Yeah but then most carrier's have a turnover rate of over 100 percent a year. We're lucky if we need 15 to 20 percent in new driver's in a year for the fleet.
Shadow the Cats ownerWith reserved parking in the truck stops nowadays and proper trip planning and if your carrier reimburses for that expense you can get a parking spot for the night. I know we do here and I spend about 2 hours a day calling the locations needed for my driver's to get that space.
Not all organizations provide your Mother Hen services.
When doing long distance traveling I prefer to run during the night as there is less traffic on the highways. With the bulk of the traveling being done on the Interstate system, my personal observations are the virtually all designate Rest Areas are filled to overflowing during hours of darkness with all variety of OTR trucks.
With me towing my race car on its trailer, it can become difficult to find a stopping location to answer natures calls.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
With reserved parking in the truck stops nowadays and proper trip planning and if your carrier reimburses for that expense you can get a parking spot for the night. I know we do here and I spend about 2 hours a day calling the locations needed for my driver's to get that space.
Shadow the Cats ownerThe current HOS allows up to 11 hours per day of driving time and a maximum of 14 hours per day total time on duty or other wise once the daily clock is started. So if a driver is going west spent most of the first day loading say that took 8 hours total and most places get you in and out anymore with carriers demanding and getting detention time for their drivers. He still had 6 more he could go. That's about 380 miles. The next day grabbing fuel doing his pretrip inspection at the same time yes that's 100 percent legally allowed. Then he drives for his first 8 hours I'd his carrier has no governor the driver can run 75. He'll have over 500 miles in 8 hours easy. Then in his last 3 can still do 200 more.
In the mean time he is trying his damnedest to find a parking space at at Interstate Rest Area so he can start his rest clock. The entrance and exit ramps of the rest area will be filled with parked rigs a half mile in either direction of the actual rest area.
MP173There are lots of stories out there of "the good old days" of drivers running on no sleep or rest from West Coast to Midwest or beyond.
Saw a story about a train crew that was talking to the DS on the radio, telling him they were tied down (they were out of hours) as the horn in the background merrily blew for crossings...
Speed limits vary, even within states. I-75 is 70 MPH south of Saginaw, MI, and 75 MPH north. I do believe there are some western states where things are a little faster still.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
The current HOS allows up to 11 hours per day of driving time and a maximum of 14 hours per day total time on duty or other wise once the daily clock is started. So if a driver is going west spent most of the first day loading say that took 8 hours total and most places get you in and out anymore with carriers demanding and getting detention time for their drivers. He still had 6 more he could go. That's about 380 miles. The next day grabbing fuel doing his pretrip inspection at the same time yes that's 100 percent legally allowed. Then he drives for his first 8 hours I'd his carrier has no governor the driver can run 75. He'll have over 500 miles in 8 hours easy. Then in his last 3 can still do 200 more.
Just checked with our shipping dept.
We can ship 1000 pounds of class 55 freight from NW Indiana to Atlanta for $228.00 - standard delivery - 3 days.
Jevic did in fact sell to Yellow and the owner after his non compete ended moved on and started New Century, which folded about 2014 or so. Part of the remains of that operation is currently being handled by one of my truckload carriers accounts.
I dont know how a driver today could drive 700 miles with the ELogs in place, unless it was a team operation.
There are lots of stories out there of "the good old days" of drivers running on no sleep or rest from West Coast to Midwest or beyond.
Ed
There was one carrier that specialized in partial TL operation. They would carry 3-5 stops OTR. They were called Jevic Transportation. They were bought by Yellow Freight but kept separate. They filed for bankruptcy in the 90s and closed their doors.
Haul of Fame: Jevic Transportation - FreightWaves
Shadow the Cats ownerGreyhounds I asked my husband who hauled more multiple pick up and drop loads in his career than he cares to remember. Even when he had 4 pick ups and 4 drops from California to the Midwest he still had the whole load delivered in 3 days including the pick-up and all deliveries. How it's done is simplicity itself. They start with the farthest away and the first drop is always the furthest away from the last stop. He had a routine load that had 3 picks one in Iowa 2 in Nebraska then his drops were Reno Sacramento and San Francisco. Those loads paid him an extra 150 a trip.
