well i have finished laying the cork and track all feeders are dropped and waiting to be wire for power. that will get done probably tomorrow. but for now here is some of the work i done since monday night. hope you like it. all it is is an addition to the 16ft yard i already have and i added another 8 ft section to make the yard 24ft long with 17 tracks for staging, run throughs and an intermodal yard.
this is some of the locomotives and some of the rolling stock i have it's a total of 40 locomotives in the picture with about 160 some odd pieces of rolling stock on the yard before i added the extra 8 ft.
well i have decided one wich of the 2 benchwork plans i want and it will be the second picture of the 2 i said i couldn't decide on which i would do in my last post. it gives me more peninsulas and i think i can get all of what i want on the this plan. i have been working on the middle 8ft of the yard the pass couple of days and i'm almost finished with it. i have to cut like maybe 8 more pieces of track, drop the feeders and i will be done. will try to post pictures when done later on tonight. back to work on the layout and happy railroading.
Well i have had a little time to design a layout as work has been keeping me busy, but a little has come and i'm gone try and do a little work on designing the benck work. I took some pictures of what I came up with, and would like your opinions on what you think about each possible benchwork plan. I know I showed some pictures of some possible plans but I'm still stuck on what to do. So here are some pictures of what i have thought of. Each of the squares equal 1ft and the room is 34' x 14' .
i have a ?. how many tracks can go under the walther's mi jack tl-1000 intermodal crane and still have space to leave a trailer beside the track. im hoping 2 tracks and a road as i got 4 of these for the layout.
I just got back from the pain specialist's office. He thinks that the pain in my right groin is on the lining of my gut,( not a hernia), so I just keep taking the nerve pain killer called Lyrica, three times per day,(at $78/month). Without the Lyrica, it is excrutiating. (sp?) So much for my aches and pains.
Anxious to see a drawinjg of your proposed layout. I will have the last possible structure on my layout, when the Ashland Iron and Steel complex is completed. Unlike the prototype structures, one can switch structures once in awhile. It keeps the model railroad interesting! This Blast Furnace complex, is really a challenge to construct,(mainly because you have to constantly have to "search and search" for the sets of parts of a given number, since they may be on three different molded sheets, among 15 sheets. The instructions are a little missleading, at times. A lot of the detailed parts are inclosed in buildings without windows.Why bother with the detail ????? Bob
HHPATH56 Hi Reggie, If you go for one peninsula, do you plan to have a "backdrop" run don the center? Of course, this would hide the view of the entire "Empire". I typed in "CTT Coffee Pot Ann Arbor", on the internet, they said it was a place to chat about model railroading, and when I went for "Map" they showed the location of the six coffee places in Ann Arbor, besides ads for gourmet coffee. Then when I clicked again, I got our Trains.com Forums. Is the Coffee Post just an Internet site something like Elliot's Diner ? Anxious to see what you have "imagineered" for your proposed layout. Do you have a "scanner" ? They make better images than photos of drawings. I spent the day yesterday getting started on the Blast Furnace model. It's footprint is 17.5" x 27" and has a height of 22 in". Besides this, there will be 2 Hulett unloaders (unloading iron orre from a 18 bin ore carrier in the harbor. (These are back ordered, with a promised July delivery date.) There will also be a Coke and Gass complex and coal and pile storage area, and a Rolling Mill next to the Blast Furnace. These will be on the central peninsula of my layout, besides the 7 track pass-througjh yard, skate and ski resort and mine mountain, and round house. Whew! Bob
Hi Reggie,
