Afternoon all...long time no visit...This is your long absent West Coast connection...I confess to being completely ingorant as to the who, what ,where and why over the past two weeks...At this rate it will take nine months to catch up with all the activity....
Just wanted to take minute to say howdy to Tom, Nick, Rob, Lars, Barndad and all that in my haste failed to acknowledge... Not sure when i'll be up again (I using a borrowed puter, might piece of dubious quality though it be) Looks like plenty of action, let me contribute with a round for all who attend today, no time or dollar limit.....Meanwhile i'll strive to get up to speed, can't violate the house rules can I?
Until later
Dave
Blast from the Past! - Blast fromt the Past!
from page 225
PASSENGER TRAIN NOSTALGIA #60 Here’s something to enjoy regarding Great Britain’s LONDON & NORTH EASTERN RAILWAY in a 1933 advertisement from my private collection: BRING HISTORY TO LIFE IN ENGLAND Visit ancient York with its 1300-year old Minster; and Durham where likes the Venerable Bede, who died as he dictated the last words of the first translation of the Bible. Wander through the historic streets of Lincoln – headquarters of a Roman Legion during the Occupation – and Norwich, once the second city of England and still preserving many relics of medieval times. Visit Litchfield Cathedral renowned for its three beautiful spires, and put yourself back in the Middle Ages at Warwick Castle. See the old walls and picturesque streets of Chester. Look down from the battlements of those might castles that Edward I built at Caernarvon and Conway, and see what a task he had to conquer heroic Wales. Every country of Great Britain speaks to you of your own ancestors. Travel through those countries by L M S and L N E R to the places you must have longed to see every since you first read a history book. Illustrated Pamphlet from T. R. Dexter – Vice-President, Passenger Traffic, (Dept. A 34) L M S Corporation, 200 Fifth Avenue, New York City. H. J. Kitchgin, General Agent, (Dept. A 34) L N E R Railway, 11 West 42nd Street, New York City, or from your own ticket agent. L M S LONDON MIDLAND & SCOTTISH RAILWAY OF GREAT BRITAIN LONDON & NORTH EASTERN RAILWAY OF GREAT BRITAIN L*N*E*R
Bon voyage to Wolfman Pete! Enjoy! Tom
Guten Morgen allerseits!
Wie ist jeder? Es ist Octoberfest, Partei wollen wir!
Ahoy Mates! Back again for just a couple of acknowledgments . . . welcome aboard CM3 'n DL! You two certainly have brightened up an otherwise "blah" morning.
THANX CM3 for volunteering to take the REPORTER's position! A most essential ingredient to make this Bragging Rights DARTS CHALLENGE a success. Now whether it ends up as a WIN for "Our" Place, that's something we'll all have to wait 'n see.
Once I read your "sample" offering, it was a hands down (as opposed to thumbs down!) decision - no contest - you were "in"!!
DL - "Smoothsides" (with or without the quotation marks) simply refers to the first of the light weight streamlined passenger cars that were manufactured without using the corrugated stainless steel sides (an innovation of the Budd Company). Those cars looked mighty fine when matched and painted in their respective company liveries. My memory banks are full of images of passenger trains at the platforms at New York City's Grand Central Terminal and over at Penn Station - all sitting there, just waitin' to GO!
Also, the VIA Rail policy of going onto the train platform to take Pix has taken on a more rigid enforcement since the events of September 11th, 2001. I recall dropping by the Halifax station and going right out to snap off dozens of Pix - no problems and in fact got some encouraging remarks from the guys working there. They may have always had a "no passengers on the platform rule" - but it was pretty much up to those working the stations. No more. Times have changed and I'm afraid not for the better. Of course Pix taking still goes on at the longer station stops - such as the one you had at Moncton. That was always a great time to expend a roll!
The overnight train between Montreal and Toronto that VIA Rail reinstuted went by the wayside due to budget cuts. It wasn't really a successful venture, but did provide an alternative for those with early morning business at either location. Those trains used to depart their respective "ends" of the route at about 11 PM and make their slow pace to their destinations. The passengers enjoyed the comforts of the Budd cars - including a Park car - food, bar, etc. and a nights sleep in their rolling hotel. Arrivals were at 8 AM. Kind of a nice touch - but hardly anything new, for that idea had been used by CN years ago (Rob can elaborate better than I on that one).
I had heard that the Renaissance equipment had taken over the Enterprise as those Budd cars became more in demand for the western routes, thereby helping to reduce interest in that travel. No matter, the "budgeteers" in Ottawa dropped the axe and it's gone, gone, gone.
One of my 50-something sisters-in-law managed to obtain tickets to that Stones concert in Halifax where 50,000 were rained upon by nature and the "boyz". I believe she traveled to Moncton a year or two ago to attend one of their performances as well. These guys and so many others who have had a taste of the fame 'n fortune, aren't about to retire - not as long as there is a market. The steam loco's would still be pulling their consists if only there was a need for 'em, don't ya think
Touched a tender note with me with your reference to the '39-'45 period. My father was a Merchie (4th mate to begin with, 1st mate at war's end) - he did his WWII voyages in the north Atlantic - sailed many a convoy to your land and up into Murmansk as well. Didn't see him for 4 years of that war - many will never know or appreciate the sacrifices made by those guys who manned the freighters and tankers bringing essential goods and war materials to the British Isles and other places.
CM3 - those Chicago switching line roads you presented may be well known up thataway, but all of it was "news" to me! <grin> [As always, appreciate the insights - quarters and round! Songs on the other hand - hmmmmm, perhaps some Stones stuff is in order - Satisfaction comes to mind!
DL - enjoyed the "Beavertail" URL and associated info. Always willing and ready to learn something new - and it was all NEW for me!
In the "You Gotta Believe" department: received an Email from Lars and he is off to the Yankees-Tigers game this afternoon up at the Stadium. Seems that one of his sons had two tickets to the game tha
Hello Tom and fellow staff – an apology for that lack of greeting before – too busy thanking Nick for his round. Forgive me. I’ll bear in mind the theme for the month and order a Kolsch from Cologne (if you’ve never visited that city the main tourist attraction is the cathedral – and the best view of the cathedral just happens to be from the pedestrian footbridge over the Rhine that is part of the main rail bridge,
- so that is handy as you know what else you can thus see from that footbridge – yep almost every train in and out of that major junction station).
I’ll order some food too – any chance of the vegetarian dish of the day today?
Now onto matters raised.
Tom: re the Park Car – others have been interested in this conversation so excuse us if we press on. My thoughts about the LC were EXACTLY the same as yours – “who needs that”, but the staff member concerned redeemed it in my view by her low key approach – no sales push, just bar service if you need it, not dissimilar to the standards of service here at Our Place I would suggest! Other staff may not be so good but there we are.
I’d go so far as to say don’t write off The Ocean so long as the Park car is in the consist, and it was not too touristy as most of the tourists on board could not be bothered to walk back there!
The Chaleur – no, I was not being clear – as you say, could not do it as a run in the way you mention for the reasons you state, but I might have gone out east to Gaspe and back to Matapedia or some convenient spot, then holed up and waited for eastbound Ocean. Could have got Skyline and Park car on the itinerary then. Maybe too ambitious but would be worth a try.
Also forgot to thank you for the Halifax pics which were handy. Nova Scotia hotel was full but we found a great small place from our guide book called the Halliburton which was nice and close to the station. Allowed easy visits to The Citadel, Pier 21 and The Atlantic Museum as well as the Corvette boat. Nice to pay respects to the guys who helped keep us (or my parents and grandparents I should say) from starvation in the dark days of ’39 – ’45, by visiting that ship.
Evening of arrival took an evening walk round the area to the back of the station (near the micro brewery in fact) and imagine my surprise to find, in the shadow of our parked up Dome Car (train had been turned for next day’s return journey) one of the world’s iconic people movers, the London Routemaster double decker bus, parked in the car park. As you may know, these are no longer in squadron service in London, but next day I found they were staple transport for tourist buses round Halifax. All I can say is I hope they look after them!
Now for a gripe – next day was a day The Ocean does not run, so 2 sets end up parked at the station all day, walking by in by now brilliant sunshine 2 Park Dome Cars stood gleaming side by side. I walked into the empty station hall and went to the ticket desk. In my politest, clearest tourist accent I asked the guy on duty (who did not seem too busy) if there was any chance I could go out on to the platform and take a picture of those 2 domes. Answer – “NO, passengers are not allowed on the platforms” - all I can say is a real jobsworth attitude, so disappointing. Certainly no 20 dollar tip for him I’m afraid.
American Orient Express – I thought the last car was a bullet end, but I may have been wrong – I did not get as close a look as I wanted due to officious staff barring my way. The cars did have smooth sides, but I’d be interested to know what that means when in the “inverted commas” as you used.
Pete – Yep Trip to Jerusalem is a Kimberley House, that will become / is now a Green King pub, although they may keep the current brand they use here for “badge engineering” purposes I guess, too early to tell yet. The pub is unspoilt though and will probably stay that way – same can’t be said for the beautiful brewery buildings.
Enjoyed the rest of your Stirling trip notes, very good – the scenic section north of Berwick has become more high profile as it got voted most scenic stretch of rail journey in UK by a celebrity orientated magazine (!) a year or so back. It is not the most scenic stretch (I maintain that goes to certain Scottish routes or Settle – Carlisle for England, but as your notes suggests, it really is a beautiful stretch).
