"OUR" PLACE - SEE NEW THREAD!

[siberianmo]

G’day All!

PASSENGER TRAIN NOSTALGIA #64

Here’s something to enjoy regarding the Pullman Company from a 1949 advertisement in my personal collection.


How to pack more pleasure into your vacation

1. Step into the cool comfort of your Pullman car. Your vacation has started! Because going Pullman turns travel time into vacation time, whether your destination is 300 or 3000 miles away.

2. Relax deep down, like an uncoiled spring. You’re mere miles out of town, but years away from the tension of your job. You’re enjoying a cool drink, the conversation and companionship of interesting people in the Pullman lounge car.

3. Dream by the miles. You’ll never sleep more soundly. Your mind is uncluttered. Your frame’s limber in that deep-mattressed, big-pillowed Pullman bed.

4. Arrive ready for the rest of the fun. And – had you noticed? – you’re looking forward to your return trip. Because going or returning, going Pullman packs more pleasure into any vacation!


See the Chicago Railroad Fair in ’49 – June 25th thru October 2nd

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . GO PULLMAN . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
THE SAFEST, MOST COMFORTABLE WAY TO GET THERE!


Enjoy!

Tom [4:-)][oX)]

[LoveDomes]

Hello Tom and whoever else is here!

How about one of those frosty cold Rheingolds in a bottle if you please! (Remember those Miss Rheingold contests[?]) While it is a bit close to dinner time at my house, I can handle a half sandwich. A ham, swiss and roast beef on a hard roll will do just fine. And, throw in one of those large pickles from the barrel, okay[?]

What a lot of reading there is on the past several pages. Good stuff, informative stuff, educational stuff, but far too much, way too much, too darned much! So, I have a suggestion for any and all who are so inclined to fill up a single forum page with your submission: put them into parts, like part one, part two, etc. Sure would be a lot easier to handle. Just my [2c] - and I'm one of the guys who reads these things! So gimme a break![swg] Seriously, just scrolling through 'em is hard enough .....

Nick You are correct - I was a wee bit over the top with my comments. But you see, we New Yorkers are guilty of being overly blunt, so I'm told![swg] I'll keep an eye on that creature called Boris now that I've been forewarned.

BK We haven't met, but I've read your posts from day one. Sounds to me as if you are more than ready for the cozy environs of a good home with a good woman. [yeah] Man - works for me! Safe journey home.[tup]

The Santa Fe guy seems to be trying to tell us something with his Chiefs and the RR. Well, that's fine - I guess. Those pix were rather interesting too. Don't know the guy, so I'll refrain from the word, "cute."[:O] I'm really NOT that kind of guy. [swg]

So, what's the deal[?] Nothing from the supporting cast for awhile,huh[?] Seems like when the Manager left, so did a bunch of others. Ok, ok, no connection - just happenstance and all of that. But it just looks rather glum these days. Maybe that isn't all so bad though. Really. I recall reading your comments about trying to get the guys to pick a time of day for their Posts and stick to it. Of course, they haven't really done so, but it is still a good idea. I'll try to help out as best I can. Unless something out of the ordinary comes up, I probably can stick to the timeframe of mid afternoon. That may help to fill a void of sorts and rerlieve Tom of having to make a post just to keep things moving.

That was a terrific bit of info you provided CM3[tup] I've been down to where those "good ole boys live" and have seen several of the historic railroads. Georgia has quite a history for railroading. I think Tom is right on the mark though when it comes to planning a get together in a location where there isn't a point man.

Oh, almost forgot - those beer coasters are something else when enlarged! Nice work, Tom. What kind of equipment are you using to do that sort of thing[?]

So, are you going to keep us in suspense about this new venture of yours, Tom[?] Monday, huh[?] That's a long way off![tdn] What's it going to be[?] Hooters Gals riding the rails[?][swg][:-,][}:)] Now there's a thought! Maybe I'll look into that myself.[swg]

Ok, this is going no where fast. So, I'll take my leave, Sir. One more and then I'm gone. Here's a ten spot for the next round - whenever the guys show up that is.

Until the next time,

Lars

[siberianmo]

G'day Gents!

Rather quiet again - two days in succession. However, thanx to passengerfan Al and his two rather looooooooong Posts, along with CM3's enlightening and inclusive post, we're still "up" on the Forum page.[tup][tup]

I've been working on a new series that will be Posted starting Monday. So, watch for it! These are really labor intensive and involves all kinds of editing in order to make them "work" with the Forums format. For example, the piece I'm working on now was started 3 hours ago and I'm just about half finished with it! [yeah] I know - get a life![swg]

CM3 That PRR Pullman "ad" you quoted looks familiar - wondering whether I've typed it and it's still sitting in my 'archives.' How's that saying go, "So many ads, so little time!"[swg] Anyway, appreciate your taking the time to share it with us![tup][tup]

Al Enjoyed the North Coast Limited Post! As with the dwindlling numbers of people remaining from WWII days (specifically veterans) the same applies to those who can recall traveling on those wonderful RR routes we had criss crossing the continent. Thanx to people such as yourself and a few others 'round here, we'll always have an opportunity to learn and if we were so fortuantate, to reminisce. Thanx![tup]

CM3 While I concur that some parts of Georgia would be "cool" for a Rendezvous my guess is that we'd need someone in the area to coordinate it. Kind of the way our approach has been with Rob in Toronto. While it is a bit early to tell, the feedback I've gotten leans toward St. Louis for the next. But nothing is cast in stone ... the guys who attend the Rendezvous in Toronto get first crack at making that 'awesome' decision![swg]

Quarters are very much appreciated and so is the round![tup] Where in the world do you find those song titles![?]![?][swg]

Later as it's time for a break for this keyboard!<groan>

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[coalminer3]

Good Morning Barkeep and all Present - coffee, for me (in an insulated cup given the wind, cold and snow here this a.m.; round for the house, and $ for the jukebox. Let's play two old favorites - "How Can I Miss You If You Won't Go Away," and "I Changed Her Oil, She Changed My Life."

Pls. excuse the silence from here, but things have been a bit crazy at work. 'Nuff said.

I went back throught the recent postings.

To ftwNSengineer. If you don't have Lynch's book on the New Haven, I think you'd enjoy it. He just did another one on New Haven passenger trains which has a lot of good information as well. BTW, I thought his PC book was well done, too

Again my compliments to all who are providing car histories, information, streamlined consists and all - I do have a pretty good sized folder of that material now.

The Welsh Highland history was most interesting. I am guessing that the Vulcan locomotives were manufactured on your side of the great divide, Nick. There was a Vulcan Company here as well.

The Budd ads brought back a lot of memories as they used to run lovely color ads in publications such as the National Geographic.

I got my R&LHS Newsletter in the mail the other day. Inside is an article abt. the Southern Museum of Civil War and Locomotive History (two in one, yet!) in Kennesaw, GA. Not only does this place house the "General," it also has an extensive collection of machinery and artifacts from the Glover Machine Works (Marietta, GA) - a company closely associated with various facets of logging operations in the southeastern U.S. Now that might be a possibility for a rendezvous sometime as Kennesaw is right close to Atlanta.

In line with what all that has been provided regarding Pullman cars, etc. recently, here's something from the PRR files in my collection. This is from the period when the transiton to all room cars was occurring, even though it was interrupted by the war. The copy included illustration (wonderful drawings) of the different types of Pullman space.

"The Pennsylvania Railroad offers you a selection of Modern Pullman Room Accommodations on Its Great Fleet...

Roomette - In daytime service with bed folding into wall, providing passengers plenty of space. Roomette in night-time service. A luxurious bed affording all the comforts of home. This accommodation affords complete privacy, including individual toilet and lavatory.

Duplex - Upstairs and downstairs "Duplex" single rooms, complete with individual toilet facilities. Roomy sofa becomes a comfortable bed at night.

Double Bedroom - As with all private room accommodations, individual toilet and lavatory are included. The sofa becomes a bed at night, over which there is a comfortable berth.

Compartment - Thje Compartment sofa makes down into a bed with an upper berth above it. It, too, has its own individual toilet facilities.

Drawing room - Complete with every personal facilitiy, the spacious Darwing Room affords a living room atmosphere in day service. Folding bed is let down at night. The sofa becomes a bed, and the upper bed, easy of access, is equally inviting. Private toilet facilities.

Master Room - Four arm chairs for day service. Connecting room has private shower and lavatory facilities. At night, two roomy 6'4" beds. Roomy locker privides ample space for clothes.

The roomette is for 1 person
Duplex is for 1 person
Double bedroom - 1 or 2 persons
Compartment - 1 or 2 persons
Drawing rrooom - 1, 2, or 3 persons
Master room - 1 or 2 persons

PRR - Feb. 1942

work safe

[passengerfan]

Good Morning Tom once again just transferring the sleeping car introduction over here.

STREAMLINED SLEEPING CARS
OF THE
UNITED STATES & CANADA
By Alan L. Pettet

INTRODUCTION







The first lightweight streamlined sleeping car to enter service in the United States was the Pullman Pool car GEORGE M. PULLMAN named for the founder of the Pullman Company. This car was a true lightweight being constructed mainly of Aluminum by Pullman in May 1933.
The car was never repeated but certainly was innovative in many ways being of lightweight Aluminum construction it was the first successful railway application of this metal to a passenger car. The trucks under the car were experimental four wheel trucks with aluminum side frames of a new design built for smooth riding qualities at high speeds, but never repeated as they required a great deal of maintenance. The experimental trucks the Sleeper observation GEORGE M. PULLMAN was delivered with were never repeated under any other car and were replaced by standard 6 wheel trucks within the first two years of operation. The experimental trucks were never seen again. Rumors persist that one of the trucks developed a serious crack and that was the reason for their removal. The interior of the GEORGE M. PULLMAN consisted of 3 Double Bedrooms, 1 Compartment, 1 Drawing Room, with Buffet and Lounge Observation area. The car ran on several different trains over the years before being sold to the C&GW for use as a Business car and Charter car. The GEORGE M. PULLMAN despite its historical significance was retired and scrapped.
Since the first streamlined sleeping cars were direct descendants of the older Pullman heavyweight sleeping cars it is interesting to note that the interiors were basically similar to the heavyweights they replaced except for the clerestory roofs. Many of the heavyweight cars were becoming all room cars by this time as many trains began offering more and more of this type accommodations.
Since the government being far more frugal with taxpayer money during that period in history than in more recent years the person traveling at government expense was only permitted lower berth space. Therefore the demand for lower berth space in Sections continued throughout most of the streamlined Railroad era up until this order was rescinded in 1956. After that time government employees were reimbursed for Roomettes if traveling alone and in some cases where it could be shown that Roomette space was sold out they would reimburse for a Bedroom or even a Compartment. When pairs of Government employees of the same sex were traveling together they would be asked to share a double bedroom or could travel in two separate Roomettes. By the mid 1960’s the Government was reimbursing for any and all sleeping car space on trains including Drawing Rooms and in the case of some high ranking military brass they were even permitted Master Room space on the BROAWAY LIMITED and CRESCENT.
In North America there were four major manufacturers of lightweight streamlined sleeping cars Pullman Standard, Budd Company, American Car & Foundry and Canadian Car & Foundry. Only two Railroads in North America built there own lightweight streamlined sleeping cars the Milwaukee Road who built a number of Touralux sleeping cars for operation in that roads OLYMPIAN HIAWATHA following WW II. These were 14-section sleeping cars and were considered to be Tourist Sleeping Cars. The other Railroad to build sleeping cars in North America was the Canadian Pacific who built the GROVE series of 10 Roomette 5 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars in there own Montreal shops. These GROVE series cars ended their days operating on the NdeM.
During the streamlined era of sleeping car construction the following sleeping car space was available from the car manufacturers Open Sections with upper and lower berths, Duplex Roomettes, Roomettes, Duplex Single Rooms, Double Bedrooms, Compartments, Drawing Rooms and the ultimate in Sleeping car space the Master Room.
The Master Room was only found on three Railroads the New York Central, Pennsylvania, and the Southern and then they were only found in those roads finest trains the PRR BROADWAY LIMITED, LIBERTY LIMITED, NYC TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED, COMMODORE VANDERBILT, and SOU CRESCENT. The Master Room provided the largest sleeping car space available for a couple with their own private shower and bathroom annex.
Trains with Drawing Rooms operated in every region of the United States and Canada, and on most of the railroads. This second largest space available to the sleeping car passenger was quite spacious and very popular with families of three and four traveling together. The Drawing Room also came with a separate Bathroom annex but no shower on most trains they operated in. The one exception that comes to mind is the Drawing Room of the CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR Vista Dome Sleepier Lounge Observations; they were equipped with showers in the Bathroom Annex after a 1951 refit. One of these cars 378 SILVER LOOKOUT a CB&Q car delivered in December 1952 was equipped with the annex shower when delivered new from the factory.
The Compartment was next in space and space charges with accommodations for two. The postwar Compartments were built with a separate bathroom annex while those built prior to the war provided a toilet in the Compartment itself offering no privacy.
The Bedroom provided the most popular type of sleeping car accommodation for two people with the postwar cars having Double Bedrooms providing separate bathroom annex and the prewar cars provided the toilet in the bedroom. Many railroads offered two Double Bedrooms that opened up in suite to provide space for families traveling together, this was sold at Drawing Room rates and gave passengers two full size bedrooms and two bathrooms. This was probably the reason for the decline in cars purchased new with Drawing Rooms in the final years of railroad owned streamlined sleeping cars purchases. The two Bedrooms were far easier to sell year round while Drawing Rooms were most popular during the summers when children were out of school and families traveled together. The final cars built new with Drawing Rooms were all constructed in 1956 and the number was quite small. In January 1956 Pullman Standard delivered three 2 Compartment 2 Drawing Room 5 Double Bedroom Sleeping Cars to the Seaboard Air Line 60 BOCA GRANDE, 61 FORT LAUDERDALE, and 62 CLEARWATER. These three cars were assigned one per consist to the SILVER METEOR trains between New York and Miami. In May-June 1956 the Union Pacific received three 2 Compartment 2 Drawing Room 5 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars that joined two previously built cars from 1954 that comprised the OCEAN series. The cars were named 1303 OCEAN MIST, 1304 OCEAN SCENE, and 1305 OCEAN SUNSET while the two earlier cars of this type were 1301 OCEAN SANDS and 1302 OCEAN VIEW. Union Pacific bought the cars for assignment to the CITY OF LOS ANGELES.
Most popular prewar streamlined sleeping car types were the 10-Roomette 5-Double Bedroom sleepers with original owners Pullman Pool, B&O, AT&SF, NYC and PRR. Postwar only the CNR, Erie and CPR would own cars of this configuration and the CPR cars were built by the railroad itself. Other popular prewar types of sleeping cars were the 6-Section 6 -Roomette 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping cars owned by the AT&SF, CRI&P, C&NW, ERIE, IC, MP, SP, and UP. Postwar 6-Section 6-Roomette 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping car owners were B&A, B&M, CNR, CB&Q, L&N, NC&STL, NYNH&H, and WABASH.
Those roads purchasing prewar 4-Compartment 2-Drawing Room 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping cars were AT&SF, CRI&P, ERIE, C&NW, IC, NYC, PRR, Pullman Pool, SP and UP. Only AT&SF, CRI&P, PRR and SP would purchase 4-Compartment 2-Drawing Room 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping cars in the postwar period. Other railroads that purchased cars with Drawing Rooms were ACL, CNR, CPR, FEC, GN, M-K-T, MP, RF&P, SAL, SOU, and T&P.
Most popular interior postwar type of sleeping car was the 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom sleeping cars built new for the AT&SF (40), ACL (25), A&WP (1), B&O (10), C&O (56), CB&Q (23), CMSTP&P (10), CNOT&P (4), D&RGW (9), FEC (12), IC (5), L&N (5), MP (12), NKP (13), NYC (137), N&W (23), NP (2), PRR (81), RF&P (10), SAL (19), SOU (25), SP (57), UP (50), and WP (7).
Similar in capacity were the 14-Roomette 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping Cars purchased new by B&O (8), KCS (8), MKT (7), MP (22), NYNH&H (27), SL-SF (17), SOU (11), and T&P (16).
The B&O, MP and SOU were the only roads that purchased both 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping cars and 14-Roomette 4 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars new.
All Bedroom Sleeping cars were built in three versions 11 Double Bedroom, 12 Double Bedroom, and 13 Double Bedroom. The 11 Double Bedroom was purchased new by C&O, IC, SAL, and UP. Twelve Double Bedroom Sleeping cars were built new for the CRI&P, NYC, and SP. And the 13 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars were built new for the NYC, PRR and SP. The operators of the CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR CB&Q, D&RGW, and WP received a half dozen 6 Double Bedroom 5 Compartment sleeping cars in July - August 1952 from Budd. Pleased with the acceptance by the public of these all room cars the CB&Q ordered two additional cars for 1956 delivery for the new DENVER ZEPHYRS. Union Pacific owned articulated 7 Double Bedroom 2 Compartment sleeping cars. The ACL rebuilt six 14 Roomette 2 Drawing Room sleeping cars in 1961 to 7 Double Bedroom 2 Drawing Room Sleeping cars. The ACL also purchased six NYC 4 Compartment 2 Drawing Room 4 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars in October 1962 and rebuilt them to 4 Compartment 4 Drawing Room cars before entering service in the FLORIDA SPECIAL.
Common on many roads were the 5 or 6 Double Bedroom Buffet Lounge cars. Rare were streamlined sleeping cars that featured sleeping accommodations and complete meal service. Trains that come to mind were the GN WINNIPEG LIMITED, UP BUTTE SPECIAL, NYNH&H FEDERAL, WASHINGTONIAN, MONTREALER, SP&S STREAMLINER and the SP OAKLAND LARK observations. In the case of the GN WINNIPEG LIMITED and UP BUTTE SPECIAL these cars were rebuilt from lightweight streamlined Sleeping cars for these specific train assignments. Even more rare were the 5 Double Bedroom Soda Fountain Lounge cars of the T&P and MP. The total of three of these cars were a product of Texas liquor laws, they operated in the TEXAS EAGLES between St. Louis and Fort Worth.
The Canadian National purchased new streamlined cars that featured Sections combined with complete kitchen facilities for some of their so-called remote region services.
One other postwar streamlined sleeping car type reaching 86 in new cars built the 22 Roomette sleeping car was owned by CRI&P (1), NYC (78) and SP (7).
Other Roomette Sleeping cars came in 17 Roomette versions for the AT&SF, and NYC. Eighteen Roomette streamlined sleeping cars were built for the IC, NYC, PRR, UP, and Pullman Pool; the latter two were transferred to the NKP. Twenty-one Roomette lightweight streamlined sleeping cars were ordered by ACL, FEC, PRR, and RF&P for assignment to the CHAMPIONS, several prewar PRR cars of this type ran in the BROADWAY LIMITED.
Next in size for sleeping car space was the Duplex Single Room operated by the PRR, SP and NP. The Roomette was just about the same size with the Duplex Single Room providing a bed crossways of the train while the Roomette provided a bed length ways of the train. The two SP cars of this type were originally built for prewar CITY OF SAN FRANCISCO trains. After they became SP property in 1945 they continued in two of the CITY OF SAN FRANCISCO consists until about 1952. They were than transferred to the STARLIGHT between San Francisco and Los Angeles. The NP - CB&Q - SP&S cars with Duplex single rooms were all Dome sleeping cars and operated in the NORTH COAST LIMITED. The NP transferred several of these cars to the IC in winter for operation in the CITY OF MIAMI. They were repainted IC colors for this service.
Several railroads ordered Duplex Roomettes that provided the same amenities as a basic Roomette in less space than provided by a standard Roomette, definitely not for the claustrophobic. They were easily spotted from outside a sleeping car by their staggered window arrangement. The Duplex Roomette was popular with the AT&SF, B&O, CB&Q, CNR, CPR, CRI&P, CMSTP&P, C&NW, GN, NP, Pullman Pool and SP&S. Only the AT&SF and CNR purchased 24 Duplex Roomette Sleeping cars the only accommodations in those cars. The twenty CNR cars rode on six wheel trucks and were built by Canadian Car & Foundry to plans provided by Pullman Standard. The CNR in later years assigned these cars as Crew Dormitory cars and later rebuilt several to Baggage Crew dormitory cars with the Dormitory space remaining the Duplex Roomettes. The twelve AT&SF 24 Duplex Roomette Sleeping cars rode on four-wheel trucks and like the CNR they became disillusioned with the cars by the 1960's. The Santa Fe instead of assigning the cars to non-revenue service like the CNR rebuilt the cars in March - April 1964 to 11 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars and assigned them to the SUPER CHIEF retaining their INDIAN prefix names. It is interesting to note that both the Santa Fe and Canadian National 24-Duplex Roomette Sleeping cars both carried names beginning with the letter I. The Santa Fe cars were given INDIAN prefix names while the CN cars carried names of towns and cities in Canada beginning with the letter I.
After the Duplex Roomette the lower berth and upper berth spaces known as Sections was at the bottom of the pecking order for Pullman space. The lower berth cost more than an upper but surprisingly both were very comfortable. Several railroads purchased all Section streamlined sleeping cars before WW II such as AT&SF 14 Section Sleepers for the CHIEF. The Union Pacific purchased articulated 12 section and 11 section open and enclosed Section sleepers for use in the CITY fleet. The CB&Q purchased articulated 12 Section sleeping cars for the DENVER ZEPHYRS. Only four railroads purchased all section streamlined sleeping cars following WW II these were the CB&Q, D&RGW, UP and WP. The CB&Q-D&RGW-WP cars of this type were 16-Section cars purchased for operation in the jointly owned and operated CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR. Six cars were initially purchased with each road owning two apiece. In 1952 one additional 16-Section sleeping car was delivered to the CB&Q for operation in both the CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR and AK-SAR-BEN ZEPHYR. The UP purchased fourteen 14-Section Sleeping cars that were delivered in 1954 for assignment to the CITY fleet. Both railroads had trouble filling these Section cars in the early 1960's and began looking for other uses for the cars. The 16-Section Sleeping cars of the CB&Q-D&RGW-WP were rebuilt to 48-revenue seat Leg-rest Coaches for the CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR beginning in November 1963. The UP rebuilt the 16-Section ALPINE series cars in 1965 to 44 revenue Leg-rest seat coaches. Many of the major railroads never owned a lightweight streamlined sleeping car with Section space like the PRR, NYC, N&W, NP, SL-SF, C&O, CMSTP&P, RF&P, SOU, and T&P. A quick review of Sleeping car space found in lightweight streamlined sleeping cars at the top the Master Room, followed by the Drawing Room, Compartment, Duplex Single Room, Roomette, Duplex Roomette, Lower Berth and Upper Berth.
Streamlined sleeping car oddities were prewar CRI&P 10 Section 4 Roomette sleeping cars 650 ODESSA LAKE and 651 LAWN LAKE built for the ROCKY MOUNTAIN ROCKET. A series of postwar streamlined twelve 8 Roomette 6 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars built in 1954 for the TWIN STAR ROCKET, ROCKY MOUNTAIN ROCKET, and GOLDEN STATES.
Other configurations that were only popular on certain roads were the 8 Section 2 Compartment 2 Double Bedroom sleeping cars of the AT&SF operated in the prewar CHIEF and SUPER CHIEF. The 14 Roomette 1 Drawing Room 2 Double Bedroom streamlined sleeping cars of the MP and T&P assigned to the TEXAS EAGLES.
Cars with Duplex Single Room accommodations included a pair of 12 Duplex Single Room 5 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars operated in prewar streamlined CITY trains that became SP owned following the war. The PRR purchased nineteen 12 Duplex Single Room 5 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars before WW II and received twenty-four 12 Duplex Single Room 4 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars following WW II. Northern Pacific purchased eleven Vista-Dome Sleeping cars that featured 4 Roomettes 4 Double Bedrooms and 4 Duplex Single Rooms beneath the dome. The NP, CB&Q, and SP&S owned the cars for service in the NORTH COAST LIMITED. In the winter months these cars could be found operating in the PRR SOUTH WIND and IC CITY OF MIAMI.
Up until 1947 Tourist Sleeping cars had been quite popular particularly on long distance Western trains. Many of these cars older heavyweight 14 and 16 section sleeping cars were operated in several trains and the space was sold for a space charge only above the price of a regular coach ticket. There was no need to buy an upgrade to first class, and then buy the sleeping car space supplement as well.
The only postwar trains after 1947 to operate with streamlined Tourist Sleeping cars in the U. S. were the OLYMPIAN HIAWATHA and COLUMBIAN the two Milwaukee Road trains between Chicago and Seattle-Tacoma. The Milwaukee Road initially constructed twelve 14 Section Touralux cars in the MT. series for operation in pairs in the new postwar OLYMPIAN HIAWATHA train sets with two extra as spares and six 32 revenue seat Coach 8 Section Touralux cars for the same train in the FALLS series. It was soon found this was too much tourist sleeping space so the 32 seat Coach 8 Section cars were withdrawn before their first year of operation was complete. Three of these FALL series cars were later rebuilt to MT. series 14 section Touralux cars and along with the second MT. series from the OLYMPIAN HIAWATHA they became the sole sleeping car space on the secondary COLUMBIAN train.
The only other railroads to venture into the Tourist sleeping car business after 1948 were the two Canadian roads both of whom continued operating heavyweight 14-Section Sleeping cars in their transcontinental trains uninterrupted until both considered purchasing lightweight streamlined cars. Instead CPR remodeled a series of heavyweight 14 section sleeping cars as tourist sleeping cars for operation in the CANADIAN of 1955. These cars were anything but streamlined but the CPR did dress them up with fluted stainless steel panels to match the rest of the all Budd built stainless steel car trains. The CPR carried these cars directly behind the Baggage Crew Dormitory cars ahead of the coaches for the passengers of these tourist sleeping cars.
Rival CN rebuilt and fully streamlined a series of heavyweight 14-section tourist Sleeping cars into 14 section tourist sleeping cars for operation in the SUPER CONTINENTAL between Montreal –Toronto and Vancouver, B.C.
At that time Canada was experiencing a period of rapid population growth. Large numbers of European immigrants were landing by ship and plane in Montreal and Toronto, this kept the Tourist Sleeping cars in both the CANADIAN and SUPER CONTINENTAL carrying large numbers of new immigrants to the Western Provinces for a number of years.
The big breakthrough in sleeping car space for coach travelers came in October 1956 with the introduction by Budd of the Slumbercoach in the new CB&Q DENVER ZEPHYRS. These cars provided forty Coach passengers with private rooms for the overnight trip between Chicago and Denver-Colorado Springs in each direction. Each Slumbercoach provided 24 Single Rooms for single occupancy and 8 Double Rooms for double occupancy. For single rooms the charge between Chicago and Denver was $7.50 plus coach fare and for double rooms the charge was $13.50 plus coach fare. Unfortunately these cars could have probably saved some of the nations passenger trains if they had made their debut a few years earlier, when some railroads were still interested in buying new passenger cars. For certain railroads the Slumbercoach became a very important part of their passenger operations. The Northern Pacific not only operated a Slumbercoach in the premier NORTH COAST LIMITED between Chicago and Seattle. Later they would assign Slumbercoaches to the secondary MAINSTREETER between St. Paul and Seattle; this would become the only sleeping car assigned to this train replacing the first class sleeping car and the crew Dormitory space as well.
The NYC returned ten 22 Roomette sleeping cars to Budd between August and October 1961 to be rebuilt to 16 single room 10 double room Sleepercoaches (NYC name for Slumbercoaches) for service in the TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED CLEVELAND LIMITED, NEW ENGLAND STATES and OHIO STATE LIMITED.
Many railroads operated streamlined sleeping cars but the largest owners of these cars was NYC (400) and PRR (347) in the United States whose combined lightweight streamlined sleeping car fleet totaled nearly 750 cars. The Canadian National owned a total of 413 new, used and remodeled streamlined Sleeping Cars. At the other end of the scale there was Atlanta & West Point with one, Western of Alabama with two, Bangor and Aroostook with two and Boston & Maine with four. Railroads such as the Lehigh Valley, Delaware & Hudson, Jersey Central, Reading, CGW, MeC, M&STL, CofG, and Monon owned none.
Streamlined sleeping cars served some very out of the way destinations in North America. Such destinations as Churchill, Manitoba on Hudson Bay, St. John’s, Newfoundland was served by narrow gauge semi-streamlined sleeping cars. Butte, Montana the richest city in America at one time with it’s mining activity was served by four different railroads and three of those provided sleeping car routes one the UP route a final destination on the line running north from Salt Lake City. The other two railroads that served Butte with streamlined Sleeping cars were the Northern Pacific and the Milwaukee Road with through routes. Prince Rupert, British Columbia always the little city with the big ambition to become a major West Coast port city was served by a streamlined train that carried a sleeping car, at one time this train was named SKEENA. Walla Walla, Washington the town that liked the sound of its name so much it repeated it was served briefly by a streamlined sleeping car operating over the NP between Seattle and the southeastern Washington city nightly traveling to and from Seattle from Pasco in the NORTH COAST LIMITED.
Streamlined sleeping cars served such famous resorts and National Parks as Hot Springs, Arkansas (MP), Greenbrier (C&O), Yellowstone National Park (UP & NP), Glacier National Park (GN), Sun Valley (UP), and to the rim of the Grand Canyon on the Santa Fe. In summer months the GN WESTERN STAR often departed Chicago with both PRR and NYC sleeping cars leased to tour groups en route to Glacier National Park where they were set out and served as the passengers hotel rooms while they visited the park. When the cars returned east an eastbound WESTERN STAR picked them up at Glacier for Chicago. From Portland the SP&S WESTERN STAR connection forwarded leased to tour group SP sleeping cars to Spokane where they joined the WESTERN STAR for the trip to Glacier National Park. The GN owned hotels in Glacier National Park that were outstanding for summer visitors.
North of the border Canadian Pacific served that countries western national parks Banff and Lake Louis owning hotels in both parks as well. Not only did the Canadian Pacific own Hotels and trains they also owned Steamships and there own Airline. Before WW II it was possible to board a Canadian Pacific Empress Steamship in Hong Kong and travel to Vancouver where you could board a CP train such as the DOMINION for the trip to Montreal where you could board another Empress Ship for the trip to England or France.
Canadian National served Jasper National Park in the Canadian Rockies and owned a hotel in that park as well.
Throughout the 1950’s and 1960’s the PRR brought train loads of passengers to the famous Army – Navy football game held each fall in Philadelphia with the sleeping cars serving as overnight hotel rooms for the annual event. And every May for many years Louisville, Kentucky was home to dozens of sleeping cars there for Kentucky Derby week some from as far away as California. Not all of these cars were streamlined sleeping cars but in the final years that the event brought passengers by rail most were brought by streamlined sleeping car and again it served as their hotel throughout the weeks celebrations. It should also be mentioned that many of the previously mentioned events and places brought many private railroad cars as well.
In winter months it was not unusual to see sleeping cars from many western roads operating in such winter trains between New York and Florida as the FLORIDA SPECIAL. It fact most winters it was rare to see many ACL or in later years SCL sleeping cars in the FLORIDA SPECIAL at all. With traffic between the Northeast and Florida busiest during the winter season the railroads operated all of their regular streamlined sleeping cars in such streamliners as the SILVER METEOR, SILVER STAR and CHAMPIONS. Demand for sleeping car space brought many off line sleeping cars from other roads to the routes to and from Florida. On the PRR SOUTHWIND NP Vista-Dome sleeping cars operated between Chicago and Miami in the winter months. The same was true for the IC CITY OF MIAMI but one had to be more astute as the IC repainted NP Vista Dome Sleepers each winter into the IC Chocolate, Orange and Yellow scheme returning them to the NP freshly repainted in NP colors each spring. The flexibility of the Pullman operated fleet among the railroads made sure that when necessary for peak travel demand or seasonal travel demands the cars from railroads where the demand was less were available to those railroads that needed them. Only at Christmas did the sleeping cars of most railroads remain on the rails of the owning road.
For years the CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR carried a through-streamlined 10 Roomette 6 Double Bedroom sleeping car east of Chicago via PRR one day and the NYC the next. The PRR owned CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR 10 Roomette 6 Double Bedroom Sleeping car 8449 SILVER RAPIDS, while the NYC leased one of the D&RGW cars of this type. The integrity of the stainless steel train was not to be broken with off line sleeping cars. But in the final years of this famous streamliner it was not unusual to see foreign sleeping cars such as B&O or even UP operating in the CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR.
The PRR PENN TEXAS at one time carried through sleeping cars from New York and Washington to St. Louis. These through sleeping cars were destined beyond to Houston, El Paso, and San Antonio by way of the MP TEXAS EAGLES as well as a second sleeping car to San Antonio via the MKT-SLSF TEXAS SPECIAL.
Other through streamlined sleeping cars operated in the Santa Fe CHIEF west of Chicago traveled east of Chicago to and from New York in the PRR BROADWAY LIMITED and NYC TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED. One other car in the CHIEF was a through car between Washington and San Diego traveling in the B&O CAPITOL LIMITED between Washington and Chicago, the CHIEF between Chicago and Los Angeles, and the SAN DIEGAN between Los Angeles and San Diego.
The SP/CRI&P GOLDEN STATE carried a through streamlined sleeping car from Minneapolis to Los Angeles. It traveled between Minneapolis and Kansas City in the TWIN STAR ROCKET and was transferred to the GOLDEN STATE at that point. At one time the Southern Pacific SUNSET LIMITED had been a through train between New Orleans and San Francisco by way of Los Angeles. After this was discontinued the MP and Santa Fe operated a through New Orleans - San Francisco Sleeping car via the MP to and from Houston and the AT&SF beyond traveling in the southern section of the GRAND CANYON from Clovis to Bakersfield and the GOLDEN GATE beyond.
Amtrak even operated a through 10 Roomette 6 Double Bedroom sleeping car between New York and Los Angeles that traveled by the SOU SOUTHERN CRESCENT and Amtrak former SP SUNSET beyond New Orleans to Los Angeles.
The All-Pullman trains were fewer in number during the streamline era than during the era the heavyweight sleeper reigned supreme. The all-Pullman streamlined trains were the following:

