June 1969 Official Guide shows IC number 1 arriving in Memphis at 520pm and departing at 540pm with no changeout of cars.
The mail contracts were gone by then, not sure about the REA. I checked a 1950s OG and there were no passenger service cars changed in Memphis.
I loved the song as a kid and still enjoy it. It tells a great story about the Mainline of Mid America...my hometown railroad.
Ed
CMStPnP Gotcha all! According to the attached link.....Cars were switched on and off the City of New Orleans in Memphis, TN. So it is plausible as a safety measure that the author of the song was asked to relocate to a car not being switched as a safety precaution? Heh-heh, Gotcha! Read text under IC Switcher #480 coupled onto the CNO Observation.... http://condrenrails.com/MRP/MemphisCentralStation/IC-Memphis-Pass-Pixs.htm
Gotcha all!
According to the attached link.....Cars were switched on and off the City of New Orleans in Memphis, TN. So it is plausible as a safety measure that the author of the song was asked to relocate to a car not being switched as a safety precaution? Heh-heh, Gotcha!
Read text under IC Switcher #480 coupled onto the CNO Observation....
http://condrenrails.com/MRP/MemphisCentralStation/IC-Memphis-Pass-Pixs.htm
Thanks to CMStP&P for posting the above link to Mike Condren's site !
Another site that I'd like to post is a very thorough history of Memphis' RR Stations @ http://condrenrails.com/MRP/MemphisUnionStation/memevol.htm
It is also History of Trains, and Memphis Stations from Ca.1852 to 1970.
Growing up the ICRR was part of my life, and a destination to watch the passing parade.
One of the Photos in the link provided by CMStP&P a fascinating story in its caption and explaines why the ICRR trains had such a reputation: "...The "Fire-boy" is already counting his miles and money before they have even left town. It was will be a quick 167 mile trip to Cairo, IL and they will be there in less than 3 hours, in time for supper. They will return south on Number 5, "The Panama Limited/Magnolia Star" around 11 pm and be back home, in Memphis, by 2:00am. Not bad; a round trip in less than 12 hours. The young man might pay close attention to his "old head" engineer across the cab. The two most senior engineers who "owned" these jobs on the "Fulton District" were Raymond Brown and N. A. "Runt" Thompson. Both men completed over 50 years of faithful service with the "Main Line of Mid-America". Engineer Raymond Brown was also known as "Two Pound Brown". He would make long, gradual, oceanliner slow downs, in "two pound reductions" of the automatic brake. Once he was clear of the restriction, he never had a speed limit. It may have 79 mph in the employee timetable, but that was just a passing number to him. Rest assured, this train will arrive "on time" at the next crew change at Cairo. (Kay-row)...".
As a point of interest; the original routing of the ICRR was from Fulton,Ky to Jackson, Tn, and then to Water Valley, Ms. Grenada,Ms. to Jackson,Ms..
Traffic via Jackson,Tn. was rerouted at some point to include the routing from Fulton,Ks to Dyersburg,Tn, and into Memphis, South through Mississippi to stop at Grenada.Ms. and then on to Jackson,Ms.
As to why the 'Change of Cars at Memphis" line was there; ICRR generally operated a couple of Switching jobs around the Central Station Area. Passenge and non-passenger cars were added and subtracted as needed. Railway Express operated a very sizeable operation in the service area under the station and tracks. As did the US Post Office, and a Loose Car Freight House operated by the ICRR. All were accessed by ramps and elevators for the cargo tugs and carts to use. See The attached photo link.
Memphis as the place where the Mississippi Delta Started ( It was often reported that the 'Delta started in the Lobby of the Peabody Hotel'.) And the ICRR and Trains were an integral part of that mistique.
Not only did Steve Goodman sing about trains, but many other tunes were also recorded by other artists, Country and Blues musicians...W.C. Handy created one called " Where the Southern cross the Yellow Dog" [Moorhead,Ms. was where the Yazoo Delta RR crossed the Y&MVRR]
trackrat888 Hey was there ever a time when the City of New Orleans was cancelled or did not run aka "Going down in Railroad Blues" and was subject to ICC review or threaten with such? Was the CNO part of the Amtrak Plan back in 1971?
