Yes that is specifically the Jacobs Shupert firebox however I thought the general dynamics were applicable.
How about then the circular nature of the corrugations giving it more strength and more area in the firebox itself, like a corrugated pipe you see along roadside ditches and drainage. If thats not right then I pass the torch to someone not so geologically orientated....been schlepping full core boxes all afternoon (well the students did most of the schlepping) but still, I opened them and layed out many many in order and started logging. Glad it's the weekend.
I believe you are thinking of something somewhat different, perhaps the Jacobs-Shupert firebox ... the Vanderbilt was corrugated, but followed very well-established marine practice in how the corrugations were used in a way that was not particularly susceptible to leakage -- the geometry had a great deal to do with it.
OK..I'll try again..Theoretically a corrugated firebox is able easily to accomadate lengthwise expansion but in application it proved to be excessively rigid and gave much trouble due to leakage at the joints.
There is something as important, if not more important, than the fact of the corrugations that makes this firebox important ... and similar to the tender design.
Note that 'bottom of the sides' and 'increased depth' have little meaning in the context of a Vanderbilt firebox; you might want to look more carefully at 'what it is and what it does' ... and why it did not see evolutionary development after the period it was introduced.
I believe it improved the rigidity of the firebox right up to the bottom of the sides and may have allowed for increased depth. This allowed for less reliance on the stay bolts.
It also makes sense that it provides more even and efficient heat disrubution.
I know that further improvements to the corrugated designs over the years were made. Perhaps by the time it became a superior way to go and of advantage steam was being phased out on the railroads. I believe the corrugated firebox is still manufactured and offered in modern day boilers.
I'm not a mechanical or power engineer so maybe these are primitive explanations...there is also the possibilty/comparison that I can draw on from Mining methods...many places still mine 'bottom up', instead of the far superior and easier 'top down' simply because that it is the way it was always done.
Something along those lines 'this is what we know and are comfortable with'.
Right, and right.
Can you provide a bit more on the firebox ... including the similarity to the tender design ... and why it did not catch on as anticipated?
A cylindrical tank car for the transport of oil. Also a new type of firebox on the locomotives that was corrugated and improved efficiency greatly.
Everyone is familiar with the Vanderbilt tender, but what other application of its general principle to railroading did that young engineer develop?
Mr. Overmod, I believe you are up!
The only photo I have seen with the tender is on page 429 of John H. White's "A History of the American Locomotive - Its Development 1830-1890". The preview on Amazon skips page 429... There is a drawing of the tender on pg. 436 (which is in the preview) that shows the trucks, but not the lettering.
https://archive.org/stream/historybaldwinlo00baldiala#page/62/mode/2up
OvermodWell, this might have been because the Lehigh and Mahanoy BUILT Consolidation
Baldwin built it at L&M's master mechanic Alexander Mitchell's urging with works number 1500. Of course, the suggestion (by Mitchell) that the Grant works was ready to build it instead pushed Baldwin to accept the order. It was ordered by L&M and delivered to LV in August 1866. One of the most expensive engines ever at the time, the cost for similar engines dropped rapidly enough for 2-8-0s to become the heavy freight engine of choice. The most common heavy freight engine prior to Consolidation was the 0-8-0, which was prone to derailment and was very hard on track, keeping speeds very low. Consolidation was the only 2-8-0 on LV's roster until 1871.
Well, this might have been because the Lehigh and Mahanoy BUILT Consolidation.
I am having trouble finding a photograph with the actual elegant lettering. The ones I have all show the locomotive but not its tender, which is upsetting for a different reason; I'd like to see if the tender trucks are Ohio pattern or some other interesting architecture...
Alright, I guess i'll answer the railroad question, I believe the most common wheel arrangement for freight services with steam engines were nicknamed "Consolidations", and the arrangement was 2-8-0.
On to the past!
