OK, I rode both trains during the period 1967-1970. The City of New Orleans looked like an all-lightweight streamliner, from its E-units (2, usually) up front to the round-end observation that was used at least at the beginning of my riding, but possible dropped toward the end. But if I remember correctly the dining car was a much rebuilt older car, rebuilt to match the lightweights but still on 6-wheel trucks. The train did run solid from Chicago to New Orleans, except cars were added southbound and subtracted northbound for St. Louis, then this became a change-trains connection, and then a bus. Possibly in 1969, the train was discontiniued, and coaches were added to the Panama with a separate train name, "The Magnolia Star." On occasion, then two diners were used, but also on occasion just one. And sometimes three E's were on the point. I think there was a combination baggage-RPO car up front and sometimes additional head end equipment, sometimes spoiling the all-streamlined appearance, during the years that the City ran.
The Panama's diner was similar, and the rest of the train was pretty much lighweight sleepers, up to the change noted above. An exception was from Chicago to Carbondale and return, when a parlor-observation with an interior made to represent the New Orleans French Quarter handled the passengers from Chicago to Chamapaign-Urbana and to Carbondale. This was a blunt-end observation, switched-out southbound and added northbound, a much-rebuilt heavyweight on 6-wheel trucks.. Through cars to St. Louis ran from New Orleans, and there were drop sleepers from Chicago for Memphis and even one for Jackson, MS, addedd northbound. Not after the Magnolia Star was established, when the connection was a separate train or bus. I think the Panama also had a baggage-RPO until the mail was switched to trucks in 1968 or 1969.
I think most of the sleepers were ten and sixes. I don't remember any but smooth-sides cars used on these trains, no Budd stainless or fluted sides.
Thanks for the info. To be more specific I am looking for info around the 1960's when the Green diamond logo was used and the info Im looking for is equipment used on specific dates. Any dates in the green diamond era will be fine.
Thanks again.
Victor
Happy Railroading
jclass wrote: greyhounds, Did the Panama handle any mail at that time?
greyhounds,
Did the Panama handle any mail at that time?
I don't know. The story was told to me by Al Watkins who was then Director of Intermodal Pricing at the ICG.
Al had worked intermodal on the North Shore, helped set it up on the Erie and came to the IC when the Mop took over the C&EI. Mail didn't come up in our conversation.
greyhounds wrote: In the "Final Days" of private railroad passenger service the IC beat Amtrak to the punch and tried to turn the Panama Limited into a mixed train. The Panama ran overnight between Chicago and New Orleans. The idea was to put a flexi-van flat on the train carrying premium priced freight. The freight would have left its origin in the afternoon and been delivered the next morning. A tarriff was filed and preperations were made. Not one load was shipped. Pretty much proving that there was no market for overnight truckload freight service between Chicago and New Orleans.
In the "Final Days" of private railroad passenger service the IC beat Amtrak to the punch and tried to turn the Panama Limited into a mixed train. The Panama ran overnight between Chicago and New Orleans.
The idea was to put a flexi-van flat on the train carrying premium priced freight. The freight would have left its origin in the afternoon and been delivered the next morning.
A tarriff was filed and preperations were made. Not one load was shipped. Pretty much proving that there was no market for overnight truckload freight service between Chicago and New Orleans.
Great idea, alright, but the I.C. may have had a different agenda. By adding one or more FREIGHT cars to The Panama Limited, the train and engine crews would have qualified for freight rate pay wherein 100-miles, not 150-miles, worked constitutes a basic day. This change would have driven the labor costs assigned to this train upwards, undoubtedly pushing its balance sheet further into the red. Increased operating costs would have made a future train off petition easier to justify before an I.C.C. examiner.
But, then, my argument does beg one question. Decades ago I remember seeing plenty of Flexi-Van flats equipped with pass-through steam pipes. Am I correct in assuming that these flats would have qualified as passenger train equipment?
OK, here's a tidbit.
But you don't know unless you try.
Hello everone,
I need some help. I am looking for specific information on Illinois Central Passenger trains. The two I am interested in the most is the "City of New Orleans" and the "Panama Limited".
Thanks in advance
icmr
Happy Railroading.
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