Tinplate ToddlerSorry, I never pre-order anything. In fact, I never order anything I cannot hold in my hands prior to buying it.
Amazon must not get much business from you. We just ordered the kid in Ottawa a new Queen mattress, desk, nightstand and he ordered a 50" sony TV all from the comfort of home. He didn't see any of it but did his research beforehand. We have a half-hour drive to the nearest store and Amazon is saving us a fortune in transportation.
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."
Tinplate ToddlerAnybody who thinks he can run a riskless business must be a complete fool.
Oh, I don't know about that. Undertakers seem to come close. After all, what's the worst that could happen other than the customer dying? And that would be a pre-existing condition.
Anybody who thinks he can run a riskless business must be a complete fool. It´s a sure guarantee to get driven out of business, sooner or later. This will eventually happen to those manufacturers, who limit their range of products to those models they think they can sell by the container load, i.e. signature models like the UP Big Boy or SP´s Gs4 4449, but also to those, who require a sufficient amount of over-priced pre-orders to cash out the investment into new tooling. With this type of attempted cherry-picking, you are bound to fail to develop a customer base, let a lone a market.
Sorry, I never pre-order anything. In fact, I never order anything I cannot hold in my hands prior to buying it.
Happy times!
Ulrich (aka The Tin Man)
"You´re never too old for a happy childhood!"
Until Rapido makes somethig I can use I will sit on my wallet as Canadian locomotives isn't something I care to own..I own a few Canadian road freight cars but,that's part of the railroad interchange plant.
I will admit their GMD-1 got a second look but,its not a common engine found on short lines or terminal switching roads so,it was a pass for me.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
What I like about this approach is that it allows Rapido to determine the volume and lower the risk for them. The last thing I want to see is Rapido go out of business. Personally, I am mostly interested in steam that is unique and not part of my little roster at home. So I will certainly pre-order the CN Northern U4. And I might pre-order the Selkirk (it will depend on the recommended minimum radius). But the smaller steam I already have -- which is not 100% prototypical but I will tolerate these differences given the price tag of the Rapido models. Until my pockets get deeper...
Simon
Whether we like it or not, it's the way of the world. If you think this business model is only for model trains, think again. It happens on most everything we buy with the exception of perishables. Being in the toy business, we have to book new items a good 12-18 months out, and like Rapido, if they can't hit the minimums, they don't make it. Same happens in the clothing and footwear business. Sneakers are made in runs of whatever they choose, they pre-book a good year or more in advance, and once it's made, that's it. Production runs have to be slotted with the makers/builders so things should run on time (we hope).
Some of the train manufacturers don't have staff on site overseas, so when the sample comes it, if it's wrong, it get's sent back to get fixed. Or, they get the sample, approve it, and when it arrives in the states, some things are not up to snuff or gets damaged in transit. It happens.
Things have changed since the old Pacific Fast Mail days. We're living in a new decade, and manufacturers can't afford to have 'extra' or make something that may not sell just because someone thought it would.
Well, I love my two Hudsons even though I have sent one of them back once and the other twice. I am putting it down to teething pains for their steam program. Rapido really likes to keep us informed about what is going on with the company, I wish Jason would address the decoder (and other issues) failers, that would make me feel a bit better about ordering two of the ten wheelers which I will do, I am just shopping for a good deal at the moment and will commit by deadline.
For some reason, I want to buy one of these as well. Must be my British heritage genes even though some of my roots in Canada go back to the late 1700s they still linger.
Like their boxcar but it is not for Southern Pacific, so no.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL Selector and all, I should make it clear I have no problem with Rapidos pricing relative to their value added features and quality. And I would hardly call my fleet of locos "scrounging for Blue Box and the like". But most were bought before some of the recent market changes, and most were bought without DCC or sound, lowering their relative prices, and yes many of my diesels are Proto2000 bought on "closeout", or NOS at train shows or Ebay. But I have paid $300 and more for nice steam loco models, that is not the issue. The main issue in this case is that Canadian steam has some unique spotting features, and may not blend well with my fleet without some work. Do I want to spend $500 and do that work? I think not. I can likely find three Sunset brass B&O B18's for less money each. Because I don't want just one, I would like to have three or four. Sheldon
Selector and all,
I should make it clear I have no problem with Rapidos pricing relative to their value added features and quality. And I would hardly call my fleet of locos "scrounging for Blue Box and the like". But most were bought before some of the recent market changes, and most were bought without DCC or sound, lowering their relative prices, and yes many of my diesels are Proto2000 bought on "closeout", or NOS at train shows or Ebay.
