Now to ask about the possible flood and mud slide damage in relationship to Amtrak?
1. Saw pictures of Trenton station under water up to top of canopy at south end.
2. MNRR ALONG THE Hudson to Poughkeepsie? .
3. The CSX line from Poughkeepsie to Albany. I would think since this is a secondary freight line that CSX may tend to delay repairs until other more important freight lines are back in service. The signal system on that portion is having the code line replaced with some form of no code line. It would appear that CSX would not want to repair that but instead go to the replacement. That may mean several months of operating segments under suspension of signals [ 59 MPH ].
3. Albany - Montreal. Anyone have any reference pictures of past floods along this line?
4. Whitehall -- Rutland?
5. Vermonter route -- Listening and viewing the flooding in Vermont one has to wonder if that route can be repaired before next year? Again any past pictures?
August 29, 201110:45 a.m. EDT
Amtrak Keystone Service will resume on Monday, Aug. 29 with Train 647 (3:45 p.m. departure from Philadelphia) and Train 652 (3:20 departure from Harrisburg). In addition, Northeast Regional Train 95 (noon departure from Philadelphia) and Train 83 (3:30 p.m. departure from Philadelphia) will operate from Philadelphia to Richmond.
Amtrak crews continue to inspect and make repairs to the infrastructure along the Northeast Corridor.
Additional operation information for Monday, Aug. 29:
Trains with origination dates of Monday, Aug. 29 that will operate:
Trains with the origination date of Monday, Aug. 29 that are canceled:
Note: Poughkeepsie to Albany is Amtrak. But water still over much of NEC and signal and undermining of roadbed still being diagnosed; NJ, NY and NE rivers still over banks causing flooding and damming at bridges, etc. MNRR just opening Harlem to N.White Plains and Hudson to Croton Harmon. NJT running Atlantic City services only. LIRR from Brooklyn and Penn Sta. to Great Neck, Hempstead, Huntington, Ronkonkoma, Babylon, Far Rockaway, West Hempstead only. No service east of Babylon, Ronkonkoma and Huntington, no service on Oyster Bay branch as yet. Reports along the Ct. River valley is that there is a lot of highwater on the river and its tributaries. Problems are that nothing can become conclusive until entire lines are above water and can be inspected. Lakes and reservoirs are more full than ever, some have been opened more than usual and so water is higher down streams; others are holding back while people hold their breath. The wind and rain damage was less than predicted while the risidual waters from upstreams has been underestimated. Now they are being estimated in spades.
In all my 68 years I have never seen such widespread damage and operating problems in the Northeast like this. While I wonder if NJT closed down too early on Saturday (MNRR, LIRR, and SEPTA operated as late as midnight) I can certainly understand why it is taking so long to assess and repair the far reaching rights of way.
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henry6 Note: Poughkeepsie to Albany is Amtrak. But water still over much of NEC and signal and undermining of roadbed still being diagnosed; In all my 68 years I have never seen such widespread damage and operating problems in the Northeast like this.
Note: Poughkeepsie to Albany is Amtrak. But water still over much of NEC and signal and undermining of roadbed still being diagnosed; In all my 68 years I have never seen such widespread damage and operating problems in the Northeast like this.
Henry6: According to the Amtrak national schedule page 61 the host RR Poughkeepsie - Schenectady is CSX. Is that a mis print?? I thought Albany - Schenectady was Amtrak????
You know, your right. Just that Amtrak is about all you see on the East side of the Hudson while CSX is moving freight over on the West Shore.
August 29, 20116:30 p.m. EDT
Amtrak service between New York City and Boston is planned to operate on Tuesday, Aug. 30, including all Acela Express trains and most Northeast Regional service. Also in New England, Amtrak Downeaster service will operate normally between Boston and Portland, Maine, in the aftermath of Hurricane/Tropical Storm Irene.
Most Northeast Regional service will operate south of Philadelphia, but no Acela Express, Northeast Regional or other Amtrak trains can operate north of Philadelphia to New York.
