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Classic Train Questions Part Deux (50 Years or Older)

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Posted by rcdrye on Saturday, January 6, 2024 1:41 PM

Saturday night was NYC's and Pullman's low night of the week, and NYC had plenty of Pullman accomodation for anyone needing a berth without running the Century.  For some reason they never took Christmas off, except when it fell on a Saturday.  It probably worked out nicely for the crews, who got to start each week from home on the same day.

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, January 7, 2024 3:25 AM

This train was born late in the pre-Amtrak streamline era, was  definitely fully a streamliner most days, from cab-unit diesel to round-end observation, carried no sleeper (except possibly on some special occasions), nor any parlor-car defined as such, yet could not be  labeled all-coach, all equipment lightweight, less  than daily service, served top-quality food, operated between two important cities, but only a portion of the roue of its  predicessor, and was replaced  by a daily-service full former route (with minor differences) Amtrak train, still in operation.  One can travel the route on Amtrak on a train that does offer sleeping as well as coach accomodations.

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, January 8, 2024 1:20 AM

The Amtrak replacement has the same name as the tran's predicessor.

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, January 10, 2024 1:17 AM

In its last week or so of its  operation, the rout was further shortened  due to an act of nature, leaving only one of its two major cities actually served.   But Antrak's train has almost the entire route of the predicessor.

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, January 11, 2024 12:56 AM

Highest ratio of dome-to-flat-top cars of sny train anywhere.  In fact, no non-dome coaches except preriods of heavier-than-usual patronage.  Nearly all terminal-terminal riders rode for the scenery as opposed to best plain transportation.  The meals were terrific, also.

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Posted by rcdrye on Thursday, January 11, 2024 5:30 AM

The D&RGW's Rio Grande Zephyr, and the briefly operated BN/D&RGW "California Zephyr Service" (1970-1971) match the description.  Collapse of part of Thistle Canyon shortened the route prior to Amtrak's takeover in 1983.  Tri-weekly for both trains.

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, January 12, 2024 7:02 AM

Correct.  Next question, please.

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Posted by rcdrye on Friday, January 12, 2024 7:05 PM

This railroad, that ended up with five EMD E8s, dieselized its passenger service by borrowing E units until its own passenger units were delivered.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Saturday, January 13, 2024 10:18 AM

That would be Norfolk & Western.  The five E8's came with Wabash in the merger on October 16, 1964.  Wabash still had three PA1's at the time of the merger but they were scrapped before they could be re-numbered.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by rcdrye on Saturday, January 13, 2024 12:43 PM

Yep.  N&W dieselized its own passenger trains with ACL and RF&P E units before its 22 GP9's with steam generators arrived.  Wabash also had some E7s that had been traded in on GP35s, which were delivered after the N&W lease in N&W paint.  Nickel Plate had retired its PAs in favor of boiler-equipped GP9s, RS11s and an RS36.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Sunday, January 21, 2024 10:01 AM

This should intrigue Alco fans.  Name the three general versions (not individual model designations) of the Alco flatnose built by Alco and its licensees.  

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, January 21, 2024 11:05 AM

If my memory is correct:

The PAs, for passenger service, six-wheel trucksm center axles not powered.   Boiler-equipped

the FAs, for freight service,  four-wheel trucks.

the FPAs, dual service, similar to FAs, but boikler-equipped and possibly slightly longer carbody.

 

Is this what you meant?

 

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Posted by rcdrye on Sunday, January 21, 2024 3:50 PM

The only FPA versions (FPA2, MLW FPA4) were the same length as FA1s but had space behind the radiators, as did non-boiler-equipped FA2s. 

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, January 22, 2024 11:34 AM

Is my the one liooked for, and should I ask the  next question?

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Posted by Overmod on Monday, January 22, 2024 4:26 PM

.

It's duplicating posts and lagging with typing again...

 

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Posted by Overmod on Monday, January 22, 2024 4:34 PM

One of them is that DL500 'world locomotive' (the Australian making the ultimate 'flat front' by putting a cab in the other end).

I think this is the same nose design that the C636P would have had.

