hi gentlemen,
Gary does understand the above very well. What bothered me was his wish to add loads of new engines (a fleet he called it) for DC- operation only. Though I do understand his wish not to invest in DCC right now, his wish to spend his money on more DC-only stuff will surely keep him from using DCC in the future. Installing decoders in a fleet of engines will turn out to be very costly when done later.
Operating a couple of trains on a DC layout, with numerous blocks you have to (dis)connect, might be not all that after all. The longer he waits the more difficult the change to DCC will become.
Wish you wisdom
Paul
my fleet probably won't get much bigger than this, one more RS1, an Alco FA/FB pair, an E7, a trio of RS3's. it's a 4' x 6' layout I'm going to try ad get it to look realistically populated. When the funds allow this summer I will come back and ask about a proper DCC system.
The layout is at a standstill currently, the right hand #5 ME turnout arrived yesterday and locomotives make it past the frog but the moment the front truck crosses it the loco dies and loses power. I got another pack of 4.25", a box of 1.25", and a box 15" R curve.
SP&S modeler, 1960's give or take a decade or two for some equipment.
http://www.youtube.com/user/SGTDUPREY?feature=guide
Gary DuPrey
N scale model railroader
You might consider getting the DCC ready locos if you have the option. It will make things easier if you make a switch later--you know plugging in a decoder instead of wiring it.
Chip
Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.
current DCC ready fleet: AC4400CW, SD70MAC, GP40-2, SD40, 2x Alco FA/FB, 4-8-2, GS-4, E5A, and NW2.
non DCC ready: F7A, RS1, E8A, and 4-8-4.
upcoming release pre order locos: F3 AB set, Dash 8-32BWH
Future purchases: E7A, F3A(multiple), RS units(unknown if DCC ready), another NW2, S-2 or S-4, possible C424/425, possible F7's.
yeah, I'm just going to bail on this layout there's no point in it anymore. it's a project that will never see fruition.
it's done, there's just no point in it anymore.
I would but I like to use atlas track because I can ballast it myself.
Gary,
Kato Unitrack is pretty reliable and easy to enhance in appearance - see for yourself:
It is easy to become discouraged when you want a lot in a small space and it does not all fit. It has seemed like you imagined more than could fit in 4X6
So look at it the other way and start with what does fit. Some layout is always better than nothing.
I was never discouraged about the layout, but there's no point it anymore. I've already cleaned it off and will be storing my trains until I feel ready to pull them out again.
I made some modifications changed it around all I need was the track, how to wire it, and how to make a mountainous/ riverside looking terrain. Instead of further wasting my time and money on this layout, I'll wait until I have the space and money to re pursue this goal again.
I'm not going to bother with it anymore I made simple guidelines I was trying to stay between, but it seemed that it wasn't going to happen and I knew better too.
BrianinBuffalo Gary; Please don't give up. You are learning a lot. It looks like you are having a lot of fun too. Brian
Gary;
Please don't give up. You are learning a lot. It looks like you are having a lot of fun too.
Brian
alco_fan It is easy to become discouraged when you want a lot in a small space and it does not all fit. It has seemed like you imagined more than could fit in 4X6 So look at it the other way and start with what does fit. Some layout is always better than nothing.
Burlington Northern #24I'm trying to build up the steam to go back there and give another shot but your comment the other day coupled with outside pressures hit a fuse. I don't mind constructive criticism but it doesn't help when the criticism is neither constructive nor comes from a person who has not shown their work. I'm not being disrespectful or rude when I say that, but I don't believe it's fair to have my work judged by those who refuse to show theirs.
If you are blaming me, you are blaming the wrong guy. I never criticized your work, I only noted that you had not yet wired multiple cab DC and therefore were not in a good position to comment on DCC versus multiple cab DC. My exact words from that thread:
alco_fan If you want to stay DC, do that by all means. I have said that multiple times. Read my posts. But until you personally wire a layout with _multiple cab_ DC with _independent control_ of the trains _anywhere_ on the layout, you do not know what is involved, trust me. So you do not have the experience to make the assertion that DC and DCC are "the same".
