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Intact 6,000 HP Diesels?

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Posted by karldotcom on Tuesday, May 6, 2014 12:12 AM

Metrolink is the County's Toy Train Set.   Just look at the New Jersey Transit Comet Car fiasco. (which were recently towed away)

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Posted by carnej1 on Monday, May 5, 2014 11:13 AM

BaltACD

Most CSX 6000 hp engines have been redesignated as CW46's from CW60's

Really?

 They spent the money to rebuild most of the fleet with 16 cylinder GEVO engines rated at 6,000 HP and then de-rated them to 4600 HP?

 I imagine that is to reduce fuel consumption (akin to CSX modifying its remaining B40-8's to limit them to 2,000 HP)?

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Posted by NorthWest on Sunday, May 4, 2014 7:25 PM

Thanks, all! Sorry about the slip.  I guess they were attempting to make them mechanically identical to the F59PHs.

I think that the 800 is still in service, at least it was in March.

And now back to the 6000 HP locomotives...

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Posted by Leo_Ames on Sunday, May 4, 2014 6:13 PM

I still get a kick out of a quote from a Metrolink official about that project when asked why they just didn't rebuild the F40PH's in kind a decade ago. He replied with some analogy about how it wouldn't make sense for you to go out and rebuild a pickup truck from 1980, so why should we?

Instead, he proposed to lengthen that ~1980 pickup truck and put the guts of a newer 1980's pickup truck inside of it. 
 
I don't think it quite had the effect he was hoping for, lol.
 

beaulieu
Metrolink acquired 4 ex- C&NW SD60s to scavenge diesel engines from, with the idea of putting the 16 cyl. 710G3 engines in F40PH locomotives and putting the 16 cyl. 645E3 engines into the SD60s. The idea was for more power in the passenger locomotives, and use the former SD60s for work train power. Luckily someone came to their senses before the project got too far along.

The idea was sound back when proposed, they just underestimated the engineering involved. Nobody was willing to tackle it for such a small order, for what Metrolink wanted to pay. 

I believe the plan though was to get two SD60's up and running with 645's afterwards for work trains, not all four. 

Do they still operate the F40PH that was in running condition that they put into operation as-is? 

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Posted by beaulieu on Sunday, May 4, 2014 5:33 PM

NorthWest

I also forgot to mention the units acquired by Metrolink in their quest to put the prime movers into F40PHs.

Metrolink acquired 4 ex- C&NW SD60s to scavenge diesel engines from, with the idea of putting the 16 cyl. 710G3 engines in F40PH locomotives and putting the 16 cyl. 645E3 engines into the SD60s. The idea was for more power in the passenger locomotives, and use the former SD60s for work train power. Luckily someone came to their senses before the project got too far along. One of the SD60s is now on Southwest Portland Cement(now under a new name) out of Victorville, CA. I don't know what happened to the other three.
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Posted by BaltACD on Sunday, May 4, 2014 12:34 PM

Most CSX 6000 hp engines have been redesignated as CW46's from CW60's

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Posted by NorthWest on Sunday, May 4, 2014 10:19 AM

Thanks, Creepycrank. That makes more sense than the SD40E program listed in the captions.

I also forgot to mention the units acquired by Metrolink in their quest to put the prime movers into F40PHs.

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Posted by creepycrank on Sunday, May 4, 2014 6:45 AM

Fortesque metals in Australia bought several SD 90,s and had Altoona works convert some to 16-710 engines but they were in such a hurray to get power that Altoona only gave them a lick and a promise and shipped them out where they are in operation today. I think it may have been as many as 4 units.

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Posted by NorthWest on Saturday, May 3, 2014 10:45 PM
From what I can tell from pictures on the web- The EMLX units have either been -scrapped or stored at Mid-America Car -scrapped for parts for NS' SD40E program (seems a bit odd) -Transferred to Progress Rail as PRLX (and then possibly other leasers) and still in lease service somewhere. Can anyone give definitive answers? GDRMco, I'm interested in where those BHP units will go. Who in the US purchased them? Sorry for the jumble, the computer will not allow me to format the post!
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Posted by GDRMCo on Saturday, May 3, 2014 9:36 PM

The SD89MAC is now just a frame with a cab and dynamic brake section sitting on it, saw pictures a while ago of it in transit to somewhere.

BHPB's AC6000s did get the GEVO-16 engine like the CSX AC6000s. They have apparently been sold to a US buyer along with the first 13 non-isolated cab ACes as BHPB is looking to fully standardize their fleet on the iso cab ACe.

There's also now more than 600 6000hp units operating in China, they've built many many more since the initial orders (HXN3, HXN3b, HXN5, HXN5b, HXN5c).

