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wanswheel

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  • From: Antioch, IL
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wanswheel
Posted by greyhounds on Friday, November 13, 2020 5:33 PM

I need to credit wanswheel for his excellent research.  

Does anyone know how I can contact him about this?

 

"By many measures, the U.S. freight rail system is the safest, most efficient and cost effective in the world." - Federal Railroad Administration, October, 2009. I'm just your average, everyday, uncivilized howling "anti-government" critic of mass government expenditures for "High Speed Rail" in the US. And I'm gosh darn proud of that.
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Posted by BaltACD on Friday, November 13, 2020 7:05 PM

Minining Man was the conduit, however, he has also been banned.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

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Posted by Erik_Mag on Friday, November 13, 2020 10:49 PM

You might try pinging Firelock about how to get in touch with Miningman.

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Posted by MMLDelete on Saturday, November 14, 2020 12:15 AM

greyhounds

I need to credit wanswheel for his excellent research.  

Does anyone know how I can contact him about this?

 

 

His excellent research on what?

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Posted by BaltACD on Saturday, November 14, 2020 8:39 AM

Lithonia Operator
 
greyhounds

I need to credit wanswheel for his excellent research.  

Does anyone know how I can contact him about this? 

His excellent research on what?

On every subject that he decided to get involved in.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Saturday, November 14, 2020 9:22 AM

greyhounds

I need to credit wanswheel for his excellent research.  

Does anyone know how I can contact him about this?

 

 

I can assure you that even though Wanwheel's been banished he still looks in on topics that interest him.  I'm sure he'll notice the topic you opened!

However, I'm more than willing to be the go-between if you have any messages you'd care to send him.  Private message me and I'll take it from there. 

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Posted by greyhounds on Saturday, November 14, 2020 12:26 PM

Thank you everyone.  I've been in contact with wanswheel and it's all worked out.

"By many measures, the U.S. freight rail system is the safest, most efficient and cost effective in the world." - Federal Railroad Administration, October, 2009. I'm just your average, everyday, uncivilized howling "anti-government" critic of mass government expenditures for "High Speed Rail" in the US. And I'm gosh darn proud of that.
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Posted by Paul Milenkovic on Saturday, November 14, 2020 6:09 PM

Flintlock76

 

 
greyhounds

I need to credit wanswheel for his excellent research.  

Does anyone know how I can contact him about this?

 

 

 

 

I can assure you that even though Wanwheel's been banished he still looks in on topics that interest him.  I'm sure he'll notice the topic you opened!

However, I'm more than willing to be the go-between if you have any messages you'd care to send him.  Private message me and I'll take it from there. 

 

Not to get too political and get myself banned, but let's say there was a posting on Slashdot about a controversial figure for whom Facebook restored his posting privileges after a ban.  This figure is sufficiently well known that Mr. Zuckerberg felt he had to go on record that "this person didn't do enough to get banned."

Speaking just hypothetically, what does a person have to do to get banned here instead of receiving a warning?  Is it a matter of disregarding one or more warnings, or are there things a Forum participant can do that "woosh" they do not appear here?

Some wag on Slashdot, and there are many, quipped, "Not enough to get banned?  The guy must work harder!"

If GM "killed the electric car", what am I doing standing next to an EV-1, a half a block from the WSOR tracks?

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Posted by tree68 on Saturday, November 14, 2020 7:07 PM

Paul Milenkovic
Speaking just hypothetically, what does a person have to do to get banned here instead of receiving a warning?  Is it a matter of disregarding one or more warnings, or are there things a Forum participant can do that "woosh" they do not appear here?

I would opine that failure to heed warnings would probably lead to more zaps than single egregarious postings.

We aren't likely to see such warnings, as they'll probably move via PMs and emails.

It's also possible that complaints from multiple forum participants might get you banned sooner rather than later.

LarryWhistling
Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) 
Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you
My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date
Come ride the rails with me!
There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...

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Posted by samfp1943 on Saturday, November 14, 2020 8:18 PM

Paul Milenkovic [noted in part]  "...Speaking just hypothetically, what does a person have to do to get banned here instead of receiving a warning?  Is it a matter of disregarding one or more warnings, or are there things a Forum participant can do that "woosh" they do not appear here?.." 

