I don't have any objections to new logos.
I do see the wheel on the rail.
BUT, The problem I see with it is if I did not know what the "nmra" was, I wouldn't know what it was, or what a "nmra.org"is, the logo would not look like a wheel on a rail to me. Being that I DO know what a "nmra.org" is, I do see the wheel on the rail and can make the connection to railroading.
I think the "modified female body part" is a bit rediculous though, as I would not have put the logo togetehr that way knowing or not knowing what a "nmra.org" is or what the symbol is, so I see little connection to it and did not find it humorous!
-G .
Just my thoughts, ideas, opinions and experiences. Others may vary.
HO and N Scale.
After long and careful thought, they have convinced me. I have come to the conclusion that they are right. The aliens did it.
In all the sound and fury, a question:
What are their plans for the traditional logo worked into the brickwork of the NMRA National Headquarters building???
Are they planning to rework that, too? I sure hope not.
As for the crescent moon logo, adding a journal box would sure help.
Chuck (Ex-member modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
Hi,
I've been an NMRA member for a lot of years, and appreciate the improvements in the monthly mag, and what they are doing to keep standards alive and well.
But why the new logo? The NMRA surely has better things to spend money - and time/effort - on than creating a new logo. The old one was just fine by me, and frankly identified the organization as RR oriented quite well.
Come on, this new whateveritis doesn't do a thing to get new members, keep old ones, or to get the hobby in front of young folks.
For what its worth,
Mobilman44
ENJOY !
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
After reading all the different views here on the new NMRA logo, I can only agree with the one´s that think it is appauling!
I hope they didn´t PAY anyone to make this abomination!?!
The font is horrible, the t*t is very visible and the .org is making me laugh out loud!
Yeah, I bet it was hard on the border of impossible to register the NMRA.com domain.......
I think it is okay to modernize and refresh logos and trademarks but this doesn´t fall anywhere near that mark!
Swedish Custom painter and model maker. My Website:
My Railroad
My Youtube:
Graff´s channel
CSX ToledoThe old logo was clearly identifiable as something railroad(a coupler over a steam loco driver). While I do not have a problem with developing a new more modern logo, I do not think this new logo has the same clear association to railroading the old had. People who are not in the hobby do not associate the new logo with railroads.
I agree with you. Not sure what would be wrong with simply having a steam loco as a logo. That would be pretty unambiguous, IMO.
John
jeffrey-wimberlyI still like the old one better.
I still like the old one better.
You betcha, and everybody knows that's the logo for the
National Model Rifle Association
howmusJeffrey is right on the money as to what the logos look like. I rather like the old logo myself, but it is pretty much dated......Here is a link to the inspiration for the new logo: http://www.nmra.org/Wheel-Logo.gif The next thread will probably one complaining that "the hobby is dying" because there are no young members in the nmra............. Guess what, they are out there, but what they percieve about an organization is a big part of whether they will join. If they percieve "Old Phart Group", well??????Progress happens and many many of us in the nmra have been yelling at National Office to "DO SOMETHING" for years. Of course now that they have, "HOW DARE THEY!!!!!"I think they tried to "hit the ground running" on this. Time will tell.73 P.S. - my only thing with the new logo is that the Font is called Howard Fat! Well I am, but they don't have to rub it in!!!
Jeffrey is right on the money as to what the logos look like. I rather like the old logo myself, but it is pretty much dated......
Here is a link to the inspiration for the new logo: http://www.nmra.org/Wheel-Logo.gif
The next thread will probably one complaining that "the hobby is dying" because there are no young members in the nmra............. Guess what, they are out there, but what they percieve about an organization is a big part of whether they will join. If they percieve "Old Phart Group", well??????
Progress happens and many many of us in the nmra have been yelling at National Office to "DO SOMETHING" for years. Of course now that they have, "HOW DARE THEY!!!!!"
I think they tried to "hit the ground running" on this. Time will tell.
73
P.S. - my only thing with the new logo is that the Font is called Howard Fat! Well I am, but they don't have to rub it in!!!
With the new logo, they'll be thinking we're a bunch of boobs...