Meant to ask – did you enjoy dining on the GNER route on this occasion (I rate it highly)?, and have you done UK sleeper journey recently or do you prefer watching the passing scene?
By the way – did you know the all UK paper timetable book (the National Rail Timetable) is to be ceased printed in Summer 2007 – if you want a souvenir copy you should try and get one on order.
Incidentally – on a Great Central point (past themes) this w/e is a gala event and here is the run down: Think I might need to fit this into my schedule, esp to see the 1937 Coronation Beavertail car now restored – you north American friends think streamlined version of Park car with no dome, painted superb blue and silver – more info here if interested but Observation saloons are very rare in the UK so this is very interesting:
http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/rvp/beaver.htm
GCR 6/7 Oct run down:
· Special Guest Loco 35005
· Traveling Post Office runs each day (drops at Quorn 11:52 and 4:16)
· Evening mail drop on Saturday 6:46
· Intensive passenger service from 8:50 to 5:15
· Demonstration Freight trains
· Demonstration Windcutter trains
· Special 'Railway Experience evening' at Quorn on Saturday 5:40 - 7:30
· Beer tent at Quorn, open Saturday, Saturday evening and Sunday.
· Inspection Saloon in use (extra £5 fare - tea, coffee & biscuits) on RB trains
· Coronation Observation Saloon on RB trains (subject to availability - sorry the coach is not finished yet and you cannot ride in it)
· All Day Breakfast available on Griddle car
· Special 'silver service' breakfast (limited spaces) on 9:15 train £10
· Afternoon Tea on 3:45 train £6.50
· Evening 'Beerex' trains with food 6:00 and 7:20 Saturday
· Trains passing on the double track every few minutes
· Turn up and drive a loco (extra fee payable)
Trolleyboy – Thanks for your comments – I’m sure you would enjoy sleeper travel after these notes, what happened to The Enterprise Toronto Montreal Service by the way?
You seem to have a link with Halton County Streetcar museum. Is that Ontario based? I’d like to visit that in the future, I have family in Toronto – is it too far away? It looked very good from the publicity I saw last time I was in Toronto 2 years back.
Tom – just noted your point about the Stones and the knighthoods, these guys were playing Halifax day of our arrival and that was reason hotels booked up. Irrespective of the music these guys should retire in my humble opinion. If the steam locos here had to be off the rails by 1968, they could have hung up their instruments ‘bout the same time!
James – great pic of that aerotrain – nice to know more about that. Still looks futuristic to me!
Sorry for the continuing UK theme of some of this post, but good to be in conversation on various matters.
DL - UK
Good Morning Barkeep and All Present; coffee, please; round for the house and $ for the jukebox. Let’s play “Moon Over the Motel,” “Washington at Valley Forge,” and “My Everyday Silver is Plastic.” Can’t say our selections are not eclectic.
Thanks to all for kind words re writing. Pete – I enjoyed the travelogue.
Nick – Camera never lies, does it? Anyway, upon further examination, I figured out that it was not a drill bit at all. It was a zeppelin mooring mast that probably rolled off a flatcar on a passing freight. BTW, all layouts are a work in progress – you should see my house(!) The RS11 shot reminded me of when the Peg units were on the CV. Now if I could just find the pictures.
Our ‘steamed proprietor is setting up a darts tournament? With the cast of characters in this place, I had an immediate flash back to the darts match between the Inspektor and the Doctor in “Young Frankenstein.” We have to show that one at the local theeatuh for Halloween.
If you need a reporter, I’m your man. For real, I used to be a sports stringer for a paper yrs. ago. I assume the reporter puts news stories together that, at the least, have to be loaded (no Boris, not that kind of loaded!) with sporting clichés.
To wit: The Captain of the Our Place Outragers, emerging from the body cavity search/decontamination/ shower tent graciously provided by the Mentor VFD, remarked between pulls on an oxygen mask, “It was a great match; I was so drunk I saw three bulls’ eyes and threw at the one in the middle. Fortunately it didn’t move. Just lucky, I guess. Anyway, individual scores don’t matter because we’ll take each match one at a time. The important thing to remember is that I’m here to help the ballclub.”
Will that work?
Herewith some material about three well-known switching lines in Chicago. Close reading of this material reveals a lot of fallen flags, and some interesting stuff about refrigerator car service at it was back in the late 60s.
Chicago River and Indiana RR Company
The Chicago River and Indiana RR Company (Chicago Junction District) has direct connection with all trunk lines entering Chicago. It serves the Union Stock Yard & Transit Co. to which all connecting railroads have access. It also serves the large packing plants and the Central Manufacturing District, a model industrial community embracing some 350 industries
Chicago River District serves approximately 150 industries available to all trunk lines through reciprocal switching and provides fast intermediate service between all trunk lines.
Excellent transportation facilities for the handling of carload freight, as well as a centralized location, provide the territory served with exceptional industrial advantages.
Kankakee Belt Route
Save a full day by routing eastern and western shipments over the Kankakee Belt Route through the Chicago District. The KBR, with 26 direct rail connections, bypasses the heavily congested classification yards in Chicago.
Connects with MILKW, Burlington, LS&BC, C&NW, IC, N&W, ATSF, GN&O, NYC, C&EI, MON, PRR, B&O, C&O
Indiana Harbor Belt “Connects With All Chicago Railroads.”
Interchange service – Linking east and west, the IHB provides fast, dependable intermediate service to and from all trunk lines operating in Chicago.
Re-Icing Facilities – The IHB re-icing facility, at Blue Island, Illinois, is one of the largest in the World. It can produce 1,000 tons of ice daily and can store up to 15,000 tons. Sixty-five reefer cars may be re-iced simultaneously. Mechanical refrigerator cars requiring attention are quickly serviced for prompt delivery to connections.
Work safe
P.S. Rock Island - all right! Let's slide over to LaSalle St and watch them and the NYC and the NKP.
Guten Tag allerseits!
Wie ist jeder? Es ist OKTOBERFEST, Partei wollen wir!
Petrol has dropped to $2.17 (rounded) up at "Collusion Corner" as the world's price per barrel continues to drop by the double digits. Go figure that!! Cold front moved in for some relief and at least for the next couple of day it will be more tolerable 'round mid-continent USA. However, warm-up is expected for the weekend. <ugh>
Next week's TUESDAY Theme for the Day! will be the Rock Island Line (a mighty fine road!) As has been the practice 'round here, we have ONE THEME per week and it is on TUESDAY's. Good suggestion, James, even if a bit early on the day.
Thanx to Nick our OPTIONAL Toy 'n Model Trains Day! wasn't a wash-out - fine layout shots and always enjoy looking at 'em. However, given the lateness of the hour (or "earlyness) and perhaps the impaired condition of the Engineer - maybe it's best for those fine looking trains to remain at idle!
That fine looking Rock Island locomotive from James is the GM LWT-12, which powered the Aerotrain - a light weight passenger train designed to speed up and revolutionize travel. They were also tested on the New York Central, Union Pacific and Pennsylvania with the Rock Island purchasing all three sets. The era was in the mid 50s to mid 60s, give or take a year or so. Lots of info on the web - just do a search on Aerotrain.
Reminder: We still need TWO names to make-up our 2nd team for the Darts Challenge in November. See the info "up" on this Page . . . Also - really need to line up someone for the REPORTER's job!! (That person may also engage in the tournament . . . .)
Okay, Gents - enough from me as I must get about the day.
Boris, serve ‘em up all of the “spiked” OJ they can handle!
Auf Wiedersehen!
Tom
G-day captain Tom and those here.
Rob, Pete, Coalminer- Thanks for the comments on my layout. I will keep on worling with the night shots. Just need to find some more areas to do so.
Tom- Since the Dart contest is going on and you have not been able to put up a theme for the Day for tomorrow. Can I suggest a Theme Like the Rock Island
This is some of my collection that I have displayed at the moment. Starting at the top: Milw. Rd. Little joe; Northern Pacific Steam locomotive 4-8-8-4 with business car. A nothern pacific VO-1000 ( not on the track) a Northern pacific S6 (The only one made for NP) and a Milwaukee road Steeple Cab. This is a small portion of my collection and is some of my best stuff without the DCC in it. My layout is all DCC.
Rock Island U25B. It not looking so good at this point. Year is 1980 and the "Rock" is dieing.
Rock Island 2, Silvis, IL, May 30, 1965, Photo by Karl C. Henkels. SD45.com
Now this!!??... Um.. Well, I really don't know what "this" is... I know its Classical since its passenger but.. Nothing I've ever seen before. I think this is one of those Turbos, but not like the Turbo trains. Probably a precursor to the Turbo train.
I'm hoping that suggesting this, doesn't cause any problem as seeing that you were busy for most of the afternoon.
So with the moon I wish you a good night and Happy railroading
James
Good Evening TOM and fellow imbibers-A Staropraman for me pleas (will I never learn....) and a round for the house.