A response:  Similarly, to walking into an 'innocent looking field', and suddenly finding oneseslf standing in a spread of live mines.   Beware the noted "...Violation of Community Standards..." Warnimg: Zip it! 

Be very aware of the posted Forum rules....My 2 Cents

 

 

 


 

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Posted by CMStPnP on Sunday, November 15, 2020 12:48 AM

Paul Milenkovic
Not to get too political and get myself banned, but let's say there was a posting on Slashdot about a controversial figure for whom Facebook restored his posting privileges after a ban.  This figure is sufficiently well known that Mr. Zuckerberg felt he had to go on record that "this person didn't do enough to get banned." Speaking just hypothetically, what does a person have to do to get banned here instead of receiving a warning?  Is it a matter of disregarding one or more warnings, or are there things a Forum participant can do that "woosh" they do not appear here? Some wag on Slashdot, and there are many, quipped, "Not enough to get banned?  The guy must work harder!"

The moderator responsible was replaced recently by the Moderator of the Model Railroader Forum.    Lets leave it at that and move on.   

The poster in question can have his account restored via Emailing Customer Service and explaining what happened specifically.   I heard he was told that but choses not to do so for whatever reason.

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Posted by zugmann on Sunday, November 15, 2020 12:52 AM

CMStPnP
The moderator responsible was replaced recently by the Moderator of the Model Railroader Forum.    Lets leave it at that and move on.   

Who are the moderators?  This is one of the only forums I've been to where the moderators aren't readily shown/listed.

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any

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Posted by CMStPnP on Sunday, November 15, 2020 1:48 AM

zugmann
Who are the moderators?  This is one of the only forums I've been to where the moderators aren't readily shown/listed.

Moderator is listed in each Forum if you are in doubt who the old Moderator was, look at the latest sticky posts.    Only one Mod has those permissions for sticky posts and usually chief Mod of the Forum.    So the next sticky post posted should have the new Mods face and name but you can also go look at the Model Railroader Forum and see.

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Posted by SD70Dude on Sunday, November 15, 2020 10:56 AM

CMStPnP

The poster in question can have his account restored via Emailing Customer Service and explaining what happened specifically.   I heard he was told that but choses not to do so for whatever reason.

I tried that after I got banned a few years ago, and they wouldn't do it.  So I moved on and created another account with the same avatar and a similar name.  

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by JPS1 on Sunday, November 15, 2020 11:03 AM

BaltACD
 Minining Man was the conduit, however, he has also been banned. 

Why were they banned?  Please be as specific as possible.  

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Posted by Convicted One on Sunday, November 15, 2020 11:18 AM

SD70Dude
after I got banned a few years ago, and they wouldn't do it.  So I moved on and created another account with the same avatar and a similar name. 

I've seen you exclaim over that several times the past few years. Not that it matters one way or the other to me personally, but isn't that a lot like saying "doesn't play by the rules", just begging for the authorities to focus their ire upon you?

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Posted by SD70Dude on Sunday, November 15, 2020 11:27 AM

Convicted One
SD70Dude
after I got banned a few years ago, and they wouldn't do it.  So I moved on and created another account with the same avatar and a similar name. 

I've seen you exclaim over that several times the past few years. Not that it matters one way or the other to me personally, but isn't that a lot like saying "doesn't play by the rules", just begging for the authorities to focus their ire upon you?

And yet they haven't.

Even if they were to do so, wouldn't I just come back under yet another name?

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by SD70Dude on Sunday, November 15, 2020 11:28 AM

JPS1
BaltACD
 Minining Man was the conduit, however, he has also been banned. 

Why were they banned?  Please be as specific as possible.  

Posting copyrighted material to the forum without proper permission.

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by Convicted One on Sunday, November 15, 2020 12:16 PM

SD70Dude
Even if they were to do so, wouldn't I just come back under yet another name?

It is surprising that they flipped the switch on your newer account,  allowing you to post without the prior moderator review .  Which would be my concern if I was in that position.

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Posted by SD70Dude on Sunday, November 15, 2020 12:54 PM

Convicted One
SD70Dude
Even if they were to do so, wouldn't I just come back under yet another name?

It is surprising that they flipped the switch on your newer account,  allowing you to post without the prior moderator review .  Which would be my concern if I was in that position.

I was definitely on moderation initially, just like any new account (my posts wouldn't appear immediately).  But I didn't say anything complex or controversial, so I guess I slipped by.  

