"OUR" PLACE - SEE NEW THREAD!

[wanswheel]

Another round for the house

Al, a couple pics of Canadian Pacific
With "clerestery" at Ottertail, BC
http://www.railroadpix.com/images/specials/rcp/E7932-44.jpg

And former CB&Q Silver Solarium
http://www.trainweb.org/DOMEmain/picCBQ377R.jpg

Who can't get enough of those Zephyrs?

Approaching Denver
http://trainweb.org/DOMEmain/picCBQ235e.jpg
Silver something, maybe "Chateau"
http://www.trainweb.org/DOMEmain/picCBQ235f.jpg

Here's a pic of Dave's UP 7002
http://www.colong.com/photos/X-1.jpg

Doug, thanks for reading my dad's writing. It took me about two hours to transcribe it. I have to look at the keyboard and locate each key before I tap it with my right index finger, which is one reason to keep posts brief, or resort to rampant URLs.

Ted when you get your bearings, have a look at this little kid in Baltimore learning to love steam locomotives.
http://www.cvrma.org/pictures/MISC/dfrr4143_steam_memories_western_maryland_rwy_baltimore_1952.jpg

Pete, Thanks for looking after us, your summary sums suberbly

[Anonymous]

Hi again everyone! Ok, I'm drinkin' ....who's buyin'?

I'll tell ya, we're not doing bad at all for a Saturday, let alone a Saturday that has so many missing patrons! Great CPR stuff Al, and the same goes for your contribution Dave! Now let's drink to us ... and cabooses!

Caboose History -- Rail Classics Magazine Sept.1988

“Caboose,” a strange word for a strange railroad car that somehow survived more that a hundred years from the days of oil-burning lamps to the computer age. Origins of the car and the word are surrounded by as much legend as fact. One popular version dates the word back to the description of a ship’s galley derived from the Dutch word “kabuis.”

The use of cabooses started in the 1830s when railroads housed trainmen in boxcars or flatcars with shanties built on them. (new photo from IRM)


The addition of the cupola – a lookout post atop the car – is attributed to a conductor who discovered in 1863 that he could see his train much better if he sat atop boxes and watched through the hole in the roof of his boxcar. Cabooses served several functions. It was an office for the conductor. A “waybill” followed every car from origin to destination. The conductor kept the paperwork in the caboose.

The car also carried a brakeman and a flagman. In the days when trains did not have automatic air brakes, the engineer signaled the caboose with his whistle when he wanted to slow down or stop. The brakeman would climb out of the caboose and make his was forward on top of the cars, twisting the brake-wheels by using a stout club. A brakeman riding the engine would work his way toward the rear.

Once the train was stopped, the flagman would get off the caboose and walk back a safe distance with lanterns, flags and other warning devices to stop any approaching trains. Underway, the trainmen would sit up in the cupola and watch from smoke from overheated wheel journals, called hot-boxes, or other signs of trouble.

It was common for railroads to assign a caboose to a conductor for his exclusive use. Conductors took great pride in their cars – despite derogatory nick-names, including “crummy, doghouse, bone-breaker, snake wagon and hearse.” Conductors would decorate the interior of their cars with many touches of home, including curtains, family photos and, most importantly, ingredients for cooking meals that became a part of American folklore.

The car served as a “home away from home” for crewmen who slept in the car on trips away from their home terminals. Cabooses became a uniquely American tradition. Overseas, their use was rare or eliminated many years ago. Even in the United States, technological change began eliminating the need for cabooses before the turn of the century. The spread in the 1880s of the automatic air brake system invented by George Westinghouse eliminated the need for brakemen to manually set brakes. Air brakes were soon followed by the use of electric track circuits to activate signals, providing protection for trains and eliminating the need for flagmen.

Trains became longer, making it difficult for the conductor to see his train from the caboose. Freight cars became so high they blocked the view from the traditional cupola. Friction bearings were replaced by roller bearings, reducing the overheated journal and making visual detection by smoke unlikely. The heavy fast trains made on-board cooking hazardous and unnecessary. Cabooses were put into “pools| and not assigned to individual conductors. New labor agreements reduced hours of service and eliminated the need for cabooses for sleeping quarters as a result of lodging provided by the company.

Electronic “hotbox” and dragging equipment detectors were installed along main lines, which could check moving trains more efficiently and reliably than men in cabooses. Computers eliminated the conductor’s paperwork. Cabooses became expensive anachronisms.

The first major railroad in the United States to eliminate cabooses was the Florida East Coast Railway. Because of the technological advances and sweeping local labor changes, FEC dropped the cars in 1972. By the fall of 1982 the nation’s other major railroads and the United Transportation Union, which represents the trainmen who ride in cabooses, reached agreement on guidelines to begin eliminating the cars.

Studies by the Interstate Commerce Commission and a Presidential Emergency Board, which was appointed to settle the labor situation, concluded cabooses could be safely eliminated. The board estimated U.S. railroads would save approximately $400 million if cabooses were eliminated.

Union Pacific purchased its last cabooses in 1979 for $63,500 apiece. UP System has a fleet of about 1,500 cabooses. There are nearly 11,000 cabooses in service on all U.S. railroads. Cabooses today cost approximately $80,000. Other railroads which have begun eliminating cabooses include Conrail, Baltimore & Ohio, Norfolk Southern, Illinois Central Gulf, Seaboard System and Santa Fe.

[:I] keep in mind that this article was written almost 20 years ago! [:I]

[West Coast S]

I too commend PWolf's efforts and those here this Saturday. Ok for my encore presentation:

Union Pacific had it's Mountain type 7002 that earned the horrific nickname "The Widow Maker" due to having three crews killed in three seperate incidents. UP officials and crew, members were, under normal circumstances, not normally given to pay credence to such superstitions. But the facts would seem to speak for themselfs.

7002 seemed to be the chosen test lab whenever evaluations were needed, at various times, she was retrofitted with various designs of valve gear, appliances and subjected to several smoke box design experiments and also displayed the first example of two-tone grey. UP attributed her availability for such service to always being in the shop for rebuilding due to yet one more occurance.

It begain soon after delivery from Alco in 1922, While at posted track speed with a empty westbound reefer block, a wayward tractor and bailer got hung up on a rural grade crossing in Kansas, the impact derailed the 7002 and several head end cars. the engine landed on it's side after a skid of several hundred feet, those crewman not ejected, were crushed by the roll over.

History repeated itself several years later, 7002 struck a train that had fouled a siding, the derailment produced the same rollover as had occured before with similar results, human error was to blame, the flagman of the fouled train was not at the proper spot and failed to follow standard safety procedures for meets , in addition the the crew had failed to notify the dispatcher that they could not clear the switch, the crew of the caboose were able to jump before it was reduced to splinters, the flagman's body was later recovered from the wreckage.


7002 was later streamlined for the 49er and had light weight rods installed, in this capacity she served accident free.. As diesels assumed control, she migrated to her old haunts in Nebraska and Kansas, along with most of the serviceable steam power,she however could not escape her reputation and she was greeted with contempt by all crews and operating officials and would be assigned a run only when no other power was in the roundhouse.

Her Waterloo occured at the tiny hamlet of Liberty Ks. in 1949, while at the head of the fast mail, running late due to extreme weather and making up time, she split the switch on the house track, plowed several hundered feet upright on the ties and ballast before impacting a wooden planked grade crossing and a second switch, which scissored her and several RPO's off the roadbed and into a nearby grain elevator and the numerous boxcars spotted there for loading.Three Postal employees lost their lives and several more were injured, the resulting boiler explosion reduced the remains of the wooden elevator and depot to ashes while tossing boxcars across the nearby landscape and into nearby homes.

UP salvaged the remains, covered the property loss claims, but this time there would be no rebuilding, she languised as a parts source at the Omaha Shops, once she was no longer usefull for even this, she was in, 1952 sold for scrap thus ending, but not erasing the memory of "The Widow Maker". I'm sure she was not missed by those that had known her.


Dave

[passengerfan]

Good Afternoon Everyone. Time for a CR and a round for the house.

Doug enjoyed the CB&Q Zephyr articles.

Pete great job with the summaries.

Mike Glad my CN Streamlined Coach material touched so close to home for you.

One of these days I will get back to writing but this forum like so many other things is definitely a distraction.

Will give CPR equal time with the CNR while Tom and the rest are enjoying their rendevouz.

CANADIAN
PACIFIC
RAILWAY
Streamlined Coaches
by Al

The Canadian Pacific Railway was Canada’s privately owned transcontinental railroad and as such presented provided one of the finest images in the transportation industry. The Canadian Pacific not only provided the fastest train service from St. John on the Bay of Fundy to Montreal by their shortcut across the state of Maine on the ATLANTIC LIMITED. But they also provided connecting steamship service across the Bay of Fundy from St. John to Digby, Nova Scotia where they connected with the Dominion Atlantic Railway that ran between Yarmouth and Halifax, Nova Scotia. From Montreal or Toronto one could board the Canadian Pacific DOMINION to Vancouver on the west coast after a spectacular trip through the Canadian Rockies. After arrival at the CP station on Vancouver’s waterfront it was a short walk to the CP docks where one could board a CP steamship for the trip to Vancouver Island at Nanaimo or Victoria the provincial capital. At either Vancouver Island port one could connect with the Esquimalt & Nanaimo Railway a wholly owned CP subsidiary that operated trains between Courteney and Victoria. For arriving passengers in Vancouver one could board other CP steam ships for Seattle or Alaska. The Canadian Pacific also provided Trans-Atlantic steamship service via their beautiful trio of postwar EMPRESS liners EMPRESS OF BRITAIN, EMPRESS OF ENGLAND, and EMPRESS OF CANADA from Europe and the British Isles to Montreal in the summer and St. John in the winter. And prior to WW II the Canadian Pacific had provided Trans-Pacific Empress services to Japan, and Hong Kong from Vancouver. After WW II the Canadian Pacific expanded their Airline into a transcontinental Airline and international Airline serving the Orient, Australia, South America and Europe.
In 1936 the Canadian Pacific Railway inaugurated their first streamlined passenger trains the VIGER, WINDSOR, ROYAL YORK and CHINOOK. A streamlined 4-4-4 Jubilee Locomotive with Tender powered each of these four trains. Each consisted of four cars with National Steel Car Company building the Baggage 30’ Railway Post office Car in each train set and Canadian Pacific constructing the Baggage Buffet 28 seat Coach, and two 36 seat Coaches in each consist. The new trains entered service on the same date September 27, 1936 and became an instant success with the traveling public. All trains were soon assigned extra cars to meet the demand of the passengers. The 4-4-4 Jubilee Locomotives were the perfect power for the four car trains and when extra cars were added they could still maintain any of the schedules with up to nine cars. The coaches and Baggage Buffet Coaches had large square windows something that would be found on all CP cars constructed through 1942. The sides were slightly rounded and they were fully streamlined in appearance. The four services the trains were assigned to was the CHINOOK between Calgary and Edmonton, Alberta round trip daily. The WINDSOR round trip daily between Montreal and Quebec City. The VIGER round trip daily between Montreal and Quebec City. The ROYAL YORK round trip daily between Toronto, Ontario and Detroit, Michigan. This latter train the ROYAL YORK was only the second streamlined train to serve Detroit the first being the NYC MERCURY. The Canadian Pacific has credited these four trains with bringing large numbers of passengers back to the rails in post depression Canada.

BAGGAGE BUFFET 28 REVENUE SEAT COACHES WITH FOUR TABLES Canadian Pacific Shops August – September 1936 (Built for and assigned to CHINOOK, ROYAL YORK, VIGER, and WINDSOR)
3050 – 3053

36 REVENUE SEAT COACHES Canadian Pacific Shops August – September, 1936 (Built for and assigned to CHINOOK, ROYAL YORK, VIGER, and WINDSOR)
2100 – 2107

In 1938 the Canadian Pacific shops constructed an additional 21 lightweight streamlined coaches on frames supplied by National Steel Car the same manufacturer who supplied 1936 cars frames. These coaches were 52 revenue seat cars with an 8 seat Men’s Smoking Lounge next to the Men’s room and a 7 seat Ladies Smoking Lounge next to the Ladies room. These cars like the earlier coaches built by Canadian Pacific featured curved sides, large square windows and double vestibules. These 21 cars were assigned to operate in the previous trains with six assigned to Calgary for use in the CHINOOK although they were available for other Calgary – Edmonton trains as well. The same was true for the six assigned to Toronto for service in the ROYAL YORK they were utilized in other trains from Toronto attracting even more passengers back to the rails. The remaining nine cars were assigned to Montreal and were operated in trains to Quebec City and Ottawa.

52 REVENUE SEAT COACHES Canadian Pacific Shops March – May 1938 (Built for and assigned to General Service based in Calgary, Toronto, and Montreal)
2108 – 2128

After seeing the way Canadian National handled their Smoking and Non Smoking seating by having it in separate compartments separated by a partition and door with all seats revenue seats the Canadian Pacific was convinced this was better than there method of separate smoking lounges featuring non revenue seating. The next two lots of streamlined cars for the Canadian Pacific were the wartime cars one being completed in 1941 the other being completed in 1942. Canada being a member of the British Commonwealth had been at war since September 1939 fully two years before the United States would become embroiled in the conflict. The Canadian Pacific was badly in need of additional coaches when the first twenty five of the 72 revenue seat coaches arrived in April 1941 from their own Montreal shops. These new cars featured the same curved windows and large square windows of the earlier lightweight streamlined cars. The new cars only had a single vestibule so were easy to tell from the earlier cars. The cars were divided into a 24 seat smoking compartment and 48 seat non smoking compartment. The new cars were assigned to general service and helped eliminate some of the wartime pressure for space being felt by the CPR. More were needed and the War Ministry permitted the Canadian Pacific to build an additional 25 Coaches for April – May, 1942 delivery. These fifty coaches would be the only passenger carrying cars received by the CPR in WW II, and like most roads the CPR used every car available even those they resurrected from the scrap lines to carry them through this their greatest time of need.

72 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (48 SEAT NON SMOKING 24 SEAT SMOKING) Canadian Pacific Shops April 1941 (Built for and assigned to General Service)
2129 – 2153

72 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (48 SEAT NON SMOKING 24 SEAT SMOKING) Canadian Pacific Shops April – May 1942 (Built for and assigned to General Service)
2154 – 2178

The Canadian Pacific began ordering trucks, air conditioning, bathroom fixtures and air brake parts as early as December 1944 enough for 35 Coaches. The parts would not begin arriving until late 1947 due to wartime shortages of certain materials. Before the first accessories arrived the CP ordered enough for an additional 64 Coaches. The first of the new postwar 68 revenue seat coaches began arriving from CP shops in January 1948 with the final delivery completed in May 1949. These were the first Canadian Pacific cars to feature the elongated windows more generally associated with lightweight streamlined cars. These cars featured 44 seats in the non-smoking compartment and 24 seats in smoking. The Canadian Pacific would standardize on the 24 seat smoking compartment. These cars also featured 4 wheel trucks, a single vestibule and the curved sides that became a trademark of Canadian Pacific built cars.

68 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (44 SEAT NON SMOKING COMPARTMENT 24 SEAT SMOKING COMPARTMENT) Canadian Pacific Shops January, 1948 – May 1949 (Built for and assigned to General Service on long distance trains)
2200 – 2298

Canadian Pacific would place one final order for lightweight streamlined passenger cars this time the cars would come from U.S. manufacturer Budd with Canadian Car & Foundry doing some of the final interior work and Dofasco a Canadian Company building the trucks and shipping them to Budd for installation.
Canadian manufacturers supplied all the seat materials, mattresses, and carpeting. The 172 cars ordered from Budd consisted of 18 Baggage Crew Dormitory Cars, 30 Deluxe 60 revenue seat Leg rest Coaches, 18 Skyline Domes (Revenue Coach seating for 26, Coffee shop seating 26, 24 seat Dome). Their were 18 48 seat Dining Cars, 28 CHATEAU series sleeping cars, 41 MANOR sleeping cars, and 18 PARK series Dome Sleeper Lounge Observations. Besides these cars the Canadian Pacific rebuilt 26 heavyweight 14 Section Tourist Sleeping cars installing corrugated stainless steel panels over the old cars sides to match the new Budd built cars. These cars retained their clerestory roofs, double vestibules and 6 wheel trucks. The cars were painted to match the Budd built cars. These 14 section tourist sleepers were built for operation in the CANADIAN directly behind the Baggage Crew Dormitory car ahead of the 60 seat Deluxe Coach. The new cars were built to equip the new CANADIAN the transcontinental train between Montreal – Toronto and Vancouver. The two sections of the CANADIAN from Montreal and Toronto came together at Sudbury westbound and split at that point eastbound for Montreal and Toronto. The Coach section of the CANADIAN initially departed Montreal with a Baggage Crew Dormitory car, one or two “U” series 14 section Tourist Sleeping cars and the Coach seating was confined to the 26 seats in the Skyline Dome. The Toronto coach section of the CANADIAN consisted of one Baggage Crew Dormitory cars, one or two “U” series 14 section Tourist Sleeping cars, one deluxe 60 seat Coach and Skyline Dome Car. The Baggage Crew Dormitory, Skyline Dome, Dining Car and PARK dome sleeper Observation from Toronto only operated as far as Sudbury where they turned and returned to Toronto on the next eastbound CANADIAN. The Coach section west of Sudbury was made up of the Baggage Crew Dormitory car that originated in Montreal. One or two “U” series 14 section Tourist Sleeping cars that originated in Montreal, the one or two “U” series 14 section Tourist Sleeping cars from Toronto, the 60 revenue seat Deluxe Leg Rest Coach from Toronto, and the Skyline Dome car from Montreal.
The Canadian Pacific operated the ATLANTIC LIMITED with a Baggage Crew Dormitory Car, a 60 revenue seat deluxe leg rest coach, trailed by a Skyline Dome, and one or two Sleeping cars generally a MANOR series and CHATEAU series. The secondary transcontinental train across Canada operated by the Canadian Pacific was the DOMINION. This train operated with a mixture of the newer Budd cars and older cars; in fact several cars in the DOMINION were heavyweights. Eventually the CPR repainted most older cars in Silver with the Maroon letter board above the windows to more closely match the Budd built cars.
The CANADIAN earned the reputation of one of the world’s truly great trains and was definitely Canada’s finest. The Canadian Pacific would purchase Budd RDC’s for all other runs in Canada with only the CANADIAN and ATLANTIC LIMITED operating with streamlined lightweight Budd cars.

14 SECTION TOURIST SLEEPING CARS Pullman Standard 1936 Rebuilt and stainless steel added by Canadian Pacific Shops 1954 (Formerly “P” series sleepers rebuilt and assigned to the CANADIAN)
UDALL

UGANDA

ULLSWATER

ULSTER

ULYSSES

UMBER

UNDERWOOD

UNICORN

UNITY

UNIVERSE

UNWIN

UPLANDS

UPSALA

UPTON

URANUS

URBAN

UREN

URQUHART

USHER

UTICA

UTOPIA

UXBRIDGE

60 REVENUE SEAT DELUXE LEG REST COACHES (36 SEAT NON SMOKING COMPARTMENT 24 SEAT SMOKING COMPARTMENT) Budd Company 1954 (Built for and assigned to CANADIAN – ATLANTIC LIMITED – DOMINION)

100 – 129

SKYLINE 24 SEAT DOME CONDUCTORS SEAT 26 REVENUE SEAT LEG REST COACH KITCHEN 23 SEAT COFFEE SHOP CARS Budd Company 1954 (Built for and assigned to CANADIAN – ATLANTIC LIMITED – DOMINION)

500 – 517

TTFN Al

[Anonymous]

Evening again fellows! I'll help myself to another shot, and set out money for a round. Today was the first time I ever saw my breath while cutting grass! It was raining too. Sheesh!

