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Prosecutors: Engineer deliberately ran train off tracks in attempt to smash the USNS Mercy

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Posted by 54light15 on Friday, April 3, 2020 2:06 PM

I would not try to dehumanize the guy but trying to drive a locomotive off the end of the rails such a distance is not the action of a rational human being. 

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Posted by chad s thomas on Friday, April 3, 2020 2:08 PM

LaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaugh

I can't believe this guy is in the same gene pool.

I bet the guy (or gal) that hired this clown wishes they were invisible right about now. Bang Head

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Posted by tree68 on Friday, April 3, 2020 2:15 PM

54light15

I would not try to dehumanize the guy but trying to drive a locomotive off the end of the rails such a distance is not the action of a rational human being. 

I suspect "triggered" may be an appropriate analysis.

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Posted by zugmann on Friday, April 3, 2020 2:16 PM

Convicted One
It could be as simple that his job was being phased out due to reduction in port activity, and he is  going "rogue" in protest.  That would be more understandable than the story we have been spoon fed.

Not really. 

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

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Posted by Convicted One on Friday, April 3, 2020 2:17 PM

54light15
trying to drive a locomotive off the end of the rails such a distance is not the action of a rational human being. 

I agree....so much so that the story we have been given suffers credibility as well.

And I really don't believe that the belittlements contribute to our understanding in any useful way.

Perhaps we should start awarding Darwin awards to those who downplayed the severity of this virus three - four weeks ago. That would make the rest of us feel better too, wouldn't it?  Whistling

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Friday, April 3, 2020 3:03 PM

Convicted One

It's "fun" to belittle those who we do not see  eye to eye with, makes us feel more certain of our own views, and our own place in life.  I get caught up in it myself, and usually regret it later.

And the engineer in this little episode certainly appears to have made a number of miscalculations, either as a result of fear, lapse of judgement, or perhaps  some more organic disability that we know nothing about.  Still, I always try to understand the position of the other guy. I may not agree with it, but that alone does not automatially disqualify his POV.

As dead as that harbor looks today (I once lived within 5 miles of this location, and the apparent dormancy evident from the aerials appears unusual to me) I have to wonder if the arrival of such a big ship may have been sufficiently unique to this man's normal daily routine that it may have "spooked" him in some way.

I'm not offering this in any manner intended to legitimize or forgive his actions. It's just to me there appears to be parts of this story not being shared with us. Yes, I'd like  to see him given a soap box to elaborate on what threat he believed he was rising in opposition to. Unfortunately I am sure that will not  be allowed to happen.

It could be as simple that his job was being phased out due to reduction in port activity, and he is  going "rogue" in protest.  That would be more understandable than the story we have been spoon fed. Sorry if my attempt at objectivity offends any of the fist pounding law an order types who want only to see the perp dehumanized and prosecuted.

 

I disagree. Seeing something you don't like and trying to drive your train into it is not a lot different than seeing something you don't like and flying a passenger jet into it. I'd say it boils down to asking how could anybody in their right mind do something like this? The answer is simple- he or she wasn't in their right mind. For whatever reason, the engineer lost it. To try and come up with explanation scenarios like saying he was mad about the port not being busy, or some such puts you in euclid territory.

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Posted by Convicted One on Friday, April 3, 2020 3:14 PM

Murphy Siding
The answer is simple

Well, if that's what gives you comfort, I'm not going the try and wrestle it away from you.

How did such a defective engineer function adequately right up to this point? Forget to take his meds? Stroke? Rage over finding out he was soon to be furloughed?

Perhaps he saw them firing up the on-board crematoriums?  Pirate

Crematoriums >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>shackles

 

Murphy Siding
puts you in euclid territory.

Confused

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Friday, April 3, 2020 3:25 PM

Convicted One
 
Murphy Siding
The answer is simple

 

Well, if that's what gives you comfort, I'm not going the try and wrestle it away from you.

How did such a defective engineer function adequately right up to this point? Forget to take his meds? Stroke? Rage over finding out he was soon to be furloughed?

Perhaps he saw them firing up the on-board crematoriums?  Pirate

Crematoriums >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>shackles

 

 
Murphy Siding
puts you in euclid territory.

 

Confused

 

I'm saying The answer is simple- he or she wasn't in their right mind. You disagree? I don't know what caused the engineer to do this, but I stand by my belief that the person was not in their right mind at the time it happened.

