Who Has the Guts to Standup for America?

[Anonymous]

Saw an interesting locomotive the other day at my neighborhood yard. It was a leased unit, orange in color. I could have chased across the yard and snapped happy snaps to my hearts content, but instead I went to the trainmaster's office, rang the door bell, and explained what I wanted to do. The NS employee said no way, no how, forget it, no pictures. If I wanted pictures, I could go up on a local viaduct and shoot away. Was I disappointed? Yes. Did it make me mad? No. Were my "rights" impeded? No.

Did the employee hate his job? I don't know. Did he hate me? Probably not. So why was he so adamant? Might be explained in one word- safety. He didn't want me run over and I can understand why he felt that way. Was he polite? Yes. Tyrannical? No.

Until I gain majority interest in Norfolk Southern railroad, it's their property and their rules. If the same guy asked me to give him a ride in my patrol car, he would have to sign a bunch of liability release forms before I ever said yes. Will I be polite? Yes. Tyrannical? No.

Heavy butter on the popcorn, please. And make my co-cola fully leaded... it's gonna be a long night.

Erik

[Anonymous]

But there is one problem. Even though you where Railfanning on Public property and a Railroad cop pulls up and tells you that takeing Photographs of Trains is wrong what do you do? The cop is wrong. The RR cop could be right too. If you don't know if you are in the right or in the wrong call the Police to make sure that you are doing the right thing so that just incase a RR cop does pull up you have proof from a real officer that you are ok. That's what I would do. I as a Railfan am not that brite at time nor am I stupid. But I know what is right from wrong. When anyone of us go Railfanning we MUST use our God given head. There are alot on this forum have said time and time again that after 9/11 things took a major turn. Plain put.....If I have a problem with someonw when I am out Railfanning,I will take my Cellphone to call the Police just to make sure that I am lajit. That is what the Police are there for. And one more thing. Like others have said,GET PERMITTION FIRST befor you tresspass! Allan.

[oltmannd]

BNSF Railfan-

RR police are REAL police! They can arrest you.

What exactly is "permission to tresspass"? If you have permission, it's no longer tresspassing, is it?

[AztecEagle]

Makes Me Wonder,WWJJD:What Would Jesse James Do?[;)][8D]

[Murphy Siding]

QUOTE: Originally posted by edblysard

Wow, Jump jet jr.
When I get to work Saturday, I will talk to my abusive and tyrannical bosses, and see if we can reverse this horrid trend in pestering rail fans....
In the meantime, if we erect a plaque on the site of your last arrest, would that help any?
Ed

Ed: Is this the railfan that you had to have arrested?

[dharmon]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Murphy Siding

QUOTE: Originally posted by edblysard

Wow, Jump jet jr.
When I get to work Saturday, I will talk to my abusive and tyrannical bosses, and see if we can reverse this horrid trend in pestering rail fans....
In the meantime, if we erect a plaque on the site of your last arrest, would that help any?
Ed

Ed: Is this the railfan that you had to have arrested?

Maybe instead of a plaque...just bronze KP......

[edblysard]

Murphy,
No, darn it!

Dan, I think it would be a waste of bronze...maybe something cheaper, like concrete.

Ed

[Murphy Siding]

QUOTE: Originally posted by edblysard

Murphy,
No, darn it!

Dan, I think it would be a waste of bronze...maybe something cheaper, like concrete.

Ed

I thought from the way you had worded that sentence that it might be one in the same. It was probably someone of the same ilk.[;)] YES!!! I did it!!! I used *ILK* in a sentence!![;)]

[dharmon]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Murphy Siding

QUOTE: Originally posted by edblysard

Murphy,
No, darn it!

Dan, I think it would be a waste of bronze...maybe something cheaper, like concrete.

Ed

I thought from the way you had worded that sentence that it might be one in the same. It was probably someone of the same ilk.[;)] YES!!! I did it!!! I used *ILK* in a sentence!![;)]

Should be ilk season in a few days anyway....if you got the proper tags...

[K. P. Harrier]

Clarification of 10-28-05 also repeated on page 1:

“RAILROADS ARE LYING, ABUSIVE TYRANTS TOWARD RAILFANS.”

I say the unpaved SLANTED edges of public roadways were paid for by taxpayers, and as such are NOT railroad liability properties. The roadway may sit on railroad property, but an easement was granted. Thus the public has a right to park off the pavement on the slanted edge. Right? Some railroads don’t think so.

[TomDiehl]

QUOTE: Originally posted by K. P. Harrier

Clarification of 10-28-05 also repeated on page 1:

“RAILROADS ARE LYING, ABUSIVE TYRANTS TOWARD RAILFANS.”

I say the unpaved SLANTED edges of public roadways were paid for by taxpayers, and as such are NOT railroad liability properties. The roadway may sit on railroad property, but an easement was granted. Thus the public has a right to park off the pavement on the slanted edge. Right?

Is the area posted "No Parking?"

