A study fatally flawed in design, with threats to its validity that make it worthless. Wanna bet the study was funded by Sanofi?
Duplicate
Turns out Trump is pushing hydroxychlroquine because he has stock in Sanofi, the company that manufactures it.
Exactly! (Eventually)
For all those observing the Passover Holidsy, this article sums up my thoughts and wishes:
Our Coronavirus story is focusing on Haredi communities. They include Bnei B’rak, Mea Shearim, Modiin Ilit, Beit Shemesh, Beitar Ilit, El Ad, and others. While most individuals have complied with Health Ministry advice and regulations, there are elements led by extremist rabbis that continue to study and pray in sizable groups, congregate in the streets, and resist efforts by police to control them. Bnei B’rak is currently in the headlines. It’s in the Tel Aviv metropolitan area, with a population over 200,000, and elected leaders who have sought to minimize its problems. It’s been put in a communal lockdown, with police enforcement of who can enter and leave, and efforts to move those who are ill, and those who have had contact with them, out of crowded homes and into hotels or other facilities.
Overall are signs of optimism, focusing on country-wide indications of new infections, the numbers of those seriously ill, and the incidence of deaths. While numbers grow, the rates of growth seem to be slowing. Optimists speak about lessening controls after Passover. Others speak about continuing for a month or two. Work continues toward developing medications and vaccines.
Overall, as measured by deaths as percentage of those infected, we’re at one half of one percent, which is a tenth of the comparable figure worldwide.
Time is confusing. One day for us is the same as the next, or the one before. Our week is no longer measured by the days when we used to go to the gym, or weekends when we’d visit the kids and grandchildren.
The Prime Minister, Health Ministry personnel, and major rabbis have indicated that there’ll be no conventional Passover. No visiting. Stay away from grandparents. Keep your Seder to only those family members actually living with you.
From this afternoon until after the Seder, it’ll be forbidden to move beyond 100 meters from one’s home. No intercity travel, and already long lines on the highways as police check addresses and turn back travelers going from one city to another.
We’ll see how this goes over.
However you do–or don’t do it–may you all have a good Passover.
Republished from San Diego Jewish World
Hag Samaich, Happy Holiday for whatever hoidays you observe.
Dave
daveklepperThe newwspaper the Manchester Guardian has often opposed ideas I believe appropriate for both the USA and Israel (like moving the USA Embassy to Jerusalem) and advocated measures that I think suicidal for Israel. Howwever, a fellow MIT graduate says this is an excellent article, and thus I recommend it for valuable information concerning the Cononavirus: Today's Guardian has an excellent article detailing how hydroxychloroquine became our president's miracle cure for COVID-19: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/06/hydroxychloroquine-trump-coronavirus-drug. The French "study" that started the ball rolling included a treatment group of forty-two hospital patients who received hydroxychloroquine. Patients who were transferred to ICU and/or died were excluded from the final analysis because they were not available to provide nasal swabs every day of the study. Excluding the patients who died and/or were transferred to ICU, the remaining patients in the treatment group had a "100% cure rate.” Today's Guardian has an excellent article detailing how hydroxychloroquine became our president's miracle cure for COVID-19: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/06/hydroxychloroquine-trump-coronavirus-drug.
When you exclude the dead, you will always have a 100% cure rate.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
The newwspaper the Manchester Guardian has often opposed ideas I believe appropriate for both the USA and Israel (like moving the USA Embassy to Jerusalem) and advocated measures that I think suicidal for Israel. Howwever, a fellow MIT graduate says this is an excellent article, and thus I recommend it for valuable information concerning the Cononavirus:
.
I also suggest that anyone who insists on having the last word or wants to continue the argument do so via private correspondance to daveklepper@yahoo.com
and not on this or any Kalmbach Forum. Thank you.
Charlie: You are the one who is biased because you wish to sensor the truth. I did not make up those stories and I cannot be called anti-Muslim. I have prayed with Muslims, eaten with them, ride their buses and taxis regularly, patronize an Arab-owned drugstore. I post this and my fact-based view of the situation and a good and fact-based memory of the struggles to establish Israel only to defend myself against accusations based on lies. I don't want to use this thread or any part of any Kalmbach Forum for this stuff, but you are the one with the help of others to make accusations that simply are not true. Just because facts are presented by someone whose politics are different than yours does not make the facts incorrect. What is going on in Sweden is proof of how badly Islam has been distorted. That does not make me anti-Islam. So stop makiing accusations and we can discuss measures to combat Coronavirus on this thread and just trains on other threads.