Greyhounds I asked my husband who hauled more multiple pick up and drop loads in his career than he cares to remember. Even when he had 4 pick ups and 4 drops from California to the Midwest he still had the whole load delivered in 3 days including the pick-up and all deliveries. How it's done is simplicity itself. They start with the farthest away and the first drop is always the furthest away from the last stop. He had a routine load that had 3 picks one in Iowa 2 in Nebraska then his drops were Reno Sacramento and San Francisco. Those loads paid him an extra 150 a trip.
Success...partially.
I left a voice mail and a phone call was returned yesterday by a person very familiar with the program. He directed me to another person (Chicago) who could provide more information. Unfortunately I incorrectly wrote the email address for said person and my correspondence was kicked back.
NS has expanded the service to Miami, and New Jersey in addition to Atlanta. Progress is slow and NS is using a cross dock at an offsite warehouse. Service is not swift...but they are targeting commodities which do not require expedited service. That freight is out there.
As I pickup more info, I will pass it along. NS contact even said they would meet with me...I was full disclosure - couldnt promise business, but had lots of questions.
Greyhound...yes, those were two big break bulks at the corner of US 30 and I394. Great location for those terminals. ABF is now utilizing the old Carolina terminal as they merged (one of the mergers that worked). ABF is using considerable amount of intermodal on NS these days. The NS train 21Z (Rutherford - Chicago) will often have 20+ ABF pups and 53 ft trailers. One of my favorite NS intermodals as it is heavy TOFC with UPS, ABF, YRC, and others. As an old trucking industry employee, it warms my heart to see those LTL trailers.
More to follow.
charlie hebdo"Time elapse to get it there 20 hours of driving time roughly so if it's a team next day solo 2 day service." It says driving time.
Lithonia Operator Ulrich Pickup today (Wednesday), delivered by Friday or very latest Monday am. Which one? The train or the truck? Or both could accomplish this?
Ulrich Pickup today (Wednesday), delivered by Friday or very latest Monday am.
Which one? The train or the truck? Or both could accomplish this?
Truck. But often it isn't about speed.. its about price and consistency. Most people would be happy to wait a day or three longer if the price is lower and the service levels are consistent. Nowadays (thanks to advances in inventory management) customers can often predict their needs weeks and even months ahead of time.. so they can order their product and have it delivered using a slower cheaper mode. Smart cusotmers are going to question the need and the cost of moving product across country at 700 plus miles a day.. Most of the time that's not needed..it goes into a warehouse where it sits..
UlrichPickup today (Wednesday), delivered by Friday or very latest Monday am.
Still in training.
Lithonia Operator So here's my question. Okay, questions, plural. Let's say we have 5 pallets of books, and they need to go from Chicago to Miami. Neither the shipper or the receiver has a rail siding. How long will it take an efficient trucking company to do this door-to-door? How long will NS's LCL service take, including its first- and last-mile partners? Let's assue that the first and last "miles" are each fifteen miles. And let's assume that from pickup by the NS subcontractor to when the boxcar with our load is coupled on to the intermodal train is 18 hours. Who gets the load there first? And is NS for sure going to have the better price? (It seems like they would have to, to get this going, unless they are way faster, which I doubt.) Except for when the driver is sleeping or stopping to eat, the long-haul truck is always on the move. Whereas the railroad will have some inescapable dwell time. Who has the most down time? The motor carrier will always have the shortest route, plus the ability to go 70 mph, not 60. I'm not sure which one transloads the individual pallets more. If it's a truck, is the drill always just little truck, big truck, little truck (if the origin and destination are high volume paces like Chicago and Miami?) Finally, are/will the rates be public knowledge?
So here's my question. Okay, questions, plural.
Let's say we have 5 pallets of books, and they need to go from Chicago to Miami. Neither the shipper or the receiver has a rail siding.
How long will it take an efficient trucking company to do this door-to-door?
How long will NS's LCL service take, including its first- and last-mile partners?
Let's assue that the first and last "miles" are each fifteen miles. And let's assume that from pickup by the NS subcontractor to when the boxcar with our load is coupled on to the intermodal train is 18 hours.
Who gets the load there first?
And is NS for sure going to have the better price? (It seems like they would have to, to get this going, unless they are way faster, which I doubt.)
Except for when the driver is sleeping or stopping to eat, the long-haul truck is always on the move. Whereas the railroad will have some inescapable dwell time. Who has the most down time?
The motor carrier will always have the shortest route, plus the ability to go 70 mph, not 60.
