The ALCo diesel locomotive thread

[kenneo]

QUOTE: Originally posted by railpac

To the best of my knowledge there is no advantage to running ALCo's elephant style, or for that matter, any locomotive. I think its just a strange preference of that RR, some other RRs with strange preferences were the N&W which specified high hoods on all of its locomotives until the mid 80s (although this was more of a saftey issue with the N&W), and the Southern Pacific which starting with the GP/SD7s ordered the full lighting package (both red and white ocilating lights) on ALL of its locomotives into the mid-to-late 80s. Although I may be wrong about this just being a preference, if anybody else could help us out here that would be great![:)][:D][8D]

It was a preferance, but if you ever worked around those locomotives at night, they were easy to locate even if you couldn't hear or see them. The "MARS" lights were to get the dumb auto drivers attention, and in the canyons, you could visually sweep the cut walls for "moving mountians" or trees that were overly eager to pay the train a visit.. The red light was used as a marker for light engines and a Rule 99 flag when the train had a UDE. Espicially useful on multiple track. No approaching train could pass the locomotive with an operating red unless the crew of the train with the red gave permission.

The first engines to have "MARS" lights were the GS-4 Daylight Northerns. The rate of car-train meets was much lower with these engines that those without, so the SP adopted them as standard. They quit using them when cash flow problems made repairs too expensive. The lawyers said - "one loco has no "MARS" lights, no locomotive can have one for lawsuit reasons". So they were all cut off. This happened twice. Once they were cut off, then replaced, then cut off again.

The UP used them in the late 40's on all road units and had them on the E's through the E-8. The 800 series Northerns and some of the Challangers had them also.

[Anonymous]

To the best of my knowledge there is no advantage to running ALCo's elephant style, or for that matter, any locomotive. I think its just a strange preference of that RR, some other RRs with strange preferences were the N&W which specified high hoods on all of its locomotives until the mid 80s (although this was more of a saftey issue with the N&W), and the Southern Pacific which starting with the GP/SD7s ordered the full lighting package (both red and white ocilating lights) on ALL of its locomotives into the mid-to-late 80s. Although I may be wrong about this just being a preference, if anybody else could help us out here that would be great![:)][:D][8D]

[Anonymous]

To the best of my knowledge there is no advantage to running ALCo's elephant style, or for that matter, any locomotive. I think its just a strange preference of that RR, some other RRs with strange preferences were the N&W which specified high hoods on all of its locomotives until the mid 80s (although this was more of a saftey issue with the N&W), and the Southern Pacific which starting with the GP/SD7s ordered the full lighting package (both red and white ocilating lights) on ALL of its locomotives into the mid-to-late 80s. Although I may be wrong about this just being a preference, if anybody else could help us out here that would be great![:)][:D][8D]

[Anonymous]

I have been a strong fan of the Tennesse Central which was all Alco since the 50's. And like you, as a result of the TC's dependence on Alco power, I have always preferred the Alco RS-3, RS-32 and FA and FB designs versus GM.
My question to you is that the TC always ran every Alco lashup elephant style. I have never able to understand what the preference for this running set-up was as the Lehigh and New England, also all Alco, ran normal and elephant style lash-ups.
Was there any advantage to running Alco's elephant style?

[Anonymous]

I have been a strong fan of the Tennesse Central which was all Alco since the 50's. And like you, as a result of the TC's dependence on Alco power, I have always preferred the Alco RS-3, RS-32 and FA and FB designs versus GM.
My question to you is that the TC always ran every Alco lashup elephant style. I have never able to understand what the preference for this running set-up was as the Lehigh and New England, also all Alco, ran normal and elephant style lash-ups.
Was there any advantage to running Alco's elephant style?

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by gfink

Grand Canyon Railway is running meticulously restored ALCO PAs and PBs daily hauling equally well restored heavy weights up 3% grades in both directions bertween Williams AZ and the south rim of the canyon.

Diesel is used exclusively from Labor Day through Memorial Day. Well restored steam, sometimes double headed with diesel, is run daily between Memorial Day and Labor Day.

The Road has additional VIA Rail PAs on the property scheduled for restoration for daily service. The ALCO PA drawn varnish string uses HEP to support the varnish.