I do not represen the Gov. of Israel and certainly not the Trump Administration. I present my own views. I have a right to defend myself and speak for myself just as other posters have, and the fact that I live in Jerusalem and have dual-citizenship does not deny me that right.
(One of Charlie's earlier postings accused me of discussing China to divert attention from Trump's errors.)
I can't add anything specific to this conversation but I can tell you, because I had to deal with it during my last few years of university administration, that Communist China was even then trying to buy influence in the academic world via various large research grants which I and others recommended against accepting. We were very skeptical of various conditions that were attached to them that normal grants never had.
Based on my dealings back then with China, I would treat any dealings with the country with much skepticism. Likewise for anything they publicly say.
Convicted One Where did he get the notion that "something like this happens every hundred years"? Was that an idea that was promoted in the book? Is there historical precedent to support this?
Where did he get the notion that "something like this happens every hundred years"? Was that an idea that was promoted in the book? Is there historical precedent to support this?
I don't recall any mention of this in the book (may be in the book though).
Convicted One ATLANTIC CENTRAL So, what do we think about Sweden? Statistical outlier would be my best guess. I'd be highly reluctant to drop my guard solely because of their potentially aberrant experience. When weighing potential death against economic sacrifice, I think that an abundance of caution is justfied.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL So, what do we think about Sweden?
Statistical outlier would be my best guess.
I'd be highly reluctant to drop my guard solely because of their potentially aberrant experience.
When weighing potential death against economic sacrifice, I think that an abundance of caution is justfied.
Not a statistical outlier, Sweden get's it, maybe someone looked at the U.K.'s numbers before they decided to go the route the rest of the world(250k dead out of a population of 56 million = .5%) and realized it was smarter to isolate those most susceptible, let everyone else get it, let their medical system only deal with those severly ill and keep the economy going.
Not to be callous here but look at it from this view, the Worlds population stands at around 8 Billion people, over a quarter of those people live in two countries, China and India, both of which could use a huge population knock down. China maybe or maybe not blew their chance to let NATURE do it's job(a second wave of infections is starting there now), they could lose 1/3 of their population and still have enough to run the country, same goes for India. This falls directly under the Darwin theory of "Survival of the Fittest", and if you don't think so, go back and relearn the simplest defintion of that law of nature.
Caution be damned, full speed ahead, don't mind the torpedo's.
Thank you for a sincere and direct opinion, so far, as a laymen regarding medicine, I agree.
I guess we will see. But I have those concerns about the serious social side effects.
In my experience studying history, the tipping points come suddenly despite lots of warning.
Examples being the 1929 crash, the war between the states, a couple of world wars............
Sheldon
ATLANTIC CENTRALSo, what do we think about Sweden?
I hope Israelis and Palestinians get through this crisis. And I hope both sides will learn from this and find a compromise for peaceful coexistence.
Perhaos you are not aware of this news. The State Department has designated the Russian white supremacist group, Russian Imperial Movement, as a terrorist group. The two Swedish nationals responsible for a series of bombings in Sweden targeting Muslim immigrants in 2016 were trained for eleven days in Russia, which has become the center of Neo-Nazi/fascist groups. "They're baaack!"
charlie hebdo David K: Your vile posts about Sweden reveal your extreme bias.They do not belong on a thread about the Covid-19.
David K: Your vile posts about Sweden reveal your extreme bias.They do not belong on a thread about the Covid-19.
And Israel does everything right.
Sheldon, many of us have the same problem you do. And in many European countries it is worse.
1. If you have immediate food or housing financial problems, contact the religious organization most famliiar to you. I have been contacted by both Jewish and Christian organizations offering to help me. Fortunately, I got my Social Security for April on time, and the help from the Yeshiva's married students is sufficient to make up the gap to all expenses, and I don't need the additional help that my USA friendly organizations have offered to provide.
2. I get reliable in accurate information from Gatestone on a variety of subjects. The information is reliable and accurate because I often have the abilitiy to check with first-hand sources, such as my co-author Mendel Kleiner, of Worship Space Acoustics, who lives in Gothenberg, Sweden, and has first-hand knowledge of conditions there. LRTA members are able to confirm events in the UK, and of course I have local sources for events in Israel and in areas controlled by the PLO and Hamas. The fact that some call Gatestone right-wing and that it is in fact a conservative organization does not alter the quality information it presents, only requires some careful evaluation of the actions it recmmends.