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Posted by Semper Vaporo on Friday, April 3, 2020 3:30 PM

Some of you have missed the reason he gave for his actions.  He was not trying to sink or damage the ship. He may have known that he could not get the locomotive near the ship.  He was trying to call media attention to what he believed was the "real" reason (his version) for the ship being there.

Semper Vaporo

Pkgs.

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Posted by MMLDelete on Friday, April 3, 2020 3:34 PM

Semper Vaporo

Some of you have missed the reason he gave for his actions.  He was not trying to sink or damage the ship. He may have known that he could not get the locomotive near the ship.  He was trying to call media attention to what he believed was the "real" reason (his version) for the ship being there.

 

So maybe he wasn't THAT bullish on momentum.

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Posted by Convicted One on Friday, April 3, 2020 3:37 PM

Murphy Siding
I'm saying The answer is simple- he or she wasn't in their right mind. You disagree? I don't know what caused the engineer to do this, but I stand by my belief that the person was not in their right mind at the time it happened.

Do you acknowledge that rage could (potentially)  place someone into a state of wrong mindedness? 

Fear? another possibility?

Perhaps the railroad does not want us to know that they had a loco controlling one of their locos? The story sure seems to have slammed shut tight since the original release.

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Posted by Convicted One on Friday, April 3, 2020 3:40 PM

Semper Vaporo
He was trying to call media attention to what he believed was the "real" reason (his version) for the ship being there.

And, I'd like to know what he thought that was, rather than simply dismissing him as a nut.

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Posted by zugmann on Friday, April 3, 2020 3:59 PM

Convicted One
Perhaps the railroad does not want us to know that they had a loco controlling one of their locos?

Yeah, hard to keep that a secret now. 

I just want to know how fast he was going when he hit the block. 

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

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Posted by BaltACD on Friday, April 3, 2020 4:01 PM

We haven't heard vetting, training and supervision as the cause yet.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

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Posted by Convicted One on Friday, April 3, 2020 4:06 PM

BaltACD

We haven't heard vetting, training and supervision as the cause yet.

 

It's the barricade's fault for failing to look before stepping out onto the tracks!

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Posted by Convicted One on Friday, April 3, 2020 4:09 PM

zugmann
Yeah, hard to keep that a secret now.  I just want to know how fast he was goin

There could be pre-incident conditions that the RR might be relutant to own up to, and unable to disclose?

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Posted by zugmann on Friday, April 3, 2020 4:11 PM

Convicted One
There could be pre-incident conditions that the RR might be relutant to own up to, and unable to disclose?

I mean, HIPPA is a thing. 

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

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Posted by 243129 on Friday, April 3, 2020 4:12 PM

BaltACD

We haven't heard vetting, training and supervision as the cause yet.

 

Poor vetting, poor training, poor supervision.

 

 

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Posted by zugmann on Friday, April 3, 2020 4:19 PM

243129
Poor vetting, poor training, poor supervision.

He coudl have been fine, but as convicted one points out, may have suffered from some sort of ailment that led to this.  How does one vet for what happens in teh future?

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

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Posted by tree68 on Friday, April 3, 2020 4:23 PM

243129
Poor vetting, poor training, poor supervision.

He apparently mentioned that he felt that the ship was there for reasons other than stated.  Does proper vetting cover conspiracy theorists?  

Like I said - he was triggered (as overused at that term is).  Unfortunately, he had a potential weapon in his hands at the time...

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Friday, April 3, 2020 5:09 PM

Convicted One
 
Murphy Siding
I'm saying The answer is simple- he or she wasn't in their right mind. You disagree? I don't know what caused the engineer to do this, but I stand by my belief that the person was not in their right mind at the time it happened.

 

Do you acknowledge that rage could (potentially)  place someone into a state of wrong mindedness? 

Fear? another possibility?

Perhaps the railroad does not want us to know that they had a loco controlling one of their locos? The story sure seems to have slammed shut tight since the original release.

 

Yes and you're agreeing with me. Rage could put someone in a bad state of mind.

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Friday, April 3, 2020 5:10 PM

Convicted One
 
Semper Vaporo
He was trying to call media attention to what he believed was the "real" reason (his version) for the ship being there.

 

And, I'd like to know what he thought that was, rather than simply dismissing him as a nut.

 

How is that different than what terrorists do to get attention for their cause?

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Posted by 243129 on Friday, April 3, 2020 6:34 PM

zugmann

 

 
243129
Poor vetting, poor training, poor supervision.

 

He coudl have been fine, but as convicted one points out, may have suffered from some sort of ailment that led to this.  How does one vet for what happens in teh future?