The extremely well maintained roadbed supports relatively high speed operation. It has many curves on the 3% grades providing outstanding "head-out-the-window" sound and photo/video oportunities. If the sight sound and smell of PAs under load appeals to you, ride the Grand Canyon.

Not to be mean gfink, but the GCRRs ALCo's are actually MLW FPA-4s.

Model : FPA-4
Hp. : 1800
Cyl.: 12
Engine : 251B
Period Produced: 10/58-5/59
a total of 50 A/B units were built for Canada
Hope this helps! [:)]

The rest of what you said is true, I have ridden the GCRR and the scenery there is truly beautiful, the train is wonderful with vintage cars from the 1920, and for slightly more $$$ you can ride in either the dome car, or the observation lounge. You step off the train only 500ft from the rim of the Grand Canyon, and for the GC itself; absolutely no words to describe it, both the train ride and GC are well worth the trip.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by gfink

Grand Canyon Railway is running meticulously restored ALCO PAs and PBs daily hauling equally well restored heavy weights up 3% grades in both directions bertween Williams AZ and the south rim of the canyon.

Diesel is used exclusively from Labor Day through Memorial Day. Well restored steam, sometimes double headed with diesel, is run daily between Memorial Day and Labor Day.

The Road has additional VIA Rail PAs on the property scheduled for restoration for daily service. The ALCO PA drawn varnish string uses HEP to support the varnish.

The extremely well maintained roadbed supports relatively high speed operation. It has many curves on the 3% grades providing outstanding "head-out-the-window" sound and photo/video oportunities. If the sight sound and smell of PAs under load appeals to you, ride the Grand Canyon.

Not to be mean gfink, but the GCRRs ALCo's are actually MLW FPA-4s.

Model : FPA-4
Hp. : 1800
Cyl.: 12
Engine : 251B
Period Produced: 10/58-5/59
a total of 50 A/B units were built for Canada
Hope this helps! [:)]

The rest of what you said is true, I have ridden the GCRR and the scenery there is truly beautiful, the train is wonderful with vintage cars from the 1920, and for slightly more $$$ you can ride in either the dome car, or the observation lounge. You step off the train only 500ft from the rim of the Grand Canyon, and for the GC itself; absolutely no words to describe it, both the train ride and GC are well worth the trip.

[Anonymous]

Grand Canyon Railway is running meticulously restored ALCO PAs and PBs daily hauling equally well restored heavy weights up 3% grades in both directions bertween Williams AZ and the south rim of the canyon.

Diesel is used exclusively from Labor Day through Memorial Day. Well restored steam, sometimes double headed with diesel, is run daily between Memorial Day and Labor Day.

The Road has additional VIA Rail PAs on the property scheduled for restoration for daily service. The ALCO PA drawn varnish string uses HEP to support the varnish.

The extremely well maintained roadbed supports relatively high speed operation. It has many curves on the 3% grades providing outstanding "head-out-the-window" sound and photo/video oportunities. If the sight sound and smell of PAs under load appeals to you, ride the Grand Canyon.

[Anonymous]

Grand Canyon Railway is running meticulously restored ALCO PAs and PBs daily hauling equally well restored heavy weights up 3% grades in both directions bertween Williams AZ and the south rim of the canyon.

Diesel is used exclusively from Labor Day through Memorial Day. Well restored steam, sometimes double headed with diesel, is run daily between Memorial Day and Labor Day.

The Road has additional VIA Rail PAs on the property scheduled for restoration for daily service. The ALCO PA drawn varnish string uses HEP to support the varnish.

The extremely well maintained roadbed supports relatively high speed operation. It has many curves on the 3% grades providing outstanding "head-out-the-window" sound and photo/video oportunities. If the sight sound and smell of PAs under load appeals to you, ride the Grand Canyon.