3. Georgetown U. Its Near-Eastern studies have been funded by Arab countries, and they call the direction for those studies, which, as forwarded to me, appear to include a lot of downright lies. Probably they would use my posting what goes on in Sweden as an example of anti-Islam prejudice. But I did learn a lot about real Islam, as a religion of tolerance, from Imam Muhammid Osman of New York's Islamic Center. actually prayed with his congregation during the 1st Gulf War at the old center at Riverside Drive and 73rd Street, and served as one of the two required legal witnesses at an Islamic wedding at the new and very beautiful center at 96th Street and 3rd Avenue. The Ramba"m, Miamodondies, gives specific permission for Jews to pray in Mosques in his Helkai Yoseh (No 18 if my memory is correct), and Shaareh, traditional Muslim law, says an Observant Jew, is a valid witness in an Islamic court. As a teacher of architectural acoustics at City College, I was invited by the New York League of Women Arab Architects to talk on the Mehtizah, the divide constructed in Orthodox Synagogues for sex-separation.
Dave,
I don't have the time, or to be honest, the interest, to read all that you and others have posted in this thread.
I have responsibilities, that have been severely impacted by this crisis. And doing my best to deal with them takes up all but a few minutes of my day.
I don't know anything about Sweden, I've never been there, don't care to go. I don't have an opinion on their social problems.
I was simply refering to the reported facts that they have not locked down their country, and yet no larger percentage are sick or dead when compared to elseware?
It's a fair question.
I asked a simple question pages ago to no response, who will pay for this vacation I am on?
Lucky for me, I am actually still working for now. But the economic impact of this on my family may end up being significant. So again, it's a fair question. Is this lock down working? Is it going to work? Could it make it worse in the long run? What mental health and addiction price will be paid? Those outcomes can be very economic driven. Steal people's money and hope and they turn to various escapes, or worse. What will the suicide rate be? We need only look at the 1929 crash for that one. I'm married to a retired addictions counselor, I know way too much about the bad choices people can make.........
I'm not saying I know better or have an answer.
But I have the right to ask the questions. However unpleasant the questions are.
Or, am I supposed to just be a good little "citizen" (read sheeple, comrade, etc) and be lead to the slaughter? Literally or economically? A victim of the virus, or economic ruin, or some thug, or the courts if I shoot the thug?
There are a lot of things that have been upside down in this world for while now, it will be interesting to see if any of them get set right?
A gut feeling I get is the death rate of persons going into the ICU. Seems like about 1/2 who go do not make it ? Of course that may depend on how patients are classified as to needing to go to the ICU. Maybe some of those who are on ventilators do not meet criteria to be assigned to the ICU ?
Sheldon, Sweden does not have a Cononavirus disaster. But:
Where I think Gatestone is wrong, is that they seem to me to assume that China's leaders are incapable of learning from their mistakes. And just possibly they are learning not only about the errors in controlling the virus, but that international cooperation is better for them in the long run than confrontation and attempts at domination.
And yes, I do wish Trump had learned from his mistakes quicker.
So, what do we think about Sweden? They have only taken minimal measures and so far do not have a disaster?
Again, if you claim that Gatestone is anti-Islam, show me an example from Gatestone, not just examples of their accusors accusations.
Muslim extremist efforts to convert the world to Islam are a fact, and if necessary I will provide the evidence.
Excuse me, but the evidence of what is happening in Sweden in particular and in other European countries as a result massive immigration cannot be swepped under the rug just because Geogegtown University receives massive amounts of money to fund "Near Eastern Studies" programs that distort history and whitewash the crimes, now against Christians since all the Jews have left or been killed, in most Muslim Arab countries.
The fact is that the influence of Adolf Hitler himself, transmitted through his close friend, the Mufti Haaj Al Husseini, changed a relatively tolerant religion, certainly far more tolerant than the specific Roman Catholisism of Torquamada's Spain with its burning at the stake, an Islam where Jews and Christians simply paid a tax and lived in tranquilaty, into a form of Naziism with an Islamic face, where somehow the portions of the Koran that are favorable to Jews and Christians are distorted and reasons provided that they don't apply. A favorite is that all European Jews, including the progeny in America (the two continents) and Israel. are actually decendents of the Russian Kazar tribe. The history of 70 Jewish families invited to return to Jerusalem when the European Crusaders were driven out, Jewish participation in the Dome-of-the-Rock construction, the welcome the Caliph of Jerusalem gave to Jewish refugees from Torquamada's Spain at the Jaffa Dock, the representation of the Jews of the Holy Land by Rabbi Eliyahu Navon in the Turkish Parliament, the construction of the first railroad. Jaffa - Jeerusalem initiated by his son, Joseph Navon, and more, all this has been missing from most Arab instruction for almost a century.
Gatestone is not anti-Islam but anti-Islam Extremism, and if you wish to refute this, please quote actions and statements by Gatestone, not accusations by Islamic Extremism apologists, which Georgetown certainly is.