Hey was there ever a time when the City of New Orleans was cancelled or did not run aka "Going down in Railroad Blues" and was subject to ICC review or threaten with such? Was the CNO part of the Amtrak Plan back in 1971?
Johnny
Our toilets dump into tanks, so that's not a problem. The sinks, however, still drain under the cars. At least it's just soapy water... And usually when the train is standing at the station, all of the passengers are off (and usually gone).
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Someone did exactly that during the stop at Appomattox on a Norfolk-Southern steam excursion back in the '90s. I was there. NOT pretty.
I thought the car hostess was going to die of embarassment.
I heard--"The conductor sings his song again 'Passengers will please refrain....'"
Which is a reference to the request that toilets not be flushed while the train is standing in the station.
Murphy Siding ACY "You Never Even Call Me By My Name" (written with John Prine), .... I was drunk the day my mama got out of prison .....
ACY "You Never Even Call Me By My Name" (written with John Prine),
.... I was drunk the day my mama got out of prison .....
That was a funny song!
schlimm "This train's got the disappearin' railroad blues."
"This train's got the disappearin' railroad blues."
the conductor sings his song again the passengers are well restrained this train's got the disappearing service blues
And I mean this as no disrespect to your former roommate. These words were handed down to me, the story I heard was that members of the Pennsylvania Trolley Museum wrote them one day when the National Limited arrived at New York on time on the correct day, in a week in which it also arrived 24 hours late, in other words on time but on the wrong day.
Patrick Boylan
Free yacht rides, 27' sailboat, zip code 19114 Delaware River, get great Delair bridge photos from the river. Send me a private message
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
It is quite possible that Goodman conceived the lyrics well before Amtrak in 1971, back when he was at UofI 1965 to early 1967. After all, it says "Illinois Central, Monday mornin' rail" and "the steel wheels still ain't heard the news...This train's got the disappearin' railroad blues." That sounds like an expression of the sadness in the mid to late 60s when passenger trains were being discontinued every month. Just a thought. However, I certainly do not recall Steve playing any part of that when he would pick up his guitar and say, "Hey, listen to this." At that time he also played a lot of blues.
C&NW, CA&E, MILW, CGW and IC fan
trackrat888 The Lake Shore Limited was in two sections one that went to NYC and the other to Boston. So depending on which way you are going you might have to change cars. IC had two branches S one that went to NOLA and the other MOAL (Mobile AL). As trains got cut many trains had gotten combined
The Lake Shore Limited was in two sections one that went to NYC and the other to Boston. So depending on which way you are going you might have to change cars. IC had two branches S one that went to NOLA and the other MOAL (Mobile AL). As trains got cut many trains had gotten combined
For a time after the City of New Orleans was inaugurated, there was a through coach Louisville-New Orleans, which was switched in/out in Fulton; this through service did not last long. The through St.Louis-New Orleans coach (switched in/out in Carbondale) lasted much longer, but was gone before 1970. I do not remember just when the practice began, but the IC stopped running the diner south of Jackson, Mississippi, in the last days of the train to reduce handling charges in New Orleans. Sad to say, I do not remember just where the diner was on my last trip on the train--and I was asleep when we went through Jackson, arriving at Carrollton Avenue about six in the morning (definitely, it was night time on the train that trip).
http://www.arlo.net/ for upcoming 2015-"till the end of the world" tour dates
ACY Steve Goodman's 800 page biography
Steve Goodman's 800 page biography
The first chapter is free online. On a hot night in Kansas City in '84, Steve is always very likable and sometimes extremely funny. I wonder if ‘changings cars’ could be a subliminal metaphor or something, for ‘changing chords’ in Memphis, Tennessee.
http://clayeals.com/readchapterone.asp
He was in Memphis in July 1971, to play guitar on John Prine’s record, Flashback Blues. This was after he wrote City but before Arlo recorded it.
http://www.lpdiscography.com/?page=song&song=167186
Excerpt from Huntley, Illinois newspaper Sun Day (2011)
On a cold April Monday morning in 1970, Steve Goodman sat on a southbound Illinois Central train, gazing out the window. Beside him sat his young wife, Nancy. They were taking a day trip to visit Nancy’s grandmother, who was already in her 90’s, so that the old lady could meet the young man that her granddaughter had married…
…Guthrie made the mistake of introducing Steve Goodman to John Denver, who ironically came near to killing the song altogether…
I read somewhere that the CNO never had less than 200 passengers, even during the worst times. He was definitely off on that one. Having said that, I love the song.
