FORUM CLINIC: Building realistic scenery

[jfugate]

Ron:

Glad to hear your hand carving experiences were favorable.

I find I can hand carve rock faces faster than using lots of rock molds, and the results are almost as good. Especially for western Oregon scenery, where we don't have that many bare rock faces anyway, I can get away with hand carving most of the time.

I'll still use a rock mold here and there, but not as often as I hand carve.

[n2mopac]

A recent article in MR (one of the Turtle Creek extension articles) talked about carving rocks from extruded foam by punching and gouging it with a screwdriver. I know Joe and some others here do not use foam for scenery, but some of my new layout has foam and I needed to make a couple of cuts for my mainline. I thought this sounded like a good way to make cuts through limestone hillside, so I tried it. It worked great for cuts and rocky bluffs like are found in the midwest. I worked with it some more and got a finer exture that resembled the more sandy rock cuts of the southwest. The foam requires a thicker paint and/or more coats to cover than plaster, but the overall effect of the rocks was very pleasing and easier than the rock castings I have done in the past.

Ron

[SpaceMouse]

Well tonight I was going to start carving my mountain. I have my prototype picture...

But dang that is some good scenery in those pictures.

You set the bar so I high I'm going to have to take up pole vaulting..

...maybe rocket powered shoes are more my style.

[Anonymous]

Another winner, Joe! Plan to try your techniques, together with others, on rockfaces already started.

John
Austin, Texas

[jfugate]

TOPIC THIS POST: Doing realistic rock faces

We'll start this post out with some prototype and model rock face photos ... of south Roseburg on the prototype SP Siskiyou Line in southern Oregon:

PROTOTYPE LOCATION

(Click to enlarge)


(Click to enlarge)


(Click to enlarge)

SAME LOCATION ON THE MODEL
Here's a couple photos of the same location on my HO Siskiyou Line:



(Click to enlarge)

I prefer to hand carve my rocks most of the time and it's difficult to describe exactly how hand carving is done other than to say just practice. I use a kitchen butter knife (one with a smooth edge, not one with serations) to do the work.

For this rock wall, I mixed up my standard vermiculite plaster mix (see previous posts for details) and then globbed it on in little bumpy globs, shaping it to look similar to the prototype photos. If you're hand carving and are new at it, it's best to work from prototype photos. If you aren't sure you can do hand carving, try working on a throwaway scrap piece of scenery first.

I did the final shaping while the plaster was still soft -- the vermiculite mix has a working time of about 10-15 minutes, which is just enough time to shape it but fast enough it will hold it's shape without you having to constantly check to make sure something didn't sag on you while you weren't looking.

Once the plaster sets up for a few hours (overnight is ideal), I paint it with my earth-tan 50-50 latex paint mix (again, see earlier posts).

Then, I mix a thin black-brown stain of water and raw umber brown acrylic paint, and paint it over the rock face, letting it settle into the cracks and crannies in order to give the rock face more texture. Plus as you can see from the prototype photos, these rocks are dark volcanic basalt, so tending toward the darker side is correct. However, I avoid making the rocks too dark (erring on the side of slightly too light) in order to compensate for the lower intensity of indoor layout lighting as compared to the sun.

I let the stain dry for a few hours then come back with some dirt brown plaster mix (see the ballasting post) and dust that on the rock faces, giving them a nice weathered, dusty look. Then I mist the face with water to set up the dirt plaster mix.

Finally, I dry brush some very light tan almost white on some of the protruding rock faces to give them a bit of extra highlight and snap. Then I let everything dry thoroughly for a day or so before proceeding on to plant vegetation in the area.

After that, for these rock faces, I planted some silfor grass using a hot glue gun. In comparing the model to the prototype, it's apparent to me I could probably stand to plant still more silfor.

NEXT TOPIC: Doing realistic paved roads

[jfugate]

Well ... phoey! I had planned to post the next installment on rocks last night with photos, but this forum was down!

I'll try again tonight.

