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Posted by Convicted One on Sunday, November 15, 2020 7:06 PM

Backshop
There are examples of that right in this thread...

You bet   . It's like a street version of "holier than thou"

"Anyone who fails to see things the way I see them are less than sane"

being another popular perception of such people

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Posted by Backshop on Sunday, November 15, 2020 7:12 PM

Convicted One

 

 
Backshop
There are examples of that right in this thread...

 

You bet   . It's like a street version of "holier than thou"

"Anyone who fails to see things the way I see them are less than sane"

being another popular perception of such people

 

Probably with a touch of Asperger's thrown in...

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Posted by SD70Dude on Sunday, November 15, 2020 7:17 PM

Backshop
Convicted One
Backshop
I don't understand why some feel the need to flount the rules

There is a fairly common mindset out there that is overly self-forgiving. Their perceptions are that they themselves somehow do the violations in a manner that is "acceptable", while everyone else does it "wrong" or goes a step too far.  This same mentality might perceive personal insults as "just in fun" when they are the source, but unacceptable and abusive when they are on the receiving end.

There are examples of that right in this thread...

I hope that isn't directed at me... ....at any rate, I should clarify the specifics of what happened in my case. 

I was banned after I expressed my feelings about the demise of a certain railroad executive in a lewd, crude and rude manner (you'll probably remember who died in December 2017).  Though this was my first offense I did not receive a warning, I found out through not being able to log in to my account one day. 

A warning and deleting that post probably would have worked just as well in my case as an all-out ban. 

I haven't ever been put on moderation, though I along with several others were warned by Angie to knock off the political stuff when a particular thread got a little too heated some time ago, and as far as I know no moderation or bans resulted from that particular exchange. 

I suppose C.O. is right, continuing to write about my experience could attract unwanted attention to my current account. 

Anyway, I don't mind the current 'hands off' moderation policy, it seems that threads only get locked or deleted after someone complains.   We'll see where this one ends up.

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by charlie hebdo on Sunday, November 15, 2020 9:45 PM

Overmod

It would be interesting to learn from schlimm what the terms of his ban were... or how much notice or warning he received.

 

You are fully aware of that. 

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Posted by MMLDelete on Sunday, November 15, 2020 10:49 PM

SD70Dude, I'd. I'd for you flying under the radar. Be careful. I've learned a lot from your posts, and hope you'll be sticking around. Why poke the bear?

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Posted by Overmod on Sunday, November 15, 2020 11:29 PM

charlie hebdo
You are fully aware of that. 

I am.  Others might not be.

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Posted by selector on Monday, November 16, 2020 1:17 AM

Maybe fly poop in the pepper, fellas, but it's 'flout', not 'flaunt.' Smile  One flaunts one's achievements or decorations, but one flouts the rules.

About moderation: it used to be, when Tom, Ken, Norris, and I had the privileges all those years ago, that we were given the authority and the tools to ban people.  We agreed to be extremely careful and conservative about banning people, and we did a fairly good job if I say so myself.  I believe I banned one, maybe two people, Tom another couple, and believe it or not, they were the ones volunteer mods were brought on board to control because they were so nasty, persistent, and prolific.  Then, in 2010 or so, our privileges were withdrawn and most/all of us resigned.  It helped that we had achieved the aims Bergie had set for us.

And yes, we were encouraged to actively coach people in an attempt to help them to remain active and valued members.  It worked for a few. Most often, it did not. No surprise there.

One really bad egg would appear on weekends with a 'banked' prior registration, of which we think he had at least 20 stored up, and he took great delight in dredging up archived posts, posting a question or a comment to bring them up to the top, and then he'd cut loose, so to speak, and post filth and personal attacks at the mods or at one of his favourite target members.  We would look for IP's that were located in the same area and know it was that person. This was pre-VPN. We'd smoke him before he got another post in.  Tom and I would literally tag team him until the wee hours of every Friday and Saturday night until he got bored.

All this to say that some of these banned people are very clever and know that they have to pick their way back into the server's welcome carefully, or back into the graces of people watching for them.  Often, it's just not worth their while.

