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Classic Train Questions Part Deux (50 Years or Older)

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Posted by rcdrye on Wednesday, January 31, 2024 1:46 PM

Chicago's Union Stock Yards were at one time owned by this small railroad, which later became a subsidiary of a large class I system after a bunch of reorganizations. The corporate history is complicated enough that I'll take either one of the names by which the line was generally known.

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, February 1, 2024 7:33 AM

Union Stack Yards  and  Transit Company.    New York Central System

OR

Michigan Central,   New York Central System

Depends on how far back do you wish to go?

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Posted by rcdrye on Thursday, February 1, 2024 7:57 AM

Almost - looking for USY&T's railroad names... Ownership of the railroad survived into the Penn Central era.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Thursday, February 1, 2024 10:10 AM

Would that be the Chicago River & Indiana?

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by rcdrye on Thursday, February 1, 2024 10:17 AM

CSSHEGEWISCH

Would that be the Chicago River & Indiana?

 

Or the Chicago Junction.  Long after the NYC system got ownership of the CR&I it was still referred to as the "CJ" by both working railroaders and railfans.

The remains of the CJ are largely unused.  Metra recently filed an adverse abandonment petition for the track along 43rd st. that crosses the ex-Rock Island.

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, February 2, 2024 2:45 AM

Looking forward to CSS's question.   Thanks

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, February 7, 2024 7:43 AM

How about it, CSS?

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, February 18, 2024 2:14 AM

Stilll waitng on CSS.

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, March 10, 2024 3:57 AM

CSS--  How about it?

Or would you like to pass it on to me.   I do have a good question in mind.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Sunday, March 10, 2024 10:12 AM

It's all yours.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, March 10, 2024 12:15 PM

Name the flgship train of the one of the three railroads and namecthe three railroads of the New York City - Chicago Pullman line (very often more  than one car) that used three Class I railroads  passenger trains in each diregtion, plus the fourth railroad, alsio a Class I, whose tracks were also used. In additon to answering, please provide all the details you can.

Bonus:  Why is the route of this Pullman line of particular interest today, and especially for two large eastern cities?

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, March 11, 2024 5:14 AM

Two of the railroads were in competition for much freight and  passenge traffic.  The ghird had frfiendly relations and interchange with both.  Nobody used this route for just transportation between end-points.  For stopovers and/or specific  scenery, yes.

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, March 11, 2024 6:15 AM

For a few years C&O's George Washington carried New York-Chicago sleepers that originated on the Pennsylvania, were turned over to the C&O in Washington, and then to the New York Central (Big Four) in Cincinnati. Big Four Trains operated into Chicago on the Illinois Central north of Kankakee, sometimes with IC power.

C&O owned several resort hotels in the West Virginia mountains.  Some of the cars layed over during the trip at one of several stations that served the George Washington.  In later years there were no through cars, but New York-Chicago pasengers who stopped over could use one of several cars that originated in Newport News (Phoebus) or Richmond to continue west.  Other cars to Chicago operated via Toledo on the Sportsman, handed off to New York Central for the last leg.

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, March 11, 2024 8:08 AM

You got the answers and should ask the next question.

The  promary hotel still rexists, the Greebier.

You did not continue to the bonus, even though I know you know it.

Amtrak's Cardinal covers this route entirely, and is the only passenger train serving both Philadelphia and Chicago, also Wilmington and Chicago.

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, March 11, 2024 10:19 AM

I think the answer lies in the use of C&O's hotels (especially the Greenbrier) for various industry and government conferences over the years.  The list is quite long, including the Greenbrier's use as an internment center for Axis diplomats at the beginning of WWII.  A bunker was built as part of a new wing between 1959 and 1962 to house essential government functions in the event of a nuclear event.  Never used, it's now a tourist attraction.

The other C&O hotel at Hot Springs, could be reached by mixed train (from Clifton Forge) until 1971.  Pullmans and private cars were handled regularly on the mixed train, though often the cars were returned empty with passengers taken by taxi to reboard at a main line station (usually Covington).

I'll post something later today after I get a chance to fact check my question.