To help illustrate my point, I just showed the new logo to my wife, who has no idea who or what the NMRA is or supposed to be and is as far from a train person as you can get, I said tell me what your first impression is, and she took one look at it and said, "its a bb, what is that for, a fund raising site?" meaning brea$t cancer research. I told here who it was for and she said sarcasticly "Did it have overwhelming approval?"
I wasnt joking when I said this has the potential of going south very fast once it hits the street.
Have fun with your trains
The Atlas forum has been foaming at the mouth in a thread on the HO forum. 7 pages of some really funny and rediculous stuff. However, the moderator just shut it down because it was getting way too silly. I emailed the NMRA pres. about the furor in case Mike doesn't look at forums. Will see what response the board has over the reaction.
Bob
yougottawanta Heres my two cents. I really do not care which way the logo is designed. I think (and I am a member ) if the NMRA wants to increase members start treating people who are new members like they are welcome.Call them , talk to them , CORRESPOND . I joined well over a year ago , left messages sent e-mails trying to get plugged in and guess what I got for my efforts ? An e-mail that stated heres a flyer look at it see what you want to come to. Here is the real problem , there is a sense that one gets that this a good ole boys club and outsiders are to be endured and really not welcome. Why spend money on logos when there is a strucdtural problem such as getting the new members plugged in and growing with in the organization.From articles I have read in the NMRA this is a common problem.It is money wasted that should be spent repairing other issues.
Heres my two cents. I really do not care which way the logo is designed. I think (and I am a member ) if the NMRA wants to increase members start treating people who are new members like they are welcome.Call them , talk to them , CORRESPOND . I joined well over a year ago , left messages sent e-mails trying to get plugged in and guess what I got for my efforts ? An e-mail that stated heres a flyer look at it see what you want to come to. Here is the real problem , there is a sense that one gets that this a good ole boys club and outsiders are to be endured and really not welcome. Why spend money on logos when there is a strucdtural problem such as getting the new members plugged in and growing with in the organization.From articles I have read in the NMRA this is a common problem.It is money wasted that should be spent repairing other issues.
tomikawaTT In all the sound and fury, a question: What are their plans for the traditional logo worked into the brickwork of the NMRA National Headquarters building??? Are they planning to rework that, too? I sure hope not. As for the crescent moon logo, adding a journal box would sure help. Chuck (Ex-member modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
Just submitted it to Jay Leno, I am sure I will hear if his staff finds it funny.
vsmithTo help illustrate my point, I just showed the new logo to my wife, who has no idea who or what the NMRA is or supposed to be and is as far from a train person as you can get, I said tell me what your first impression is, and she took one look at it and said, "its a bb, what is that for, a fund raising site?" meaning brea$t cancer research. I told here who it was for and she said sarcasticly "Did it have overwhelming approval?"
I showed the new logo to my wife, sister, and brother in law...all of them thought it was a female body part.
Nick
Take a Ride on the Reading with the: Reading Company Technical & Historical Society http://www.readingrailroad.org/
It's obviously a wheel on a rail or at least some add man's conception of such some people can argue about anything
Milepost 266.2steemtrayn I don't mind the logo so much, but why does ".org" have to be part of it? Is the organisation now nothing more than a website? I thought it might be because nmra.com went to another site with similar initials (National Mustang Racing Association, maybe), but nmra.com forwards to the nmra.org home page.
steemtrayn I don't mind the logo so much, but why does ".org" have to be part of it? Is the organisation now nothing more than a website?
I don't mind the logo so much, but why does ".org" have to be part of it? Is the organisation now nothing more than a website?
I thought it might be because nmra.com went to another site with similar initials (National Mustang Racing Association, maybe), but nmra.com forwards to the nmra.org home page.
The DNS root zone ".com" was originally intended for commercial ventures, ".org" for organizations.
Having a ".org" DNS domain is one way of signalling that you are an organization. Also having the corresponding ".com" DNS domain ensures that people who thinks everything is ".com" will find you as well.
"nmra.us", on the other hand, is owned by a different group - the National Midget Racing Association.
Grin, Stein
P.S - a midget is, in the context mentioned above, not a short person. It is tiny racing car - looks kinda like a gocart with a protective cage around the driver ....
rrebell Just submitted it to Jay Leno, I am sure I will hear if his staff finds it funny.
Problem is having watched Leno several different times, I don't think he or his staff knows funny from trash.