A brief visit tonight as I am on a short break from an experiment ( no-not like that,you evil minded bunch..)-attempting to record a song via internet-currently waiting for Stevie,in London at college, to record a guitar part or two onto the demo he has been sent,I will then edit and record the bass (tonight ) & drums (tomorrow) and send it on to Chrissie to work out her vocal parts which we will record as soon as she can get over here.
Anyway,should have time to throw some pix at you but will have to do the socialising bit in the a.m-please excuse the breach in bar etiquette-perhaps another round will go some way to smoothing things over....................
O.K then,pix it is-some more views of the S.O.B lines,for your amusement
" border="0" />
Here we have the `Metro` section with former DWP RS11 bringing a Detroit-Toronto service towards the industrial area branch junc. The Bradford GO train is easing in for a station stop at the rear. The crew hostel is on the left. The 1st boxcar IS on the rails-the drill bit in the foreground remains a mystery..........
Looks like some unlucky sales rep will be taking his cheque-book to the car pound.... O.N.R boxes delivering newsprint to the Globe & Mail printworks at the rear-Its rained recently if the shine on the tarmac is any clue...
Similar shot from a different angle-The O.N.R.`chevron` car is hand painted and lettered with C.D.S rub-downs (although the flash has distorted the colour) whilst the `progressive` scheme car awaits lettering
Steel stockholders spur (with Bradford backscene behind)
Late afternoon sunlight creates odd lighting effects...industrial district with `big hill` to rear,leading up to where Bradford board should be
similar shot ,but with less `atmospheric` lighting
And further round again:- from the front,industrial area,local line,through line ( with via service ) and the bank ( with #410 Gravenhurst-Toronto)
`Eye in the sky` shot-`north-east `corner
`North-west` corner
`South-west` corner
As can be seen-much remains to be done -not least a serious tidy up of the workspace,still Rome wasn`t built in a day........................
Right,looks like I`m needed elsewhere-a round for the chaps before I go please Leon
Will catch up on all the good stuff going on tomorrow a.m. (the middle of the night to you guys)
Take care now,nick " border="0" />
First team for the Darts Challenge is set: Pete 'n Rob! Okay, Gents - two more names and we're "in"!! Don't forget - perhaps the most important participant in all of this will be the REPORTER.
You know, it's fun again at the bar when we have the participation we've seen lately along with the obvious enthusiasm and interest displayed on these pages. Really think this is the way we should strive to maintain "Our" Place - many thanx to all who give a "Rat's Patoot"!!
Good to see the Wolfman stop by and we've become rather accustomed to his "spot" at this time of the day. As long as the 'puter doesn't screw things up, eh You have a new Mate now with DL appearing on consecutive days. You kow what's nice about that - amongst other things He READS the words, as do you and Nick. A fine, fine attribute and something that I hope is picked up by one and all. Now that is not to say our "regulars" from this side of the "the pond" don't do the same thing - however, we all have been witness to those who just pop in - drop their witty or not so witty remarks - and take off without so much as a fair-thee-well. You KNOW my atttiude about that, eh Screw 'em all but six, and save those for pall bearers!
What's with you guys driinking English brew when it's OKTOBERFEST!! <grimmace>
Rob - great seeing you too this afternoon and a fine inclusive Post you dropped on us. Appears as if you're back in "shape" - must be something in the water, eh Is it just me, or do you really have a cast iron stomach <grin> Didn't pick that up at the St. George Arms!
As an aside, for the guys who don't know, the St. George Arms wound up being the "official pub" for our 1st Annual "Our" Place Classic Trains Rendezvous in Toronto this past May. All three evenings were spent there and quite frankly, it's a good thing that we had things to do each morning, or I'd still be there! <oooooh>
Appreciate the favorable comments on the Quebec Bridge. You know, there's just so much all of us DON"T KNOW - and isn't it grand to enjoy the revelations
So, where IS EricX2000 Eric We can only "wonder" in wonder at what he MAY be doing in Sweden!! The dream of dreams - slave of sorts to a 6 ft blue eyed, blonde beauty in a sting bikini - ah, I digress! On a TRAIN of course, just to maintain our "connection" with the subject matter 'round here. <grin>
Pete- we've discussed this before, but once you reach "that" point in life, it makes absolutely no sense to procrastinate.Our young friends just haven't a clue - priorities are far different - but one thing in life is absolute: there are NO do-overs. So, when it comes to I "shudda, wudda, cudda" - tell it to the wind, Mate - you had your chance and you blew it. So "fess up" and accept it. End of sage advice from siberianmo.<grin>
Enjoyed your Part Two and the accompanying Pix! Well done, Sir! That Pub looks like a place that you and I could easily get in "trouble" in! Yes, I know the story - we've discussed it - but still, it really looks like "my kinda place." Thanx!
The Stones supposedly will stop by our tent this weekend - whether it's ooooompah or not remains to be seen.
I just HAVE to say this: One of these guys has been "dubbed" a "Sir" by the Queen. Okay - fine. But how come these ingrates haven't spent one minute of their time peforming for the troops in far flung places, some where lives are being given for those who would NEVER do the same That stuff irritates me . . . Yeah right, Sir Mick - Sir Paul - Sir Elton. <barf> Go out and entertain the young people from the UK, Canada and Austrailia (and perhaps some not-so-young) who are are willing to defend the freedoms they take for gran
Good afternoon Tom and all assembled. Ruth I think I could manage a CR and one of the oktoberfest #3's with the extra saurkraut and the honey garlic farmers sausage I had shipped in from Kitchener Waterloo.
Right to the catch up's on yesterdays fine fare and that which has transpired today.
Tom-A darts tourney eh you can puit me down to play , I've never done 501 but those guts at the second class agenerally too drunck to hit the board let alone the bullseye Great rundown on the ATSF trains from you yesterday oh and could you tell that I forgot the spellcheckToday's bridge story was right on as per usual. I've just scene the documentary on our history channel on it again yesterday afternoon
Doug-I think I failed the test miserably though not as bad as Sir Nick did..I've always been an Alcophile ( confirmed also it's catching and has no known cure a other than purchasing a great many models of their fine locomotives oh and the odd MLW Canadian varient is even more ctaching ... as he coughs and sputters )
BK-Right on sage advice from you on all matters pertaining to the bar as usual.I also thoroughly enjoyed your drum heads as well. I have to say that the ATSF's were always some of the most attractive and ornate in my mind. Thanks for the thanksgiving wishes as well and allow me to wish you and Lydia and capt Tom and family best wishes as well.
Mike-An excellant write up on the Super Chief, thanks for shareing sir.
Pete-I'm glad that you enjoyed the Pt 3.It's interesting to hear that a Harvey House is re-oppenning. I don't imagine that you will be able to purchase a steak dinner with tthe trimmings for $1.75 or one of the other gormet meals for $0.50 however.
Lars-I see that you were able to make it in with your bookcovers as well which is great. Nice to see that the theme days are still "cooking with gas" as they say.
CM3-I must say that your ATSF item did not dissapoint. You are the sage writer of our membership I must say.5x sir. And a wonderfull G&MO and in today as well.This is the kind of stuff that makes me log in every day.
DL-Nice to see you regularly on board.Hiopefully you and Nick and Pete will sign up for darts as well,then my lack of skill won't be as noticable.I'd have to concur with both you and Tom, the AOE and TH Mountaineer would do nothing for me.I suspect that you are right in your assesment of their satff,likely the low paid unappreciated, same as most cruise lines.Give me regular rail travel. I always marvell at the setail of both yours and Tom's descriptions of the sleeper car service. I've never partaken in a sleeper service on a train always short range trips , along the VIA Corridor or on a commuter train.Yes Tom the list is long , so unfortunatly or fortunatly our life spans
James-Nice layout shots again sir.At least your layour has some scenery !
Well appologies to anyone I've forgotten, I'll leave a bit of extra cash in Tilla for a round for anyone I may have unwittingly snubbed. Ring the ding there Boris. Him in ledrehosen I have to say just isn't right
Rob
Hi Tom and all.
Hopefully I can get this in at my usual time. A Kimberley Mild is an excellent drink to start please RUTH. Even if the brewery does close Tom will be able to still get it at Our Place.
NICK Glad you got Lord Beaverbrook working well, it sounds as stong as the prototype.
I too am hoping that we can get the regulars over to travel the British rails one day, of course the "Road to the Isles behind steam is a must.
Interesting point on the light on the pics, I have heard many say that the light in the 60s was the best that there has been for colour pics, also it its amazing how the colour of some locos change in photos, Mallard spings to mind.
Are the Oompah Band really going to play Stones classics this weekend.
MIKE Great post on the Super C Chicago_ Los Angeles freight. Who was Gerty do you know.
Great links, as usual, the artwork on the Santa Fe ADs is very good. Do you think the Oktoberfest loco will be needed Saturday night..
JAMES Thanks for the layout pics. The locos at night is a great photo.
DL-UK. Sad news indeed about Kimberley, am I right in thinking the Trip To Jerusalem in Nottingham sold a range of their ales. There are a lot of Greene King Pubs in my home town. The Abbot is not TOO bad, but it is too strong for a quaffing beer, about their other stuff the least said the better as far as I am concerned, and with some good pubs being turned in to private houses not a good time at all for the British beer drinker.
Thanks for the link to the ticket prices, I know peak fares are unbelieveablely dear, you get the feeling the rail companies would love it if they could get the trains, like airplanes, only reserved seats that have to be booked in advance. GRRRR.