Quite the busy little bar today in spite of our absences. Al wrote another streamliner, and Mike really outdid himself with his personal experiences, complete with URL links! Terrific reading Mike! Great job on the Summaries Pete, I'm sure it will be appreciated. Good to see super Dave back to dust off his stool too! Here's the 2nd part of the Burlington Zephyr ENCORE:

The Burlington Zephyrs – March 1937 Railroad Stories

The second trailing car of the Denver Zephyrs and the first one of the Twin Zephyrs are fitted up with this cocktail lounge.


The three-car Twin Zephyrs which were inaugurated between Chicago and the Twin Cities on April 21, 1935, are now operating elsewhere. One is known as the Sam Houston Zephyr, and makes a daily round trip of 566 miles between Fort Worth, Dallas and Houston, Texas, at an average speed of 57 miles an hour. The other is the Ozark State Zephyr, running from St. Louis to Kansas City and back, 558 miles, also at an average speed of 57 miles an hour. Both weigh 112 ½ tons, use a 660-horsepower Diesel engine.

To take their place the Burlington operates two new seven-car Twin Zephyrs, each of which makes a daily 882-mile round trip between Chicago and Minneapolis at an average speed of 66.3 miles an hour. Weighing about 330 tons apiece and powered by 1800-horsepower Diesel engines, they have 170 saleable seats. They provide the last word in day train luxury, with coaches that are equal of the parlor cars of yore in comfort and superior in looks, a cocktail lounge, and unbelievably beautiful dining car, and an inter-car telephone system to make diner inter-car phone to reserve diner seats.
The largest, longest and most complete Zephyrs are two twelve-car trains recently put in service between Chicago and Denver. Westbound they cove 1034 miles in 16 hours flat, and eastbound, 1039 miles in 15 hours and 40 minutes. Their two motive power cars contain an 1800 and a 1200-horsepower Diesel unit; and each entire train weighs 628 ½ tons.

These larger Zephyrs, incidentally, will probably show about the same operating costs as a comparable steam train; and because of their high purchase price and maintenance may well be more expensive in the long run. But they travel long distances without stopping for water, and that means greater average speeds.


Hmmm ...... that wasn't long enough ... soooooooo

Hoodoo Engine by E.C. Huffsmith – June 1936 Railroad Stories



Number 107 was scrapped nearly 28 years ago, but even today the old-timers talk about her. They call her the hoodoo, the killer, the deadliest engine on the old Denver & Rio Grande. No more, thank God, does she travel the winding road through Gunnison Canyon, the walls of which echoed time and again with the shriek of her whistle and the clang of her bell. No longer does Death sit at her throttle, as he did, guiding at least a dozen members of her train and engine crews and scores of passengers into Eternity. No longer do rails shudder at the prospect of taking out the hoodoo on a dangerous run.

Even at the start the 107 was ill-fated. The clang of her bell was the tolling of a funeral knell. No. 107 was one of three narrow-gage, anthracite-burning engines that were ordered for the Rio Grande in the late eighties. She was the first put into service on the run between Grand Junction and Gunnison, Colo. G.A. Lathrop, the Gunnison story writer, remembers her. So does his father, Lewis R. Lathrop, who was in D.&R.G. engine service more than half a century.

The first hogger to take her out on an unlucky trip was Bill Duncan. They left Grand Junction at night and were well on the way to Gunnison when an accident occurred. It was pitch dark. They failed to see that part of a bridge had been washed away. Both men perished, together with nobody knows how many passengers.

The engine was salvaged. Some of the enginemen hesitated to take her out again, but this fear was laid to pure superstition, and Engineer Godfrey was not afraid. It was a beautiful starlit evening. Godfrey’s friends said later he had a premonition of impending disaster. Between Escalante and Dominguez a huge boulder rolled across the track, right in the 107’s path! The collision was terrible. It killed Godfrey, his fireman, and several passengers.

After that, even the non-superstitious rails fought shy of the 107. The feeling that she was a hoodoo grew alarmingly. But there was always somebody willing to try again. Engineer Bratt took her out on a clear, cold, wintry night less than three months afterward, on the same run. Between Sapinero and Curecanti, in the canyon of the Gunnison, she encountered a heavy snow-slide. The engine turned turtle. As usual, both engineer and fireman were killed. It was thought, but never definitely proved, that some passengers perished also.

When the 107 was hauled back into yards at Grand Junction, men looked upon her scarred sides with horror. Local call boys experienced much difficulty in finding crews for her, so the 107 was transferred to a western run, between Salt Lake City and Ogden. At least three accidents occurred while she was in service there.

By this time her reputation as a killer had spread over the entire railroad; most of the men in engine service refused to touch the 107. Again she was transferred, this time to the run out of Alamosa, where she added several more engineers and firemen to her growing death list.

Finally, the men positively rebelled at taking out the dread 107, so in 1908 the D.&R.G. officials were obliged to scrap her. Gingerly she was taken to Burnham station, and to the boneyard. Even there the rails gave her a wide berth at night, and many were the tales told of grim spectral figures seated in her dilapidated cab or hovering over the last resting-place of dead engines.

Yes, sir, the 107 was a hoodoo if ever there was one. It is hard to find another that can beat her grim record.


And now, for something completely different

[pwolfe]

Hi Tom and all.

Instead of an Encore I will attempt to do the Summary for TOM

NAME DATE TIME PAGE REMARKS ETC
(1) siberianmo Tom Posted: 11 May 2006 05:23:25 (328)Thursdays info & summary.

(2) barndad Doug " 11 May 2006 07:12:30 (328) Lionel TrainMaster part 2

(3) siberianmo Tom " 11 May 2006 07:27:30 (328) Inclusive Post etc

(4) passengerfan Al " 11 May 2006 08:05;18 (328) CB&Q Streamlined Head
End Cars

(5) coalminer 3 " 11 May 2006 09:07:36 (328) Inclusive Post etc.

(6) passengerfan Al " 11 May 2006 09:08:56 (328) CB&Q Streamedlined Dome Cars.

(7) pwolfe Pete " 11 May 2006 10:58:16 (328) My Post 1.

(8) trolleyboy Rob " 11May 2006 11:11:17 (328) Picking up Tom & Ted.

(9) trolleyboy Rob " 11 May 2006 11:17:08 (328) Rendezvous Encore.

(10) pwolfe Pete " 11May 2006 13:49:57 (328) My Post 2.

(11) barndad Doug " 11May 2006 18:00:58 (328) IRM Zephyr.

(12) wanswheel Mike " 11May 2006 18:04:06 (328) Inclusive Post & Link

(13) passengerfan AL " 11 May 2006 19:43:56 (328) CB&Q Streamlined Dining & Lounge Cars.

(14)siberianmo Tom " 11 May 2006 22:45:01 (329) Tom in Toronto at Night.

(15) siberianmo Tom " 12 May 2006 05:31:20 (329) Tom in Toronto in the Morning.

(16) barndad Doug " 12 May 2006 05:50:06 (329) Streetcar Riot.

(17) passengerfan Al " 12 May 2006 06:52:25 (329) CPR Streamlined Dining & Lounge Cars.

(18) trolleyboy Rob " 12 May 2006 07:04:34 (329) Robs Update.

(19) coalminer 3 " 12 May 2006 09:02:16 (329) Inclusive post & West Virgina Station Scene.

(20) michaelson " 12 May 2006 09:58:36 (329) Search For a name at Our Place.

(21) passengerfan Al " 12 May 2006 15:00:30 (329) CNR Streamlined Dining & Lounge Cars.

(22) pwolfe Pete. " 12 May 2006 17:58:13 (329) My Post.

(23) barndad Doug " 12 May 2006 17:59:13 (329) Mysterious Explosion.

(24) siberianmo Tom " 12 May 2006 21:44:55 (329) Tom's Ted's & Robs day in Toronto.

Hopefully That is the Summery up to Saturday and there arn't too many spelling mistakes etc. Pete.

[wanswheel]

Hi Tom and everyone, a round for the house

Al's post on the Canadian National refers to a CN train to Washington operated by an American subsidiary that employed my grandfather and great-uncles, who were all born in Canada (PEI) in the 1880s.

Central Vermont Railway map 1966
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/pictures/1606/cvcvr.jpg
The last Central Vermont timetable for the old Montrealer
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/pictures/1606/cvmaintt.jpg

Here's a letter my father wrote to the author Robert A. Le Massena, with links to pictures:

September 15, 1974

Dear Mr. Le Massena:

Through the kind courtesy of Dave Morgan, I have only this weekend received a copy of Trains Magazine for May 1972. I had asked Dave for the copy, because I had seen, in the listing of available back issues, mention of an article, "The Bootlegger", and I felt sure that it could only refer to our beloved Montrealer and Washingtonian.
[1949 photo of Montrealer]
http://imagescn.technomuses.ca/railways/index_view.cfm?photoid=-1087565537&id=57

Sure enough. But more than just another article: it was an absolute pleasure to read your sensitive, accurate, and detailed story.

I had been, when I had just seen the listing "The Bootlegger", mildly indignant at such a name -- knowing full well that there were those who did call the Washingtonian that -- but the first paragraph of your story took away the sting: "whose southbound run was dubbed accurately, if not politely, the Bootlegger."

So long as you recognized the irreverent tone with which the name was applied down on the southend -- but never up on the CV!!!!

But let's not get away from the subject. Probably the most important thing to me was that you wrote of the train as she was when I also was a boy in St. Albans, and my father was a fireman (hand firing those 600's all right!) on nos. 20 and 21, while his two brothers with more senority were engineers, some of the time on these two trains.
[The CV 600]
http://imagescn.technomuses.ca/railways/index_view.cfm?photoid=1330977016&id=55
[A fireman]
http://www.cvrma.org/pictures/MISC/dfrr4109_fireman_stokes_engine_east_broadtop_rr.jpg
[A CV engineer, Mr. Hale]
http://imagescn.technomuses.ca/people/index_view.cfm?photoid=-1188559220&id=26

I have placed the setting of your story as somewhere between 1928 and 1933 -- simply because the 600's came in April 1927, while the Pennsy was electrified to Washington by about 1933, I believe. Of course, your photograph of No. 21 with the 601 at East Swanton is dated July 1940, and the smoke deflectors and the higher coal bin on the tender were applied perhaps around that time.
[The 601 at St. Albans in 1950]
http://imagescn.technomuses.ca/railways/index_view.cfm?photoid=-865848423&id=55

To put my time into perspective, I was born 10/13/14. In late 1926, I started substituting as a messenger in "SA" telegraph office in St. Albans, adjacent to the Despatcher's office, and I worked part time and full time there until late 1931.
[CV Dispatcher's office]
http://imagescn.technomuses.ca/people/index_view.cfm?photoid=-1108028983&id=26

So I was there, too, during the great days when The Montrealer and The Washingtonian were our best trains, and we spared nothing to make and keep them exactly that. It went into the permanent record of any man who delayed those trains even one minute. (Except of course that the CV couldn't do anything about The New Haven, who were the villains in the old CV saying, "The New Haven will lose 20 minutes into Springfield, the B&M will hold their own, and we have to make up the 20 minutes into Montreal."

Which brings up one of the very few things I could find fault with in your story -- your comments about the slower run over the CV. Not so, not at all! While I can't produce timetables going that far back to prove it, it is my recollection that the New Haven and the B&M both had 40MPH terminal to terminal schedules for the trains while we had 45 MPH on the CV. At one time the schedule White River Junction to St. Albans was down to 2 hours 28 minutes for the 117 miles, and there was a standing bulletin that nos. 20 and 21 were not to make up more than 20 minutes between White River Jct. and St. Albans. Of course, it was also the informal understanding that the engineer who couldn't make up 20 minutes wasn't qualified for the run!

The only other thing I could find wrong was a slight misidentification of track. You are right that Windsor-White River Jct., 14 miles, was CV track; but also, the 11 miles between East Northfield, Mass. and Brattleboro, Vt., were paired track -- southward on the CV west of the Connecticut River, northward on the B&M across the river.

But a little more significantly, north of St. Albans the CV track did not end at the Canadian border: St. Armand, Des Rivieres, Iberville, all were CV, all the way to St. Johns, which was total of 43 miles if my momory is right. At. St. Johns northward, the CV joined the CN track running from Rouses Point and Cantic to St. Johns and Montreal. So the exchange of mileage on crews nd engines was the 47 miles St. Johns to Montreal versus the 43 miles St. Albans to St. Johns.

In post-WWII years, the CN upgraded the Rouses Point Branch of the CV between Fonda Jct. and East Alburgh, where the old Canada Atlantic line diverged to Boteau, and tied to the connection to the Rouses Point-St. Johns line at Cantic, to create a new main line between St. Albans and St. Johns. For a few years, service was maintained between St. Albans and St. Johns via the original main line through East Swanton-Highgate Springs-St. Armand, through a pair of locals pulled by the old 219 and 220, then finally the old line was abandoned save for a section up to East Swanton only.
[Alburgh tressel, part of the route from St. Albans to Rouses Point, NY]
http://photos.nerail.org/showpic/?photo=200402182109234626.jpg&byrail%3A77%3ACentral_Vermont

This changed the crew and engine mileage, of course, shortening the CV mileage to 25 miles St. Albans to Cantic. Initially, the CN tried to exercise their additional mileage; but the Brotherhoods went to Uncle Sam, who ruled that unless CN allowed the CV crews constructively their old 43 miles St. Albans-St. Johns, then Uncle Sam would require CN to take their engines and crew off at the border, thus requiring establishment of engine and crew terminals at Cantic, at prohibitive cost to CN. So CN yielded.

Another idiosyncracy of Nos. 20 and 21 was that, by special agreements with the Brotherhooods, these two trains, and these two only, were exclusively CV jobs all the way White River Jct. to Montreal. This came about because of a contract Grand Trunk Railway had signed with Rutland RR in 1919, under which GTR agreed never to operate a through passenger service Montreal-New York City except via Rutland RR. In order to operate the Montrealer and Washingtonian without violating that contract, it was necessary that the CN avoid all participation in the operation of the train; so it was set up as a CV operation, running into Montreal under CV trackage rights, rather than as a CN operation St. Johns-Montreal. Reservations on the train were all handled by St. Albans, and when I was working as a messenger on the second trick, the hottest thing I had to handle was to run out to the ticket office with the "space message", which handed back to St. Albans all the space not checked in at the gate when the train left Montreal. The St. Albans ticket agent then did all the filling of requests for space down the line.

The CV's only dining car was each morning put on the rear of No. 21 at St. Albans, to Montreal, and taken off each night.

The subterfuge was carried to the point that 5 CN 4-6-2's, the 234-238 inclusive, moved down to the CV in 1924 to cover the runs, were repainted and renumbered 234-238. After the CV got the new 600's, 4-8-2's, the 234-238 were sent back to CN, but were again repainted in St. Albans in their real owners livery and numbers before they went back.

Oh, we were mighty proud of our train. When the disastrous Flood (which all Vermonters know to be the big one of 1927) knocked out the CV between St. Albans and White River Jct., Nos 20 and 21 were run for an entire year over the D&H, who very kindly charged the CV $400 per day for the use of their track, meanwhile requiring CV to furnish engines and crews and fuel and pay for a D&H pilot, but refusing to let the trains handle a single passenger except Montreal-New York or beyond. Do you wonder at the strength of the feeling in Vermont in 1971-72, when we were waging the campaign to get Montreal service restored by Amtrak via the CV instead of the D&H? I am sure wars have been fought over lesser issues, than the determination of CV employees and the State of Vermont that this time we are going to get the trains back! (A Burlington Free Press signed editorial said, "What Vermonters must do is beat Governor Rockefeller to the punch"!!)

But here I'm getting into another subject, which someday will be the subject of that book I've promised people to write -- as you may know, I was the originator of the proposal (literally a 29-page business Proposal dated July 26, 1971) to get the Montrealer and Washingtonian restored. It took 13 months out of my life, but we won. Which is the reason that in May 1972 I didn't get a copy of Trains Magazine -- I was just to inundated in fighting the campaign to take time to pick up the magazine!

Now I have the May 1972 issue, and belatedly I've enjoyed more than I can say, your fine article, which in almost every paragraph took me back some 40 years in a heady return to those days when life was so much simpler for all of us -- or so it seems.

In return, I had promised Dave Morgan to send him a copy of the original Proposal for the Montrealer's restoration, which I shall... Xerox at the office.... I'll run two copies...and send you one too; had Amtrak known as much as you do of the importance of the old Montrealer, it wouldn't have taken us 13 months to teach them. (Their position was, no train has run for 5 years, therefore no train should ever run there.)
[CV Montrealer in 1961, five years before demise]
http://photos.nerail.org/showpic/?photo=200202101158501222.jpg&byrail%3A95%3ACentral_Vermont

Of course, now that the train is back, it is most gratifying to find it is the absolutely best performing train financially on the entire Amtrak System.

I hoped I haven't bored you with these extended comments, but I put a lot of my life and soul into that train, both when I was a boy and in 1971-72. I don't think there could possibly be anyone who appreciated your article more than I.

Sincerely,

Joseph V. MacDonald

Montrealer at White River Junction
http://photos.nerail.org/showpic/?photo=2005070920572227700.jpg&byrail%3A61%3ACentral_Vermont

My parents were aboard this train, the first Amtrak Montrealer into Montreal.
http://imagescn.technomuses.ca/railways/index_view.cfm?photoid=-1395018677&id=77

[West Coast S]

Happy travels Herr Kapatian tom and all north of the boarder, I have returned from the legion of the lost!! Barndad, got a few extra eggs and a cup of coffee you can spare, no sense in disturbing the hired help!
That stool of mine is dusty indeed.

Tom, appears Rob is the quentsential host and a model for Canadian hospitality, hope you and the others are having the time of your lives, wish I were with all of you instead of stuck in my 6x6 foot cubicle..

Barndad, the streetcar riots, got me thinking ( a dangerous thing to do!) Today, in LA such an incident would require one to hire a high priced attorney to properly sue the MTA,city, county and persons employed by the transit agency, don't forget the shady doctor operating out of the self serve carwash with the questionable medical background. Can you say CHA-CHING...

Rob, Went to the Orange Empire Railway Museum last week for the unvailing of car 850 one of only two survivors built by Laconia in 1913, How this restoration is finished is open to debate, In place of the well known PE bright red, a deep wine red was applied. This steems from the fact that some served on the San Bernadino line where the bright red was eschewed for some long forgotten reason, perhaps passenger operations being abandoned by 1942 and the disposition of surplus older equiptment prevented new colors from being applied.

They also have a former SP U25B in operable condition, she was one of the trio of locomotives that recieved Bicentenial colors, though it looked fantastic in fresh Scarlet and Grey, It would be nice to see the special colors restored, SP set it aside for preservation after reconditioning and repainting back to standard colors, the other seventy six examples were scrapped by the mid eighties.

