derailing the train.

Of course it would only be a matter of time before someone started complainning " the light are to bright, I can see them from my house, whah! whah!"

[Anonymous]

I think it is rediculous that people complain about train horns. I've lived beside railway tracks all my life. (CN and CP mainlines on either side of my house.) Because I have heard them all my life, then it doesn't bother me at all. I can understand the plea of people who live literally right beside the tracks-- close enough to rattle chinaware, etc. But most people should be able to get used to it. I have friends who moved to a house near the tracks. (Their old house was far from any railroad.) At first it woke them up every night when it passed through with the horns blaring. But after about 12 months, they slept right through it. As others have mentioned, people usually don't listen to the horns and bells, ignore the flashing lights, and drive around the gates. But if an unlucky motorist or pedestrian had these warnings, then it obviously isn't the railroad's fault. Its better to have the warning then not. Is a human life more important then an irritated homeowner?

~ðrågóñsläµér

[vsmith]

I thought this was relavent to the conversation, found and confirmed true on the Darwin Awards site:

"(2 August 2002, Kansas) Police said an Olathe man was struck and killed by a train after his vehicle broke down on Interstate 35. His attempts at repairing his car had failed, and he had stepped away from the busy freeway to call for help, when the train engineer spotted him standing on the tracks. The engineer said the man was holding a cell phone to one ear, and cupping his hand to the other ear to block the noise of the train."

If this idiot woudn't listen to the horn, what can you do? Fence off 1000's of miles of track I guess and spend milllions to seperate all grade crossings? Yeah, like our Gov will spend a penny for that...

[dharmon]

Which goes back to the idea of a capaciter and ZAPP....... Or maybe give all the train crews pellet guns......Hello stupid......pop.......hey what was that .....pop.....whoa train......

[Anonymous]

To quiet the train horns is the last thing we need to do. If anything, with all the DUMB A$$'s out there we need to make them louder, thats just my 2 cents.

[Anonymous]

Ive got an Idea! Replace gates with collomns of fire, shooting up from the roadway! People will not want to catch their car on fire (Unless their bigger idiots than the wourld should have to handle), so they have to stop! Kind of goes along with the capacitor.

[Anonymous]

I settled into chair with coffee to read this thread and got to where the sound levels were to be and I had to speak up.

If you are going to have 4 6000 Horse deisals thundering and roaring to keep that 110 car train rolling over the slight grade my town sits at about 30 miles an hour that 110 deciable horn will disappear into the screech of the turbos.

They run heavy and fast.. It takes 16 seconds for top speed from first whistle to crossing gates and train on crossing. Sometimes they would be a mile and just finishing a meet the gates go down a minute passes and no train, suddenly the drama of impatient drivers finding themselfs confronting a blasting horn 20 yards away is too much to watch.

The range of 100 feet specified in the whistle is too little and very unsafe. The main reason to whistle is to clear the track NOW and if you want to live wait until the train passes.

IF you cannot stand a train whistle maybe a option of putting home on market and moving at least 10 miles from the track may be needed.

I have to smile also because truckers are buying the very same railroad whistles and placing them on their rigs. I would be so tickled to see these same lawmakers considering this bill to have on of those go off nearby on the interstate. The very ground shakes.

I am in support of good whistles and common sense dictates that people wait becuase after all a train is much bigger than they are and have power to kill or main if they choose to try and save a minute of time. It could mean forever. Dont go around those gates.

[Anonymous]

As was well put in a reaction by a friend of mine, "What are they? Murderers?" People need to think this through, and OL should show more TV commercials. I saw a few from a TV cannel up in York PA, and OL has some good, graphic ones.

I don't know what it was, but there was a show on TLC one day that had footago of vehicles stuck on crossings as trains came by. If they showed these mor often (Mayby even Big Screen TVs at crossings) people would be less willing to weave the gates. One wasa test, and had a Brand new pickup truck being hit by a train consisting of chemical tank cars and at least 1 loco. The train kept going, but the truck almost snapped in half. Other footage has: a van being smashed to pieces, a car causing sparks along the rails, a tractor trailer being thrown up in the air in pieces, and trains that didn't make it eather (Wreck scenes and hoppers on top of homes), and much more. On the other hand, i guess the destruction of the Delorian on Back to the future III wasn't enough to sink in.

[edblysard]

Kenfath,
What the rules state is if the whistle or horn on the lead locomotive in a consist fails, and no other locomotive in the consist has a working horn,
the train must stop clear of any public crossing, a member of the crew must detrain, and proceed to the crossing.
After the crew member has determined the crossing to be clear of traffic, the train may proceed into the crossing, ringing the bell continiuosly until the lead locomotive fully occupies the crossing, with the crew member remaining at the crossing to warn any approching traffic.
After the lead locomotive fully occupies the crossing, the crew member may retrain and the movement may proceed.
If one of the trailing units has a functional whistle or horn it may be sounded by another crew member at grade crossings if needed, but the lead locomotive must be removed from the lead and replaced with one of the other locomotives with a working horn or whistle at the first available opportunity.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[Anonymous]

I am an Operation Lifesaver instructor and with all of the things we teach, this rule they are proposing is completely crazy. The way things are now is just fine, there are already too many injuries and fatalities on the rails the way it is (one is too many!) If this rule is implemented, these numbers will jump. ATTN: GOVERNMENT, LEAVE WELL ENOUGH ALONE!, especially when it involves the public's safety!

[Anonymous]

[:(]As usual somebody got the government involved. Most locomotives horns are 128db and we are still ignored. I would have voted for sound shields for the cabs (especially on passenger equipment) and double the ditchlights. Anything to get the attention of those that ignore us. I guess the bright side to all this is maybe we'll achieve better therapies for the PTSD victims that man the cabs.

