QUOTE: Originally posted by solzrules Oh. Well in that regard, you may be right. I suppose it would depend on the commodity prices and stuff like that. After reading about the troubles the DME are having over upgrading an existing line, I was speculating about the trouble other railroads might have doing something similar (upgrading infastructure).
QUOTE: Originally posted by kenneo QUOTE: Originally posted by solzrules Oh. Well in that regard, you may be right. I suppose it would depend on the commodity prices and stuff like that. After reading about the troubles the DME are having over upgrading an existing line, I was speculating about the trouble other railroads might have doing something similar (upgrading infastructure). Ah. The reason the DME had so much trouble is that they coupled the rehab and the new construction. The rehab then fell under the same rules as new construction. Had they kept a clear disconnect (principally by not saying a word about any rehab or up grading and just doing the work as if it were a normal maintainence cycle), only the new construction would have fallen under the view of folks.
QUOTE: Originally posted by greyhounds And we've got people right here on this board who want the Federal Government to divert money from the BNSF so people can grow wheat in Montana to produce noodles in the Far East.
QUOTE: Originally posted by futuremodal QUOTE: Originally posted by greyhounds And we've got people right here on this board who want the Federal Government to divert money from the BNSF so people can grow wheat in Montana to produce noodles in the Far East. And who might that be? The ones on our side who defend Montana farmers against BNSF's rate structure simply desire intramodal competition for BNSF as a means of empowering market based competitive rates. If that means breaking up BNSF or forcing BNSF to host a competitor on it's tracks to comply with Staggers Act caveats, or in subidizing a new railroad into BNSF's territory to provide that competition, so be it. No one has said we should divert money from BNSF and give it to farmers as far as I know.
QUOTE: Originally posted by solzrules Something else to consider regarding DC Series motors. The more load is placed on them, the more current they draw. This increase in current increases the electro-magnetic field in the motor. This causes the motor to work even harder. They are the perfect motors for a train. They work even more efficiently with more load on them. That's how these little Joe engines were rated at 7000 hp. They probably could have maxed out at an even higher horsepower.
QUOTE: Originally posted by CMSTPP By the way, nice pics of the GP38-2. Pretty cool to see that still working. In duluth here there is a Ex milwaukee GP40 still working in the yard. It has been repainted I hope to get some pics of it tomorrow. James
QUOTE: Originally posted by CMSTPP I believe the little joes were rated at 5500 Horse power. But it wasn't all HP that made them effecient. There tractive effort was so great, 250,000 pounds per square inch. This made the locomotive able to haul large trains over the mountains.
QUOTE: Originally posted by MichaelSol QUOTE: Originally posted by CMSTPP I believe the little joes were rated at 5500 Horse power. But it wasn't all HP that made them effecient. There tractive effort was so great, 250,000 pounds per square inch. This made the locomotive able to haul large trains over the mountains. Well, Milwaukee never published new figures after the voltage upgrade to 3400 volts DC. The Joes weren't really the workhorse in terms of tractive effort. The GE boxcab was the workhorse. The Joes were more like a thoroughbred; built to move fast. These are at 3400 volts: The EF-1,2, and 5 are one, two and four unit GE Boxcabs. The EF-4 is the GE 750 series, aka Milwaukee Little Joe. Class .. cont. hp...one hr hp...TE ...EF-1...3,785.....4,647.....112,750 ...EF-2...5,678.....6,970.....169,000 ...EF-4...5,791.....6,267.....108,850 ...EF-5...7,571.....9,293.....232,750 Electrical equipment could put out more horsepower, for instance, for shorter periods. A Joe could conceivably put out 10,000 hp for a 15 minute rating, and in cold weather, that short time rating might be closer to the one hour rating. But, it would slip its wheels, so that much horsepower couldn't be used. Seven thousand horsepower from a Joe was measured on Butte Hill by Barry Kirk, and didn't slip, but that had to be close ... An EF-5 had a potential hp rating on that basis of 20,000 hp. Best regards, Michael Sol
QUOTE: Originally posted by MichaelSol Well, I am sure the catenary would be melting as well.
QUOTE: Originally posted by erikem Noel Holley's The Milwaukee Electrics stated that the catenary was good for a maximum of 4,000 amps per train (could be a bit higher on a winter night). This would imply a maximum of 14,000 to 15,000 hp from a pair of Joe's.
QUOTE: Originally posted by solzrules Why then, and I realize that this may have been discussed before, did the Milwaukee abandon its electric power?
QUOTE: Originally posted by futuremodal QUOTE: Originally posted by solzrules Why then, and I realize that this may have been discussed before, did the Milwaukee abandon its electric power? If I may venture an abstract guess, Milwaukee jettisoned it's electric power (and eventually it's whole PCE) for the same reason(s) Montana Power Co. jettisoned all it's power plants and became (gag!) TouchAmerica - sometimes management just does stupid things. BTW, where exactly are you in that photo? It looks like just north of Avery.
QUOTE: Originally posted by Tancarter I stumbled on this site by accident looking for something else related to the Milwaukee Road. While I am not a history buff, reading the posts has brought back a lot of good memories. My dad worked for Milwaukee in the early '70's in Montana, Idaho and Washington, and I truly lived in a box car as we followed him all over working on the line. We even spent time in Avery. My mother tells stories about staying there and about drunken bears feasting on the fermented grain from derailed cars. When we weren't following my dad, our home was in Ryegate, where I listened to the Milwaukee rumble past until it sneaked off in to the dark .
QUOTE: Originally posted by greyhounds And sometimes they do the right things that some unfortunate people just won't accept as the right things.
QUOTE: Originally posted by MichaelSol QUOTE: Originally posted by greyhounds And sometimes they do the right things that some unfortunate people just won't accept as the right things. Yes, when the losses doubled as soon as the PCE was shut down, that sure proved the point in an emphatic way, if nothing else would. Of course, for some, that meant it was the right thing to do .... because that's how they learned math.
QUOTE: Originally posted by greyhounds QUOTE: Originally posted by MichaelSol QUOTE: Originally posted by greyhounds And sometimes they do the right things that some unfortunate people just won't accept as the right things. Yes, when the losses doubled as soon as the PCE was shut down, that sure proved the point in an emphatic way, if nothing else would. Of course, for some, that meant it was the right thing to do .... because that's how they learned math. Correlation is not, in any way, causality. We've been over this before - some still don't understand it.
QUOTE: Originally posted by Kevin C. Smith The decision to scrap the electrification was made in what year? '71 or '72? I'm sure it was not long before the 1973 oil embargo but when did the wires start coming down? What, in your opinion, would have been tha latest date MR could've "stayed the execution" and reactivated the electric service before it would've been too expensive to do so?
QUOTE: Originally posted by ValorStorm The rumor was that before there was an MRL, Bill Brodsky drew up a business plan to take over the PCE before it was to be pulled up, and run it in direct competition to BN's former NP, not just thru Montana, but along its entire length. This MAY have been a factor in BN's acquiescing to the release of the NP line in the first place. In one of the aforementioned "heated discussions" in a (hopefully) locked thread, I made this insipid point and caught all-fired hades for it. Montana was a hot topic back then. Speaking of Montana Power Co., ....
Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.