If you go for one peninsula, do you plan to have a "backdrop" run don the center? Of course, this would hide the view of the entire "Empire". I typed in "CTT Coffee Pot Ann Arbor", on the internet, they said it was a place to chat about model railroading, and when I went for "Map" they showed the location of the six coffee places in Ann Arbor, besides ads for gourmet coffee. Then when I clicked again, I got our Trains.com Forums. Is the Coffee Post just an Internet site something like Elliot's Diner ? Anxious to see what you have "imagineered" for your proposed layout. Do you have a "scanner" ? They make better images than photos of drawings. I spent the day yesterday getting started on the Blast Furnace model. It's footprint is 17.5" x 27" and has a height of 22 in". Besides this, there will be 2 Hulett unloaders (unloading iron orre from a 18 bin ore carrier in the harbor. (These are back ordered, with a promised July delivery date.) There will also be a Coke and Gass complex and coal and pile storage area, and a Rolling Mill next to the Blast Furnace. These will be on the central peninsula of my layout, besides the 7 track pass-througjh yard, skate and ski resort and mine mountain, and round house. Whew! Bob
yes i do plan to put a backdrop up and i have it drawn on the sketch. oh i never new it was a real coffeeshop i always thought it was just a place to talk about trains and what you do in your everyday life on the internet. if it is it's a new one to me. correct me if im wrong. yeah in gone take it to kinko or the fedex store and try to get them to scan it for me. then i post what i have now. i have the huge yard roundhouse, engine service area, caboose, rip, a/d, and engine staging area drawn. airport, intermodal, and passenger station placement is decided. im going to make mainline 3 going up to a 2" rise for 8 straight feet along the inside of the peninsula. once it gets to the top of the rise it will go straight for another foot then gradually getting wider as it gets to the end of the peninsula for the widest possible radius it can get inside of mainline 2. then doing the same as i come around the back side of the peninsula. if you can visualize what im saying all of the area inside line 3 will be up 2" higher then the rest of the layout and i thinking will be the only level that's really not going to be on the the tabletop. plus i really like the way the cork looks on top of the plywood. on that level the passenger station is on the back side of the peninsula with 3 sidings with walkways plus over head walkway, and passenger station. the intermodal is going to be on that back wall somwhere in the middle of the wall on mainline 2. i have the airport on the far 13' wall across from the end of the peninsula. the runway is actually going to span almost that whole wall. now all i have to do is find a place for a coal plant, grain plant, gas plant, catipillar tractor facilty, car lot, neighborhood, and a autorack plant. i have enough room i think for all this, but dont know where to put it and not make it look so crowded. if you think this is to much let me know and i try and see what i really dont want it on there. you know i really want it on there but something will have to get left off. if it needs to. what you think.
HHPATH56 Hi Reggie, Kalmbach was doing some maintenance work this morning, when I tried to Reply. Pcarrell's latest idea of the double crossover, sounds great. You might make it a Pass-over, and make use of your Kato truss bridges. Are you inj Ann Arbor, or there abouts. I'm just "up the road apiece", just North of Hamburg . Drop in some time. Kurt Polak invited you to drop in at the CTT Coffee Pot, in Ann Arbor Where is it located ? Bob
Kalmbach was doing some maintenance work this morning, when I tried to Reply. Pcarrell's latest idea of the double crossover, sounds great. You might make it a Pass-over, and make use of your Kato truss bridges. Are you inj Ann Arbor, or there abouts. I'm just "up the road apiece", just North of Hamburg
. Drop in some time. Kurt Polak invited you to drop in at the CTT Coffee Pot, in Ann Arbor Where is it located ? Bob
i have figured out where my elevations going to be and i think i have come up with another track plan and i like it even more. its a variation off of the one pcarrell drew up but it only has one peninsula in the center of the room. the peninsula is coming of of the wall down by the door and it will be 3.5 feet wide by 27 feet long. the ctt is another forum on this site. i stopped by and said my hellos as i was once an o scaler myself.
You know, you could always offset the peninsulas some. That would give you more people room in the corners without sacrificing any isle space. The peninsulas would be slightly shorter though, but it might be worth the sacrifice. It might look something like this:
You could even criss-cross the loops to ease the curves, but a train gets a little tougher to follow. It could be a possibility though.
Food for thought........