[Anonymous]

i live in west norriton, pa. i am just up the street from the SEPTA R-6 norristown line, which i use to commute to work daily. this line hosts some of the most impatient people at a road crossing i have ever seen. SEPTA installed a very long gate, which pretty much blocks both lanes on the street. this gate is broken almost daily from people trying to go around it, because they are "late for work". it is usually some jack*$!, trying to keep "up to their timing" because they don't like to wait. the gates come down, and, at the very last second, they just BARELY make it. there is always next time. this was the second time today this happened. i think cameras should be installed at crossings facing the back of cars, to get license plate numbers, and hunt these idiots down. SEPTA still untilizes BUDD silverliner 3 and 4 mu sets. these are from the READING and PC days, when passenger cars were a lot heavier, and take just a little more time to stop. SEPTA's septa's stations are usually right next to grade crossings, and with all the people wandering about the area, this is dangerous territory. i even seen someone get out of a car at the gate, and run up to the moving train, going under the gate, and trying to board the train which was moving at about 10 mph!! the conductor verbally attacked this moron, telling him to get away. this was the most bizarre thing i seen at a grade crossing yet!! SEPTA needs louder horns too. they have these old 2-chime horns, which scare no one. they need to put k-5la's on their trains. hopefully, when the new trainsets arrive, they will have them. CSX also utilizes this track a few times a week. i noticed that when CSX comes through there, they lay on the 5-chime, and nobody moves! but, there will always be some "roadwarrior" out there who thinks they know what they are doing, then, they will wake up dead. on a lighter note, happy holidays to all!!!

[Anonymous]

Waaaaah! The mean ol' train and its loud horn are scaring me! And their driving down my property value! I can't watch "American Idol" with all that poopy train noise. Please government, make 'em stop!

[Modelcar]

....This craze of "quiet the train warning horns" is growing and sounds like more and more locations will be somehow putting it into effect...including this city here....An article in our paper just yesterday identified a zone one can hear the horns, etc....It looks like, locally, we're going to see some form of it in the near future.

When and after this city legislation takes place and we happen to experience a or several fatalities....someones heads will roll, but then it will be too late.

[WDGF]

If the RR owns the grade crossing (am I correct on this?), can they remove the grade crossings in "quiet zones"?

[tree68]

QUOTE: Originally posted by WDGF

If the RR owns the grade crossing (am I correct on this?), can they remove the grade crossings in "quiet zones"?

If they did that, how would the bozos run the gates????[:p]

Without question there would be a substantial amount of opposition, particularly in the case of main arteries... Of course, if the RR presented the case as one of safety, with lots of stats showing that the horns were necessary if the crossing was open, you never know how the courts would rule... If the taxes paid on the RoW were substantial, that could factor into the mix as well. Might get some locality to back off the whistle ban, though, or fund grade separations.

[wabash1]

In a town i lived in the railroad was getting complaints about the shape of the crossings. how rough they was continued by news articles and lawyers on people wanting to get composated for the repairs for their cars. so at 7am one morning the railroad stepped in and closed 3 crossings and people come home from work to find the crossing they used so much was closed and they had to find another way home.the city got involved with other lawyers to no availe the railroad had every right to close them crossings. Now there is other laws in place keeping them from doing this. but they still have the right to close them with proper paper work.

[JoeKoh]

Wabash
congats on 4 stars
it simple people stop look listen and live
stay safe
Joe

[AlcoRS11Nut]

The people where I live are complaining about this too!!!! Exscpetally this one guy, who built his house next to the tracks. Yes, the tracks were already there when he built his house. If it bothered him, why did he move there in the first place?!!!

Anyway, if they do do it, (which I think is a STUPID idea!!!, if anything they should make then LOUDER!!!) I think there will be a lot more crossing accidents from these yahoo's that don't pay attention to the warnings. If they get hit, they (if they live) or one of their family members will probably sue the railroad, and get the settlement. I don't know why they do, the train can't swerve, and the car should have been stopped before the tracks. They should have "Look, Listen, & Live" etched in their windshield as a reminder to them.

Okay, I'll get off my soap-box now.

[edblysard]

Heres the deal.
Local, County and state ordinaince cant not superceed federal regulations.
Fed regs say we have to sound the horn.
Guess what,
we do.
I asked the FRA, they said ignore the ordinance.
They will fine the engineer if he dosnt, and they(FRA) catch him.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[Anonymous]

Ed, does that mean the no horn zones are non existant in all legality?

[edblysard]

Not non exsistant, but non enforcable.
Every ordinance includes the phrase "the engineer may sound the horn in a emergency situtation".
They do not define what a emergency is, and if the engineer feels there is a danger at a crossing, he has to sound the horn.

Federal law states that if your railroad is engaged in interstate commerce, no local or state ordinance may superceed the federal laws, unless such ordinance or law is more restrictive in it's action, or in the interest of the general public.
Not blowing for a crossing endangers the general public, a second year law student could win this argument in any court.

Most railroads will comply with no horn zones, but only after the local identity assumes responsibility and liability for crossing accidents.
And you can bet that happens rarely.

Its sorta like the funny laws you hear about, like here in Harris county, it is illegal to play your fiddle on Sundays.
And you cant beat your mule between sundown saturday and sunrise monday.
What, theres a local fiddle playing, mule beating patrol?

I would love to see a local cop try and stop, much less ticket, a 50 mph coal trains crew!

What's he going to do, put spike strips on the tracks?
Maybe try a PIT manuver with his patrol car vs a SD70?

And heres one federal law you dont hear about too often.

Guess what entity can legaly hold up interstate commerce in the commision of its duites, and by law, we are ordered to not interfere with them?

Not the police, or the fire department, not even a ambulance, even though we try not to get in the way of any of these, and we have cut crossings to allow them through.

Not the military, or even the President of the United States.

If you guessed the U S Postal Service, your correct!

We cant delay the U S mail.
By order of Congress, it is a felony to impeed, delay, or rob a employee of the US Postal Service in the commision of their duties.
Everybody else is smooth out of luck!

And dont confuse an ordinance with a law.

A ordinance is a municipal statue or regulation, not a law.

A law is a governing body of rules, customs or conduct, enacted by , or a piece of, enacted legislation.

And every law must pass the test of wether it is in the interest of, or serves the interest of the public.

If your state legislature passed these ordinances, then they would be law, but they would be challanged in, and most likley overturned by that states supreme court.

If you local city fathers says you cant blow the horn, the federal law superceeds that, and you had better sound the standard crossing warning.

Just hit someone at one of these "quite zones" and watch how fast the FRA pulls you license, and how fast the victims family sues not only the railroad you work for, but sues you, the engineer for not following the federal law.