As of early this Monday evening, about a half-mile of Amtrak right-of-way remained submerged near Trenton, N.J. As the water levels recede, Amtrak engineering forces will make repairs to the track and signal control infrastructure. Updates will continue to be provided and an estimate for restoration of full service south of New York is not yet available.
Therefore, full Amtrak Keystone Service and will operate only between Philadelphia and Harrisburg, Penn. on Tuesday, Aug. 30, while the Pennsylvanian (Trains 42 & 43) will operate only between Pittsburgh and Philadelphia on that date.
Other service changes on Tuesday, Aug. 30, include:
Other cancelations on Tuesday, Aug. 30, include:
Amtrak will continue to provide updates via Amtrak.com, the Customer Contact Centers, Facebook, Twitter and the news media.
NJ TRANSIT notice: No service to Trenton due to flooding
http://www.njtransit.com/tm/tm_servlet.srv?hdnPageAction=PressReleaseTo&PRESS_RELEASE_ID=2704
present MTA service advisory
Metro-North expects to resume regular weekday service on the Hudson Line, New Haven Line Main Line, and Lower Harlem Line tomorrow. Service suspensions will remain in effect on the Upper Harlem Line and New Haven Line Branches. Subway, bus and Staten Island Railway service is now running normally across the system with limited exceptions. Access-a-Ride and Able-Ride have resumed normal service. The LIRR currently has full service restored on the Port Washington, Babylon, Ronkonkoma, Hempstead, West Hempstead and Far Rockaway branches, as well as west of Hicksville on the Huntington Branch, with some delays.
LIRR has launched a pilot program using hand-held Ticket Issuing Machines that allow customers to purchase tickets on board trains with all major credit and debit cards....
The latest in a series throughout the summer highlighting how you can use your MetroCard to enjoy all that New York has to offer brings us to the world’s largest urban zoo....
The Verrazano-Narrows towers are getting a "leg lift," thanks to a two-year, nearly $19 million project....
henry6While I wonder if NJT closed down too early on Saturday
IMHO, I don't think they shut down rail service too early at all. They spent all of Saturday afternoon and evening reshuffling equipment so as to keep it out of flood areas and avoid getting it trapped after the storm.
All sets stored in Bay Head Yard were stored on the main tracks near Woodbridge.Sets in Suffern were moved to Waldwick.Sets in Raritan were moved to the MMC.Sets in Hoboken were moved to Waldwick and Summit. That, on its own is a lot of equipment. Being that service was cut mid-day, there was a lot of stuff in Hoboken's various yard that had to be deadheaded back to their terminating yards, and anything that usually overnighted in Hoboken had to be deadheaded from wherever it was to either Waldwick or Summit.
That's fifteen yards' worth of equipment that had to be stuffed into twelve yards, assuming that I counted correctly. Granted, Summit is always empty, so it's not like they're taking a full yard and further stuffing it, but it's not very big either, so it fills up quickly.
There may even be more that I don't know about.
And, AFAIK, most equipment is positioned where it is ready for service tomorrow. The only equipment that is stranded out of the service areas is Morrisville. However, that is so much equipment, that there probably isn't room in all of the other yards to fit it all. The only yards that could possibly hold the electric equipment are Dover, the MMC, Hoboken, Long Branch, and County. Hoboken was emptied, and the rest are at capacity on a normal night! Additionally, with no service west of New Brunswick tomorrow, there may not even be a need for this equipment.
