Let's lay out all the potential threats and timing involved with Hurricane Irene.
http://www.weather.com/weather/hurricanecentral/article/hurricane-irene-major-northeast-threats_2011-08-23
Hurricane Agnes in 1972 caused massive damage in the Northeast. There was much damage to railroads. Agnes has been blamed for helping drive the then limping along, Erie Lackawana into bankruptcy.
Forecasters are warning Hurricane Irene could track through the Northeast. What are railroads doing to prepare?
I was thinking the same thoughts (Agnes vs Erie Lackawanna). With our recent trip to the Allentown, Pa area and the geography of the railroads in PA - valley running for the most part, it is obvious that Irene can cause some serious damage.
Let's hope folks are prepared for this and get outta town, particularly in the barrier island area of NC. We vacation frequently at Emerald Isle in NC and that area is really vulnerable.
ed
Well, good ol' Amtrak has already cancelled everything south of DC.
Carl
Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)
CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)
More immediate concern is the forecast for the Carolina's. Here is Norfolk Southern's notice: http://www.nscorp.com/nscportal/nscorp/
Seems likely that CSX will have a similar plan.
It could be very costly, but I have no doubt the both will recover from the storm.
Agnes was the straw, but the EL could barely recover from an afternoon thunder shower. Times have changed.
"We have met the enemy and he is us." Pogo Possum "We have met the anemone... and he is Russ." Bucky Katt "Prediction is very difficult, especially if it's about the future." Niels Bohr, Nobel laureate in physics
Amtrak: Good thing we got that money for upgrades cause now we'll be using it for repairs!
If and it is a big if: The eye of the Irene should go just west of the NEC for any distance we may find that the old style PRR style CAT will be substantially damaged. I could see months of diesel hauled trains if that admittaly low probable track of Irene should happen. maybe a change to electric motors at Newark - New Rochelle? A track further east of Irene may damage the old constant tension NH CAT severely..
As of 5:30 PM thursday Amtrak cancelled all florida service Fri - Sun including Auto Train and Carolinian Sat - Sun.
This probably is because CSX will be securing all crossing signals against wind damage. Further the record of trees across the tracks of CSX from Florence north has been a problem even in minor storms not hurricanes.
EDIT: Amtrak is operating Silver Star MIA - JAX to carry the many intra Florida passengers it carries. Especially MIA - TPA - ORLANDO.
Mayor of Philadelphia just announced all SEPTA service will stop midnight Saturday. It is the first time (according to the mayor) this has happened since the inception of SEPTA.
James
Interesting topic, and I wonder what kind of impact this will have as places (ports, for example) experience delays. How long will it take for delays on the east coast take to make it to the west coast (backed up trains, etc)?
Dan
And in New York City area: From the Weatherbell.com site:
http://www.weatherbell.com/weather-news/new-york-city-plans-to-shut-down-transportation-system-before-irene-hits/
FTL: "...In preparation for Hurricane Irene, New York City is taking action. According to the New York Daily News, New York City is planning on shutting down the entire transportation system on Saturday. As part of the MTA's hurricane plan, before the shutdown begins, a 10 to 12 hour evacuation period will occur. Subway service will be the first to begin suspension and this will happen at least 8 hours before landfall. All rail and bus services will begin to shutdown when sustained winds reach 39 mph. The risk of keeping subway tunnels open during hurricane conditions is extremely dangerous. Numerous subway tunnels are guarenteed to flood in a Category 1 hurricane. Most lines that run through lower Manhatten, as well as under-river tunnels, are at a high risk of flooding..."
[Disclaimer;] This is a relatively new weather site. And IMHO. The attraction here is a couple of highly respected 'weather guys'- Joe Bastardi and Joe d'Aleo. I have watched Joe Bastardi as he did TV spots for "Accu-Weather" for a number if years. He has been remarkably accurate. He was on a radio broadcast about this past tuesday, and pretty much laids out what seems to be happening with this storm track for Hurricane Irene,currently with this new business. (?).]
When he finally reached Islamorada, there was a crowd of men, women, and children waiting. They were loaded on board and Haycraft was going to begin the return journey. Suddenly, a twenty foot tidal wave hit the train and toppled all eleven cars. The engine did not fall and Haycraft and the engine crew survived. The people in the train cars were not so lucky.
http://www.suite101.com/content/the-labor-day-hurricane-of-1935-and-the-end-of-the-fec-railway-a245324
Thankfully, forecasting has improved since then. Warning has been given to get out before it is too late.
