Murdering den of thieves

[Anonymous]

http://www.centredaily.com/mld/centredaily/news/6154874.htm

Budget for railroad crossing safety may be under the knife
By Ken Leiser

St. Louis Post-Dispatch

(KRT) - The White House's proposed federal transportation spending plan could spell the end of the line for a program aimed at preventing accidents at the nation's railroad crossings.

Under the plan, the administration would no longer require states to spend $155 million a year of their federal transportation aid on rail highway crossings. Missouri's share of the federal money is about $4 million annually, while Illinois receives about $8 million.

Instead, the crossing money_distributed until now under the federal government's Section 130 program_would go to the states in a form that would give them greater latitude in how it is used to improve transportation safety.

Not long after Secretary of Transportation Norman Mineta unveiled the transportation spending proposal last month, a railroad trade association voiced concern about elimination of the Section 130 program.

While not a significant line item in any state highway budget, industry officials say the rail highway crossing program has helped in significantly reducing the carnage at the nation's crossings over the past three decades.

Between 1975 and 2002, the number of collisions at highway rail grade crossings plunged from 12,126 to 3,066. The number of crossing deaths was cut by more than half over that span, too, from 917 to 355.

Rail safety experts also credit the Operation Lifesaver education program, tougher law enforcement efforts and various engineering improvements for the safety gains.

"We think that (program) is a very large part of the reason that grade crossing accidents and fatalities have both been cut sharply over the last 20 years," said Tom White, a spokesman for the Association of American Railroads.

Edward Hamberger, the association's president, said in a May letter that the group was "strongly opposed" to eliminating the railroad crossing program and urged state highway officials to continue their support for it.

"Now is not the time to do away with a tried and true highway safety program," Hamberger wrote to the state highway group.

The American Association of State and Highway Transportation Officials wants to keep the rail crossing program alive and to even increase the funding that flows to its member states, said Leo Penne, the organization's program director for intermodal and industry activities.

The current $155 million-a-year level has not kept pace with inflation since the mid-1980s.

President George W. Bush's administration believes that its proposal - and that is all it is at this point - would bolster transportation safety by giving the states more flexibility in spending their money, said Warren Flatau, a spokesman for the Federal Railroad Administration.

There will be no net loss of safety funds as a result of the proposal, federal transportation officials say.

"For our part, the FRA will continue to work in close cooperation with the state departments of transportation in providing technical guidance, assistance and recommendations in addressing grade crossing safety concerns," Flatau said.

But railroad safety advocates fear that rail crossing safety will lose what little money it gets if the projects are forced to compete with other needs.

"I would hate to see them bring it in and not earmark it toward railroad safety because chances are that they would forget about it," said Denny Moore, a trustee for the nonprofit Angels on Track Foundation. "They would use it somewhere else."

Moore's teenage son Ryan was killed at a crossing in 1995. The nonprofit foundation promotes railroad grade crossing safety in Ohio.

Meanwhile, efforts to draft a new six-year, $247-billion transportation spending blueprint are moving forward in Congress.

Whether states will be required to continue spending prescribed amounts on rail crossings is still a topic for debate, although several sources believe Section 130 will survive. Rep. Jack Quinn (R-N.Y.) has introduced a bill that not only would preserve the program but also increase national spending to at least $300 million.

In Missouri, the state tackles its problem crossings using its share of the federal money - stuck at about $3.998 million a year since 1991 - and another $1 million generated by a special tax on vehicle licensing.

The state and railroads review grade crossings to compile a list of the most dangerous. The projects are ranked in order of priority, and about 25 to 35 are funded each year.

The state, for instance, helped improve the Rock Hill Road crossing over the Union Pacific Railroad tracks in Webster Groves_once listed in a federal analysis as one of the 10 most dangerous in the state.

The crossing has a full set of lights and gates. But for some reason, when no trains were coming, southbound motorists occasionally were confused and made left turns from Rock Hill onto the tracks instead of nearby Lockwood Avenue.

"There was uniform recognition by the railroad, by the state and by us that that was a problem," said Webster Groves Public Works Director Dennis Wells.

Nothing - signs, striping, lighting - prevented the occasional wrong turns.