Those are some great DVDs. I dont think the UK DVDs are compatable over here as I have tried one and it wont play on the player although the computer can play it, apparently there is only a few discs it will do this, (about 5 if I recall right). Perhaps one of the regulars knows if there is a DVD player available over here that will play UK discs as well.
Here is part 2 of the trip in June
Tour to Scotland 2006
Part two Newcastle to Stirling
At Newcastle the 7:30 AM from London King’s Cross terminated and after a few minutes 91120 hauled the Mk IV coaching stock off to Heaton Depot for servicing. After the platform was clear the Edinburgh train arrived, having left King’s Cross at 8 AM but with a couple less stops, hauled by electric loco # 91102 Durham Cathedral. An on time departure past the Newcastle Keep which looked over a grand sets of diamond crossings in steam days, the track layout as been much simplified nowadays.
The train is soon speeding north past Heaton depot now mainly serving Diesel Multiple Units. Further north is a triangular junction which is a freight only line heading east and serving and area which was the Northumberland coalfield the area from which the Stephenson’s came from and is known as the “Cradle of Railways”.
Past a couple of lines serving open-cast coal pits and pleasant scenery the train approaches Berwick coming from the south the famous Royal Border Bridge (Mike had a great link showing the bridge in one of the posts at Our Place) is visible from the train as it as to make a long 90 degree turn. Over the bridge our train makes the only stop on this trip at Berwick-On-Tweed.
The reason I took the East Coast route to Scotland was that I had not traveled over the line north of Newcastle for many years. Leaving Berwick the train soon passes into Scotland and onto a part of the line, which runs on top of cliffs alongside the North Sea, this scenic bit of line does not get a lot of publicity unfortunately.
With Edinburgh bay to the east the train is soon slowing for Waverley station.
The station as been extended in the past and is quite difficult to navigate if not a regular user. We had arrived at platform 20, which is separated, from the main part of the station by a wall. So it was over the footbridge in to the main part. I though the train to Stirling would be leaving from one of the North Bays but it was due to leave from the south end of one of the through platform. Luckily it was a couple of minutes late and I was able to make the connection.
Waverley station was known to be tricky in the early days and by tradition the clock on the North British Hotel, by the station in Princes Street, runs two minutes fast.The hotel and clock can be seen in the top left corner of Mike’s first Waverley station link
There is a couple of great links to photos of Waverley in Mike’s post.
Heading north from Waverley the line runs through a shallow cutting with Edinburgh Castle high on a hill on one side and Princes Street on the other, after two tunnels the train calls at Haymarket station. On departure of the station Haymarket loco depot is passed. In steam days it supplied the top-link locos for the East Coast, including the A4 loco for the Non-Stop Elizabethan Edinburgh to London express a duty shared with King’s Cross depot. Later it looked after the Diesel fleet including 8 of the legendary Deltic Express Passenger Diesel-Electrics. Today the modernized depot looks after a large part of the Scottish Diesel Multiple Unit (DMU) fleet, of classes 150/2, 156 158 and 170/4.
After heading north for a few miles we head west towards Glasgow, leaving the line to the Forth and Tay bridges and Aberdeen. The magnificent Forth Bridge can be viewed in the distance from this line. I have heard that it is illuminated at night by floodlights a sight I would love to see.
Through Falkirk and a tri-angular junction it is not far to Stirling a pleasant enough trip on the 2-Car class 158 DMU although with the slowest approach to the station stops I can remember in quite a while. The last time I arrived in Stirling was on a steam special after a 10-day tour of S
NOTICE - NOTICE - NOTICE
"Our" Place has been challenged by the boyz over at the 2nd Class Saloon in Can-Am Village to a grudge match of DARTS! Best 3 out of 5 games takes the bragging rights.
So, who amongst you are "up" for this We are looking for a few good men who can handle their darts AND their beer!
We need TWO TEAMS OF TWO . . . . Sign up board is back in the Pool Room, next to the handcuff display. First to sign up will comprise the teams. Post your intentions here as well!
Deadline: Must have names not later than close of business October 18th.
RULES: Those of the Brtitish Darts Organization with counting down from 501.
WANTED: A reporter to "narrate the results" and provide a SUMMARY for the guys at the bar. Contact me by Email if you are up to the challenge for this ESSENTIAL position!
When: In early November - precise dates 'n times to be announced. Games 1 and 3 will be held at the 2nd Class Saloon - transportation provided by Mentor Village Carriages, Vito the Hit, owner-operator. Game 2 will be held in our pool room.
Back again to acknowledge the fine efforts of our "regular" CM3 and our new found friend, DL in the UK! Appreciate your participation and enjoyed the input. Round appreciated along with the quarters, from our West Virginia "connection."
That brings to mind something along the lines of the "protocol" we have here at the Saloon by Siding:
One MUST greet the bartender upon entering and one MUST order a drink and/or food. Otherwise ONE receives a tweetable offense - in the case of DL, that's ONE offense - no greeting! Punishment is levied in the form of a fine - which most times is buying the house a drink or three! It could get more severe, depending on what the "infractions" happen to be! (These are but a few of the "things" separating us from the other Threads . . . .) <grin>
Oh yes, for the coffee, tea and soda drinkers - it's $5 per drink! You might say! This IS a bar, hardly a coffee shop, diner or ladies auxiliary tea circle! Order some food and the charge is forgiven!
Yes, CM3 - Cards won! It was a good game to watch as the Red Birds looked as if they were all on the same page, so to speak. Getting to the other guys' "best" is always a good way to start out. However, we need 2 more victories, before any chortling begins from me - and then I doubt it will be audible! Mets look as if they just might - maybe - could be in for some difficulty. I concur that Pedro has really not factored in for a long time, but they were relying on El Duke - or whatever he's called. The Dodgers could - might - maybe - pull this out. It should be a good series.
DL - Depending on what one "reads" - I've seen it both ways - protocol for my way of thinking is to reward exceptional service, nothing less - dining is the exception - again, just my Twenty dollar tip in anyone's way of doing things seems most generous to me. The only "tips" I ever received during my career were along the lines of "don't take any wooden nickels!" Now, you'll probably have to be a bit more "Americanized" to figure that one out!
In case anyone has forgotten - the quarters are for our Juke Box (5 plays for 25 cents) - all digitized - we call it Herr Wurlitzer! The repository for the quarters is a rather large pickled pig's feet jar that was named Coal Scuttle, as a result of a "contest" we had some pages back. So, to feed the Coal Scuttle is really putting quarters aside for use in Herr Wurltizer! And, we have two cash registers pretty much at either end of the bar - one is Tilla the other Cashinator - again, products of a "contest."
CM3 - Immediately after graduation from high school (6 AM the following morning) my journeyman plumber Uncle picked me up and off we went to one of his favorite "jumping off spots" before work. While I couldn't look a glass of milk in the eye, he'd have a "shot 'n a beer" to begin the day. No more - just that. We'd also run across many construction guys in that tavern - some were Mohawk iron workers - and they were quite a bunch. Fearless is just one descriptor that comes to mind. I was just an apprentice plumber - and a poor one at that. My name was "kid" and I only spoke when spoken to. My oh my how times have changed, eh
DL - My "problem" isn't with the Learning Coordinator, it's more the idea of it all that totally ticks me off. When one travels the cross Canada train, the "Canadian," usually one of the crew takes care of the appropriate announcements and the like when coming up on scenic and informational places. These people are never in your face, bothersome or otherwise taking away from the ambiance of traveling in a real train to real destinations. When I had learned that not only were the Budd cars coming off the Ocean and that a LC would set up shop in the Park Car - well, nothing more needs to be said."Who needs it?" said I. Obviously some do - some appreciate it - and that's all well and good. Mine are many, many enjoyable trips - in the solititude of the hum of the chatter, the sounds of the car as it moves along the steel rails and the zipping by of the trees, poles and assorted other visuals that always captivate me. Listening to someone tell me what I already know isn't a treat - and that's selfish - but nonetheless, it's how I feel.
I knew that the Park car bedrooms were going to be restricted for crew use. That's another "rub." VIA Rail has screwed up "my train" and I seriously doubt that I'll be back for one of the most pleasant rail journeys in my years - Montreal to Halifax. Ahhhhhhh, but I have so many memories! Our first trip was in 1990 and the last was in 2005. I've traveled the Renaissance version on a weekend visit to a friend in New Brunswick, and that's where my first hand info on those "Chunnel Chuggers" was obtained. There was no Park Car for that particular journey, as VIA hadn't yet finalized the "gimmick" of attracting more tourists.
Through all of my ramblings, it is good to know that you found the Park car to be what I had hoped. You now have locked into your experiences something that very few will ever have. Those Budd cars used to criss-cross most of the USA, along with other "varieties" - domes were "king." All gone now - except of course for the excursions and the like. Must admit, now tha
Nick – thanks for the offer of a beer, mines a Kimberly Mild – sad news is that local paper announced decision taken a few days back that closure would be soon and that was official. That is Green King for you – an independent but fast becoming a Grim Reaper. We have to put up with their brews (IPA and Abbott) all over the place. I know Pete will be sorry to hear this too.
