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There are a 180,000 Amish in the NE US alone who have to use Amtrak or Bus by virtue of their faith

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Posted by John WR on Saturday, March 16, 2013 9:30 AM

I apologize for my attempt to maintain a proper perspective here Schlimm.  However, I think Bonas makes a very valid point.  The Amish are one group of Americans.  Dismissing their needs on the basis of stereotypes about their beliefs is, in my view, a mistake that goes beyond agreeing or disagreeing about Amtrak.  

John

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Posted by schlimm on Friday, March 15, 2013 9:19 PM

Your humor falls flat.  Better keep your day job.

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Posted by John WR on Friday, March 15, 2013 1:41 PM

schlimm
No one is belittling the Amish.  However, it is rather a stretch of the 1st amendment and Amtrak's charter to let religion be a factor in deciding on a subsidized rail service.

I was wondering if anyone would notice that, Schlimm.  But for you I was planning to start a new religion -- The Righteous Rail Riders -- and insist that any attempt to alter Amtrak would be an offense against my freedom of religion.  

John

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Posted by blue streak 1 on Friday, March 15, 2013 1:13 PM

come on people.  Its time that we remember the words   ------  " We the people " .  Lets stop balkanizing the USA and try to work together. 

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Posted by BaltACD on Thursday, March 14, 2013 11:03 PM

Most of the Amish communities I am familiar with do not have Amtrak stations within buggy distance, and would need some form of motorized conveyance to be able to utilize Amtrak.

My understanding of the Amish, they cannot own automobiles, have no electricy at their homes, no indoor plumbing or toilet facilities.

However, they are permitted the use of electric lights, electronics, and power tools in the operation of their businesses.

Mennonites, who inhabit the same areas as Amish and have a similar manner of dress, are permitted to own and operate automobiles. 

The 'Amish Mafia' show broadcast on the Discovery Channel offers some insights into a Amish community.  How accurate it is, is open to question.

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Posted by schlimm on Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:42 PM

No one is belittling the Amish.  However, it is rather a stretch of the 1st amendment and Amtrak's charter to let religion be a factor in deciding on a subsidized rail service.

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Posted by John WR on Thursday, March 14, 2013 8:47 PM

Certainly Amtrak was not created because of anyone's religious beliefs.  Yet the fact is that some who ride Amtrak do so because of their religious beliefs.  I would argue that it is not valid for us to make our own personal judgments about those beliefs.  However, there is a question about whether or not their beliefs should be considered in deciding whether or not to continue Amtrak routes.  

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Posted by Paul Milenkovic on Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:27 PM

Not being an expert on the German Anabaptists of which the Amish and their rules are one particular sect (I encountered some prosperous farmers with a brand new  Ford Super Duty Turbo Diesel truck at Fleet Farm wearing "Amish" garb, but they may be of one of the other Anabaptist groups), guess I have some questions.

So, one is supposed to not own or drive a car, but it is OK to ride Amtrak or Lamars (Greyhound), which uses modern combustion engines, but it is not OK to get a ride from someone or ride an airplane?

This "slap in the face" remark also goes kind of far inasmuch that one particular branch of a religion (Amish are just one group of German Anabaptists -- many other Anabaptists are hardworking prosperous people who drive late model vehicles) chooses to forgo personal combustion engines, as a matter of piety through foregoing worldly luxuries or whatever devotional reason, so Amtrak service (Diesel powered) becomes some kind of 1st Amendment respect for someone's religion question?

If GM "killed the electric car", what am I doing standing next to an EV-1, a half a block from the WSOR tracks?

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Posted by schlimm on Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:01 PM

The "mass migration" is also a part of the phenomenon of many young Amish leaving the faith and community and moving to other places, usually urban areas.  Some Amish are also able to drive vehicles which they borrow from "Auslanders" (foreigners = non-Amish).

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Posted by oltmannd on Thursday, March 14, 2013 11:42 AM

Bonas

Every day that I pass thru a major bus or train station there are groups of Amish. As it turns out there are about 180,000 of these folk who depend on Greyhound and or Amtrak to get them around. For several years there has been a mass migration of amish out of PA and OH as land prices and taxes have forced them off there homesteads. For Amtrak and Greyhound to ignore this population by cutting rural stations and routes is a slap in the face to them and the bottom line. They are one of many groups that have to use ground transport like students,senior citizens,disabled and fixed income people and those that live nowhere near a airport.

 

Ohio 59,103
Pennsylvania 58,009
Indiana 45,144
Wisconsin 14,957
New York 10,787
Michigan 10,218
Missouri 9,833
Kentucky 8,172
Iowa 7,179
Illinois 6,267

The "mass migration" isn't due to inability to pay taxes, it's population growth.  There just isn't more land for them to buy to farm.  Many have gone into owning/working in other industries.  If you own an RV assembled in Indiana, chances are a Amish guy or two worked on it.

As for "relying" on trains and buses. That's nonsense.  They very often rely on "English" to drive them where they need to go.  

-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/

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Posted by schlimm on Wednesday, March 13, 2013 7:46 PM

I don't think the government's provision of transportation services to a group who cannot own automobiles because of religious beliefs would be constitutional unless said services were otherwise warranted.

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Posted by John WR on Wednesday, March 13, 2013 7:27 PM

Within the United States there are identifiable groups that have come to depend on Amtrak for their transportation.  One group is those who for religious reasons use Amtrak.  Many people with disabilities depend on Amtrak.  Many people in rural areas have no other transportation available to them.  Students going to college often use Amtrak's generous baggage allowance.  Older Americans use Amtrak in disproportionate numbers.  

Bus service becomes increasingly problematical.  Testifying before the Congress on March  5 Amtrak President Joe Boardmen pointed out that from 2005 to 2011 bus service to rural areas declined by 11 per cent over all.  Some states have much greater declines in bus service.  Also, today increasing numbers of buses are operated by discount bus companies.  These companies structure their service so they are not required to comply with the Americans with Disabilities Act.  Many do not provide accessible restrooms.  A significant proportion of buses are simply not available to people with mobility impairments.  Even where accessible bus service does exist we do not know how long the private sector will be willing or able to provide it.

The number of rural areas served by air service is also declining as deregulation as forced may air carriers out of business.  

For increasing numbers of people Amtrak is their only transportation.  And for another group they don't even have Amtrak; they simply have no transportation to distant places.   

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There are a 180,000 Amish in the NE US alone who have to use Amtrak or Bus by virtue of their faith
Posted by Bonas on Wednesday, March 13, 2013 4:15 PM

Every day that I pass thru a major bus or train station there are groups of Amish. As it turns out there are about 180,000 of these folk who depend on Greyhound and or Amtrak to get them around. For several years there has been a mass migration of amish out of PA and OH as land prices and taxes have forced them off there homesteads. For Amtrak and Greyhound to ignore this population by cutting rural stations and routes is a slap in the face to them and the bottom line. They are one of many groups that have to use ground transport like students,senior citizens,disabled and fixed income people and those that live nowhere near a airport.

 

Ohio 59,103
Pennsylvania 58,009
Indiana 45,144
Wisconsin 14,957
New York 10,787
Michigan 10,218
Missouri 9,833
Kentucky 8,172
Iowa 7,179
Illinois 6,267

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