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Posted by CMStPnP on Monday, November 16, 2020 2:04 AM

Lithonia Operator
SD70Dude, I'd. I'd for you flying under the radar. Be careful. I've learned a lot from your posts, and hope you'll be sticking around. Why poke the beat?

Agree, it's just not the same enjoyable discusssion without at least one token Canadien to mess around with in the head. :)

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Posted by charlie hebdo on Monday, November 16, 2020 6:31 AM

selector

Maybe fly poop in the pepper, fellas, but it's 'flout', not 'flaunt.' Smile  One flaunts one's achievements or decorations, but one flouts the rules.

About moderation: it used to be, when Tom, Ken, Norris, and I had the privileges all those years ago, that we were given the authority and the tools to ban people.  We agreed to be extremely careful and conservative about banning people, and we did a fairly good job if I say so myself.  I believe I banned one, maybe two people, Tom another couple, and believe it or not, they were the ones volunteer mods were brought on board to control because they were so nasty, persistent, and prolific.  Then, in 2010 or so, our privileges were withdrawn and most/all of us resigned.  It helped that we had achieved the aims Bergie had set for us.

And yes, we were encouraged to actively coach people in an attempt to help them to remain active and valued members.  It worked for a few. Most often, it did not. No surprise there.

One really bad egg would appear on weekends with a 'banked' prior registration, of which we think he had at least 20 stored up, and he took great delight in dredging up archived posts, posting a question or a comment to bring them up to the top, and then he'd cut loose, so to speak, and post filth and personal attacks at the mods or at one of his favourite target members.  We would look for IP's that were located in the same area and know it was that person. This was pre-VPN. We'd smoke him before he got another post in.  Tom and I would literally tag team him until the wee hours of every Friday and Saturday night until he got bored.

All this to say that some of these banned people are very clever and know that they have to pick their way back into the server's welcome carefully, or back into the graces of people watching for them.  Often, it's just not worth their while.

 

That says a lot (negatively) about their need to mess with moderators. And I was glad to see someone else point out the flaunt v flout distinction,  as I didn't want to be accused of being a grammar Nazi. 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Monday, November 16, 2020 7:58 AM

Overmod
  I still worry for Wayne when he mentions something he posts as coming from there...

Don't worry about me, I'm careful to post links, and links only,  which is supposed to be fine according to the rules.  If I shouldn't do so no-one in Forum authority's told me not to.

I have been moderated once myself, but in my case it was due to aggressively trying to save a Kalmbach employee's job, and on a particular Kalmbach Forum.  The post only lasted (seemingly) about 30 seconds before it disappeared but it sure got someones attention!  Water under the bridge now.  

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Posted by SD60MAC9500 on Monday, November 16, 2020 11:10 AM
 

Forum rules are important to follow and it's a shame they can't be followed by some. Though on the other hand you lose valuable information. Double edged sword in a way. 

 
Rahhhhhhhhh!!!!
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Posted by Overmod on Monday, November 16, 2020 11:55 AM

Flintlock76
I'm careful to post links, and links only,  which is supposed to be fine according to the rules.

The concern here is less about posting copyrighted or hotlinked information without permission, but about posting anything explicitly at the behest of a "banned" ex-member.  

So you're golden if you say "Mike MacDonald found this, and I'm sharing it here" ... but not if you say 'I'm posting this for wanswheel'.  This would largely be a distinction without much of a difference, except the latter is a formal no-no in most forums...

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Posted by Convicted One on Monday, November 16, 2020 12:33 PM

selector
he took great delight in dredging up archived posts, posting a question or a comment to bring them up to the top,

The pendulum seems to swing both ways on that particular area.  If one posts a new thread on a topic that has been well covered in the past, you are almost guaranteed to be admonished that "we have already covered that"  or "learn to use the search feature".

But, if you instead bump an ancient thread, you run a very real risk of irritating someone over just the grounds you state.

I was surprised there were no complainers grousing  over the  recent ressurection of the "Freight on Manhatten Island" or "Has a GG1 Ever Been Restored to Running Order?"   threads.

I think there was a complication at one point where an update to the forum software unlocked all the previously locked threads. And someone would from time to time bump one of those. (which was when the complaints about bumping old threads really gained momentum)

But how is a newbie to know which threads were previously locked, but subsequently emancipated?