Pete – good point about the cheap tickets – they are usually operator specific so yes, they will be cut back too I suspect. There’s a big story behind the cheap fares which is outside the scope of this post and rarely covered in the media as it is complex to those who don't understand railways – after some ill informed articles about supposed rip off fares I contacted a journalist and suggested he write a detailed story explaining not HOW but WHY. To his credit he did and the story is on this link (of interest if you want to know why UK fares are so crazy). I’m pretty sure I’m the person quoted in the last para. I’ll paste the article of the link does not work.
http://money.guardian.co.uk/consumernews/story/0,,1783832,00.html
The excuse re dropping Gatwick / Brighton is they are increasing the Reading – Gatwick not via London service. In itself this will be good, but a through passenger will still need 2 changes, and the stock will be local commuter stock with little baggage space so no good for airport passengers etc. I missed that Ramsgate service at the time (but was aware of it) I regret missing the Deltic Haulage now of course.
I’ve not been on a moving Pendolino but it looked cramped to me when I inspected one at Euston. I had the privilege of riding on an APT during the time it was put into public service as a relief train back in about 1984 (superb by the way) and that had decent windows and great interior layout which felt spacious enough given the restricted body dimension required to permit tilt within the UK loading gauge. As you know doubt know MK IV was built for tilt profile, and as you say, much better than a Pendolino from the passenger aspect.
I look forward to the rest of your Stirling journey.
Tom, back to The Ocean. I think I should take a note book actually, as I’m often thinking of past journeys and have no notes. But on this occasion I scribbled a few notes on a bit of paper so I could feed back here. I felt I’d got some great advice and I thought a few of the regulars might appreciate my thoughts, judging by the comments by and large people seem interested.
Just a few points though:
Learning Co-ordinator (LC) : Like you I had serious reservations, but the only way I could get in the Park Car was Easterly Class and the LC comes ‘free of charge’. We Brits tend to think that sort of ‘organised’ guidance is rather too forward, and lets face it, those of us used to looking round the depot etc through the fence or in our own time and way don’t need the help, we have our own enthusiasm.
But my fears were unfounded. She was very low key, and basically operated as the Park car steward, and would answer questions people had, in a very interesting style (eg I asked her about the Phantom ship in Chaleur Bay and got a detailed and helpful answer, I also asked her for some museum recommendations in Halifax and that was answered helpfully too) – she did 2 talks unprompted, one about the Lobster industry and one about regional wines, but you could just ignore it if you wanted. To my mind she struck EXACTLY the right note. Later in the evening when only myself and my partner were in the Park Car I was chatting to her and asking about the bedrooms in the car and the car layout (they are used for the crew now the stock is Ren as they don’t have the rooms listed on the computer for booking now the Park Car is seasonal) and it did not occur to me to ask but I’d hardly mentioned my interest in them than she offered to show us the rooms, allowed us to take pictures etc (which was in, after all, her and other staff’s private rest space). I can not speak highly enough of her efforts.
Mind you, it was all I could do to persuade her not to put ice in the Scottish Single Malt my partner chose as an evening drink, but I selected a Canadian Rye whisky on her advice, and she said it was usual to drink that on ice, so I took her advice. Not bad I thought.
One thing I forgot to ask about was the protocol on tipping / gratuity. I know it varies for different staff on the train, but the LC did such a good job and was very kind and helpful I wanted to show our appreciation so gave her 20 Dollars Canadian. Do you feel that was appropriate?
Given the desirability of the Budd cars though I think I might have selected the Chaleur for my journey east (although I did need to get to Halifax to pick up my flight to the UK – which given the reduced time in the flying sardine can that flying to/ from Halifax allows, I just might fly in and out of there every time I need to get to Eastern Canada! Hang the extra cost – the journey was worth it alone in my view).
American Orient Express / Rocky Mounaineer: We think exactly alike, quite clearly. The only thing of interest to me about the AOE was the stock – seemed to have a Skyline and a Park car on the AOE – is that the case? Do the other vehicles in the consist have any pedigree?
Thanks for the movie house tip. Next time you do British theme day maybe I can request some of those BTF films get a showing, perhps mixed in with the selction of the US stuff Coalminer3 mentions?
Cheerio
DL-UK
PS - thanks for the Quebec bridge info - I see there was link with the Forth Bridge - a slim one. Having just crossed it I still maintain it needs a lick of paint!
Good Morning Barkeep and all Present; coffee, please; round for the house; $ for the jukebox. Cards Win! Cards Win! Can’t see any of the afternoon games so caught highlights on ESPN. Now we will see what the Mets can do against Red Sox West.
James – Thanks for layout shots
Mike – I remember the story on the Super C, and thanks for the URLs.
Lars – Book covers are appreciated as I don’t always keep up with that sort of stuff.
BK drumheads were interesting. The one with the Super Chief/El Cap together is from when the trains ran combined (usually in the “off season.”) Summer and holidays, IIRC, they ran separately.
DL-UK The association of American Railroads did a lot of films as well. Many of them are on video or DVD. Other roads such as the new Haven, NYC, and PRR also made promotional films. Oops, almost forgot the series of films done by the Boston and Maine. Anyway, one of the AAR films (deals with several track and equipment engineering subjects) features Hugh Beaumont (aka Ward Cleaver). I always wondered what he did during the day (LOL).
Our ‘steamed proprietor provided some most interesting material on the Quebec Bridge. Mohawk ironworkers are legendary.
Here’s some consist information for the GM&O since we have been talking about that road a little bit. Date for this is 1969.
Train 1-4 “The Limited”
Parlor Car (Drawing Room): Chicago-St. Louis
Diner-Lounge: Chicago-St. Louis
r/s coaches: Chicago-St. Louis
Trains 3-2 “Abraham Lincoln”
24 seat, 1 drawing room parlor car: Chicago-St. Louis
Trains 5-6 “Midnight Special”
“All through Gulf, Mobile and Ohio trains are air-conditioned and Diesel-Electric operated.”
Great Railroad Bridges - #4
Used with permission from Wikipedia.com
Quebec Bridge
The Quebec bridge, with the Pierre-Laporte bridge in the background.
Carries
3 lanes of roadway1 rail line1 pedestrian walkway
Crosses
St. Lawrence River
Locale
Quebec City, Quebec, and Levis, Quebec
Maintained by
Canadian National Railway
Design
Cantilever bridge
Longest span
549 m (1,800 feet)
Total length
987 meters (3,239 feet)
Width
29 m (94 feet) wide
Opening date
December 3, 1919
Coordinates
46°44'46?N, 71°17'16?W
The Quebec Bridge in Canada crosses the lower Saint Lawrence River to the west of Quebec City, and Levis, Quebec.
The Quebec Bridge is a riveted steel truss structure and is 987 meters (3,239 feet) long, 29 m (94 feet) wide, and 104 m (340 feet) high. Cantilever arms 177 m (580 feet) long support a 195 m (640 feet) central structure, for a total span of 549 m (1800 feet), the longest cantilever bridge span in the world. It is the easternmost complete crossing of the Saint Lawrence.
The bridge accommodates three highway lanes, one rail line, and a pedestrian walkway; at one time it also carried a streetcar line. It is owned by the Canadian National Railways.
HistoryBackground
Before the Quebec Bridge was built, the only way to travel from the south shore of the St. Lawrence in Levis to the north shore at Quebec City was to take a ferry. As far back as 1852 a project for a bridge over the St. Lawrence River at Quebec was considered, and again, in 1867, 1882, and 1884.
A March 1897 article in the Quebec Morning Chronicle noted:
The bridge question has again b
Three days into the 90s (F), rather humid -but all is to "break" later today! <phew> Petrol leaped to $2.18 (rounded) up at "Collusion Corner" - a jump of 22 cents and all the while the world oil barrel prices DROPPED!! Speculators are having a grand time . . . These JOs rank right down there with the other "honorable" professions of the world, such as animanl abuser, child molestor and - oh well, you get the point.
Acknowledgments go out to all who contributed to our Thread yesterday, including those who Posted after my PM departure - BK - Lars - Nick - Mike - Pete 'n James.
Today is "Toy 'n Model Trains Day!" OPTIONAL here at the Tavern by the Tracks. It's a day of the week set aside to discuss and/or provide some Pix (not an overwhelming number!) of our respective layouts or those of others - model 'n toy train manufacturers "info" most welcome.
It appears that we have "officially" added one more to the Legion of the Lost - passengerfan Al is no longer a "regular" and apparently has moved on . . . . hasn't responded to Emails - whether directly or via the Forum. Oh well . . . . was a nice ride, but he has been really gone for several months. Good fortune to you - wherever you are!
As we progress through this month, the absences will be noted - beginning with BK - followed soon by Pete - then Lars and soon thereafter, Moi. I'm not asking anyone to do a thing out of the ordinary. For those who participate - you know the way we do things - so if you wish, keep things moving. Ruth has the bar from 9 AM to 5 PM - Leon 'til CLOSING. "Whoever" wishes, may open up. And of course - the bar is CLOSED on Sundays! Breakfast - brunch - lunch at the tables 'n booths from 6 AM 'til 2 PM!!
Hope all is well with and for all of you, no matter where you are and what you may be doing!
Boris
Auf Widerseshen!
G-day Captain Tom and those at the grill and for those that can "hear" me at the bar.