Allegheny2-6-6-6 It's obviously a wheel on a rail or at least some add man's conception of such some people can argue about anything
Thats only true IF your very familiar with trains and railroads and train components and IF your aware of what the letters NMRA stand for then YES, you can put 2 and 2 together and guess its ment to be a wheel on a rail, but 99.998% of the American population are not familiar enough with either, so for them its FAR from obvious what its supposed to be, hence my wifes reaction and the other reactons of non-train people other forum members have mentioned.
Part of the problem is that most of the people here who dont see the potential problem are probably too deeply involved in the hobby to understand what those outside of the hobby are seeing. Our pattern recogniztion system is hardwired differently, as I said earlier, while we see the SD-60 in the burned toast, everyone else sees the Virgin Mary.
I await to see if Leno's people pick it up as part of their "stupid signs" skit.
NittanyLion It looks more like an owl's eye. Or the left half of the Conrail logo.
It looks more like an owl's eye.
Or the left half of the Conrail logo.
Color the center red, and it reminds me of the "eye" of HAL-9000.
"I'm sorry, Dave...I can't let you run your trains with that antiquated analog system. DCC is far superior."
Robert Beaty
The Laughing Hippie
-----------------------------------------------------------------
The CF-7...a waste of a perfectly good F-unit!
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the
end of your tunnel, Was just a freight train coming
your way. -Metallica, No Leaf Clover
"Thats only true IF your very familiar with trains and railroads and train components and IF your aware of what the letters NMRA stand for then YES, you can put 2 and 2 together and guess its ment to be a wheel on a rail, but 99.998% of the American population are not familiar enough with either, so for them its FAR from obvious what its supposed to be, hence my wifes reaction and the other reactons of non-train people other forum members have mentioned".
Then why else would you be looking at the National Model Railroad Association website?
From my wife's point of view, she only saw the logo and not the magazine, she says it definatley has something to do with eyes. She is a professional Administrator in the Nursing field.
Personally, I don't like it. I don't want to have to search out what things mean or relate to.
The old one works great for me. I am not against change, but lets make it meaningful and recognizable change not a guessing game.
I give great credit to the NMRA for all the work they have done over the years with standards etc., but have always felt as well that it was a good old boys club and did not seem to have the ability to relate to newcomers and youth. This new logo will not do anything to assist in this area, only further camouflage them from the real world.
They could also start to lobby for us for better quality in some products. It still gets my brisstles up when I hear of people and myself included, paying lots of money for locomotives that growl and grind around your layout. The technology is there so that this doesn't need to happen anymore. Maybe we should stop paying the price and wake some of these quality control people up.
to some of the new Walther's products and ExactRail. Beautiful entries into the hobby.
Johnboy out.......................................myworth
from Saskatchewan, in the Great White North..
We have met the enemy, and he is us............ (Pogo)
Allegheny2-6-6-6 "Thats only true IF your very familiar with trains and railroads and train components and IF your aware of what the letters NMRA stand for then YES, you can put 2 and 2 together and guess its ment to be a wheel on a rail, but 99.998% of the American population are not familiar enough with either, so for them its FAR from obvious what its supposed to be, hence my wifes reaction and the other reactons of non-train people other forum members have mentioned". Then why else would you be looking at the National Model Railroad Association website?
My Wife ask if its a chapter within the NMRA for *** cancer? I said no it theirvnew logo, she answer need to go back to drawing board and try again!
vsmith Part of the problem is that most of the people here who dont see the potential problem are probably too deeply involved in the hobby to understand what those outside of the hobby are seeing. Our pattern recogniztion system is hardwired differently, as I said earlier, while we see the SD-60 in the burned toast, everyone else sees the Virgin Mary.
I get it! It's a Rorshach test!
Mark
markpierceI get it! It's a Rorshach test! Mark
Yep, and those dirty minded doctors that keep showing us all those dirty pictures have the nerve to tell us we have a sick mind.....
Ray Seneca Lake, Ontario, and Western R.R. (S.L.O.&W.) in HO
We'll get there sooner or later!
Its not someone looking at the website I'm thinking about, its a banner fluttering outside a building at a show/convention or someone just wearing a ballcap or a T-shirt with the logo emblazed upon it walking out of a show or around town in general circulation where contact with the general public will occur.