Well, seems i've got some details that require my immediate attention, will return shortly.

Dave



Times have indeed changed...

[passengerfan]

Part Two.

Canadian National Streamlined Coaches
by Al

14 SECTION TOURIST SLEEPING CARS Canadian Car & Foundry late 1920s Rebuilt and streamlined by CNR shops 1954 (Rebuilt and streamlined for operation in the SUPER CONTINENTAL)

2225 POINT ACONI

2226 POINT BASSE

2227 POINT BIEUE

2228 POINTE DE BUTE

2229 POINTE CALUMET

2230 POINTE CARRE

2231 POINTE DE CHENE

2232 POINTE CLAIRE

2233 POINT COMFORT

2234 POINT CREWE

2235 POINT CROSS

2236 POINT EDWARD

2237 POINT AU GAUL

2238 POINT GARDENER

2239 POINTE GREY

2240 POINT IDEAL

2241 POINT LANCE

2242 POINTE LEBEL

2243 POINT MAY

2244 POINT MICHAUD

Canadian National placed the largest single order for streamlined coaches ever placed with a single manufacturer when they ordered 161 new 80 revenue seat coaches in October 1952. Before the first car from this order was delivered 1954 the CNR added an additional 57 coaches identical to the first bringing the order to a total of 218 in December 1953. The new coaches rode on four-wheel trucks and featured a single vestibule end; maximum seating capacity was 80 with 52 in non-smoking and 28 in smoking. These cars were built for General service for service system wide and deliveries took place between January and July 1954. These cars would probably be the most rebuilt cars on the CN over the following years.

80 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (52 NON SMOKING SEATS 28 SMOKING SEATS Canadian Car & Foundry January – July, 1954 (Built for and assigned to General Service)

5437 – 5654

All of the new coaches and the previously mentioned 14 Section Tourist sleeping cars were delivered in the new paint scheme of Olive Green, Black, with Yellow lettering and separation stripes. The previous scheme had been Olive green only with Yellow lettering. The new bolder scheme was much more attractive with Black car sides below the windows, Olive green for the rest of the car sides and Black roof. All colors were separated by Yellow stripes and car lettering was in Yellow as well. The scheme featured a Canadian National Red Maple Leaf emblem in a Yellow circle with Yellow lettering on the car sides near the ends. Many historians believe this to have been the best color scheme the Canadian Nation ever had.
At the same time the huge coach order was placed with Canadian Car & Foundry an order for sleeping cars dining cars, and Parlor cars was placed with Pullman Standard, and streamlined head end cars were ordered from National Steel Car Company.
As early as 1956 one of the above streamlined coaches number 5554 was rebuilt to a CNR business car complete with open platform Observation end where the former vestibule had been located. The new Business car was renumbered 91.
Beginning in 1964 the CNR began remodeling a number of the 80 revenue seat Coaches to 72 revenue seat coaches with 52 seats in non smoking and 20 seats in smoking. In addition to the reduction in seating a snack bar was installed at the end of the non-smoking compartment. The work was performed in CN Pointe Ste. Charles shops and a total of 26 cars were remodeled in this manner by the end of 1965. The cars retained their original coach numbers and were assigned to trains operating in Corridor service between Quebec City and Windsor.

72 REVENUE SEAT SNACK BAR COACHES (52 NON SMOKING SEATS 20 SMOKING SEATS) Remodeled from 5437 – 5654 series coaches by CNR shops 1964-1965 (Remodeled for trains operating in the Quebec City – Windsor corridor)

5446-5456-5477-5510-5516-5537-5560-5573-5578-5582-5583-5588-5591-5598-5606-5617-5620-5624-5629-5630-5635-5638-5645

Two of the 5437-5654 series coaches were remodeled by CNR shops for service in the CHALEUR between Montreal and Gaspe and served as the overnight coaches in these trains with seating reduced to 64 and a large snack bar installed near mid car. The Canadian National referred to these cars as Buffeteria Coaches. And they retained their original numbers 5619 and 5625. Original seating was for 64 with 28 in smoking and 36 in non-smoking seats. Six years later in 1973 the smoking compartment was reduced to 24 and the Snack Bar section enlarged. The seating total was reduced to 60 at that time.
Another pair of these Coaches 5545 and 5623 were remodeled with seating reduced to 72 and a small six crew Dormitory space was installed with two tiers of three bunks each. The seating was compartmentalized with 52 in non-smoking and 20 in smoking. The completed cars retained their original numbers and were assigned to Cochrane – Senneterre trains operating across northern Ontario and Quebec.
Nine 5437-5654 series coaches were extensively remodeled to 52 revenue seat coaches with a Buffet and 20-seat lounge area in 1964. After completion of the work the cars were assigned to the SUPER CONTINENTAL and renumbered 3000 – 3008. Cars remodeled were originally coaches 5601, 5480, 5549, 5513, 5502, 5564, 5543, 5592, and 5463 in that order. These cars served the coach section of the SUPER CONTINENTAL. In 1965 CNR shops remodeled 31 additional coaches with 44 revenue seats a Buffet and 24-seat cocktail lounge. The lounge and Buffet were against one side of the car separate from the rest of the car and a passageway passed beside the Cocktail Lounge and Buffet area. These cars 5559, 5540, 5538, 5575, 5570, 5551, 5608, 5553, 5539, 5615, 5612, 5451, 5565, 5563, 5568, 5546, 5567, 5577, 5614, 5613, 5555, 5609, 5550, 5561, 5606, 5572, 5604, 5600, 5566, and 5607 were renumbered 3009 – 3039 respectively. This gave the CNR enough of these cars to assign them to the SUPER CONTINERNTAL, PANORAMA, CHALEUR, OCEAN, and SCOTIAN.
The original 3000-3008 plus 3020,3022, 3023, 3024,3026, 3029, and 3031 were further rebuilt in 1968-1969 without revenue coach seating but instead with 20 seat dining area 5 seat lunch counter kitchen bar 22 seat cocktail lounge. They were renumbered 750-765 in the following order 750, 756, 751, 757, 752, 753, 754, 755, 758-765. These cars were then assigned to the coach sections of the SUPER CONTINENTAL and PANORAMA. After the PANORAMA was discontinued they could be found operating in the maritime trains.
Fifteen additional 3000 series cars were rebuilt in 1971 –1972 without revenue seating and the interiors were rebuilt to 20-seat lounge Buffeteria 24 seat Cocktail Lounge. These cars were rebuilt to eliminate some of the dining car deficit and were crewed by three men. The cars were assigned to the SUPER CONTINENTAL, OCEAN, and SCOTIAN replacing the 3000 series cars in these trains. After rebuilding the cars were numbered 2500-2514 as follows.

2500 ex 3019 originally CN 5612

2501 ex 3021 originally CN 5565

2502 ex 3018 originally CN 5615

2503 ex 3009 originally CN 5559

2504 ex 3010 originally CN 5540

2505 ex 3013 originally CN 5570

2506 ex 3014 originally CN 5551

2507 ex 3017 originally CN 5539

2508 ex 3015 originally CN 5608

2509 ex 3012 originally CN 5575

2510 ex 3011 originally CN 5538

2511 ex 3016 originally CN 5553

2512 ex 3027 originally CN 5614

2513 ex 3036 originally CN 5556

2514 ex 3028 originally CN 5613

In 1972 the Canadian National began a program of remodeling cars into Dayniter Coaches for assignment to all trains that operated overnight in Canada on the CNR. Initially the first cars were remodeled for the SUPER CONTINENTAL between both Montreal and Vancouver and Toronto and Vancouver. The CN charged a fare supplement for coach passengers who wished to ride in the far more comfortable Dayniter coaches. These cars featured fully reclining seats with leg rests over carpeted floors even the walls of these cars were carpeted below the windows and the 52 seat cars interiors were much quieter. Some of the later Dayniter conversions went even further in noise reduction with an elevated seating area with a step up from the aisle which insulated passengers even more from the track noise. The first of these cars converted to Dayniter coaches were remodeled in 1972 - 1973 from 80 revenue seat coaches and renumbered 5700 – 5725.

5700 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5605

5701 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5520

5702 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5510

5703 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5524

5704 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5462

5705 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5460

5706 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5526

5708 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5450

5709 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5445

5710 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5535

5711 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5484

5712 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5438

5713 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5515

5714 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5453

5715 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5507

5716 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5457

5717 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5523

5718 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5466

5719 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5461

5720 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5477

5721 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5496

5722 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5521

5723 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5475

5724 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5493

5725 originally CN 80 seat Coach 5479

Long before the conversion of the first Dayniter took place the CN had reduced the original 80 seats in the Coaches to 76 seats permitting more legroom between seats. The seating was then 52 non-smoking and 24 smoking; the conversion to 76 seats took place during the 1960s.
A single 76 revenue seat Coach number 5439 was remodeled to a 38 seat Club Car with Galley for service in the RAPIDO trains in the Canadian Corridor. The car after remodeling was renumbered and named 653 MT. ROYAL CLUB.
Canadian National was one of the few railroads to buck the decline of railroad passenger services in the 1960s with some measure of success although at what price has never been fully revealed. It was a well thought out and planned effort with the key being the Red, White, and Blue fares. Under this fare structure the most heavily traveled days the Red day's fares were full price. White days were those days immediately following the most heavily traveled days and a discount of 20% was offered on those days. The least traveled days were the Blue fare days with discounts of 33-1/3%. The fares were based on the day travel began and applied to sleeping car, Club car fares as well as coach travel. The new paint scheme and stylized CN logo were introduced at the same time and it wasn’t long before trains were seen in the new Black and Gray scheme with Orange logo. Many people thought the light gray was actually white. The CN refurbished and repainted the interiors of all cars as the outsides were repainted. The interiors were given a brighter image with many new bright colors making up this more modern scheme. But not only was there the more attractive interiors but also the CN did little things like offering Bingo to passengers of the long distance trains in the dining cars after the evening meal hours. Small prizes such as a CN Comb and Brush set, a deck of CN playing cards, or maybe a complimentary meal for a coach passenger were awarded to the winners of the Bingo games. All meals were included in the fares of the first class passengers of the Club cars or Sleeping cars. For those same first class passengers on the long distance trains the CN served complimentary Coffee and sweet rolls in the first class lounge car between 9:00 AM and 11:00 AM each morning. The growth in passengers during this period was quite phenomenal although CN has never released the exact figures. The author had occasion to ride CN trains quite often during this period and doesn’t remember one that wasn’t full.
In fact it was during this period that the previously mentioned changes occurred to Coaches and the Dayniter coaches were introduced. At the same time the greatest increase in CN passengers occurred in first class riders with the CN purchasing large numbers of used streamlined sleeping cars from U. S. roads. At the same time the CN purchased only one coach train set the former Reading CRUSADER. This became the first Budd built train set owned by the CN although they did purchase a large number of Budd RDC’s both new and used. The CN purchased this train set in 1964 and completely rebuilt it in the roads Pointe Ste. Charles shops. The CN after rebuilding the old Reading CRUSADER renamed the train CHAMPLAIN operating on a daily Montreal – Quebec City round trip schedule. The fastest train covering the 170-mile Montreal Quebec City run prior to the CHAMPLAIN operated each direction in 3 hours 45 minutes. The new CHAMPLAIN cut 30 minutes off the scheduled running time to 3 hours 15 minutes. As built in 1937 the five car CRUSADER had an observation car at each end with three intermediate cars. The two Observations were numbered 1 and 5 and seated 56 with a 14 seat-smoking lounge in each Observation end. Cars 2 and 4 were 56 seat coaches with a 12 seat Smoking lounge and the center car 3 was a 32 seat Diner with 22 seat Tavern lounge. With an Observation at each end it was not necessary to turn the consist at terminals but simply reverse the seats for the return. The CN stripped the interiors of the five car stainless steel train set and rebuilt it as follows.

22 SEAT CAFÉ LOUNGE CAR Budd Company November 1937 (Purchased and rebuilt to above configuration by CN shops in 1964 assigned to CHAMPLAIN)
300 originally Reading 3

54 REVENUE SEAT COACH (39 SEAT SMOKING 15 SEAT SMOKING) Budd Company November 1937 (Purchased and rebuilt to above configuration by CN shops 1964 assigned to CHAMPLAIN)
301 originally Reading 2

59 REVENUE SEAT COACH OBSERVATION (51 SEATS NON SMOKING 8 SEATS SMOKING) Budd Company November 1937 (Purchased and rebuilt to above configuration by CN shops 1964 assigned to CHAMPLAIN)
302 originally Reading 1

72 REVENUE SEAT COACH Budd Company November, 1937 (Purchased and rebuilt to above configuration by CN shops 1964 assigned to CHAMPLAIN)
303 originally Reading 4

68 REVENUE SEAT SNACK BAR COACH OBSERVATION Budd Company November 1937 (Purchased and rebuilt to above configuration by CN shops 1964 assigned to CHAMPLAIN)
305 originally Reading 5

A major speed up in the corridor began taking place in 1965 the first new train to reflect the speed up was the RAPIDO Toronto in each direction. The RAPIDOS that entered service October 31, 1965 were seven car trains with no checked baggage. The running time for the 335 mile route was 4 hours 59 minutes giving the CN the fastest start to stop schedule in North America when introduced. The RAPIDO was assigned an FP9A-F9B-FP9A for power. This gave the seven car trains 5,250 hp for the fast run between Canada’s two largest cities. The CN expanded the RAPIDOS to twice daily service in each direction one year later on October 31, 1966. The morning and afternoon RAPIDO added stops at the same time. A suburban stop was made on the west side of Montreal at Dorval and at Guildwood on the east side of Toronto. Even with the additional stops the RAPIDOS maintained their 4 hour 59 minute schedules. This was due mainly to ongoing track improvements. The AFTERNOON RAPIDOS began operating Executive Club service using the Canadian National Railways only two streamlined Open Platform observations owned by the road BURRARD and BEDFORD. The AFTERNOON RAPIDOS were assigned a Bistro Car in 1968 that was set up with a Bar. Piano, and strawhatted Piano player to while away the time between terminals. The Bistro Cars 3100 and 3101 seated 66 passengers in the lounge atmosphere and were rebuilt from two older CN coaches 5292 and 5300 built by CCF in 1942. The main change to these cars was they were equipped with 4 wheel trucks for their RAPIDO service. The CN tried to maintain the length of the RAPIDOS to ten cars on weekdays and no more than twelve on weekends. It was not unusual to see as many as three Club cars operating in RAPIDOS.
Beginning in early 1967 the CN added additional RAPIDOS to the Montreal – Quebec City run eliminating the CHAMPLAIN at that time. The new RAPIDOS cut the running time of the former CHAMPLAIN by 16 minutes to 2 hours 59 minutes for the 170 mile run.
The Canadian National purchased new equipment for Southwestern Ontario service in 1966 with delivery taking place in August 1967. This was the TEMPO equipment. These fluted Aluminum skinned cars were equipped with disc brakes and featured bright attractive interiors. The one drawback to the new cars was a rough ride at high speeds; this problem was never fully corrected even with the addition of dampeners and other snubbing devises installed on the trucks. The 25 cars were built and delivered by Hawker Siddeley from their Thunder Bay plant. The CN purchased three types of TEMPO cars Club Cars, Baggage Coach Buffet Lounge Cars, and Coaches. To pull the new TEMPO cars the CN rebuilt and regeared five MLW RS-18 diesels for the service. The TEMPO equipment was the first CN train to enter service that required Hotel power meaning the Diesels were equipped with a diesel generator set in the short hoods to supply the cars with electrical power for lighting air conditioning and heat. The anodized aluminum skin that CN left in tact they simply added a stylized CN logo in black to the new cars sides at Window level. These represented some of the lightest weight cars ever built for passenger service in Canada.

39 REVENUE SEAT CLUB GALLEY CARS (22 SEAT NON SMOKING 17 SEAT SMOKING) Hawker Siddeley August 1967 (Built for and assigned to TEMPO service)
320 – 324

In November, 1967 the CN rebuilt TEMPO Club Galley Car 320 into and 80 revenue seat TEMPO coach and renumbered the car 375 at that time. In October 1969 the CN shops rebuilt TEMPO Club Galley 324 into a 52 revenue seat Coach with Galley with no change of number. The car was further rebuilt to a straight 80 seat Coach in October 1974 and renumbered 376 at that time.

BAGGAGE 16 REVENUE SEAT COACH BUFFET 26 SEAT LOUNGE CARS Hawker Siddeley August 1967 (Built for and assigned to TEMPO Service)
340 – 344

Two of the above cars were remodeled with 24 Coach seats replacing the former 16 seat Coach section and this eliminated the Baggage Compartment. The first car reworked was 341 in November 1969 and the other car 342 was reconfigured in October 1975 with no change of number for either car.

82 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (62 SEATS NON SMOKING 20 SEATS SMOKING) Hawker Siddeley August 1967 (Built for and assigned to TEMPO service)
360 – 374

Canadian National operated the TEMPO trains generally as five car trains initially using two routes between Toronto and London where the routes came together and just west of London the route split again with one terminating in Sarnia the other terminating in Windsor. The TEMPO equipment eliminated many of the other trains along these routes although the routes still maintained additional trains. The Club cars were used very little west of London but from east of London to Toronto they were generally full.
Canadian National was to purchase three experimental trains the TURBOS for service between Montreal and Toronto and later Montreal and Ottawa. The new nine cars trains built by Montreal Locomotive Works with turbines supplied by Pratt & Whitney (Canada) were originally scheduled to enter service in time for EXPO 67 held in Montreal. These trouble plagued trains never entered service until 1972. The problem’s associated with the Turbines seemed to run satisfactorily in the summer months but winter was another story. That fine powdery snow all to common to the region during winter months played havoc with the Turbine blades of the four engines in each TURBO two located in each end Turbo Dome unit. It was not unusual for the Turbines to fail on many winter trips. The author boarded a TURBO in Toronto one morning for Montreal and upon entering the CLUB Dome expecting to see an engineer in the cab through the clear Plexiglas panel that separated passengers from the control compartment of the TURBO, I was surprised to see an empty compartment. Instead the fiberglass nose clam shell doors were open and a MLW FPA 4 was coupled to the front of the TURBO. Promptly on time the diesel accelerated the TURBO out of Toronto Union Station and after clearing the station trackage quickly had the TURBO traveling at track speed. In fact having ridden the TURBOS on numerous occasions before had to admit that the diesel-electric’s acceleration was far superior to the TURBOS acceleration. When the car attendant had time I inquired about the diesel up front and learned that it was not unusual in winter operation at that time and that as long as one of the Turbines was idling to supply hotel power for lighting and heat they ran that way quite often in the winter. Well much to my surprise the old MLW FPA4 arrived in Montreal Central three minutes faster then the TURBO itself was scheduled for 3 hours 59 minutes. I’m not sure if the diesel was capable of the same top speed as the TURBO but the faster acceleration of the Diesel seemed to make the difference. Each of CN’s nine car articulated TURBO trains consisted of a Power Dome Turbo Club Car with Club seating for 22 on the main level and 8 in the dome, two TURBO Club Cars with seating for 40 in each, followed by one 56 seat TURBOLUXE Coach seating 56, one TURBOLUXE Buffeteria Coach seating 38, one TURBOLUXE COACH seating 54. This was followed by another TURBOLUXE Buffeteria Coach with seating for 38, a TURBOLUXE Coach with seating for 56 and a Power Dome Lounge Car with lounge seating for 24 in the dome and TURBOLUXE Coach seating for 28 on the main floor. This gave each of the three TURBO train sets Club seating for 110 and Coach seating for 270 for a revenue seat total of 380 passengers per trip.