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Someplace I saw that SEPTA had equipment at Trenton that will need diesel tows...then NJT and AMtrak can assess what can be done...NJT's stuff is stored at Morrisville, PA, across the Delaware from Trenton. MNRR has not announced plans to operate above Croton on Hudson as yet, nor above White Plains on the HArlem and nothing in Conneticut (but that may change with Acela service NYP to BOston being reinstated). NJT's MNRR track from Suffern to Harriman along the Ramapoo River is still under water according the NJ.COM, so no Port Jervis service is anticipated for at least tomorrow.
henry6Someplace I saw that SEPTA had equipment at Trenton that will need diesel tows
See here: http://photos.nj.com/the-times/2011/08/photos_mercer_county_flooding_28.html
And here: http://photos.nj.com/the-times/2011/08/photos_mercer_county_flooding_25.html
The Vermont RR System is taking a Standing 8 Count. Every line has significant damage. The Bridge at White River Junction will require major repairs. Bartonville Covered Bridge has been washed down stream. Whitehall to Rutland has a one mile stretch still under water and numerous washouts. Photographs of much of the damage by Kevin Burkholder is available on the Trainorders Eastern Board.
In reference to your note about equipment out of position. Amtrak is short of equipment PHL - WASH so is using Acela equipment on some regional trains WASH - PHL. Train 188 for example. It all comes down to the flooding problem at Trenton station messing NJ TRANSIT, SEPTA AND AMTRAK up.
NJT's M&E has to go to Summit and Montclair U. for higher ground yards...Summit, Gladstone, Dover and Port Morris (diesel only unless dragged) with sidings and passing sidings on the P&D plus unwired sidings and the Rockaway Wye at Denville but I presume, has to keep some clear for Morristown and Erie Morristown to Denville and NS Hackettstown east on the Boonton LIne. Don't know what was used and for what this weekend. Over on the former Erie Lines, they were water level routes so to speak and thus prone to all kinds of water fouls....The Ramapoo River from Suffern to Harriman being the major flood area yet today I understand. In addition to the water, the tree and other over growth over the years, while sound mufflers to the neighbors, have become problems from overhanging vegetation and fallen trees on the tracks from mildest of winds and erosion. Haven't checked the websites yet this morniing....
Website check shows LIRR still not running Babylon to Montauk, the Long Beach and Oyster Bay branches. MNRR open to NH but not CT branches, Harlem to Southeast but bus to Wassaic, Hudson Line open Both roads have delays and cancellations. NJT not operating Suffern to Port Jervis, Montclair U to Denville, and New Brunswick to Trenton. Other serivces operating with delays and cancellataions.
MNRR just announced that the Port Jervis line from Suffern - Port Jervis will probably be out of service for months. Listed at least 3 sections of wash out of 1000 ft each and many signals under water.
SEPTA announced Trenton line will operate but only to Levittown.
WOW! That's intresting. I wonder if 1) since they have plans for installing a new signal system it they'll do it now and 2) if there is any possibility of using NYSW...which has got its own Irene problems...to pick up the slack of taking trains to Campbell Hall from Hawthorn. NJT has talked about service to Sparta, NJ (Rt23 Corridor) in the past and such talk has emerged again, this might me a cheap trial time through NJ...no 70, not even 50 mph running, but...
Just read both NJT and MNRR websites...NJT says nothing but MNRR had in depth report of helicopter surveilance. Also says riders can use tickets on Beacon Ferry to Hudson Line, use bus from Harriman to NJT's Ramsey-RT17 station in NJ. Not clear what is being done for riders west of Harriman, however, if bus service is working or if trains are coming down from PJ.(I tend to doubt it). Suggestion not being made for PJ or even Middletown area riders is to go to Hackettstown, Mt. Arlington, or Dover and Denville for service. Need more thought and communication between agencies here.
MEDIA REPORT about Trentoon station.
http://www.philly.com/philly/business/20110830_Amtrak_may_resume_trains_to_NY_on_Wednesday.html
BCopied from Amtrak web site.
August 30, 20111:00 p.m. EDT
Amtrak continues to restore service along the East Coast. Some Amtrak Northeast Regional service between New Haven, Conn., and Springfield, Mass., and some Empire Service between Albany/Rensselaer and New York will resume after 4 p.m., today, Tuesday, Aug. 30.
Amtrak service between New York City and Boston is operating, including all Acela Express trains and most Northeast Regional service. Most Northeast Regional service is operating south of Philadelphia, but no Acela Express, Northeast Regional or other Amtrak trains can operate north of Philadelphia to New York due to flood damage near Trenton, N.J.