And this isnt a new issue, several attempts have been made over the years by local goverments to creat quite zones.
Some succeed, but most dont.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[Anonymous]

This topic reminded me of a story I heard about that's almost as ridiculous as this is. There's this railyard in Birtain that's been unused for quite a while and they want to reopen it and put it back into use. Part of the line happens to go past a maximum security prison that is houses some of the most dangerous murderers and terrorists in the UK. The prison authorities are against the railway starting operations there because the sound of the trains going by might disturb the prisoners' sleep. They aren't talking about the trains blowing their horns or anything, just the sound of them going by. Never mind the fact that there's a huge wall around the prison that would probably drown out a lot of the sound anyway. They are quite serious about this and claim that some things that may seem like nothing to us can seriously disturb some of the individuals in the prison.

My opinion on this: Prison is not supposed to be fun or an enjoyable experience. If the prisoners don't like the sounds of the trains going by then that's their own fault for breaking the law and getting put into there in the first place. There are probably many other things on these peoples' minds that they would be more concerned about than the sound of a train going by.

[mudchicken]

Trainhearted: Ed is 1000% correct....Local whistle ordinances are worth less than the political hacks that enabled them. The FRA has created the current dilemma following the current proposed rulemaking which was politically inspired following FRA cracking down on No-whistle zones where accidents were on the rise.

If the noise bothers you - move. If you can't move - call it AMBIANCE ! and live with it. The only people driving down real estate values are the NIMBY whiners and the none too bright real estate tradesmen.

Mudchicken

[Anonymous]

One issue that is a bit off topic came up (Kinda) was bypass of crossings. I take this to mean either digging the entire railroad down into the ground and paving over the tunnel or raising the railroad on a bridge and passing over the town. Who is going to pay for that?

Regarding Local Laws, Let the engineer blow that horn. Heck, the mayor and city council lives down town or near enough to hear that law being broken. I am a former driver and Federal Rules also applied to me. UNLESS a Local Law is more restrictive. For example, a Air Horn is legal coming into town but NOT legal in a "Quiet zone" such as a hospital etc. for these situations we had a city horn (Same as import cars "Beep") but those were never used, good dose of language out the window at top of lungs usually got the lout who did endanger him or herself out of the way.

They did a similar "test" ok.. exhibition of a collision on a crossing between a large car and a train. The train needed about a mile to stop and every foot of that mile was a ground off part from the vehicle. One would assume there will be body parts and hamburger strewn on every tie for that mile.

Government will continue on it's colossal misguided paths where it wills, we average joes can only stay out of the way and live as best as we can.

And one last note to those who are impatient and run crossings if you get killed I would hope that your family gets to clean the mess off the track. No one else should be made to pay for or fix your act of stupidity.

"Look Listen and LIVE"

[mudchicken]

HighIron: The over/under/by-pass is usually paid for by the street owner or developer. Most states usually get ony $1.5 Million per year or less from the Feds in Section 300 monies to address crossing safety. (that does not go far, maybe 1 overpass a year)

[Puckdropper]

Speaking of the thick prision walls absorbing sound, why not make those people that need their beauty sleep sound proof the outside walls of the house? Sure, you still hear the train horns outside, but you also have the neighbors, air conditioner, car horns, grain elevator fans, etc...

Another thought... Auto manufacturers should reduce the sound proofing for specific frequencies... Train horns and emergency vehicles...

Keep those train horns loud so they can be heard!

[Anonymous]

What I think they did in Washington DC to bypass the busy crossings was th have the road on an overpass. Trains have a harder time at steep grades than automobiles, and it is easyer to build a road over a rail line then a rail line over or under a road.

[Modelcar]

.....Yea, but one outfit is as bad as the next in changing by building bridges and cuts, etc...

[Anonymous]

I live in Ont. Can.in a city of aboult 300 000 people. We are served by 3 railroads (2 Class ones, and 1 Short line),Operation Lifesaver is in full scream here,we have billboards on buses, roadsides,bus shelters,radio ads,and TV ads. That said,I drive a Shuttle Bus for a living, and I see all manner of R.R.crossing crimes in my travels EVERY DAY !!! WHY DO PEOPLE TAKE LIVES, SO FOR GRANTED ! ? I have also seen the very sad, bad results from such STUPIDITY .We also have train / noise regulations here, but as most of our train speeds are low near town,and our train crews are very observant, our fatalities are minimum...But I have also seen how LOUD LONG HORN BLASTS can avert disaster(with the hope that the stupid will learn in living another day)...IF ANYONE IN POWER LISTENS TO OUR COMMON SENSE PLEAS, HORNS WILL NOT BE SQUELCHED ANY MORE THAN THEY ARE!!!

[Anonymous]

Seems like this is a good place to post this

As some of youi know, I jsut did the tour of Florida, very nice and warm might I add.. Now one night we stayed in a hotel near the train Tracks... now these tracks had Traffic lights, which is down right Stupid in the first place, but they had them. Now i couldn;'t halp but notice THAT EVERY single car, you could fit 2 comfotably between the Traffic lights and the RR crosdding, but there was always a THEIRD or FORTH car that would stop on the tracks!!

ALWAYS stop on the tracks!! ?!?!?!?

Who the heck Stops on RR tracks? I think I learnt thatr 3 minutes after i was born not to do that, that seems pretty easy to understand that concept.. It comes more naturally then common sence, it's like Elementry sence, somehting you should have learned along with the ABC's.

I litterally could not believe my eyes. There was not one car, whilwe iwas observing that stayed on the other side of the tracks, and we are talking about the CSX main line.

Perhaps, as i'm told, that the light automatically turns green when a train goes through.
Heres how that system works: FIRST the RR lights must be triggered in order to send a signal to the Town's Traffic light box in order for the Traffic lights to display Green..

So what happens if the RR lgiths fail, that would cause a glitch in the system, and not turn the traffic light green, causing it to stay RED.
To me, It's bad enoguh that RR lgihts Fail sometimes, and relying on them isnt an exceptionally Great idea. But relying on them to start flashing, then send a signla to the traffic light box so the traffic lights turn green, is relying on them FAR too much, if those ones failed your up shaza creek without a paddle. your boxed in between 2 cars, if your lucky, maybe more.

WHAT i'm trying to say .. DON'T STOP IN THE MIDDLE OF THE CROSSING!! Would you stop your car in the middle of the highway, or an airplane runway?