Right, Jeff. He says "I'm the train they call the City of New Orleans".
Also, "I'll be gone five hundred miles when day is done". At 12:05 a.m., the southbound "City" was in Hammond, Louisiana, 867.8 miles from Chicago, and the northbound counterpart was 914.5 miles from New Orleans. Steve didn't count mileposts either. He was too busy writing a great song.
Tom
tree68 Methinks we're assuming that the riders changed cars. Maybe the lyrics refer to the removal of the cars themselves. It would have likely made for a slightly longer than usual stop, thus a notable event.
Methinks we're assuming that the riders changed cars. Maybe the lyrics refer to the removal of the cars themselves. It would have likely made for a slightly longer than usual stop, thus a notable event.
I also think the changing cars is reference to picking up or setting out cars. Some parts of the song (to me, anyway) sound like it's being sung from the point of view of the train itself, not a specific passenger.
And like others have said, most songs are written for entertainment. They aren't, nor are they meant to be, exact documentation of something. Even songs written about specific events often have inaccuracies in them.
Sometimes, the truth just doesn't "sing."
Jeff
One more factor that supports the idea that it's fiction. It's indisputable that the song describes a southbound trip: "...out on the southbound odyssey, the train rolls out of Kankakee...." I don't have an extensive collection of Official Guides, but my January, 1971 issue (fairly close to the time when the song was written) says that I.C. no. 1, the southbound City of New Orleans, arrived in Memphis at 4:41 p.m., and departed Memphis at 6:01 p.m. I don't think we can reconcile this with "Nighttime on the City of New Orleans, changing cars in Memphis, Tennessee." It's dinner time; not nighttime. But dinner time doesn't fit, so Steve said nighttime. It fits, so he used it. Artistic license.
Incidentally, the northbound "City" arrived Memphis at 2:15 p.m. and departed at 2:35 p.m., so it wasn't in Memphis at night either.
Undoubtedly, there were more than "fifteen restless riders". I doubt that Steve bothered to count.
I rode N.O. to Chicago in 1963. I was in the last car, and I remember that they added cars to the rear in Memphis. The song, though, as someone mentioned was not intended to be a documentary. It was intended to convey a mood, which it does successfully.
_____________
"A stranger's just a friend you ain't met yet." --- Dave Gardner
Steve Goodman was my roommate for one semester in Urbana before he dropped out (and prior to writing "CNO"). He was a warm, funny and very generous guy as well as a talented musician. However, as I recall, he was a wee bit careless about details.
I would have to go with "switching" cars based on the fact that back in the fifties our train waited at Durand for the train from Port Huron and we took one car from that. Then our train continued west toward Owosso.
Norm
That is a really good collection of photos...
And I'd tend to agree with other posts that "changing cars" might refer to switching cars in and out of the train as clearly did occur in Memphis...
And there is a CRI&P TA in one of those Memphis shots.
M636C
Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.
Maybe the cars being changed were RPO cars or other mail cars?
The song describes a southbound trip. Number 2, a northbound train, is shown in the photos having coaches added in Memphis. If the train carried extra cars north of Memphis, normal practice on the southbound run would be to assign through passengers to the through cars and "shorts" to the cars being removed in Memphis. Since Steve & his wife didn't go all the way to Memphis on the trip that inspired the song, they would have had no real reason to be concerned with changing cars in Memphis. I repeat: That line is probably fiction.
CMStPnPSo it is plausible as a safety measure that the author of the song was asked to relocate to a car not being switched as a safety precaution? Heh-heh, Gotcha!
You must have missed that "previously loaded Memphis coaches" in that text you mentioned. If they were not concerned about people in the cars actually being switched, they wouldn't be concerned about people in the standing train...
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