Engineering forces continue to work to restore service between Philadelphia and New York. The flood waters near Trenton, N.J, have receded and the track and signal repairs are underway to resume safe operation. Additional update will be provided this evening regarding service for Wednesday, Aug. 31.
The Auto Train operating between Sanford, Fla., and Lorton, Va., will resume on Wednesday, Aug. 31.
Amtrak Trains today are taking about 2 hr delays between PVD - NEW hAVEN
MNRR has its buckets full and hands tied...major work has to be done between Sloatsburg and Harriman and there are problems west of Harriman, too, at least at Otisville which is expected to fixed by Friday. Equipment stranded in Port Jervis has to be serviced in NJ and it just might sometime this weekend or early next week.
henry6 Equipment stranded in Port Jervis has to be serviced in NJ and it just might sometime this weekend or early next week.
Equipment stranded in Port Jervis has to be serviced in NJ and it just might sometime this weekend or early next week.
Henry: Any chance that the MNRR equipment can be brought out going west on CP from Port Jervis? Is that route blocked?
Do you expect a schedule curtailment on that route since Suffern is just inside NY state?
Is there enough traffic Suffern - Hoboken to continue the route?
August 30, 20115:00 p.m. EDT
Amtrak is restoring much of the service along the East Coast, with a full Acela Express schedule between Washington and Boston, and most Northeast Regional trains between Richmond/Lynchburg/Washington and Boston, effective Wednesday, August 31. Engineering teams have made repairs to restore service after flooding between Philadelphia and New York, subject to residual delays near Trenton, N.J.
Also available now for booking are most of the Empire Service trains between New York and Albany/Rensselaer, the Adirondack (Trains 68 & 69) between New York and Montreal and all of the Keystone Service trains between Harrisburg and Philadelphia (most continuing to New York). All of the Shuttle trains between New Haven, Conn., and Springfield, Mass., will now operate. As previously planned, the Vermonter (Trains 55 & 56) will operate between Washington and Springfield, Mass.
Earlier, Amtrak announced the Auto Train operating between Sanford, Fla., and Lorton, Va., will resume on Wednesday, Aug. 31. Service will also resume on that date for the full New York-Miami routes of the Silver Star (Trains 91 & 92) and Silver Meteor (Trains 97 & 98) and the full New York-Atlanta-New Orleans route of the Crescent (Trains 19 & 20).
Service remains suspended for these routes or segments:
Suffern to Hoboken is hourly seven days a week plus half hourly at some times of the day and more during peaks...so there is not problem there...it was Erie's main commuter operation. Getting equipment out of PJ could go west to BInghamton as I am told the route is OK but where will it go from BInghamton? D&H route to Schenectady is OAS as is Conrail Shared Assets/NS across NJ east of Allentown. NYSW to Syracuse is just as useless at the moment as CSX is out through the Mohawk Valley. Stay tuned. We should know more by or duirng the weekend.
NJ TRANSIT is working to restore most rail service tomorrow, August 30, in the wake of residual impacts from Hurricane Irene. Bus and light rail service will operate on a regular weekday schedule. Crews continue to work around the clock to make necessary repairs and reconstruct areas of the railroad damaged by the storm. As NJ TRANSIT works toward restoring the system to normal operation, customers are advised of possible delays and cancellations due to remaining storm damage.
NJ TRANSIT is advising customers of the following:
Rail Service:
Bus Service:
For a complete list of bus service adjustments, view Travel Alerts & Advisories.