NYC

TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED

DETROITER

CLEVELAND LIMITED

ADVANCE COMMODORE VANDERBILT

COMMODORE VANDERBILT

GENESEE

PRR

BROADWAY LIMITED

PITTSBURGHER

GENERAL

SPIRIT OF ST. LOUIS

LIBERTY LIMITED

AT&SF

SUPER CHIEF

CHIEF

SP

LARK

CASCADE

OVERLAND LIMITED

B&O

CAPITOL LIMITED

C&O

GEORGE WASHINGTON

ACL

FLORIDA
SPECIAL

MIAMIAN

PULLMAN

TREASURE ISLAND SPECIAL

FORTY-NINER

ARIZONA LIMITED

IC

PANAMA LIMITED

NYNH&H

FEDERAL

B&M

BAR HARBOR EXPRESS

UP

CITY OF LOS ANGELES

Only five of the above trains the TREASURE ISLAND SPECIAL, FORTY-NINER, PANAMA LIMITED, BAR HARBOR EXPRESS and MIAMIAN carried sleepers with upper and lower Berth sections. The other trains would achieve all-Room status with several introduced as all room streamliners. One of the most famous heavyweight All-Pullman trains the SAL ORANGE BLOSSOM SPECIAL never became streamlined and operated as a heavyweight for all of its years of service.
Many Railroads purchased used lightweight streamlined sleeping cars from other railroads when those railroads ended sleeping car services or even passenger train services. The NdeM became the largest purchaser of used streamlined sleeping cars with the Canadian National next. Few U. S. roads purchased used sleeping cars from other roads. Among those that did was the Milwaukee Road who purchased five PACIFIC series 10 Roomette 6 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars from Union Pacific. Other U. S. roads that purchased used sleeping cars were AT&SF, ACL, B&O, IC, NKP, and SCL.
The streamlined sleeping cars came with either stainless steel finish, or painted to match the rest of the train. In some cases where smooth side steel sleeping cars operated in otherwise stainless steel consists they were painted with shadow line striping to simulate the fluted stainless steel panels of the trains other cars. From a distance it was difficult to spot one of these cars in an otherwise stainless steel streamliners consist.
Many railroads owned streamlined sleeper lounge observations that brought up the markers of the roads premier trains. The streamlined Observations were either Skytop (Milwaukee Road), taper ended, round ended, and blunt or square ended. Most of these cars were combined with sleeping and Buffet Lounge facilities. Several railroads had Buffet and lounge seating only in their Observations while others combined lounge seating with sleeping car space and no Buffet or bar so the revenue from this source would not have to be shared with Pullman.
The old heavyweight Pullman workhorse had been the 12-1 containing 12 sections and 1 Drawing Room. During the Streamline era the workhorse was the 10-6 with 10 Roomettes and 6 Double Bedrooms.
Many of the older heavyweight sleeping cars offered rooms besides sections such as the following:
LAKE prefix
FORT prefix
CAMP prefix
10 Sections
1 Drawing Room
2 Compartments

CHIEF prefix
ISLAND prefix
10 Sections
1 Drawing Room
1 Compartment

VILLA prefix
10 Sections
3 Double Bedrooms

STAR prefix
LITTLE prefix
PRAIRIE prefix
14 Sections

GLEN prefix
6 Compartments
3 Drawing Rooms

CLOVER prefix
8 Sections
5 Double Bedrooms

WILLOW prefix
7 Drawing Rooms

POINT prefix
10 Sections
2 Drawing Rooms

FIR prefix
6 Sections
4 Roomettes
4 Double Bedrooms

Pullman streamlined or semi streamlined over 130 heavyweight sleeping cars prior to WW II for the following railroads:

Streamlined

Baltimore & Ohio

CAPITOL LIMITED

NATIONAL LIMITED

Gulf Mobile & Ohio

GULF COAST REBEL

Pennsylvania

GENERAL

LIBERTY LIMITED

PITTSBURGHER

SPIRIT OF ST. LOUIS

Pullman

FORTY NINER

Semi-Streamlined

Chicago Burlington & Quincy - Chicago Rock Island & Pacific

ZEPHYR - ROCKET

Colorado & Southern
Fort Worth & Denver

TEXAS ZEPHYR

Kansas City Southern

SOUTHERN BELLE

Missouri Pacific

COLORADO EAGLE

Southern

TENNESSEAN

Lightweight streamlined sleeping cars for the most part were named but roads such as SP preferred numbers and other than SP sleeping cars operating for a time in the GOLDEN STATE, SAN FRANCISCO OVERLAND and CITY OF SAN FRANCISCO they were numbered. The cars assigned to the previously mentioned trains were numbered by the mid-1950s losing their names at that time. The NP streamlined sleeping cars delivered in 1948 were initially named only. All were numbered in 1954-55 and future deliveries of NP cars were delivered with numbers only. I can still recall the young man catching the NORTH COAST LIMITED insisting the Dome sleeper he was boarding was named VISTA-DOME NORTH COAST LIMITED.
Many Railroads supplemented their car names with numbers for the accounting departments. But many of these numbers were never actually painted on the cars themselves. In those cases the accounting department used a cross-reference guide to match car names to numbers.
After the breakup by the Government of Pullman and Pullman Standard the operating arm Pullman sold many heavyweight sleeping cars to the railroads. Pullman named most of the prewar lightweight streamlined sleeping cars, while the postwar sleeping cars were named by the railroads that purchased them. The following are examples of the most popular named sleeping cars.

ALPINE prefix
14 Section

UP

AMERICAN prefix
6 Section 6 Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

UP
C&NW
SP
ERIE

BAY suffix
22 Roomette

NYC

BEACH suffix
6 Section
6Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

NYNH&H

BLUE prefix
10 Roomette
3 Double Bedroom
2 Compartment

AT&SF

12 Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

WABASH

BROOK suffix
12 Duplex Single Room
5 Double Bedroom

PRR

CAPE prefix
2 Compartment
2 Double Bedroom
Buffet Lounge

CNR

CASCADE prefix
10 Roomette
5 Double Bedroom
AT&SF
B&O
CRI&P
NYC
PRR
PULLMAN POOL

CHATEAU prefix
8 Duplex Roomette
1 Drawing Room
3 Double Bedroom
4 Section

CPR

CITY prefix
17 Roomette
1 Section

NYC

18 Roomette

NYC
NKP
PRR

5 Double Bedroom
Café Lounge

NKP

10 Roomette
6 Double Bedroom

C&O
NKP

CLUB suffix
1 Compartment
4 Double Bedroom
Buffet Lounge
Observation

CB&Q
NP

5 Double Bedroom
Buffet Lounge
Observation

C&O

COLONIAL prefix
1 Drawing Room
3 Double Bedroom
Bar Lounge

PRR

COUNTY suffix
10 Roomette 6 Double Bedroom

ACL
PRR
RF&P

13 Double Bedroom

NYC
PRR

CREEK suffix
12 Duplex Single Bedroom
4 Double Bedroom

PRR

8 Double Bedroom
Skytop Lounge
Observation
CMSTP&P

CRESCENT prefix
1 Master Room
2 Drawing Room
Buffet Lounge

SOU

EAGLE prefix

All MP and T&P Sleeping cars
PRR sleeping cars assigned as through cars in MP and T&P trains

FALLS suffix
6 Double Bedroom
Buffet Lounge

NYC
PRR

14 Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

CNR

GLACIER suffix
16 Duplex Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

CB&Q
GN
SP&S

GOLDEN prefix
Most often associated with SP and CRI&P cars operating in GOLDEN STATE

GREEN prefix
6 Section
4 Double Bedroom
6 Roomette

CNR

GROVE suffix
10 Roomette
5 Double Bedroom

CPR

HARBOR suffix
22 Roomette

NYC

IMPERIAL prefix
4 Double Bedroom
4 Compartment
2 Drawing Room

C&NW
NYC
PRR
SP
UP
Pullman Pool

INDIAN prefix
24 Duplex Roomette
Later
11 Double Bedroom

AT&SF

INN suffix
21 Roomette
PRR

ISLAND suffix
1 Double Bedroom
1 Master Room
Buffet Lounge
Observation

NYC

LAKE prefix
10 Roomette
6 Double Bedroom

CMSTP&P

LAKE suffix
6 Double Bedroom
Buffet Lounge

NYC

LOCH prefix
24 Single Room
8 Double Room

NP
CB&Q

MANOR suffix
4 Roomette
5 Double Bedroom
1 Compartment
4 Sections

CPR

MT. prefix
14 Section

CMSTP&P

NARROWS suffix
2 Drawing Room
1 Double Bedroom
1 Compartment
Buffet Lounge
Observation

PRR

NATIONAL prefix
6 Section
6 Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

UP
WABASH

NORTHERN prefix
16 Duplex Roomette
1 Compartment
2 Double Bedroom

C&NW

OCEAN prefix
2 Compartment
2 Drawing Room
5 Double Bedroom

UP

PACIFIC prefix
10 Roomette
6 Double Bedroom

UP
CMSTP&P

PALM prefix
10 Roomette
6 Double Bedroom

AT&SF

PARK suffix
3 Double Bedroom
1 Drawing Room
Dome
Lounge Bar
Lounge Observation

CPR

PASS suffix
4 Section
8 Duplex Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

CB&Q
GN
SP&S

6 Roomette
5 Double Bedroom
2 Compartment

CB&Q
GN
SP&S

PINE prefix
10 Roomette
6 Double Bedroom

AT&SF

PINE suffix
6 Section
6 Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

C&EI
L&N
NC&STL

PLACID prefix
11 Double Bedroom

UP

POINT suffix
14 Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

NYNH&H

PORT prefix
12 Double Bedroom

NYC

RAPIDS suffix
10 Roomette
6 Double Bedroom

PRR

REGAL prefix
4 Double Bedroom
4 Compartment
2 Drawing Room
AT&SF

RIVER suffix
10 Roomette
6 Double Bedroom

A&WP
CNR
FEC
L&N
NYC
PRR
SOU
WofA

14 Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

SL-SF

4 Section
1 Compartment
7 Duplex Roomette
3 Double Bedroom

CB&Q
GN
SP&S

RIVIERE prefix
10 Roomette
6 Double Bedroom

CNR

ROYAL prefix
5 Double Bedroom
Buffet Lounge
Observation

L&N
NYC
SOU
WofA

SILVER prefix

All CB&Q, WP Sleepers and those D&RGW sleepers assigned to California Zephyr

SOUTH prefix
18 Roomette

CNR

STAR prefix
11 Double Bedroom

UP

STREAM suffix
6 Double Bedroom
Buffet Lounge

NYC

SUN prefix
11 Double Bedroom

UP

VAL prefix
22 Roomette

CNR

VALLEY suffix
6 Section
6 Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

AT&SF

10 Roomette
6 Double Bedroom

NYC

14 Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

SOU

VISTA prefix
1 Double Bedroom
4 Drawing Room
Lounge Observation

AT&SF

Both Canadian National and Illinois Central identified some of their sleeping cars by the first letter the car name began with.
B series
11 Double Bedroom

IC

C series
10 Roomette
6 Double Bedroom

IC

D series
10 Roomette
5 Double Bedroom

IC

E series
8 Duplex Roomette
4 Section
4 Double Bedroom

CNR

F series
22 Roomette

IC

G series
4 Compartment
2 Drawing Room
4 Double Bedroom

IC

I series
24 Duplex Roomette

CNR

NdeM and FCP purchased most of their lightweight streamlined sleeping cars used from U. S. and Canadian roads. They were renamed with the following prefixes, these prefixes did not necessarily identify specific interior configurations as the U.S. and Canadian roads did. The following prefixes were some of those assigned to NdeM and FCP sleeping cars.