HHPATH56 Hi Reggie, Personally, I don't see the purpose of using the insulation. My tracks are laid on cork roadbed directly to the plywood, for most of my layout. The tracks may rise on ramps, (in order to have cross-overs), but in general the roadbed is flat. I cut the plywood out for rivers, gravel pits and lakes,(and screw on old drawers to support them). I cover scraps of styrofoam with plaster cloth, to form minor undulations of terraine. and build mountains on plywood arcs, with heavy screen wire tacked on, and plastered. What do you think of my previous suggestion of using a modified form of "pcarrel's" suggested backward S shaped layout. Bob
Personally, I don't see the purpose of using the insulation. My tracks are laid on cork roadbed directly to the plywood, for most of my layout. The tracks may rise on ramps, (in order to have cross-overs), but in general the roadbed is flat. I cut the plywood out for rivers, gravel pits and lakes,(and screw on old drawers to support them). I cover scraps of styrofoam with plaster cloth, to form minor undulations of terraine. and build mountains on plywood arcs, with heavy screen wire tacked on, and plastered. What do you think of my previous suggestion of using a modified form of "pcarrel's" suggested backward S shaped layout. Bob
oh yes im drawing one up now. i really think im going to switch to this it really gives the long runs as compared to what i had and still give the broad curves. i like it alot i really dont want to use alot of insulation i figure just one layer all the way around in the places i would need it to make the transition to that level
Note my changing AVATAR ! I am about to write instructions, on how to Post photos and the personal AVATAR. Many of the modelers would Post these, if they knew how.
HHPATH56 Hi Reggie The more I look at "pcarrel's" suggested layout, the more I can see that a modification of it will be just what you want. Suppose that you use the center 24ft. of the 34 ft wall.(leading to the door),for your long yard. This will leave 5 ft. for the entry and lift out track section on one end ,and 5 ft.at the bottom left for extension of a the drill tracks and 3 mainlines. The "rip" (Repair In Place) tracks are for minor loco, or freight car repair. The A/D (Arrival and Departure) tracks should lead directly to your mainlines, so that they do not interfere with tracks used for staging,switching, and the maintenance tracks, eg.(washers, water,coal etc.) The maintenance structures are quite small, (compared to the 27"x17.5" Blast Furnace footprint, that I an about to construct). All these structures can be next to each other on one side of the maintenance track.. As I see it, the shape of the layout would be sort of a "backward stylized capital S", with the ends of each curve and the ends of the S enlarged more than is shown on "pcarrel's" diagram. This would give you a straight top and bottom on the 34 ft. sides, and provide for the long sweeping curves for your long trains. There would be plenty of room for industrial sidings and run arounds. The top of the layout would be made of 5/8" plywood, with undulating curves, (to conform to the S), and shaped to overlap the benchwork, which could still be basically small rectangular braced modules made of 1"x3" (or 2"x4"s) bolted together,(or bolted to odd shaped wooden frames), so that it could be dismantled into small braced topless tables. Do you plan to use 2" insulation board, above the plywood ? What are your thoughts on this suggestion? Bob Hahn
Hi Reggie
The more I look at "pcarrel's" suggested layout, the more I can see that a modification of it will be just what you want. Suppose that you use the center 24ft. of the 34 ft wall.(leading to the door),for your long yard. This will leave 5 ft. for the entry and lift out track section on one end ,and 5 ft.at the bottom left for extension of a the drill tracks and 3 mainlines. The "rip" (Repair In Place) tracks are for minor loco, or freight car repair. The A/D (Arrival and Departure) tracks should lead directly to your mainlines, so that they do not interfere with tracks used for staging,switching, and the maintenance tracks, eg.(washers, water,coal etc.) The maintenance structures are quite small, (compared to the 27"x17.5" Blast Furnace footprint, that I an about to construct). All these structures can be next to each other on one side of the maintenance track..
As I see it, the shape of the layout would be sort of a "backward stylized capital S", with the ends of each curve and the ends of the S enlarged more than is shown on "pcarrel's" diagram. This would give you a straight top and bottom on the 34 ft. sides, and provide for the long sweeping curves for your long trains. There would be plenty of room for industrial sidings and run arounds. The top of the layout would be made of 5/8" plywood, with undulating curves, (to conform to the S), and shaped to overlap the benchwork, which could still be basically small rectangular braced modules made of 1"x3" (or 2"x4"s) bolted together,(or bolted to odd shaped wooden frames), so that it could be dismantled into small braced topless tables. Do you plan to use 2" insulation board, above the plywood ? What are your thoughts on this suggestion? Bob Hahn
yes i do plan on using 2" insulation on top but one of te mains will be on the tabletop that way i will have to use less insulation as price per sheet is 30 to 35 a sheet.
pcarrell Seems to me that there are probably better uses of the space as well. Here's one possibility that jumps out at me. Of course, this is just a rough sketch. You'd want to plan it out better then this, but I think it would work and give you a long run with some nice scenic possibilities, as well as have decent isles. You could add some big, broad scenic curves here and there, say in the 100"r range, throw in a town or two and not be able to see any other towns from there.....it could be nice. Click to enlarge I'm sure there's other uses of the space that would be good too, maybe better. BTW, sweet yard!