The most common steam wheel arrangement for freight service was the 2-8-0 "Consolidation". The first one of the type was so named to honor the merger that created the Lehigh Valley system. The engine itself was delivered by Baldwin to the new Lehigh Valley Railroad with elegant lettering for one of the roads that merged into the LV. Name the railroad Consolidation was lettered for.
You have passed the question.
This is directly from the web, unless this isn't copied and pasted, this is not a pass, it needs to be from memory.
Now that is something that is not from the web, that looks pure to me, you pass this. Good job!
Overmod Check to be sure, but I believe the K-M has successfully operated under its own power!
Check to be sure, but I believe the K-M has successfully operated under its own power!
Correct! Still only one engine. I have seen rumors that they're shopping for a second. The engines are fairly easy to come by, as they were used all over Europe in rail and non-rail (marine, stationary) applications. The transmission is likely to be a little more trouble, as it was different from the ones used in production series in Germany.
The K-M hydraulics were really pretty successful, despite a service life of less than 10 years. The game changer for SP was the SD45, which SP started getting in quantity in 1966, ending up with over 350 by 1970. With the same effective horsepower rating as the K-Ms with a single, standard EMD engine (albeit a 20-cylinder) the SD45 didn't require the same wheel wear control a diesel-hydraulic required. Alco's DH643 had the same dual-engine design as the K-Ms, with similar high maintenance requirements. SP did own a fair number of C628 and C630 models from Alco, so the engine wasn't an issue.
I can't find a picture of them together, but there's a photo out there of KCS 479's tender at NWS&W - a compact Vanderbilt from a medium sized 2-8-0.
I'll post a new question tomorrow morning at the latest. In the meantime....
SP MW8799 (The MW comes from Maintenance of Way, and indicates non-revenue use) was buit as SP9010 by Germany's Krauss-Maffei, one of 15 K-M diesel-hydraulic hood units and 6 cabs (3 originally D&RGW), later renumbered to 9113. After retirement as an active locomotive it was rebuilt in 1969 to an unpowered (but cab-equipped) camera car for SP's pioneer Simulator Training Program. Numbered MW1166, it was almost immediately renumbered to MW8799.
After it was retired (1984) it was stored (1986) at the California State Railroad Museum. Owned by the Pacific Coast Locomotive Assn. since 2008, it has been restored to its original 1964 appearance. It is occasionally operated as an NPCU, or cab unit, since it is still unpowered, though PCLA does have a K-M engine, transmission and truck set it hopes to restore (the locomotive originally had two).
However...you have to answer a question correctly before you can ask one...so this does not count.
Since we're talking about SP, I might as well ask a question or two, and see what your answers are:
First, where did SP #8799 reside before it was scrapped after it's service, and what was it used for?
Second, what kind of locomotive is 8799? Were there more than one of the type?
If you were wrong, I was wrong too -- I remember the reference I used mentioning the Vanderbilt arrangement. A back-check would be to look at KCS engines to see which classes in fact had those tenders.
It looks like I was wrong about the Vanderbilt. The tender on 28 in the photos I could find this morning looks like a normal rectangular tank, but with a couple of tanks on top that look like residential/commercial oil tanks. Couldn't find a view from the back.
I'll give it to you. #28, with ex-KCS tender.
I seem to remember Northwestern Steel and Wire had an ex-GTW 0-8-0 used in-plant at Sterling IL that was experimentally converted to oil. The oil bunker on the Vanderbilt tender used wouldn't fit under the cab roof, so they simply turned the tender around. I don't think the experiment lasted long, and NWS&W's coal-burning steam operations ended in 1980. It might have been one of Trains Magazines "Would You Believe It" series.
SP cab-forwards, and just about any other oil-fired engine I could name, operated with the tender bunker-first, against the locomotive, just as conventional locomotives did. They piped the oil forward to the firebox, but that's not what I'm looking for.
The tender in question was intentionally coupled cistern-first to the locomotive, with the bunker at the after end. (If it helps, the locomotive was conventional.)
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