CLUB prefix
6 Double Bedroom
Buffet Lounge

NdeM

4 Double Bedroom
Buffet Lounge
Observation

NdeM

DR. prefix
18 Roomette

NdeM

GOLFO DE prefix
4 Double Bedroom
4 Compartment
2 Drawing Room

NdeM

LAGO prefix
16 Duplex Roomette
1 Compartment
3 Double Bedroom

NdeM

10 Roomette
6 Double Bedroom

FCP

6 Double Bedroom
5 Compartment

FCP

MAR
MAR DEL prefix
10 Roomette
5 Double Bedroom

NdeM

MONTE prefix
6 Section
6 Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

NdeM

8 Section
3 Compartment

NdeM

PRESA prefix
22 Roomette

NdeM

3 Double Bedroom
1 Drawing Room
Bar Lounge

FCP

2 Drawing Room
1 Compartment
1 Double Bedroom
Buffet Lounge
Observation

FCP

2 Master Rooms
1 Double Bedroom
Buffet Lounge
Observation

FCP

RIO prefix
14 Roomette
4 Double Bedroom

FCP

10 Roomette
6 Double Bedroom

FCP

SIERRA -SIERRA DE prefix
13 Double Bedroom

NdeM

The NdeM also assigned the names of countries of the world to a large number of former NYC 10 Roomette 6 Double Bedrooms sleeping cars purchased for Mexican service. Next to the NdeM the Canadian National was the largest purchaser of used lightweight streamlined Sleeping cars. The Canadian National purchased large numbers of used cars from U.S. roads in the late 1960's for services throughout the country. During EXPO 67 in Montreal the Canadian National leased Sleeping cars from a number of U.S. roads.
The majority of streamlined sleeping cars were purchased by the railroads with specific train assignments in mind. Several sleeping car lines were never streamlined while in other cases streamlined sleeping cars were the only lightweight cars in an otherwise heavyweight train.

TTFN AL

[passengerfan]

Good Morning Tom and the rest of the gang. Time for a coffee and a crumpet from the Mentor Bakery.

PASSENGERFAN AL'S ATREAMLINER CORNER #48

NORTH COAST LIMITED CB&Q – NP – SP&S Trains 25-26 September 9, 1948 Chicago – Seattle/Portland daily 2,318 miles each direction 52 hours each way Although this is the date generally listed for streamlined NORTH COAST LIMITED operation the trains in actual fact heavyweight head end cars and heavyweight sleeping cars were still operated in the trains until 1952.

The NORTH COAST LIMITED oldest named train to the Pacific Northwest dating from April 29, 1900 was owned by the Northern Pacific Railway and was the last of the northwest’s premier trains to be fully streamlined. The September 9, 1948 date is generally accepted as the date the final car of the orders to equip the lightweight streamlined NORTH COAST LIMITED was delivered from Pullman Standard and placed in a consist departing Chicago by the CB&Q. Actually the NORTH COAST LIMITED kind of evolved into a lightweight streamlined train over a period of about 1-1/2 years. Six sets of equipment were required for daily operation of the NORTH COAST LIMITED between Chicago and Seattle and Portland. The NORTH COAST LIMITED when it began service as a lightweight streamlined train was the slowest of the premiere trains between Chicago and the Pacific Northwest. The CB&Q owned one set of equipment of the NORTH COAST LIMITED, as they were the operator between St. Paul and Chicago. For power the CB&Q supplied their own E-Units over their trackage. Between St. Paul and Seattle the NP purchased EMD A-B-B sets of F3 diesels to power the NORTH COAST LIMITED. The NP would soon switch to A-B-A sets of power, as they did not require turning at terminals. Each consist of the NORTH COAST LIMITED carried a through Chicago – Portland Coach and Sleeping car forwarded to and from Portland by the SP&S from Pasco, Washington. The following is the initial six eleven car consists of the NORTH COAST LIMITED between Chicago and Seattle – Portland. The last train set is shown without power as one set was being serviced in Chicago.

6500A EMD F3A 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

6500B EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

6500C EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

400 3,000-Gallon Water Baggage Car

425 30” Railway Post Office 21-Crew Dormitory Car

500 56- Revenue Seat Day Coach

588 56- Revenue Seat Leg Rest Coach

589 56- Revenue Seat Leg Rest Coach (Chicago – Portland)

494 26- Revenue Seat Coach Buffet 20- Seat lounge Car

450 12- Seat Lunch Counter 30- Seat Dining Car

ABERDEEN 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

BILLINGS 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

BISMARCK 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car (Chicago – Portland)

RAINIER CLUB 4- Double Bedroom 1- Compartment Buffet 26- Seat Lounge Observation

SECOND CONSIST

6501A EMD F3A 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

6501B EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

6501C EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

401 3,000-Gallon Water Baggage Car

426 30’ Railway Post Office 21 Crew Dormitory Car

501 56- Revenue Seat Day Coach

590 56- Revenue Seat Leg Rest Coach

591 56- Revenue Seat Leg Rest Coach (Chicago – Portland)

495 26- Revenue Seat Coach Buffet 20- Seat Lounge Car

451 12- Seat Lunch Counter 30- Seat Dining Car

BRAINERD 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

BUTTE 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

DETROIT LAKES 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car (Chicago – Portland)

SPOKANE CLUB 4- Double Bedroom 1- Compartment Buffet 26- Seat Lounge Observation

THIRD CONSIST

6502A EMD F3A 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

6502B EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

6502C EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

402 3,000-Gallon Water Baggage Car

427 30’ Railway Post Office 21- Crew Dormitory Car

502 56- Revenue Seat Day Coach

592 56- Revenue Seat Leg Rest Coach

593 56- Revenue Seat Leg Rest Coach (Chicago – Portland)

496 26- Revenue Seat Coach Buffet 20- Seat Lounge Car

452 12- Seat Lunch Counter 30- Seat Dining Car

DICKINSON 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

FARGO 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

HELENA 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car (Chicago – Portland)

ARLINGTON CLUB 4- Double Bedroom 1- Compartment Buffet 26- Seat Lounge Observation

FOURTH CONSIST

6503A EMD F3A 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

6503B EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

6503C EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

403 3,000-Gallon Water Baggage Car

428 30’ Railway Post Office 21- Crew Dormitory Car

503 56- Revenue Seat Day Coach

594 56- Revenue Seat Leg Rest Coach

595 56- Revenue Seat Leg Rest Coach (Chicago – Portland)

497 26- Revenue seat Coach Buffet 20- Seat Lounge Car

453 12- Seat Lunch Counter 30- Seat Dining Car

JAMESTOWN 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

MISSOULA 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

PASCO 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car (Chicago – Portland)

MONTANA CLUB 4- Double Bedroom 1- Compartment Buffet 26- Seat Lounge Observation

FIFTH CONSIST

6504A EMD F3A 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

6504B EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

6504C EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

404 3,000-Gallon Water Baggage Car

429 30’ Railway Post Office 21- Crew Dormitory Car

504 56- Revenue Seat Day Coach

596 56 Revenue seat Leg Rest Coach

300 (SP&S) 56- Revenue Seat Leg Rest Coach (Chicago – Portland)

498 26- Revenue Seat Coach Buffet 20- Seat Lounge car

454 12- Seat Lunch Counter 30- Seat Dining Car

VALLEY CITY 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

WALLA WALLA 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

PORTLAND (SP&S) 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

TACOMA CLUB 4- Double Bedroom 1- Compartment Buffet 26- Seat Lounge Observation

SIXTH CONSIST

405 3,000-Gallon Water Baggage Car

430 30’ Railway Post Office 21 Crew Dormitory Car

505 56- Revenue Seat Day Coach

598 (CB&Q) 56- Revenue Seat Leg Rest Coach

599 (CB&Q) 56- Revenue Seat Leg Rest Coach (Chicago – Portland)

499 26- Revenue Seat Coach Buffet 20- Seat Lounge Car

455 (CB&Q) 12- Seat Lunch Counter 30- Seat Dining Car

CHICAGO (CB&Q) 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

DUBUQUE (CB&Q) 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

SAVANNA (CB&Q) 6- Roomette 8- Duplex Roomette 1- Compartment 3- Double Bedroom Sleeping Car (Chicago – Portland)

MINNEAPOLIS CLUB (CB&Q) 4- Double Bedroom 1- Compartment Buffet 26- Seat Lounge Car

In 1954 The NORTH COAST LIMITED became the VISTA-DOME NORTH COAST LIMITED and became one of the premier trains of North America. Each of the five consists received two Vista Dome 46-leg-rest seat coaches replacing two of the 56 seat flat top coaches. The other two Vista-Domes were Sleeping cars and were assigned two per consist replacing flat top sleeping cars. The NP operated the Vista Domes with a flat top car between so passengers had an unobstructed view. The NP VISTA-DOME NORTH COAST LIMITED was a faster train matching the timekeeping of the EMPIRE BUILDER by that time and had introduced the Raymond Loewy two-tone green paint scheme with white separation stripe.
In 1958 the VISTA-DOME NORTH COAST LIMITED received new 48-seat Dining cars from Budd the last new Dining cars ever built before Amtrak.
In 1959 the VISTA-DOME NORTH COAST LIMITED added a single unpainted stainless steel car a Slumbercoach to each consist. The reason this car was unpainted was due to the fact they operated in a pool with the VISTA-DOME DENVER ZEPHYR Slumbercoaches and that train was all stainless steel. The NCL lasted until Amtrak and many feel that this route should have been retained rather than the more northerly GN EMPIRE BUILDER route. The reason for the more northerly route was simply that no Interstate paralleled that route like the one that followed the NP across Montana.

TTFN AL

[siberianmo]

WEDNESDAY’s INFO & SUMMARY of POSTS

We open at 6 AM, all time zones. (Don’t ask how we do that!)[swg]

G’day! Here we are again – Wednesday, time to fill up the coffee mugs, check out the menu board for our <traditional> and <light> breakfasts and sample The Mentor Village Bakery pastry case![swg]


Daily Wisdom

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Info for the Day:

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Today Pike Perspective’s Day!
Thursday Fish ‘n Chips Nite!
Friday Pizza Nite! & Steak ‘n Fries Nite!
Saturday Steak ‘n Trimmin’s Nite!

RR Book Relay – First mailing was Monday![tup]


SUMMARY

Name …..…………… Date/Time …..…..………. (Page#) .. Remarks

(1) siberianmo Tom Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 05:33:05 (228) Tuesday’s Info & Summary

(2) passengerfan Al Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 07:01:59 (228) Streamlined Coaches

(3) siberianmo Tom Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 11:05:47 (228) NOSTALGIA #63 Ad, Budd Co. (1949)

(4) LoveDomes Lars Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 11:51:19 (229) Domes, etc.

(5) BudKarr BK Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 12:33:39 (229) from Helsinki!

(6) siberianmo Tom Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 13:59:55 (229) Acknowledgments, etc.

(7) Trainnut484 Russell Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 16:59:12 (229) Inclusive Post & Pix

(8) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 19:12:07 (229) Inclusive Post, etc.

(9) siberianmo Tom Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 19:54:30 (229) Acknowledgments, etc.

(10) Trainnut484 Russell Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 20:24:48 (229) etc.


NOW SHOWING at The Mentor Village Emporium Theatre:

. . . January 23rd thru 28th: Denver and Rio Grande (1952) starring Edmond O’Brien, Sterling Hayden & Dean Jagger


That’s it! [tup][;)]

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]
Proprietor of “Our” Place, an adult eating & drinking establishment!

[Trainnut484]

Evening Tom and all who haunt this place tonight. Leon, that wet suit rig-a-ma-roe looks good on ya. I'll have a Coca-Cola to go, because I'm just dropping this note for Tom.

Tom, thanks for the Bathams. I kinda got the sense from Bk's post upstream that he was in Finland for something other than for pleasure, but that doesn't mean one can't have fun. I don't know who Ted's replacement is either, and I was speaking in future tense that his protege' will fit the bill [;)]. Hopefully someone will answer the call.

Take care,

Russell

[siberianmo]

Good Evenin’!

<yawn> Heard someone come through the door, and it woke me up![swg]

To the acknowledgments:

Trainnut484 Russell
Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 16:59:12

Nice to have you stop by during the week, especially since it appears that our Regulars for the most part have flow the coop! Have a Bathams on me.

You confused me regarding your comment to BK. Suggest you review his Post on page 221, it’s not a pleasure trip. Also, did you find something that I missed regarding Ted’s “protégé”[?] No one has stepped up to assume the Manager’s position that I’m aware of – yet. [%-)][%-)]

If you build a ‘puter system for Rob I’ll ship to him![tup] Sure miss having perhaps the most consistent and supportive Regular missing for so long.

Interesting contrasts in pix, eh[?] Somewhere in my photo archives is a pix of me at the AT&SF station at the Grand Canyon’s south rim in 1953 AND a 1988 pix of me in the same place. Those are great for “keepers.”[tup]

Speaking of pix, I’m pleased with the way those coasters that Pete gave me turned out so well. If you “click” on the image the details are really vivid. This technology is fantastic.[yeah]

nickinwestwales Nick
Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 19:12:07

Once again, “it worked!” I used the “refresh/repost” feature BEFORE Posting this blurb, and there you were! So, I’ll add you to my acknowledgments ….

Those four drinks, right over there, are yours – all in different styles of beer glasses as you can see. Nice touch, eh[?][swg]

Do you have a pix of the train station at Haverfordwest[?] If so, please send it to me by Email.

Thanx for that URL on the Atlas track planning. I tried that a couple of months ago and had a devil of a time with it. I’ve saved it on a disc, so I’ll get to it again. It’s something I’ve wanted to do, then kind of lost interest. NowutImean[?] Appreciate your keeping me in mind – means a lot.[tup]

Did you catch the “word” on Rob[?] He’s offline for perhaps up to two weeks. Not good. Looks like the IC has pretty much dissolved.[tdn]

On a positive note, it’s almost time ‘round here to shut this thing down and catch a flick on the tube with my bride![yeah]


Leon the Night Man has the bar! This man of sartorial splendor is attired in what looks like a wet suit with a mesh overlay. He tells me it is the “latest” in fashion here in Mentor Village.[wow]

Catch y’all in the ‘morrow!


Tom[4:-)] [oX)]


Stick around a few minutes AFTER POSTING - The information you MISS may be for YOU!

Those who acknowledge the other guy, get acknowledged!

[nickinwestwales]

Evening [4:-)]TOM and gentlemen all-given the number of `rounds for the house` bought recently,I`m sure I must have a drink or two to take care of so thanks gents-dont mind if I do ! [swg]-TOM-my remarks R.E. the Can-Am were very much tongue in cheek-in point of fact my South Ontario Bridge Lines ( The S.O.B Route [:-^] ) is suffering similar traffic density problems to the Can-Am and increased staging will be a high priority once the weather improves-while on the model theme,I may have found a track planning prog. that could be of use-go to www.atlasrr-com and then click on rts download-it took about a half hour to load,is FREE (always a good selling point for me) and includes `footprints` for Walthers, Atlas & Life Like buildings as well as track elements for tru-track (precious little use and frankly weird geometry) code 100 & code 83 ranges as well as their `0` & `N` equivalents-nothing for `S` unfortunately,but the grid sizes are adjustable so once you work out the ratio`s it should be useable.
Not the easiest software I`ve ever used,but I`m making progress and if I can do it any fool can..!!
Right,whose been in this fine day-RUSS-good to see you`ve fulfilled your early potential [swg].....
BK-greetings from a nearby timezone,glad you are enjoying the lifestyle this side of the pond-hope you are putting the drinks on expenses or you may find yourself hitching home......
LARS-The description of your appetite pleased the latent poet within me deeply but be warned-on my days off Boris has the run of the galley-be VERY carefull what you ask for,he is somewhat literal in his interpretations......
Al- Another worthy contribution-I am starting to think that some form of `imagineered` streamliner ( with domes,naturally ) might be in order for my model pike,if only to put some of this info to good use ( note to self-add another staging track to planned extension )
O.K. fellas,I`m beat-another day of digging holes in the garden (they`ll never find the bodies now haha.....) plus a full on band practice (since our erstwhile frontmans desertion I have become the de-facto lead singer,at least until we can press-gang some unsuspecting sucker into signing on the dotted line [}:)] ) have left me rather feeling my years,see you all tomorrow for pikes perspectives and whatever strangeness the day may bring-sleep well,it`s the moonlight mile for me,nick [C=:-)]

[Trainnut484]

Good afternoon Tom and gang. I'll have a Miller Lite for now. Nice day here in KC with plenty of sunshine and temps in the mid 50's. I guess Spring wants to get a three month head start.

pwolfe Pete, great to hear from you, and those labels you brought back sure do sound good. I think I'll try a Batham's later after finishing my Miller Lite. Can't wait to see other great stuff you brought back with you.

BK, sounds like you're having a good time in Finland. Hope your trip back to the states is safe.

Ted, sorry that you had to step down as Manager. I know your protege' will do just as great as you did. Don't let your new duties keep you forever away from "Our" Place.

Rob, it's a bad thing your computer went South. Mine is not that far behind as sometimes it crashes in the middle of something. I'll build another system here soon. I'd rather build my own system than buy one from Wal-mart or any discount store.

While blowing off the dust (cough cough) and going thru an old box of memories, I came across a pic of me when I was a wee little train tyke standing next to a miniature train in a park that I loved to ride when visiting my Grandmother.

Me when I was 4 years old standing next to miniature train in Independence, KS


Now, fast foward 30 years. Bigger me, same train, same place.
Still rides good.

Sorry if the pics don't enlarge.

Take care,

Russell

[siberianmo]

G'day Gents!

Just heard from trolleyboy Rob up in Ontario. Seems his 'puter has bitten the dust and he's anticipating being offline for perhaps as long as two weeks. Could be back sooner, but he's not rushing off to purchase a replacement. So, c'mon those of you who like that term REGULAR it's time to belly up to the bar and provide the continuity of Posts needed 'round here![tup][tup]

A few acknowledgments are in order - and I stress "few"!

passengerfan Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 07:01:59

Good Gawd Gertie, are you trying to set a record 'round here[?] That's quite a compilation of Streamlined Coaches, one that when put together with everything else you've provided, is surely a book unto itself. Nice job![tup][tup]

LoveDomes Lars Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 11:51:19

Nicely done on those Domes - always good to get some "grounding" when it comes to the topic we're all interested in. The folks at Wilkpedia do a great job don't they[?]
Nice Pix too![tup] Never get tired looking at those dome cars.[yeah]

Appreciate your stopping by, I need someone to keep me awake![swg] Thanx for the round![tup]

BudKarr BK Posted: 24 Jan 2006, 12:33:39

Helsinki by Gawsh! That's a fer piece from home, wouldn't you agree[?] Hope your return does in fact occur sooner rather than later. It's never easy being away for the last round of trips, knowing that your heart and mind is elsewhere. Been there, done that - but of course, not at all as extensively as what you are into.

No doubt we'd love to see the pix of those trains you mentioned. There's an abundance of sites out there where one can find pretty much anything and everything rolling on tracks. Only problem is the copyright restrictions. I've sent so many emails requesting permission to use this or that, and it seems to be a rarity to get a response. But nothing ventured, nothing gained, so I ask again.[swg]

Can't say that the people in our family on the Canadian side are disappointed about the outcome of the elections. However, as we say down here too, it probably will not really change a thing, at least not in the foreseeable future. Unless and until there's a majority and a significant one at that, it more than likely boils down to business as usual.
I'm all for anything and anyone unafraid to tell these wrist wringing, nay saying - oh never mind! [#offtopic] Boris Ring the bell - drinks on me!

While I'm hardly a student of Finland, I do know of the struggles that country has had over the centuries with their Russian neighbors and others. They seem to be a resiliant bunch and have carved out quite a respectable society from the bits 'n pieces I've assembled. Would like to visit one day.

Thanx for the round and the Euro note. We'll have it deposited over at The Second National Bank of Mentor Village with the day's receipts. I'm sure Vito's international currency teller, Franklin Mint, will love it![swg]

Later!

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[BudKarr]

Hello Captain Tom!

Greetings to all from Finland, Helsinki to be precise. I think before my comments begin, it is time for me to say that I have missed “Our” Place and the friends made over these months. I have not had the time to engage in browsing the pages, but it does seem that many have been added since my last contact with you.

The power here is similar to that of Germany at 230v, 50hz. Fortunately, the hotel has all of the converters necessary for me to make this connection. I doubt that my skills would have enabled me to do so without some help from a young engineering student who has found employment here between studies. Oh yes, the time is 1900 hours – 7 hours “off” from where you are Captain Tom.

I would like one of your steak dinners, but recall that they are not served until Friday and Saturday evenings. So, perhaps I will stick with some liquid refreshment, an Alexander Keiths will do.

I did read several pages previous to the one I am on and it appears that there are some changes taking place at the bar. Certainly hope none of these events will alter the flow or fine exchanges of information taking place at my favorite place to roost, outside of Alberta that is! Speaking of Canada (and I know politics are not appreciated here) – but I must make mention of the newly elected Prime Minister Stephen Harper – my intended is ecstatic. She is a loyal proponent and supporter and in fact we dined with him and his wife before the holidays. (I may have told you that, or some of it – do not fully recall.)

Finland is a marvelous place and most interesting politically as well. I am sure with a bit of web surfing, one can find all kinds of interesting factoids about the country. In just one group gathering, I met with people conversing in Finnish (primary language), Swedish (secondary for many), Russian and of course English. Unbelievable how fluent these folks are and how easy it is to switch from one to another.