Light Rail Service:
mnrr bulletin for tomorrow
Recovery Efforts Continue While service has resumed across much of the MTA system, other areas were hit extremely hard by Hurricane Irene. Metro-North Railroad’s Port Jervis Line has sustained catastrophic damage that will require months to repair. Shorter-term recovery efforts are underway to restore a number of other LIRR and Metro-North branches. The full extent of the damage to the Port Jervis Line has not been determined, as much of the line remains inaccessible and under water. Through a combination of observations made on the ground and from a helicopter, Metro-North work crews have observed significant washouts and fallen trees at numerous locations along the tracks west of Suffern. Some of the more significant issues that have been identified include: Three washout locations of 1,000 feet each near Sloatsburg A 400-foot section of track washed out to a depth of 8 feet south of Sloatsburg Significant damage to several railroad bridges Suspected significant damage to the signal system, which is exposed and under water. Metro-North will retain an engineering firm to perform a thorough inspection of 24 miles of infrastructure to determine the full extent of necessary repairs and determine required environmental permitting. Major construction work would follow. It will take months to rebuild the track, signal and bridge infrastructure required to reinstitute train service. The exact duration will be determined by the investigation. Metro-North worked with Orange County to develop an alternate service plan for the 2,300 people who use the Port Jervis Line each weekday. Bus service will take customers between the Harriman Station and train service at the Ramsey/Route 17 station. Buses will follow the train schedule. Metro-North will seek to expand the bus options available as road and station conditions improve in Orange County. In addition, Metro-North customers can use their Port Jervis Line commutation tickets on the Newburgh-Beacon Ferry or on the Newburgh-Beacon Bus. Port Jervis Line commutation tickets also will be honored for travel on the Hudson Line. Customers from Salisbury Mills west to Port Jervis can park at Harriman and Beacon or Cortlandt on the Hudson Line, where their valid LAZ parking permits will be honored. A permit does not guarantee a space. Elsewhere, Metro-North and the LIRR are experiencing local power outages that are preventing signals and grade crossings from functioning. In the meantime, crews are engaged in removing fallen trees, pumping floodwaters and inspecting rails and switches in order to have the tracks ready to restore train service as soon as power is restored to signals and crossings. Monitor MTA.info and the MTA's email and text message alerts for the latest service status.
While service has resumed across much of the MTA system, other areas were hit extremely hard by Hurricane Irene. Metro-North Railroad’s Port Jervis Line has sustained catastrophic damage that will require months to repair. Shorter-term recovery efforts are underway to restore a number of other LIRR and Metro-North branches.
The full extent of the damage to the Port Jervis Line has not been determined, as much of the line remains inaccessible and under water. Through a combination of observations made on the ground and from a helicopter, Metro-North work crews have observed significant washouts and fallen trees at numerous locations along the tracks west of Suffern. Some of the more significant issues that have been identified include:
Metro-North will retain an engineering firm to perform a thorough inspection of 24 miles of infrastructure to determine the full extent of necessary repairs and determine required environmental permitting. Major construction work would follow. It will take months to rebuild the track, signal and bridge infrastructure required to reinstitute train service. The exact duration will be determined by the investigation.
Metro-North worked with Orange County to develop an alternate service plan for the 2,300 people who use the Port Jervis Line each weekday. Bus service will take customers between the Harriman Station and train service at the Ramsey/Route 17 station. Buses will follow the train schedule. Metro-North will seek to expand the bus options available as road and station conditions improve in Orange County.
In addition, Metro-North customers can use their Port Jervis Line commutation tickets on the Newburgh-Beacon Ferry or on the Newburgh-Beacon Bus. Port Jervis Line commutation tickets also will be honored for travel on the Hudson Line. Customers from Salisbury Mills west to Port Jervis can park at Harriman and Beacon or Cortlandt on the Hudson Line, where their valid LAZ parking permits will be honored. A permit does not guarantee a space.
Elsewhere, Metro-North and the LIRR are experiencing local power outages that are preventing signals and grade crossings from functioning. In the meantime, crews are engaged in removing fallen trees, pumping floodwaters and inspecting rails and switches in order to have the tracks ready to restore train service as soon as power is restored to signals and crossings. Monitor MTA.info and the MTA's email and text message alerts for the latest service status.