Seems to me that there are probably better uses of the space as well. Here's one possibility that jumps out at me. Of course, this is just a rough sketch. You'd want to plan it out better then this, but I think it would work and give you a long run with some nice scenic possibilities, as well as have decent isles. You could add some big, broad scenic curves here and there, say in the 100"r range, throw in a town or two and not be able to see any other towns from there.....it could be nice.
Click to enlarge
I'm sure there's other uses of the space that would be good too, maybe better.
BTW, sweet yard!
i went back and looked at this plan you gave and im really liking it. i see some things i can do with this im going to draw one out with this and see what i get.
The 3x8 one. You could then space the other peninsulas 4 feet apart, which will lend towards those sweeping curves you want. Kinda "less is more" thinking.
Wow !
Johnny's Toy Shop, talk about kindling some memories. I remember when they first opened up, not in the building they are in now but a relatively small shop down by Ritte's Corner. Used to spend some $'s there on the model car kits, glue and paint, bought a few ship models as well but they never seemed to survive the firecracker and cherrybomb attacks by some unseen enemy forces.
Reggie, Thanks for the trip down memory lane.
Remember the Veterans. Past, present and future.
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fifedog:
yes i think im going to go with 3ft aisle to keep it comfortable. yes i am freelancing i will see something and just want to put it on the layout. so i really dont want to model anything as i am really spontanious and will just go with the flow if all fails. being that im going to have these running sessions i thought about letting a couple of the guys if they wanted model something on my layout and i will provide all the material and allow them running time on the layout whenever they want as long as im home.
if i eliminated a penisula which one should i remove the smaller 3x8 or one of the bigger 4x8's.
bob:
thanks for the input you had i will try and comment back to you everything you told me and how i think about it. i like the thought of just 2 mains but dont you think it would be better to have 3 that way more fun as we all say can be had and done. i dont want to get it up with 2 and say later i wish, should, could have done that and then will be to far along to go back and change it without to much difficulty. i also think with 3 mains you can have all the passing sidings you would have with just 2. which would make for more fun.
yes i like massive yards and yes what i have built and are building now has to be incorporated in the layout somewhere and somehow. also the yard i have is nowhere near complete as i was trying to just get it up and ready for the show that it was in. being that the yard is 24 feet long and the wall it will be on is 34ft that leaves 10 ft to have switches that lead off of one of the leads at both ends of the yard to have all the things a yard should have. like engine facilty, sand facility, water towers, rip tracks a/d tracks as i dont know what either are, roundhouse and table, engine wash places and all of the other things that a major yard normally has. remember im not modeling any particular railroad or region but this is more of a freelanced layout. i like taking ideas from magazines, and layouts i have seen/toured an try to incorporate it in what i have. also let me say im a guy who really likes running trains more than the scenery itself. my first goal is to get the trains up and running with all the track in place if that can be done so to say.
yes the layout will be massive but like you said much has to be considered and thats what im trying to do before i nail screw or even really think about building the bench work except the yard i have built already. i built a huge o scale layout in a house im renting out and man i really learned alot from that layout and said i will not make the misstakes i did on that one on this one. example build with lighter wood and in smaller sections to make it that much easier to take down or dismantle if i had to. also the last layout was an island one with a couple access places. didnt really like it once i gotit up but said what the heck im no about to go back and redo this again so it stayed the way it was. i will do massive research and get as much help as i can before i go any further. thats way im asking for aal the help i can get before i proceed any further.