Railroads? Nothing in my schedule thus far to permit it. I have had the occasion to walk to a few train stations in the cities I have been in, but that is all. Saw some extremely interesting modern trains, all seemingly moving much fast than what we are accustomed to in North America. Perhaps I will be able to retrieve some photos from the internet once I get settled back in Alberta. For now though, I am without camera (normal practice for me) and playing it strictly business (also normal for me).

It looks as if I may be able to depart Europe for the states before too long. Then wrap up at the home office before heading up to Canada. I will surely keep an eye on this place and hope to connect with all of you sooner rather than later.

Time for another one of my evening sessions, so I must break away. Captain Tom, buy the Gentlemen a round on me. Oh, what is that? That’s a €20 Euro banknote! Drinks on me.


BK

[LoveDomes]

Good Day Tom and Gentlemen at the bar,

I’m hungry enough to eat the south end of a northbound skunk running through a black turnip and sleaze bean patch!

So, how about one of those Italian hero sandwiches (hold the onions) and a pint of Bathams!

Not very much to comment on this day, aside from passengerfan Al’s latest “everything one needs to know and more” Post.[wow] Fantastic effort and overwhelming content.[tup]

Where is everyone this fine day[?] Haven’t seen trolleyboy Rob for several days; wanswheel Mike is outta sight and perhaps, uptight [swg]; along with many of the guys who normally check in during the morning hours. Is there something going on that I’m unware of[?] A party, a shindig, something going on that I’m missing[?]

Okay, enough of that; here’s a bit of basic info on my favorite rail cars, the domes: From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.



A dome car owned by the Santa Fe Railroad in the 1950s.from: www.trainweb.org

A dome car is a type of railroad passenger car that can include features of a lounge car, dining car and an observation. Its primary feature is a glass dome on the top of the car where passengers can ride and see in all directions around the train.

Configuration
A portion of the car, usually in the center of the car, is split between two levels, with stairs leading both up and down from the train's regular passenger car floor level. The lower level of the dome usually consisted of a small lounge area, while the upper portion was usually coach or lounge seating within a "bubble" of glass on the car's roof. Passengers in the upper portion of the dome were able to see in all directions from a vantage point above the train's roofline.
On some dome cars, the lower portion was built as a galley, where car attendants used dumbwaiters to transfer items between the galley and a dining area in the dome portion of the car.

History
The popular story is that the first dome cars in North America were conceived by Western Pacific's President Harry Mitchell. Mr. Mitchell was riding in the cab of one of his railroad's diesel locomotives through the Rockies when he thought that every passenger should be able to see the scenery that is passing by on his railroad's passenger trains. His idea was to provide a full 360-degree view from above the train in newly built "vista-dome" cars. The idea really wasn't too radical as railroad cabooses were often built with a cupola above the car's roofline so the train crew could get a better view of the train, and the Canadian Pacific Railway had used 'tourist cars' with raised, glass-sided viewing cupolas on their trains through the Canadian Rocky Mountains in the 1920s. Modern Vista-dome cars were introduced on the California Zephyr inauguration in 1949.



Auto-Train Dome Car 510 began life on the Sante Fe Railroad. from: www.TrainWeb.com

As dome cars became more common on North American passenger trains, some western railroads purchased or built "superdomes". These were dome cars where the upper level of the car extended for nearly the entire length of the car. Starting in the 1980s, the use of the dome car has become rarer as Amtrak has introduced new bi-level passenger cars that reach the maximum possible height over the length of the car. Dome cars are very popular on tourist railways and private charter rail services.
***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ****** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** *****

Until the next time!

Lars

[siberianmo]

G’day All!

PASSENGER TRAIN NOSTALGIA #63

Here’s something to enjoy regarding the Budd Company from a 1949 advertisement in my personal collection.


Cars For Proud Trains

Without exception, the stainless steel railway passenger cars built by The Budd Company go into their owners’ finest trains. On the Pennsylvania, for example, you may ride in them on the Broadway Limited, The General, The Red Arrow, the “Spirit of St. Louis” and others of its blue ribbon fleet.

Where quality is a consideration, either in appeal to the public or in dependable, economical operation, the things Budd makes have achieved a unique and strengthening position.

In 1934 Budd built its first] train, the Pioneer Zephyr, first lightweight streamliner of all. It revolutionized railway car construction. Budd is now the world’s second largest builder of railway passenger cars.

In 1912 Budd invented the steel automobile body. Today Budd is the world’s largest independent builder of automobile body components.

In 1919 Budd introduced the steel disc automobile wheel. During the past twenty-seven years, in addition to producing millions of automobile wheels, Budd has placed more wheels on trucks, buses and highway trailers than all other makes in the world combined.

The great complex of Budd industrial facilities, producing a quarter of a billion dollars worth of goods annually, has sprung from one basic philosophy- build better products through the use of superior materials and challenging design.

The Budd Company, Phila., Detroit.

Budd


Enjoy! [tup]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[passengerfan]

Good Morning Tom and the rest of the gang. Time for a quick Cup of Coffee and a Crumpet from the Mentor Bakery. Then its off to the VA for my every 6 month check up.

STREAMLINED COACHES OF THE UNITED STATES AND CANADA
By Al

INTRODUCTION

The lightweight streamlined Coach brought a degree of dignity and comfort to this means of travel so long neglected in the heavyweight era and earlier. Their were a few railroads that made changes to heavyweight era coaches that made this means of travel more comfortable but those railroads were few and far between. Generally speaking throughout the heavyweight era of rail travel the coach passenger was forced to travel in a crowded car with small washrooms, cold drinking water was rare and for those coaches with cold drinking water machines the paper cup from a dispenser alongside was a cent or two. In those days a Hershey Chocolate bar sold for a cent as well. Even scarcer was finding a coach during the heavyweight era with air conditioning, and after finding one did the air conditioning actually work. The
Railroads paid much greater attention to their first class trade with ice water machines with free paper cups, linen headrests, crisp fre***owels, individual bars of soap, large dressing rooms attached to large rest rooms, and by 1936 many of the first class cars were air conditioned. Those passengers who could afford to travel in either Parlor or sleeping car were treated quite well, far better than today’s airline traveler is. Anyone traveling in a coach for more than two hours on a hot summer day during the heavyweight era would certainly arrive in a bedraggled state to say the least without air conditioning or any of the other niceties. While a passenger traveling on the same train in an air conditioned Parlor car would arrive as fresh as the proverbial daisy.
Most heavyweight era cars traveled on six wheel trucks although several railroads owned coaches that ran on four-wheel trucks. Many of these were holdovers from the wooden car era and if one looked closely beneath the steel sheathing, evidence of the cars wooden origins was usually evident.
Seats in most heavyweight era coaches were generally speaking of the flip over back type making it simple to ready the car for the return journey by simply flipping the seat backs opposite to the position they arrived in. Another popular type of seating during this period were the paired seats on a central pedestal that turned completely, these offered a little more comfort as the backs usually reclined a couple of notches from the straight up and down position. Stuffing in these seats and backs was usually straw or horsehair with the most uncomfortable springs ever devised by man to torture his fellow man. All of this was covered with smooth easily washable leather or leatherette type material guaranteed to cause a person to slip off as soon as that one position of reasonable comfort was achieved. Finally a material seat covering was introduced that a person wouldn’t slip off of, but it was guaranteed to leave you itching for many hours after leaving the train after trying to sleep in one of these seats overnight.
Generally heavyweight coaches seated between fifty-eight and eighty passengers in anything but reasonable comfort. No such thing as a footrest could even be found on the majority of these heavyweight coaches, and for those with a footrest it was rare indeed if it was adjustable. It is said that the only persons capable of a nights sleep in one of these coaches was a baby in mothers arms or the traveling drummer (salesman) of whom it has been said could sleep standing up if required to do so.
For those passengers making a trip of a couple days duration or more some trains offered the Tourist Sleeper a car not quite up to Pullman car status but offering either fourteen or sixteen Sections for coach fare plus a nominal upper or lower berth charge. Generally speaking these were old Pullman section sleeping cars sold to the railroads and manned by the railroads own car attendants or in some cases they were actually Pullman owned and operated Tourist sleepers. Few Tourist sleeping cars lasted much past the late 1940s and only three North American railroads either built there own streamlined tourist sleepers or remodeled older cars giving them a streamlined appearance for service in the 1950s Canadian National Railways, Canadian Pacific Railway, and the Milwaukee Road.
The first appearance of true coach luxury in heavyweight cars debuted in the late 1930s in the heavyweight coaches of the C&O with two seats on one side of the center aisle and a single seat on the other side of the center aisle. These coaches seated 36 passengers and are generally recognized as the first true luxury coaches of the heavyweight era. These cars also introduced large rest rooms with a smoking lounge connected to each rest room. But for most passengers’ luxury coach travel would not be available until the lightweight streamlined coaches began making their appearance in the middle 1930’s. The heavyweight coaches of many railroads were often quite shabby in appearance both externally and internally. The interiors often had pealing paint, dirty floors as if the car cleaning crews and maintenance crews had neglected them, that was certainly the case with many of these cars during the depression and on some roads the practice of car neglect in the area of cleanliness continued. It wasn’t until the nations highways began to improve and inter-city buses began carrying more of these coach passengers, that the railroads finally woke up to the fact that the inter-city coach passenger contributed a great deal to a railroads bottom line. Remember these revenues did not have to be split with Pullman. But being typical of railroad arrogance at the time, inaction was the chosen course until it nearly became to late. They initially did nothing to counter the threat posed by inter-city buses with many railroads themselves becoming inter-city bus operators. For several railroads buses would play an important role for travel over the less popular routes and were certainly cheaper to operate than even the Doodlebugs. What with the bus requiring but a driver who not only drove but assisted the passengers in boarding and loaded the luggage, while the Doodlebugs required at least three, four or more crew. At the same time more and more people were beginning a love affair with the family automobile for many trips between cities. This was at a time when sweeping improvements in buses, automobiles and the nations highway system were all occurring simultaneously. Not forgetting to mention a fledgling Airline industry that was struggling with its very existence during this same period of time. If not for the Mail contracts enjoyed by the infant airline industry it is doubtful if they could have made it with passenger revenues alone. The Railroads almost waited to long to notice the changes occurring in many cases right alongside the railroads right of way, with many of the new highways choosing the same path as the railroads had selected earlier when they were built.
Many heavyweight trains were Mail and Express trains with a rider coach or two bringing up the markers being provided for passengers. These Mail and Express trains generally stopped everywhere and spent many minutes loading and unloading Mail and express before proceeding to the next town and another stop. Passengers were welcome to ride the Mail and Express trains Rider coach, but don’t expect even the water tanks to have been filled in many instances. Many passengers rode these trains, as they were the only trains that stopped at their small city or town. The smart passengers were those that only rode the Mail and Express train between the small cities or town they boarded in and a larger city that offered more choices of trains to ride. These rider coaches were generally the oldest steel coaches a railroad owned and their last assignment before maintenance of way service or scrap was operating on these Mail and Express trains. These coaches rarely had a window that one could see through due to the years of accumulated dirt and grime, another use for these older coaches was on the rear of a branch line mixed train that required more passenger capacity than a single combination Baggage Coach provided. It almost seemed as if many railroads were reluctant to purchase heavyweight coaches and in many cases they purchased old Pullmans and stripped the interior rebuilding these cars to coaches.
All heavyweight coaches were built with a vestibule at each end whereas in the case of the lightweight streamlined cars only Jim Crow or divided coaches, and certain prewar lightweight coaches were built with two vestibules. In the case of the Jim Crow Coaches and some prewar Canadian National and Canadian Pacific coaches that divided a smoking and non-smoking seating areas the two compartments were separated by a partition and door across the car. In the case of the Jim Crow cars each of these compartments had their own rest rooms with a vestibule at each end. The other lightweight cars to have two vestibules were commuter type cars. As the heavyweight coaches were replaced by lightweights the older cars ended up in the roads secondary trains, and for those that were already assigned to secondary trains they were passed to commuter, branch line, or Mail and Express train service. The last step for these old heavyweight Coaches was transfer to Maintenance of Way service or the scrap line. Once the streamline era really began in earnest during the late 1930’s few Railroads would order further heavyweight coaches. The M-K-T probably purchased the last twenty-five heavyweight coaches 901-925 from American Car & Foundry Company in 1937. The railroads purchased 425 parlor cars from Pullman in 1942 for conversion to coaches after the War Department turned thumbs down on such a large quantity of these cars being allowed to operate with there limited seating capacity and coaches were capable of accommodating so many more. This really represented a windfall for the railroads as no new cars were permitted to be constructed during the war and for Pullman to release so many of these parlor cars for conversion to coaches early in the war would see the railroads through to the end of the war. Even so many cars that had been slated for maintenance of way service or scrapping were pressed into service for the duration of WW II. Many of these cars were already sitting on rip tracks at the beginning of the war and with a minimum of work were returned to service. Heavyweight coaches were built by car builders Pullman, American Car & Foundry, Barney & Smith, Bethlehem Steel, Canadian Car & Foundry, National Steel Car Company, and many more were even railroad rebuilt from other types of heavyweight cars.
Heavyweight coaches featured Harriman Style Roofs (rounded), as well as the more traditional Clerestory roofs, with even the flat almost streamlined roof making its appearance toward the end of the heavyweight era. Most popular colors for the old heavyweight coaches were Pullman Green and Pullman Red while yet other roads tried variations of Maroon and Dark Green. Most railroads first class equipment and Pullman cars received Gold Leaf or Dulux Gold lettering of car names and numbers, but this was not the case with the lowly coach they received yellow lettering of the railroads name and car numbers after all gold leaf or Dulux Gold was expensive.
The layout of most trains during the heavyweight era was head end cars first trailing the locomotive tender, coaches, a diner, and in the case of many daylight trains a Parlor car or two. Santa Fe operated many trains during the heavyweight era with a Café Observation bringing up the markers a real treat for coach passengers. The overnight trains generally carried Pullmans to the rear of the Dining Car with a Lounge Observation sometimes complete with Barber and Valet service brought up the markers but these cars were only for the benefit of first class passengers.
The first indication that improvements were coming for the coach passenger came from the east, namely the Central of New Jersey Railroad when they inaugurated their BLUE COMETS February 21, 1929 between New York City and Atlantic City twice daily in both directions. Here was a train specially designed and rebuilt from existing heavyweight cars for coach passengers only. Thirteen cars were selected for rebuilding for BLUE COMET service two Baggage cars, two Baggage Smoking combinations with 48 revenue seats, six coaches with 64 revenue seats, one 36 seat Dining car (operated in trains during meal hours only), and two Open Platform Observations with 48 armchairs. All coaches were carpeted and the seats were covered in Persian Blue Mohair to compliment the exterior blues applied to the BLUE COMET cars. The exterior of the remodeled cars was finished in two shades of Blue with a Cream painted window band separating the two blues. All lettering and numbers were Gold Leaf. This was truly America’s first deluxe all coach train service and except for the timing of its introduction just before the stock market crash and subsequent great depression the BLUE COMET would probably have been successful. Unfortunately the BLUE COMET trains were soon discontinued during the depression and even after they were never reinstated.
Interesting that the second heavyweight deluxe coach train was an almost exact copy of the BLUE COMET named the MOTOR QUEEN. The new MOTOR QUEEN operated between Detroit and Cincinnati providing daily service in each direction. The two five car trains were remodeled heavyweights painted Blue with a Cream painted window band separating the blue. All lettering and numbering was again Gold leaf. Each of the two train sets operated with five cars a Baggage 48 revenue seat coach combination, two 64 revenue seat Coaches, a 24 seat Dining 18 seat Lounge Car, and the final car in each consist was a Open Platform Observation with 48 plush armrest seats. These two train sets were also replaced during the great depression but at least an attempt had been made at offering coach passengers some luxury by at least two railroads.
The Northern Pacific Railway received five and the CB&Q one of a new coach type in 1935 for service in the jointly operated NORTH COAST LIMITED. Each NORTH COAST LIMITED train set received one of the new coaches that featured 56 reclining revenue seats with an 8 seat-smoking lounge. Seating in these cars was generally assigned to the first 56 passengers traveling between Seattle and Chicago in each direction. With only one of these cars per consist Portland passengers were excluded. All cars in the NORTH COAST LIMITED at that time except for a Sleeping car were through Chicago - Seattle cars. The one sleeper was a Portland car that was forwarded to and from Pasco by the Spokane Portland & Seattle Railway jointly owned by the Great Northern Railway and Northern Pacific Railway, but all coach passengers to and from Portland changed trains to the SP&S train. These cars closely resembled streamlined cars as they had a flat roof and large square double paned sealed windows, two vestibules, fully air conditioned, and rode on 4 wheel trucks.
The Great Northern Railway took note of the new coaches purchased by the Northern Pacific Railway for NORTH COAST LIMITED service. When the Great Northern received new Coaches 938-949 in 1937 they were much different instead of being flat roofed they were round roof and except for the six Wheel trucks and riveted construction were considered stream-lined. A single vestibule, with 58 plush reclining revenue seats and a cheerful bright interior assured these cars their streamliner status. Each car was lettered for the EMPIRE BUILDER and the luxury coaches as they were called in company literature and advertising were assigned two per consist to the Great Northern Railways finest the EMPIRE BUILDER. One of these cars was a Chicago - Seattle car the other a Chicago – Portland car with the SP&S forwarding this car to and from Portland by way of Spokane. These cars would be among the first cars repainted following WW II in the new EMPIRE BUILDER colors of Omaha Orange and Pullman Green with the Dulux Gold striping and lettering. The cars were assigned to other train duties after the 1947 equipping of the EMPIRE BUILDER with all new streamlined train sets and would not be retired as a group until 1970.
The first successful lightweight streamlined coaches made their appearance in the two articulated streamliners of 1934. The first of these was the Union Pacific’s Pullman Standard built EMC powered M-10000 later to be named the CITY OF SALINA delivered in February, 1934. The other streamliner of 1934 was the Chicago Burlington and Quincy Railroads 9900 ZEPHYR delivered by Budd in May 1934. These were America’s first truly successful streamliners. Several earlier experimental trains one dating back to 1900 on the B&O another a 1929 CGW trains will be covered in their respective chapters. The two western roads that took the plunge into streamlining first the Union Pacific with their M-10000 CITY OF SALINA and the Burlington with the 9900 ZEPHYR later renamed PIONEER ZEPHYR were both considered major successes. Even though the Union Pacific train would be retired and scrapped in 1941 for its Aluminum needed for the war effort, in actual truth the Union Pacific retired the train due to its own success. The train as the CITY OF SALINA began each day in Salina, Kansas and ran to Kansas City. Later it made a round trip from Kansas City to Topeka and then returned to Salina completing its day’s work. The articulated consist was partly its downfall for the CITY OF SALINA route outgrew the train with a steam hauled replacement with more cars for additional capacity taking over the route. The Union Pacific was also not enamored with the power choice of the M-10000 it was a distillate engine producing 600 horsepower. The 9900 PIONEER ZEPHYR was retired in 1960 and transferred to the Museum of Science and Industry on Chicago’s Lake Shore where it has recently returned after a nearly year long restoration and is now displayed inside a new parking facility adjoining the Museum.
The two streamliners differed in materials used in their construction the M-10000 CITY OF SALINA was built of Duraluminum a derivative of ordinary Aluminum but much stronger developed for airship construction and the aircraft industry. It was stronger than ordinary Aluminum and was easily cold shaped. The frame and center sill of the cars, as well as the trucks and wheels were constructed of steel, as were the engine motor mounts and that framing around the engine. The 9900 PIONEER ZEPHYR was constructed of stainless steel shot welded together. The two articulated trains were very close in weight with the CITY OF SALINA slightly longer with larger passenger capacity. The 9900 PIONEER ZEPHYR was the faster of the two and was also the only true diesel powered train set with a 600 HP Winton Diesel powering the Electric Generator that supplied power to the traction motors. As mentioned earlier the M-10000 CITY OF SALINA featured a 600 HP distillate engine a type of power plant installed in many EMC built motorcars. The CITY OF SALINA was the only streamliner ever equipped with a distillate engine.
The major problem with these early streamliners was they were articulated, and that fact meant that when extra capacity was needed there was none available as nothing else on the road was compatible.
The Santa Fe would take a different approach to streamlining with a single 52 revenue seat lightweight stream-lined Stainless Steel Coach 3070 being delivered by Budd in January, 1936. This car established the 13’ 6” standard height for lightweight streamlined cars; this cars width was 10’, which became standard for lightweight streamlined cars. The length was 85’ which also became standard although this latter figure varied somewhat with certain Railway Post Office cars having an overall length of 60’ while other lightweight streamlined cars ran 77’ – 80’ and 85’ in length. The height and width dimensions permitted the new car to be used with any heavyweight car by simply coupling them together, steam lines, signal lines, air lines and coupler height standards had all been established long before Santa Fe took delivery of Coach 3070. These dimensions allowed the diaphragms of heavyweight and lightweight cars to be an almost perfect match. The Santa Fe Railways approach to streamlining would eventually become the standard for the railroad industry, Diesel Electric Locomotives for power and individual non-articulated lightweight streamlined cars. In the case of the Santa Fe for the most part they would choose cars of Stainless steel or sheathed in stainless steel owning only a few sleeping cars and a number of Baggage Cars that were smooth sided cars of Cor-ten Steel. Many other roads selected the less expensive Aluminum or Cor-ten steel cars painted in the new color schemes adopted by that particular railroad. For many railroads the streamline era ushered in a new paint scheme along with the new diesels and lightweight streamlined cars. In fact it has been said that the Diesel design men at La Grange and Schenectady would design most of the railroads new paint schemes. Many of these railroads had one paint scheme for their passenger diesels and lightweight streamlined passenger cars and another for just their Freight Diesels. Streamlined Steam Locomotives and tenders would be assigned to pull many of the early streamlined passenger trains. In the case of the Santa Fe their finest the SUPER CHIEF would be assigned diesel power while the streamlined consists of the CHIEF were assigned modern steam power not streamlined steam power between 1938 and 1945 before finally being dieselized. Roads like the Milwaukee Road, New York Central, Pennsylvania, and Southern Pacific would operate their prewar streamliners with modern streamlined steam power until after WW II. And roads like the Norfolk and Western were even reluctant to give up on steam for they’re streamlined train until the latter half of the 1950s.
Lightweight streamlined coaches and train sets were built by American Car & Foundry, Bombardier, Budd Company, Canadian Car & Foundry, Canadian Vickers, General Motors, Goodyear Zeppelin Corporation, Hawker Siddeley Canada Limited, Montreal Locomotive Works, National Steel Car Company, Pacific Railway Equipment, Pressed Steel Car Company, Pullman Standard, and the Rohr Corporation. All constructed more than one streamlined coach during the lightweight streamlined era. Foreign built lightweight streamlined cars and equipment came to North American Railroads from France, Japan, Netherlands, South Korea, and Switzerland. Those railroads who rebuilt older heavyweight cars into streamlined cars or built new lightweight streamlined cars in their own shops were the Atlantic Coast Line (ACL), Baltimore and Ohio (B&O), Canadian National (CN), Canadian Pacific (CP), Chicago Milwaukee St. Paul and Pacific (CMStP&P). The Great Northern (GN), Gulf Mobile & Ohio (GM&O), Illinois Central (IC), Louisville & Nashville (L&N), Lehigh Valley (LV), Nashville Chattanooga & St. Louis (NC&StL), New York Central (NYC), New York New Haven & Hartford (NYNH&H), Pennsylvania (PRR), Reading (RRR), and the St. Louis – San Francisco (StLSF) all of these railroads could count themselves among those railroads that rebuilt heavyweight cars into streamlined cars or who built new streamlined cars from the ground up.
Probably one of the best known and most successful early coach train operations was introduced by the Union Pacific and Chicago and North-western Railroads on August 21, 1935 named the CHALLENGER, they operated between Chicago and Los Angeles daily. The CHALLENGER was the first attempt to offer long distance coach passengers some of the amenities offered to first class passengers in an economy train. The Union Pacific had suffered a major drop in coach rider ship, and with it revenue during the great depression. The thinking was the concept of the CHALLENGER might be a way to recoup some of this lost business and revenue. Union Pacific management was convinced that by offering an all coach train with some of the amenities offered first class passengers only in the past might be the way to attract new riders and bring back old riders to the trains. Not only did the new CHALLENGERS restore the lost coach revenue, but also within a year was the most profitable passenger operation on the Railroad. Initially the trains were made up of old heavyweight cars refurbished for the new service offering Coach, economy dining cars and Tourist Sleeping cars. So pleased with the initial years operation of the CHALLENGER were the two operating roads that the Union Pacific rebuilt an additional sixty cars (47 Coaches, 5 Dining Cars, and 16 Tourist Sleepers) for the 1936 edition of the CHALLENGER beginning May 15, 1936.
The CHALLENGER offered a stewardess nurse who proved especially helpful to Mothers traveling with infants and smaller children, the CHALLENGER provided at least one coach in each consist for the exclusive use of Women and Children traveling together. Where most overnight trains were charging coach passengers a nickel or dime for pillow rental the new CHALLENGER provided free pillow service. The CHALLENGER was the first long distance coach train in the United States that all cars were fully air-conditioned. The CHALLENGER was the first train to provide subdued Blue lighting in the coaches for the nocturnal parts of the trip. Of course white lighting was provided for those passengers who wished to read by individual lights above each seat. All seats in the rebuilt CHALLENGER coaches were equipped with individually adjustable seat backs and the cushions were covered in a Scottish plaid covering to signify thrift. Each seat back headrest was covered with a fresh white linen headrest cover changed daily with the trains name Challenger embroidered in Red script on those headrest covers. The Dining Car served extremely reasonable priced meals and in no time became quite popular with the thrifty minded passengers. Rather than assign a separate Lounge Car the Dining Cars were used for this purpose during non-meal hours. Eventually the trains would have separate Lounge cars assigned beginning in April 1937. The CHALLENGER heavyweight coaches, dining cars, lounges, and Tourist Sleeping Cars were painted Olive Green with Gold Leaf lettering and with the words Challenger in Red Script centered on the car sides below the windows. The CHALLENGER continued to grow with the Union Pacific assigning all available cars to CHALLENGER service after rebuilding and refurbishing including many of their Harriman type cars. The Union Pacific – Chicago and North Western – Southern Pacific introduced a second CHALLENGER between Chicago and San Francisco on September 15, 1937. This coincided with the delivery of the first lightweight streamlined cars purchased for assignment to the CHALLENGER. There were 48 revenue seat lightweight streamlined Coaches delivered for all three CHALLENGER owners C&NW 6132-6147, UP 5300-5327, and SP 2424-2429. Fifty seat articulated paired lightweight streamlined coaches were delivered to the Southern Pacific 2414-2415, 2416-2417. Also 56 Revenue seat lightweight streamlined Coaches with stewardess - nurse quarters for the C&NW 6160-6166 and UP 5200-5211. The final group of cars delivered at that time were five Twin Unit Dining cars delivered to the Union Pacific numbers 5100-5104. The Twin Unit Dining cars were assigned to the LOS ANGELES CHALLENGER pool of cars while the coaches could be found mixed with heavyweights in the consists of both the LOS ANGELES CHALLENGER and the SAN FRANCISCO CHALLENGER. The new cars delivered to the C&NW for CHALLENGER service were painted the same Olive Green paint as the UP and SP CHALLENGER cars but instead of Gold Leaf lettering on the Olive Green like the UP and SP used. The CHALLENGER cars the C&NW owned were lettered using yellow paint with two narrow yellow paint stripes running the length of their cars one above the windows the other below the windows. Even this influx of new cars would not be enough to stem the demand for space on the CHALLENGERS and Pullman supplied an additional forty Tourist Sleeping Cars for the CHALLENGERS. This became one of the few instances Pullman owned Tourist Sleeping cars actually carried a train name in this instance THE CHALLENGER on there sides as all other cars assigned to this service carried. So successful were the CHALLENGERS that on many summer days they departed with two and even three sections of the LOS ANGELES CHALLENGER and SAN FRANCISCO CHALLENGER. Demand for seats on the CHALLENGERS sometimes forced the operators of the CHALLENGERS to use equipment that was not up to the trains standards and in most of those cases the cars were assigned to the short trip passengers.
Rival Santa Fe on the Chicago – Los Angeles route received thirty 60 Revenue seat lightweight streamlined stainless steel coaches from Budd for assignment to that roads SCOUT the closest competitor to the CHALLENGER. The Santa Fe SCOUT was a daily economy train that differed from the CHALLENGER in that it carried first class Pullman Sleeping cars over part of its route. But the Tourist Sleeping cars carried by the SCOUT were not only through cars but additional cars of this type were added in route on the westbound SCOUT. The SCOUTS economy diner was open to both first class and coach passengers. The SCOUT and LOS ANGELES CHALLENGER matched the others time keeping thus offering passengers a choice of routes between Chicago and Los Angeles. The Santa Fe SCOUT was always considered a heavyweight train and other than the lightweight streamlined Budd coaches the SCOUT would never become more streamlined than that. Where its closest rival the Union Pacific LOS ANGELES CHALLENGER after being discontinued following WW II would be reinstated in the 1950s as a lightweight streamlined CHALLENGER, serving as a rival to the Santa Fe EL CAPITAN a premium service coach train rather than as an economy train.
By December 1936 there was twenty-seven lightweight streamlined trains in service all carrying coaches and many of the trains were fully articulated or partially articulated. These 27 trains are listed below:

UNION PACIFIC

M-1000 CITY OF SALINA fully articulated 3-car train delivered February 1934 entered scheduled service January 31, 1935 between Salina and Kansas City round trip daily.

M-10001 CITY OF PORTLAND fully articulated delivered October 1934 entered scheduled service June 6, 1935 between Chicago and Portland ten times monthly.

M-10002 CITY OF LOS ANGELES fully articulated entered scheduled service May 15, 1936 between Chicago and Los Angeles ten times monthly.
M-10004 CITY OF SAN FRANCISCO fully articulated entered scheduled service June 14, 1936 between Chicago and San Francisco ten times monthly.
M-10005 CITY OF DENVER M-10006 CITY OF DENVER partly articulated entered scheduled service June 18, 1936 overnight every night in both directions between Chicago and Denver.

CHICAGO BURLINGTON & QUINCY

9900 PIONEER ZEPHYR fully articulated delivered May, 1934 entered scheduled service November 11, 1934 between Lincoln and Kansas City round trip daily.

9901 TWIN ZEPHYR 9902 TWIN ZEPHYR fully articulated entered scheduled service April 21, 1935 one round trip daily between Chicago and Minneapolis later increased to two round trips daily.

9903 MARK TWAIN ZEPHYR fully articulated entered scheduled service October 28, 1935 one round trip daily St. Louis to Burlington.

9904 ZEPHYR TRAIN OF THE GODDESSES 9905 ZEPHYR TRAIN OF THE GODS fully articulated entered scheduled service December 18, 1936 between Chicago and Minneapolis two round trips daily.

9906 DENVER ZEPHYR 9907 DENVER ZEPHYR partly articulated entered scheduled service November 7, 1936 between Chicago and Minneapolis two daily round trips.

ILLINOIS CENTRAL

121 GREEN DIAMOND fully articulated entered scheduled service May 17, 1936 between Chicago and St. Louis round trip daily.

CHICAGO MILWAUKEE ST. PAUL & PACIFIC

1-2 HIAWATHAS not articulated entered scheduled service May 29, 1935 between Chicago and Minneapolis round trip daily

3-4 HIAWATHAS not articulated entered scheduled service October 11, 1936 between Chicago and Minneapolis round trip daily

NEW YORK CENTRAL

MERCURY non-articulated entered scheduled service July 15, 1936 between Cleveland and Detroit round trip daily.

NEW YORK NEW HAVEN & HARTFORD

COMET fully articulated bi-directional entered scheduled service June 5, 1935 between Providence and Boston seven round trips daily.

BESLER non-articulated bi-directional entered scheduled service September 12, 1936 between Bridgeport and Hartford three round trips daily.

ALTON

ABRAHAM LINCOLN non-articulated entered scheduled service July 1, 1935 between Chicago and St. Louis round trip daily.

BALTIMORE & OHIO

ROYAL BLUE non-articulated entered scheduled service June 24, 1935 between New York and Washington round trip daily.

MAINE CENTRAL/BOSTON & MAINE

6000 FLYING YANKEE fully articulated delivered February, 1935 entered scheduled service April 1, 1935 between Boston and Bangor round trip daily.

GULF MOBILE & NORTHERN

352 REBEL 353 REBEL non-articulated entered scheduled service July 10, 1935 between Jackson and New Orleans round trip overnight.

The one thing the above trains all had in common was coach accommodation although only a few of the above trains were actually all coach trains, those trains were the M-10000 CITY OF SALINA, 9900 PIONEER ZEPHYR, 9903 MARK TWAIN ZEPHYR, COMET, BESLER and 6000 FLYING YANKEE. Others were for both Coach and Parlor car service the 9901-9902 TWIN ZEPHYRS, 9904 ZEPHYR TRAIN OF THE GODDESSES, 9905 ZEPHYR TRAIN OF THE GODS, GREEN DIAMOND, HIAWATHA'S, MERCURY, ABRAHAM LINCOLN, and ROYAL BLUE.
The CITY OF PORTLAND, CITY OF LOS ANGELES, CITY OF SAN FRANCISCO, CITY OF DENVERS, and REBELS all provided Coach and Pullman Sleeping car accommodation.
The DENVER ZEPHYRS were the only trains that provided Coach, Parlor, and Pullman Sleeping car accommodation. The only trains in the previously mentioned groups whose cars could simply be uncoupled and coupled were the HIAWATHAS, MERCURY, ABRAHAM LINCOLN, ROYAL BLUE, and the CITY OF DENVER. The REBELS could simply be coupled and uncoupled but they were not compatible with any other equipment. After December 1936 all lightweight streamlined passenger equipment would be compatible for coupling and going from car to car. Cars would no longer be articulated in more than three car sets, and in most cases pairs only with the vast majority of all lightweight streamlined cars delivered after December, 1936 single cars. In the 1950’s the railroads would once again experiment with lightweight low center of gravity trains that were incompatible with the rest of the railroads passenger equipment, and from time to time thereafter these lightweight streamlined experiments continue to surface for another look. Recently in 1999, new TALGO trains entered service in the Northwest built for State agencies and operated by Amtrak. Branding these as experimental is probably unfair as after their early trials in the United States they went on to Spain where the TALGO type became very successful. The latest trains to enter service in the United States are the ACELA trains operating in the Northeast corridor at speeds up to 150 miles per hour.
Prior to WW II there was a number of Coach streamliners built and placed in service in different regions of the country for overnight operation. These trains for the most part were seven-car train sets built by Budd or Pullman Standard and either pulled by a single 2,000 hp passenger diesel or in many cases streamlined steam locomotives generally a 4-6-2 Pacific. The three things these trains all had in common was comfortable reclining seats in the coaches, clean modern dining cars, and attractive lounge cars. Many of these trains borrowed an idea from the CHALLENGERS (originally introduced on the GM&O REBELS) and introduced stewardess nurses or train hostesses and some even went so far as to assign one coach for Women and Children traveling together. It’s to bad Amtrak and VIA Rail Canada haven’t tried this women with children coach idea, but then some would say times have changed and at least in the United States the American Civil Liberties Union would have a field day with that idea. After all if all the screaming kids and their mothers were assigned or confined to one coach or two then they could disturb one another and permit the rest of the coach passengers to have some peace and quiet. But unfortunately the American Civil Liberty Union Lawyers in this country would rather force all passengers to suffer someone else’s children equally.
The routes of these very popular coach streamliners were between New York City and both coasts of Florida by two routes SILVER METEOR (PRR, RF&P, SAL), and CHAMPION (PRR, RF&P, ACL, FEC), New York City and New Orleans (PRR, SOU). Between Chicago and Florida by three different routes CITY OF MIAMI (IC, C of G, FEC), SOUTH WIND (PRR, L&N, ACL, FEC), and DIXIE FLAGLER (C&EI, L&N, NC&StL, AB&C, ACL, FEC).
Other lengthy coach operations would be introduced before WW II such as the PRR TRAILBLAZER overnight between Chicago and New York City, not to be outdone the NYC introduced an all coach overnight train between Chicago and New York on the same date the PACEMAKER. This latter train was a heavyweight and would not be completely streamlined until after WW II. The Baltimore and Ohio Railroads COLUMBIAN became a Jersey City to Chicago overnight coach train days before WW II began. The PRR was the only one of the three railroads with New York City – St. Louis routes (NYC-B&O-PRR) to offer a coach streamliner between those two points the JEFFERSONIAN introduced in 1941 using rebuilt heavyweight cars stream-lined in Altoona Shops for this train.
The Santa Fe offered a deluxe streamlined Coach service between Chicago and Los Angeles in the same 39-3/4 hours as the All Pullman SUPER CHIEF naming the new coach consists EL CAPITAN. The EL CAPITAN was nineteen hours faster westbound and twenty-one hours faster eastbound than the SCOUT or the UP LOS ANGELES CHALLENGER and therefore an extra fare was charged to ride the faster train. The EL CAPITAN trains were an immediate hit with the traveling public and quickly grew from their humble five car beginnings with a passenger capacity of 186 to eight cars with a capacity of 366. Before WW II the EL CAPITAN would increase by a third train set thus providing every other day service in each direction. The EL CAPITAN will be more fully covered in the Santa Fe Chapter of this book. We will mention here that from those first five car train sets the EL CAPITAN went on to become the finest all coach daily long distance train in the world until 1971.
By the beginning of WW II most railroads in the United States and Canada owned some streamlined cars or in many cases complete streamlined trains. Nearly every region of the country witnessed the passing of lightweight streamlined passenger trains, not always daily for many of the prewar streamliners were in such short supply that some trains only operated every five or six days.
The railroads were operating many lightweight streamlined trains by the beginning of the war that carried both coach and parlor cars. The Southern Pacific who by the outbreak of WW II was operating a MORNING DAYLIGHT, NOON DAYLIGHT, and SAN JOAQUIN DAYLIGHT between San Francisco and Los Angeles in both directions daily operated some of the more famous of these. The latter by its namesake valley while the first two traveled by way of the Coastline. The Santa Fe was offering three daily streamliners named the GOLDEN GATES between San Francisco and Los Angeles in a Bus-Train-Bus service. The Santa Fe was also providing four streamlined round trips daily with two consists of the SAN DIEGANS between Los Angeles and San Diego. Further east the Southern Pacific Railroads subsidiary Texas and New Orleans was operating twice-daily streamlined trains between Houston and Dallas, the morning trains in each direction were the HUSTLERS and the afternoon trains were the SUNBEAMS. North of there Santa Fe was operating the CHICAGOAN and KANSAS CITYAN daily between Oklahoma City and Chicago. The other Santa Fe streamliner operating in the mid-west at that time was the TULSAN between Tulsa and Kansas City with through cars to and from Chicago carried in the CHICAGOAN eastbound and KANSAS CITYAN westbound. The Southern was operating a Coach streamliner the TENNESSEAN between Washington and Memphis that carried heavyweight Pullmans behind the streamlined coach section. The CB&Q was opera-ting the four car GENERAL PERSHING ZEPHYR between St. Louis and Kansas City round trip daily and by the outbreak of the war it was extended beyond Kansas City to Omaha and Lincoln. The CB&Q was also operating a train between St. Louis and Minneapolis overnight with the Rock Island that carried lightweight coaches and heavyweight sleeping cars the ZEPHYR – ROCKET. Rock Island was operating Diesel – Electric powered ROCKETS with light-weight coaches between Chicago and Peoria (PEORIA ROCKET), Des Moines and Chicago (DES MOINES ROCKET), between Minneapolis and Kansas City the Rock Island provided daily service using two sets of ROCKET equipment one in each direction. Other ROCKET services operated between Kansas City and Dallas and the CB&Q was operating the 9901and 9902 ZEPHYRS (formerly TWIN ZEPHYRS) between Dallas – Fort Worth and Houston. The TEXAS ZEPHYR was providing overnight service between Denver and Dallas over CB&Q subsidiaries FW&D, and C&S. The TEXAS ZEPHYR was another of those trains with lightweight coach section and heavyweight Pullman section. Of course by that time the Chicago – Denver route was served by three overnight trains the CB&Q DENVER ZEPHYR, C&NW-UP CITY OF DENVER and the CRI&P ROCKY MOUNTAIN ROCKET the latter with direct service to Colorado Springs and Denver. The Rock Island was operating the CHOCTAW ROCKET between Memphis and Amarillo daily in each direction using two Diesel – Electric powered streamlined train sets. Three Railroads were operating streamliners between Chicago and Minneapolis daily the CB&Q with twice daily streamliner service with the TRAIN OF THE GODS and TRAIN OF THE GODDESSES ZEPHYR train sets. Milwaukee Road was offering twice daily HIAWATHAS between Chicago and the Twin Cities, and last but not least the C&NW introduced their Diesel – Electric powered streamlined 400s between the same terminal cities providing a daily train in each direction.
The Alton was offering two daily streamliners in each direction between Chicago and St. Louis the ABRAHAM LINCOLN and ANN RUTLEDGE. The NYC was providing through MERCURY train service between Chicago-Detroit- Cleveland daily in each direction using streamlined steam powered consists. The NYC on the very day the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor took place December 7, 1941 inaugurated new Budd built lightweight streamliners between New York City and Detroit-Cleveland named the EMPIRE STATE EXPRESS powered by streamlined 4-6-4 Hudson Locomotives.
The prewar lightweight streamlined coaches were well lighted, airy, clean, and comfortable, fully air conditioned, with ice water, clean rest rooms, and were generally not over-crowded. The prewar lightweight streamlined coaches were equipped with folding steps at vestibules for boarding, skirting to hide the equipment and air conditioning units located beneath the cars etc. Several of the early articulated streamliners even had streamlined truck covers but mechanical forces that needed to inspect the trucks soon discarded these. Buying a lightweight streamlined railroad passenger car was almost like buying an automobile except there was even more options available. For the car body itself a Railroad could choose Cor-ten steel, aluminum or stainless steel from manufacturers such as American Car & Foundry and Pullman Standard. From Budd there was no choice as they only built Stainless steel cars. There were three types of air conditioning Ice, Steam ejector, and mechanical, with ice being the cheapest initially to install but the most labor intensive as the cars equipped with Ice systems where fans blowing across the ice provided the cooling consumed 500 lb. of ice per hour. Most cars equipped with ice systems bunkered 4,500 lb. of ice beneath the car enough for nine hours of cooling before needing replenishing. The ice type air conditioning was ordered by few railroads after WW II. The Steam Ejector system where the steam line from the diesels or steam power up front was very popular with many roads and the secret to successful operation of this system was maintaining constant steam pressure. The Santa Fe was very successful with the steam ejector system while Southern Pacific replaced their steam ejector installations with Mechanical. The mechanical or electric type that either used a power supply to operate a generator for electrical power for the air conditioning or used power from a cars belt driven generator were by far the most popular. The latter type was quickly replaced by a separate engine driven unit operating an electric generator supplying the necessary power, as the belt driven generator was not of sufficient power output to supply the batteries with enough power for any extended station stop. Most lightweight streamlined cars built for and operated in complete streamlined trains before the war were equipped with full width diaphragms giving the streamliners an unbroken appearance as if one long unit. Many railroads selected certain types of trucks for their prewar streamlined cars and switched to newer types of trucks on car orders following the war. The commonwealth truck with outside swing hanger appeared on New Haven passenger cars beginning in 1948. Beginning in 1947 the H type coupler became standard for all passenger cars. No longer was their any slack action on passenger trains equipped with these couplers. Following the war many of the lightweight streamlined cars no longer were purchased as deluxe cars, the skirting was missing and in many instances the full width diaphragms were no longer an expense that many railroads were willing to pay for. On some cars rigid non-folding steps replaced folding steps. But many of the postwar lightweight streamlined cars were built with carpeting in the aisles a feature no longer restricted to just the first class cars. And this was only the beginning of better things to come for the postwar coach passenger. World War II brought a halt to new passenger car construction except for Troop Sleepers, Troop Kitchen, and U.S. Army Hospital cars but none of these could be mistaken for streamlined car types.
Many Railroads had streamlined a number of trains before WW II but the vast majority of lightweight streamlined trains would come following WW II and in some cases second and third generations of the same streamlined trains would follow. The major railroads would move from ten and twenty trains per month on certain routes to daily service requiring additional equipment for the postwar streamliners, this was particular true of western roads such as the Santa Fe and Union Pacific.
Following WW II the car manufacturers were inundated with orders for lightweight streamlined cars and complete streamlined trains. Orders were for everything from head end cars to Observations and every type passenger car in between. It was almost as if a large majority of the Railroads heavyweight passenger cars had worn out at the same time from the heavy wartime use and were in need of replacement immediately or as soon as possible. Rider ship figures had soared to new heights during the war and the railroads were determined to hold onto as much of that business as possible, many felt the best way was to offer the traveling public more lightweight streamlined trains. For the coach passengers the best was yet to come from the car manufacturers. First following the war came the leg rest seat for long distance services, the seating capacity of these leg-rest coaches varied between 38 and 56 with even the latter seating capacity able to offer large rest rooms and smoking lounges. In Canada Canadian Pacific Railway purchased 60 Leg-Rest seat Coaches for the CANADIAN and other services. Even better news for coach passengers came from the CB&Q in 1947 when the worlds first lightweight Vista Dome train sets the TWIN ZEPHYRS began twice daily round trip service between Chicago and Minneapolis. These train sets each featured seven cars with five of these cars dome equipped. The 24 seats in the dome coaches was for the use of any coach passenger who wished to enjoy the view and this space was not sold as revenue seating. Only the Dome Observation was off limits to Coach passengers as this car was a parlor and the 24 seats in this dome were reserved for the use of the parlor car patrons. With four domes in each consist for coach passengers this gave those passengers 96 dome seats. The revenue coach seats in these four cars numbered 212. Besides the dome seating the Baggage Buffet Lounge car provided 39 non-revenue seats and the dining car another 48 non-revenue seats. So in actual fact the Vista Dome TWIN ZEPHYRS provided coach passengers with 162 non-revenue seats for a ratio of 1-3/4 seats per coach passenger. Where the Vista Dome TWIN ZEPHYR Coaches seated 50 or 54 in revenue seats. The two Vista Domes with the seating for 50 operated one per consist had a Conductors office otherwise they were the same as the 54 seat Vista Dome Coaches.
The long distance Vista Dome Coach with 46 reserved leg rest seats was introduced with the jointly owned and operated CB&Q-D&RGW-WP CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR inaugurated March 20, 1949. Each CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR operated with three Dome Coaches in each consist and two other Vista Domes for the enjoyment of Pullman Passengers. Besides the CB&Q-D&RGW-WP Budd would sell these 46 seat Leg Rest Dome Coaches to the Missouri Pacific for the COLORADO EAGLE, Great Northern for the EMPIRE BUILDER, and Northern Pacific for the NORTH COAST LIMITED.
Credit must also be given to the Chesapeake & Ohio Railway for the innovative planning and design work that went into the stillborn CHESSIE. The CHESSIE consisted of three trains constructed by Budd for service between Washington-Newport News and Cincinnati. The CHESSIE never entered service but did go on a tour of the area served and was then quietly dropped. The CHESSIE would have given coach passengers the highest ratio of non-revenue seats to revenue seats of any coach streamliners ever constructed. If a fifteen car CHESSIE had operated there would have been 322 revenue seats available and 288 non-revenue seats available. But if thirteen car or fewer CHESSIE trains had operated the non-revenue seats would have outnumbered the revenue seats. The CHESSIE never entered service and most of the equipment from the three train sets was sold to other railroads.
Postwar lightweight streamlined coaches were built in long distance versions with leg rest seats with seating between 38-60. Higher capacity shorter distance coaches with seating from 54-80. There were combination Coaches with Baggage Coach and Baggage Crew Dormitory Coach. Other types of postwar cars that featured coach seating were Snack Bar Coaches, Dining Coaches, Coach Lounges, Stateroom Coaches, and of course Dome Coaches in both long distance and short distance versions. Combination Domes for multiple uses, and Coach Observations. Later would come Hi-Level Coaches, Keystone Coaches, Bi-Level Coaches, and Superliner Coaches not to mention the experimental lightweight trains. Budd came up with the Rail Diesel Car in the latter 1940s as the answer to the less than profitable Branch Line rail operations. At least with the Budd RDC the Branch Lines at least stood a chance of breaking even with their less expensive operating costs. The RDC came in four basic types the all coach RDC-1, the Baggage Coach combination RDC-2, the Railway Post Office Baggage Coach Combination RDC-3 and the shorter in length Railway Post Office Baggage Combination RDC-4 (one Midwestern Railroad even operated RDC-4s with seating for 17 passengers the M&STL.).
Probably the greatest number of new streamlined trains entered service between 1946 and 1949 when the car manufacturers were working around the clock turning out lightweight streamlined cars to equip the nations postwar streamlined trains. A second round of new streamlined car purchases took place from the car builders in the early to mid 1950s that would complete the streamlined car needs of most railroads in the United States and Canada.
It seemed as if every railroad from every region of the United States was demanding new lightweight streamlined cars from the manufacturers as soon as possible following the Second World War. The car manufacturers were anxious to fulfill those orders in spite of many shortages of certain raw materials caused by the war. In spite of these initial shortages of materials the Railroad car manufacturers soon discovered there were many new sub contractors available to them more than ever before thanks to the hundreds of small manufacturers that came into being with the encouragement of a wartime government in a time of national need. And many of these small wartime manufacturers were only to willing to bid on parts and assemblies for the new postwar streamlined passenger car boom in order for there doors to remain open following the second world war.
One Railroad the Milwaukee Road built all of there own lightweight stream-lined cars in there own Milwaukee shops except for ten Super domes, and thirty sleeping cars delivered by Pullman Standard, not to mention the five used Budd built PACIFIC series 10-6 sleeping cars purchased from the Union Pacific.
Another railroad the CI&L (MONON) purchased twenty-five surplus U.S. Army Hospital cars built by American Car & Foundry in 1944 in anticipation of an invasion of Japan that thankfully never took place. The MONON shops converted these cars into the roads entire lightweight streamlined passenger fleet. The Alaska Railroad purchased thirty two of the same cars and had a WW II ship builder Puget Sound Bridge and Dredging Company in Seattle rebuild them into the ARR modern passenger fleet before barging them north to the Railroad. Just one more example of a once busy wartime contractor looking for postwar business wherever they could find it in order to keep the doors open. The former U. S. Army Hospital cars had a fully streamlined appearance after completion by the Seattle based ship builder Puget Sound Bridge & Dredging.
The two major Canadian Railroads the Canadian National and Canadian Pacific did not receive the large numbers of streamlined passenger cars necessary to streamline the majority of their fleet until 1954 later than any of the major U. S. Railroads. That was probably because of a lack of competition in Canada, whereas in the United States major cities such as Seattle on the West Coast were served by the Great Northern Railway, Milwaukee Road, Northern Pacific Railway, Union Pacific, and Canadian Pacific Railway. Nearby Vancouver, British Columbia a city of comparable size was served by Canadian National, Canadian Pacific, and Great Northern. Many Canadian travelers were finding it possible to travel
Canadian National and Grand Trunk Western between Toronto and other eastern Canadian cities to Chicago where they could board the Great Northern Railways EMPIRE BUILDER to Everett where they could change trains to the INTERNATIONAL to complete there trip to Vancouver. This route was faster by over a day than the all-Canadian route of either the Canadian National or Canadian Pacific. It was also possible for passengers between Toronto and Winnipeg to travel faster by way of Chicago and St. Paul than the Canadian routes north of Lake Superior. Both of these alternatives to the all Canadian route were comparable in price, and the time difference of a full day on the trip to the west coast made it even more attractive for Canadians to take the route south of there border.
South of the U.S. border the National de Mexico received the AZTEC EAGLE train sets from the Schindler Company of Switzerland the first and only new long distance trains built for the NdeM during the forties or fifties. The makeup of these beautiful red and cream painted lightweight stream-lined train sets included 1st and 2nd class coaches, fortunately the latter never caught on in the United States and Canada. It was bad enough that Railroads operating in the American south operated with so called Jim Crow or divided coaches to separate the races. That a single example of this type car should have been built during the streamline era is America’s disgrace. Unfortunately a number of U.S. railroads built lightweight streamlined coaches with divided interiors. These will be covered in the respective chapters of those Railroads.
Many Railroads when sleeping car needs waned rebuilt these cars to coaches the one means of rail travel that showed an increase in demand on some roads in the U.S. in the late 1950s and 1960s. Many Railroads purchased new cars for commuter services and as long distance train services of some of those roads slowed they converted their long distance coaches to commuter cars by adding additional seating. In other cases railroads that operated no commuter services sold long distance coaches to railroads that operated commuter services for conversion to high capacity commuter coaches. There always seemed to be a ready market for good used coaches right up to the time of Amtrak and even beyond in some cases.
The Canadian National Railway appeared to overbuild when they had Canadian Car & Foundry build and deliver 218 eighty-seat coaches 5437-5654 between January and July 1954. This group of coaches would probably become the most widely rebuilt and remodeled group of coaches owned by any Railroad, with the entire group having seating reduced to 76 within the first two years of service. Some of these coaches were rebuilt to Snack Coaches, Lounge Cars, Club Car, Dining Lounge Cars, Coach Crew Dormitory Cars, and in one instance even a business car complete with open platform observation. Still others were rebuilt to Dayniter Coaches, and even Dining cars.
In 1956 the new CB&Q DENVER ZEPHYRS introduced the Slumbercoach to the rail traveling public. These cars with 24 private single rooms and 8 private double rooms were the answer for several railroads to attract increased coach ridership. The fare for space in the Slumbercoach was based on your coach ticket plus $7.00 for a single room as a room charge between Chicago and Denver or Colorado Springs. If the new Budd built Slumbercoach had been even five years earlier it would probably have been much more widely accepted. Here was the car that made all the privacy afforded a Pullman Passenger traveling in a Duplex Roomette available to the coach passenger for a much lower fare. The Slumbercoach rooms offered the coach passenger
The Slumbercoach rooms offered the coach passenger his own seating, sink, toilet, and bed in complete privacy. Initially these cars operated on the B&O, MP, NYC, NP, and CB&Q. By the time of Amtrak’s take over only the BN (ex CB&Q and NP) and B&O were operating the original Slumbercoaches from Budd and PC was operating the converted Sleeping cars from Budd.
The remainder of this book is a Railroad by Railroad look at the Streamlined coaches and the trains they operated in