It's actually safer to stop your car in the middle lane of the highway!!

Some people..

[Anonymous]

A town I used to live in had Maryland Midland railway tracks through town. they cross the road at an intersection from one corner to the other. There is a traffic/ rr crossing light, but cars still stop beyond the stop line, right on the tracks. Its been like this, lets say forever, becayuse they are former WM tracks, and the old freight station is right at the intersection, and it is now a furnature store.

[Anonymous]

I recently read something on the internet about somebody wanting to have a device at a crossing that plays a recording of a train horn once the train is a certain distance away from the crossing so that just the people at the crossing hear the horn. I really don't see the practicality of this. You still hear the train even when it's farther away and if the recording was at the same volume as a real train (although I'd doubt that) you'd still hear it from far away. All in all, though, I think this is just a stupid idea that would be complicated and expensive. What will they think of next!?

[dekemd]

QUOTE: Originally posted by edblysard


I would love to see a local cop try and stop, much less ticket, a 50 mph coal trains crew!

What's he going to do, put spike strips on the tracks?
Maybe try a PIT manuver with his patrol car vs a SD70?

Stay Frosty,
Ed

Sarge, he hit the spikes but the wheels still haven't gone flat. Should we try shooting out the wheels or set up a road block?[:D]

[Supermicha]

I wonder what kinds of problems some people might have. In Germany trains only blow there horns one time before crossings with no gates and no lights. And does we have more accidents? no! Saftey is necessary i think, but too much is not good!

Micha

[Modelcar]

....Ed, our NS and CSX main lines that travel though Muncie have a through town speed limit of 30 Mph....and....again today in our paper is more on this subject of quieting the train horns and it really sounds like it is going to happen here yet this year.

[mudchicken]

Sask:
The idea of the mast mounted directional horns is to simply direct the sound of the horns down the corridor that the street traffic is travelling on. The thinking is that this may reduce the muffled effect of trees, buildings, etc. that dimini***he decibel level of the horn. It stiil won't get the attention of the brainless wonder with his boombox on as loud as it goes or numbnuts jabbering on the cell phone....

mc[banghead]

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by kevinstheRRman

Seems like this is a good place to post this

As some of youi know, I jsut did the tour of Florida, very nice and warm might I add.. Now one night we stayed in a hotel near the train Tracks... now these tracks had Traffic lights, which is down right Stupid in the first place, but they had them. Now i couldn;'t halp but notice THAT EVERY single car, you could fit 2 comfotably between the Traffic lights and the RR crosdding, but there was always a THEIRD or FORTH car that would stop on the tracks!!

ALWAYS stop on the tracks!! ?!?!?!?

Who the heck Stops on RR tracks? I think I learnt thatr 3 minutes after i was born not to do that, that seems pretty easy to understand that concept.. It comes more naturally then common sence, it's like Elementry sence, somehting you should have learned along with the ABC's.

I litterally could not believe my eyes. There was not one car, whilwe iwas observing that stayed on the other side of the tracks, and we are talking about the CSX main line.

Perhaps, as i'm told, that the light automatically turns green when a train goes through.
Heres how that system works: FIRST the RR lights must be triggered in order to send a signal to the Town's Traffic light box in order for the Traffic lights to display Green..

So what happens if the RR lgiths fail, that would cause a glitch in the system, and not turn the traffic light green, causing it to stay RED.
To me, It's bad enoguh that RR lgihts Fail sometimes, and relying on them isnt an exceptionally Great idea. But relying on them to start flashing, then send a signla to the traffic light box so the traffic lights turn green, is relying on them FAR too much, if those ones failed your up shaza creek without a paddle. your boxed in between 2 cars, if your lucky, maybe more.

WHAT i'm trying to say .. DON'T STOP IN THE MIDDLE OF THE CROSSING!! Would you stop your car in the middle of the highway, or an airplane runway?

It's actually safer to stop your car in the middle lane of the highway!!

Some people..

Hey Kevin, Welcome to America Buddy!

Dont you know that Common Sense is illegal down here, and its very dangerous to be thinking sensibly also. People will be resentfull and angry if you point out how stupid they are. Its a well known fact that down here its everyones God given in-alienable right to beincredulously stupid.

In fact being stupid is a point of pride for many down here, how else do you explain the armies ot creatins down here who drive while eating, putting on make up, talking on the phone, reading the newspaper, changing jr's daipers, doing their income taxes, or watching a DVD, all while blasting down the freeway at 90mph in their giant SUV (bonus points are given while doing all the above at the same time while steering with your knees).

So people stopped on the tracks, BIG DEAL, THATS THERE GOD GIVEN RIGHT, DAMMIT!!!.DARN RIGHT IT IS, DAMMIT!!!![:(!]

Dont you know that its the TRAIN that has to stop, least the blessed driver of the Hummer would have to defile his Self-rightousness by stopping before the crossing.

DONT YOU KNOW WHAT A SIN THAT IS DOWN HERE? DONT YOU?[}:)]

Kevin, Just yanking your chain,LOL, [:D]now you've got some idea why I'm always blasting drivers down here.[xx(]

Actually I'm surprised you managed to get out of Florida alive, the way some of those morons drive down there.[;)]

[wabash1]

I hate florida the only people that live in florida is old people and their parents.

vsmith
You bring up a good point . just because you cant do any of these things and drive is no reason to get down on us. Have you ever been around nashville tn at rush hour ? or atlanta ga? the south is all about sports football and nascar, rush hour is like nascar at talledaga or daytona 4-5 lanes of high speed drafting. if you are doing less than 90mph on the shoulder get in the grass . or some one will put you there. and if you think you can run with the big boys that is where football comes in. go to any parking lot of any office or factory and watch the games begin. ( i would say go to a wal-mart store but the women get to mean exspecialy at sales) . and watch the people scrap over a parking spot 2 up from the fartherest one there. Heck i remeber riding with my 91 year old aunt in her corvette. we idled at 110mph. For some reason people stay away from senoir citezens

[Mookie]

Ah Wabash and VSmith - you made my day - !!!!

Sounds a little like Lincoln - just throw in some ice and snow!