yes my operational thoughts are as follows i want all aisle's to be 3ft wide 30"at the minimum. thought of the long broad curves are the things i want and i thought i would beable to get that with a peninsula that is 4ft wide and will bare a radius of 23 to 18 inches and have a reach no farther thn 2ft if i had to reach over the layout for anything if i had to. i want/plan to have sessions with the group im in and whoever else want s to come and enjoy as long as i get advanced notice of you coming. i will be running dcc mostly and possibly have a toggle switch to relay from dcc to dc if you get what im saying. my dcc system of choice is NCE
? for you what type of benckwork are you suggesting as i said earlier i would love to keep the yard i have in this benchwork but would consider redoing my yard another way if its going to give me more fun and thats what i what lots and lots of fun. yes please if you do consider it for a 3 track main. i want that and will pick the 3 main over the yard.
thanks for the input and im not being critical of anything you said i have the certians i want and will be invitng of all thoughts you have and i know i will incorporate a few of them in this process of building my layout.
again thanks in advance for your help
Reggie - In reference to ailse width, again it'll be predicated on whether you will be hosting operating sessions/open houses, or just you and maybe 2 others. 3' will be comfortable, for the most part, if your operators are follwing their trains. 2' will create "choke" points. Also the standard door width is approx 30"...could you stand to keep squeezing past other operators in that space...? I think if you eliminate just one peninsula, your room will be more comfortable.
Are you frelancing your pike, or are you trying to capture a specific region/railroad?
Reggie,
Nice area for a layout. That's even huge for HO let alone "N".
I also agree that the space could be better utilized w/ a different approach. Those yard pics are really impressive and you seem real covinced to want to incorporate a massive yard yourself. The yard shown is great for a what it is, an enormous staging facility for that show layout.
You should keep the mainline to double track, additional through tracks, passing sidings, and interchange can always be implimented within the design if desired.
You have quite the space to build a better operating yard to use a more prototype configuration.
I would suggest a freight yard, classification, passenger yard, coach yard, commuter tracks, RPO and the all important yard, drill tracks and leads. Pending the era the yard can be built to use the appropriate engine faciliy.
You are on a mission to build quite a large layout, much should be considered as to the overall operating potential of such a space.
The yard you describe will "stage" many trains only to run them around the room antil such time that they return to the yard. The potential for running extremely long train exists, however, The plan w/ all those small/ short peninsulas somewhat defeats a great view and operating potential. Longer mainline runs sweeping along much longer peninsulas through the finished sceniced layout would be quite impressive.
I don't know just how much thought has been placed on the operational possibilities for such a layout, But this needs to be considered at this time. The space can utilize a couple of divisions w/ various interchange yards, industrial yards and switching etc.
I sense your excitment about the plans for such a layout, but so much more though is needed at this time. I would hate to see such a layout become a shoulda woulda, boring ops, that will be reworked and reconfigured in time.
Modeling B&O- Chessie Bob K. www.ssmrc.org
fifedog Hey Reggie. Good to see family is well, and that little one - WOW! That is an awesome yard you constructed. How many cars will it hold? As to your dream layout, if you intend to have folks over for operating sessions, you're gonna need 3 foot aisles...trust me. I would read up on everything about David Barrow and his Cat Mountain and Santa Fe. He really nailed the linear layout design, and I think I lot of his techniques would work for you.
Hey Reggie. Good to see family is well, and that little one - WOW!
That is an awesome yard you constructed. How many cars will it hold?
As to your dream layout, if you intend to have folks over for operating sessions, you're gonna need 3 foot aisles...trust me.
I would read up on everything about David Barrow and his Cat Mountain and Santa Fe. He really nailed the linear layout design, and I think I lot of his techniques would work for you.
yeah she's growing up fast and right before my eyes. thanks for the compliment on the yard and i really dont know how many it hold as it will be 24ft long, but i think i have enough rolling stock to fill it up from one end to the other, and i have right at a thousand pieces. the yard has 17 tracks and can add 2 more to make it 19 if i plan to move the part i have for intermodal yard to the peninsula. the yard is the main feature i want on the layout and im going to have another one on there somewhere. just havent figured out whether or not it;s going to be on the 13ft wall at the opposite end of the romm from the door or on one of the penisulas. i think im going to put either my passenger station or move my intermodal yard from the yard and put either of them on that 3' x 8' penisula. i hear what you are saying about the aisles but being the size of the room is narrow do you think i will have problems with the aisle being 30" wide in front of the yard or should i take off half a foot on all the peninsulas and give that extra 6" to the walkway in front of the yard and that will make all aisles 3ft wide.