Eighty percent of the $443,143 cost to realign a section of Rock Hill near the tracks was covered using federal money from the federal program. The city and Union Pacific also chipped in for the project, which was largely completed last summer.

[edblysard]

WE DONT CARE!
The Unihead Ed

[Anonymous]

You are not welcome here! Get it. Don't hide behind the cloak of the internet and find any one of us rails and spout your crap to one of us face to face. Now go away!
Ken

[Anonymous]

What is the point you are trying to make? What I read here only proves that railroads and communities are working together to improve railroad safty. Do you even read what you post? Please find another WEB sight to play on.
ILLINIOS

[JoeKoh]

oh my Operation lifesaver is working!
the gov't funds railroad crossings
the railroads try to work with local gov'ts.
we've said this all before clown!
go back home to mamma!
joe

[eolafan]

Hey Missouri, don't go away mad......

JUST GO AWAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[dknelson]

Well lots of programs get cut in economic hard times. It is a matter of priorities. Nothing can take the place of an alert and intelligent driver.
This is off topic but I once read that it would take about $2200 worth of added safety devices and engineering in an automobile to give the driver the same protection and benefits that a $20 bicycle helmet would provide. But nobody wants to wear the helmet when they drive (I am talking autos here not Harleys) so we "prefer" I guess to spend thousands more on our cars to make it involuntary. The human mind is a strange and interesting thing, is it not? If you need further proof, go to the frozen food section of a store and price out frozen peas -- compare buttered and unbuttered peas and then notice how much you are paying the company to butter your peas for you.
And now, back to our regularly scheduled programming ....it's a beautiful day ... Go Rochelle Webcam!

Dave Nelson

[Mookie]

Thank you Dave for a breath of fresh air!

Jen

[BRAKIE]

Missy Go take a bungee jump off the nearest bridge and forget the bungee cord..We are tired of your trash,lies and half truths...Why do you insists on making a fool of yourself? Can't you read? If so reread that carefully and you will see how big of a fool you made yourself..AGAIN!

[wabash1]

I only have a few things to say to this post. by missouri.

1) everything you have posted in the past that we said we didnt care about that the railroads and the goverment ( that you elect) work together to make things safer and that it is the public who disobeys laws and get them selves killed. seems like a old record to me. but now i will post the best

2) I realize you are not from missouri as i know there is no such news paper in st. louis . so with that ill tell you this stop look listen and live. the only decent advice i can give you.

3) missouri why dont you go and help the amish out. horses are considered the #1 transportation mode in america that is why laws on the books still should be inforced couse horses have the right away at all times even padestrians have the right away and look at how many get hit. why dont railroads lose cases in court couse the railroads have the right away at crossings its kinda hard to sue someone who is in the right.

[Anonymous]

I'm concerned as much as anyone about safety. In the transportation field we should be paying more attention to the land use decisions made by local and county elected officials. It seems developers can build wherever they like with no provisions for alternate modes of transportation. We're forced to drive, whether we like it or not. That's the freedom people die for? - forced to depend on modes of transportation so dangerous they require seat belts, air bags and crash helmets?

There are plenty of other web sites on the internet dealing with sprawl development, smart growth, etc., but none of the experts there seem concerned about who has a right to what where transportation is concerned. Whether you agree with me or not it might be good to express our safety concerns on these other websites that deal with the planning process.

[Anonymous]

HEY MORON!!!!!!!!
THE FEDS AND THE RAILROADS CAN ONLY DO SO MUCH. THE REST IS UP TO DUMBF***S LIKE YOU TO PAY ATTENTION TO WHERE YOUR GOING. NOT DRIVING AROUND WITH YOUR HEAD UP YOUR ***!!!!!
MARTY,CA.

AT LEAST EVERYONE ELSE SIGNED WHAT THEY POSTED YOU CHICKEN ***

[edblysard]

What, you mean they charge you to butter your peas?
Do they use real butter, or oleo?
My oh my, whats next?
The Unihead Ed

[csxns]

Angels on track sux so do you denny.

[foamer4000]

I belive that Jesus would tell his dicipels to: stop, look, listen and live. He could perform many miracles but he couldn't stop a train or fix what is messed up with your brain!
David

[Anonymous]

Actually, He could. But He won't. He allows us to choose for ourselves, even when He forbids it.