And this is the land of the SUVs! Nuts to a hummer - I am getting a tank to drive around in - say I like that - Mookie in an old Sherman Tank! Get Outta My Way You Cell Phone Bagel Eatin' Junkie!

[cherokee woman]

Mookie, sounds like a good idea!! But being only 4'7", I'd have to have a LADDER to get in the cotton pickin' tank[:D] My brother-in-law used to have a big pickup; when he would pick me up from work, I'd be climbling & crawling my way into it. Of course, he wouldn't BOTHER to help me up in it, just sit behind the wheel and laugh his fool head off[banghead]

cherokee woman[angel]

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by wabash1

I hate florida the only people that live in florida is old people and their parents.

vsmith
You bring up a good point . just because you cant do any of these things and drive is no reason to get down on us. Have you ever been around nashville tn at rush hour ? or atlanta ga? the south is all about sports football and nascar, rush hour is like nascar at talledaga or daytona 4-5 lanes of high speed drafting. if you are doing less than 90mph on the shoulder get in the grass . or some one will put you there. and if you think you can run with the big boys that is where football comes in. go to any parking lot of any office or factory and watch the games begin. ( i would say go to a wal-mart store but the women get to mean exspecialy at sales) . and watch the people scrap over a parking spot 2 up from the fartherest one there. Heck i remeber riding with my 91 year old aunt in her corvette. we idled at 110mph. For some reason people stay away from senoir citezens

I live in Los Angeles, Ca. I cut my teeth with maniac drivers! Those things I listed are on the driving test, as well as backing up without using your mirrors or changing lanes without looking over your shoulder. I feel sorry for people who visit from other parts where they will stop for you in a crosswalk, no dice here, they'll hit you, run away, and when they're caught claim they didnt see the family of 9 with 2 shoppingcarts and 2 baby carraiges crossing the street in broad daylight ot that they jumped out from behind a parked car on an empty street. If you ever want an education in driving, next time your on vacation take a drive from LA to Vegas on the I-15. The semi-trucks go 90! Anything less than 75 and the trucks will knock you off the road, the cars are going 100! I have been going down the same I-15 to San Diego at 75 and be blasted by passing cars going well over 100, almost everyone of these hammerheads is in a full-size luxo-SUV. Shear Insanity!

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Mookie

Ah Wabash and VSmith - you made my day - !!!!

Sounds a little like Lincoln - just throw in some ice and snow!

And this is the land of the SUVs! Nuts to a hummer - I am getting a tank to drive around in - say I like that - Mookie in an old Sherman Tank! Get Outta My Way You Cell Phone Bagel Eatin' Junkie!

Hi Mookie,

FYI, Eco-terrorists burned a Hummer dealer here a few months ago, shortly after guerrilla artists started putting up posters that said "BURN HUMMER, BURN!"

Waiting for the t-shirt of that one!!!

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by vsmith

QUOTE: Originally posted by kevinstheRRman

Seems like this is a good place to post this

As some of youi know, I jsut did the tour of Florida, very nice and warm might I add.. Now one night we stayed in a hotel near the train Tracks... now these tracks had Traffic lights, which is down right Stupid in the first place, but they had them. Now i couldn;'t halp but notice THAT EVERY single car, you could fit 2 comfotably between the Traffic lights and the RR crosdding, but there was always a THEIRD or FORTH car that would stop on the tracks!!

ALWAYS stop on the tracks!! ?!?!?!?

Who the heck Stops on RR tracks? I think I learnt thatr 3 minutes after i was born not to do that, that seems pretty easy to understand that concept.. It comes more naturally then common sence, it's like Elementry sence, somehting you should have learned along with the ABC's.

I litterally could not believe my eyes. There was not one car, whilwe iwas observing that stayed on the other side of the tracks, and we are talking about the CSX main line.

Perhaps, as i'm told, that the light automatically turns green when a train goes through.
Heres how that system works: FIRST the RR lights must be triggered in order to send a signal to the Town's Traffic light box in order for the Traffic lights to display Green..

So what happens if the RR lgiths fail, that would cause a glitch in the system, and not turn the traffic light green, causing it to stay RED.
To me, It's bad enoguh that RR lgihts Fail sometimes, and relying on them isnt an exceptionally Great idea. But relying on them to start flashing, then send a signla to the traffic light box so the traffic lights turn green, is relying on them FAR too much, if those ones failed your up shaza creek without a paddle. your boxed in between 2 cars, if your lucky, maybe more.

WHAT i'm trying to say .. DON'T STOP IN THE MIDDLE OF THE CROSSING!! Would you stop your car in the middle of the highway, or an airplane runway?

It's actually safer to stop your car in the middle lane of the highway!!

Some people..

Hey Kevin, Welcome to America Buddy!

Dont you know that Common Sense is illegal down here, and its very dangerous to be thinking sensibly also. People will be resentfull and angry if you point out how stupid they are. Its a well known fact that down here its everyones God given in-alienable right to beincredulously stupid.

In fact being stupid is a point of pride for many down here, how else do you explain the armies ot creatins down here who drive while eating, putting on make up, talking on the phone, reading the newspaper, changing jr's daipers, doing their income taxes, or watching a DVD, all while blasting down the freeway at 90mph in their giant SUV (bonus points are given while doing all the above at the same time while steering with your knees).

So people stopped on the tracks, BIG DEAL, THATS THERE GOD GIVEN RIGHT, DAMMIT!!!.DARN RIGHT IT IS, DAMMIT!!!![:(!]

Dont you know that its the TRAIN that has to stop, least the blessed driver of the Hummer would have to defile his Self-rightousness by stopping before the crossing.

DONT YOU KNOW WHAT A SIN THAT IS DOWN HERE? DONT YOU?[}:)]

Kevin, Just yanking your chain,LOL, [:D]now you've got some idea why I'm always blasting drivers down here.[xx(]

Actually I'm surprised you managed to get out of Florida alive, the way some of those morons drive down there.[;)]

LOL well put, You know i could ahve watched that crossing for hours, Except every time i'd snap at seeing somehting stupid, my Girlfiend would yell out, YOUR going to Give yourself a Heart attack, or high blood pressure!