ARTICULATED POWER CONTROL STAND DOME TURBO CLUB WITH GALLEY (8 REVENUE SEATS IN DOME 22 REVENUE SEATS ON MAIN LEVEL) Montreal Locomotive Works / Pratt & Whitney (Canada) March – June, 1967 (Built for and assigned TURBO service)
125 126 129

ARTICULATED TURBO CLUB CARS WITH GALLEY (40 REVENUE SEATS) Montreal Locomotive Works March – June 1967 (Built for and assigned to TURBO service)
200 201 202 203 204 263

ARTICULATED TURBO BUFFETERIA COACHES (38 REVENUE TURBOLUXE SEATS) Montreal Locomotive Works March – June 1967 (Built for and assigned to TURBO service)
225 226 227 228 229 257

ARTICULATED TURBO COACHES (56 REVENUE TURBOLUXE COACH SEATS) Montreal Locomotive Works March – June 1967 (Built for and assigned to TURBO service)
250 251 254 255 256 259

ARTICULATED TURBO COACHES (54 REVENUE TURBOLUXE COACH SEATS) Montreal Locomotive Works March – June 1967 (Built for and assigned to TURBO service)
260 261 264

ARTICULATED TURBO POWER DOME CONTROL STAND 24 SEAT LOUNGE IN DOME and 28 REVENUE TURBOLUXE COACH SEATS ON MAIN LEVEL Montreal Locomotive Works / Pratt & Whitney (Canada) March – June, 1967 (Built for and assigned to TURBO services)
150 151 154

In 1969 Canadian National speeded up the SUPER CONTINENAL from its original 73 hours 20 minutes when introduced in 1955 to 69 hours 45 minutes. At the same time coach passengers were offered a third option for travel between Montreal and Vancouver and Toronto and Vancouver. There was regular Coach, Dayniter Coach and now Dormette Coach service. The latter used the 24 Duplex Roomette Sleeping cars in the “I” series that were no longer sold as sleeping car space. These cars originally built between October, 1949 and March, 1950 by Canadian Car & Foundry rode on six wheel trucks but were otherwise fully streamlined cars. The CN was the only operator of cars in Canada with this interior arrangement. The Santa Fe purchased 24 Duplex Roomette cars in the U.S. of the INDIAN series. These cars in later years lost favor with the Santa Fe and they rebuilt them to 11 Double Bedroom sleeping cars. The CN “I” series were named as well as numbered.

2000 INDIGO

2001 INGELOW

2002 INGRAMPORT

2003 INGERSOLL

2004 INKERMAN

2005 INNES

2006 INVERNESS

2007 INWOOD

2008 IONA

2009 INGONISH

2010 INVERMAY

2011 INTERVALE

2012 IRIS

2013 IRMA

2014 IRONDALE

2015 IROQUOIS

2016 IRVINE

2017 ISABELLA

2018 ISLEVIEW

2019 ITUNA

The new Dormette service was only a short reprieve for the “I” series cars that would find more and more use as Dormitory space for crews.
Even as Canadian National passenger service were about to be swallowed by VIA Rail Canada the CN Pointe Ste. Charles shops were busy converting several of the “I” series cars into 52 seat Dayniter Coaches. The following six cars were converted at this time.

5726 originally CN 2018 ISLEVIEW

5727 originally CN 2003 INGERSOLL

5728 originally CN 2012 IRIS

5729 originally CN 2016 IRVINE

5730 originally CN 2008 IONA

5731 originally CN 2001 INGELOW

The Canadian National in modern times always put a best foot forward for passenger comfort this included Coaches as well as first class travel. For Coach passengers they offered passengers a choice of standard coach, Dayniter Coach and Dormette on the SUPER CONTINENTAL. They offered fast frequent trains in the Canadian Corridor between Quebec City and Windsor. They offered remote services to small towns in northern Ontario and Quebec where the train was the only means of transportation and they offered trains off the beaten path such as trains to Flin Flon, Manitoba and Churchill on Hudson‘s Bay.
The Canadian National also operated the 3’6” narrow gauge railroad system in Newfoundland. At one time the Canadian National offered daily train service on the island between Port Aux Basques and St. Johns. The route was just less than 500 miles and required a full 24 hours for the CARIBOU to run from terminal to terminal. The CN provided Ferry service between the mainland at North Sydney to Port Aux Basques on the south west corner of Newfoundland. A second ferry service operated summers between North Sydney and Argentia, Newfoundland. The train route from Port Aux Basque traveled north through Stephenville and Corner Brook before turning east to Grand Falls and Gander. It then turned south east to Clarenville and Argentia Junction where it turned east for St. Johns. St. Johns was the headquarters of narrow gauge rail system and also the provincial Capital and largest city on the Island. The top train speed in Newfoundland was fifty miles per hour but the CARIBOU rarely approached this speed in its meandering route across the island. The CARIBOU was a well equipped train with Head End Cars, Coaches Dining and Sleeping cars. One sleeping car was assigned to the Crew as a dormitory car. The narrow gauge cars were quite comfortable to ride due to the slow speed of the train if one could overcome the train’s one shortcoming lack of tight lock couplers. The banging caused by the slack running in and out took some getting used to. Each of the streamlined coaches carried 50 seats with 34 in non smoking and 16 in smoking. The cars were equipped with baker heaters as well as steam lines. The largest supplier of modern passenger cars to the CN Newfoundland Railway was Canadian Car & Foundry, although the final lot of modern cars came from National Steel Car in 1958. The first streamlined steel coaches arrived in 1943.

50 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (34 NON SMOKING SEATS 16 SMOKING SEATS) Canadian Car & Foundry June, 1943 (Built for and assigned to Newfoundland Narrow Gauge services)
750 – 757

50 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (34 NON SMOKING SEATS 16 SMOKING SEATS) Canadian Car & Foundry July – August, 1949 (Built for and assigned to Newfoundland Narrow Gauge services)
758 – 765

50 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (34 NON SMOKING SEATS 16 SMOKING SEATS) Canadian Car & Foundry March, 1955 (Built for and assigned to Newfoundland Narrow Gauge services)
766 – 770

50 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (34 NON SMOKING SEATS 16 SMOKING SEATS) National Steel Car August 1958 (Built for and assigned to Newfoundland Narrow Gauge services)
771 772

TTFN Al

[Anonymous]

Good morning again friends. I just dropped off some quarters for the jukebox, but I can be talked into a beer and a round, if I have to. Nice to see Al had been here with another fine streamliner post. Here's another ENCORE from me:

The Burlington Zephyrs – March 1937 Railroad Stories

One of the new Denver Zephyr trains. It is composed of twelve cars (only ten are shown in the photo), two of which house the motive power units: The first car two 900-horsepower diesel engines and the second a 1200-horsepower diesel engine.


While it was not exactly a prosperous one, the year 1933 was one of the most momentous in the history of American railroading. It marked the birth of the Diesel-electric, streamlined passenger train. Ere twelve months were up it wan on the rails, and today a couple dozen more are or soon will be in service. Thus a whole revolution in the technique of railroading has been effected, and a new type of transport train has become another commonplace in the railroad business.

The Diesel-electric, streamlined passenger train has been making good – not necessarily because it is Diesel-electric, but simply because it has given the customer more in comfort, speed and looks and also because it has caught his attention more effectually. No better case in point can be found than the largest group of Diesel-electrics on any other American road, the Burlington’s fleet of eight Zephyrs.

The original Zephyr, which broke all long-distance speed records on a demonstration journey from Denver to Chicago at an average of 77.6 miles an hour, was completed in the spring of 1934 and was put in service late that fall between Kansas City, Mo., and Lincoln, Neb., via Omaha. It was so successful in attracting new passengers that it has been followed by seven other Zephyr type trains; and the eight of them now cover a total of 5900 miles every day.

These facts tell their own story. For the Zephyrs are expensive trains, costing twice as much as a steam train of the old-fashioned type and a great deal more even than a steam engine and light-weight cars, such as the Milwaukee’s Hiawatha. The first Zephyr, a three-car unit (including the engine), came to better than $250,000. Although costs are being reduced, a Diesel-electric locomotive cannot be built for less than three times as much as a steam locomotive of the same capacity, and hence a train of the same cars costs all the way from 25 to 100 per cent more when hauled by it. Obviously, then, the Zephyrs must have justified their high original cost, or there would not be eight of them on the Burlington alone.

They have done so in different ways. First and most important, they have attracted full loads of passengers. Their appearance alone was bound to do so, for the sight of their stainless steel, speed-lined exteriors is enough to claim the attention of any person. The advertising and ballyhoo that accompanied them helped enormously, for they created the impression that these trains represented a new era in transportation. And the comfort and speed built into them completed the job. They were air-conditioned; they were professionally designed to please the eye of the passenger; they were operated at low fares on mile-a-minute schedules where trains had never been run so fast before. No wonder there were no seats left.

Out of justice to the steam locomotive manufacturers, it is worth pointing out here that all these factors have nothing much to do with the type of motive power. The same thing can be done and has been done with streamlined trains. The Diesel-electric engine burst upon the railroad world at a very luck time, when the movement toward light weight, air-conditioning, high speeds and streamlining was still in its infancy. By using all these new developments, the Diesel-electric stole the show, and created the impression that there is a mysterious law forbidding a steam engine to haul a light-weight train.

However, this article is written to praise and not *** the Zephyrs, and if the men who made them and the railroad which operates them have sense enough to put them over in a big way, the credit must be theirs. The fastest, cheapest, and swellest train in the world is no good to anyone while it is still on paper or in the back of somebody’s mind. Secondly, the Zephyrs have justified their first cost by showing low operating expense. The original Zephyr streamliner is composed of three cars (including the power unit)., boasts 72 saleable seats and costs about 31 cents a mile to run. This is no less than half the cost of a standard steam train of similar capacity.

Again, to be sure, the figures do no tell the whole story. The Milwaukee’s light-weight, steam-powered Hiawatha provides 464 seats, 291 of them saleable, and is operated for 90 cents a mile, which figures out to less cost per seat than the 31 cents of the Zephyr. But nobody has yet constructed a steam train seating 72 people which can be operated at 31 cents a mile, and as long as this is true the Burlington is justified in claiming all it does for the four-car Zephyr.

The third feature of the Zephyrs which helps work off their high price is the huge daily mileage run off by each of them. Since interest on money which is borrowed to buy equipment must be paid whether the equipment is used or not, the best way to reduce the interest charge per mile is to get as many miles a day out of the equipment as possible. The Zephyrs are averaging 737 miles a day apiece, with the Denver trains each doing over 30,000 miles a month. So far the best record for a steam passenger locomotive is around 19,000 miles a month, and the average is far less. Within the next few years, it is predicted, some steam engines will be doing better than 25,000 a month. If so, it would not be going too far to say that the competition of trains like the Zephyrs will be the inspiration for such deeds.

As has been mentioned, eight Zephyrs are now in daily service. The first one, a three-car train, is still making 500 miles a day at an average speed of 52 miles per hour, on a round trip run between Lincoln, Omaha, St. Joseph, and Kansas City. Slightly smaller than ordinary equipment, it weighs about 95 tons, uses a 660-horsepower Diesel motor. Next is the four-car Mark Twain Zephyr, in local service between St. Louis and Burlington, Iowa, a 442-mile round trip. Because of the number of stops, it averages only 40 miles an hour.

[:I] A herd of buffalo can only move as fast as the slowest buffalo, and when the herd is hunted, it is the slowest and weakest ones at the back of the herd that are killed first. This natural selection is good for the herd as a whole, because the general speed and health of the whole herd is maintained or even improved by the regular killing of the weakest members. In much the same way, the human brain can operate only as fast as the slowest brain cells through which the electrical signals pass.

Recent emiological studies have shown that while excessive intake of alcohol kills off brain cells, it attacks the slowest and weakest brain cells first. Thus, regular consumption of spirits helps eliminate the weaker cells, constantly making the brain a faster and more efficient machine. The result of this in-depth study verifies and validates the causal link between all-weekend parties and job-related performance. It also explains why, after a few short years of completing university studies and then getting married and settling down, most professionals cannot keep up with the performance of the new graduates. Only those few that stick to the strict regimen of voracious alcoholic consumption can maintain the intellectual levels that they achieved during their university years.

So, this is a call to arms. As our country is losing its technological edge we should not shudder in our homes. But get back into the bars and pubs and quaff that pint! Your company and your country needs you to be at your peak, and at your best, and you shouldn't deny yourself the career opportunities that you could achieve through excessive alcohol consumption. Take life by the bottle and be all that you can be! And remember a good cold beer will kill those bad, useless brain cells that are slowing you down and it will make the necessary room needed to get the good brain cells up front and at the top ready to perform at their best. So bottoms up, down the hatch, look out brain it's coming fast! [:I]

[passengerfan]

Good Morning Tom and the rest of the early risers . Time for coffee and a crumpet from the Mentor Village Bakery.

Nice to hear our esteemed leader and the others are having a good time in Toronto and the weather is cooperating.

Just a quick posting on something Canadian this AM.

CANADIAN
NATIONAL
Streamlined Coaches
By Al
Part One

The Canadian National Railway seemed reluctant to streamline passenger services in Canada; in fact there are critics who will argue that the CNR only streamlined transcontinental passenger services after the rival CPR announced they had purchased streamlined Budd built equipment for 1954 – 1955 delivery.
The truth is the CNR had first purchased semi-streamlined Coaches as early as 1937 for service system wide. And system wide on the Canadian National Railway meant from Halifax, N.S. on the Atlantic Coast to Vancouver and Prince Rupert on the Pacific Coast, with a narrow gauge operation in Newfoundland and a Northern Terminal located in Churchill, Manitoba on the shores of Hudson Bay. Service was provided jointly with its American subsidiaries from Montreal and Toronto to Chicago and from Montreal to Boston, and Washington. At one time it was possible for passengers to board a sleeping car in Montreal or Quebec City and not step off until arrival in Miami so vast was the interchange network operated by Pullman between the United states and Canada. The Government of Canada who in turn had to answer to the Canadian Taxpayer for any purchases such as new passenger cars and new locomotives owned the Canadian National Railway.
The Canadian National Railway operated passenger trains from Coast to Coast and almost everywhere in between. They operated a vast network of named trains through out its territory among them the CONTINENTAL LIMITED (Montreal – Vancouver and Toronto –Vancouver daily), CONFEDERATION (Toronto – Vancouver daily), NATIONAL (Toronto – Winnipeg daily), OCEAN LIMITED (Montreal – Halifax daily), INTERNATIONAL LIMITED (Montreal – Chicago daily), and MAPLE LEAF Toronto – Chicago daily).
The Canadian National Railway had purchased large numbers of heavyweight cars in the late 1920’s just in time for the great depression. Many of the older cars were stored for the duration of the depression. But in spite of having large numbers of cars as the depression began easing the Canadian National Railway by the mid 1930’s was finding itself short of Coaches. An order was placed with Canadian Car & Foundry for 50 new Coaches divided into a 48 revenue seat non-smoking section and 16-revenue seat smoking section. There was a partition complete with door between the two sections of the coach, very similar to the division used by the so-called Jim Crow coaches in the United States. The U.S. Roads tended to have separate smoking lounges located near the car rest rooms and this was non-revenue space. These cars were classed as semi streamlined and looked very similar to the cars that were produced by Pullman Standard from their old Osgood Bradley Plant in Worcester, Mass. Called the American Flyer cars. The cars were manufactured in two lots with the first delivered by Canadian Car & Foundry between July and October 1937, these 64 revenue seat Coaches seated 48 in a non-smoking compartment and 16 in the smoking compartment. All seats were revenue seats with this arrangement. The U.S. Roads tended to have separate smoking lounges usually attached to the Rest Rooms at the ends of the cars. In the U.S. arrangement the seats were non-revenue. The new coaches rode on six wheel trucks, were fully air-conditioned, and had twin vestibules. The first order of these cars was for fifty and they were assigned to long distance trains system wide. With only fifty of the new cars only one or two of these cars could be found in a given consist. Canadian National was pleased enough with the new cars that a second order was placed for them during WW II, these were the only revenue cars built for the Canadian National Railway in WW II. The distinguishing feature between the 1937 car lot and the 1942 car lot was the 1937 cars had square corners at the top of the vestibule Dutch doors and the 1942 cars had rounded corners at the top of these doors. The 1942 cars were assigned to service system wide with no particular preference to any train other than long distance services.

64 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (48 NON SMOKING SEATS – 16 SMOKING SEATS) Canadian Car & Foundry July – October, 1937 (Built for and assigned to General Service in long distance trains)

5180 – 5229

64 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (48 NON SMOKING SEATS – 16 SMOKING SEATS) Canadian Car & Foundry February – March, 1942 (Built for and assigned to General Service in long distance trains)

5283 – 5307

The Canadian National Railway for its part purchased a large number of Parlor Cars at the beginning of WW II from Pullman for conversion to coaches for wartime service. The following listing gives the cars CN Coach numbers month and year converted to Coaches original Pullman names, all cars were originally in U.S. Pullman Parlor car service mostly in the northeastern United States. All of these cars after conversion operated in CN service for many years most not being retired until the 1960’s The first groups converted to coaches seated 56 in non smoking and 24 in smoking for a total of 80 revenue seats. Conversion to coaches took place at Pullman Chicago, CN London, CN Pointe Ste. Charles, and GTW Port Huron.

5255 June, 1941 originally Pullman LIBERTY ISLAND

5256 June, 1941 originally Pullman BUCKEYE STATE

5257 June, 1941 ex Pullman EAGLE BLUFF originally Pullman COSMOS CLUB

5258 June, 1941 originally Pullman LIBERTY COUNTY

5259 June, 1941 originally Pullman EAGLE HEIGHTS

5260 June, 1941 originally Pullman EAGLE HILL

5261 June, 1941 originally Pullman EAGLE LAKE

5262 June, 1941 originally Pullman EAGLE MOUNTAIN

5263 June, 1941 originally Pullman EAGLE POINT

5264 June, 1941 originally Pullman EAGLE POND

5265 July, 1941 originally Pullman LIBERTY POLE

5266 June, 1941 originally Pullman JOSEPH WHEELER

5267 May, 1941 originally Pullman WILLIAM MOULTRIE

5268 June, 1941 originally Pullman LIBERTY BOYS

5269 July, 1941 originally Pullman EAGLE BAY

5270 June, 1941 ex Pullman EAGLE CANYON originally Pullman ARMY-NAVY CLUB

5271 June, 1941 originally Pullman LIBERTY PARK

5272 June, 1941 ex Pullman LIBERTY GROVE originally Pullman THE AIRWAY

5273 July, 1941 originally Pullman GRIDIRON CLUB

5274 June, 1941 originally Pullman LIBERTY COLORS

5275 July, 1941 originally Pullman LIBERTY HILL

5276 June, 1941 originally Pullman LIBERTY STREET

5277 June, 1941 originally Pullman MALVERN HILL

5278 June, 1941 originally Pullman OLD IRONSIDES

5279 June, 1941 originally Pullman SLEEPY HOLLOW

5280 July, 1941 originally Pullman LUNDY’S LANE

5281 June, 1941 ex Pullman SENATOR HENRY CABOT LODGE ex Pullman FARRAGUT SQUARE originally Pullman CEDAR MOUNTAIN

5282 June, 1941 ex Pullman SENATOR MORGAN G. BULKELEY ex Pullman ARMORY SQUARE originally Pullman CUMBERLAND ROAD

The same CN and GTW shops converted a second group of Pullman Parlor cars in 1942 to coaches. These cars were rebuilt for long distance services and the seating of these cars was for a total of 62 with 46 in smoking and 16 in non-smoking.