 

By observing behavior in the present.

 

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Posted by 243129 on Friday, April 3, 2020 6:38 PM

tree68
Does proper vetting cover conspiracy theorists?

Yes, proper vetting can give indications of 'different' behavior and supervision can observe 'performances'.

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Posted by SALfan on Friday, April 3, 2020 6:51 PM

Overmod

You forgot the silvery, silvery tinfoil.  And the red mercury.  

And the shackles.  So many, many shackles...

 

Don't forget the colander to wear on your head to keep the CIA from controlling your brain (like the woman in the park near Union Station in DC, when we were there). 

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Posted by Convicted One on Friday, April 3, 2020 7:12 PM

Murphy Siding
How is that different than what terrorists do to get attention for their cause?

Well, that is likely the reason we will never hear much more on this.  The story will be surpressed. Which is exactly the fuel that conspiracy theorists work on.

Would it really harm the republic to hear what this person's reasoning was? Who's interests are best being served supressing the truth? However whacky it may or may not be.

But then I believe there is intelligent life elsewhere in the universe. Whether it's coming here to visit remains to be proven.  Which I guess is part of the reason I am skeptical whenever I see individuals dismissed as "lone nutters". They may very well be just that, but I would prefer to draw that conclusion myself, as opposed to having it made for me.

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Posted by SALfan on Friday, April 3, 2020 7:18 PM

caldreamer

Actually, ADX Florence is one of two federal supermax prisions.  The other is in Marion Indiana.  Colorado would have no say if he was sent there.  ADX Florence has far more dangerous prisoners than him.  For example, Ted Kosinski the Unibomber, Shiek Kalid Mohammid who planned the first World Trade Cneter Bombing, and Terry Nichols who was one of the Oklahoma City bombers.  Need I say more?

 

 

Marion was designated the Supermax when Alcatraz was closed, then when Florence was built Marion reverted to its previous designation as a U.S. Penitentiary, the security level below Supermax.  I don't know whether Marion was designed and built as a Supermax.  Marion may have been redesignated a Supermax (has been several years since I retireed) but not as far as I know.  I awarded and administered a contract to modify the Prison Industries factory at Marion to accommodate a product change, and visited it at the beginning of the contract.  It stuck out like a sore thumb; one minute you're riding thru beautiful farm country and the next minute you drive up to a VERY serious-looking prison.

I do know that ADX Florence was purpose-built to be a Supermax.  Think of it as a very high-tech cattle barn, so that cell doors and gates can be opened remotely as necessary.  That is done to minimize the exposure of correctional staff to the inmates, many of whom would like nothing better than to maim or kill a staff member.

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Posted by Backshop on Friday, April 3, 2020 7:18 PM

Convicted One

Would it really harm the republic to hear what this person's reasoning was?  

 

"Reasoning" is a stretch, itself...

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Friday, April 3, 2020 7:24 PM

243129

 

 
zugmann

 

 
243129
Poor vetting, poor training, poor supervision.

 

He coudl have been fine, but as convicted one points out, may have suffered from some sort of ailment that led to this.  How does one vet for what happens in teh future?

 

 

 

By observing behavior in the present.

 

 

How would you even do that? The man must not have been a foaming at the mouth, crazy eyed lunatic when he punched the clock that morning or his coworkers would have caught on. ConvictedOne suggests it's possible the guy just snapped. How can anyone foresee that in the present?

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Friday, April 3, 2020 7:32 PM

Convicted One

 

 
Murphy Siding
How is that different than what terrorists do to get attention for their cause?

 

Well, that is likely the reason we will never hear much more on this.  The story will be surpressed. Which is exactly the fuel that conspiracy theorists work on.

Would it really harm the republic to hear what this person's reasoning was? Who's interests are best being served supressing the truth? However whacky it may or may not be.

But then I believe there is intelligent life elsewhere in the universe. Whether it's coming here to visit remains to be proven.  Which I guess is part of the reason I am skeptical whenever I see individuals dismissed as "lone nutters". They may very well be just that, but I would prefer to draw that conclusion myself, as opposed to having it made for me.

 

And that's exactly what he was hoping for. If you condone giving a soapbox to every "lone nut" who does something terrible to get attention, where do you stop? What about Theodore Kaczynski, Mark David Chapman, Timothy McVeigh, Travis Bickle, or The Monkees?

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