If you want to stay DC, do that by all means. I have said that multiple times. Read my posts.
But until you personally wire a layout with _multiple cab_ DC with _independent control_ of the trains _anywhere_ on the layout, you do not know what is involved, trust me. So you do not have the experience to make the assertion that DC and DCC are "the same".
Then I said:
alco_fan You missed my point. I applaud your start. We all started there (except maybe Sheldon). It is better than sitting on the sidelines. All I said was that it has not, so far, given you the background to make a definitive comment about wiring multiple cab DC. Keep going!
You missed my point. I applaud your start. We all started there (except maybe Sheldon). It is better than sitting on the sidelines.
All I said was that it has not, so far, given you the background to make a definitive comment about wiring multiple cab DC.
Keep going!
Then I spent a considerable amount of time trying to help you understand multiple cab DC wiring with Atlas components, which _you_ indicated that you were not able to grasp from Atlas book. I also note that I am the _only_ person on that thread to try to help you with _DC_.
So let me recap
- I do not have any opinion at all about your work good or bad except to say (again!!!) that it is great that you have started.
- I do not think you need to go DCC if you do not want to. But I do think it is important that you understand multiple engines running with DC better so that you can achieve what you want on your layout with DC or DCC.
- I tried to help you understand multiple cab DC wiring better
- I will say (again!!!) Keep going!
- I hope you do not give up. If you do, it is not accurate to blame anyone else for it.
- Keep going!
Good luck.
ok, well it will have to sit for a little bit more. this atlas track shortage is killing me. out of curiosity which scale are you in?
the post I was referencing was when AC asked you what you personally knew of my wiring. your response to that was what hit it. No I'm not mad at you I was just a bit frustrated I'll admit my first layout wasn't the best but I only had one powerpack at that time. My apologies if it seems that this came of as an aggressive pursuit or hostile action. I didn't mean for it to be like that.
As for what I want(or wanted) I was to be honest not entirely sure.
Burlington Northern #24out of curiosity which scale are you in?
N scale back when the quality was not nearly as good as today (pre 1991). HO since then. I have some buddies doing N scale now and if it ran like it does now back in the day I would still be in N today. But I have gone too far down the HO road now
I hear from them that Atlas 55 will be arriving soon. Keep going!
alco_fan Burlington Northern #24out of curiosity which scale are you in? N scale back when the quality was not nearly as good as today (pre 1991). HO since then. I have some buddies doing N scale now and if it ran like it does now back in the day I would still be in N today. But I have gone too far down the HO road now I hear from them that Atlas 55 will be arriving soon. Keep going!
Burlington Northern #24 I don't really want to give up on it, but with outside pressures, track shortage, the instantaneous barrage of DCC info, and various other problem. It would seem that there's no point.
I don't really want to give up on it, but with outside pressures, track shortage, the instantaneous barrage of DCC info, and various other problem. It would seem that there's no point.
Modeling the Pennsy and loving it!
out of curiousity how many N scale locos could one DCC system power without booster(s) and with booster(s)? If multi cab wiring is as bad as Alco says then it would be easier and more time saving to switch to DCC but it will cost more.
I know 3-4 of my locos will need to be milled out in order to have DCC installs, I know my AC4400CW, SD70MAC, upcoming F3AB set, and some other locomotives are DCC ready? a couple of them I'd like sound in my BNSF locos atleast because I plan on getting more of them.
That's great!!! Is it 6 locos at one time with the rest shut off? I was going to try and realistically represent the SP&S on the layout so the number of locomotives on layout wasn't going to be overwhelming but just enough to show the presence. I was going to have 2 RS1's #50 and 51(needs to be bought and painted), SP&S #802 & 804(both need to be purchased and painted), #750(E7A that I will buy myself for my upcoming birthday), all three SP&S GP9's(T.T. equipped must be bought painted), an NW2(must be bought and painted), and an S2 or S4(must be bought and painted). this was part of my reason for being reluctant to switch to DCC because I have lots of locomotives that will need to be bought painted and decaled. Why? because the manufacturers don't love me and won't produce any SP&S stuff .