5308 April, 1942 originally Pullman ABSECON

5309 April, 1942 originally Pullman BELSENA

5310 March, 1942 originally Pullman WILMINGTON

5311 May, 1942 originally Pullman DAVIDA

5312 May, 1942 originally Pullman CHAMITA

5313 June, 1942 originally Pullman STANFIELD

5314 June, 1942 originally Pullman ROBERTA

5315 June, 1942 originally Pullman ILMA

5316 June, 1942 originally Pullman MELANIE

5317 July, 1942 originally Pullman THEOLINDA

5318 July, 1942 originally Pullman COLETTA

5319 July, 1942 originally Pullman MILDRED

5320 July, 1942 originally Pullman HENRIETTA

5321 April, 1942 originally Pullman ETHELWYN

5322 August, 1942 originally Pullman STRELSA

Also in 1942 other former Pullman Parlor cars were converted to Coaches with a seating capacity of 76 with 50 in non-smoking and 16 in smoking. These cars were assigned system wide for operation.

5323 April, 1942 originally Pullman BOWIE

5324 April, 1942 originally Pullman COWLEY

5325 November, 1942 originally Pullman ELIZABETH

5326 April, 1942 originally Pullman GLEN LOCH

5327 April, 1942 originally Pullman HOLIDAYSBURG

5328 April, 1942 originally Pullman POMEROY

5329 April, 1942 originally Pullman CHESILHURST

5330 April, 1942 originally Pullman DELAIR

5331 April, 1942 originally Pullman USELDA

5332 April, 1942 originally Pullman NAHANT

5333 April, 1942 originally Pullman RAMBO

Besides the above Parlor car conversions to Coaches the CN converted a number of other type cars purchased from Pullman to coaches. Among these were a group of Baggage-Buffet-Club-Smoker-Barber Shop and Baggage-Buffet-Club-Smoker cars converted to 80 revenue seat coaches with 56 in the non-smoking compartment and 24 in smoking.

5334 July, 1942 originally Pullman EAGLE VALLEY

5335 July, 1942 originally Pullman BAY STATE

5336 August, 1942 originally Pullman HOOSIER STATE

5337 August, 1942 originally Pullman LIBERTY BELL

5338 August, 1942 originally Pullman PRAIRIE STATE

5339 August, 1942 originally Pullman LOOKOUT MOUNTAIN

5340 August, 1942 originally Pullman MAMMOTH CAVE

5341 August, 1942 originally Pullman NEW ENGLAND

5342 August, 1942 originally Pullman EAGLE ISLAND

5343 August, 1942 originally Pullman EAGLE HARBOR

5344 August, 1942 ex Pullman EAGLE CLIFF ex Pullman CHARLES CAROLL OF CAROLLTON originally Pullman EAGLE CLIFF

5345 August, 1942 originally Pullman EAGLE FORD

5346 August, 1942 originally Pullman EAGLE RAPIDS

5347 August, 1942 originally Pullman ALEXANDER H. STEPHENS

5348 July, 1942 originally Pullman INDIAN HEAD

5349 July, 1942 originally Pullman INDIAN RIVER

5350 July, 1942 originally Pullman INDIAN TRAIL

5351 Jul, 1942 ex Pullman EDWARD HOPKINS originally Pullman JAMES MADISON

5352 July, 1942 ex Pullman EDWARD WINSLOW originally Pullman JOHN ADAMS

5353 July, 1942 originally Pullman RHINECLIFF

5354 July, 1942 originally Pullman EDGERTON

5355 August, 1942 originally Pullman MOUND CITY

Three Baggage Buffet Club Smoker Barber Shop cars were converted to 76 seat coaches in July – August 1942 with 52 non-smoking seats and 24 smoking.

5356 July, 1942 originally Pullman WILKINSBURG

5357 July, 1942 originally Pullman VENDERGRIFT

5358 August, 1942 originally Pullman ROGERS

Two Dormitory Buffet Lounge Club Barber Shop cars were converted to 80 revenue seat coaches in July 1942 with seating altered to accommodate 60 non-smokers and 20 smokers.

5359 July, 1942 originally Pullman DUPAGE

5360 July, 1942 originally Pullman LANDER

A single Buffet Baggage Club Smoker was rebuilt to a 80-revenue seat Coach with 60 seats in non-smoking and 20 seats in smoking in October 1942.

5361 October, 1942 originally Pullman INDIAN SPRINGS

An interesting single car conversion to coach was the Pullman Recreation Car COLISEUM built with a Gym Barbershop Shower-Bath Library Lounge and Recreation Hall. CN converted it to a 76 revenue seat Coach with 52 seats in non-smoking and 24 in smoking. This car was rebuilt in October 1942.

5362 October, 1942 originally Pullman COLISEUM

CN London shops rebuilt two former Pullman 10 Compartment Sleeping cars to 76 seat Coaches with 52 seats in non-smoking and 24 in smoking in October 1942.

5363 October, 1942 originally Pullman NIAGARA FALLS

5364 October, 1942 originally Pullman PORT CLINTON

The following 7 Compartment 2 Drawing Room Cars were rebuilt by CN London shops to 76 revenue seat Coaches in October 1942.

5365 October, 1942 originally Pullman CANATHA

5366 October, 1942 originally Pullman GLENFINLAS

5367 October, 1942 originally Pullman JEMEZ

5368 October, 1942 originally Pullman LA GRANGE

5369 October, 1942 originally Pullman SHINUMO

5370 October, 1942 originally Pullman VACA

5371 October, 1942 originally Pullman WALPI

5372 October, 1942 originally Pullman DIXIANA

5373 October, 1942 originally Pullman EVERETT

5374 October, 1942 originally Pullman KISSIMMEE

5375 October, 1942 originally Pullman SUMTER

London shops rebuilt six Pullman 10 Section 2 Drawing Room Sleeping cars in October 1942 to Coaches five with 76 seats divided with 52 in non-smoking and 24 in smoking numbers 5376-5380. The sixth coach conversion was for a 60-seat coach with 40 seats in non-smoking and 20 in smoking, this car was numbered 5381 and was assigned to transcontinental trains.

5376 October, 1942 originally Pullman CEDAR GROVE

5377 October, 1942 originally Pullman DOME ROCK

5378 October, 1942 originally Pullman FORT ERIE

5379 October, 1942 originally Pullman GLEN PARK

5380 October, 1942 originally Pullman HIGH GATE

5381 October, 1942 originally Pullman LONG BEACH

The next new Coaches for Canadian National arrived from Canadian Car & Foundry between December 1947 and March 1948 and even though they rode on six wheel trucks and had a full vestibule at each end they were considered fully streamlined. These car roofs were squared off not like the previous two groups of coaches whose roofs tapered down at the ends. These new cars also featured larger elongated windows generally associated with streamlined coaches. These cars smoking and non-smoking compartments were divided more evenly then the previous 64 seat coaches with 32 non-smoking seats and 28 smoking seats. When Canadian National was asked about the number of smoking seats when compared to non-smoking they replied demand for smoking space had grown dramatically during the war and by wars end certain older heavyweight coaches were operated with all seats for smoking passengers.

60 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (32 NON SMOKING SEATS – 28 SMOKING SEATS) Canadian Car & Foundry December, 1947 – March 1948 (Built for and assigned to Transcontinental trains)

5382 – 5411

Canadian National once again turned to CCF with a 1950 delivery of 25 more 60 Revenue seat Coaches with the same number of smoking seats and non smoking seats as the 1947 cars. These would be the last six wheel trucked double vestibule coaches constructed for Canadian National Railways. All future coaches built for the CNR would feature 4 wheel trucks and single vestibules except of course for the articulated Turbo equipment.

60 REVENUE SEAT COACHES (32 NON SMOKING SEATS – 28 SMOKING SEATS) Canadian Car & Foundry January – October, 1950 (Built for and assigned to Trans-continental Services)

5412 – 5436

An explanation of transcontinental services as Canadian National interpreted the meaning should be offered. They considered all through trains between Montreal and the West Coast, Toronto and the West Coast, Toronto and Winnipeg, Montreal and Chicago, Montreal and the Maritimes, Winnipeg and Churchill, and Edmonton and Prince Rupert. As newer Coaches arrived for assignment to the CONTINENTAL the older cars from 1937 and 1942 were assigned to the other transcontinental services. Regional trains that operated in the Provinces of Quebec, Ontario, and the Maritimes also operated with some of these older coaches.
With the introduction of the SUPER CONTINENTAL scheduled for April 24, 1955 the Canadian National had placed all of their car orders with Canadian Car & Foundry, National Steel Car, and Pullman Standard for the equipment for all of the new trains. And from GMD they had placed orders for FP9 and F9B diesels for pulling all of the new trains. Not to be left out the Canadian National also ordered MLW FPA4 and FPB4 diesels for operation in the eastern half of the system.
When rival Canadian Pacific announced the new Budd built CANADIAN would operate with matching tourist sleeping cars in the consists the Canadian National assumed this meant fully streamlined cars. The Canadian Pacific 14 section tourist sleeping cars were actually old heavyweight cars refurbished on the interior with the exterior receiving fluted stainless steel panels and the clerestory roofs were painted silver to match the rest of the train. The Canadian National decided to fully streamline a series of old 14 section heavyweight sleeping cars originally built for CN predecessor Canadian Northern dating to 1919 for the new SUPER CONTINENTAL. These 14 section tourist sleeping cars were fully rebuilt and streamlined by the CN Pointe Ste. Charles Shops in Montreal. The work was so intensive on these cars it included replacing the entire clerestory roofs with new streamlined roofs, new welded car sides with larger windows, new air conditioning, and refurbished interiors. The work performed on these cars was as fine a quality as that ever done by any railroad. The only give away that these were not new construction cars was the six wheel trucks they rode on, and the twin vestibules that were retained. But even these vestibules had new all steel Dutch doors installed to the outside world with new traps as well. Besides new carpeting in the interiors and fresh paint all new lighting fixtures were installed throughout with the newly installed ceiling. The bathroom fixtures were new modern fixtures as well thus giving the cars a totally new appearance. The cars were completed in the late fall of 1954 in plenty of time for the new SUPER CONTINENTALS debut. The conversion and streamlining of these twenty cars by CNR shops and the craftsmanship exhibited in them is probably what led to the CN doing so much conversion work of their own in later years.

Part 1

TTFN AL

[siberianmo]

ENCORE! Saturday - ENCORE! Saturday!
first Posted on page 165


. . . . . . Mentor Village Gazette . . . . . .

Vol. I, Number 1 . . . . . . . . Wednesday, November 17, 2005 . . . . . . . . . Free


coalminer3 CM3 Inducted into the PERMANENT ORDER OF THE STOOLS

Nov 17th, Mentor Village
By: Verbal Funderburk

Coalminer3 CM3 was inducted into the Permanent Order of the Stools on Nov 2nd . A society of esteemed customers of the Village’s bar and grill, known as ”Our” Place located near the junction of CP’s freight yard, they have no redeeming qualities other than their affection (affliction) for Classic Trains.

Following an announcement made by the Selection Committee, the induction ceremony was held in the Pool Room of the bar and was attended by the “usual lineup” of Mentor Village’s finest citizens. Mayor I. M. Running along with Chief of the Constabulary Book M. Dano were overheard commenting, “Who is this guy?” as they lined up at the bar for the complimentary drinks.

Coalminer3 CM3 was unavailable for comment, although his press representative did authorized the following statement: “This is a day, that will!”

A fight soon erupted between the track gangs of the CN, CP and Can-Am railroads, quickly broken up by the Constabulary, under the supervision of Inspector Clueless. Order was quickly restored and the room was turned over to the not-so-regular meeting of the Ladies of Perpetual Motion and Knitting Circle. (More on page 14.)


Shopping mall proposed for Mentor Village

By: Taura Loura Goldfarb

A shopping mall has been proposed for Mentor Village in the undeveloped area located between ”Our” Place and The Coffee Shop. Backed by Cheatham & Steele, Bankers and Malefactor’s Arus, the development is expected to win approval by the Village Board of Aldermen when they next convene. The date has not been established.

Several of the Village’s business owners are in favor of the plan and expect to occupy the prime locations. These include: Ulfoncle Gilot’s Tobacco Shop - Boogaloo Payne’s Music Emporium - Daury Freese, The Ice Cream Parlour - Ginger Snap’s Cookie Place - Harmut Broghammer’s Pharmacy - John Outhouse, The Bath Store - Love Lovelace’s Female Fashions - Plato Papps Men’s Wear and Somchit Inthisack’s Fine Furniture.

EDITORIAL

Mentor Village commemorated Veterans/Remembrance Day through a series of activities, most notably those undertaken over at the local distillery bar and grill, known as ”Our” Place. Friends and fans of the railroads gathered to listen to tales from the war years. Perhaps the highlight was the presentation of 9 WWII rail related advertisements provided by the Proprietor, Siberianmo.

We endorse activities of this nature in our village and commend the participants from taking a day of from their debauchery, madness, and civil disobedience. The local Constabulary is pleased as well.

CLASSIFIED Section

Wanted!

COMIX

From the Bumper:

4 Out of 3 People
Have Trouble With Fractions

Impotence . .
Nature’s way of saying “No hard feelings!”

Hang up
and drive!


Enjoy!

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]


ENCORE! Saturday - ENCORE! Saturday!

[Anonymous]

Good morning to one and all! I'll scape my own breakfast together this morning, and clean the dust off some of the unused stools here here here. Is there an echo in the bar? Glad to hear the wether is cooperating for the Rendevous in Toronto. I guess we're keeping all the nasty stuff down here! Have fun at Rob's museum today. One of these days I'll get to visit too! Here's a Zephyr ENCORE for today:

A Preserved Pioneer by Paul Hammond, Vintage Rails, Spring 1996



When the Pioneer Zephyr departed Denver Union Station for Chicago in 1934, it captured America’s imagination and attention. Not only were world records established in long-distance speed and performance, but this was also the beginning of a new diesel-powered age for railroading. Fittingly, at least three Zephyr trainsets have survived in the U.S>; two are preserve din museums in Illinois.

During the Zephyr’s active years, at was assigned a number of runs as the Burlington ordered newer and larger streamlined locomotives and cars. On May 26, 1959 – the 25th anniversary of its historic journey – the time came for the Pioneer Zephyr’s retirement. The train had hauled more than one million passengers over 3,200,000 miles during its distinguished career.

But this was not to be an end. The following year the stainless steel trainset was donated to the Chicago’s Museum of Science and Industry. After undergoing repairs to bring it back into top mechanical and cosmetic shape, the Zephyr was placed on outdoor display. For the next three-plus decades, untold tens of thousands had the chance to view this distinctive, pioneering streamliner – itself given National Historic Mechanical Engineering Landmark status. In spite of the museum’s best efforts, the Pioneer Zephyr suffered its share of deterioration, mostly to the interior. As the 1990s dawned, however, the museum decided all objects in its custodianship should be properly cared for in the years to come – regardless of size – or transferred to other institutions. Plans were made to either build shelters for, or bring inside, several large items. In addition to the Zephyr, New York Central’s famed 999 and a WWII vintage German U-Boat would benefit, among others.

In conjunction with these plans, restoration of the Pioneer Zephyr was deemed a necessity. Following transport to Milwaukee, Wisconsin, aboard special highway trailers, work began at Northern Railcar Corporation in 1995. A target appearance of 1940 has been set as the ultimate goal; an important component of the work will be understanding and replication of the processes – such as shotwelding – in use by Budd at the time of manufacture, and subsequent maintenance by the Burlington.

The stainless steel exterior skin remains intact. Electro-chemical action and deterioration (caused by the employment of mild steel for repairs over the years) are being mitigated, and a final cleaning, light straightening, and polishing will restore the train’s in-service luster. Inside, the many stainless steel surfaces are being cleaned and polished, and lighting, ventilation ducts, speaker systems, and doors are being made operational once again.

In the passenger seating areas, floor tiles are being replaced in-kind along with all carpeting. Seat will be reupholstered. The mail compartment, baggage section, operator’s cab, and engine room will be stabilized, cleaned, and reworked as necessary to be at least visually complete; fittings, piping, and instrumentation will be reinstalled as part of these efforts – especially those in the cab.

The Zephyr’s restoration, planned for completion in 1996, will coincide with its relocation to a special gallery at the Museum of Science and Industry. Located inside a new underground parking garage, this gallery – scheduled to open in early 1998 – will be accessed through a new entry and ticketing area. The museum’s staff has been hard at work developing plans for the Zephyr’s display; these will seek to recapture some of the mood of the era.

Motion effects, engine and horn sounds, and other “experimental” happenings are envisioned, along with an on-board tour simulating the record-breaking Denver to Chicago run. Exhibit units surrounding the train will focus on its scientific and technological advancements, as well as its Art Deco/Streamline styling and the Chicago “Century of Progress” exhibition where crowds flocked to see the silver steak. Once all this is completed, a visit to the Museum of Science and Industry should be well worth the time for Zephyr aficionados.

Another Zephyr trainset that has found a good home with a museum is the Nebraska Zephyr, displayed at the Illinois Railroad Museum in Union (northwest of Chicago). This train in later years was remodeled with a “transition car,” allowing newer locomotives to provide motive power without sacrificing the Zephyr’s streamlined look. It periodically operates along the museum’s three-mile-long main line, and in recent years has even ventured out over Chicago-area railroads as a “traveling ambassador.”

A third Burlington trainset, the Mark Twain Zephyr, is privately owned in the Chicago area. In addition the Boston & Maine-Maine Central’s Flying Yankee Budd-built articulated trainset is stored outdoors in Glen, New Hampshire (near scenic Crawford Notch). Although it is intact mechanically and cosmetically, the streamliner faces an uncertain future – the train’s owners have announced plans to convert the Flying Yankee into a stationary restaurant.

The Nebraska Zephyr, with its articulated (permanently coupled) equipment, pulls away for the LaGrange, Illinois, station in July 1967 as it approaches Chicago Union Station


[:I] A little old lady sits at the luncheonette counter and orders a hamburger. The huge guy behind the counter bellows, "One burger!"
Whereupon the chef grabs a huge hunk of chopped meat, stuffs it in his bare armpit, pumps his arm a few times to squeeze it flat, and then tosses it on the grill.
"That's the most disgusting thing I've ever seen," the old lady says.
Yeah?" says the counterman. "You should be here in the morning when he makes the doughnuts." [:I]

[siberianmo]

G'day!

A brief synopsis of the day's activities in Toronto, Canada - "Steel wheels on steel rails day!"

Boarded VIA Rail at 9:15 AM - arrived downtown . . . . .

Checked out Union Station - prowled the streets - had a bit of brunch . . .

Boarded GO Transit for a round trip to nearby community . . .

Boarded Toronto subway for a short trip . . . .