[Mookie]

Someone needs a new hobby! Maybe an entire life.....

[chad thomas]

Well the way I see it just because the road has an easement to CROSS the tracks that doesn't give you the right to loiter there. My company has easements all over (Cable TV) and I can go anywhere we have an easement to work on the cable when need be but that does not give me the right to hang out on someone elses land just cause we have an easement.

[rvos1979]

QUOTE: Originally posted by edblysard

Murphy,
No, darn it!

Dan, I think it would be a waste of bronze...maybe something cheaper, like concrete.

Ed

ED and Dan:

I'll pay for the truck, where do you want the concrete?

Always wanted to get into the Mafia business.......[}:)][:D]

Randy

[Simon Reed]

KP Harrier - why don't you suggest to George W. that your railroads have been infiltrated by Iraqis/Iranians and they're after your oil.

You'll have them illegally invaded in no time....

[BudKarr]

This cannot be a for real question. Tell me it was only devised as a way to run up some numbers.

BK (add one for me!)

[CopCarSS]

QUOTE: Originally posted by BudKarr

This cannot be a for real question. Tell me it was only devised as a way to run up some numbers.

BK (add one for me!)

Bud,

Actually it's just a ploy of the popcorn cartel to increase the demand for their product before they radically cut supply and rake in the dough for the overpriced stock they selectively release to the high demand market. Before you know it, you'll be seeing commercials advertising that "Popcorn is Forever," and your significant other will demand popcorn on all significant occasions.

Sure glad I bought a lot of stock in Orville Redenbocker! Mwu ha ha ha ha[}:)]

[chad thomas]

QUOTE: Originally posted by CopCarSS

QUOTE: Originally posted by BudKarr

This cannot be a for real question. Tell me it was only devised as a way to run up some numbers.

BK (add one for me!)

Bud,

Actually it's just a ploy of the popcorn cartel to increase the demand for their product before they radically cut supply and rake in the dough for the overpriced stock they selectively release to the high demand market. Before you know it, you'll be seeing commercials advertising that "Popcorn is Forever," and your significant other will demand popcorn on all significant occasions.

Sure glad I bought a lot of stock in Orville Redenbocker! Mwu ha ha ha ha[}:)]

Dang it Chris. You told him, now we are going to have to kill him.[(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D]

[AntonioFP45]

QUOTE: Originally posted by PBenham

The point is that there are railroad employees that do not like having railfans[:(!] around when they are at work. They hate their jobs[xx(], hate their employer[xx(], and they hate [V] you, too!

O.K, you may be correct to a degree, but isn't this the exception rather than the norm??????? I'm 42 years old, railfanned a lot in my younger years and had only one "negative" experience with a yard master (who was just doing his job).

QUOTE: ........... also hate their jobs, hate their employer, and hate ANYONE that interrupts their chowing down on a doughnut, drinking coffee,smoking, and behaves outside their sphere of understanding, which is pathetically tiny.[V]

- Hmmm. I don't know guy, but in many cases a railfan's attitude and demeanor has a significant bearing on how he will be treated by railroad employees. It seems like the majority of the time a railfan that stays cool headed and shows good manners fares out O.K when challenged by employees or police.

QUOTE: Well, this is a fight that cannot be won, gang, unless there is a 100% united front that will let the major carriers know that they need to have us on their side[^] NOT fighting them.

- We have to face reality here. Class 1 and Regional railroads are Busineses trying to make a profit, reduce expenses, and avoid lawsuits. Excet for trespassing, we don't play a major part in their plans. That's the cold reality. Most of us are aware of this and are not bothered by it. Unless (I hope it doesn't happen) terrorists start blowing up or derailing trains left and right, the rail industry is not going to pay us much attention. Doesn't seem to bother most railfans. Don't forget that over the past two decades, a few railfans that chose to criminally trespass or harass railroaders have made it harder for the rest of us that use good sense when near railroad property.

QUOTE: [V] A way to protest: write your member of the house and your senators and tell them that you want to have Amtrak de-funded, and have the railroads restore ALL pre-Amtrak trains, at 100% of all costs on their own! Then we'll see...

- Amigo...think realistically........that will NEVER happen. Amtrak was created because the railroads wanted to dump passenger service. Except for Southern, passenger trains were impacting profits significantly by the late 1960s after the mails were transferred to airplanes (courtesy of Lyndon Johnson and his allies in the air industry)

If Amtrak were defunded.......so what for the railroads. Top managers would likely celebrate quietly! One of their biggest liability weights would be gone. A significant number of senators support the freight railroads and are not going to vote for sandbagging the railroads with the ENORMOUS liability involved with taking over passenger service again.

Not happening........unless it's on a model railroad.

Stay cool, use common sense and courtesy when challenged. Don't start shouting "It's my constitutional right, yada, yada, yada......... The 1970s and 80s are gone. We're in a tougher, much less friendlier world now. What you've been complaining about is simply a reaction of regular human beings to this colder world where people are often rude and nice guys get sued.