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Monday, November 16, 2020 12:41 PM

It doesn't bother me if an old topic is brought back from the dead, in fact I'm amazed someone has the time to go looking for the same!  

Hey, if a topic doesn't interest me I just don't bother with it, and there have been plenty.  

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Posted by Convicted One on Monday, November 16, 2020 12:46 PM

I agree with you. But there have been times  when bumping a very old thread would arouse the 'all-volunteer torch and pitchfork brigade'  to high alert.

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Posted by tree68 on Monday, November 16, 2020 2:09 PM

Flintlock76
It doesn't bother me if an old topic is brought back from the dead, in fact I'm amazed someone has the time to go looking for the same!  

I did that years ago on one of the old "uselists."  Got a royal reaming in return.

I suspect that the folks who do so are doing general searches in an area of interest (perhaps not even on the forum) and get back these old posts/threads.  At least their comments are on topic.

As you may know, I spend a fair amount of time watching the Deshler webcams on YouTube.  Every now and then someone will come on the chat with some variation of "what am I watching?"

If they happen in when a train is passing, it's more obvious, but if they visit the site during a lull in the traffic, all they see is the backside of downtown.

LarryWhistling
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Posted by MMLDelete on Monday, November 16, 2020 3:08 PM

I don't mind old threads. The one about restoring to running order a GG1 interested me; it's something I'd never thought about.

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Posted by selector on Monday, November 16, 2020 4:24 PM

I understand people's ire when an archived or severely dated thread is bumped.  It stems, if I'm correct, largely because of the execrable 'search' non-function at this site, despite a number of so-called upgrades and changes of platform. We have had less than good success when we've attempted it ourselves, but buddy, with only six posts to his name, finds the one thread that seems to have it all and posts his own question or observation.  Not only that, but it isn't being asked about anywhere on the past ten pages!  So, it seems a lot like an intrusion. At least, that's what I think brings up the antipathy when it happens.

Still, very old threads do serve a useful purpose; they remind us that there's a lot of history here, and that some of our old friends whose names appear in the thread have long since driven their last spikes.  Over in the model forum, someone asks, "What happened to so-and-so? Hasn't posted since July." about once a quarter, at which several chime in with their own questions about people who seem to have dropped off.

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Posted by chutton01 on Monday, November 16, 2020 4:35 PM

Convicted One

I was surprised there were no complainers grousing  over the  recent ressurection of the "Freight on Manhatten Island" or "Has a GG1 Ever Been Restored to Running Order?"   threads.

For the "Freight on Manhatten Island" thread I jumped into it as the Phillip Goldstein Marine and Offline terminal website didn't exist in 2002 as it currently does now with a varied and in-depth information on marine-rail operations in NY Habor (originally I believe it was only focused on the BEDT operations, which is still interesting).
Things can change and new information comes to light...

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Monday, November 16, 2020 4:36 PM

selector
"What happened to so-and-so? Hasn't posted since July."

The same question was asked when frequent (And well liked!) poster Johnny Degges, who went by the Forum name "Deggesty," dropped out of sight.  Wanswheel, bless him, did some research and found his obituary.  COVID got him.  At least Johnnys name was known so Wanswheel (I assume) didn't have much trouble finding out what happened.

On a lighter note, I think Wanswheel's a lot like Chuck Norris, "You don't find him, he finds YOU!"  

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Posted by Convicted One on Monday, November 16, 2020 4:57 PM

selector
but buddy, with only six posts to his name, finds the one thread that seems to have it all and posts his own question or observation.  Not only that, but it isn't being asked about anywhere on the past ten pages!  So, it seems a lot like an intrusion. At least, that's what I think brings up the antipathy when it happens.

Interestingly enough, even when the "on board" search engine was disfunctional, you could find items deep inside this forum, via a routine google search.

Which, ostensibly at least, would explain how a n00b might find deep treasure here. That google search may have been what brought them here in the first place. 

I believe that at least a part of it, once a community starts to get paranoid over perceived threats from ghosts, goblins, and sockpuppets...they start shooting at shadows. We  are our own best enemies in that regard, we can assemble the pieces perfectly to best fit our.... concerns. Because we know BEST what bothers us.