Sounds like it will be awhile before everything gets back to normal the only bit of good news is the Irene weakened to a category 1 storm. However I have heard this will flood the NY subway system.
Some Amtrak NEC SERVICE CANCELLED for Sat. All Sunday Amtrak service cancelled on NEC including Albany and Harrisburg. + some long distance trains.
The biggest concern that all Transit systems [ Amtrak, Commuter, subway, bus ] is the possibility of flooding. I will focus on RRs except where others come into play.
Flooding has to be classified into 2 kinds: Saltwater and Freshwater.
If there is a choice freshwater is always the first choice.
There are a number of tunnels that can be affected by flooding. Each of these tunnels will be subject to a series of questions that those of you that know may be able to answer.
1. What is the MSL [ MEAN SEA LEVEL ] elevation of the tunnel especially the openings?
2. How close to a body of water is the tunnel and will that body of water flood fresh or seawater?
3 Is there flood gates protecting this tunnel?
4. Is this tunnel connected to any other tunnel in any way?
5. Does the tunnel have water pumps and how are the tunnel pumps powered? Is it off the power grid? and does it have some kind of back up power source such as diesel generators or diesel direct?
5. A non inclusive list of tunnels south to north and some of each's problems
a. CSX Virginia ave tunnel.
b. Amtrak 1st St tunnel to WASH Union station. Any connections to Metro subways?
c. Baltimore CSX Howard St tunnel?
d. Amtrak Baltimore B&P tunnel. Any connection to Howard St tunnel.
e. PHL although not tunnels per say the Zoo interlocking fly unders? Also the elevation of 30th St station is fairly low?
f. Trenton -- The almost tunnel just south of Amtrak station.
g. PATH tunnels. e know they are protected by some flood gates.
h. North river tunnels [2] for Amtrak from NJ - NYP
i. NYP elevation? Note the eighth Ave subway runs right over the boarding platforms at NYP so if water gets into that tunnel then water would fall into the platform area. 2nd note there are access tunnels and utility conduits 20+ ft under the platforms.
j. The 4 East River tunnels.
k. Elevation of Sunnyside yard. Water could run into East River tunnels?
If any salt water gets into any of the switch motors, signal cables, signal cabinets, power cables [ many of these items have very old insulation that may not be impervious to salt water. The salt can have long lasting effects on any wiring and motors. Sometimes a fresh water flush can help but no guarantees especially if imersion is long lasting..
Listen to continuing storm coverage live at one of these sites:
blue streak 1 The biggest concern that all Transit systems [ Amtrak, Commuter, subway, bus ] is the possibility of flooding. I will focus on RRs except where others come into play. j. The 4 East River tunnels.
Have the answer for for the East river tunnels --- No flood gate but MTA is trying to prevent flood waters. Check these pictures.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mtaphotos/6086208770/in/photostream/
All fear, all the time!
Murray Television Coverage:http://boston.cbslocal.com/http://newyork.cbslocal.com/station/cbs-2/http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/http://www.wbaltv.com/index.htmlhttp://www.nbcwashington.com/
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
BaltACDAll fear, all the time!
Thank Katrina for that.......
Fear & Hysteria sell!
Murray BaltACD: All fear, all the time! Thank Katrina for that.......
BaltACD: All fear, all the time!
Thank goodness it appears that Irene lost much of its wind strength due to the cold front moving in. Thank goodness. Now the clean up and power restoration needs to be complete. Reports from you NEC people are needed.
As OF 1930 [7:30 PM here is a snap shot
1. Amtrak has made no decisions on NEC however Auto train, Palmetto, Meteor, Carolinian from NYP - Raleigh cancelled with Silver star only operating JAX - MIA. Buses BOS - Portland, Me. All Piedmont service operating.
2. VRE full schedule but with a warning that NS should operate normally but CSX LINE to Fredricksburg may have major problems.
3. marc does not know if PENN LINE WILL OPERATE due to trees and major CAT PROBLEMS hopes to know by 10 PM tonight.
4. SEPTA -- NO INFORMATION YET
5. NJ TRANSIT -- No information yet
6. LIRR - Still waiting to find out what lines will be open.
7. MNRR -- Still waiting and a majr mudslide at Spuyten Duyvill blocking both MNRR and amtrak.
8. SHORE LIINE EAST -- Expecting to operate Monday afternoon.
9. MBTA - Still evaluating
Update as of 2030:
1. Amtrak seems to have cancelled Crescent both ways all the way to NOL
3. MARC expects Camden and Brunswick lines to operate with delays.
5. NJ TRANSIT -- Atlantic city line will operate. Light Rail on weekend schedules with some trees on tracks.
6. LIRR Trees on all lines
7. MNRR -- Sounds as if all lines subject to mud slides. mentions that many trees are hung up in CAT. Wonder if the constant tension CAT is holding the trees up??