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, March 11, 2024 7:23 PM

The MoPac/T&P Sunshine Limited and Texan participated in quite a few Pullman "Lines" in the pre-Texas Eagle era.  Two railroads sent cars out of New York, and three out of Washington to participate.  Name the railroads that were part of this service (one of the Washington cars was handled on two connecting railroads, but I only need the originating one).

Note that while most of the cars operated both ways on the Sunshine Limited, one "Line" went west on the Texan, and returned on the Sunshine Limited.

The Sunshine Limited ran as two trains out of St. Louis, 1 and 21, swapping cars at Little Rock for various Texas and Mexican destinations.  I won't require you to figure out which cars went where.

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, March 12, 2024 9:43 AM

First a  ciorrection to my question and RC's answer, and having relevence, I think, to RC's question.  Actually,  the George Washington's Penn Station, New York, Central Station (IC) Chicago Pullmans used six, not four, rasilroad's tracks.  We fordot C&O using trackage-rights Orange-Alexandria on the Southern, and RF&P Alexandria - Washington.

The two New  York-through-to-Texas Pullman carriers were certainly bothy the New York Central and the Pennsylvania.  From Washington the B&O, Southern, and RF&P (for SAL-L&N).  

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Posted by rcdrye on Tuesday, March 12, 2024 9:56 AM

New York answers are correct (PRR, NYC).  Since this was for a connection to MP trains the Southern/RF&P/L&N were not involved.

C&O's operation to Washington was straight trackage rights with no revenue sharing, so I didn't include it to answer Dave's previous queation.  Big Four had various arrangements with IC over the years that weren't straight trackage rights.

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, March 12, 2024 11:57 AM

That leaves only the C&O and Pennsylvania as possibilities, with the C&O probably using another rsilraod from Louisville or Cincinnati to St. Louis.

The B&O probably had Texas cars from both Jersey City and Washington.

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Posted by rcdrye on Tuesday, March 12, 2024 12:05 PM

I did say I wouldn't require the other railroad's name.  PRR is correct.  C&O turned their car over to the NYC (Big Four) at Cincinnati - the car reached St. Louit via Indianapolis.  This was a good many years before C&O's George Washington was combined with the remnant of B&O's Metropolitan for Washington-St. Louis service.

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, March 12, 2024 12:36 PM

The railroad and  train name of the last new intercity service serving Chicago and a distant city before Amtrak.  It was faster tha any previous schedule over the particular route; not faster than the rail competition, but preferred for other reasons.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Thursday, March 14, 2024 10:15 AM

The railroad is the Chicago North Shore & Milwaukee and the trains are the "Electroliners".

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by rcdrye on Thursday, March 14, 2024 12:30 PM

GTW "Mohawk" Chicago-Detroit 1967.  Beat old GTW time via Durand, but was not quite as fast as NYC(MC) trains via Ann Arbor.

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, March 15, 2024 4:42 AM

Inaugurated when the Central's Twilight Limited lost its dining car.

Also had poular stops at Detroit-Suburban Pontiac, Royal Oak, and Birmingham.

Your question, please.

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Posted by rcdrye on Sunday, March 17, 2024 4:56 PM

Here's a good map excercise:

This railroad crossed more railroads entering Chicago before heading downtown than any other.

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, March 18, 2024 1:27 AM

The C&O (ex-PM) after the move from Grand Central to Northwestern, with the B&O similarly close behin the C&O.

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, March 18, 2024 6:24 AM

Close - The B&O/C&O moves over the B&OCT come in second.  This railroad crossed the B&OCT twice on its way downtown.

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, March 19, 2024 3:19 AM

Wisconsen Central (or Wiscinsin Southern?) when using Central Station, the Illinois Central Station.

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Posted by rcdrye on Tuesday, March 19, 2024 7:57 AM

WC/Soo Line had very few crossings -  IC east of Broadview was a straight shot until the last two miles.

The line I'm looking for pretty much "boxed the compass" before heading into its terminal.  

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Tuesday, March 19, 2024 10:15 AM

With that clue, I would go with Grand Trunk Western, crossing B&OCT at Blue Island and again near 49th and Leavitt.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul

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