But I have paid $300 and more for nice steam loco models, that is not the issue.
The main issue in this case is that Canadian steam has some unique spotting features, and may not blend well with my fleet without some work.
Do I want to spend $500 and do that work? I think not. I can likely find three Sunset brass B&O B18's for less money each. Because I don't want just one, I would like to have three or four.
Sheldon
Sheldon, my comment was about Rapido, not about you.
I think that Rapido's pre-order policy is sane business policy, especially in this day and age.
Custom-made brass locomotives for many models were hand-made in relatively limited numbers (in most cases). Dealers could sign-on for what they thought saleable, and the importer could order the building of a comparable number, plus a few extras for back-up if the model proved popular. If something was a real hit with modellers, another run could be commisioned.
However, with mass-produced models, the tooling is a major cost, and needs to be amortised over a set number of units which will determine the price per unit and the number needed to make a reasonable profit. If there are insufficient pre-orders, the model is unlikely to be made....unfortunate for those who were interested, but a good practice, in my opinion, business-wise.I have a very nice brass model of a CNR H-6-g, built by Samhongsa and imported by Van Hobbies. I've detailed it to match photos of its prototype, and it's a nice-running locomotive...
I got it at a very good price because it did not have its original box. When Rapido announced the the Royal Hudson would be their first model of steam, I was disappointed, as it was of no interest to me. Had they announced the Ten Wheeler at that time, I would have put in my pre-order. However, while the Royal Hudson project was underway, I happened upon another H-6-g, same maker and importer, but this one with a can motor (the first one has an open-frame motor, in which I installed rare earth magnets, vastly improving its performance). This one, obtained at an estate sale, was an even better price (the sellers knew its worth, but had dozens of locos they needed to move) and I'm currently in the process of making it look like the prototype its original owner (whom I knew) had numbered it. It will be considerably different from the one shown above, and will require a scratchbuilt tender, I think.
I truly wish success for Rapido's steam projects, and while I may, at some point, put in a pre-order, I am in a position where I definitely don't "need" more locomotives.
In March of 2017, I pre-ordered a specifically-lettered tank car from Intermountain, and while it's the same car as many they've offered over the years, with various lettering, it's not yet been done recently in that particular lettering scheme, despite having been offered earlier.
Wayne
What Rapido is doing is a little different than the typical limited production - and quite sensible. If they don't have committed sales for enough models, either the individual price will have to be much higher to cover the tooling and production cost, plus a reasonable profit, or they don't get made. Things have always been that way - limited production or not. The glory days weren't all roses, sometimes those manufacturers lost their shorts on a run or two that didn't sell well.
For other limited production stuff - well, I have quite a few models sold under that model. Only one did I ever actually order ahead of time, and no money down was required. I subsequently got 2 more of that model, long after they were sold out, on eBay. For much less than I paid for the first one - and they were unopened, unused. My most recent loco purchase - also a limited run item. A few weeks after delivery, they started showing up on eBay. I skipped it then. Then they were getting hard to find - suddenly, closeout sale, got one. A new run was done of the same model, but not in the paint scheme I wanted/have. I'm not counting P2K locos, almost all of which were labeled "Limited Run" on the boxes prior to Walthers buying them. They were so 'limited' that in some cases I was still finding new in box ones 10+ years after they were made, at train shows and on ebay.
The stuff is out there. Often still new, not something someone ran on their layout for 20 years and now the familiy is getting rid of it because the modeler passed away. I haven't missed anything I wanted so far. Same with structures - I've found plenty of out of production Walthers kits, unbuilt. Some of the bridge kits I have, from Central Valley, Micro Engineering, and Walthers - not sure if they are all still in production, but I found them at a train show, still sealed and unbuilt. Rolling stock kits - depending on what it is, I can probably find it new at a hobby shop I know, guy's had the same inventory for probably 25 years now. I think I've been there enough to get the ones I want, but there are still shelves full of BB kits, Bowser, Accurail, and others. I still find ones I want at train shows and on eBay.