It's funny, because I find myself every now and then going to a community that I've never  before even been to, only to get "called out" as ol so-and-so, back with a new sockpuppet to continue (their) eternal struggle. I suspect that once people become exposed to that  element,  they get sensitized, and start recognizing patterns that are not even there?

I'm sure it (sockpuppetry) does  occur often enough to lend validation to their concerns, but at the same time I think vanity plays a role as well, in the assumption that others actually  care enough to work that hard just to make them miserable.

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Posted by Convicted One on Monday, November 16, 2020 5:05 PM

chutton01
For the "Freight on Manhatten Island" thread I jumped into it as the Phillip Goldstein Marine and Offline terminal website didn't exist in 2002 as it currently does now with a varied and in-depth information on marine-rail operations in NY Habor (originally I believe it was only focused on the BEDT operations, which is still interesting).

Sincerely, I am glad that you did revive that thread. I learned things I never knew. I just used your thread as an example, because it fit the boilerplate of what we were discussing. And believe me, we have had some people here get highly irritated in times past, over such resurrections.

I think in complete honesty, their actual grievance is with the subject matter  contained in a particular thread....but preferring  to avoid appearing like content control polize, they use the vintage of the thread, as a scape goat of sorts.

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Posted by SD70Dude on Monday, November 16, 2020 5:19 PM

I actually like it when people revive old threads, and I've dug up a few myself.  I prefer to keep all the discussion on a particular topic in one thread, makes it easier to find later on. 

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by Convicted One on Monday, November 16, 2020 5:20 PM

I suspect part of it too, is that the "old guard" of a forum (any form, I'm not just picking on this one) often feel that new members owe them some degree of subordination.

And when they don't get it, perceived threat starts to fuel their imaginations.  Leading them to suspect that old adversaries are up to new tricks.

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Monday, November 16, 2020 5:38 PM

SD70Dude

I actually like it when people revive old threads, and I've dug up a few myself.  I prefer to keep all the discussion on a particular topic in one thread, makes it easier to find later on. 

 

I don't mind having an old thread brought back to life. The only thing I hope is that the poster reads the old thread first. 

Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Monday, November 16, 2020 5:40 PM

Convicted One

I suspect part of it too, is that the "old guard" of a forum (any form, I'm not just picking on this one)  feels that new members owe them some degree of subordination.

And when they don't get it, perceived threat starts to fuel their imaginations.  Leading them to suspect that old adversaries are up to new tricks.

 

Why did I picture Walter Matthau and Jack Lemmon from Grumpy old menClown

Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.

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Posted by zugmann on Monday, November 16, 2020 5:47 PM

Convicted One

I suspect part of it too, is that the "old guard" of a forum (any form, I'm not just picking on this one) often feel that new members owe them some degree of subordination.

And when they don't get it, perceived threat starts to fuel their imaginations.  Leading them to suspect that old adversaries are up to new tricks.

 

Dude - you ARE the old guard!

 Back in the day, this thread would be knocking on 100 replies, 3 people would be banned, 5 moderated, and 2 would have quit in disgust (only to sign back up the next day).  Now it's like a library reading room in here. 

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any

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Posted by SD70Dude on Monday, November 16, 2020 5:51 PM

zugmann
Convicted One

I suspect part of it too, is that the "old guard" of a forum (any form, I'm not just picking on this one) often feel that new members owe them some degree of subordination.

And when they don't get it, perceived threat starts to fuel their imaginations.  Leading them to suspect that old adversaries are up to new tricks.

Dude - you ARE the old guard!

You're senior to him by over 5 years, you must be getting close to a pension!

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by Convicted One on Monday, November 16, 2020 5:54 PM

Murphy Siding
Why did I picture Walter Matthau and Jack Lemmon from Grumpy old men? 

I've a few friends who used to tease me mercilessly about the Jack Nicholson movie "About Schmidt", that I should sue for them stealing my story.

So, if you ever wonder what I might really be like in real life.....there is your template. 

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Posted by zugmann on Monday, November 16, 2020 5:55 PM

SD70Dude
You're senior to him by over 5 years, you must be getting close to a pension!

I get first pick of the rocking chairs. 

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any

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