9. MBTA -- expecting to operate except Green line riverside line has major tree and overhead wire problems.
From news reports as well as websites, it appears trees rather than water will cause the continued suspension of rail services for MNRR, LIRR, and NJT. There are some reports that stations were flooded out, trees remain across the tracks, and catenary is down or fouled by trees (MNRR report along with mud slide near Spuyten Devil). PATH says it will start up at 4AM Monday. NJT light rail and bus service will resume under restricted conditions. Some NYC bus routes have resumed with very, very limited services. From what I gather at the websites the assessing of damages and needs did not start until late Sunday and has apparently found more than anticipated. Gonna havta waitandsee.
RIDEWITHMEHENRY is the name for our almost monthly day of riding trains and transit in either the NYCity or Philadelphia areas including all commuter lines, Amtrak, subways, light rail and trolleys, bus and ferries when warranted. No fees, just let us know you want to join the ride and pay your fares. Ask to be on our email list or find us on FB as RIDEWITHMEHENRY (all caps) to get descriptions of each outing.
August 28,20117:45 p.m. EDT
Amtrak will operate most Northeast Regional trains between Philadelphia and Washington starting on Monday, Aug. 29. All Amtrak service between Boston and Philadelphia is canceled due to the extensive flooding, debris on tracks, and power issues as a result of Hurricane Irene. In addition, all Acela Express service between Boston and Washington is canceled.
Amtrak crews continue to inspect and make repairs to the infrastructure along the Northeast Corridor.
As of 7 p.m., the following trains with origination dates of Monday, Aug. 29 will operate:
As of 7 p.m., the following cancellations have been made for origination dates of Monday, Aug. 29:
SEPTA - some service on former RDG lines. No service on most AMTRAK lines.
Per the MTA [NY] Web site some LIRR SERVICE no MNRR service due to many problems ..
In the aftermath of Hurricane Irene, the MTA will provide limited service on Monday, August 29. The MTA's regular fare and toll policy will resume on Monday at 5:00 a.m.
With limited exceptions, service will resume across the subway system at 6:00 a.m. Monday morning. Service will be less frequent than normal, and customers should expect longer waits and more crowded trains. Frequency of service will improve over the course of the day.
The Staten Island Railway will resume normal service at midnight tonight.
Limited bus service was restored in all five boroughs of New York City earlier this evening. Service levels will continue to increase but may not reach normal levels tomorrow.
The Long Island Rail Road is restoring near-normal service for Monday morning's rush hour on six of its branches, but customers are advised to expect some cancelations and some trains operating with fewer than normal complement of cars. The AM rush service is being restored to and from:
Service remains suspended to and from:
Metro-North Railroad cannot operate regular service on any of its three lines, on Monday, August 29. There is still significant damage to many portions of the Metro-North system. Local streams and the Bronx River continue to overflow their banks and high winds continue to fell trees across the tracks.
All MTA Bridges and Tunnels are open
MTA paratransit services are expected to be operating normal service beginning at noon on Monday.
MARC Penn Line (on the NEC) is still suspended this Monday morning.
Well, the Adirondack Scenic ran as scheduled on Sunday, except for the morning trip, which was cancelled for lack of patrons (many folks had cleared out after some campgrounds closed, and the daytrippers pretty much stayed home).
Since we sometimes have trouble with trees on the tracks when there isn't any weather, we were on the lookout, but had no issues. It was clear that the river that runs along the side of the tracks for most of our local route was rising rapidly, however.
In monitoring the local fire departments there, they had no more issues than what would come up with any summer thunderstorm.
But it did rain constantly all day.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
MARC did operate Penn line this morning on an "S" schedule and plans to this afternoon. Amtrak is still recovering the line from PHL - WASH. Do not know if AMTRAK AND MARC are using diesels on that portion??
AMTRAK ran several regional tranins PHL - WASH rt but had many delays as well as MARC. SEPTA STILL NOT OPERATING ON NEC.
nj transit operating no trains except light rail.
LIRR operating all lines west of Hicksville except beach lines.
MNRR OPERATING A Sunday schedule this afternoon on lower Harlem and lower Hudson lines only.
SLE operating a weekend schedule from NH starting at 4:02 PM.
MBTA OPERATING WITH delays of debri and equipment failures. [ probably sea water in some equipment? ]
Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.