I guess I;m different from most consumers. If i DO miss something I wanted, I'd be disappointed, but it wouldn;t feel like my layout plan is now ruined. And odds are, I'll find one in a year or so anyway.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
It's not just locomotives, though. There are a lot of structure kits no longer available, although Walthers does occasionally restore limited production of some retired models.
Get 'em while you can, particularly steam and Transition Era models. Setting up for a run of any model is not something to be taken lightly, and may mean suspending or dropping another model from production. There's only so much production capacity out there.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
And I agree with Dave about the preorder thing as well, the idea of ordering and waiting a year does not excite me one bit.
I know that this pre-order/limited run world and that business model is the way things are now, and I know that presumably intelligent business owners -- the ones with their money on the line after all - say it's the way it has to be.
But I still wonder if it really is the way it has to be. Is it really such a world of tiny demand and tiny supply? How is it that other forms of marketing and other business models work to create demand, or satisfy demand over time frames longer than a few weeks? Is the model train economy really such an outlier?
One of the remarkable things about the old Pacific Fast Mail line of brass imports is that the owner Bill Ryan had his own likes and interests, incluing Great Northern, Northern Pacific, and Western Pacific and Shays, so that is what he took his chances on and virtually created the demand for those engines and those road names. And they were imported in such quantity as to be available for dealer's shelves for a while and thereby created the interest over a period of time.
True that was also back in the day when there were dealers. And they had shelves. And they took some chances on what they stocked. Sigh. I am a flip-phone geezer I guess.
Dave Nelson
This is disappointing, but in a way it's also very encouraging.
Obviously, this might end up a dead end for Rapido, especially if the rest of their future offerings die on the subscription vine. Steam, I mean. That would be disappointing because they are quickly establishing themselves as the standard bearers for higher detailed and true-to-prototype models...if you can afford them. And I think they are pricing themselves wisely. Yeah, they are stiff prices if you're used to scrounging for Blue Box and the like, but boy do you get a great model.
What I mean by encouraging is that the company is in a strong position, and has placed themselves in the hobby, where they can be forthright and keep their potential clients fully apprised of where they're at..as the Newfoundlanders would put it. They are always aware of their own status, and they share an abundance of their thinking and concerns with their customer base. They are also quick to turn on a dime when it seems prudent to do so. They won't lay out the cash and hope for the better. Those days are long gone in our hobby. Instead, they express their concerns in an informative newsletter that gets published at least six times a year, and they put US in the driver's seat. "You tell us what you want, and we'll build-em. Build 'em good, too."
This is what keeps Rapido booming, and in turn it is good for us and for our beloved hobby. They're savvy, they mean well, and they treat us like valued customers. Can't see a down side to that.
I'm very interested in mid sized steam like Ten Wheelers and Consolidations, but I don't model Canadian roads, and I'm not sure I'm ready to spend $500, or any thing close to that, on a lettering/kit bash project.
Now a B&O B18 might be a different story.
Sheldon, spoiled by the good looks, good performance and low cost of my existing fleet of Spectrum, older BLI and Proto Steam.
A bit of topic but of more interest to me is the announcement for a 3D scan party at Oregon Rail heritage center. What are they scanning? SP&S 700? That would make me excited, but BLI has also anoinced such a model. Is it SP 4999?
Regards, Isaac
I model my railroad and you model yours! I model my way and you model yours!
This is not surprising. People said the Royal Hudson was too unique and special, and they say they won't buy the Royal Hudson, but they would buy 5 of the 4-6-0 locomotive if given a chance. Then when given the chance, they sit on their wallets.
.
We hear the same thing about Big Boys, why so many of this rare and unique locomotive and not a new model of a 2-8-0 that was 1,000 times more common?
Simple... Royal Hudsons and Big Boys sell.
This is something you learn in business. What people say they want is seldom what they will actually buy. Make the items the buyers will buy. Don't listen the vocal critics that will never ever wipe the dust off the checkbook.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
If anyone is planning on aquiring a D10 or H6 ten wheeler from Rapido Trains, you might want to do it soon since it appears that pre-order numbers have been quite dissappointing to the point that they might not enter production. https://myemail.constantcontact.com/Rapido-News-115---Join-us-for-a-3D-Scan--Order-Deadlines--New-Videos-.html?soid=1101318906379&aid=o2-fOhGvqPU
Lone Geep
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