That's a cute little "big helper" you have there!
If you are mostly interested in running long trains, it seems that the opposed loop layout suggested in the sketch by "pcarrell", would be a better set up for you. You could put the long yard on the side of the room by the door, and have a smaller yard, as he shows. My first thought is that you are trying to replicate a huge "Club layout yard", on a personal layout. Those short rectangular peninsulas won't possibly accommodate your long trains, and a single mainline gets awfully dull, very soon! My personal multi-switching reverse loop layout may not fit with your desires, but it lends itself to challenging model railroading. With an HO setup, I built my 24'x24' around the room layout in small preplanned sections, so that it not become "tedious".
I find that scanning a pencil drawing is better than trying to take a picture of it, to download on your computer. You mentioned that you have a bunch of Kato truss bridges. The following photo shows one way to make use of several truss bridges, other than for crossing a river. There are a total of 6 truss bridges forming the ramp. Click on the photo to enlarge it Do you and Kurt Polak live in the Ann Arbor, Michigan area? I live in the house with a white picket fence, at 9841 Hamburg Rd, (about 3 blocks North of M 36). Drop in some time! Give me a call Ph: 810-231-2171 I would like to hire someone knowledgeable with DCC wiring, (with reverse loops and wyes), to help with the wiring of my Digitrax Super Chief layout with many reverse loops. Anyone, available? Give me a call. Bob Hahn
Click on the photo to enlarge it, Then click successively on the left picture (which shows a track diagram that I just suggested to one model railroader). With each click, you can get an enlarged series of pictures of my layout. (with some duplications)
Great Stuff! Looks like your family is doing well! Glad you're still into the trains.
Stop by and say hi at the CTT Coffee Pot!
Kurt
HHPATH56 Great photos! Is that you in the first photo? Do you plan to take sectons of your layout to your club, or to shows ? Must the rail design placement and height of the rails match your assigned place in the club or show layout? Do you plan to use reverse loops, cross-overs and wyes on your layout. These are intended for DCC use, but with special wiring can be addapted to DC. You say that you want to use your layout as both DCC and as a DC layout. Are your locos able to run on both DCC and DC ? Are you mostly interested in running long trains around the mainline ? Or, do you plan to shunt freight onto the peninsula sidings. With over 100 turnouts, mine is basically a switching layout, with detailed scenery and structures as my prime interest. My (complex), possible routing of many trains on reverse loops, cross-overs and wyes allows for some 18 possible routes for a given loco to go around part, of all of the layout,and to reverse direction at many locations. What are your desires and specifications? Do you plan to have pass-overs and ravines with rivers and lakes, or harbors, mountain tunnel, hidden rails, etc ? Bob Hahn
Great photos! Is that you in the first photo? Do you plan to take sectons of your layout to your club, or to shows ? Must the rail design placement and height of the rails match your assigned place in the club or show layout? Do you plan to use reverse loops, cross-overs and wyes on your layout. These are intended for DCC use, but with special wiring can be addapted to DC. You say that you want to use your layout as both DCC and as a DC layout. Are your locos able to run on both DCC and DC ? Are you mostly interested in running long trains around the mainline ? Or, do you plan to shunt freight onto the peninsula sidings. With over 100 turnouts, mine is basically a switching layout, with detailed scenery and structures as my prime interest. My (complex), possible routing of many trains on reverse loops, cross-overs and wyes allows for some 18 possible routes for a given loco to go around part, of all of the layout,and to reverse direction at many locations. What are your desires and specifications? Do you plan to have pass-overs and ravines with rivers and lakes, or harbors, mountain tunnel, hidden rails, etc ? Bob Hahn
no this is me with my beautiful wife thats allowing me the room and my other little princess
and here she is helping me build the yard man she's a great helper
steemtrayn Caps key stuck?
Caps key stuck?
why do you ask that. no its not just how i like typing. if i were applying for job i would do as needed to my typing