Unless the words "National Model Railroad Associatin" are included on caps or shirts their will be confusion as to what it suppposed to represent, especially to non-train types, and even then it will likely have to explained that its a wheel on a rail. Afterall most of this country is already extraordinarily easily offendable in general, especially when it comes to things that can be misinterpreted as a body part. It just seams to me that the end product demonstrates a surprising lack of understanding about how scary PC things can get here in the real world when its clear that a vague abstract image can be read many ways other than that which you intended.
What they need is a group of Beta Testers to try this out in public, namely wearing a shirt or cap with the logo with only the NMRA.org letters on it, then go to typical public spaces and see what the reactions are over a period of a few weeks and report the results, maybe no one will care, maybe a few wearers will be beaten up by angry feminists, I dunno, I guess it would depend where in the country you are, I know I wouldnt wear it here for any reason without a pink ribbon attached next to it.
vsmith Unless the words "National Model Railroad Association" are included on caps or shirts their will be confusion as to what it supposed to represent, especially to non-train types, and even then it will likely have to explained that its a wheel on a rail.
Unless the words "National Model Railroad Association" are included on caps or shirts their will be confusion as to what it supposed to represent, especially to non-train types, and even then it will likely have to explained that its a wheel on a rail.
Agree! I surely don't want to be associated with the National Male Reprobate Association.
vsmith Part of the problem is that most of the people here who dont see the potential problem are probably too deeply involved in the hobby to understand what those outside of the hobby are seeing
You know, for someone whose signature proudly proclaims you to be an unconventional and artistic type for whom "reality is a crutch", you sure seem to rather concerned about prim propriety when it comes to the logos your wear on your hat or T-shirt.
Tell me, what is the worst "problem" that could happen to you due to the new logo?
That some random strange lady seeing a hat (which you presumably would be *way* too mortified to wear anyways ....) somehow would make the mistaken assumption that you were supporting cancer research or some such thing?
Oh, the infamy of it all ....
steinjr vsmith Part of the problem is that most of the people here who dont see the potential problem are probably too deeply involved in the hobby to understand what those outside of the hobby are seeing You know, for someone whose signature proudly proclaims you to be an unconventional and artistic type for whom "reality is a crutch", you sure seem to rather concerned about prim propriety when it comes to the logos your wear on your hat or T-shirt. Tell me, what is the worst "problem" that could happen to you due to the new logo? That some random strange lady seeing a hat (which you presumably would be *way* too mortified to wear anyways ....) somehow would make the mistaken assumption that you were supporting cancer research or some such thing? Oh, the infamy of it all .... Grin, Stein
rrebell steinjr vsmith Part of the problem is that most of the people here who dont see the potential problem are probably too deeply involved in the hobby to understand what those outside of the hobby are seeing You know, for someone whose signature proudly proclaims you to be an unconventional and artistic type for whom "reality is a crutch", you sure seem to rather concerned about prim propriety when it comes to the logos your wear on your hat or T-shirt. Tell me, what is the worst "problem" that could happen to you due to the new logo? That some random strange lady seeing a hat (which you presumably would be *way* too mortified to wear anyways ....) somehow would make the mistaken assumption that you were supporting cancer research or some such thing? Oh, the infamy of it all .... Grin, Stein I can think of a couple of things, first a dramatic drop in merchandise sales, second, loss of members who ask if it is alright to do things, not all people will believe it is about model railroading, how many t-shirts have you see with meanings that don't go with the initials as we know them etc. like "National Male Raunchy Association" and that came to mind immediately!!!!!!!!!!!!
Stien
rrebell makes my point, plus just because I might think "reality is a crutch" doesn't mean I'm going to walk around with something possibly offensive to other people plastered across my chest, my mom raised us kids better than that. Its simply about respecting other people, not any prim-ness.
I wont wear this simply because I dont want to offend people I already know and work with who might be put off by the questionable imagery of the logo. The sad truth is that it doesnt matter what the logo actually is, its what it can be percieved as.
If you want to wear it, go for it. I'll stick to the "old school" logo, looks way better anyway you slice it.
Boy.... I guess the women are right. We have a one track mind and trains aren't on it.
Paul