[SpaceMouse]

And I am working on rocks right now. Dang!

[jfugate]

I'm currently building an op session report from my *very unusual* April Op session on the Siskiyou Line.

I've decided to do photo essay reports from Siskiyou Line op sessions as a vicarious tutorial to folks who may not be able to make prototype-based op sessions very often. I've got 40 some photos from last Saturday's op session and it will take me a while to get them all posted with captions. But once I do, I'll come back to this topic and do the next installment on rocks.

Here's one photo as a teaser ...

(click to enlarge)

[tomytuna]

To Joe and all contributors....please accept my sincere Thanks for this TOPIC...Joe...I'm sure that I can speak for many that this topic is suppurb....But like others..I will not CLOG up this post with mindless comments...but be assured..I love your " Clinics "..thanks again . Tom

[jfugate]

I'm Okay, just very busy getting ready for my current April 9 op session ... next installment on this clinic coming soon ...

[hminky]

I use paver sand. I prefer it over dirt and outdooor materials. Also the sand is that, sand. It is more consistent in texture and finish when it is glued. Dirt from outside needs to be debugged and demagnitized. Dirt offers suprises when it is glued.



That is paver sand in the foreground. I found that it is very versatile, see my web article.

http://www.pacificcoastairlinerr.com/gravel/

Just a thought
Harold

[ukguy]

Did this topic die, I was looking forward to the next instalment. I'm not wanting to put any pressure on Mr Fugate at all, I much appreciate all that he (and everybody else) has contributed but it just seems a while since anybody posted. Call it pesimistic but is Mr Fugate OK? I hope so. Does anybody know?
Anyways I hope you are all havin fun and the wheels are on the rails,

Be safe & take care.
Karl.

[jfugate]

QUOTE: Originally posted by cwclark

Joe....what's a spring clamp?..will vise grips holding the wire at the end of a table work also?

CW:

Vice grips would work also, but they're not quite as convenient as a spring clamp. You can find them in all sorts of sizes at any hardware store. I find the 2" and 3" sizes to be the most useful. Here's a photo:



If you do spline roadbed like I do, you'll have several dozen of these puppies lying around. [:D]

[AggroJones]

Dirt is okay for dirt. But sometimes it comes out a little dark. To fix this, I mix the scenic base color with white paint in a thin wash. And I spackle the ground with sponge wet with the wash. It looks terrible when applied, but it dries fantastic looking. Forgive the quality of the photo.


[2c]

[AggroJones]

ukguy, I was contimplating using fake fur in place of sweatshirt in that technique. Thanks for confirming that it works. Great minds think alike.

[egmurphy]

Great thread. Thanks to Joe F for starting and maintaining it, and to everyone else for chipping in with great tips and suggestions.



Regards

Ed

[ukguy]

Another method I have discovered (probably reinventing another wheel) for making long grass is :-

1 Die the fake fur your desired colour
2 Glue the fake fur fluffy side DOWN in the area you want to cover. Leave overnight to dry.
3 Instead of ripping the backing off as per Joe's sweatshirt method, peel the backing back cutting the 'grass' to the desired height as you go using an exacto or scissors thus releasing the backing.

Two benefits are :-

1 Gives a very controlled method of placement and height. Also there is no backing 'edge' to hide as with the traditional fake fur method.
2 The backing that has been cut off will still have a good length of nap and can be used in the conventional method of fake fur (fluffy side up), also, this will require minimal height triming, hence you will get twice the area covered with the same amount of fake fur.

Have fun & be safe,
Karl.

[ukguy]

Joe & all, I contacted Scenic Express by e:mail in regards to aquiring one of their catalogues. The next day I recieved a detailed e:mail back (hows that for service) saying that they would place me on the mailing list to recieve the new catalogues whenever they were released (free of charge) and as I had just missed out on the last mailing if I sent them $3 to cover postage they would send me the current catalogue immediately.
I hope that their order shipping and processing is this good (as I am sure it is), its so good (and refreshing) to find a supplier with customer service in mind.