CSX Chicago Line (former NYC water level route) at Amsterdam, NY:
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/archivethumbs.aspx?id=71555
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
This is presenteing quite a bind for CSX, CP, NS and NYSW at this point. CP-D&H is out at Central Bridge, NS/CSAO across NJ has problems, and NYSW is out east of Port Jervis, on the Hudson Seccndary and thier own line east of there. Friday is the mantra heard as to when things will be open. Meanwhile traffic is piling up in places like Binghamton awaiting ability to get to Albany, New England and Montreal and to NJ wether own tracks or detour arrangments. Today is Wednesday.
What I have not heard, however, is if the Massina line is open north from Syracuse; nobody's mentioned it.
Word this morning is that CSX has one track open down the Mohawk but....that doesn't mean all is open and moveing. Between CSX's backed up and regular trains and the Amtrak schedules, it is doubtful CSX can handle other's delayed trains.....
Watched the News this morning, and there are some NE areas that are looking pretty grim for fast repairs, and getting back into operational systems.
From lohud.com. [linked here:
http://www.lohud.com/article/20110831/NEWS03/108310343/Port-Jervis-rail-line-closed-repairs-may-take-months?odyssey=mod|newswell|text|News|s
Their headline:
"The signal system is very, very compromised," Anders said. "The track doesn't even exist anymore."
The damage includes:
• Three washout locations of 1,000 feet each near Sloatsburg
• A 400-foot section of track south of Sloatsburg washed out to a depth of 8 feet
• Significant damage to several railroad bridges
The full extent of the damage to the Port Jervis Line has not been determined, as much of the line remains inaccessible and under water. Through a combination of observations made on the ground and from a helicopter, Metro-North work crews have observed significant washouts and fallen trees at numerous locations along the tracks west of Suffern. Some of the more significant issues that have been identified include:.."
Judging from the above posters and their links and these links as well, the damage to the Mass Transit infrastructure of NJ/NY area is awfully ugly--Catastrophic is mentioned several times in the links(?)
Wed. 8/31/11 4:15PM. NJT has opened the last remaining line, the Boonton Line west of Montclair to Denville (several of the 1000 series trains Hoboken to Dover, Mt. Arlington, Lake Hopactcong, Mt. Olive, and Hackettstown had been detoured, presumably express, via Summit and Morristown up to this afternoon) with no stop at Mt. View where water still inundates the parking lot. On the Raritan Valley line, all is open but Bound Brook remains a no stop as it is still flooded. Sufferen to Port Jervis remains OOS until further notice, some real problems there and not just as far as Harriman. MNRR is back in service opening the Harlem Line from Southeast to Wassaic this afternoon but Danbury Line still not working right.
Freight wise, pics of Central Bridge on the D&H/CP look bad track wise, bridge ok, with Friday the announced target but someone snuck in a "maybe tonight"; we'll have to see what happens. CSX reportedly got one track back through the Mohawk Valley and is starting to move their own traffic and whatever Amtrak trains there might be. NS keeps reporting a wash out "near BInghamton" but I don't really know what they may be referring to as there has been trains west of Binghamton right along and service via CP to Scranton and south has not been reportly effected but east to NJ via Allentown has been. NYS&W is ok north to Syracuse, had some washouts near Utica, is ok to Port Jervis bun not east of there yet; both NJT/MNRR and NS have problems there, NS on the Hudson Secondary, and NYSW east of Warwick, all of which hope to be cleaned up by Friday.
Looks like LIRR has Montauk trains up and running again tonight but Ronkonkoma to Greenport not back yet. And MNRR has delays on Waterbury line because of electrical proglems with signals and highway crossings; Danbury line is suspended.
henry6What I have not heard, however, is if the Massena line is open north from Syracuse; nobody's mentioned it.
I heard the DS giving a southbound (probably Q620 or an alumina train - I didn't catch the symbol) paper tonight. The problem is that Q620/Q621 are Massena/Selkirk trains. They can get to Dewitt OK, but it depends on where the traffic is going from there.
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