Boarded Toronto steetcar for a long roundtrip . . . .

Boarded Toronto subway for a return trip to Union Station . . . .

Boarded ViA Rail for return trip to Brantford, Ontario.

Dinner, "awards ceremony" and "business meeting" at St. George Arms restuarant 'n bar, St. George, Ontario.

Good time was had by all! "Official end of Rendezvous in Toronto!"

Tomorrow's calendar: visit and tour of trolleyboy Rob's streetcar museum. Followed by visits to other points of interest . . . .

Weather was beautfiful - comfortable temps & NO rain! [tup][tup][tup]

THANX to all who have contributed to keeping "Our" PLace "up on the Page!" [tup][tup][tup]

Check with ya tomorrow!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[Anonymous]

Good evening Al, Rob, CM3 and Michaelson. I'll buy the first round of the evening .... a shot of Jack being what I need after this cold and rainy day! Great streamliners today Al! We may not have many folks in the bar tonight, but we certainly don't lack for excellent reading material! Here's another little contribution from me:

A Mysterious Explosion by Bert Lanning – Aug 1975 Railroad Magazine

One chilly fall evening in 1924, No. 11, the regular night train for Vancouver, B.C., stood at the Canadian Pacific station in Nelson, B.C., waiting for departure time, 9pm. Its five day coaches and two sleepers were nearly filled to capacity. A powerful coalburning Pacific belched black smoke into the clear darkness as her fireman swung scoops full of coal into the white-hot fire.

The hogger, having finished his inspection and oiling of the running gear, had climbed back into the cab and was listening for the air-whistle signal to make the mandatory standing brake test. Then, with that important, but routine task done, he adjusted the flow of oil from the lubricator and relaxed on his leather seat to await the highball.

Right on schedule, two beeps sounded just above his head. His left hand eased out the throttle while his right hand released the independent engine brake. Soon the string of coaches was clattering over the yard switches on its westbound journey. With a full moon shining brightly overhead, plus the brilliance of the engine’s headlight, visibility was excellent. They picked up speed on the single-track Kettle Valley line.

For the first 25 miles they roared slightly downgrade as they followed the fast-flowing Kootenay River, paley lit by moonglow. For long periods the fireman was able to take life easy on his seat. Then, after No. 11 had made several stops along the way, the well-loaded train pulled into the busy junction point of Castlegar, where a branch line swings southward to the city of Trail, B.C.

At 10:30pm they rumbled across the big bridge that spans the Columbia River, with hollow thunder that silenced the hoot owls and tree toads, and then rushed toward the steep two-percent grade of Farron Hill, some 15 miles ahead. Now, the fireman started to build up an extra-good fire, making sure the back corners of the firebox were well banked, ready for the hour-long battle o the summit of the Christina mountain range.

With a satisfactory grade of coal in the Pacific’s tender, keeping up a full head of steam was no problem. Nevertheless, for the next hour it was hard sluggling for the fireman, with little time to relax on his seat. As the grade grew steeper and their speed decreased, the hogger widened on his throttle and dropped the Johnson bar forward. Exhaust blasted through the surrounding dark mountains. Checking his watch at intervals, the hogger noted that they were on time and should arrive at Farron siding according to schedule.

Meanwhile, back in the day coaches, some of the passengers had headed for their berths in the two sleepers at the rear. But many remained in the five day coaches, mostly those who had destinations before Vancouver and were content to make the all-night journey sprawled out over plush seats.

Near midnight, the Farron mileboard swam into view and the hogger reached for the whistle cord to give the usual long single blast for the station ahead. Soon they reached the summit and rolled slowly to a stop over the ash pit, where the fireman was allowed ten minutes to shake down his fire and dump the ash pans. On that necessary job he was assisted by the night watchman on a pusher engine stationed there.

Apart from the pusher’s crew and the telegraph operator and his wife, nobody lived at the desolate siding where the Farron depot stood. After checking around his engine, No. 11’s hogger climbed back into his cab and, when he saw the fire cleaning was done, eased his train past the depot, where the order board showed green.

Soon the string of passenger cars was rolling down the far grade, the fireman enjoying a well-earned rest on his seat. With a two percent downgrade, the engineer had to shut off his throttle and bring the Johnson bar back to the center position. As they sped swiftly around the many curves, he made a couple of light applications on the trainline air to steady his train and to keep down to a safe speed.

On one of these curves the engine crew were startled to hear a sudden loud boom come from somewhere to their rear. Immediately the trainline brakes went into emergency. As they ground to a stop, the man at the throttle gave the necessary whistle blasts, telling the crew to go out and flag. Then as a necessary precaution, he yanked the Johnson bar over to the reverse position and set the independent engine brake to help hold his train on the steep grade.

Being on a sharp curve prevented the engine crew from seeing what had happened back along the coaches. But soon a brakeman came running up to inform them excitedly that an explosion had occurred in one of the day coaches, completely wrecking it! Grim-faced, he said that some of the passengers had been injured, if not killed, and the conductor was using the head-phone hook-up to get help. He advised the engineer to close the airline valve at the head of the wrecked coach, which would let him control the rest of the train’s brakes.

Then, after arranging for the fireman to go on ahead to protect that train, he hurried back to assist the rest of the crew in caring for the victims. An hour or so later, a special train, carrying doctors, nurses, food, and medical supplies arrived from the Grand Forks, some 40 miles ahead. They found that the explosion had killed eight passengers and injured a dozen or so more. After they had been taken to the nearest hospital, a wrecker removed the damaged coach to let No. 11 continue its run.

An investigation into the cause of the explosion proved beyond a doubt that dynamite had caused it. Although several theories were suggested, the mystery of that fateful moonlit night was never solved.

[:I] NASA decided to send a shuttle into space with two monkeys and an astronaut, and trained them for several months. When they thought they were all ready, they placed all three in the shuttle and got ready to send the team up into space.
As the moment came closer, NASA's mission control center announced, ''This is mission control to Monkey One. Do your stuff.''
At that the first monkey started typing like mad and suddenly the shuttle's engines ignited and the shuttle took off.
Two hours later, NASA's mission control center announced, ''This is mission control to Monkey Two. Do your stuff.''
At that the second monkey started typing like mad and suddenly the shuttle separated from the empty fuel tanks.
Another two hours later NASA's mission control center announced, ''This is mission control to the astronaut...''
At this the astronaut shouted ''I know, I know. Feed the monkeys and don't touch anything.'' [:I]

[pwolfe]

Hi Tom and all.

A quick pint of Bathams while I take a break from the work on the house please LEON.

Glad you are having a great time TOM TED and ROB and today looks full of good things going on. Is it really a month since the 1st year birthday bash.

Some great posts today with DOUGS almost unbelievable article on the streetcar riot over a cent rise in fares.
Thanks CM3 for the Amtrak switching info. and for the great piece from the notebook,
a station scene which happened every day but described as to make it feel as you were there. A true talent.[bow].

AL I hope it is not too long before you are able to go to Toronto. Many thanks for the CP and CN Streamline cars posts [tup] It was good to read the details of the 'Park" cars on the Canadian as shown in Tom's pics of the CAN-AM.

Well I am being yelled at to get back to work. At least there was time to read the posts so I hope I can call in later PETE.

[passengerfan]

Good Afternoon all.Time for a CR and a round for the house. Since I gave the CP dining and lounge cars preference this AM I guess I should do the same for the CN this Afternoon.

CANADIAN
NATIONAL
(CNR)
Streamlined Dining & Lounge Cars
by Al


In 1954 the Canadian National received new streamlined cars from Pullman Standard, National Steel Car Co. Ltd. and Canadian Car & Foundry Ltd. The orders were among the largest orders placed for streamlined equipment. From National Steel Car came new head end cars to equip the new passenger trains soon to enter service. From Canadian Car & Foundry 212 new 80-seat coaches’ one of the largest orders for one type car ever ordered. The remaining streamlined car types were built by Pullman Standard for services the length and breadth of Canada. Many interior appointments of the Pullman Standard cars were added to the cars after delivery to Canadian National in the railroads own shops.
In May 1954 eight 2-Compartment 2-Double Bedroom Buffet 29-seat Lounge cars were delivered for operation in the OCEAN LIMITED, INTERNATIONAL LIMITED and overnight Toronto – Montreal services. All eight CAPE series car were transferred to VIA Rail Canada in March 1978.

2-COMPARTMENT 2-DOUBLE BEDROOM BUFFET 29-SEAT LOUNGE CARS Pullman Standard May 1954 Plan: 4189A Lot: 6928 (Built for and assigned to OCEAN LIMITED – INTERNATIONAL LIMITED – CAVALIER)

1082 CAPE ROSIER

1083 CAPE BRULE

1084 CAPE PORCUPINE

1085 CAPE RACE

1086 CAPE CANSO

1087 CAPE BRETON

1088 CAPE CHIGNECTO

1089 CAPE TORMENTINE

Four “WHITE” series cars with 8 Sections 1 Double Bedroom 16-seat Dinette and Kitchen were delivered in June 1954. These cars were built for service in the new SUPER CONTINENTAL between Capreol and Winnipeg through the remote territory of northern Ontario the railroad passed through. The 1010 WHITE ROCK was rebuilt to a club car with seating for 38 and an airline style galley was installed for the first class passengers. The car was renumbered and renamed after rebuilding in May 1964 receiving the new number 663 and name CLUB DE LA GARNISON. A similar rebuilding took place to 1011 WHITE RAPIDS in July 1964 and the new name and number 662 CLUB LAURIER was applied. The other two cars 1012 WHITE OAK and 1013 WHITE SANDS were renumbered only 1358 and 1357 in that order in July 1964. All four cars were transferred to VIA Rail Canada ownership in March 1978.

8-SECTION 1-DOUBLE BEDROOM 16-SEAT DINETTE KITCHEN CARS Pullman Standard June 1954 Plan: 4188 Lot: 6927 (Built for and assigned to SUPER CONTINENTAL across Northern Ontario)

1010 WHITE ROCK

1011 WHITE RAPIDS

1012 WHITE OAK

1013 WHITE SANDS

Nine Kitchen 16-Seat Dinette 20-seat Parlor Cars were also part of the huge Pullman Standard order and were delivered in July 1954. These cars were built for services between Halifax – Sydney, St. John – Cape Tormentine, Toronto – Niagara Falls, Winnipeg – Saskatoon and Winnipeg and Port Arthur. Instead the cars operated between Toronto – Sarnia, Toronto – Windsor, Montreal – Ottawa and Montreal – Quebec City. All nine cars transferred to VIA Rail Canada service in March 1978. Originally numbered 900 to 908 the cars were renumbered 1360 – 1368 between April and June 1965.

KITCHEN 16-SEAT DINETTE 20-SEAT PARLOR CARS Pullman Standard May 1954 Plan: 7638 Lot: 6929 (Built for and assigned to various services)

900 FRANCOISE LAKE

901 BABINE LAKE

902 BEAVERHILL LAKE

903 MOOSE LAKE

904 SEVERN LAKE

905 RADIANT LAKE

906 GRAND LAKE

907 BRAS D’OR LAKE

908 LUSTER LAKE

Pullman Standard delivered a very large lot consisting of fourteen dining cars to the CN in August 1954, these cars were configured as 40-seat dining cars but many later were converted to full 48-seat dining cars. The conversion was simply a matter of replacing four tables for two with four tables for four and the addition of eight dining chairs. The CN initially assigned these cars to the SUPER CONTINENTAL and OCEAN LIMITED. In later years these cars could be found operating in any train as all streamlined dining cars were pooled. The cars were numbered 1337 – 1350 and all were transferred to VIA Rail Canada in March 1978 except for 1345 that was wrecked retired and scrapped in June 1975.

40-SEAT DINING CARS Pullman Standard August 1954 (Built for and assigned to SUPER CONTINENTAL – OCEAN LIMITED)

1337 - 1350


There were six 26-seat Lunch Counter 6-crew dormitory cars delivered by Pullman Standard in September 1954. The CN referred to these cars as dinettes and all carried numbers 425 – 430. Initially the cars were assigned to the SUPER CONTINENTAL between Montreal and Winnipeg and to pool train service between Toronto and Montreal. All six cars were transferred to VIA Rail Canada in March 1978.

6-CREW DORMITORY 26-SEAT LUNCH COUNTER CARS Pullman Standard September 1954 (Built for and assigned to SUPER CONTINENTAL)

425 – 430

In 1965 Canadian National in anticipation of the coming EXPO 67 realized there would be a shortage of Dining cars especially if two sections of certain trains were operated.
The easiest solution to this shortage was to rebuild ten of their 60-revenue seat coaches built by Canadian Car & Foundry dating from April 1947 into 48-seat dining cars. This was undertaken in the railroads Montreal shops and ten dining cars were completed during the year. They were numbered 1369-1378 after rebuilding were assigned to the SUPER CONTINENTAL and PANORAMA pool of cars operating between Montreal and Vancouver. These ten cars except for 1373 were all transferred to VIA Rail Canada. Dining car 1373 was destroyed by fire in 1971 retired and scrapped.

CN 1369 originally CN 5384

CN 1370 originally CN 5385

CN 1371 originally CN 5387

CN 1372 originally CN 5391

CN 1373 originally CN 5392

CN 1374 originally CN 5397

CN 1375 originally CN 5398

CN 1376 originally CN 5401

CN 1377 originally CN 5408

CN 1378 originally CN 5410

Beginning in August 1967 the Canadian National introduced new Tempo trains to southwest Ontario services. The new trains were the first HEP powered trains to enter Canadian service. Hawker Siddeley Canada Ltd constructed the cars at their Thunder Bay plant. These cars were Aluminum and carried the brushed aluminum finish with black accents. Service was provided from Toronto by two routes to London, Ont. Where the routes joined but only briefly until they split once again with one line going to Sarnia the other to Windsor. The Tempo trains were powered by 1,800 hp MLW RS-18 Road Switchers painted in a gray and orange scheme. A Cummins HEP package was installed in the short hood to provide the train’s hotel power.
Originally their were five 39-seat Club cars (Parlor cars) equipped with Airline style galleys to provide food and beverage service at the club car seats, seating was paired seats on one side of the aisle and single seats on the other. These five cars were numbered 320-324. In 1967 car 320 was remodeled to an 80-seat Coach and renumbered 375. Two years later in 1969 car 324 was remodeled to a 52-revenue seat coach and retained its galley with no change of number. This car provided a semi first class service between Toronto and London for a fare less than club but higher than regular coach. In 1974 the car was shopped once again and converted to an 80-seat coach and renumbered 376.
Also in August 1967 there were five 16-revenue seat coach snack bar 26-seat lounge cars delivered for TEMPO service with numbers 340-344. In 1969 car 341 was remodeled with 24-revenue coach seats. It retained the snack bar and 26-seat lounge. Passengers could purchase snacks and return to their seats with their purchases to consume those purchases using a pull down tray from the seat ahead. The beverage lounge was separated from the rest of the one end of the car by a corridor down one side, this kept minors out of the beverage lounge area.

TTFN Al

[Anonymous]

Thank you for thinking of me, Tom! I did locate an issue, and will have it mailed to me next week! MUCH appreciated!

A name, eh? Heck, help yourself. Michaelson is my 'web' identity anyway at several forums, so an 'alias' to my 'alias' is as convoluted as anything else that goes on in the wonderful world of the www, I'd say.[(-D]

Next time you pass through, you'll have to stop by the distillery again. They've built a brand new visitors center, and it's a nice place to go to just get off the 'big road' for a while. It was a great place to take the kids back in the day as everything was free, and it got them out of the house for a while. (grins)

Regards! Michaelson....er....Jack....what ever. (grins)

[coalminer3]

Good Morning Barkeep and all Present; coffee, please, round for the house and $ for the jukebox.

Glad to see that folks made it to Toronto. I, too, would like to be there, but....................

Pete – There is still some station switching done here, but most of it is by Amtrak..

Barndad – Thanks for the CB&Q material. The piece abt. the streetcar riot was a good one – I’m surprised they haven’t thought of that in Boston.

Al – Again, thanks so much for sharing car-related material.

Herewith a little something from the notebooks.

In the smoky West Virginia air stood a small group of people on the platform at the brick railroad station waiting for the New York train. Their talk was typical of any mountain town; the women discussing children, families, birth and death; and the men hunting, fishing and the latest gossip from up and down the river. These were hard working people; black and white, tied together for a short time by the common bond of waiting for the New York train.

Obediently following its four locomotives, a 90-car coal train swung off the branch line west of the station and clumped by the building. Three more engines were on the rear with the caboose tucked in behind them. The train pulled off the main line and onto the yard lead only to be passed by another coal train on the main. The second train was an interdivisional or “ID” coal train pulled by four diesels. Smoke billowed up from the tops of the engines and sand poured down as they tried to keep their footing on the rails while pulling the heavy train.

Inside, the ticket agent sold a last coach ticket for Washington, slid the ticket window shut, and made sure the office was locked before lighting another cigarette and going outside to drag the heavy baggage wagon, its iron wheels clanking, down to the east end of the cracked concrete platform.

A sharp-eared passenger heard a locomotive blowing for the tunnel west of the station and said, “Here it comes.” Another blast from the horn and the train surged out of the tunnel, roared past the station and braked to a noisy screeching halt. Here, clearly, was an engineer who liked to bring it in fast and hit the mark as he stopped. The car doors opened and a handful of passengers climbed down while others boarded. Up front, the agent handed suitcases and boxes into the baggage car’s gaping doors. The baggage handler passed a few suitcases and boxes down to the ticket agent along with a manila envelope stamped “R.R.B.” This was company mail. The conductor stood impatiently by the open coach door, waiting for the two men to fini***heir work. They were done. The conductor flipped a highball signal to the engineer; two blasts on the horn, the “sough” of releasing brakes, and the train was rolling again, continuing its journey east.

Work safe

[trolleyboy]

Good morning folks. Just thought that I would pop in for a quike OJ and #3 before I head out and nab Tom and Ted and head down onto the trainstation.Looks like the weather is going to cooperate today which is a [tup] thing for sure. Like Tom said wish you all were here.

Doug Great article, I do hate seeing streetcars on their roofs like that though.[:(] I'm glad that people don't react to fair increases like thta anymore [:O]

Al' Great to see you back in the saddle sir [tup]. I can't think of a more appropriate streamliner for this morning [tup]


Well folks time to skeedaddle.

Rob

[passengerfan]

Good Morning to Doug and whoever else is at the bar this AM. Time for a coffee and one of those crumpets from the Mentor Bakery.

Happy to hear the rendevous is going great inspite of Mother Nature.

As soon as my Dr. will let me I hope to be following in your footsteps to Toronto.

Guess we should have some train information this AM.

Since the leader is in Toronto we should have something Canadian.

CANADIAN
PACIFIC
(CPR)
Streamlined Dining & Lounge Cars
by Al

The Canadian Pacific operated a number of lightweight streamlined dining and lounge cars. Many were built in the CP Montreal shops from frames supplied by National Steel Car Company Ltd. The CPR built four streamlined trains in 1936 for high-speed service in Alberta, Ontario, and Quebec powered by new 4-4-4 streamlined “Jubilee” locomotives. Each four-car train was identical a Baggage-Buffet-8-seat Dinette 20-seat Coach provided the food and beverage service on these trains. The total seating capacity of the trains was 100. The two train sets operated in Quebec ran between Montreal – Quebec City as the WINDSOR and FRONTENAC. The train between Toronto and Detroit was named the ROYAL YORK. The western train was named the CHINOOK operating round trip daily between Calgary and Edmonton. Car numbers 3051 and 3052 were retired in 1967 and rebuilt for Maintenance of Way service. The 3051 was sold to the National Museum of Science and Technology where it is displayed today.
Car numbers 3050 and 3053 were retired from service in 1969 and sold for scrap.