The Slumbercoach revived the old Tourist Sleeper concept popular until the late 1940’s, although not quite as much space was available to the Slumbercoach patron it was provided for a much lower fare than its Pullman contemporary. Although the Milwaukee Road would build new Touralux cars (Milwaukee Roads name for Tourist Sleeping cars for their OLMPIAN HIAWATHA). Canada’s two major roads would operate modernized Tourist Sleepers in their most famous postwar streamlined train the Canadian Pacific Railways CANADIAN and the Canadian National
Railway SUPER CONTINENTAL.

TTFN AL

[siberianmo]

TUESDAY’s INFO & SUMMARY of POSTS

We open at 6 AM, all time zones. (Don’t ask how we do that!)[swg]

G’day! Here we are again – Tuesday, time for the guys to fill up the coffee cups and check out the menu board for our <traditional> and <light> breakfasts. Also, don’t neglect The Mentor Village Bakery pastry case![swg]


Daily Wisdom

I need to go shopping for clothes to shop in. (Yogi-ism)


Info for the Day:

* Weekly Calendar:

Wednesday Pike Perspective’s Day!
Thursday Fish ‘n Chips Nite!
Friday Pizza Nite! & Steak ‘n Fries Nite!
Saturday Steak ‘n Trimmin’s Nite!

RR Book Relay – First mailing yesterday![tup]


SUMMARY

Name …..…………… Date/Time …..…..………. (Page#) .. Remarks

(1) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 05:17:35 (227) Inclusive Post, etc.

(2) siberianmo Tom Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 05:34:08 (227) Mondays’ Info & Summary

(3) passengerfan Al Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 06:05:24 (227) Streamliner #46

(4) ftwNSengineer P Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 06:26:26 (228) Inclusive Post! & Federal Express Finale

(5) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 06:57:08 (228) Inclusive Post, etc.

(6) coalminer3 CM3 Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 08:44:01 (228) Covered the bases!

(7) ftwNSengineer CM3 Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 08:53:24 (228) etc.

(8) siberianmo Tom Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 11:12:18 (228) Acknowledgments, etc.

(9) passengerfan Al Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 12:07:06 (228) Streamlined observations

(10) siberianmo Tom Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 12:15:38 (228) Something special!

(11) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 14:28:46 (228) etc.

(12) siberianmo Tom Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 15:45:26 (228) NOSTALGIA #62 – Ad, California Zephyr (1949)

(13) LoveDomes Lars Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 15:57:04 (228) SIRT, final, etc.

(14) pwolfe Pete Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 16:45:56 (228) He’s baaaaaaaack!

(15) West Coast S Dave Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 17:31:50 (228) Chat

(16) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 18:57:25 (228) Time Machine & WHR

(17) passengerfan Al Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 19:34:31 (228) Streamliner #47

(18) siberianmo Tom Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 19:45:38 (228) Acknowledgments, etc.

(19) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 20:12:57 (228) Nite cap

(20) siberianmo Tom Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 21:17:29 (228) reply to nickinwestwales


NOW SHOWING at The Mentor Village Emporium Theatre:

. . . January 23rd thru 28th: Denver and Rio Grande (1952) starring Edmond O’Brien, Sterling Hayden & Dean Jagger


That’s it! [tup][;)]

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]
Proprietor of “Our” Place, an adult eating & drinking establishment!

[siberianmo]

Yo Nick!

Looking forward to the pix - B&W or color, mox nix![swg] Appreciate your willingness to participate - really helps keep this thing going![tup]

The Can-Am will never be dismantled or sold, not in what's left of my lifetime! That's a given. However, maybe I should include you in my will.[swg]

Sawing wood and digging post holes just fatigues me beyond belief. Wonder why that is[?] Hmmmmmmm. Anyway, catch ya in the 'morrow.

Leon the Night Man has the bar. Just check this guy out. Tonight he's wearing his white "spats" over those spiffy shined combat boots, white cummerbund, leather bikers outfit with red bandana. Cool, eh[?][swg] Boris put Tex down and ring the bell. A round on the house, Gents![tup]

Tom[4:-)] [oX)] [zzz]

[nickinwestwales]

Whoops,forgot to mention-next sundays pix contribution will be a (mostly B+W) W.H.R selection-won`t do justice to the scenery but should put some flesh on the bones of the story,given that most of you won`t have a clue what I`ve been wittering on about.
TOM -hope the URL will be of use,sorry about wrong spelling (standards slipping all over dontchaknow )-If a change of scale is in the wind,give us first refusal on the H.0-I can always sell the car or a couple of guitars [swg],right bed time,more holes to dig tomorrow-just been for a ten minute random net-surf-boy theres some weird *** out there,makes me feel quite normal by comparison,a quick rum and its the moonlight mile for me-be lucky gentlemen all,nick[C=:-)]

[siberianmo]

Good Evenin’!

An interesting day, packed with more RR information than my tired old eyes have time to take in. Good stuff, Gents – very much appreciated and in keeping with the theme of ”Our” Place which is Classic Trains![tup][tup][tup]

Hope you had the opportunity to check out those “coasters” that Pete brought back from Merry Olde, if not, scroll back a bit and check ‘em out by clicking on the URL.

Some acknowledgments:

passengerfan Al
Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 12:07:06

These compilations of yours are simply chock full of “good stuff,” but way to much to digest in one sitting (speaking ONLY for myself). I always get back to ‘em, though and through ‘em. Very informative and well done.[tup][tup][tup]

nickinwestwales Nick
Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 14:28:46

Appreciate the URL – which should be http://www.s-scale-rr.com/ (had to back out the extraneous character) Now that I have the S-Capades, I’m more and more convinced that 1:64 is by far the best scale in the hobby. The expense, however, would gag a healthy maggot, that’s the rub along with a rather sparse selection of road names, locos and rolling stock. Thanx again!

LoveDomes Lars
Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 15:57:04

If any of you noticed Lars’ Post with my cyber name, you weren’t seeing things. [%-)] He sent it to me for Posting since he was having difficulty accessing the web. Once he got back on line, I deleted my version.

Nice finale for the SIRT story. It was an interesting railroad with a rather storied history in the chapters of NYC transit. Good job![tup][tup][tup]

pwolfe Pete
Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 16:45:56

Good to have you back amongst us, Mate! Have a Bathams on me![tup]

West Coast S Dave
Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 17:31:50

Holding off on that round you bought – we seem to be out of mineral water ‘round here! Not following your “upscale” thinking. Huh[?][%-)][%-)]

Interesting commentary about the California Zephyr, a train I never traveled aboard.

nickinwestwales Nick
Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 18:57:25

I like the Time Machine approach to story telling – pulling the red lever really works![swg] Good stuff with the WHR![tup][tup][tup]

Thanx for the Keiths by the by!

passengerfan Al
Posted: 23 Jan 20-6, 19:34:31

Back again and this time with Streamliner #47![wow] Just “happens” to be right on topic![swg] Thanx for the round![tup]


Later!

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]


Stick around a few minutes AFTER POSTING - The information you MISS may be for YOU!

Those who acknowledge the other guy, get acknowledged!

[passengerfan]

Good Evening Tom and the rest of the gang. Time for a CR and a round for the house.
Since I have to be up early and on my way to the VA for a check up I am doing the column tonight.

PASSENGERFAN AL'S STREAMLINER CORNER # 47

VISTA-DOME CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR CB&Q – D&RGW – WP Trains 17-18 March 20, 1949 Chicago – San Francisco daily each direction 2,532 miles 56 hours

CONSIST ONE leaving Chicago for Oakland

(Chicago – Denver)
9960A CB&Q EMD F3A 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

9960B CB&Q EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

9960C CB&Q EMD F3A 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

(Denver – Salt Lake City)
6001 D&RGW ALCO PA-1 2,000 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

6002 D&RGW ALCO PB-1 2,000 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

6003 D&RGW ALCO PA-1 2,000 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

(Salt Lake City – Oakland)
801A WP EMD F3A 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

801B WP EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

801C WP EMD F3B 1,500 HP Diesel Passenger Booster Unit

802 SILVER STAG WP Baggage Car

4718 SILVER LARIAT CB&Q 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach
(Women & Children)

1107 SILVER MUSTANG D&RGW 24- Revenue Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach

817 SILVER THISTLE WP 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach

251 SILVER LOUNGE CB&Q 24- Seat Vista Dome 19- Seat Coffee Shop 7- Seat Lounge 17- Crew Dormitory Car

864 SILVER PALISADE WP 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

861 SILVER ARROYO CB&Q 10- Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

195 SILVER RESTAURANT CB&Q 48- Seat Dining Car

400 SILVER MAPLE CB&Q 16-Section Sleeping Car

1133 SILVER CREEK CB&Q 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car (New York – Oakland)

375 SILVER HORIZON CB&Q 24- Seat Vista-Dome 3-Double Bedroom 1-Drawing Room Buffet 12-seat Lounge 17- Seat Lounge Observation

CONSIST TWO

904 SILVER BUFFALO CB&Q Baggage Car

1105 SILVER BRONCO D&RGW 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach
(Womens & Childrens)

4719 SILVER RANCH CB&Q 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach

816 SILVER SCOUT WP 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Seat Leg-Rest Coach

250 SILVER CLUB CB&Q 24-Seat Vista Dome 19- Seat Coffee Shop 7-Seat Lounge 17-Crew Dormitory Car

1131 SILVER SUMMIT D&RGW 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

863 SILVER MOUNTAIN WP 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

193 SILVER CAFÉ CB&Q 48- Seat Dining Car

871 SILVER PALM WP 16-Section Sleeping Car

866 SILVER BAY WP 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car (New York – Oakland)

377 SILVER SOLARIUM CB&Q 24- Seat Vista Dome 3-Double Bedroom 1-Drawing Room Buffet 12-seat Lounge 17- Seat Lounge Observation

CONSIST THREE

1100 SILVER ANTELOPE D&RGW Baggage Car

4717 SILVER LODGE CB&Q 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Coach
(Women & Children)

814 SILVER SAGE WP 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach

815 SILVER SCHOONER WP 24- Seat Vista Dome 46-Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach

252 SILVER ROUNDUP CB&Q 24- Seat Vista Dome 19- Seat Coffee Shop 7- Seat Lounge 17- Crew Dormitory Car

427 SILVER FALLS CB&Q 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

862 SILVER CANYON WP 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

194 SILVER DINER CB&Q 48- Seat Dining Car

1121 SILVER PINE D&RGW 16-Section Sleeping Car

8449 SILVER RAPIDS PRR 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car (New York – Oakland)

376 SILVER PENTHOUSE CB&Q 24- Seat Vista Dome 3-Double Bedroom 1-Drawing Room Buffet 12-Seat Lounge 17- Seat Lounge Observation


CONSIST FOUR

903 SILVER BEAR CB&Q Baggage Car

811 SILVER DOLLAR WP 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach
(Women & Children)

4720 SILVER RIFLE CB&Q 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach

1108 SILVER PONY D&RGW 24-Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach

832 SILVER HOSTEL WP 24- Seat Vista Dome 19- Seat Coffee Shop 7- Seat Lounge 17-Crew Dormitory Car

428 SILVER VALLEY CB&Q 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

1132 SILVER GORGE D&RGW 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

842 SILVER PLATTER WP 48-Seat Dining Car

401 SILVER LARCH CB&Q 16-Section Sleeping Car

867 SILVER SURF WP 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car (New York – Oakland)

881 SILVER CRESCENT 24- Seat Vista Dome 3-Double Bedroom 1-Drawing Room Buffet 12- Seat Lounge 17- Seat Lounge Observation

CONSIST FIVE

801 SILVER BEAVER WP Baggage Car

4716 SILVER BRIDLE 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach
(Women & Children)

813 SILVER PALACE WP 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach

4721 SILVER SADDLE CB&Q 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach

1140 SILVER SHOP D&RGW 24- Seat Vista Dome 19-Seat Coffee Shop 7-Seat Lounge 17-Crew Dormitory Car

865 SILVER RANGE WP 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

425 SILVER BUTTE CB&Q 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

1115 SILVER BANQUET D&RGW 48-Seat Dining Car

872 SILVER POPLAR 16-Section Sleeping Car

1134 SILVER GLACIER D&RGW 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car (New York – Oakland)

1145 SILVER SKY D&RGW 24- Seat Vista Dome 3-Double Bedroom 1-Drawing Room Buffet 12-seat Lounge 17-Seat Lounge Observation

CONSIST SIX

905 SILVER COYOTE CB&Q Baggage Car

812 SILVER FEATHER WP 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach
(Women & Children)

1106 SILVER COLT D&RGW 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach

4722 SILVER STIRRUP CB&Q 24- Seat Vista Dome 46- Revenue Seat Leg-Rest Coach

831 SILVER CHALET WP 24- Seat Vista Dome 19-Seat Coffee Shop 7-Seat Lounge 17-Crew Dormitory Car

1130 SILVER PASS D&RGW 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

426 SILVER CLIFF CB&Q 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

841 SILVER PLATE WP 48-Seat Dining Car

1120 SILVER ASPEN D&RGW 16-Section Sleeping Car

423 SILVER POINT CB&Q 10-Roomette 6-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car (New York – Oakland)

882 SILVER PLANET WP 24- Seat Vista Dome 3-Double Bedroom 1-Drawing Room Buffet 12-seat Lounge 17-Seat Lounge Observation



One additional Sleeping Car a 6-Double Bedroom 5-Compartment was added to each of the six consists in September 1952 train lined to the rear of the Dining Car.