I have heard that Wednesday is layout pixs day. Well I have been doing some experiments with the layout lately. I have been working with lit scenes at night and they seem to be turning out better than I had thought Nick was woundering about my layout. It is a 20 by 10 layout featuring the Milwaukee road. There are three industries that are being served on this layout. One is a Grain elevator that is 1 foot high and 3 feet long. The other two are part of a cement plant. One for the cement hoppers and the other for packaged powdered cement being loaded into boxcars.
The last glipse of the sun is seen on the rail as dark shrouds everything. This is located at Devole Tower right outside the Diamond. A pair of U-boats are sitting aside Idleing, for helper service up the 1.00% grade just above the diamond. The Train orderboard has a red light for the next on coming train, ready for there orders. It was raining that night so the picture is more grainy than it would have been. ( This is on my layout but this turned out so well that it looks real.)
This the back of the engine shed. The rounding curve coming from the East gives it a good look. The scenery part is coming along well and will be approved upon in the times to come.
Budkarr- I understand that I have come off to a bad start and the only one to blame here is myself. I am hoping over time that you will except me as being one here. And that everything goes well.
Tom- I'd like to thank you for letting me come back. I will keep up with the theme of the day and the next exciting things to come.
I will be signing off right now but there will be more pics to come of the layout.
A pint of Holdens Mild please RUTH As I am in time to see you before LEON takes over.
ROB Many thanks for the part 3 on the Canadian it was a real pity that the large investment in the Budd cars did not pay out for the CP, but at least they have put in many years of good service.
Looking forward to the sausages tomorrow.
DL-UK That sure seems a backward step terminating the Cross Country trains at Manchester and Newcastle. I wonder what will happen to the through cheap tickets, will the other company allow one through ticket or will a seperate ticket be needed for each different leg of the journey. I know an ordinary expensive ticket can be bought but the 'buy in advance' cheaper tickets may be hard to come by. That is bad news of Virgin dropping the Brighton/Gatwick service. It will mean getting across London on the tube with suitcases etc for people needing to get to the Midlands North West and Scotland, although there is that service from Gatwick to Watford Junction which is allright IF there is a decent connection at Watford, still nowhere near as good as a through train. The Sussex Scot always seemed a well filled,( sometimes too much so,) train when I used to see it. For a while there was a summer Saturday train that ran from the West Midlands to Ramsgate in Kent which ran via the West Coast and Kensington which used a preserved class 55 Deltic as haulage.
As to the Pendelinos, I used to live on the West Coast route so have seen them from the start. When they were first introduced I though they were awful with the seats not lining up with the windows, and it was some times hard to find a working toilet and the smell around the toilet area was, in many cases awful,.Also the PA system seems to leave a lot to be desired with its annoying beeping sound. On my last visit the Pendelino fleet seemed to have settled down and were giving good service, although the seating arrangement leaves a lot to be desired in my opinion, also if travelling north bound nearly all the seats in the first coach face backwards which I try to avoid if at all possible. the only thing in their favour is the are certainly fast and the tilt mechanics is first rate.In my opinion they are not a patch on the MKIVs
It is sad news about Kimberley it does indeed seem as though Greene King are doing a Whitbread.
I will post the Part 2 to Stirling all being well tomorrow.
Many thanks for the Canadian trip details It was very interesting to read about the Renaissance cars in use there.
Great Santa Fe Day.
DOUG. Thanks for the Alco diesel pics. How many marks does one get if too drunk to read the test.
CM3 Great description of SF cars and the services availiable on board, it certainly was a different age, imagine trying to get your shoes cleaned on a aircraft. Enjoyed the Joke.
ROB Great piece on the Harvey Girls and Fred Harvey. I have read they have opened a restaurant in the Harvey tradition recently at Union Station Kansas City..
BK Good to see you. Great set of Santa Fe Drumheads.
LARS Another great set of bookcovers loved the one with the Alco and the F series on the cover.
TOM Thanks for the kind words.Enjoyed your post to DL-UK on the Canadian cars.
Looking through the list of the Santa Fe named trains it struck me how many called or even started at Kansas City . I wonder if the KC football team took their name from the Santa Fe train the Chief.
It is really great about Our Place that we have the knowledgeable folks who can put details to a long ago memory like CM3 has to your long ago trip on the Super Chief..
As you may have guessed at the start with asking Ruth to serve I started this much earlier and had to go out.
I have just seen your posts NICK and Mike so I will send this and have a read.
Pete.
Hi Tom and everyone, a round for the house.
Baseball season begins tomorrow for the Mets. Good luck Cardinals fans.
Is that you the hippie Nick?
Here's an article from Time Magazine, July 19, 1971 (www.time.com)
Fast Freight: Across the U.S. on Super C
The nation's railroads are for perennial labor disputes, failing passenger service and, in the case of giant Penn Central, spectacular bankruptcy. Yet the railroads have become increasingly good at moneymaking service, using new specialized and electronic gadgetry that would baffle Casey Jones. For a closeup view of modern railroading, Associate Keith Johnson rode cab and caboose on the world's fastest freight train, Santa Fe's premium-rate Super C, Chicago to Los Angeles. His log:
8:20 A.M., CHICAGO. "Highball, Gerty, all aboard," comes the word over the cab loudspeaker. Engineer eases the throttle open, and his huge diesel units, totaling more 10,000 h.p., growl into action. They are pulling nine cars, mostly mail loaded in truck trailers carried on 85-ft. flatcars. From the cab track seems too frail and narrow to support 1,500 tons of locomotive and load. After the train leaves the Corwith yards, the speedometer needle creeps up slowly through the flat, industrial along the Des Plaines River. Finally are thundering along at 79 m.p.h., the top speed allowed this train. There a loud beeping sound over Gerty's an Alertor, with sensors wired to cab controls, has detected that he not moved for some 20 seconds. This safety device will automatically the train if the engineer does respond.
10:30 A.M., CHILLICOTHE, ILL. The first of 17 crew changes between Chicago and Los Angeles. Gerty climbs down the side of the red, yellow and silver lead diesel unit; Engineer Bill Burk climbs up. Off again, then a stop for 20 minutes in Galesburg. A load of lumber on the local freight ahead of us has shifted dangerously, so that car must be set out on a siding. Though a fast train like Super C means less working time for the crews, Burk says he prefers handling a longer, heavier train: "It's the difference between a Sunday outing in the family sedan and driving a racing car. Here you've got a lot of power and you've got to keep the speed up."
The Super C sweeps along the Mississippi River at full speed, then slows to cross into Iowa over a combined highway-railroad bridge. At La Plata, Mo., after crossing to the eastward track to pass a slower freight also heading west, the engineer again opens the throttle fully. With so much power hauling a relatively light train, the Super C seems to reach top speed almost as fast as an automobile. The mileposts flash by, one every 45 seconds.
5 P.M., KANSAS CITY, MO. Long-haired young Brakeman George Ketner, sporting bell-bottomed jeans, says he likes working the Super C: "All you have to do is get on at the beginning and get off at the end of the run." The train pulls out past the Santa Fe's year-old Argentine sorting yard, equipped with one IBM System 360 Model 30 and two Honeywell DDP-516 computers, which have speeded up car movements through the yard by about 50%. Two delegations of Japanese railroadmen have inspected the new yard, and one print of a Santa Fe film about Argentine even has a soundtrack in Japanese.
The Super C passes through blue-stem-grass country, where herds of beef cattle are fattened for slaughter. After a red sunset over the Kansas prairie, the engineer switches on the regular headlights and a rotating white Mars light, which cuts a circular cone through the dark. The shiny tops of the distant rails reflect the jewel-like green signals, a row of beckoning beacons in the night. Engineer O.K. Stewart remembers meeting a bobcat on the tracks one night. "Those old eyes were glowing as big as baseballs when we came around the curve," he says.
6:30 A.M., BELEN, N. MEX. The caboose is no Pullman car, but it is comfortable enough with folded-down seats to sleep on, a lavatory, a small refrigerator, a water cooler and an oil stove, which serves to heat the car and warm the breakfast coffee cake. The desert dawn is bright and clear; the sun backlights the Manzano Mountains to the east. The train climbs continually to the Continental Divide crossing at Gonzales. "Back in the days of hand-fired steam locomotives, we were real glad to get here," says Ray Derksen, acting train master at Gallup. Derksen points out a hotbox detector at trackside, an infrared gadget that spots defective wheel bearings; one installation can cost as much as $50,000, but a single derailment caused by a hot box can be much more expensive.
10:55 A.M., WINSLOW, ARIZ. A tear in the metal roof of the lead trailer has orsened, so in the 25 minutes we stop here, a maintenance crew makes a quick patch. From Winslow the line climbs again to its highest point at Riordan, the 7,313-ft. Arizona Divide. On a fast train like the Super C the crews get a full day's pay for as little as 2½ hours on the railroad. The men lay over in Seligman; if they are not assigned a return run within 16 hours their pay starts again The pay is good: the average on the Albuquerque division is more than $12,000 a year, with senior engineers making $18,000 easily. Trainmaster E.L. Kidd notes that practically all of the men who run the Santa Fe come from railroading families.
