IC plated over the center end windows of the P-S dome coaches it bought from MP/T&P and all three of the front (short end) windows of the Budd domes. This may have been done due to IC's concern about safety in its approach through the south side of Chicago. They were purchased in 1967, just as coaches were added to the Panama and the whole IC fleet was downgraded to some extent. All six were sold in 1970 and 1971, so they weren't on the property very long.
rcdrye They also ran on PRR's South Wind on occasion, usually in NP paint. Depending on the year and the painter's instructions, the letterboards on the dome sleepers carried "Pullman" with NP or CB&Q lettering near the vestibule, or, later, "Northern Pacific" even in IC orange, with "Pullman" end tabs. Unlike IC's own ex-MP domes, the forward windows were not plated over. Two NP domes (one each coach and sleeper) got BN paint and numbers.
They also ran on PRR's South Wind on occasion, usually in NP paint. Depending on the year and the painter's instructions, the letterboards on the dome sleepers carried "Pullman" with NP or CB&Q lettering near the vestibule, or, later, "Northern Pacific" even in IC orange, with "Pullman" end tabs. Unlike IC's own ex-MP domes, the forward windows were not plated over.
Two NP domes (one each coach and sleeper) got BN paint and numbers.
I also saw a DL&W sleeper on the Panama that could be so distiguished only by the small leetrs on the letterboard.
I did ride in an unrepainted UP sleeper from North Cairo to Birmingham--American Sailor in June of 1966; Apparently the IC 6-6-4's were all being used to carry troops on the Panama from points north to Jackson, Mississippi, where they changed to coaches on the train for Shreveport.
I regret that I was unable see to the Panama that ran from Chicago (in 1964?) the day after the northbound was unable reach even Brookhaven, Mississippi, because a small bayou had flooded the track. It must have been quite a sight to see the foreign cars on the train.
When the borrowed domes ran on the South Wind, they remsined in their owners' colors.
I never did know why the IC did not want dome passengers to see forward of the IC domes. Afraid that someone might read the signals?
Johnny
Zephyr Overland and Rob:
"The Cars of Pullman" (Welsh and Howes) has picture of an SPS owned NCL dome repainted into SPS colors about 1968 or 69. I have said that the SPS repainted that one car to spite the NP and BN. Our book case is blocked in by a Christmas tree so I can't locate that book now.
I took a caboose trip in 1970 from Vancouver, Washington to Bieber, CA. The former SPS ACD in Vancouver was very, very angry that the new company (BN) "took" their new GP38's for their use.
Ed Burns
rcdrye I guess only C&NW used the longer cars... NP's 1954- and 1958-built domes wore only two different paint schemes between delivery and the Amtrak takeover. Describe both schemes.
I guess only C&NW used the longer cars...
NP's 1954- and 1958-built domes wore only two different paint schemes between delivery and the Amtrak takeover. Describe both schemes.
It would be the NP two-tone green designed by Raymond Loewy and some of the domes were temporarily repainted in IC colors when they were assigned to the City of Miami for winter season service.
Rob:
I give you the next question. I should have phrased the quesion better. The NP and MNS (not really sure about the GN and CBQ) had 40 foot flat cars that carried one number. There were locks on the cut levers and TTX type loading plates between the two cars. This allowed three tractors (and accompaning machinery) to be loaded on the long car.
NP EddieRob and All: My question is regarding the three Hill railroads that had articulated flat cars for hauling tractors. Name the three railroads. There were two kinds of ways of securing the two flat cars. What was type securement. How long (approximately) were each flat car? The MNS had similar flat cars.
I'm going to go with SP&S, NP and CB&Q. If they handled them at all like C&NW, they paired 60 foot flats with drawbars or welded the coupler draw pins shut. TTX-like drop panels, though wider, made the loading path.
I'll post a new thread about Electric Locomotives.
Rob and All:
My question is regarding the three Hill railroads that had articulated flat cars for hauling tractors. Name the three railroads. There were two kinds of ways of securing the two flat cars. What was type securement. How long (approximately) were each flat car? The MNS had similar flat cars.
I know nothing about electric locomotives. What is the difference between the two or three types of propulsion (gear) system?
All yours, Ed.
We have two partial answers, both are correct with their replies. I will let NP Eddie and rcdrye decide who gets to ask the next question.
In addition to their initial order CN started amassing RDC's from all over the place...does anyone know what the peak number on the roster was?
I didn't mind the RDC's for short trips, say around 1-3 hours. They sure could go like the wind when asked to.