We all packed into to 2 rooms at this massively cheep hotel, supposedly "fire-proof" rooms, i didn't and still don't believe that, the polubming was bad, the maintenance man wouldn't stop coughing, and the room next door, all you could hear is eeeeeeeee..eee.eeeeeeeeee..eee.eeeeeeeee..eee...eeeeeeeeeeee..eee....eeeeeeeeeee
and an occasioanl yell, BOY I WONDER what they were doing

next year, Quality or Comfort inn

That night i decided to hell with bed, i'll take the floor, I kind of thought the floor might be.. you know.. cleaner.

Couldn't guarantee these sheets had been washed

wow, yeah thats really gross.

[Mookie]

QUOTE: Originally posted by vsmith

QUOTE: Originally posted by Mookie

Ah Wabash and VSmith - you made my day - !!!!

Sounds a little like Lincoln - just throw in some ice and snow!

And this is the land of the SUVs! Nuts to a hummer - I am getting a tank to drive around in - say I like that - Mookie in an old Sherman Tank! Get Outta My Way You Cell Phone Bagel Eatin' Junkie!

Hi Mookie,

FYI, Eco-terrorists burned a Hummer dealer here a few months ago, shortly after guerrilla artists started putting up posters that said "BURN HUMMER, BURN!"

Waiting for the t-shirt of that one!!!

Boy you people are really serious out there! That's a lot different than here, where the eco-terrorists will just make sure a beetle isn't disturbed in the salt marshes.

[Anonymous]

When you say hummer dealership.. your talking about the SUV Hummer dealership, right?

[:D]

just tryuing to get the terms defined.

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by kevinstheRRman

When you say hummer dealership.. your talking about the SUV Hummer dealership, right?

[:D]

just tryuing to get the terms defined.

What other kind of burning Hummer do you know of...????

Might want ta see a doctor 'bout that...

[Anonymous]

Oh Burning hummer...

I'm trying to keep myself PG-13 rated, so the use of the word HUMMER should be discontinued..

Burning Hummer, eh? hehehehehehehehe... bet it feels weird...

OH YOU mean burning hummer the SUV... yeah.. uhh.. that must be terrible..
[:D]

[Anonymous]

Hey: Maybe there IS such a thing as too quiet...

Remember that the whole purpose of horns, whistles, gongs, ditch lights, and any other implements is supposed to be save lives. I was involved in a rail fatality last week, anything that would have alerted that victim to get off the tracks would be very necessary. I've heard plenty of things louder and more disturbing than train horns
and whistles. Somebody can always complain about the noise, but are they grateful that nobody gets hit?

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by kevinstheRRman

Oh Burning hummer...

Burning Hummer, eh? hehehehehehehehe... bet it feels weird...

[:D]

As we used to say at my Architecture School,

"Theres nothing wrong with this project that cant be solved with a little lighter fluid and a match!"

[Mookie]

QUOTE: Originally posted by WaterLevelCat

Hey: Maybe there IS such a thing as too quiet...

Remember that the whole purpose of horns, whistles, gongs, ditch lights, and any other implements is supposed to be save lives. I was involved in a rail fatality last week, anything that would have alerted that victim to get off the tracks would be very necessary. I've heard plenty of things louder and more disturbing than train horns
and whistles. Somebody can always complain about the noise, but are they grateful that nobody gets hit?

[:I] Curious Mookie again - what's a Water Level Cat? New breed to me!

Moo

[vsmith]

If it floats with all four feet straight up, its level?

[dharmon]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Mookie

QUOTE: Originally posted by WaterLevelCat

Hey: Maybe there IS such a thing as too quiet...

Remember that the whole purpose of horns, whistles, gongs, ditch lights, and any other implements is supposed to be save lives. I was involved in a rail fatality last week, anything that would have alerted that victim to get off the tracks would be very necessary. I've heard plenty of things louder and more disturbing than train horns
and whistles. Somebody can always complain about the noise, but are they grateful that nobody gets hit?

[:I] Curious Mookie again - what's a Water Level Cat? New breed to me!

Moo

Dunno...but sounds like it won't perform too well at altitude. [xx(]

But if you place the cat in tub, and push it under until it's level.....should work. May try that on my next tile project.

[Mookie]

you guys should go back to the pizza and pepsi - sounds like you got into the wrong color cola!

Miffed Moo!

Grumble Grumble

[Anonymous]

As a locomotive engineer. It is quite nice to have the loudest most annoying horn as possible on a locomotive. Especially when you are running down a 2% grade at 20mph, and come around a blind 14 or 15 degree curve to see a family of four set up in lawn chairs grilling on the hibachi between the rails of the main line. I'll tell you that there is no worse feeling in the world than throwing the train into emergency and watching helplesly as a three year old girl disapears under the nose of the locomotive. As it was, we missed killing them by about ten feet. All I can remember is the mother of the little girl holding her and crying, knowing how close they came to dying that day. The only thing that saved their lives was the horn on the locomotive. So **** on any government official or activist group that wants to quiet them. Let them sit behind the control stand in the same situation and then see what they have to say.

[Anonymous]

this was once tryed in flordia but collisons increased by double and the rule was lifted.

[retsignalmtr]

the way people have their radios and cd players at a high volume they would never be able to hear the horn anyway. i was a signal maintainer on the nycta and many times my helper and i were reminded where we were while being engrosed in our work that a train was approaching by the motorman laying on his whistle or horn. many times the trains had no horns or defective horns that didn't make very much noise. several coworkers were killed because they had no warning of an approaching train. i live seven miles from a csx and metro north line and i can sometimes hear the horns in the middle of the day. i'm sure that if those people who want to lower the volume had children riding school buses over guarded or unguarded crossings they would change their minds.

[mudchicken]

Water Level Cat - a fan of NYC and its water level route?

[kenneo]

Or is Mookie using an underfur disguise? [:-,]

[Modelcar]

....The comments of the Locomotive Engineer above, should be published in newspapers in these localities that want to silence the warning train horns...or make it required reading for the politicians. My city, Muncie is one of them that want to silence them and I believe it is going to happen this year...! Two class one's, NS and CSX run though our city with lots of crossings.

[Mookie]

QUOTE: Originally posted by kenneo

Or is Mookie using an underfur disguise? [:-,]

The Mookie hates water - could teach swimming from all the lessons she has had - but can't swim a stroke, tries hard not to drink it and can't imagine a water level cat. Still getting over a "water spaniel"....silly dog!

