I can't answer your questions about the others, but 4501 was finished in "Virginia Green" during its excursion career by direction of Graham Claytor, basically as an "ersatz" Southern PS4 passenger locomotive.
Mr. Claytor tried for years to get a Pacific type he could re-do as a PS4, but the closest he got was an Atlanta and West Point Pacific, but the owners insisted it retain A&WP markings.
There is a real PS4 in existance, but it's in the Smithsonian in Washington, and it's never coming out.
I am really not trying to be a smart alec, but I Googled Southern 722 and there is a Wikipedia page for it
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Railway_722 and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Railway_630
While it doesn't answer all your questions, it does some.
friend611As to the locomotive in the Smithsonian, it is Ps4 1401 and (as I have read) the building was built around it, the reason why it cannot be brought out.
Having been there, it looks almost impossible to bring it out. There are no doors, and it sits in a pit, being taller than the automobiles that surround it on two sides (a tiny window and station replica are the other two). A shame, as she is a beautiful locomotive that is almost obscured by other displays. At least she is covered and in climate controlled rest.
I've seen the 1401 at the Smithsonian myself, years ago, and NorthWest is correct, it's a stunning and absolutely gorgeous locomotive, takes your breath away to see it. No wonder Mr. Secretary Claytor loved it so.
Still, I suppose life "stuffed and mounted" beats no life at all.
The chances of removing 1401 from the Smithsonian are slim & none. The building wasn't actually built around her, but that's almost what happened. She was moved over Washington streets and placed inside the open side of the building; then a glass wall was built to close her in. Since then, the Washington Metro subway was built. Any attempt to remove her would involve a move above subway tunnels, and it's been suggested that the engine's weight might collapse the tunnels.
She was not restored to her original appearance. Southern replaced her Baker valve gear with Walschaerts' ,. and the rods were given some sort of bright plating. The running boards were also revised at some point. Except for the plated rods, I actually prefer her this way, although others are welcome to disagree.
Tom
I do not know if this is still true or not, but when the 4501 was in the Washington area in the late sixties, the whistle was taken on the Smithsonian engine and put on the 4501--and recordings were made of that whistle as it was blown, and then the recordings were played in the museum. So, the whistle you heard as you were by the engine was her own whistle.
Johnny
Yes, the men in the shop in Birmingham, did well in keeping the two running. However, one new brass that was installed on the pony truck did not do well on the first trip afterwards. In May, 1972, the 722 led the 4501 on an excursion to Opelika and back (the 4501 continued on to Columbus, Georgia, with some of the cars and such passengers as Graham Claytor and David P. Morgan).
Before we reached Opelika, the bearing began running hot, so we were late arriving in Opelika and even later returning to Birmingham.
I have a lovely photograph of the engines crossing the Southern just east of Birmingham, on the CG's trestle. The picture is especially important to me because my then fiancée and I were on board.
I've always thought that Southern was in the same general 'boat' as PRR with respect to steam -- they spent what 'new passenger locomotive' money they had on Pacifics and such, just a couple of years before the development of Super-Power, and then had to ride out the Depression with what they had bought and paid for. When 'new motive power' time came 'round for them again, it was diesels all the way instead of Hudsons, 4-8-4s or other approaches..
Southern wasn't the only road without modern steam power after WW2 although it may have well have been the largest in that situation. It appears that SR was also sold on diesels fairly early, considering that they had FT's in service during WW2.
and e-units for passenger before that
And Alcos--when the Tennessean was inaugurated, Alcos were the power between Bristol and Memphis--and until diesels began being run through between Washington and Memphis/Birmingham/New Orleans, Alcos remained the power (though changed to PA's) for this train for this end of its run.
The Southerner was always diesel powered south of Washington.
The Tennesean was inaugurated with EMD E-units between Washington and Monroe or Lynchberg, N&W J's to Bristol, and the one streamlined PS4 between Bristol and Memphis. The Alcos came some time after the inauguration, how long after I do not know. While the Southerner just had one E, the Tennesean, which initially included silver-painted heavyweight Pullmans, had two, and A and a B. Of course a regular PS4 was used whenever the Khuler-streamlined one was not available.
Dave, the streamlined Ps4 had to run between Washington and Monroe--down in the morning and back in the evening. The Southern passenger timetables issued at the time when the Tennessean was new show an Alco A and B on the point of this train. It took two sets of Alcos to maintain the power on the Bristol-Memphis leg--leave Bristol or Memphis in the evening, and be at the other end the next morning. Indeed, the timetables indicated steam power between Washington and Bristol, and diesel power between Bristol and Memphis. The same timetables also show an E on the point of the Southerner.
Monroe was the engine change point since it was the south end of the Washington Division, and N&W engines took the Southern trains between Monroe and Bristol.
I stand corrected on the streamlined PS4, but it was replaced by E-units between Montroe and Washington by late 1942 or early 1943, when I saw it regularly at Charlottesville with one A-unit and one B. It was the second Southern Ry train to get diesels out of Washington, even before the Crescent, which did get diesels long before it got lightwieght sleepers. Agai, the initial Tennesean sleepers were heavyweights painted silver.
630 and 722 were sold by Southern to ET&WNC between '50-'53 I believe. The reason those two were the ones chosen is because they were stored in the Asheville roundhouse and must have been in the best shape. 4501 was put in green paint because Paul Merriman, who bought her from the K&T, liked Southern's ps2 4-6-2s in green and gold and decided to paint her in SRR green and gold. When Southern traded the 2 diesels for 630 and 722 Claytor told Bill Purdie to paint one locomotive in Southerns freight paint (gold and Black) and the other in green and gold like 4501 and the choice of the locomotives was up to him. 630 received minor repairs and was painted black while 722 needed and received heavy repairs and emerged the green engine of the 2. Like mentioned above, I learned most of this from Jim Wrinn's book Steam's Camelot (highly recommend read). There you go!
I would love to see either of the 2 GSMR locomotives return, it looks that 1702 should be back in a couple of years considering the deal with Swain county, but I would love to see a KS class 2-8-0 return to the Murphy branch, and hope to see something with 722 in the coming years.
in Knoxville tn the old southern engine that had sat in a park since her retirement was pulled out and brought back 2 life. someone remembered it was fresh out of the southern shops before being mothballed 4 50 years and now lives and breaths fire and smoke on steel wheels and rails. our constitution says "we the people" and the Smithsonian is the peoples house. if we want it never say never!!
Friend611, what makes you seem to think that the 722 is at risk? She's safe and is in no danger of being destroyed.
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