One of my favorite quotes dealing with life came from Clint Eastwood in the movie "Heartbreak Ridge". It was: " ANALYZE, ADAPT, and OVERCOME!" This actually works. You over come with good common sense and thinking.

Peace.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by oltmannd

BNSF Railfan-

RR police are REAL police! They can arrest you.

What exactly is "permission to tresspass"? If you have permission, it's no longer tresspassing, is it?

Ok ok your right. Sorry about that oltmannd. I was wrong.
Allan.

[richardy]

QUOTE: Originally posted by oltmannd

BNSF Railfan-

RR police are REAL police! They can arrest you.

They may be a sworn officer, real police is a very loose term, but they work for a private company not a government entity. Their power off the railroad property in my state is limited except for investigative power of a crime that was commited on railroad property (i.e. they cannot make a traffic stop on a public street and issue a traffic citation with possibly the exception of a grade crossing violation which usually is on railroad property). Of the cases where I have knowledge the special agents always had the local police with them when they made an arrest off railroad property. The jurisdiction of the railroad police is generally the railroad property.

[tree68]

Is it too late for some popcorn and a cold soda? I'm kind of partial to that kettle corn stuff, and Vernors Ginger Ale will do just fine.

[chad thomas]

Well Larry, At the rate we've been selling popcorn out of the machine mabee we can afford to expand into the Kettle corn market too. [;)]

[Anonymous]

"They may be a sworn officer, real police is a very loose term, but they work for a private company not a government entity. Their power off the railroad property in my state is limited except for investigative power of a crime that was commited on railroad property (i.e. they cannot make a traffic stop on a public street and issue a traffic citation with possibly the exception of a grade crossing violation which usually is on railroad property). Of the cases where I have knowledge the special agents always had the local police with them when they made an arrest off railroad property. The jurisdiction of the railroad police is generally the railroad property."

A railroad cop's status really depends on the state they are operating in. In Arizona, for example, I believe that peace officers not only must be sworn, but ALEOAC certified (which means they went through an academy.) ALEOAC certification gives a peace officer the right to enforce the law anywhere in the state of Arizona... except for the Indian reservations. In effect, this means a BNSF cop can make an arrest on "public property" if he sees a violation of state law occurring. It's different in Alabama; there is no question that an NS or CSX police officer can make arrests on railroad property, but they must have juristictional agreements with local counties or municipalities to do law enforcement off railroad property. (As a certified deputy, I recently had to be "resworn" to do traffic control and security for an Auburn football game- my law enforcement authority was limited to that county juristiction for a very limited time.)

To add misery to heartache, there is provision for private citizens to make arrests. Private citizens are also not bound by constitutional guarantees concerning evidence. This is how store employees (known as "loss prevention agents") tackle shoplifters leaving a store; it's also how bounty hunters get to kick down doors and enter houses without a search warrant. And this was in effect before 9/11...

It is always easy to blame the government for stopping you from doing fooli***hings. It's not so easy to realize that the Constitution regulates the actions of your government... not your fellow citizens.

Be nice to each other and pass the popcorn.

Erik

[edblysard]

You can say till your blue in the face, but that dosent necessarly make it true.
Cities and counties have, for decades, encroaced on RR property in the construction of "public" roads...even if the taxpayers paid for it dosnt make it taxpayer property.
If your foolish enough to use taxpayers money to build a swiming pool in my back yard, then, regardless of who paid for it, its my pool!

PS, we need an address for the driver of the concrete truck.

Ed

QUOTE: Originally posted by K. P. Harrier

Clarification of 10-28-05 also repeated on page 1:

“RAILROADS ARE LYING, ABUSIVE TYRANTS TOWARD RAILFANS.”

I say the unpaved SLANTED edges of public roadways were paid for by taxpayers, and as such are NOT railroad liability properties. The roadway may sit on railroad property, but an easement was granted. Thus the public has a right to park off the pavement on the slanted edge. Right? Some railroads don’t think so.

[espeefoamer]

Since when does hating the railroads equal standing up for America? I stand up for America,and I like the railroads,well,maybe not the UP...[;)]

[siberianmo]

[2c] On the subject:

I stood up for America for a 32 year military career. Somehow I missed the real enemy, I guess ........

[Anonymous]

By the way. Where is SPBED? He's always spilling his 2 cented mind on things like this. He seems to know everything around here,LOL. Allan.

[chad thomas]

QUOTE: Originally posted by BNSFrailfan.

By the way. Where is SPBED? He's always spilling his 2 cented mind on things like this. He seems to know everything around here,LOL. Allan.

I think disinformation central, um I mean spbecial, or whatever is star chaseing somewhere in cyberspace, in an endless search for someone that is willing to actually look at his website. But I could be wrong.[;)]

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by chad thomas



I think disinformation central, um I mean spbecial, or whatever is star chaseing somewhere in cyberspace,