[wabash1]

Model car

whos going to stop me from blowing the horn? they can put any ruling up they want in any city they want but until the thing comes out in bullitin form or in the time table. i will blow. and if i feel it is safer to blow than run silent i will. what are the cops going to do go to the next crossing with red lights on sit on the crossing blocking it so i cant go thru? ( this may sound dumb but a cop tried this on me once.) the truth be known we will kill more people . I think i have a idea that will beat the stupid question thread calling it the stupid things people do at railroad crossings . in which you will tell what you have seen people do at crossings and on the railroad right of way. and dont forget most of these people always tell us we are number 1.

[Anonymous]

My Wife and I are for the train wistles, we moved here to north Idaho from Yakima WA.
Here in Sagle (just south of Sandpoint) our property borders the BNSF Railway and the
Sagle Road, BNSF grade crossing is right out front. Our Realestate agent was amazed when we told her we wanted to be as close to the BN Main Line as posible.
We love BNSF and keep as close an eye as possible on the trains and tracks and if ever we caught anyone messing around with either, we would turn them in, in a Seattle Second. We see drivers going around the gates quite often, as we see it they should get three tickets, one for running a red light, one for driving on the wrong side of the road while going around the gate, and one for trespassing while the gates are down.
As the wife says "those guys destination will still be there after the train is gone!"
I thought I would add this little poem I wrote while working at Boise Cascade Corp. in Yakima. Yeah Im not a railroader by trade just in Heart. I'm just a retired mill rat, but my Dad Worked for the Northern Pacific for 28 1/2 years including six of them at Stampede Pass in the 1940's running the ventalation system at Stampede Tunnel. Anyway here's the poem.

A little food for thought

Safety mindedness is the headwaters
that let's the rivers of non injury
flow freely into the oceans of
longevity and prevent the dams of
haste from forming the lakes of
death, injury and waste.

Raymond G. Phelps
railwayray

[David3]

Here in Joliet, IL people want to propose a law to stop train horns on the BNSF, UP, and EJ&E. My dad and I are all for the horns. These people don't realize that if you don't blow horns more people will go around gates, then that means that more people will get hit by trains. Then the people will be mad again. There's just no pleasing these people. [:(!]
Dave

[zardoz]

AAR Statement on FRA Rule on Whistle Blowing

The Federal Railroad Administration (FRA) announced publication of an interim final rule that mandates the sounding of train horns at highway-rail grade crossings and establishes criteria by which communities can qualify as a quiet zone areas. This new rule recognizes that sounding train horns saves lives while, at the same time, provides localities alternatives to the locomotive horn where safety will not be compromised. “The industry commends the FRA for developing a rule that recognizes public safety concerns and allows localities to develop alternatives to reduce train horn noise in residential neighborhoods,” said AAR President and CEO Edward R. Hamberger.

“Implementation of this rule will make it even more critical to substantially increase the funding of the Section 130 Program as proposed in H.R. 3550, TEA-LU and to allow maintenance of crossing devices to be considered an eligible expense,” Hamberger added.

The rule will take effect on December 18, 2004. The railroad industry looks forward to working with the FRA during the 60-day comment period on the specific elements of the proposed rule.


http://www.aar.org/Index.asp?NCID=1903

[dharmon]

QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz

AAR Statement on FRA Rule on Whistle Blowing

This new rule recognizes that sounding train horns saves lives while, at the same time, provides localities alternatives to the locomotive horn where safety will not be compromised.

I thinking the the only safe alternative to the horn is to drop the gate and place a lock and chain on it holding it down, placing tire spike strips on either side so no one can drive around and putting a sign on it that says road closed.

[Modelcar]

...I don't know how local authorities plan to put this new pending ordinance into effect and inforce it. They sure do seem serious about doing it this year yet....and unless something changes, I believe they will. It will be interesting to see what happens.

[Anonymous]

Here in Canada the train drivers are directed by federal legislation re sounding horns starting at 1/4 mile distance from crossings. BUT, believe it or not, individual municipalities can pass by-laws prohibiting the sounding of loco horns within town limits. I think Mudchicken is on the right track with getting everybody to sign accountability for mishaps. They shouldn't be called accidents because most of them aren't accidental. They're the result of somebody being wilfully stupid.
"Geez, when I bought my house nobody told me trains might make noise." Duh!

[wabash1]

here is a concept for the no noise people. at night ( with my black NS engine) i should turn off all lights step lights ,head lights number lights and run dark no horn blowing or bell ringing. and not haft to stop to see the mess of bodies we mutilate at crossings ever again. lets see how long it will take for them to fix that.

you cant put stop sticks down at crossings as this would only slow down the law breakers and get them killed faster. no noise would be better as this allows the conductor to sleep longer.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by dharmon

QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz

AAR Statement on FRA Rule on Whistle Blowing

This new rule recognizes that sounding train horns saves lives while, at the same time, provides localities alternatives to the locomotive horn where safety will not be compromised.

I thinking the the only safe alternative to the horn is to drop the gate and place a lock and chain on it holding it down, placing tire spike strips on either side so no one can drive around and putting a sign on it that says road closed.

I agree with Dan, but thats a lot of money invested in Spike Strips!

You know who goes around the gates more often then not? The "30 minutes or it's free" pizza guys. These guys are terrible for going around the gates, And bad news for him now, there are Two seperate police forces that can guve hium a ticket for going around RR gates. The Regaular town Police force, or The CPR Police, they now have the ability to give out tickets. Last time they did, they were parkes at the side of the crossing in a Red honda Civic.. pretty discreet I think, And trust me, thats a whopper of a fine.

[techguy57]

As I've said before I am all for the engineers blaring the horns as loudly as they please because if it saves one life it is worth it. Now, I live about half a mile from the UP Janesville sub, AKA Metra's UP-NW line. There isn't a ton of freight traffic near wher I live on the route but there is some and I rarely ever hear their horns as they pass by. Surprisingly what I actually do hear is the sound of Metra's F40 diesels. I can hear them even when our house is closed up tight, like it is now to keep out the cold.