Come on Sharks Get us A STANLEY!
BrianinBuffalo Gary; I have enough power to run them all at once if I want. Running all six at once would be near impossible on my Scenic Ridge layout as their is really only one main line with a passing siding. I can easily run 2 trains with 3 locos in a consist no problem. BLM has the NCE Powercab for $139.00 when and if you interested. That is the best price I have seen anywhere. Cheers, Brian Go Sharks, Go Sens!
I have enough power to run them all at once if I want. Running all six at once would be near impossible on my Scenic Ridge layout as their is really only one main line with a passing siding. I can easily run 2 trains with 3 locos in a consist no problem.
BLM has the NCE Powercab for $139.00 when and if you interested. That is the best price I have seen anywhere.
Cheers,
Go Sharks, Go Sens!
ehhhh, I'm having second thoughts about switching to DCC. I think my layout will be built for single train operation with the ability to support switching in the yard, and alternating trains on the main. 2 people minimum, 3 people max. but It'll probably just be me running alone 95% of the time so It'll be fine.
BrianinBuffalo Gary; Sounds good to me. I would have no idea how to do straight DC (other than one loop of track) so I am of little help when it comes to that. I think Broadway Lion is a master at DC. He would be a good one to get direction from. He has many good ideas on how to do things cheaply that look great. Brian
Sounds good to me. I would have no idea how to do straight DC (other than one loop of track) so I am of little help when it comes to that.
I think Broadway Lion is a master at DC. He would be a good one to get direction from. He has many good ideas on how to do things cheaply that look great.
BrianinBuffaloI think Broadway Lion is a master at DC.
His trains cannot run backwards and cannot change speeds relative to one another. That does not seem the best choice for a general purpose layout, although it is fine for the monks very specific needs.
There are many more flexible ways to wire for DC, as described in the books Gary has already.
it's still one heck of a layout though, he can pull off the job of a train dispatcher with such ease. It's an amazing wonder that deserves to grace the pages of Model railroader in my opinion.
Burlington Northern #24I know 3-4 of my locos will need to be milled out in order to have DCC installs, I know my AC4400CW, SD70MAC, upcoming F3AB set, and some other locomotives are DCC ready? a couple of them I'd like sound in my BNSF locos atleast because I plan on getting more of them.
Milled out to have DCC, or milled out to have DCC w/sound?
I don't know much but from what I've seen it looks like the milling is to make room for speakers.
Schuylkill and SusquehannaNCE makes its own line of decoders, but I don't know if they make any "drop in" decoders for N scale.
Yes, they do.
In fact, their decoders for Atlas locos are dropped in at the factory.
kevinrr Burlington Northern #24I know 3-4 of my locos will need to be milled out in order to have DCC installs, I know my AC4400CW, SD70MAC, upcoming F3AB set, and some other locomotives are DCC ready? a couple of them I'd like sound in my BNSF locos atleast because I plan on getting more of them. Milled out to have DCC, or milled out to have DCC w/sound? I don't know much but from what I've seen it looks like the milling is to make room for speakers.
modified the track plan again, winging it at the moment the top most track is going somewhere and will have a switch for locos to reverse onto the turntable, I will try to place a coach shed or diesel shed somewhere(it could also go onto the pasco side) there might be a stub end yard on this side.
There may be a left hand turnout facing the opposite direction placed at the end of the right hand turnout not sure yet.
Working on the Vancouver side right now, A yard is not looking to be a plausible option so I'll try some industries or a town scene.
I'm watching this with interest!
Modelling HO Scale with a focus on the West and Midwest USA