The other would be the DL 204 'super 1500' design that closely followed the Black Marias, the ones that went to GM&O.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Tuesday, January 23, 2024 10:19 AM

daveklepper got two of them (PA and FA), and Overmod got the third with the World Locomotive,  rcrdye was correct in that the FA and FPA had identical carbodies.  I'll let daveklepper and Overmod decide who goes next.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, January 23, 2024 11:42 AM

Overmod, would you like to ask the next question here?

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Posted by Overmod on Tuesday, January 23, 2024 12:40 PM

No, you got two to my one, and the early version apparently doesn't count.  In any case, your questions are better, and you have a birthday coming up.

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, January 24, 2024 6:20 AM

The two renmnants of the vast D&RGW & RGS & CS narrow gauge network are trasdures indeed, the CVumbres v and Toltec and the Durango & Silverton.  The common-carrier abandonment that left in place or allowed restoration was Antonito-Durango-Farmington.

Which D&RGW narrow-gauge operation was the last to cease  before that common-carrier abandonment?  (Hint, not immediately before, but later than one might think.)

History of the route, please.  At least recent history.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Wednesday, January 24, 2024 10:14 AM

I'm going to go with the Monarch Branch.  It became isolated with the last abandonments of the Marshall Pass lines and was converted to standard gauge in 1955.  The July 1965 issue of TRAINS (the first issue that I ever bought) had a good article about the branch and the conversion.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, January 24, 2024 12:30 PM

Right.  Next question is yours.

I believe the branch was subsequently abandoned when a mine that was  the reason for the branch's continued extstance played out or was no longer profitable.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Thursday, January 25, 2024 10:07 AM

What operating characteristic, other than ownership and electric operation, did Chicago Aurora & Elgin, North Shore Line and South Shore Line have in common?

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Saturday, January 27, 2024 10:07 AM

Time for a clue, the characteristic deals with their entrance into downtown Chicago.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by rcdrye on Saturday, January 27, 2024 8:49 PM

They both operated over Elevated Railways, the CNS&M over the Northwestern Elevated, and the AE&C/CA&E over the Metropolitan West Side Elevated.  In both cases Rapid Transit service was extended over the interurbans' lines, by NWE successor Chicago Rapid Transit to Niles Center (Skokie), and by MWE initially to Forest Park and later (by CRT) to Bellwood for service to Westchester.

The CNS&M entrance was made entirely under Insull ownership, except for the CM&StP's underlying ownership of the tracks between Wilson Ave and Wilmette.  The AE&C made its arrangements with the MWSE prior to common ownership.

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, January 28, 2024 5:28 AM

RC has covered most, but additions are:

All passenger trains  MU-self -powered, with low-voltage MU control, not locomotive-hauled.

Use of both mortor and trailer cars.

Third-rail and trolley-pole-trolley-wire uperstion, even if most of the  CA&E was third rail and the NS trolley-wire except operation on CRT-CTA.

Use of at least two people (engineer and conductor) on all interurban trains, possibly exception for local streetcar operations.

600 Volt DC power,

All cars used series to parallel transition in accelerating.

Electric heating

Mileage-based ticketing on interurban runs.

Multi-ride commuter discount ticketing.

Railroad-based, not transit-based, signalling on their own property.

Interchange freight with both the national railroad network and with connecting interurban lines.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Sunday, January 28, 2024 10:08 AM

I'll give it to rcdrye since he covered the Chicago entrance, which is what I was looking for.  However, he missed South Shore's trackage rights into Chicago over the Illinois Central.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, January 28, 2024 2:40 PM

I read too hastely and missed the South Shore, which lacks many of the features I mentioned.

Happy to have RC the cwinner.

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, January 29, 2024 3:03 AM

The South Shore did not employ any third -rail pickup and used pantographs and not trolley-poleds, was a 1500 volt, not 600-volt, electrification, interchanged with the North Americasn freight network, but not with connecting interurnban lines, except on rare occasions, like the delivery of the Pullman-built High-Speeds to the Indiana RR.

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, January 31, 2024 9:07 AM

Waiting for RC's question

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