But when we choose an action, we also choose its consequence as well. He won't interfere. We are free! But it's always stupid human choices, our own or someone elses, that causes all the pain.

Now what do we do about those who are dead because of someone elses choice - the choice to build the grade crossing in the first place.

Maybe some of us believe in capitol punnishment for even a momentary lapse or a confusion when at the crossing - the one that shouldn't have been built in the first place.

OOPS, I forgot. Some of us don't care. Or is it that some of us are just tired of all the foul mouthed talk by intolerant cold hearted "let 'em die" types on this issue! I am!

And I almost forgot, HURRAY for "Missouri". There is some rational thinking here.

I'm done,
Now Ex Forum Member (administrator take note)

PS:
Scientific theory has been postulated that Hell is actually endothermic, therefore will be perceived as infinitely cold - COLD AS THE HEARTS THAT WILL GO THERE!

God will Judge!

[wabash1]

Duh so why not go to those sites like we told you. we dont care. the fact is i see what goes on every day. i see people run past the gates around other cars to beat a train. and for some reson it is our fault. like i said i dont care ill hit them and if they are lucky ill kill them. and ill be at work next day. more than i can say for them. its not the speed of the train its not the terrain or the design it is the idoits behind the wheel that dont look listen and live.

[Anonymous]

Another gutless wonder afraid to sign his name. On top of that you have the gall to try to preach to us. Shame on you. I hope you do leave.
TIMOTHY ARGUBRIGHT

[wabash1]

another name caller that wont sign his name but decides to hide. then says he wont be back. i say great. this site is getting better already. and what is this administrator take note junk. then we get a church lesson i see that these must be young kids couse i learned that 30years ago in church.

i will answer some of his junk . yes i believe in capitol punishment. if we had more of this instead of putting them in prison then this country be better off and not in debt

if the people dont tresspass or go past flashing red lights they wouldnt get killed. but if they are not at fault ( at least in your mind) then its fine to hold up a ambulance with lights and sirean or a fire truck a cop. then the traffic intersection. go thru red lights . then i wonder why my insurance is so high

[Anonymous]

Because the insurance pays the claim and not the railroads. The cops are stupid when it comes to investigations becaus ethe railroads train them to be stupid.

[Anonymous]

Railroads do not train police officer's.
ILLINIOS

[wabash1]

so let me get this straight. If i am on a snow covered road and i slide into someone and haft to call the police and they show up. then i whip out my locomotive engineers lic and show it to him. he puts blame on the innocent person i slide into for being there and he is paying all damages becouse the railroad trained him and infact is a railroad employee. and sinse we all stick together i am in the clear. and should never get a traffic ticket.( i must go back to court and get a refund for that speeding ticket. 77mph in a 55mph zone) let me know for sure cause i wont pull my state lic out anymore just my loco lic.

[cabforward]

r.rs. certainly do have their own police depts.. their powers are substantial and serious..

r.r. police do b'ground checks for new employees; they investigate.. accidents, trainwrecks & vandalism; deaths of r.r employees, passengers and trespassers; theft & pilferage of shipments & r.r. eqpt.; presence of drugs on-the-job & usage..

also cooperate with local & federal agencies where investigations overlap jurisdictions..

there are probably many functions not publicized, such as undercover..

[Anonymous]

Hey SHUT UP McArthy's son.. opps i mean cabforward i didn't ask for your opinion.. if i wnat any crap from you i'll squeeze your head.

Capische?

Kev...

OR DETOUR KEV... does that now meet your aproval.. ?

[Anonymous]

Another Thing...

One of Ken's posts Reads this:


"Modified by administrator on 6/24/03 4:28 pm."

AM I the only one that takes offence to this? Editing someone elses posts is Surely Not the CANADIAN way!! I take strong offence to that.. I hate it when people Edit other people stuff, and my stuff.

In Canada.. Radios Don't Edit songs.. TV Stations don't Bleep out vocabulary.. WE stand proud by Claus #3 of The Canadian Charter of Rights And Freedoms.. saying EVERYONE has the right to free speach and Freedom of Expression.. WITHOUT EDITING!

I find that appauling that the Editors would do such a thing.. surely you folks have bigger fi***o fry.. no?