C&O also swapped three 52-seat coaches with C&NW for an RDC-2 and two RDC-1s. The coaches (3483-3485) later went to SP (2216-2218) and then to NdeM. They were the only corrugated side cars on the C&NW (except for the RDCs!) RDCs to B&O, eventually Blue Mountain and Reading (RCD-1) and MBTA (RDC-1). The RDC-2 was wrecked in 1976 under B&O/PAT in Pittsburgh.
C&O also appears to have traded with M-K-T for their lone RDC-3, one source saying three coal hoppers. I haven't been able to verify that. The RDC-3 ended up on CN and later VIA.
CSSHEGEWISCH:
Part of your question is the sale of MSTL's two RDC4's (with 17 coach seats) for 32 open coal hoppers from the C&O. I do not know the routing as I don't believe that the MSTL and C&O had a junction with each other. I am not aware of any other railroads trading equipment for other equipment.
763-234-9306 (cell)
I'll stick with RDC's. Equipment swaps between roads have occurred over the years, such as Amtrak swapping 2 E8A's for 4 Conrail SW8's. C&O swapped equipment for some RDC's. What were the other railroads involved and what equipment did C&O provide?
Actually, it was more the train-offs that triggered the sale and scrapping of steel cars rather than the purchase of Budds. The ten postwar reclinning seat coaaches were used almost always in Boston - Portlans (and some to /bangor on the MC), and, yes, substition of the Budds to Portland made those cars surplus and also ended sevice to Bangor. Enough of the American Fllyers were kept for the Montrealer and Ambassador B&M contribution, but abandonment of service to Troy, belloows Fqlls, etc., threw more steel cars out of work. Oh yes, Bdds also took over the Montreal service while it lasted, usualy one CP Budd coach with a B&M combine.
I was just helping. Mark (CSSHEGEWISCH) is up.
rcdrye 57 RDC-1 4 RDC-2 7 RDC-3 30 RDC-9 -------------- 109 Total B&M's RDCs also replaced plenty of steel cars including relatively new stramlined cars.
57 RDC-1
4 RDC-2
7 RDC-3
30 RDC-9
--------------
109 Total
B&M's RDCs also replaced plenty of steel cars including relatively new stramlined cars.
Got it ! With CSSHEGEWISCH getting two of the three parts, the next question is his or give him the option to defer it to you.
CSSHEGEWISCH I will say that the railroad is Boston & Maine, the replacement cars were RDC's, I don't know how many.
I will say that the railroad is Boston & Maine, the replacement cars were RDC's, I don't know how many.
Congratulations, two of the three. The number should be an easy find, it vastly eclipsed the New Haven's 40...dig deep you can find it !
I took a stab at Disneyland because it was the only significant event I can recall about California at that time.
OK, lets try this one during the same time period. This financially strapped eastern railroad was the last to utilize wooden commuter cars. The state public utility commission pressured the railroad to replace the aging fleet, which reluctantly they did. Who was the railroad, what were their replacements and how many?
(Difficulty: Moderate, clues.)
Plan B is always handy to have!
https://books.google.com/books?id=rSQAbMtClsYC&pg=PA246&dq=%22the+santa+fe+railway+sponsored+a+special+celebration%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj0hp-74efQAhVFkJAKHfpaDAIQ6AEIIzAA#v=onepage&q=%22the%20santa%20fe%20railway%20sponsored%20a%20special%20celebration%22&f=false
After the success of prototype Hi-Levels 526 and 527, Santa Fe memos showed the intent to hit Disneyland's opening in 1955. Santa Fe had an ongoing connection to Walt Disney, including allowing him to use the Santa Fe name on the park railroad. Unfortunately for the passenger department, the board didn't authorise the purchase of the Hi-Levels until Budd had already developed a considerable backlog - probably the last time that happened. Once the opening was missed the inauguration was pushed back until all of the cars were delivered.
I'm going to throw another wild guess, the opening of Disneyland in 1955.
ZephyrOverlandI'm gonna throw a wild guess. Was the inaugruation of the hi-level El Capitan planned to coinside with the Tournament of Roses parade?
No, but it was something close in the 1955 calendar, a one-time event that got many riders on the El Capitan and other AT&SF trains over the years.
rcdrye So... Let's stick with Santa Fe's passenger trains. The inaugural of the all High-Level El Capitan was timed to (unofficially) coincide with what event in California? The timing didn't work out, since AT&SF got their order into Budd after NP, GN and PRR, so the train inauguration was over a year late.
So... Let's stick with Santa Fe's passenger trains. The inaugural of the all High-Level El Capitan was timed to (unofficially) coincide with what event in California? The timing didn't work out, since AT&SF got their order into Budd after NP, GN and PRR, so the train inauguration was over a year late.
I'm gonna throw a wild guess. Was the inaugruation of the hi-level El Capitan planned to coinside with the Tournament of Roses parade?
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