3 P.M., NEEDLES, CALIF. From the River crossing, it is uphill across the Mojave Desert, hazy with heat, sand swirling beneath high purple mountains. We make a triple meet, going into a siding at 15 m.p.h. to pass a loaded 84-car coal train that is so heavy it must stick to the main line; at same time an eastward freight sweeps by on the descending grade. After Victorville it is a climb of 1,106 ft. in 19 miles to the summit of Cajon Pass, eerily shrouded in fog. We crawl along, watching for signals looming out of murk, then creep down the steep slope, air brakes hissing, to San Bernardino. Suddenly all is neon lights, freeways, gas stations and palm trees.
9:40 P.M., LOS ANGELES. We pull into the terminal at Hobart in southeastern Los Angeles, end of the 2,202-mile journey from Chicago. It has taken only 39 hours and 20 minutes, 40 minutes faster than scheduled - a trip faster than that of the Super Chief, the Santa Fe's crack passenger train. Twelve minutes after we stop, the first trailer has already been unloaded by a giant yellow straddle crane and driven away.
http://images.nypl.org/?id=68972&t=w
Arizona territory
http://www.archives.gov/research/american-west/images/030.jpg
Geronimo
http://media.nara.gov/media/images/43/8/43-0773a.gif
Topeka 1945
http://muse.museum.montana.edu/rvndb/rvn-jpgs/RVN20616.jpg
http://muse.museum.montana.edu/rvndb/rvn-jpgs/RVN20615.jpg
Argentine Yard, Kansas City 1943 (Jack Delano photos)
http://memory.loc.gov/service/pnp/fsac/1a34000/1a34700/1a34716v.jpg
Westbound freight waiting for the eastbound at Ricardo, NM 1943
http://memory.loc.gov/service/pnp/fsac/1a34000/1a34700/1a34732v.jpg
Gallup, NM
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Mojave Desert view from the train
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Colorado River view from the train
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Diesel 103
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Santa Fe ads
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Mike
Well good evening Gentlemen all-before we begin I would like to make a public apology to both TOM" border="0" /> and LARS for ill-considered and frankly insulting remarks made recently-am more than happy to take it outside and let you both have the first pop-fully deserved...........................
Moving on............Regrettably,I have no German so cannot enter into the full spirit,however I CAN order a beer in almost any language-(it`s a gift,apparently..) so:-
Leon,a round of steins of foaming golden lagers ( I would steer you all towards the big green bottles of Staropramen Prague bier in the back fridge-by chance,this was available on draught at last fridays venue (the only place I`ve ever found that does so...free to the musicians--even taking into account the $40 cab fare home I was STILL way ahead of the game-although a touch liverish on sat............................)
O.K-to business:-
CM3-glad you enjoyed the layout pix-I dont pretend it`s more than it is-just a place to run my trains.........
BK-(and LYDIA) fine research on railroads vs railways-re beatles/DECCA,according to urban myth,even Keith Richards,the ultimate hooligan, now refers to "dear old Sir Edward"when asked about the "toilet wall graffitti" album cover...........
PETE-The Bulleid in the px is "Lord Beaverbrook"-one of the "new generation" Hornby models-as bought it was a terrible runner-removal of the traction tyres on the middle drivers (which caused it to rock back and forwards ) have resulted in a smooth running loco which will happily lift 6 cars up the big bank on the layout and would almost certainly take more if the loops permitted
Enjoyed the "Scots trip" nice pix also-would be a gas to do it again with `the company`-still-who knows......
Grim news about Youngs brewery-their `Ram Rod ` bottled ale was a benchmark of my youth...........
ROB-Gotta love that VIA blue-a real class act-The only VIA unit I have in the dull ( & frankly tedious ) grey is a Walthers F40ph that I cant find an excuse to repaint............
DOUG-As ever mate,a wonderful selection of images ( and gags ! ) loved the rusty `F` units-some serious atmosphere there--also the `flying donkey` and the cat...............one of our badger sized beasts has a destructive interest in my old WEM copycat tape loop machine-As soon as it`s out,the wretched thing is diving into the machinery trying to kill it and has the gall to look hurt when aggressively discouraged
MIKE-Been there and tried the nutmeg thing-weird ***-but ( and this is important)--it`s another dry day-stay with it mate
LARS-nice stuff on the VIA routes and consists
TOM" border="0" />-have yet to see `Fierce Creatures` although it is one of the very few on my list-a great fan of Cleese/Palin etc ,as you know-can only imagine the pleasure I will derive from it......
DL-UK- Thanks for corrections R.E `pendolinos`-interesting observations of the VIA service-welcome aboard,pull up a seat ,beers are on me
JAMES:- are you still with us ?-nice pics of your layout:-wednesday is `model day `round this place-if you want to give us a rundown on your layout,I for one would be interested in hearing it-a few pix would also be welcome.....................
might have a few images myself,you never know.................
Right-note for those that have commented :-.......My pix date back over several years and several cameras-the earliest ones are taken on a `point& press` 110,the `middle era` on a slightly more sophisticated 35 mm and the most recent on a 4million pixel digi-cam,set at 2 mill-per image...........
I suspect that any clarity of image is due to living in an area where it rains almost daily,thus removing dust from the atmosphere and being on the west coast,the sea adds to the ambient light available by reflection.
Also,the subject matter is part of "The Great Little Trains of Wales"-a significant part of the tourist industry over here-these engines are preserved and operated in the great Victorian tradition-not a one of them leaves the shed in the morning without looking their very best---------also-any picture looks better on a computer screen than it does `in the flesh` so to speak--try printing one out and you will see-they look very flat by comparison
DOUG-I tried the drunks test ,as advised,-sadly I attempted to stand up whilst standing on my hands and both computer & self were damaged in the process-I trust you will forgive me if I don`t attempt to repeat the exercise.................put me down as a minus whatever-I can cope................................
take care chaps-Leon, a round for all and some weird *** for Herr Wurlitzer-White Rabbit by Jefferson Airplane,Wooden ships by C.S&N and to finish off, that most sinister of triumverates-- Gimme Shelter,Midnight Rambler & Sympathy for the Devil by the Stones..........
See you all tomorrow for toy train day,
take care,be lucky,nick
G'day Captain Tom and fellow travelers at the bar!
Ruth, a round if you please and I'll have a frosty cold Keiths . . . .
Some fine posts from the guys today and as Tom said, sure looks a bit like "old times" around here. I'm going to miss my "bookend" as he departs for a couple (or more) weeks away. Looks as if "The Three Horsemen" will be riding off to separate destinations this month . . . .
I'm a bit short on conversation today - so let me get right to it:
Continuing with the "Theme for the Day!" here are some books featuring the Santa Fe (passenger) Railway:
Until the next time!
Lars
Seems quite a bit like "old times" here at the bar with so many fine contributions to fill up the morning slot. That is most unusual, unexpected but very much appreciated, I hope, by all of YOU!
Just read through that "drunk test" again from Doug and there's quite a bit in there for some of us to think about! Good laffs, fer sure, fer sure!
Like those Santa Fe drumheads from BK - and of course, good to have you back with us. Figured you'd stop by before heading out again and I'm glad you did. Sage wisdom and advice is never wasted 'round here, and I concur - none of this should have transpired. There is a lesson in this for all of us - don't be too quick to welcome unless and until you know who you are dealing with. Then again, anyone can say anything out here in the virtual Ether . . . . makes things like trust look a bit like a fairy tale. Anyway, nice selection for our "Theme for the Day!" and we look forward to MORE . . . .
Another visit from Rob and this time something to contribute for the "theme"! Nicely done, Sir and it fits quite well within the "parameters." Fred Harvey House's were "fixtures" at many U.S. and Canadian rail terminals. HOWEVER, you really should relace that "spell check" software - "Cofederacie" really
Yet another visit from DL in the UK - better watch it, we may mistake you for a "regular" 'round this joint!
A long time back I began carrying a small spiral notebook with me for salient comments during rail and air trips. To this day, I continue with that habit which really began when I was an investigator in "my other life." Anyway, from what I've read, it surely appears as if you have a critical eye for details and an ability to have your thoughts chronicled on them.
There's quite a bit in your latest to comment on, and I'm not certain that anyone other than I has the experience of travel aboard VIA Rail's Ocean to Halifax and return - on either consist - all Budd or the Renaissance Euro's.
Let me add my as follows:
Glad the "tips" assisted you in a positive manner. That's what I had hoped.
I haven't encountered the "Learning Coordinator" and doubt that I will. That "innovation" totally turned me off to travel aboard the "new" Ocean <ugh>
Park car accommodations: We've been very fortunate to have booked our bedrooms in the Park car on more trips than I honestly can recall. We've crossed Canada four times (2 round trips) and had the Drawing Room Suite (triple bedroom) for all of those journeys. It IS the way to go! Also, bedroom D in the Park car is the largest double as it is in the Chateu series of sleepers.
Interesting comments about the "Orient Express." We had a similar experience in Vancouver as the Rocky Mountaineer was boarding directly across the platform from our arriving "Canadian" from Toronto. Everything surely appeared as "plastic" to me with the college kids all appearing to be "interested" in helping the "tourists" with this 'n that and not a one of them having enough railroad expertise to pack into a thimble. Someone mentioned, "Wouldn't it be wonderful to travel like THAT?" I had all to do to restrain my commentary - and my wife was extremely please at my self control!