Now I cant wait to see the catalogue, man I hate waiting, God give me patience..... but hurry !!

Have fun & be safe,
Karl.

P.S Oh and she also stated in the e:mail that although the website was currently a little bare they were in the process of adding the rest of their products and updating the site.

[cwclark]

Joe....what's a spring clamp?..will vise grips holding the wire at the end of a table work also?

[jfugate]

Rich:

That's a great story!

Now you see what I mean ... isn't the Scenic Express catalog a gold mine? Too bad their web site isn't such a disappointment . Their catalog is everything their web site is not.

[Anonymous]

So today (Sunday April 3) I traipse over to the Greenberg Train (and Toy) show in Wilmington, MA. Which I did not know was happening until I read about it in another thread on this forum.

Stuffed along one wall I come upon a long set of tables stacked with scenic details - you know, trees & tree kits, flocking etc. Well what do I stumble on? Both Silfor and Heki grass plus a Noch puffer bottle. Now I'm in trouble. Whilst perusing all this great stuff I feel a little nudge at my elbow and this fellow hands me a little basket (yeah I've got that much stuff [}:)]). And I needed it because the trees were way cool.

After spending a few minutes grabbing stuff I check out before I do any more damage to the already thin wallet. Of course in these situations you get to talking to the person running the table and he introduces himself -- Jim Elster. Now sometimes I'm a bit slow; it isn't until he says he'll throw in one of his catalogs that has "Scenic Express" emblazoned on it that I realize that I've just had one of those uncanny coincidences (and in case the rest of you are as slow a me Jim Elster is the owner of Scenic Express).

So thanks for the tip Joe! [:D]

[hminky]

Thanks guys,
I find faux fur very versatile for grassland development. Here is my initial attempt at sagebrush. Having a central California based railroad most standard scenicing methods don't work.



I have found faux fur can be transmorgified into lots of things.

Harold

[Anonymous]

Harold,

I picked up MR crafstman at Borders a couple weeks ago. It was cool to see a guy who's layout I recognized from this forum. Nice Job! You make On30 look extremely tempting!!!

[jfugate]

Great example of fake fur grass there, Harold!

[hminky]

QUOTE: subject of grass

My March 2005 RMC article about making grass and bushes from faux fur is now on-line . It is the original manuscript.

http://www.pacificcoastairlinerr.com/fur_grass/article/





Thank you if you visit[:D]
Harold

[steel]

Don't stop the Clinic yet. I've learned more from this than reading 10 years worth of MRR!!!

[Anonymous]

Great stuff Tutaenui

I'll just need to figure out where to get, or how to substitute for the Noch puffer bottle.

Thx

[tutaenui]

Going back to the subject of grass SILFLOR is great but expensive. As an alternative I suggest HEKI long blade grass. See http://altezeitgruppe.com/scenic_treatment.htm for its effectiveness.Limited colour range is the only draw back but I think NOCH might offer a wider range in a similar product. HEKI also has a product similar to SILFLOR but less than half the price. Again a more limited range of colours.
<BRAD>

[electrolove]

Yes, please do a post about rocks. I'm going to have some on my layout. That would be really nice.

I'm not sure if you have talked about realistic water yet, rivers and things like that. Maybe you can learn us how to do it the right way so it looks great? Just a suggestion.

QUOTE: Originally posted by jfugate

"You're welcome!" to everyone who has enjoyed this forum clinic.

With the soon to be posted piece about constructing conifers, I'm nearing the end of the scenery topics I have that I can discuss. Perhaps I could do a post about painting and detailing rocks, but that about covers it.

Does anyone have a favorite scenery topic or question that I have not covered? Something I may have overlooked, perhaps?

Speak up, or we'll be closing out this forum clinic soon and moving on to something else.

[jfugate]

Aggro:

Chime in!

I think you learn more by discussing the ideas than just listening to the online equivalent of a lecture. Questions, comments, alternatives, smart remarks ... whatever. [:D]