I think I added the Canadian Northern avatar right away after creating this account, but if I had really wanted to stay hidden I could have chosen a unrelated username and added an avatar after the initial moderation ended.  

Anyway, things seem to have worked out, I obviously haven't committed any ban-worthy offenses over the last few years.  

It's a shame Wanswheel and Miningman didn't follow a similar strategy to mine.  

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by Convicted One on Sunday, November 15, 2020 1:20 PM

SD70Dude
I was definitely on moderation initially, just like any new account (my posts wouldn't appear immediately).  But I didn't say anything complex or controversial, so I guess I slipped by.  

LOL, perhaps you slipped through a rabbit hole during one of the changes in the guard?

It matters not to me either way, I don't have any problem with your posts. 

Just seems like you invite unnecessary scrutiny with your admissions. The kind that seldom ends well. (FWIW)

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Posted by CMStPnP on Sunday, November 15, 2020 3:33 PM

SD70Dude
And yet they haven't. Even if they were to do so, wouldn't I just come back under yet another name?

Well you can't permanently ban someone anyway.   Banning is based on IP and you enter banned IP's into a table.   Problem arises that as you ban more and more IP's you start blocking off your website from others on the internet and traffic starts to decline.     So common practice is to flush the restricted IP table every 6-18 months depending on accumulation.    So nobody is ever banned permanently.   Their account or pwd is changed or suspended.    Most folks only try to come back within a 6 month period and give up.

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Posted by Overmod on Sunday, November 15, 2020 4:59 PM

Bans here are of course not based on IP - they are based on sign-in credentials.  Otherwise how could you sign in to the forum from a hotel or a mobile device?  The use of IP is only for identification at registration, not for posting.

The bans are accomplished through the software, and interestingly this not only triggers before any actual signing-in procedure takes place, but sets a cookie (perhaps more than one) that gives you an accelerated page from whatever local machine and browser you tried to log in from.  In this respect, if no other, Kalmbach IT has thoroughly and correctly implemented effective security.

Unfortunately, it appears the bans are implemented for what may be the maximum length of ban the software is configured for: that's a year like 2058.  Until then you can rest assured that no one will be able to use that 'banned' forum name again; you will note that the forum is already structured so that a given username can't be reused with a new 'contact' IP address... this was part of wanswheel's issue, he won't rejoin with a different username because that one has special meaning to him.

It will be interesting to see if the 'new and improved' forum software experience coming in 'stage 3' in the spring will use a different security approach, and that might include graylisting of 'suspect' (or unwanted) domains.  For a forum of this kind, I don't think that level of gateway protection is necessary. 

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Posted by Backshop on Sunday, November 15, 2020 5:25 PM

I don't understand why some feel the need to flount the rules?  It's not like this is a paysite.  It's free.  It's like being invited into someone's house and being an arse.

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Posted by Overmod on Sunday, November 15, 2020 5:33 PM

Backshop
It's like being invited into someone's house and being an arse.

The problem with a great many of these 'bans' is more like being invited to someone's house, and suddenly being informed that you've triggered them for some undisclosed reason and are being summarily kicked out on the sidewalk without recourse.

There are many intermediate stages, including Ang-style warnings that people are 'treading on sore water' as an old friend of my father's liked to say, followed up by PMs of more, or less, politeness stating the precise problems and 'watch out not to do them again'.  In turn followed up by mandatory moderation, which prevents errant posting in the first place ... and in fact getting rid of any unsatisfactory post 'submitted' before anyone reads or is irritated by it.

Banning is a last resort to get rid of incorrigibles who Just Don't Get It.  Or who repeatedly flaunt the terms of the TOS after being given the necessary Talmudic warning.  What it isn't is a Star-Chamber like way to send posters an elite clique doesn't like down the memory hole, as George Carlin said, "forever"...

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Posted by charlie hebdo on Sunday, November 15, 2020 5:54 PM

Overmod

 

 
Backshop
It's like being invited into someone's house and being an arse.

 

The problem with a great many of these 'bans' is more like being invited to someone's house, and suddenly being informed that you've triggered them for some undisclosed reason and are being summarily kicked out on the sidewalk without recourse.