ML

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Posted by Leo_Ames on Saturday, May 3, 2014 3:37 AM

Thanks

If they've been rebuilt to similar standards to those on CSX, despite their own dissatisfaction with them, I suspect they'll find new homes. 

That SD90MAC count isn't correct. While CPR's (After almost being exported to Saudi Arabia) and those owned outright by UP should be all gone, there should be numerous survivors in one form or another from the leased group on Union Pacific. A few are in Australia for instance, one supposedly was rebuilt into the SD70ACe prototype, there should be a few in the EMLX lease fleet, one is being rebuilt with a Cummins powerplant I read somewhere recently. and I believe another company or two was trying to peddle H engined SD90MAC's a few years ago like PRLX.

Is the SD89MAC still around?

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Posted by beaulieu on Saturday, May 3, 2014 1:53 AM

The AC6000CWs on BHP were rebuilt by GE at GE's expense, there were only eight. This happened before everybody gave up on 6000 hp. One was wrecked, and BHP decided to standardize on SD70ACe locomotives. The only 6000 hp. locomotives left are the 600 in China (300 from each builder), and two demonstrators that belong to EMD (EMDX 90 and 91).

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Posted by Leo_Ames on Friday, May 2, 2014 6:16 PM

There's no as built AC6000CW left in the US.

The three pre production models on CSX were repowered with 4400 HP 7FDL16's while the rest recieved 6000 HP 16 cylinder versions of the GEVO engines. Virtually all of them have also seen their Hi-Ad trucks replaced. And the electricals have also been heavily upgraded. 

On Union Pacific, they were "de-converted" to match the specifications of the convertibles that never received their planned 6,000 HP powerplants and now have FDL's inside and are essentially equivalent to their many AC4400CW's.

If there are any in as-built condition, they're on the BHP Billiton in Australia. But a quick search just now shows one as scrapped after a wreck, a statement from this forum about them having been repowered (Which I'm skeptical about), and multiple comments that they've been retired and replaced by SD70ACe's (Which is why I'm skeptical that they were repowered just a short time earlier). Appears they were even more dissatisfied with them than Union Pacific and CSX were. 

So they don't appear safe and appear to have no future there. I assume their best chance for survival is being exported and rebuilt with new power plants and other upgrades. But rather or not that would be cost effective or even if there would be any interested parties, I don't know. But a few other Australian locomotives have came to the US over the past 15 years so there's a bit of precedence (All five SD50's and a C36-7).

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Posted by efftenxrfe on Thursday, May 1, 2014 9:40 PM

About a half dozen of each, EMD and GE 6000 hp locomotives, were lead and controlling units I've run on a dozen or so trains.

Mixed with other units ( GE Dash-whatever or SD60's/70's) their efficacy didn't display any distinction: train performance arose from hp per ton.

No mechanical, electrical or pneumatic problems happened.

Oil leaks stained the sides of the EMD's. The GE's were cleaner (6000 hp specifically.)

I' liked neither and both....

They ran, pulled and rolled.

Seeing the GPS  and the hp  being produced on displays did in a sort of "gee whiz' way. distract but watching those screens were like ; "tex-ting while driving ."

Still, save one of each locomotive, if it can be done? I ran them, and l enjoyed them.

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Posted by NorthWest on Thursday, May 1, 2014 7:50 PM
I think all the 265s are essentially out of service, the SD90MACH-IIs stored, or scrapped. At least a couple still exist, or at least pictures have recently surfaced. I think all the AC6000CWs have been repowered.
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Posted by carnej1 on Thursday, May 1, 2014 12:12 PM

The Railwolf
Are there any remaining intact SD90MACs or AC6000CWs operating in the USA with their original 16V265H or 7HDL16 engines, respectively? I know most SD90s were sold, scrapped, or repowered with 710 engines (SD9043MAC), and all the CSX CW60ACs I've seen have been repowered with the GEVO-16. I have never heard either super engine in person. I hear that the 265, being four-stroke, sounds totally unlike anything EMD.

Never saw a 265-H powered SD90MAC but I can attest from experience that the CSX AC6000CW's in as -built (HDL Engine) configured engine were screamers. Probably the twin turbochargers had a lot to do with it...

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Thursday, May 1, 2014 9:57 AM

The SD9043MAC's were built with 710 engines, with provision for re-powering with 265 engines at some future date.

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Intact 6,000 HP Diesels?
Posted by The Railwolf on Thursday, May 1, 2014 8:31 AM
Are there any remaining intact SD90MACs or AC6000CWs operating in the USA with their original 16V265H or 7HDL16 engines, respectively? I know most SD90s were sold, scrapped, or repowered with 710 engines (SD9043MAC), and all the CSX CW60ACs I've seen have been repowered with the GEVO-16. I have never heard either super engine in person. I hear that the 265, being four-stroke, sounds totally unlike anything EMD.

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