[Anonymous]

Ok here are some pics.
This is an ALCo S-6 that I found at the Green Bay, WI RR museum. This is an operational locomotive, in fact I rode behind this locomotive;
http://yardlimit.railfan.net/archive/jhw/1083.jpg
This is a drawing that I did of an S-2 switching;
http://yardlimit.railfan.net/archive/jhw/drawing-1-28-03.jpg
Not my pic, but this is a White Pass & Yukon Route 3ft gauge RSD-35W, in my opinion, one of the most interesting locomotives built by ALCo or its subsidaries, this locomotive was built by Bombardier in 1982.
http://www.whitepassfan.net/whitepass/home/pub/images/diesel/114/elj-pr-064_blw_114_sk_1995-06-12_medium.jpg

http://www.whitepassfan.net/whitepass/home/pub/images/diesel/114/elj-pr-065_blw_114_sk_1997-08-27_medium.jpg
enjoy! [;)]

[Anonymous]

Ok here are some pics.
This is an ALCo S-6 that I found at the Green Bay, WI RR museum. This is an operational locomotive, in fact I rode behind this locomotive;
http://yardlimit.railfan.net/archive/jhw/1083.jpg
This is a drawing that I did of an S-2 switching;
http://yardlimit.railfan.net/archive/jhw/drawing-1-28-03.jpg
Not my pic, but this is a White Pass & Yukon Route 3ft gauge RSD-35W, in my opinion, one of the most interesting locomotives built by ALCo or its subsidaries, this locomotive was built by Bombardier in 1982.
http://www.whitepassfan.net/whitepass/home/pub/images/diesel/114/elj-pr-064_blw_114_sk_1995-06-12_medium.jpg

http://www.whitepassfan.net/whitepass/home/pub/images/diesel/114/elj-pr-065_blw_114_sk_1997-08-27_medium.jpg
enjoy! [;)]

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by railpac

Keep 'em comin' guys, let's see some more questions! [8D]

How about pictures? Do you have any you would post? After people see some they might have some questions. It looks like you have been "tested" so far.
Keep up the good work. [;)]

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by railpac

Keep 'em comin' guys, let's see some more questions! [8D]

How about pictures? Do you have any you would post? After people see some they might have some questions. It looks like you have been "tested" so far.
Keep up the good work. [;)]

[Anonymous]

Keep 'em comin' guys, let's see some more questions! [8D]

[Anonymous]

Keep 'em comin' guys, let's see some more questions! [8D]

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by TARGUBRIGHT

The Alco PA's. Not a lot were built, was it a good engine? Or did it too have some problems??
TIM A

Actually, TARGUBRIGHT, quite a few PAs were built 294 total in all versions. this locomotive was good, but problems with the 244 is what got them. Only 4 PAs survived however due to the fact that they ware rebuilt with 16-251s and later 12-251s. Two units survive in Mexico and are operational, but is doubtful that they will run again. Now as far as I know either 1 or both of the other 2 survivors have been purchesed by US interests for restoration. So we may one day see an operating PA in the US.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by TARGUBRIGHT

The Alco PA's. Not a lot were built, was it a good engine? Or did it too have some problems??
TIM A

Actually, TARGUBRIGHT, quite a few PAs were built 294 total in all versions. this locomotive was good, but problems with the 244 is what got them. Only 4 PAs survived however due to the fact that they ware rebuilt with 16-251s and later 12-251s. Two units survive in Mexico and are operational, but is doubtful that they will run again. Now as far as I know either 1 or both of the other 2 survivors have been purchesed by US interests for restoration. So we may one day see an operating PA in the US.

[Anonymous]

The Alco PA's. Not a lot were built, was it a good engine? Or did it too have some problems??
TIM A

[Anonymous]

The Alco PA's. Not a lot were built, was it a good engine? Or did it too have some problems??
TIM A

[adrianspeeder]

Quote
"Although I can tell you that the last locomotive to leave the ALCo plant was a T-6 finished in late december 1969. In fact this diesel is still in use by a Con-Agra grain elevator, they are aware of the units historical signifigance, and the locomotive is well taken care of."
End Quote

I know for a fact that the second to last loco to leave the factory was a T-6, sister of the T-6 at Con-Agra. It is currently owned by the Middletown & Hummelstown RR, and used for freight duty. It looks great in its red and whiteish paint, and smokes and sounds like an alco should.