I'm not sure which one transloads the individual pallets more. If it's a truck, is the drill always just little truck, big truck, little truck (if the origin and destination are high volume paces like Chicago and Miami?)
Finally, are/will the rates be public knowledge?
Pickup today (Wednesday), delivered by Friday or very latest Monday am.
greyhounds Shadow the Cats owner t's roughly 1400 miles to Miami from Chicago. You're going to be part of a multi pickup load on either a truckload or LTL direct to Miami yes those do exist reefer carriers love loadsback to Florida and California like these. Figure about a buck a mile for everything on the OTR side if you're going with as part of a multi pick and stop load. Time elapse to get it there 20 hours of driving time roughly so if it's a team next day solo 2 day service. So just let me make sure I understand what you're saying correctly. This truck is going to average 70 MPH from Chicago to Miami while making stops for partial unloading?
Shadow the Cats owner t's roughly 1400 miles to Miami from Chicago. You're going to be part of a multi pickup load on either a truckload or LTL direct to Miami yes those do exist reefer carriers love loadsback to Florida and California like these. Figure about a buck a mile for everything on the OTR side if you're going with as part of a multi pick and stop load. Time elapse to get it there 20 hours of driving time roughly so if it's a team next day solo 2 day service.
So just let me make sure I understand what you're saying correctly.
This truck is going to average 70 MPH from Chicago to Miami while making stops for partial unloading?
"Time elapse to get it there 20 hours of driving time roughly so if it's a team next day solo 2 day service."
It says driving time.
I remember both Roadway and Carolina built two huge break bulk facilities in Chicago Heights, IL. I thought a rail intermodal terminal should be put right there.
Just like UPS has at Willow Springs.
MP173 Typically the local terminal will load freight to the "Break Bulk terminal" which serve the terminal. This is a massive consolidation terminal, often 100 - 200 doors in which trailers are unloaded and freight is then loaded either for destination terminals (if sufficient volume) or to the break bulk serving the destination.
I remember both Roadway and Carolina built two huge break bulk facilities in Chicago Heights, IL.
I thought a rail intermodal terminal should be put right there.
[/quote]
MP173Typically the local terminal will load freight to the "Break Bulk terminal" which serve the terminal. This is a massive consolidation terminal, often 100 - 200 doors in which trailers are unloaded and freight is then loaded either for destination terminals (if sufficient volume) or to the break bulk serving the destination.
greyhounds So just let me make sure I understand what you're saying correctly. This truck is going to average 70 MPH from Chicago to Miami while making stops for partial unloading?
Shadow the Cats ownert's roughly 1400 miles to Miami from Chicago. You're going to be part of a multi pickup load on either a truckload or LTL direct to Miami yes those do exist reefer carriers love loadsback to Florida and California like these. Figure about a buck a mile for everything on the OTR side if you're going with as part of a multi pick and stop load. Time elapse to get it there 20 hours of driving time roughly so if it's a team next day solo 2 day service.
The 5 pallet shipment from Chicago to Miami will be an LTL shipment. It will probably not go directly on a single truck with either single or team driver UNLESS someone is paying to expedite this movement or it is on a partial truckload shipment and it is brokered out. These partial truckload shipments are typically 1/2 to 3/4 of the volume of the trailer...leaving room for a "partial". There are carriers that specialize in these partial truckload or "volume LTL" freight moves.
So, here is what used to occur when I was in the LTL business 32 years ago.
Pickup in Chicago by a local driver who is based out of a local terminal. This driver leaves in the morning with possibly 10-15 deliveries in his territory. Truck is typically loaded overnight or early morning. Driver makes deliveries, typically in morning and mid afternoon is empty and then starts making pickups in his territory. The five pallets of books are picked up along with other pickups in his territory. Typically a shipper will tender several such LTL shipments at the time of pickup. So, the driver may pickup 5 pallets of books for Miami, 1 pallet of books for Memphis, and 3 pallets for Atlanta.
Driver returns to terminal with these 3 shipments plus others picked up. Trailer is unloaded either by driver or by dock crew. Bill of lading is converted into the freight bill at some point with information regarding shipper/consignee, pieces, weight, commodity, and the tracking number.
Typically the local terminal will load freight to the "Break Bulk terminal" which serve the terminal. This is a massive consolidation terminal, often 100 - 200 doors in which trailers are unloaded and freight is then loaded either for destination terminals (if sufficient volume) or to the break bulk serving the destination.