 

There are many intermediate stages, including Ang-style warnings that people are 'treading on sore water' as an old friend of my father's liked to say, followed up by PMs of more, or less, politeness stating the precise problems and 'watch out not to do them again'.  In turn followed up by mandatory moderation, which prevents errant posting in the first place ... and in fact getting rid of any unsatisfactory post 'submitted' before anyone reads or is irritated by it.

Banning is a last resort to get rid of incorrigibles who Just Don't Get It.  Or who repeatedly flaunt the terms of the TOS after being given the necessary Talmudic warning.  What it isn't is a Star-Chamber like way to send posters an elite clique doesn't like down the memory hole, as George Carlin said, "forever"...

 

We don't definitively know how many times Wanswheel or MM were warned.  I believe someone said a while back that Wanswheel refused to agree to conditions of reinstatement. 

Could you clarify your elite clique" remark? 

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Posted by JPS1 on Sunday, November 15, 2020 6:19 PM

SD70Dude
 JPS1 BaltACD  Minining Man was the conduit, however, he has also been banned. Why were they banned?  Please be as specific as possible.  Posting copyrighted material to the forum without proper permission.  

Thanks.

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Posted by Convicted One on Sunday, November 15, 2020 6:29 PM

Backshop
I don't understand why some feel the need to flount the rules

There is a fairly common mindset out there that is overly self-forgiving. Their perceptions are that they themselves somehow do the violations in a manner that is "acceptable", while everyone else does it "wrong" or goes a step too far.  This same mentality might perceive personal insults as "just in fun" when they are the source, but unacceptable and abusive when they are on the receiving end.

That is just a general observation pointed towards your question, and in no way is it intended reflective of WW's and MM's specific situation.

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Posted by Overmod on Sunday, November 15, 2020 6:40 PM

We definitively know how many times miningman was warned: none.  (unless he is a liar, which I doubt).  That's official Kalmbach warnings; we of course warned him repeatedly not to repost 'for wanswheel' and advertise he was doing so, and kept saying so.   I still worry for Wayne when he mentions something he posts as coming from there...

For the TOS to mean something, I'd agree that the least trace of sock-puppetry, especially on behalf of an acknowledged banned member posting more of the same material that ultimately got him banned, is grounds for discipline.  It's the lack of warning, grievance, or appeal of any kind that comes across as high-handed.

wanswheel received warning in the form of 'permanent moderation' -- which of course gave Kalmbach oversight by pocket veto, as it were, over any long post as well as any perceived copyright violation or other issue of concern.  It was while under that restriction that he came to be banned, apparently without notice for several days, as I recall only manifesting when he had to log out and back in for some reason.  I don't believe anything was formally ever communicated to him; most of the justifications here are retroactive explanations 'after the fact' -- although I don't argue with their validity under the TOS.

The 'elite clique' is a comparatively few people at Kalmbach who put themselves in charge of this aspect of moderation.  It clearly doesn't involve Dave Lassen when he was actively moderating some posts of concern; it clearly doesn't involve Ang, whose style is clearly to warn before discipline.   On the other hand we have seen quite a few editors and columnists leaving just a little quicker or sooner than seems 'fully voluntary' -- not with positive effect on either the magazine or the site quality.  As I suspect the old 'house policy' of disallowing any discussion of moderator policy may still be in force I will go no further, but that there is the same sort of arbitrary modac we suffered under Wibberley, I think there is little doubt.

I know I was banned without warning for making a joke about a friend -- and I did get an explanation, after a week, essentially saying it wasn't funny.  I subsequently got put on moderation for something in a self-deleted post (it was intended as amusing and was factually correct, but read, and more significantly reacted to, as something much different and not at all a sense I would even imply, as if no other posts of mine 'counted' for anything here) -- that was reversed after a couple of weeks, in a grudging-sounding way, which I took as a stern warning to avoid stepping on invisible toes.

It would be interesting to learn from schlimm what the terms of his ban were... or how much notice or warning he received.

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Posted by Backshop on Sunday, November 15, 2020 6:59 PM

Convicted One

 

 
Backshop
I don't understand why some feel the need to flount the rules

There is a fairly common mindset out there that is overly self-forgiving. Their perceptions are that they themselves somehow do the violations in a manner that is "acceptable", while everyone else does it "wrong" or goes a step too far.  This same mentality might perceive personal insults as "just in fun" when they are the source, but unacceptable and abusive when they are on the receiving end. 

There are examples of that right in this thread...

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