Adrianspeeder

[adrianspeeder]

Quote
"Although I can tell you that the last locomotive to leave the ALCo plant was a T-6 finished in late december 1969. In fact this diesel is still in use by a Con-Agra grain elevator, they are aware of the units historical signifigance, and the locomotive is well taken care of."
End Quote

I know for a fact that the second to last loco to leave the factory was a T-6, sister of the T-6 at Con-Agra. It is currently owned by the Middletown & Hummelstown RR, and used for freight duty. It looks great in its red and whiteish paint, and smokes and sounds like an alco should.

Adrianspeeder

[AltonFan]

QUOTE: LC asks:
Why do you like ALCO's so much?

I can't speak for anyone else, but I think the appeal of ALCo diesels is that the bodies tend to be curvy, as opposed to EMD's more angular designs. This is even true of ALCo's second generation power.

[AltonFan]

QUOTE: LC asks:
Why do you like ALCO's so much?

I can't speak for anyone else, but I think the appeal of ALCo diesels is that the bodies tend to be curvy, as opposed to EMD's more angular designs. This is even true of ALCo's second generation power.

[Anonymous]

True the RS-18u's as rebuilt by CPR had the type E excitation instead of the static excitation the RS-18s were originally built with.

[Anonymous]

True the RS-18u's as rebuilt by CPR had the type E excitation instead of the static excitation the RS-18s were originally built with.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by railpac

QUOTE: Originally posted by Limitedclear

Just for the record, the CPR shop was St. Luc in Montreal.

What is the difference between an RS-11 and an RS-18?

LC

Actually, there isn't much difference between a RS-11 and a RS-18, the only real difference between the 2 in the styling of the locomotive, the RS-11 of course had the notched carbody ends, where the RS-18 has projecting number boards and the sand filler hatch is on the roof. MLW found that these two locos were so similar that the original designation of the RS-18 was the RS-11M. Both used a 12-251 rated at 1800hp and used the same electrical systems as well. Oh and LC, is this supposed to be a test [;)]?

Not really, except perhaps the bit about St. Luc. Of course, there is a distinction between the RS-18 and the RS-18u as remanufactured by CPR. The wiring diagrams, brake system (26) and other components are different...

LC

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by railpac

QUOTE: Originally posted by Limitedclear

Just for the record, the CPR shop was St. Luc in Montreal.

What is the difference between an RS-11 and an RS-18?

LC

Actually, there isn't much difference between a RS-11 and a RS-18, the only real difference between the 2 in the styling of the locomotive, the RS-11 of course had the notched carbody ends, where the RS-18 has projecting number boards and the sand filler hatch is on the roof. MLW found that these two locos were so similar that the original designation of the RS-18 was the RS-11M. Both used a 12-251 rated at 1800hp and used the same electrical systems as well. Oh and LC, is this supposed to be a test [;)]?

Not really, except perhaps the bit about St. Luc. Of course, there is a distinction between the RS-18 and the RS-18u as remanufactured by CPR. The wiring diagrams, brake system (26) and other components are different...

LC

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Limitedclear

Just for the record, the CPR shop was St. Luc in Montreal.

What is the difference between an RS-11 and an RS-18?

LC

Actually, there isn't much difference between a RS-11 and a RS-18, the only real difference between the 2 in the styling of the locomotive, the RS-11 of course had the notched carbody ends, where the RS-18 has projecting number boards and the sand filler hatch is on the roof. MLW found that these two locos were so similar that the original designation of the RS-18 was the RS-11M. Both used a 12-251 rated at 1800hp and used the same electrical systems as well. Oh and LC, is this supposed to be a test [;)]?

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Limitedclear

Just for the record, the CPR shop was St. Luc in Montreal.

What is the difference between an RS-11 and an RS-18?

LC

Actually, there isn't much difference between a RS-11 and a RS-18, the only real difference between the 2 in the styling of the locomotive, the RS-11 of course had the notched carbody ends, where the RS-18 has projecting number boards and the sand filler hatch is on the roof. MLW found that these two locos were so similar that the original designation of the RS-18 was the RS-11M. Both used a 12-251 rated at 1800hp and used the same electrical systems as well. Oh and LC, is this supposed to be a test [;)]?

[Anonymous]

Just for the record, the CPR shop was St. Luc in Montreal.

What is the difference between an RS-11 and an RS-18?

LC