My point is this: I'm sure I'm in the minority of people overall, but where I live I fully expect to hear horns and bells and engines. This doesn't bother me, actually I find that I sleep better with the low hum from the diesels. But the fact that I can't hear the horns from a half mile away concerns me a little. Can't people understand that if this is the case they are too quiet already? I know I'm preaching to the choir, but its just so frustrating!
[banghead]

Please go to the FRA website and comment on this if you feel as strongly as I do. Your opinion has a chance to make a difference. Please visit the site to comment:
http://www.fra.dot.gov/Content3.asp?P=1318

Mike

[cypriano]

Perhaps some of the engineers who have been supporting horn blowing can justify blowing the horn in the middle of a grade crossing with the next grade crossing more than a mile away. As I said earlier in this thread, I have been the first car at a crossing, no one from either side attempting to go around the gates, and the engineer is leaning on the horn as he enters the crossing so we get the full Doppler effect. It reminds of the answer of why a dog licks his privates: Because he can.

One nice thing that has been here in Lake County Illinois is that all grade crossing have posted on beneath the flashing light on the gates is a sign with the RR's name and phone # so that malfunctioning gates and/or lights can be reported. There used to be a crossing on the single track freight line of the C&NW (now UP) at Wadsworth Road that was not working too much. Too many times I had been stopped with out a visble train. At that point, one can see in each direction 2 1/2-3miles.

[dekemd]

QUOTE: Originally posted by cypriano

Perhaps some of the engineers who have been supporting horn blowing can justify blowing the horn in the middle of a grade crossing with the next grade crossing more than a mile away. As I said earlier in this thread, I have been the first car at a crossing, no one from either side attempting to go around the gates, and the engineer is leaning on the horn as he enters the crossing so we get the full Doppler effect. It reminds of the answer of why a dog licks his privates: Because he can.

I believe the rule book states two long blasts, a short, and a long that is held as the lead engine goes across the crossing. They are following the rules and FRA mandates.

[Anonymous]

I do not ever recall hearing or reading about a railroad empoyee being hit by a train
while driving his/her vehicle. Hum wonder why that is?

railwayray
Sagle Idaho

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by railwayray

I do not ever recall hearing or reading about a railroad empoyee being hit by a train
while driving his/her vehicle. Hum wonder why that is?

railwayray
Sagle Idaho

How about a railroad worker being hit by a train while driving a railroad vehicle?

Check out Ed's posting back in January. Here is a link to it.

http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=1&TOPIC_ID=11547

If you or anyone else would like to see the pics (that Ed send out) of this accident just email me and I will be happy to email them to you. The train was equipped with a camera and there are 5 shots of the truck pulling onto the tracks just prior to the accident. In one shot you can see parts of the truck shooting into the air. [}:)]

[Anonymous]

Isin't loud enough?

[Anonymous]

In this day and age ,with super insulated cars, to quiet them down, and theese days of OVERLY loud car stereos, that proposal is just f*%#ing STUPID!!!!!
Go Bush.........you freakin' MORON!!!!! Let's see what else you can screw up!!!![:(!]

[wabash1]

the fra says i must hold the last long til the engine is over the crossing. not because i can blow its because i haft to. I dont like sitting at a crossing waiting on the train to go by listening to the horn. it is annoying. but i wont stop blowing either . its my job. and a job i love.

[Junctionfan]

I find that some of the NS C39-8 the hunchbacks, are too quiet. Watched a video of one approaching a crossing and its horn was too quiet. I could have slept through it when I was there but the only thing stopping me was of course it was a train.

[Randy Stahl]

QUOTE: Originally posted by railwayray

I do not ever recall hearing or reading about a railroad empoyee being hit by a train
while driving his/her vehicle. Hum wonder why that is?

railwayray
Sagle Idaho

A friend, Mike Adams was killed by a locomotive/ train. Mike had just finished doing dailys on the engine in Madison and was returning to Janesville. He dailyed the engine that killed him that morning. The world we live in is dangerous, Mookie is right , ultimately only we are responsible for our own safety. No one is immune from complacency, hopefully though , when it happens it won't cost us our lives. RR crossings merit special attention, roll down the windows, turn the A/C off, turn the radio down, stop, look and listen !
Randy

[TH&B]

Pass a law that every car and truck must role down their windows prior to crossing any railroad track, rain or shine or snow. If a train should ever hit a car with windows closed no investigation or further delay required. Cheap and simple. Too cheap and simple in fact, none would ever ok it for some reason or other, not much $$$ to be made with such a law.

[Randy Stahl]

I think that kinda already is the law....If you get hit by a train it's your fault . It's safer to roll the window down and prevent an accident.
Randy

[zardoz]

QUOTE: Originally posted by cypriano

Perhaps some of the engineers who have been supporting horn blowing can justify blowing the horn in the middle of a grade crossing with the next grade crossing more than a mile away. As I said earlier in this thread, I have been the first car at a crossing, no one from either side attempting to go around the gates, and the engineer is leaning on the horn as he enters the crossing so we get the full Doppler effect.

Back in the "good old days" (pre-desktop control stand) the engineer had an actual air valve that activated the whistle. The engineer could physically control the amount of air being sent to the whistle, and could (if he was so inclined) "feather" the whistle volume as needed, from a loud blast for saffety, to a gentle "toot' to get the attnention of a crewman.

Now with the %&$#@!!! desktop control, there is only a stupid bush-button to activate the whistle, and it is a "all or nothing" operation.

And as other posters noted, the rule (paraphrased) is "the whistle shall be blown until the crossing is occupied".

[wcfan4ever]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Randy Stahl

I think that kinda already is the law....If you get hit by a train it's your fault . It's safer to roll the window down and prevent an accident.
Randy

Its funny how many people still try to blame the train. I have heard people say the train wasnt loud enough, but those are the people that are signing those petitions saying they want horns banned. Its not like a train can veer away from the crossing.
I say let the train blow the horn has much as possible. It may be loud and annoying but you cant say you didnt hear the train then. I have to deal with it every night. The train comes in at Midnight and we have 20 crossings that wind around town. The train comes in eastward then turns a 180 then goes west then south into the yard. 90% of the crossing are when the train is coming in while heading west facing my house. It wakes you up everynight but I haven't heard anyone get hit by the train in years within the city limits.
There have been many area communities that have been pushing for a horn ban but not too long ago, the state mandated that there are to be no more horn bans. If anything, there was to be horn bans lifted in some cities. That is great news! Just my view.