25’ BAGGAGE BUFFET 8-SEAT DINETTE 20-SEAT COACHES CPR Shops August – September 1936 (Built for assignment to the CHINOOK FRONTENAC ROYAL YORK WINDSOR)

3050 – 3053

In June 1938 an additional streamlined car was built for one of he trains the ROYAL YORK. This car was a Buffet 17-seat Lounge 22-seat Parlor Observation car. The observation end of this car was blunt ad equipped with a diaphragm at both ends. There were windows on either side of the diaphragm of the end of the car operated as the observation end. In 1968 the 6630 was sold to the QNS&L with no change of number or paint scheme.

BUFFET 17-SEAT LOUNGE 22-SEAT PARLOR OBSERVATION CPR Shops June 1938 (Built for and assigned to ROYAL YORK)

6630

Between September 1947 and March 1949 CPR Montreal shops constructed ninety-nine 68-seat coaches divided into smoking and non-smoking sections the smoking section seating 24 and the non-smoking section seating 44. The cars were numbered 2200 – 2298, the reason they are mentioned here is that three of these cars 2289 –2291 were rebuilt in 1958 to 40-seat Parlor cars renumbered 6600 – 6602 arranged with two and one seating and were equipped with an airline style galley for food service at passengers seats. The cars were assigned to the pool trains between Montreal and Toronto operated jointly with the CNR.
In 1953 the CPR decided to streamline their transcontinental services with two train’s one new fully streamlined train the CANADIAN the other train named the DOMINION would be partially equipped with new streamlined cars and heavyweights in combination.
Each streamlined CANADIAN was assigned three feature cars per consist and the DOMINION was likewise equipped with the new cars built by Budd with Canadian content such as trucks and other items in the cars construction. In order to equip the two transcontinental streamliners the CPR ordered a total of 54 feature cars from Budd to equip the CANADIAN, DOMINION and ATLANTIC LIMITED with spares held in reserve. There were three types of feature cars the SKYLINE DOME car was a multi-purpose car with 26 coach seats forward of the dome on the main level, beneath the dome was a kitchen and six seat dinette, on the main level aft of the dome was a Buffet area with seating for 23 where meals and beverages were consumed by coach passengers of the CANADIAN and DOMINION. Those SKYLINE Dome cars assigned to the ATLANTIC LIMITED served both the coach and sleeping car passengers of that train as the SKYLINE Dome was the only food and beverage car in the consists. The standard 24-seat dome was for coach passengers of the CANADIAN and DOMINION. Each consist carried a single SKYLINE Dome car. The cars all carried the name SKLINE on there flanks and were numbered 500 – 517 All SKYLINE Dome cars were transferred to VIA Rail Canada ownership.

24-SEAT DOME 26-SEAT COACH KITCHEN 6-SEAT DINETTE 23-SEAT BUFFET CARS Budd Company 1954 – 1955 (Built for and assigned to CANADIAN – DOMINION – ATLANTIC LIMITED)

500 – 517

There were eighteen 48-seat dining cars built for the CANADIAN, DOMINION and pool service trains between Montreal and Toronto. They were assigned one per consist to each of the trains. The CANADIAN and DOMINION operated with two Dining room crews in their transcontinental trips. One crew operated between Montreal and Winnipeg the other between Winnipeg and Vancouver. This practice is continued today in VIA Rail Canada service. The new 48 seat dining cars were named only assigned names of Canadian Pacific Hotel Dining Rooms and Lounges.

48-SEAT DINING CARS Budd Company 1954 – 1955 (Built for and assigned to CANADIAN – DOMINION)

ACADIAN

ALEXANDRA

ALHAMBRA

ANNAPOLIS

CARTIER

CHAMPLAIN

EMERALD

EMPRESS

FAIRHOLME

FRONTENAC

IMPERIAL

KENT

LOUISE

PALLISER

PRINCESS

SELKIRK

WASCANA

YORK

The most talked about car in the CANADIAN and DOMINION trains were the PARK series Dome –Sleeper Lounge Observation cars. These cars were the perfect ending to any streamliner. Almost identical to those built for the CB&Q-D&RGW-WP CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR America’s cruise train, it was only fitting that Canada’s cruise train the CANADIAN have similar cars carrying the tail signs. These eighteen cars built for the CANADIAN and Dominion carried names only. The names selected were the names of Provincial and National Parks thus the reason the cars were always referred to as the Park cars. The interiors of these cars were floor planned with 3-double bedrooms 1-Drawing Room on the main level forward of the dome on the main level. Beneath the dome was a bar and 12-seat cocktail lounge, to the rear once again on the main level was a 14-seat Lounge Observation. The Dome level seated the usual 24 ad the PARK cars were for the exclusive use of sleeping car passengers. Of the eighteen built seventeen all but YOHO PARK that was destroyed in an accident went to VIA Rail Canada. Next to the car names below is the province where the park is located.

24-SEAT DOME 3-DOUBLE BEDROOM 1-DRAWING ROOM 12-SEAT LOUNGE BAR 14-SEAT LOUNGE OBSERVATIONS Budd Company 1954-55 (Built for and assigned to CANADIAN – DOMINION)

ALGONQUIN PARK – ONTARIO

ASSINIBOINE PARK – B. C.

BANFF PARK – ALBERTA

EVANGELINE PARK – N. S.

FUNDY PARK – N. B.

GLACIER PARK – B. C.

KOKANEE PARK – B. C.

KOOTENAY PARK – B. C.

LAURENTIDE PARK – QUEBEC

PRINCE ALBERT PARK – SASK.

REVELSTOKE PARK – B. C.

RIDING MOUNTAIN PARK – MANITOBA

SIBLEY PARK – ONTARIO

STRATHCONA PARK – B. C.

TREMBLANT PARK – QUEBEC

TWEEDSMUIR PARK – B. C.

WATERTON PARK – ALBERTA

YOHO PARK – B. C.

All CPR Budd built cars surviving went to VIA Rail Canada ownership when the Canadian Government took over national passenger services.

TTFN Al

[Anonymous]

Wow! Even on official "Our Place" business, Tom finds the time to post! Hope you guys have a terrific time, and I sure wish I could be with you. I'll just be making my own breakfast around here this morning. Don't worry, the Mentor Bakery made its usual morning delivery without any hitches.

Here's a little something to read with your morning coffee:

Streetcar Riot by Stephen D. Maguire – August 1975 Railroad Magazine

Muskegon Traction & Lighting Co. fare-raise riot at intersection of Western Ave. and Pine St., Muskegon, Mich., August 5, 1919. Trolleys 41, 49, 63, and 83 are scrambled.


One of the most unusual events in streetcar history occurred in Muskegon, Michigan early in August 1919, the Muskegon Traction and Lighting Co., that operated the local trolley system, announced a raise in fare from six to seven cents.

Normally such an announcement would have been greeted by nothing worse than verbal protests. But on the cool, rainy evening of August 4th, when the fare had gone up one cent, a mob of about 1,000 people unexpectedly swooped down on the car barn at Franklin and Michigan streets, and, with the yards and streets packed with onlookers, systematically wrecked streetcars. They violently pushed a few over, drove some into each other, and burned at least one.

Of the 30 cars in service and stored at the barn, 12 were destroyed others damaged, on that night between 10 p.m. and 3 a.m., when the city officials finally restored order. But even then the downtown area was a shambles, with the damaged and toppled trolleys blocking the street. At least one death was recorded. A 22-year old man jumped from a car, nearly severing a leg, and died three days later in a local hospital.

Nearly 20 persons were arrested after the incident and the supposed leader was charged under a new anti-Communist law. Only one of those originally arrested was acquitted. The others, charged with rioting, either pleaded guilty or were convicted by juries. The city officials became targets of special investigators appointed by Michigan’s attorney general. When the investigations ended, Governor Albert E. Sleeper found Muskegon Mayor John H. Moore and eight aldermen guilty of official misconduct and negligence of duty in their efforts to quell the riot. And all over a penny fare increase!

The city saw its first streetcar line built in 1882 as the Muskegon Street Railway Co., with eight horsecars, 30 horses, and a capital investment of $30,000. Electric service, instituted in 1889, was primarily a city operation but later there were short extensions to neighboring Bluffton, Lake Michigan, and Mona Lake.

Nearly ten years after the riots, Muskegon trolley service ended on October 19, 1929. A last-minute effort to allow the public to take over and operate the system was made in September, a month before, but defeated at the polls by a 5 to 1 vote. The facts came from an article by Tom Younkman in the Muskegon Chronicle.

Looking east on Western Ave. below Pine St. shows MT&L 27 on side jammed into 83 in center. Car 63 is on right. Note International Harvester truck, horse and wagon, and Model T car. Photographs from Lawrence M. Carlson collection.


[:I] Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, and the wisdom to hide the bodies of those I had to kill because they pissed me off.
And also, help me to be careful of the toes I step on today, as they may be connected to the***that I may have to kiss tomorrow.
Help me to always give 100% at work: 12% on Monday, 23% on Tuesday, 40% on Wednesday, 20% on Thursday, 5% on Friday.
And help me to remember: When I'm having a really bad day, and it seems that people are trying to **** me off, that it takes 42 muscles to frown and only 4 to extend my middle finger and tell them to bite me. [:I]

[siberianmo]

HAPPY 13th MONTH ANNIVERSARY to "Our" Place!!!"


Good Morning Gents!

A cloudy, but dry day - so far! Rendezvous in Toronto begins this day with the boarding of VIA Rail at 9 AM (or thereabouts - thereaboots!)[swg]

Gonna be a GREAT DAY and wish you all were here . . . .

Catch y'all tonite . . . [tup][tup][tup]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[siberianmo]

Hello Guyz!

Communicating from Brantford, Ontario, Canada via the marvels of hi-tech! [swg]

No way I'm going to provide anything more than a THANX to one and all for keeping the Thread "up on the page!" [tup][tup][tup]

Rob - Ted 'n I have just concluded our "getting to know you" session at a bar/restaurant in a small village known as St. George. Delightful place - great food - cold beer and lotsa good conversation! As "they say" - wish you were here! [tup]

Tomorrow we embark upon our steel wheels on steel rails Official Rendezvous Day!. It begins with a VIA Rail trip into Toronto's Union Station - then a round of travel experiences aboard Toronto's "GO Tranist" - subways 'n trolleys. Should be a blast!

Unfortunately the weather has been less than ideal. Lots of rain, poor visibility and rather chilly. However, nothing can or will dampen our enthusiasm for enjoying the sights 'n sounds of Toronto's rail offerings . . . . [tup]

Meeting these two guys - up close 'n personal - is indeed "something else!" Ted is as genuine an "article" as any guy could be and Rob is every bit "himself" in person as he is at the bar! Sez a lot, eh[?] You bet!

Appreciate all of the efforts put forth by one and all - especially those who took the time to Post over on "my other Thread!!" [tup][tup][tup]

Good to have you back with us, Al and we "toasted" you tonight - I know it is a "bittersweet' thing - but there will be another time!

Cindy you're a sweetheart for pitching in . . . and I thank you Boris 'n Leon for keeping the place runnin' . . . [tup][tup][tup]

See y'all tomorrow night . . .

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[passengerfan]

Good Evening All Time for a CR and a round for the house.

I shall do one mopre CB&Q post and call it a day. They were truly a great railroad and offered passenger service second to none. Every Budd car they ordered was deluxe with full skirting no other railroad did the same.

CHICAGO
BURLINGTON
&
QUINCY
(CB&Q)
Streamlined Dining and Lounge Cars
by Al

In June 1933 the CB&Q ordered a three car articulated streamliner from the Budd Company of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. The new train delivered in April 1934 became known as the PIONEER ZEPHYR. The famous shovelnose diesel was introduced with this train and ideas introduced in this train would be incorporated in even today’s streamlined trains such as the Amtrak Talgo train sets operating in the Pacific Northwest. The first articulated unit 9900 included the engineer’s compartment, engine room, 30’Railway Post Office compartment and a 15-3/4’ Baggage compartment. The center articulated unit 505 provided a 29-1/2’ baggage compartment, the train heat boiler, a buffet followed by the cars entrance and a 20-revenue seat coach compartment. The third articulated unit 570 featured a 40-revenue coach seating compartment forward with the cars entrance next followed by a pair of bathrooms on either side of the center aisle and a 12 passenger parlor lounge observation. The car we are concerned with here is the 505.
The Buffet was a compact kitchen located ahead of the cars entrance and contained stove refrigerator and preparation area as well as pantry and sinks for dishwashing etc. Passengers were served at their seat, as there was no room in the tiny 5-1/2’ buffet for serving them. The PIONEER ZEPHYR is now on permanent display at the Museum of Science and Industry located along Chicago’s lakeshore.

ARTICULATED BAGAGE BUFFET 20-REVENUE SEAT COACH Budd Company April 1934 (Became the second car in the PIONEER ZPHYR)

505
Two new three car articulated Zephyrs arrived from Budd in March 1933 for Chicago – Twin Cities service as the TWIN ZEPHYRS. The two power units 9901 and 9902 contained an engineer’s compartment, engine room 28-3/4’ Baggage compartment and train heat boiler room. The center car featured a kitchen Pantry and four-seat lunch counter occupying the first 13-1/2’ of cars 550 and 101. Next were the cars entrance followed by a 40-revenue seat coach section in which the first eight seats forward on each side of the aisle doubled as a dining area. Most passengers of these two trains were again served at their seats. The third articulated cars 571 and 102 provided a 26-revenue coach section forward, the cars entrance and behind a pair of restrooms was a 24-seat parlor lounge Observation.

ARTICULATED KITCHEN PANTRY 4-SEAT LUNCH COUNTER 40-REVENUE SEAT COACHES Budd Company March 1935 (Built for and assigned to TWIN ZEPHYRS)

550, 101

In October 1935 the CB&Q received an articulated four-car train set the MARK TWAIN ZEPHYR. Each of the four articulated units that comprised the train were numbered and named. The names reflected characters from MARK TWAIN novels. The shovelnose cab unit 9903 *** JOE featured the engineers compartment, engine room, 30’Railway Post Office Compartment and 15’Baggage compartment. The second articulated car 506 BECKY THATCHER was a 64’full baggage car. Car 531 HUCKLEBERRY FINN featured a kitchen and pantry followed by the cars entry next came a 16-seat dinette and 20-revenue seat coach compartment. The last car 572 TOM SAWYER provided 40-revenue seat coach compartment the cars center entrance and a 16- seat parlor lounge Observation. The four-car train was assigned to a daily round trip between St. Louis and Burlington, Iowa.

ARTICULATED KITCHEN-PANTRY 16-SEAT DINETTE 20-REVENUE SEAT COACH Budd Company October 1935 (Built for and assigned to MARK TWAIN ZEPHYR)

551 HUCKLEBERRY FINN

In October 1936 the CB&Q received two ten-car streamliners for service as the DENVER ZEPHYRS. Each of these trains was powered by an A-B set of Shovelnose diesels with 1,800 hp in the Cab unit and 1,200 hp in the booster unit. The trains were comprised of articulated and single cars with one set of three articulated cars and two pairs of articulated cars the remaining three were all single cars. The second car in each consist was a Baggage 12-crew dormitory Bar 34-seat cocktail lounge car either 980 SILVER LINING or 981 SILVER BAR. The here car articulated set comprised two coaches and the third unit was a 40-seat dining car either 152-SILVER GRILL or 153 SILVER SERVICE. The last car in each DENVER ZEPHYR offered 10-seat parlor, desk, and 1-booth seating four, buffet 1-booth seating four and the lounge observation seated 22. These two cars were numbered and named 230 SILVER FLASH and 231 SILVER STREAK.

BAGGAGE 12-CREW DORMITORY BAR 34 SEAT COCKTAIL LOUNGE CARS Budd Company October 1936 (Built for and assigned to DENVER ZEPHYRS)

980 SILVER LINING

981 SILVER BAR

ARTICULATED 64-REVENUE SEAT COACH ARTICULATED 38-REVENUE SEAT COACH ARTICULATED 40-SEAT DINING CAR SET Budd Company October 1936 (Built for and assigned to DENVER ZEPHYRS)

4631 SILVER CITY
4632 SILVER LAKE
152 SILVER GRILL

4633 SILVER SPRUCE
4634 SILVER PLUME
153 SILVER SERVICE

10-SEAT PARLOR BUFFET 8-SEAT CARD AREA 22-SEAT LOUNGE OBSERVATIONS Budd Company October 1936 (Built for and assigned to DENVER ZEPHYRS)

230 SILVER FLASH

231 SILVER STREAK

Less than two months later in December 1936 the CB&Q received two six-car articulated trains to replace the earlier TWIN ZEPHYRS. A single 1,800 hp shovelnose diesel unit, the last of their kind purchased by the railroad, powered each of these fully articulated trains. These two trains were named the TRAIN OF THE GODS and TRAIN OF THE GODDESSES. Each train set operated a round trip daily between Chicago and the Twin Cities. The first articulated car in each consist was an Auxiliary power, Baggage Bar 34-seat cocktail lounge car 960-VENUS or 961 APOLLO. The fourth articulated car in each consist was a 32-seat dining car 150-CERES or 151-VULCAN. The last articulated car in each consist 24-revenue parlor seats 10-seat lounge observation 225JUNO or 226 JUPITER.

ARTICULATED AUXILIARY POWER 10’ BAGGAGE BAR 34-SEAT COCKTAIL LOUNGE CARS Budd Company December 1936 (Built for and assigned to TWIN ZEPHYRS)

960 VENUS

961 APOLLO

ARTICULATED 32-SEAT DINING CARS Budd Company December 1936 (Built for and assigned to TWIN ZEPHYRS)

150 CERES

151 VULCAN

ARTICULATED 24-REVENUE SEAT PARLOR 10-SEAT LOUNGE OBSERVATIONS Budd Company December 1936 (Built for and assigned to TWIN ZEPHYRS)

225 JUNO

226 JUPITER

In June 1938 the CB&Q received a single articulated car to be added to the PIONEER ZEPHYR number 500. This car was trainlined third in the train with the trains observation articulated to the rear. This car featured a Kitchen-Pantry 16-seat Dinette 24-revenue coach seats. The 505 thereafter operated as a baggage car only after that time with the Buffet and coach seating removed. The windows remained but the interior was stripped.

ARTICULATED KITCHEN-PANTRY 16-SEAT DINETTE 24-REVENUE SEAT COACH Budd Company June 1938 (Built for and assigned to PIONEER ZEPHYR)

500

In August 1937 Budd delivered two additional articulated cars to increase the capacity of the TRAIN OF THE GODS and TRAIN OF THE GODDESSES. One car was added to each consist with 4850 PSYCHE going to the TRAIN OF THE GODS and 4851 CUPID being added to the TRAIN OF THE GODS. Each of these cars featured 40-revenue coach seats and 16-seat dining area. These cars were trainlined just ahead of dining cars 150 CERES and 151 VULCAN with their kitchens serving the dining areas in 4850 PSYCHE and 4851 CUPID.