So, lets say the carrier has break bulk terminal in Atlanta. It will load the Miami 5 pallets and the 3 pallets for Atlanta, plus other freight generated for that terminal and the terminals supported by the break bulk. Atlanta may break for possibly 25-50 terminals in the Southeast. There will probably be multiple trailers each night moving between Chicago and Atlanta. These might be 28 ft pups or 53 ft trailers. Pups allow for "drops and kicks" en route. Perhaps Chicago can load a 28 ft pup for Chattanooga along with a 28 ft for Atlanta. The 28 ft will be dropped in Chatt. and perhaps a 28 ft picked up for the Atlanta break bulk. Similar to Block Swaps with the rails.
Atlanta breaks the trailer and delivers the 3 pallets to local consignee and loads a trailer for Miami including the five pallets...and others.
Memphis is routed via either Memphis direct or the break bulk servicing Memphis.
Typical service level would be four days to Miami and possibly overnight to Memphis...if not then 2nd day. I have had freight delivered overnight from NW Indiana to Jonesboro, Ar using LTL carriers...just the right combination of terminal network for that to occur.
At Miami the inbound trailer is unloaded and cross docked to a local trailer and out for delivery.
Rates used to be public, now they are either public or contract. The LTL rate structure is based on several factors....classification of freight - from class 50 - steel and heavy metal products to class 500 - feathers. Rates are also based on mileage and weight. There is always a minimum rate (perhaps $200) with rates for less than 500#, 500 - 1000#, 1000 - 2000#, 2000 - 5000#, and above.
This is a very efficient method of shipping partial loads from point to point....very similar to UPS/FedX for parcels, and the railroads for single or multiple carloads...or even airlines with hub and spoke operations.
I enjoyed my 10 year career in LTL but the industry in the 1980s was in turmoil. Lots of big carriers filed chapter 11 and left the industry. Big carriers such as Consolidated Freightways (CF) are gone. PIE - gone. Ryder - gone. Smith - gone. American - gone...my small carrier - gone.
What NS is hoping to provide (in my opinion) is the line haul between terminals and then have a local carrier make delivery. I think it can be done, but NS cannot sell this. They do not have the sales DNA to make it work. Let the local carriers sell it.
Hope this helps.
ed
It's roughly 1400 miles to Miami from Chicago. You're going to be part of a multi pickup load on either a truckload or LTL direct to Miami yes those do exist reefer carriers love loadsback to Florida and California like these. Figure about a buck a mile for everything on the OTR side if you're going with as part of a multi pick and stop load. Time elapse to get it there 20 hours of driving time roughly so if it's a team next day solo 2 day service. I know my boss tries for a minimum dollar a mile for any part of a multi drop or pickup load. So say we have 3 pickup for a load each shipment pays a dollar a mile for their spot on the trailer from the pickup point to the destination.
You're starting with the wrong question. Very seldom will the train 'get it there quicker', either door-to-door or tailgate-to-tailgate.
The first question is whether it can be done more inexpensively than the all-truck alternative (and this has two parts: cheaper to the shipper, or cheaper to the LTL carrier of record). The second question is whether it can be done reliably: pick a time and arrive within a few minutes. The third question is risk of various kinds, including accidental delays or driver concerns.
I made very careful studies on reducing dwell time in high-speed intermodal container freight. Some of that applies to trains containing either LTL company bridge traffic in boxcars or loaded LTL trailers in particular lanes between distribution centers or areas.
Mg suspicion is that 'the public' never sees the railroad part of the billing as a separate item; it'll be an end-to-end service. I was hoping we'd get some detailed NS marketing insight, but it appears they ain't talkin'.
Thanks for that info Juniata Man. I will reach out and try to break thru the phone barrier today (time permitting).
jeffhergert"Hello, you've reached the PSR Railroad. How may you help us?" Jeff
Jeff
MP173; just read an article in the October TRAINS concerning NS' LCL service. This would appear to be an Industrial Products service offering and NOT an intermodal service product.
Based on this, queries to intermodal people at NS may not be fruitful as was your experience. I'd hope that inquiry to NS' Industrial Products folks would be more successful.
CW
SD60MAC9500Already available.
Like it. Like it a lot.
I'd put some kind of roof over it for the snow and rain. And I'd have some kind of a mobile home for the workers to get warm, use a restroom, eat lunch, have some coffee, etc. Aside from that, this is gold.
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