CB&Q
450 SILVER DOVE
451 SILVER QUAIL
452 SILVER THRUSH
WP
851 SILVER CRANE
852 SILVER SWALLOW
D&RGW
1135 SILVER GULL

TTFN AL

[nickinwestwales]

Well here we are again,ready to rock`n`roll-[4:-)]TOM,I`ll take a Starop,a Keiths for yourself ( at a guess) and brews of choice for the company..lovely job,good man [^]
O.K-earlier on CM3 made mention of a time machine,well,given the slightly esoteric nature of the transport pool available here ( Zeppelins,Rickshaws,fully chopped & standard Triumph Bonnevilles et al ) it will come as no suprise that a rummage through the murky depths of the back shed has revealed a TARDIS ( one for the whovites here) in apparently pristine condition.
Having evicted the chickens,mice,raccoons and other squatters and given it a cursory dusting down we are now ready for a test flight,so,lets set the dials for North Wales,circa 1877 pull the big red lever and hold on VERY tightly...................................

The Welsh Highland Railway had its origins in three other companies:- the North Wales Narrow Gauge Rly,which commenced pass ops in the above year.The Portmadoc,Beddgelert & South Snowdon Rly of 1901(which consisted of a steam engine,6 electric locos,which may or may not have been delivered,and 2 over-bridges which were never used & to this day stand in splendid isolation at the south end of Beddgelert village) and the horse worked Croesor tramway of 1863/4 which linked slate quarries to the west of Blaenau Ffestiniog with Portmadoc harbour
Of these,the N.W.N.G was the most significant,forming the northern section of the later W.H.R.
The N.W.N.G commenced it`s run from Dinas Jn on the L.N.W.R (later L.M.S) Caernavon-Afon Wen branch ( for those of you with maps to hand,this line followed the coast south to join the Cambrian Rys (later G.W.R) Aberystwyth-Pwlhelli line).
From Dinas it struck out east to Tryfan Jn where a branch south to Bryngwyn served both the village of that name and the slate quarries on the north flank of Moel Tryfan.
The main line continued east to Waunfawr before turning gradually south to run across the west flank of Snowdon,past Quellyn lake to the eventual terminus at Rhyd Ddu.
The initial motive power consisted of a pair of 0-6-4 single fairlie side tanks built by the Vulcan foundry in 1875 ( Moel Tryfan & Snowdon Ranger ) augmented in 1908 by a 3rd Fairlie (Gowrie) provided by Hunslet and purchased in anticipation of the long hoped for extension south to Portmadoc.
In the event,`Gowrie` proved to be a poor steamer and was ,with typical Welsh pragmatism,unloaded on the war office in 1916 at an inflated price
That year also saw the passenger service abandoned ( permanently in the case of the Bryngwyn branch ) freight being carried on an as required basis thereafter.
The W.H.R story proper starts in 1923,when the line finally made it south,through the delightful picture-postcard village of Beddgelert,down through the Aberglaslyn pass and into Portmadoc,where it crossed the G.W.R line at grade before running through the streets to join the Festiniog Rly in a somewhat awkward junction at Harbour Stn.
Given that the line travelled through an extremely sparsely populated area and mineral traffic receipts had been steadily declining for years,it should never have been built and indeed was in receivership by 1927.
The ailing company was leased by the Festiniog Ry from 1/7/1934 but saw it`s last passenger train on 26th sept 1936,finally closing on 1st July 1937.
The rails were lifted during 1941 as part of the war effort.
As to stock,the W.H.R commenced operations with the single surviving Fairlie `Moel Tryfan` plus the P.B&S.S.R loco,Hunslet 2-6-2 tank `Russell`of 1906 (still extant & in working order [^] ) these were augmented with ex W.D Baldwin 4-6-0t #590 (1917).
`Moel Tryfan `survived until 1954 whilst #590 lasted until 1942.
All were too large for the Festiniog`s restricted tunnel clearances and both Tryfan & Russell were mutilated/modified in an attempt to use them, although unsucessfully.
Operationally,the line was run as two halves,with W.H.R locos & crew working from Dinas to Beddgelert and Festiniog crews running the little `England ` engines ( see yesterdays pix ) on the southern section (the big Festiniog double Fairlies` { see nicks pix album shots#61} were not generally used,probably because of the light traffic on offer,although there are records of them running up to Beddgelert for trial purposes.
On a happier note,the line is now being relaid south from Caernavon and last I heard had reached Rhyd-Ddu once again under Festiniog auspices,this time using ex-south african Beyer-Garretts and Funkey diesels ( nicks pix#62)
to confuse the issue further there is also the W.H.R.(1964) company,who own the Portmadoc New stn site,Russell and a degree of moral high ground.(yesterdays pix)
They & the Festers have been at loggerheads for many years,although I understand the hatchet has now been buried and Russell may soon,once again, be seen traversing some of the most beautiful and dramatic scenery Wales has to offer.
For anyone interested,the W.H.R website has a `trip down the line `photo gallery at either www.WHR.co.uk or www.Bangor.ac.uk/m/whr
O.K,thats enough from me,set the controls for `Our Place,2006` and pull the big red lever again,speak soon,all the best,nick [C=:-)]
Right Boris-in the absense of TEDS moderating influence,floggings will continue until staff morale improves

[West Coast S]

Afternoon Tom and the gang.. Well, well one must just about reserve a seat at the bar these days, shall we put Boris in a Mess Dress uniform in keeping with our new found entertainment status ? A round of Monet, mineral water with a key lime twist. Welcome back PWolf and Nick, appreciate the coasters and good to know you both are keeping well.

Tom, the CZ never got its just due in my opinion, for that matter, the WP was pretty much unknown until its demise that propelled it from its former obscurity to fame..

I'm sure we all have that certain medium to small size road that is no longer among us that is fondly recalled.... It was risky and bold of WP to commit to the expense and reputation of operating a first class passenger train, that had nothing to offer but comfort and scenery to the traveling public, if you had to get east or west quickly, one chose the Overland route, if liesure and supreme comfort was your goal the CZ was the way to travel, so proclaimed savy travellers of the time.

Sleep well, along with all your departed sisters, your likes shall never pass this way again.


Dave

[pwolfe]

Hi Tom and all.

A pint of the usual and a round please on my return to Our Place[tup].

We had a great trip to the old land.Although I was not able to see NICK( the only day the trains over there were not reliable) it was great to talk on the phone. Many thanks to TOM and as a bonus I was able to see the CAN-AM in person absolutely wonderful [wow][yeah]

The bar has been busy while I've been away and I'll catch up before telling about the trip. Hope you like the Beer-Mats GOOD TO BE BACK PETE.

[LoveDomes]

Hello Tom and whoever else may be stopping by!

Looks like another successful Sunday Photo Posting Day! at Captain Tom’s Place. [tup] Cheers to all who took the time and made the effort to contribute![tup]

I’ve established an account with PhotoBucket and try to stay a step ahead by doing a little here and there so that when the weekend rolls around, I’m ready. I think Tom “taught” me that![swg]

How about a bit of JD on the rocks today and one of those great looking roast beef sandwiches[?] Skip the potato salad. Here’s a ten spot for a round on me. By the way, Pete those are interesting brews! Skip the JD, and let me have one of those Holden's Special Bitters![swg]

Today is another installment on my S.I.R.T. essay – part three and the last.

Caveat: These ramblings are not necessarily in order of events, but rather a free-flow of my thoughts and notes at the time of preparation. Therefore, it will not be uncommon for the reader to experience a back and forth reference to time and places as I proceed through this effort.

Shortly after the war to end all wars came to its conclusion, there was a “hum” about the Island regarding the anticipated arrival of property buyers for locations along the S.I.R.T. routes. This was brought about by expectations of a subway tunnel connecting Staten Island with Brooklyn. While the tunnel idea fell into the heap of good ideas and well intentions nevermore to be, the Island did experience some positive impact as a result of the excitement.

By the mid 1920’s electrification was completed for the South Beach, Tottenville and North Shore Lines, in that order. The idea being if BMT subways were in fact to arrive on the Island, compatibility would most assuredly be a demand. So, the project met with approval and the S.I.R.T. entered into a new era of electrification. One hundred 67 ft.-cars, similar in design to those of the GMT were placed in use thereby completing the matrix of compatibility issues.

In 1925, tunnel headings were made in Staten Island and across the Narrows in Brooklyn. As mentioned previously, the tunnel idea was scrapped that same year. Due to a host of issues, least of which centered about the obstructionist stance taken by Mayor John Hylan, who had a history of opposition to virtually anything proposed by the BMT. Additionally, fingers were pointed at Governor Alfred E. Smith and his connection as a share holder of the Pennsylvania Railroad, a major competitor of the S.I.R.T.’s parent road, the Baltimore & Ohio.

All during the WWII years, with gasoline rationed and a population hard at work to support the war effort through attendant industries (shipyards, munitions plants, etc.) the S.I.R.T. enjoyed profitable revenues and accompanying ridership numbers. However, shortly after the war ended, some set backs took place.

In 1946, a major fire destroyed the St. George Ferry Terminal, which also was the terminus for the three lines of the S.I.R.T. Eight cars were lost and eight damaged along with one ticket agent burned to death. It took until 1951 for the terminal and new rail facility to be completed, but by then America’s fondness for automobiles had clearly reversed the fortunes of the S.I.R.T.

In 1947, the “Blizzard of ‘47” paralyzed all outdoor operations, giving pause to many insofar as alternatives were concerned. The following year, the NYC Board of Review sank another “nail in the coffin” with its control over virtually all transit systems, excepting the S.I.R.T. and a few others. That control enabled the Board to offer fare cuts and generous transfers for and between buses and subways. With the Ferry at 5 cents a trip, and an Island bus system perhaps the best in the City, the S.I.R.T. “folded the tent” on its South Beach and North Shore Lines in 1953. The only reason the Tottenville Line (the longest route) survived was due to an arrangement to have the Island bus system serve as “feeders” along the route, otherwise it surely would have closed.

Today, the trains still run between St. George and Tottenville. The NYC MTA took over passenger operations in 1971 and the line is referred to as the Staten Island Railway. 1973 witnessed the end of the “old’ cars, with the more modern and fully compatible-with-NYC-subway R44 cars pressed into service.

For me and those who have “history” with the S.I.R.T., it will always be called that. To this day I have just a wee bit of difficulty accepting the look of the train as it pulls into the station. Somehow, I’m taken by the absence of those brownish cars of old. RIP, S.I.R.T.


An interesting URL to browse is: http://www.nycsubway.org/nyc/sirt/


Until the next time!

Lars

[siberianmo]

G’day All!

PASSENGER TRAIN NOSTALGIA #62

Here’s something to enjoy regarding the California Zephyr from a 1949 advertisement in my personal collection.


Luxurious comfort at economy saving fares in new VISTA-DOME chair coaches.

Feminine as a boudoir in the women’s lounge. Men’s lounges equally complete.

Enjoy delicious meals and personalized service in the California Zephyr’s beautiful dining car.

”SCENIC-WAY” TO CALIFORNIA TAKE THE VISTA-DOME
. . . . . . . . . . CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR . . . . . . . . . .

Extra Pleasure * Extra Comfort * No Extra Fare

“Scenic way” is right!” Only the amazing new California Zephyr gives you the double thrill of riding the most wonderful train in the world right through America’s most wonderful scenery./ And what a way to see it! The new VISTA-DOME way! Now you can look ahead . . . look up . . . look down . .l . look everywhere . . . while you glide in luxurious comfort through the magnificent Colorado Rockies and Feather River Canyon in daylight hours . . . Utah and Nevada by starlight or moonlight. Your choice of low cost VISTA-DOME reclining chair coaches or new type Pullman accommodations, drawing rooms, bedrooms, roomettes and sections. Through sleeper daily between New York and San Francisco.

NEW, FASTER DAILY SCHEDULES

WESTBOUND (Read Down) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . EASTBOUND (Read Up)
. 3:30 PM Lv – Chicago . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Ar 1:30 PM
11:59 PM Lv – Omaha . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Ar 4:55 AM
. 1:19 AM Lv – Lincoln . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Ar 3:40 AM
. 8:40 AM Lv – Denver . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Ar 7:00 PM

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Colorado Rockies . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
. 1:53 PM Lv – Glenwood Springs . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Lv 1:35 PM
10:25 PM Lv – Salt Lake City . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Lv 5:40 AM

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Feather River . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
. 7:00-11:00 AM . . . . . . . . . . .Canyon . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2:00-6:00 PM
12:28 PM Lv – Sacramento . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Lv 12:50 PM
. 1:34 PM Ar – Stockton . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Lv 11:53 AM
. 4:00 PM Ar – Oakland . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Lv 9:44 AM
. 4:50 PM Ar – San Francisco . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Lv 9:00 AM

BURLINGTON * RIO GRANDE * WESTERN PACIFIC




Enjoy!

Tom [4:-)][oX)]

[nickinwestwales]

Well hey-now PETE can enjoy his preferred pint of Bathams with an appropriate matching coaster-this place is definately going up market-we`ll have punters demanding clean glasses next [swg].
Just a quick `dust cutter` for me please Boss,busy collating info for a little North Wales land cruise to share with you all later on-a thumb nail portrait of the Welsh Highland Railway,one of those `never should have been` financial disasters that underdog fans like me find so irresistable[^]
TOM-mention of the `S` capades reminds me-found this in an M.R. special www.S-scale-RR.com,a bunch of links & stuff apparently,put together by a guy name of Ed Loizeaux who has a big N.Y.C spread,prob. old news but might be useful for bits`n`bobs
see you all later,nick [C=:-)]

[siberianmo]

Hey Guys!

Check out what Pete brought back to "Our" Place from Merry Olde!



Click on the URL to enlarge:
http://photobucket.com/albums/b222/siberianmo/Beer%20Can%20Collection/?action=view¤t=d93fbc0d.jpg

Ring the bell, Boris! Let's all have one of each![tup][tup][tup]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[passengerfan]

Good Morning Tom, Time for another coffee and one more crumpet. You suggested I move the Observation article over here so I shall.

STREAMLINED OBSERVATIONS
OF THE
UNITED STATES
&
CANADA

By Al


Introduction

With the dawn of the streamline era in North America came the birth of the streamlined observation, a car type that was to grace the rear of most of the finest streamliners in the land. With few exceptions every major named streamlined train in North America featured a streamlined observation bringing up the markers.
The streamlined Observations were those cars that were designed for end of train operation giving a streamlined appearance in most cases to the end of the streamliner. They came in Blind end with no windows to view to the rear. Blunt or squared off end that came with windows and a center door with window as well, and also those with only a small emergency door in the rear with window such as Southern Pacific postwar. Many of the blunt end Observations were fitted with a diaphragm to enable them to be used mid-train if necessary. Many of the Observations had swallow-tailed or rounded ends; these were the most pleasing to the eye.
And in the case of the Milwaukee Road who built the majority of their streamlined Observations they were unique to that road the prewar Beavertails and postwar Skytop Observations.
Prior to the streamline era heavyweight observations came in three basic types Open Platform, Solarium end Observations and Western railroads such as the CNR, CPR, CMSTP&P, D&RGW, NP and SP offered the Mountain Observation.
This latter type the Mountain Observation resembled nothing more than a conventional heavyweight car with the area from the windows up cut away, an awning like covering supported by lightweight stanchions. Other Mountain Observations resembled a coach in the center section complete with windows and extended length Open Platforms at either end of this center section. In the case of the Canadian Pacific they installed panes of glass in the roof of the enclosed center section. Most of these Mountain Observations were older cars cut down for this purpose. The Mountain Observations as the name implies were used in the mountainous regions of these roads for daylight operation in the summer months only. Passengers were able to enjoy the magnificent mountain scenery that these cars provided up close and personal. The Milwaukee Road was still operating Mountain Observations through their Electrified territories in daylight hours as recently as the summer of 1952 in the secondary COLUMBIAN trains that operated between Seattle - Tacoma and Chicago. The two major Canadian Roads the Canadian National and Canadian Pacific were both operating Mountain Observations as late as 1954 on their transcontinental trains in the mountains of Alberta and British Columbia.
The heavyweight Solarium Observations were popular with railroads operating in colder climates and were assigned to trains on a year round basis. The rear quarter of the Solarium Observations was known as the sunroom. The two most popular types had either two large windows or three large windows down each side at the sunroom end. Those Solariums with six seats in the sunrooms were those cars with two large windows on each side at the rear of the car. While those with three large windows on each side at the rear denoted those cars with seating for eight in the sunroom or solarium end. Most Solarium Observations were fitted with a diaphragm at the sunroom end as well. The rear of these cars resembled a regular passenger car except for the fact they had a door in the center with a large glass pane and a large window on either side of this door for passengers in the sunroom to see to the rear.
The heavyweight Open Platform Observation as the name implies provided an Open Platform for passengers to enjoy the passing scenery from. Some of these platforms were not meant for passengers to enjoy in the case of one railroad whose Open Platforms measured but 14 inches. Many of the Open Platforms were five or six feet and several extended for eight or even ten feet being recessed into the car sides. Some heavyweight Open Platform Observations featured an upright post in each outside corner attached to the corners of the open platforms to help support the car roof overhang. These types of Open Platform Observations quickly earned the nickname Four Posters for their resemblance to Canopy beds.
Heavyweight Open Platform Observations generally featured a lighted round tail sign with the train's name centered on the brass railing that surrounded the open platform. The open Platforms were equipped with brass gates in the railing to permit one to descend to the ground or a center gate in the rear that permitted access to a trailing car. It was on this center gate that the lighted tail sign was most often mounted.
The CB&Q carried two lighted square tail signs on either side of the Open Platforms center gate hung from the Brass railing. New York Central preferred square tail signs hung from the brass railing of many of their finest trains, in the case of their SOUTHWEST LIMITED they hung oval tail signs from the brass railing.
Rival PRR preferred tail-signs in the shape of their Keystone herald.
While heavyweight Solarium Observations generally featured two lighted tail signs one under each rear facing window one proclaiming the operating Railroad the other the train name (CB&Q). Of course there would be exceptions to those placements, for instance the DL&W LACKAWANNA LIMITED carried the trains lighted drumhead sign hanging from the Solarium Observations safety gate.
Two cars built with minuscule Open Platforms later had diaphragms installed with the brass railing remaining intact on either side of this addition, these two cars were the COMMANDER - IN - CHIEF and AMERICAN REVOLUTION bringing up the markers of the C&O GEORGE WASHINGTONS.
Another feature found on many of the heavyweight Open Platform Observations was the overhanging awning or sunshade attached to the Open Platform overhanging roof. This was generally made of Canvas and painted; the reason for painting the canvas was to stiffen it to prevent flapping in the wind and painted the canvas was much easier to keep clean. Even when painted they were generally replaced about twice a year. Awnings of the longer varieties were usually given wooden stiffeners on the pull up type and steel stiffeners on the fixed type to hold them in place against the wind.
In the case of Canadian Pacific, Missouri Pacific, Northern Pacific, Union Pacific and Wabash some of there large heavyweight Open Platform Observations featured an enormous round dome light for the enjoyment of passengers on warm summer evenings.
Milwaukee Road heavyweight Open Platform Observations assigned to that roads OLYMPIAN featured a roof-mounted spotlight that was operated from the open platform, as did those heavyweight Observations operated on the Northern Pacific NORTH COAST LIMITED at one time. Great Northern featured similar spotlights on the roofs of their heavyweight Solarium Observations operated on the rear of the EMPIRE BUILDER.
Most railroads heavyweight Open Platform Observations had a center door permitting passenger to go from the inside of the car to the Open Platform with windows of equal size on either side of this center door. The Great Northern, Louisiana & Arkansas, Maine Central, Northern Pacific and Southern Pacific had an access door mounted on the right side when viewed from the cars interior and a very large picture window occupied the left side next to the door.
At least one railroad the Missouri Pacific experimented with a dust catcher to prevent passengers enjoying the Open Platform from being covered by dust. The MP attached a square frame the width of the platform with the opening covered with canvas mounted to either side of the coupler poling pockets. Two poles were attached to the top of the brass railing and extended out from the rear to the far side of this frame covered in canvas approximately six feet. The devise took two men less than five minutes to install or remove. No record exists as to whether it was successful or not. Dust and cinders were things one had to contend with when riding the open platforms. When operating at slower speeds in the mountains or terminal trackage riding the open platforms was a pleasant experience, but few passengers except young railfan braved the open platforms at most other times. I know of only one young railfan foolish enough to brave riding the open platform between Seattle and Spokane in February 1958 on the CASCADIAN when a heavyweight Open Platform was substituting for the train's regular car. After completion of that eastward trip he wondered if warmth and feelings would ever return to his numbed body.
Interiors of heavyweight Observations came in a wide variety ranging from Coach, Dining, Parlor, Lounge and Sleeper, also combinations of the previously mentioned types. Some of these cars also were equipped with Barber Shops, Buffets, Showers, Card Rooms, Libraries, Soda Fountains and Valet facilities.
The heavyweight Observations featured Clerestory, Rounded, flat, and even the Harriman style roofs.
Heavyweight Observations were carried on the rear of not only railroads premier passenger trains, but also most secondary trains and even many local trains. Many of these latter trains carried a Dining - Coach Observation or Coach Dining Lounge Observation.
Many of the heavyweight Solarium Observations were equipped with Diaphragms on the rear as were a few of the Open Platform Observations. The latter with diaphragms looked quite ghastly. With few exceptions the railroads during the heavyweight era realized that Observations belonged on the rear with no cars after them. Besides the railroad needed someplace to hang there lighted drumhead signs from so the world would know what train was passing and what railroad owned that train.
With the coming of the streamliners came an infinite variety of lightweight streamlined Observations. Lightweight Streamlined Observations came in Blind end, Square end or blunt end, round end, Swallow Tail or Taper end, Sloping or Beavertail end and Open Platform ends.
Interiors of lightweight streamlined Observations were configured in Coach, Coach Lounge, Coach Parlor Lounge, Coach Buffet Lounge, Sleeper, Sleeper Lounge, Sleeper Buffet Lounge, Parlor Lounge, Tavern Bar Lounge, Tavern Bar Buffet Lounge, Dining Lounge, Dining Parlor Lounge, Dormitory Sleeper Buffet Lounge, Dome Sleeper Buffet Lounge, Dome Sleeper, Dome Parlor Lounge, Dome Coach Lounge, and yes even one conversion to a Coach - Baggage configuration.
The four major North American Car manufacturers and one foreign Car manufacturer constructed lightweight Streamlined Observations. The Pullman Standard Company constructed the greatest number of lightweight streamlined Observations over 170 between the 1930’s and mid 1950’s. The Budd Company of Philadelphia came in second with over 140 including the final two built in 1956 for the CB&Q DENVER ZEPHYRS. American Car & Foundry produced 44 for U.S. Railroads. St. Louis Car Company built 7 in total for two different Electric Interurban Railroads. Swiss Manufacturer Schindler constructed three for the National De Mexico for the AZTEC EAGLE train sets.
Even though Pullman Standard may have constructed the greatest number of lightweight streamlined Observations rival Budd produced the greatest variety.
Twelve Railroads either built there own lightweight streamlined Observations or rebuilt and streamlined heavyweight cars to streamlined Observations. Those railroads were the following:

Baltimore & Ohio

Canadian National

Canadian Pacific

Chicago Indianapolis & Louisville

Chicago Great Western

Great Northern

Gulf Mobile & Ohio

Illinois Central

Milwaukee Road

Missouri - Kansas - Texas

New York Central

Pennsylvania

Some of the those roads did the streamlining themselves while others like the B&O in some instances and the GM&O had Pullman streamline heavyweight cars to streamlined Observations.
Pullman converted many lightweight streamlined Observations to straight coaches as their usefulness as Observations waned due to the increased costs of switching etc.
Before the ru***oward streamlining occurred in the mid-1930s there were two notable early examples that are worth mentioning.
The first of these occurred on the B&O in 1900 when the experimental Adam's Windsplitter was rebuilt from conventional cars of the day into a true streamlined six-car train. Mr. Frederick Upham Adams design for the train included streamlining a locomotive as well something the B&O refused to do. The tender did receive streamlining to match the cars. After about a year of testing in the Baltimore - Washington area the cars were stripped of they're streamlining and returned to regular service. Most streamlined trains that followed thirty and forty years later recognized the contributions to streamlining the Adam's Windsplitter ushered in. This train introduced flush mounted windows with the car sides, full width diaphragms, and flat sheet metal sides. The cars also featured skirting that enclosed the trucks; this last item quickly lost favor with the railroads in the 1930's due to the need for truck maintenance and daily inspections. The last car in the Adam's Windsplitter was an Observation that the rear of tapered to almost a point. There was a narrow door at the very end for emergency exit otherwise it would have come to a point. The Observation of the Adam's Windsplitter was numbered 435.
The second of these early streamlined Observations is credited to the Chicago Great Western for the conversion work done to three McKeen motorcars in 1928 at that roads Oelwein, Iowa shops. Two of the motorcars lost their engines and power trucks in the conversion becoming trailers. The third unit became Electro-Motives first motorcar conversion to a Gasoline Electric complete with 30' Railway Post Office Compartment and Baggage Compartment. The Power unit was assigned the number 1000 and the two trailing cars were 1001 and 1002. The 1002 is the car we are concerned with here. The 1002 emerged from rebuilding with a nicely rounded rear with an emergency door in the center. All of the former round windows the car had been built with were removed, replaced by square windows. Except for the detracting roof mounted ventilators and lack of skirting the car was otherwise quite streamlined.
When one entered car 1002 from car 1001 one would find a small kitchen on your left and Pantry with car heater on the right. Next was a small dining area with one table and four chairs on either side of the center aisle. To the rear of this dining area was a twenty-seat Coach section ten seats either side of the center aisle in five pairs. The first pair of seats on either side of the aisle faced rearward all others faced forward. These seats were not as spartan as those found in car 1001 so by today's airline standards they would be considered business class. Next was a pair of restrooms followed by the cars center entrance doors. Behind the cars center entrance doors was four Pullman sections two on either side of the center aisle. The BLUE BIRD was a day schedule the Pullman sections were for passengers going to and from the famed Mayo Clinic in Rochester. In the rounded Observation end was located thirteen Wicker chairs for the Parlor car patrons of the BLUE BIRD. The entire train was painted in Royal Blue with gold leaf lettering and trim. The BLUE BIRD was inaugurated on a daily round trip between Minneapolis and Rochester beginning January 13, 1929. This early forerunner of streamlined trains that followed fell on hard times with the coming of the great depression. The train was discontinued in 1931.
Texas & Pacific should receive the recognition they are due for the first streamlined stainless steel Observation delivered by Budd in 1933 numbered 150. The train was named the SILVER SLIPPER and the car 150 was the only racially divided Observation ever built in the United States. There were two compartments with seating for 32 each having separate restrooms. The white section was located in the observation end and also provided a twelve seat smoking section. The two-car train was a miserable failure and was soon returned to Budd where it was eventually scrapped. Observation 150 was delivered in 1933 placing it ahead of both the UP M-10000 and CB&Q ZEPHYR 9900 both delivered in 1934. But unlike either of the 1934 trains the 150 was not articulated to the rest of it’s consist.
The next two streamlined Observations to appear brought up the markers of two trains that are generally recognized as America's first truly successful streamlined trains. Both the UP M-10000 later named the CITY OF SALINA and the CB&Q 9900 ZEPHYR later named the PIONEER ZEPHYR were each three car articulated train sets. The last of the three cars in the UP train ended in a Bullet shape with no windows for viewing to the rear so it was referred to as a blind end observation. The Burlington's 9900 ZEPHYRS third car was numbered 570 and featured a swallowtail or tapered end. This car featured windows for viewing to the rear. From these two early streamlined trains would come a building boom, in streamlined passenger trains by railroads from one end of North America to the other and nearly any streamlined train that rated a name required a streamlined Observation for the markers end.
The Tapered or Swallow tailed streamlined Observation soon became the most popular type followed closely by the rounded end Observation. American Car & Foundry, Budd Company, Pullman Standard and St. Louis Car Company offered both the swallowtail and round end Observations.
The seven streamlined Observations built by St. Louis car were for two different Electric Interurban roads The Chicago North Shore and Milwaukee and the Illinois Terminal. Those for the North Shore as it was more popularly known were for two double ended four car articulated trains named the ELECTROLINERS built to operate between Chicago and Milwaukee. They used both third rail and overhead trolley pick-up for power on their daily dashes between Chicago's famed Loop and downtown Milwaukee. The North Shore ELECTROLINERS were bi-directional so turning was unnecessary at terminals. The cab end served as an observation when going in the opposite direction.
Those built for the Illinois Terminal were non-articulated and picked up power from trolley poles. The three Observations built for the Illinois Terminal were Parlor Observations.
The railroads that owned the greatest numbers of streamlined Observations were the Pennsylvania, New York Central, Milwaukee Road, Southern Pacific, Union Pacific, Santa Fe and Burlington.
Those with but a single example of streamlined Observations were the Central Of Georgia, Texas & Pacific and Western Railway of Alabama although some would argue the single example for the latter road was for use in the Southern Railways CRESCENT.
Several railroads owned no lightweight streamlined Observations at all they included Central Railroad of New Jersey, Clinchfield, Delaware & Hudson, Erie, Minneapolis & St. Louis, New York Ontario & Western, Nickel Plate Road, Northern Alberta, Ontario Northland, Pacific Great Eastern, Richmond Fredericksburg & Potomac, Rutland, Soo Line, and Spokane Portland & Seattle. All of the above had owned heavyweight Observations.
The railroad with the greatest number of railroad built or remodeled Observations was the Pennsylvania with sixteen all remodeled or built by the roads famous Altoona, Penn. Shops.
Without a doubt honors for the most interesting streamlined Observations would go to the Milwaukee Road for their Beavertail and Skytop Lounge Observations.
Canadian Nationals only lightweight streamlined Observations purchased new were the only Open Platform cars of this type purchased that were not for Business car use. These two cars BURRARD and BEDFORD featured 7 Compartments Kitchen Lounge and the Open Platform. The cars were assigned to Bankers Specials and other charter work for most of their CN service. The only regular assignment for the cars was in the AFTERNOON RAPIDOS where they served as Executive Club Cars between Montreal and Toronto.
The Canadian National, Canadian Pacific, Chicago Burlington & Quincy, National De Mexico, New York Central, Pennsylvania, Southern Pacific and Union Pacific both owned Stainless Steel and Painted Observations.
The Southern Pacific must hold the record for streamlined Observations in different paint schemes. They had DAYLIGHT Red & Orange, two tone Gray scheme of the CASCADE - LARK - SAN FRANCISCO OVERLAND, Red & Silver of the GOLDEN STATE, Yellow and Gray of the CITY OF SAN FRANCISCO, and the Stainless steel with red band above the windows of the SUNSET LIMITED. The Union Pacific's lone corrugated stainless steel Observation was from the GM TRAIN OF TOMORROW. They simply painted the car streamliner colors before assigning it to their Portland - Seattle pool train.
Atchison Topeka & Santa Fe owned only stainless steel Observations they purchased from American Car & Foundry, Budd Company and Pullman Standard.
Budd Company favorite customer Burlington owned Observations from American Car & Foundry and Pullman Standard for service in the GN EMPIRE BUILDER, WESTERN STAR and NP NORTH COAST LIMITED.
By far the honor for the strangest Observation conversion must go to the Rock Island who converted Coach Parlor Lounge Observation 455 MISSOURI into a Coach Baggage car with the Observation end serving as the Baggage end. This car was assigned to the remnant of the former CHOCTAW ROCKET. A Baggage Door was installed in each side just head of the rounded Observation end. The windows around the Observation end remained in place. But only if you were a Baggage Man or pet traveling in a cage would you enjoy the view from the rear of this Observation.
As beautiful as the lightweight streamlined Observations were gracing the rear of the finest passenger trains in the land, the truth was they required extra switching to always keep them in their place on the rear of the trains. This was true for those trains that picked up and set out cars enroute. The lightweight streamlined Observations with the blunt end could be used in mid-train operation if necessary. This was the case with ACL and SAL in their Florida Streamliners that carried two Observations in each consist one mid-train the other on the rear. The Great Northern WESTERN STAR is the only train that carried a beautiful high windowed swallow tailed Observation mid-train. This was after the GN combined the FAST MAIL and WESTERN STAR between St. Paul and Seattle. Working Mail cars were trainlined behind the power followed by the trains Baggage Car, Coaches, Diner, Sleeping Cars and MOUNTAIN suffix Lounge Observation. To the rear of the Observation storage mail cars were trainlined. The reason for this odd arrangement was quite simply the length of the train. If any other order of cars would have been tried it would have required time consuming double station stops. Some of the storage mail cars were set out in route and not having to disconnect the power made for a shorter delay in getting underway again.
Many streamlined Observations lost their distinguishing features altogether and were rebuilt to straight coaches etc. such as some of those for the Great Northern, Santa Fe and Southern Pacific. The Southern Pacific rebuilt at least two lightweight streamlined Observations into their famous 3/4 length Dome Lounge Cars losing the observation ends in the rebuilding.
Many other roads simply chose to sell off their lightweight streamlined Observations, as they were no longer needed. The NdeM was the largest buyer of used lightweight streamlined Observations.
The New York Central second largest purchaser of lightweight streamlined Observations owned none by the time of the merger with the PRR and NYNH&H in 1968 that created the Penn Central.
It was quite surprising to railroad historians when Amtrak purchased a total of 47 of these Observations.
For the scope of this book we will not cover the lightweight experimental Talgo, Aerotrain, Turbo etc. as they deserve to be covered on there own.
The following listing is of major lightweight passenger trains that were never assigned streamlined Observations.

AT&SF

HI-LEVEL EL CAPITANS

KANSAS CITY CHIEF

SAN FRANCISCO CHIEFS

TEXAS CHIEFS

CNR

SUPER CONTINENTALS

PANORAMAS

CAVALIERS

TEMPOS

CPR

ATLANTIC LIMITED

VIPER

C of G

NANCY HANKS II

C&EI

MEADOWLARK

CB&Q

AMERICAN ROYAL ZEPHYR

BLACKHAWK

CMSTP&P

CHIPPEWA HIAWATHA

PIONEER

D&RGW

PROSPECTOR
(Postwar)


GN

WINNIPEG LIMITED

L&N

GEORGIAN

GULF WIND

HUMMINGBIRD

MP

COLORADO EAGLE

LOUISIANA EAGLE

TEXAS EAGLE 1-2

TEXAS EAGLE 21 - 22

VALLEY EAGLE

NYC

DETROITER

WOLVERINE


NP

MAINSTREETER

PRR

KEYSTONE

UP

BUTTE SPECIAL

CITY OF ST. LOUIS

The following list covers named streamlined trains that operated with streamlined Observations but were never heavyweight trains prior to the streamline era.

ALTON

ABRAHAM LINCOLN

ANN RUTLEDGE

AT&SF

CHICAGOAN

EL CAPITAN

GOLDEN GATE

KANSAS CITYAN

SAN DIEGAN

TULSAN

ACL

EAST COAST CHAMPION

WEST COAST CHAMPION

B&O

CINCINNATIAN

COLUMBIAN

ROYAL BLUE

CofG

MAN O' WAR

CNR

AFTERNOON RAPIDO

CHAMPLAIN

CPR

CANADIAN

C&O

PERE MARQUETTES

C&EI

WHIPPOORWILL

CB&Q

AK-SAR-BEN ZEPHYR

CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR

DENVER ZEPHYR

GENERAL PERSHING ZEPHYR

KANSAS CITY ZEPHYR

MARK TWAIN ZEPHYR

NEBRASKA ZEPHYR

PIONEER ZEPHYR

SAM HOUSTON ZEPHYR

SILVER STREAK ZEPHYR

TWIN ZEPHYR

ZEPHYR-ROCKET

CMSTP&P

AFTERNOON HIAWATHA

MIDWEST HIAWATHA

MORNING HIAWATHA

CRI&P

CHOCTAW ROCKET

DENVER ROCKET

DES MOINES ROCKET

KANSAS CITY -
MINNEAPOLIS
ROCKET

PEORIA ROCKET

ROCKY MOUNTAIN ROCKET

TEXAS ROCKET

TWIN STAR ROCKET


C&S/FW&D

TEXAS ZEPHYR

GN

RED RIVER

GM&O/GM&N

GULF COAST REBEL

REBEL

IC

CITY OF MIAMI

CITY OF NEW ORLEANS

GREEN DIAMOND

KCS

SOUTHERN BELLE

NC&STL

CITY OF MEMPHIS

NdeM

AZTEC EAGLE

NYC

EMPIRE STATE EXPRESS

JAMES WHITCOMB RILEY

MERCURY


PRR

SOUTHWIND

READING

CRUSADER

SAL

SILVER COMET

SILVER METEOR

SILVER STAR

SOU

SOUTHERNER

TENNESSEAN

SP

MORNING DAYLIGHT

NOON DAYLIGHT

SAN JOAQUIN DAYLIGHT

SHASTA DAYLIGHT

T&NO

HUSTLER

SUNBEAM

UP

CHALLENGER

CITY OF DENVER

CITY OF LOS ANGELES

CITY OF PORTLAND

CITY OF SALINA

CITY OF SAN FRANCISCO

There are probably many trains in the above listing I have overlooked or been unable to find.
Many of the streamlined trains mentioned above originally pulled by steam so either oil smoke or cinders dusted the tops of many of the streamlined trains including the following:

ABRAHAM LINCOLN

ARIZONA LIMITED

BROADWAY LIMITED

CHIEF

CITY OF MEMPHIS

COMMODORE VANDERBILT

CRUSADER

DAYLIGHT

FIREFLY

GENERAL

JEFFERSONIAN

LARK

LIBERTY LIMITED

OVERLAND LIMITED

RED BIRD

SAN JOAQUIN DAYLIGHT

SOUTH WIND

SPIRIT OF ST. LOUIS

TEXAS SPECIAL

TRAILBLAZER

TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED


There were many trains that had operated with heavyweight Observations that when they were streamlined also assigned streamlined Observations.


HEAVYWEIGHT TRAIN NAME STREAMLINED TRAIN NAME RR


ABRAHAM LINCOLN
ABRAHAM LINCOLN ALTON

CHIEF
CHIEF AT&SF

SUPER CHIEF
SUPER CHIEF AT&SF

CAPITOL LIMITED
CAPITOL LIMITED B&O

FLYING YANKEE
FLYING YANKEE B&M/MeC

GEORGE WASHINGTON
GEORGE WASHINGTON C&O

HOOSIER LIMITED
HOOSIER MONON

TIPPECANOE
TIPPECANOE MONON


OLYMPIAN
OLYMPIAN HIAWATHA CMSTP&P

400
400 C&NW

PROSPECTOR
PROSPECTOR D&RGW



EMPIREBUILDER EMPIRE BUILDER GN

INTERNATIONAL INTERNATIONAL GN

ORIENTALLIMITED WESTERN STAR GN

PANAMALIMITED PANAMA LIMITED IC

FLYINGCROW FLYING CROW L&A/KCS

TEXASSPECIAL TEXAS SPECIAL MKT/SL-SW

COMMODAREVANDERBILT COMMODORE VANDERBILT NYC

OHIOSTATELIMITED OHIO STATE LIMITED NYC

SOUTHWESTERNLTD. SOUTHWESTERN LTD. NYC

20THCENTURYLTD. 20TH CENTURY LTD. NYC

MERCHANTSLIMITED MERCHANTS LIMITED NYNH&H

NORTHCOASTLIMITED NORTH COAST LIMITED NP

BROADWAYLIMITED BROADWAY LIMITED PRR

CONGRESSIONAL CONGRESSIONAL PRR

GENERAL GENERAL PRR

LIBERTYLIMITED LIBERTY LIMITED PRR

SENATOR SENATOR PRR

SPIRIT OF ST. LOUIS SPIRIT OF ST. LOUIS PRR

ROCKY MOUNTAIN LIMITED ROCKY MOUNTAIN ROCKET CRI&P

METEOR METEOR SL-SF

CRESCENT LIMITED CRESCENT LIMITED SOU

CASCADE LIMITED CASCADE SP

DAYLIGHT LIMITED DAYLIGHT SP

GOLDEN STATE LIMITED GOLDEN STATE CRI&P/SP

OVERLAND LIMITED SAN FRANCISCO OVERLAND SP

SHASTA
SHASTA DAYLIGHT SP





SUNSET LIMITED
SUNSET SP


TTFN AL

[siberianmo]

Good Mornin’!

Another Monday, another new start! Well, perhaps not for moi, but those of you who are working to keep ahead of the “knock at the door.”[swg]

We really had quite a decent turnout for our Sunday Photo Posting Day! Especially considering the NFL playoff games and the reality of Sunday being a bit more than just another day.[tup]

We surely missed trolleyboy Rob this weekend and especially for his pix Posting. All work and no play, makes for a dull existence![tdn] Hope to see ya at the bar real soon, wherever you are![swg]

As mentioned in the SUMMARY pwolfe Pete is back in Missouri. Give him a bit of time to get squared away, and I’m sure we’ll be enlightened with some stories from Merry Olde and of course some pix for Sunday Photo Posting Day![tup]

Also from the SUMMARY Special THANX this day to barndad Doug – LoveDomes Lars – Trainnut484 Russell - Theodorebear Ted and nickinwestwales Nick for their contributions to our Sunday Photo Posting Day![tup][tup][tup]

Some acknowledgments:

West Coast S Dave
Posted: 21 Jan 2006, 18:13:58

Regarding your Saturday visit, THANX for the kind words, the round and RR info![tup][tup] Hope the new job is working out well for you.

passengerfan Al
Posted: 21 Jan 2006, 18:41:44

Some excellent info in your Streamlined observation Post on Saturday. Surely qualifies for rePosting, given that we have sparse turnouts over the weekends and your efforts just may “tread water” in cyber space. Appreciated the round.[tup]

nickinwestwales Nick
Posted: 21 Jan 2006, 20:40:23

Cindy was in the kitchen on Saturday evening[?][?][?]

nickinwestwales Nick
Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 05:17:35

The S-Capades passenger train isn’t really a set, although loosely termed I suppose that fits. The loco was purchased separately and I was just fortunate enough to find the matching passenger cars elsewhere. As I’ve mentioned in the past, S-gauge prices will knock the socks off of most people I know. Hardly something for the beginner. Now, those Rivarossi/IHC HO locos were bought at bargain bin prices – really. I have New Haven, VIA Rail and Canadian Pacific – all twin EMD E8A/A units. If I recall, they were under $50 (US) per set. Now that’s a good price in any scale! A thing that always got my attention is that the Rivarossi and IHC products are identical in all respects. Never knew that – they must have joined up somewhere along the line.

passengerfan Al Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 06:05:24

Should be a great Super Bowl – two teams that worked hard and played their style of football through the playoffs. Seattle had some fine teams back when they were in the AFC and the fans suffered some hard times too. Nice to see some “new blood” in the big one. Am very happy for the Steelers and their fans. Looking forward to the game.

Nice Streamliner and putting out an Index when you reach 50 makes good sense.[tup]

ftwNSengineer P
Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 06:26:26 and 08:53:24

And so the story comes to a close. Compelling is the word that comes to mind. Good job![tup][tup][tup] Hope you enjoyed ALL of the pix![swg]

Theodorebear Ted
Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 06:57:08

Kind words appreciated and nice to see you this fine day![tup]

coalminer3 CM3 Posted: 23 Jan 2006, 08:44:01 (228)

A round and more quarters! What more is there to live for, eh[?][swg] Thanx!

We have so much ongoing info pouring into the archives of ”Our” Place that my guess is if we good compile it all and put a hard binder on either side, we’d have a best seller, fer sure, fer sure! Appreciate the continuing “good stuff”![tup][tup]

Haven’t heard a whole lot coming out of the latest tragedy in WVA to indicate that anything is being done to look at the entire scenario of mining. Hey – I’m ignorant about ‘what is, what should be, what outta, cudda, shudda,’ etc. But, I know enough about common sense and safety in the work place to know that something other than lip service is in order. Continuing sorrow in WVA. My positive thoughts to the families and survivors.

Steelers played one hulluva game, eh[?]


Later!

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]


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