ARTICULATED 40-SEAT COACH 16-SEAT DINETTES Budd Company August 1937 (Built for and added to TWIN ZEPHYRS)

4850 PSYCHE

4851 CUPID

In May 1938 the CB&Q received two 87’cars to be added one per consist to the DENVER ZEPHYRS. These cars featured a 16-seat dinette at one end a buffet next and 48-revenue coach seats. The two cars 4852 SILVER BEAM and 4853 SILVER BELL were trainlined directly behind the DENVER ZEPHYR Auxiliary power, Crew Dormitory, Bar Cocktail lounge cars.

16-SEAT DINETTE BUFFET 48-REVENUE SEAT COACHES Budd Company May 1938 (Built for and added to the DENVER ZEPHYRS)

4852 SILVER BEAM

4853 SILVER BELL

All future streamlined cars would be constructed to full streamlined car dimensions and there would be no further articulated cars built for the CB&Q.
In May 1938 the CB&Q received three dining cars from Budd with a most unusual seating arrangement of regular tables seating 24 and seating with backs to the windows that seated an additional 15. This gave these cars a 39-seat total in the same space that an all dining table arrangement would have seated 48. All three were converted to 48-seat dining cars early in their CB&Q careers. These three cars were assigned to the heavyweight ARISTOCRATS between Chicago and Denver there only permanent assignment. It is believed they operated in the They were assigned to the TWIN ZEPHYRS before that train received its Vista Dome equipment in 1947. They became the substitute dining cars for whatever ZEPHYR needed one. All three were numbered and named with SILVER prefix names now standard naming practice for Budd built cars operated by the CB&Q.

39-SEAT DINING CARS Budd Company May 1938 (Built for and assigned to ARISTOCRAT later assigned to General service)

190 SILVER PHEASANT

191 SILVER INN

192 SILVER SPOON

The next four lightweight streamlined dining cars delivered to the CB&Q were actually dining parlor observations. Two of these were delivered in 1939 one in March for the GENERAL PERSHING ZEPHYR between St. Louis and Kansas City round trip daily. This four –car train operated with the last shovelnose diesel built CB&Q 9908 SILVER CHARGER, a single 1,000 hp diesel occupied the forward part of the car body and a baggage compartment the rear half. The fourth car 301 SILVER STAR featured Kitchen-Pantry 24-seat dining 22-seat parlor observation.
The second of these cars delivered to the CB&Q in 1939 was 300 SILVER SPIRIT delivered in October. This car identical to the 301 SILVER STAR was assigned initially to the SILVER STREAK ZEPHYR operating a daily round trip between Lincoln and Kansas City by way of Omaha and St. Joseph. This was a five-car train with a single 2,000 hp EMC E5A unit up front for power.

24-SEAT DINING 22-REVENUE SEAT PARLOR OBSERVATION Budd Company March 1939 (Built for and assigned to GENERAL PERSHING ZEPHYR)

301 SILVER STAR

24-SEAT DINING 22-REVENUE SEAT PARLOR OBSERVATION Budd Company October 1939 (Built for and assigned to SILVER STREAK ZEPHYR)

300 SILVER SPIRIT

The two remaining cars of the above type were delivered to the CB&Q in June 1940. Initially they were assigned to the AK-SAR-BEN ZEPHYR. The names and numbers of this pair were 302 SILVER HOURS and 303 SILVER FOUNTAIN. The 302 SILVER HOURS operated for most of its service life bringing up the markers of the SAM HOUSTON ZEPHYR between Dallas/Fort Worth and Houston round trip daily.

24-SEAT DINING 22-REVENUE SEAT PARLOR OBSERVATIONS Budd Company June 1940 (Built for and assigned to AK-SAR-BEN ZEPHYR)

302 SILVER HOURS

303 SILVER TRAYS

Except for cars built for the CB&Q subsidiaries FW&D and C&S this covers the prewar streamlined feature cars of the Burlington. For the information on the FW&D and C&S cars see those respective chapters.
Following WW II the CB&Q was anxious to complete the modernization of their passenger services with additional Budd built cars. The first train to receive completely new consists following the war were the VISTA-DOME TWIN ZEPHYRS of December 1947. Not only did these trains introduce the modern dome to the traveling public, but also they were among the finest day streamliners ever built.
The first car in each VISTA-DOME TWIN ZEPHYR was a baggage buffet bar 33-seat lounge car 800 SILVER BUFFET or 801 SILVER SALON. These cars were delivered in December 1947 in time for the train’s inaugural.
The next two cars were the dining cars assigned to each VISTA-DOME TWIN ZEPHYR they were not delivered by Budd until January 1948 and for the trains inaugural two of the pre-war streamlined 39-seat dining cars were substituted for about a month. The train’s dining cars were standard Budd 48-seat dining cars that would become standard from that company. As one entered the dining area from either the kitchen end of the car or the adjoining car they were greeted with a booth on either side of the center aisle with seating for four. Between these booths on either side of the center aisle were four standard dining tables with seating for four. The advantage of this type arrangement allowed the booths to seat passengers during off peak periods until dining space at the tables became available. Cocktails were usually served at these booths before lunch or dinner. During peak travel times the booths were set as regular dining space, sometimes all four booths or one at each end of the car depending on how many were expected for dinner. The two built for and assigned to the VISTA-DOME TWIN ZEPHYRS were 196 SILVER SALVER and 197 SILVER FEAST.

BAGGAGE BUFFET BAR 39-SEAT COCKTAIL LOUNGE CARS Budd Company December 1947 (Built for and assigned to VISTA-DOME TWIN ZEPHYRS)

800 SILVER BUFFET

801 SILVER SALON

48-SEAT DINING CARS Budd Company January 1948 (Built for and assigned to VISTA-DOME TWIN ZEPHYRS)

196 SILVER SALVER

197 SILVER FEAST

Probably one of the most famous postwar trains to enter service was the jointly owned and operated VISTA-DOME CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR operating between Chicago and Oakland pier. The CB&Q operated the trains between Chicago and Denver, the D&RGW operated the trains between Denver and Salt Lake City and the WP operated the trains between Salt Lake City and Oakland. These trains like the VISTA-DOME TWIN ZEPHYRS that preceded them carried five domes in each consist. There were three feature cars in each eleven-car VISTA-DOME CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR train set.
The fifth car in each consist was a Vista-Dome 19-seat coffee shop 7-seat lounge buffet 17-crew dormitory car with a 24-seat dome located above the Buffet –Lounge area. The dome seating was reserved for sleeping car passengers only and the buffet lounge coffee shop was open to all passengers but was most often the domain of the coach passengers.
The eighth car in each VISTA-DOME CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR consist was a 48-seat dining car nearly identical to those built for the VISTA-DOME TWIN ZEPHYRS.
The eleventh and final car in each VISTA-DOME CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR the observation was the piece-de-resistance. This car provided three double bedrooms one drawing room forward of the dome. Beneath the dome was a Bar and 12-seat lounge. On the main level to the rear of the dome was a lounge with seating for 18 in the observation. The dome featured the usual 24-seats. Obviously these cars were reserved for the first class trade.

24-SEAT VISTA-DOME 19-SEAT COFFEE SHOP BUFFET 7-SEAT LOUNGE 17-CREW DORMITORY CARS Budd Company October –November 1948 (Built for and assigned to VISTA-DOME CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR)

CB&Q

250 SILVER CLUB

251 SILVER LOUNGE

252 SILVER ROUNDUP

D&RGW

1140 SILVER SHOP

WP

831 SILVER CHALET

832 SILVER HOSTEL

48-SEAT DINING CARS Budd Company November 1948 (Built for and assigned to VISTA-DOME CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR)

CB&Q

193 SILVER CAFÉ

194 SILVER DINER

195 SILVER RESTAURANT

D&RGW

1115 SILVER BANQUET

WP

841 SILVER PLATE

842 SILVER PLATTER

24-SEAT VISTA-DOME 3-DOUBLE BEDROOM 1-DRAWING ROOM BAR 12-SEAT BUFFET LOUNGE 18-SEAT LOUNGE OBSERVATIONS Budd Company December 1948-January 1949 Plan: 9511 Lot: 9659 (Built for and assigned to VISTA-DOME CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR)

CB&Q

375 SILVER HORIZON

376 SILVER PENTHOUSE

377 SILVER SOLARIUM

D&RGW


1145 SILVER SKY

WP

881 SILVER CRESCENT

882 SILVER PLANET

In December 1952 Budd delivered two Vista-Dome 24-revenue seat coach 3 –Crew Dormitory Buffet 6-seat Lounge 17-seat Coffee shop cars 320 SILVER GARDEN and 321 SILVER PATIO, for operation in the new KANSAS CITY ZEPHYR and AMERICAN ROYAL ZEPHYR.
Three 48-seat dining cars were delivered by Budd in October-November 1952 198 SILVER CUISINE, 199 SILVER INN and 200 SILVER MANOR. Two of these cars 199 SILVER INN and 200 SILVER MANOR were assigned to the KANSAS CITY ZEPHYR while the third 198 SILVER CUISINE was assigned to the AK-SAR-BEN / CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR pool. Dining car 199 SILVER INN was the second Budd built dining car to carry this name the 1938 built car was destroyed in a wreck in 1946.
Also in December 1952 a single Vista-Dome 3-Double Bedroom 1-Drawing Room Bar 12-Seat Buffet 18-Seat Lounge Observation was delivered to the CB&Q for the AK-SAR-BEN / CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR pool of cars.

24-SEAT VISTA-DOME 24-REVENUE SEAT COACH 3-CREW DORMITORY BUFFET 6-SEAT LOUNGE 17-SEAT COFFEE SHOP CARS Budd Company December 1952 (Built for and assigned to AMERICAN ROYAL-KANSAS CITY ZEPHYRS)

320 SILVER GARDEN

321 SILVER PATIO

48-SEAT DINING CARS Budd Company October – November 1952 (Built for and assigned to AK-SAR-BEN ZEPHYR / CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR pool and KANSAS CITY ZEPHYR)

AK-SAR-BEN – CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR

198 SILVER CUISINE

KANSAS CITY ZEPHYR

199 SILVER INN

200 SILVER MANOR

24-SEAT VISTA-DOME 3-DOUBLE BEDROOM 1-DRAWING ROOM BAR BUFFET 12-SEAT LOUNGE 18-SEAT LOUNGE OBSERVATION Budd Company December 1952 Plan: 9533 Lot: 9659-112 (Built for and assigned to AK-SAR-BEN / CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR pool)

378 SILVER LOOKOUT

The CB&Q would have the distinction of introducing the last new long distance full service trains in the United States prior to Amtrak. The new trains inaugurated October 28, 1956 were the new VISTA-DOME DENVER ZEPHYRS replacements for the streamlined 1936 trains. Each new VISTA-DOME DENVER ZEPHYR normally operated with fourteen cars. The 1956 DENVER ZEPHYRS were quite different than the 1936 DENVER ZEPHYR trains in that they carried cars not only between Chicago and Denver but each day four cars continued beyond Denver on the rear of the westbound D&RGW ROYAL GORGE to Colorado Springs. The same four cars after servicing and washing returned to Denver that same afternoon on the rear of the eastbound D&RGW ROYAL GORGE and continued on to Chicago in the DENVER ZEPHYR. Each of the new VISTA-DOME DENVER ZEPHYR train sets carried three feature cars. There was a Vista-Dome 15-crew dormitory 8-seat lunch counter 4-seat lounge 19-seat Coffee shop car in each consist that operated as a through car between Chicago and Colorado Springs providing breakfast service between Denver and Colorado Springs each morning, and full meal and lounge service between Denver and Chicago in each direction. The two cars built for the VISTA-DOME DENVER ZEPHYR trains were 253 SILVER CUP and 254 SILVER KETTLE.
The two 48-seat Dining cars built for the VISTA DOME DENVER ZEPHYRS were 201 SILVER CHEF and 202 SILVER TUREEN.
The remaining pair of feature cars assigned was for the use of first class passenger only. These were the Vista-Dome 11-seat parlor 5-seat parlor drawing room Bar 12-seat cocktail lounge 13-seat lounge observations 235 SILVER CHATEAU and 236 SILVER VERANDA. The DENVER ZEPHYRS provided Parlor car service between Chicago and Omaha westbound and Denver and Lincoln eastbound. They were one of the few trains that provided sleeping car accommodation and parlor car seating in the same trains.

24-SEAT VISTA-DOME 15-CREW DORMITORY 8-SEAT LUNCH COUNTER BUFFET SEAT LOUNGE 19-SEAT COFFEE SHOP CARS Budd Company October 1956 (Built for and assigned to VISTA-DOME DENVER ZEPHYRS)

253 SILVER CUP

254 SILVER KETTLE

48-SEAT DINING CARS Budd Company October 1956 (Built for and assigned to VISTA-DOME DENVER ZEPHYRS)

201 SILVER CHEF

202 SILVER TUREEN

24-SEAT VISTA-DOME 11-SEAT PARLOR 5-SEAT PARLOR DRAWING ROOM BAR 12-SEAT COCKTAIL LOUNGE 13-SEAT LOUNGE OBSERVATIONS Budd Company September 1956 (Built for and assigned to VISTA-DOME DENVER ZEPHYRS)

235 SILVER CHATEAU

236 SILVER VERANDA

Besides the Budd built cars delivered in stainless steel that have already been mentioned the CB&Q owned a number of other streamlined feature cars painted for parents GN and NP streamliners. The CB&Q operated the NP NORTH COAST LIMITED and GN EMPIRE BUILDER and WESTERN STAR between Chicago and St. Paul. The cars owned by the CB&Q operated in those trains are covered in the GN and NP chapters.

TTFN Al

[wanswheel]

Hi Cindy or Leon or whom it may concern, a round for the house

Nick, you're right, that is a replica of Stephenson's "Rocket" at the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry. The old miniature Santa Fe has indeed been replaced by "The Great Train Story," which is what that link is actually about. Just click on the word "Tour" to see the pictures of the BNSF layout.

Eric, it's no surprise that Swedes are taller than most, but six feet from the floor seems excessive elevation to run model trains. Just kidding, sorry for the mishap. Incidentally as a kid I used to wait a moment for a bus to depart so to inhale the delicious fumes.

Doug, your knack for selecting photographs to decorate your posts is a gif to us all.
Enlarging the picture of the Exposition Flyer at Stockton shows that the motor vehicles at the station are typical of what was being driven in 1952. One advantage of getting older is to know what was what way back when.

Al, once I went 55 years without going online, no problem. Doubt if I could do it again. Thanks for another ample dose of Centrum Silver.

CM3, the little people in the parlor cars whose drinks are spilt in derailments, they probably are feeling no pain. At their scale about a teaspoon of Jack Daniels should be sufficient to party on.

Pete, if I referred to those locomotives as electric I meant that the pictures were electrifying.

Now what, should I address the rendezvousers or just figure Tom wouldn't haul his laptop to Toronto.
If you're within sight of this site, Tom, Ted and Rob, you haven't been gone long enough for me to miss you. But I will after a while, I promise. http://memory.loc.gov/pnp/pan/6a27000/6a27700/6a27708r.jpg
Mike

[Anonymous]

Howdy hi Tom and friends! I'll have a bottomless draught on this cold, and buy a round on this cold, rainy and windy day. That's quite a collection of CB&Q Zephyr information Al, and reminds me of something I don't believe I shared here before.



This is a dinner ticket for a fundraiser that we do at the IRM about six days each year. If ya'll ever get a hankerin' to visit the IRM, I suggest you check the website and plan to attend when this train is running. I'm not sure what they plan to do this year, because of the car damage we experienced about 6 months ago, plus I know they want to work on all the trucks, provided there is money enough to do it all.

Believe it or not, this engine makes no noise when it runs, but the horn can sure make you jump!


Here's the damage to two of the cars as a result of a switch being thrown while the train was backing up


Welcome ericx2000 [#welcome] Hope you join in on the bar banter and share your SSR railroading experiences with us! I was at a meeting of the 20th Century Railroad club last night, where the presentation dealt with pictures found on the internet, using foreign words in Google searches, which seemed yield pictures that we don't typically see when searching just in English. The speaker had Google searched words like tranjo, tranparado, tranvia, traukinys, trein, trem, tren, treni, treno, trenu, trikk ... and that's just some of the "T" words.


Glad the jokes weren't a total bomb for you today Tom, but somehow, it's more fun to hear the complaints! [;)] As for the JO situation, we're keeping as cool as we can, because we don't have too much longer to endure their crap. I'd like to think they'll get what they so richly deserve down the line.

Thanks for the link Peter. Now I just have to figure out how to work it! [:0]

[:I] A priest was driving to his church when he saw two people bending over in the grass. He decided to see why. He walked over to them and asked what they were doing. The man said they were homeless and grass was the only thing they could eat. The priest said, ''You can eat over at the church.'' The woman said, ''We have nine children -- will there be enough?'' ''Oh yes, '' the priest replied, ''the grass is 2 1/2 inches taller over there.'' [:I]

[:I] Two cannibals are eating dinner and one says, "I hate my mother-in-law."
The other replies, "Well, just eat your noodles, then." [:I]

[pwolfe]

Hi Tom and all.

I just popped in to see if CINDY needed a hand but it all seems quiet at the moment[:(],
now that ROB as gone to pick up TOM & TED.

Ah well I'll give BORIS a hand with the dishes, have a pint of Bathams and remind everyone that it is Fish 'N' Chip nite tonight.

DOUG The link I gave you in my last post does not seem to be working try this one
http://www.d8233.org.uk/links.html
and click on the photo galleries for some pics of a TrainMaster look a like
PETE.

[trolleyboy]

Okay guys since Lars is still away here's another reminder for next week. The biggest most important Birthday Bash will occur on the 18th at 7pm Tom's time,central lets make his 68th the best that it can be. He does it for us.

Rob

[trolleyboy]

Here's a blast from the past that I dug up in my travels last night. I figure that it's appropriate concidering today is "R" day for the rendezvous. A state of the rendezvous planning post from the head cook and bottle washer himself ( until we found Boris and Leon that is ) This just goes to show the time taken in planning and prepping this feat of a meet by Tom. a 5x[tup] fer sure fer sure !
This post originally appeared last june and way back on page 24 ! [wow][:O]

Rob

QUOTE: Originally posted by siberianmo

Hi Dave - The coffee pots 'round here are always filled with freshly brewed regular and unleaded ........ help yourself! [tup]

Should you come across that info on the RDC you mentioned, please post it .... [tup]

Based upon what has come through thus far regarding the FIRST ANNUAL "Our" Place Classic Trains Rendezvous, we ARE going forward with the planning as posted earlier.

Particulars are encouraged to be sent to me by Email, thereby freeing up our thread for the "stuff" that goes on 'round here. So, your thoughts are most welcome. [swg]

From the Email I've received - all positive - it's just a matter of going through those steps I've listed - refining 'em where needed - and moving on with the plan. With a group of 10 regulars - I expect that we'd be really living well if half that number agreed to (1) the rendezvous (2) a location (3) and time of year.

Speaking just for me, I'd be content with any location that can provide the type of experience that our guys are looking for. As I gather more info from the Email inputs, I'll provide a narrative for all to see .... similiar to my previous post.

See ya! [tup] [;)]
Tom