KEVIN ILAQUA.

[wabash1]

Well cabforward or backward which ever you are almost right. If the railroad police do background checks who do they call? what accedents do they investegate? drugs on the job? and usage. hmmmm looks like i been mislead. and if they do undercover with who ?

[mnwestern]

Oops,
Once again I thought I'd check out a thread to see if there was anything useful about railroads on it and once again found nothing but useless blather. I haven't been on trains.com forums for a while. What happened? There once was good stuff here. Now all I see is five or six children filling out the threads with drivel. Can we get back to railroad talk?
T

[Anonymous]

So what you are saying is that when a Automobile is hit by a train at a grade crossing. It is investigated by the rail police and not local Police? That does not sound correct. What court hear's there case's?
TIM A

[Anonymous]

Oops Terry

I bet your under the impression that i care about what you have to say...

sorry.. i hate to burst your bubble.. I DON'T!


You must be the type to jump to conclusions!(i.e the bimbo type).. It's called Reading! Read what people have posted and there Sequential order..

Don't call me a "child" agin.. you'll regret it.
Kevin.

[Anonymous]

Hmm! A name caller? There must be some invisable ink on my computer screen. Just where is the name calling in Mr. Ex Forum Member's post? I think he was just responding to an eariler post that had referenced a religious perspective.

Now just who is this "J" person, who "seems" to harbor so much hostility and comtempt for so many posts in this forum? Let's see - there are 340 million people in this country, and 26 letters of the alphabet. "J" could refer to a first name or last. So do the math, he or she is therefore one of 26 million people, or shall we say, "Mr Anonymous" - just like the ex forum member.

OOPS - did I just call someone a name! NO! No need to take it that way!

As for capitol punnishment, are we to understand that you favor death to people who simply do stupid things or some how goof. Surely I must be misreading your retort!

Also did you mean to say you haven't been to church in thirty years! - only when you were a kid. If you chose to go back, you might find nuttin's changed much. They will still preach pretty much the same old love and caring for others.

But I guess that those in our society who don't want to hear it don't have to - so they won't. And especially not in this forum! Right! And by all means, lets not affend anyone by suggesting that we as a people should have any concern or compassion. And also we must not dare mention the Empiror's new cloths, to anyone, Right? (Now see who's really trying to censor this forum?)

Maybe, if most posts had the moniker on the thread list, we could simply not read the opinions of those who have affended us in the past. Then no need to censor anyone. We all could then spend all our time here contributing instead of defending.

So enough of the hostility already. Those of us who want to protect even stupid people by eliminating, or at least signaling all remaining grade crossings, are NOT THE ENEMY.

Now to the point of my post!

What can be done to solve the problem that has inflamed so many? I think I see in between the lines of many of your posts, that you, Mr. J, would like to not run over any more stupid people. I couldn't agree more, and I also would prefer we all stop bickering and just go ahead and do something positive to solve it! But how - is the only remaining question? Maybe these suggestions could help.

1. As for "stupid" or "careless" drivers, pedestrians, and tresspassers; we must continue to try to educate them, persuade them to be more careful, ticket them for infractions, apply increasing social peer pressure, etc.

2. As for blind, unsignalled crossings, they are a public menace, a criminal nusance, and the're everywhere. They all must be immediately closed, until they can be signalled. Period. NO EXCEPTIONS!

3. As for the existance of grade crossings in general, we must pound harder on our politican's heads to stop making more of them - at least not on trackage faster than 15mph. We must close as many existing ones as possible. Cost money? So what. Its money or lives - take your choice.

If the politicians won't stop it - don't just VOTE THEM OUT - CAMPAIGN THEM OUT. Every locomotive engineer alive should be regularly storming the state houses. Raise a stink, man - where it will be heard by the really guilty ones.
And keep it up until they are shamed into fixing it!

Now go ahead and yell at me because I want to stop the carnage in the only practical ways available. But remember, Mr Ex was right; He!! will be populated by the "Cold Hearted" Indeed, cold hearted people also make this life a living he!!, too.

Oh, and by the way - What's my bias? I've been in the railroad signal profession for thirty five years. I still think crossings at grade should be outlawed. Period!

Yours Respectfully,
Old Pole Burner