Films: Mentor Village, where "Our" Place is located has a fine motion picture theatre, called the Emporium. We feature new presentations beginning each Sunday and run for the week. Check out our Sunday Photo Posting Day! to keep abreast of what's being shown! Many fine flicks from the U.S. and UK. Thanx for the URL.
Check out this URL for the Emporium's Grand Re-opening:
http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/215/916297/ShowPost.aspx#916297
(scroll down to near the bottom of the page)
Finally, THANX CM3 for that summary of features for those Santa Fe "named" trains of old. What you wound up doing was providing for me the ANSWER to a question that has haunted me for decades. What WAS the train I took in 1947/48 from LA to Chicago - as a 9 or 10 year od - ALONE Well, all of these years I really never made the effort to "dig" - probably because it wasn't that imortant to me. Now that I'm "into" this Thread and "classic trains" those memories came back. What WAS that train
Tuesday Theme for the Day - Santa Fe Railway
Greetings once again Captain Tom and fellow sophisticates!
I give you drum heads from the Santa Fe Railway passenger trains of years gone by - classics in every sense of the meaning:
I hope to be back with more as the day progresses . . .
BK in Alberta, Canada's beautiful high mountain country!
Good Morning Captain Tom and fellow sophisticates!
A brief return to the old haunts before we pack up and depart for the Thanksgiving holiday. My, my it appears as if things have been rather stressed in my absence. Perhaps my return will restore a bit of tranquility to this bar of adult men.
Ruth, I shall have a Crown Royal on the rocks if you please – a bit early for me, but I require the “jump start.” Thank you, and a round for the fellows!
As a departure from what should be an inclusive posting, I would like to recognize the return of DL-UK to our group and although I have not read through your latest submission, I surely will before the day comes to an end. Welcome back and it appears you had a marvelous time in Canada.
My rather infrequently checked email (e-mail or Email – which is it??) revealed some distressing and enlightening messages, but alas, none of it should have been necessary. A shame and a pity all rolled into one. I apologize for rekindling that which should remain extinguished, but I must have my say in this as well. I am after all, a trusted member of this group who has earned his “stripes” so to speak.
I have been a patron of Captain Tom’s fine establishment for more than a year. Many of those months had me off on business ventures all over the globe, primarily Europe. Upon return, I could always count on this oasis in the Ether awaiting me with good cheer, excellent reading matter and good natured interaction (for the most part!). For me, one who clearly presented the meager background I had to offer regarding trains of all stripes – real or model – the acceptance by the regular customers was heartening indeed. Whether I fit the mold or not, the overwhelming majority of those here made me feel as if my presence was important to the whole of “Our” Place and appreciated. To this day, it is the very reason why I return to this hiatus.
CMSTPP, James or whoever you may be in reality, let it be known that you will encounter those in life who will “call” that hand you are playing. When that happens, you must be ready to reveal it. There is no where to hide once the cards are on the table and it is as plain and simple as that. Whether you are indeed 18 or younger perhaps, you will learn that to frequent a place where you are either ineligible or unwelcome does not bode well for any one, especially you. You have not gotten off to the kind of beginning where acceptance will be easy. Judgments have been made and will continue on as the other guys drop by in later days. You will simply have to live with it.
Captain Tom sets the rules around here and if he says you can sit amongst us, it then becomes our individual choices to accept it or move on. It is indeed a shame that we have had this befall us – we are not a teenage hangout nor will we ever be. I would rather not hear of this business of being 18 can put you in the military, give one the right to vote and all of that. I look at it quite differently. There are people my age who should have the right to vote taken from them and there are good reasons why many should never be permitted into the military. So those criteria do not factor into my thinking. What does is found in the manner in which one conducts himself amongst others. Men KNOW when they are being conned, adolescents may not. I think what our friend red P had to offer sums it up quite nicely.
Ruth, I will be back shortly with my contribution to this Tuesday “Theme for the Day!” – Santa Fe. My, my – the place does look quite handsome in the splendor of OKTOBERFEST!
BK in Alberta, Canada’s beautiful high mountain country!
Good day staff and customers. Can I order an afternoon tea please?
Thanks you for your observations on my bit on the Ren day cars Tom. No doubt we think alike. You only have to see the Budd Park Car to see how much better that is (and did I see it – I got the whole internal tour – rooms and all by the kind Easterly Co-ordinator on The Ocean) more of which later.
As for Montreal Gare Centrale – yes very good ambiance, and helpful info desk and ticket staff – allowed me to pick up and a new Amtrak system timetable (kept under the counter if you need one, but handed over with pleasure when asked). And, as mentioned before the decoration / wall murals are superb, and very well maintained. I guess the access issues on those main stations is all mixed up with rebuilds to make use of air rights so the platforms are gloomy as hell with the fires out – maybe that is why they’ve not wanted passengers down there for too long.
Anyway, first of all to Tom and various others (inc Timothy on the Canadian Passenger RR thread) whose little hints and tips were a real help on The Ocean Journey, ticket pickup, baggage checks etc. Knowing the score makes all the difference and put me into poll position for things like early morning and after dark dome car visits, best places for scenery, plenty of space in bedroom thanks to luggage tips, most of the journey we had front seats in the dome and it was basically thanks to you guys. Most other Easterly passengers were tourists (there was a large tour group of 20+ Australian travellers taking The Ocean Easterly as part of their longer holiday, but we left them standing when we needed to get to that Park Car). I had printed out a digest of the comments people had made to help me and it was all spot on – a big thank you.
I only let you down once, and that was by not being able to make the Delson museum., despite your encouragement. I’ll be back, as it was disappointing not to be there.
So, some of the Easterly Class stuff is spin – at Montreal the dedicated check in was only slightly more dedicated as there were large numbers in Easterly on our journey – by the time we queued for ages for no other reason than to select our meal sitting time it was time to go down on to the train (so never saw the Panorama Lounge – even though it was 90% empty when we arrived at the station at 17.00 the steward in the lounge told us Ocean passengers could not wait in there till 17.45 - when we were in the queue – and when we left the queue at was 18.15 and we went straight to board).
We had a warm and friendly welcome both from the Sleeper steward and the Easterly Learning co-ordiantor, no need for the tour of the room – all self explanatory.
So – what do I think of a Ren Sleeping Car? Well, once again a good European car that should be working in Europe.
Pro: The shower was handy and worth the small extra payment – although you need to prepare your bathroom for the dousing. Design failure not to have a sloping floor as it does not drain well.
Con: What really drove me crazy at night was the shower pipe slapping against the wall – not in our room – I predicted this and laid the thing on the floor – but in the next door room – I could hear it slapping through the wall keeping me awake until I got fed up and used the ear plugs.
Con: Air con fan is too noisy too – this is a fault on the early 1980s BR Mark 3 sleeper (built to same loading gauge of course so my bench mark comparator for this exercise). Heated panel in bathroom is not really what you want either – in fact bathroom fan could be noisier and room fan quieter!
Con: Room temp dial seemed a work of fiction – it regulated the temp but not within the range on the dial. Only when I asked steward about this did he change the temp on the car computer – said his indicator showed our room at 17 C which was too cold – he changed it and then of course it got a bit on the warm side – why not just make the dial in the room work all right?
Pros: Beds are slightly longer and wider than the BR Mk 3 mentioned above, and room is wider too with the little cupboard space – so if you think Ren stock is cramped prepare yourself for a UK Sleeper journey! However, BR Mark 3’s are better at stowage space in the smaller compartment – with more useful hooks etc available.
I’ll save my posts on The Park car till later, and my views on the Dining Car - where sadly I have some sharp comments about fairly mediocre standards (almost as bad as British standards of service I might add).
Something of interest at Montreal was the American Orient Express lined up on adjacent track, with VIA power at the Head End – ready to depart same time as us but heading west for Vancouver. Sadly efforts at a closer look were met with an officious instruction from a Porter to the effect of I should get back on my train. I have to say it looked good but when our sleeping car attendant asked if I wished I was riding it I had to say “no” – essentially I prefer a real train going to a real place for a real reason with real people on board, not a cruise. What do others think? It was also rather sad to see all the stewards (at their door posts ready for departure) looked like overseas labour. I have no ideological objection to this – people should be able to sell their labour where they can – but to me it is code for an employer who wishes to pay rock bottom wages yet still find employees who have to be prepared to answer every beck and call of their over pampered passengers. Again what do others think? I’d like someone to tell me I’m wrong and say that AOE staff are amongst the best paid in the business, but sadly I doubt it.
FILM
I’ll sign off with this link since we have discussed film earlier – in case you did not know BR had its own in house film division for about 40 years (some great titles out on DVD from the British Film Institute no less for anyone with an interest in the UK scene). An enthusiast has created this superb website dedicated to the films – hope you enjoy a look:
http://www.britishtransportfilms.co.uk/
Click on the Films listing A-Z and some of the film titles for some great film stills (Try “Blue Pullman” and “Snowdrift at Bleath Gill” for a taste – and Pete, if you want a warm up for the A4 at Delson look at the page for “Elizabethan Express”). I can’t recommend the recently re-mastered DVD’s highly enough (do they work in North America – I know video worked to a different standard?)
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