The countries where Christians can live without fear in the Islamic world are Jordan, if the King remains on the throne, Morocco (Jews can also live there), Kasistan (very liberal Democracy), and a few others. Even in Pakistan, Egypt, Algeria, and the Sudan, where there is nominally freedom of religion, crimes against Christians and churches in particular, are not punished on occasion. The Mufti taught the Muslim-Arab world to hate Jews in particular, but hatred spreads, even to one kind of Muslim against another.
Further proof of Georgetown U's bias is the number of their professors who advocate Boycott - Divestment - Sanctions against Israel. Gatestone may take economic positions that, as basically a liberal, I disagree with, but it does defend my right to live my life, while Georgetown defends those who wish to evict or kill me.
No society is totally bad or good, and I am happy to report the following:
The first in a convoy of 11 El Al planes carrying tons of critical medical equipment to Israel from China touched down at Ben-Gurion International Airport on Monday morning, as the nation continues to battle the coronavirus pandemic.
Israel’s Defense Ministry announced on Sunday that planes carrying 20 tons of vital medical supplies, including 900,000 surgical masks, 500,000 protective suits, several ventilators and other equipment would touch down one after another over the course of the next several days, in a coordinated effort with Israel’s Foreign Ministry, El Al Airlines and Israel Chemicals.
Due to an international run on coronavirus testing reagents, Israel has not been able to perform the 30,000 tests per day that Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu called for last week, but has still managed to continue testing on a smaller scale.
As of Monday, Israel’s coronavirus death toll stood at 51, with 8,611 confirmed cases of infection. So far, 585 people have recovered from the virus since the first official case was registered on Feb. 2.
My comment: The ratio of recovered-to-death continues to improve here, and China seems willing to help us. And there are now Israeli doctors assisting in China. So possibly the Gatestone prediction of a second wave will be proved wrong. Here, we not only hope, but also pray, for that.
Erik_MagHaving read "The Great Influenza" shortly after it was published, I am not surprised to hear that GWB picked up on it
Just curious...I doubt my local library will be open anytime soon, so your insight is appreciated.
Sometimes even the experts don't have it right, Dr. Fauci was downplaying COVID-19 in late January having thought the WHO was giving an accurate account of what was going on in China.
Similar thing with the general public wearing face masks. With exponential growth, even a small decrease in transmission rates can make a big difference after a few generations. Taiwan went on a crash program to make enough masks to allow most of the population to wear them.
Latest local update is the number of new cases in the last 24 hours has been the lowest in almost a week.
I believe, especially in this age, to listen to experts in the relevant fields. Nobody on this forum is even a medical doctor, let alone a specialist in infectious diseases or a researcher in virology or other relevant specializations.
Favipiravir is an interesting chemical: it inhibits viral RNA polymerase, which is kind of the opposite strategy from 3CLpro inhibitors (which inhibit the breaking up of large RNA strands into critical shorter pieces used in viral replication).
It is not said to have any effect on mammalian RNA synthesis, which technically makes it nontoxic at effective antiviral dosing strengths (and in typical modes of drug admission). There were worries from animal-model testing, however, that it might prove teratogenic (so, at the least, its use in pregnant or fertile women might be contraindicated)
The other issue I have at present is that I still have little evidence that this stuff is active in infected airway cells (of the type selectively invaded by SARS-CoV-2 via the ACE2 surface 'receptor') Whether that is true for other tissues rich in 'bindable' structure, as in the heart, does not appear to be established. I have to wonder if this is tantamount to a very large, somewhat ill-controlled field trial of this medication, somewhat like the logic behind the old conductor's test for how much of the collected fares to turn in to the company each day.
As noted for 3CLpro, this is unlikely to facilitate or accelerate actual immune-system response to deactivate the virus natively; it must continue to be administered to keep virus titer effectively low. It certainly should be as effective as a 3CLpro inhibitor in stopping runaway virus replication leading either to pronounced symptoms or to leukotriene cascade/cytokine storm and thence ARDS; I see no reason why it wouldn't also allow the same resolution of chronic immune misresponse just as 3CLpro inhibitors did for FIP in cats.
Since the lion's share of apparent deaths in 'susceptible' cohorts all appear related to massive unstopped viral replication, treatment with an agent of this kind appears both potentially effective and reasonably ethical, provided the teratogenic possibilities can be minimized. It certainly seems to be available in the large dose amounts, with reasonably high ongoing production, that will be needed to safeguard large numbers of the at-risk 'nonremoved boomers' incapable of producing their own effective full immune response to the virus, long enough for effective later-stage priming and development of effective antibody response to be 'designed for.'
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